Making Double Nucleus Colonies Part II

[@UoGHoneyBeeResearchCentre]

Thank you to everyone for watching and supporting our videos! If you have any questions about our videos, please check out our list of FREQUENTLY ASKED QUESTIONS on our website, which can be found at honeybee.uoguelph.ca/videos/frequently-asked-questions/

[@craigfenton1913]

Apart from the fact you are my father in-laws doppelganger, you two are almost identical, I have enjoyed watching both the videos I have just seen. My boss wants to introduce double nuces into his operation and I will be doing the queens for him this year. I've not had much to do with double nuces and watching the two videos has taken some of the stress out of it for me. My worry was with the separation of the queens and keeping them apart. Thankyou for your knowledge and sharing. 👍🏻

[@UoGHoneyBeeResearchCentre]

Hey Craig I've never met a doppelganger but did have someone send a picture awhile back of another guy that looked like me and even held his hands the same way when doing a presentation. I guess there is only so many different faces. Great to hear you have found our videos helpful! Good luck with the double nucs.

[@TheJelleyMan637]

Wow, the first ever video with 0 dislikes... Thank btw, your videos are educational and very informative. You're reaching people in South Africa :P

[@UoGHoneyBeeResearchCentre]

Hi SJ in SA! Nice to hear you find the videos helpful and haven't 'disliked' them :)

[@kstienburg276]

You overwinter your nucs indoors. But for those of us who overwinter outdoors the 5 frames can't be enough for the winter? I was planning to place another divided deep on top and then super as you do. This would give me 10 frames per side. So 2 hives in one footprint. You comment or suggestion will be appreciated.

[@Allan79789]

I have used this method to overwinter outdoors for 3 years, and the bees do fine on five frames.

[@mandarsoman6437]

Best !! Thank you for sharing this technique. Can we also follow similar for apis cerana ?

[@StickyDankFingers]

If you wouldn’t mind it would be extremely helpful to know the date or window of dates that you make up these double Nucs. Since I am In Pennsylvania (USA) I can easily adjust my timing accordingly. I’m thinking your goal is to grow the nuc colonies strong enough to make the winter for spring replacements or apiary expansion. Thank you. Hope you make some more videos this year :). .... maybe you’ll include that day(s) of the recording. Thanks again.

[@UoGHoneyBeeResearchCentre]

We make up double nucs late May to early June. So after dandelions but before clover.

[@bigsky14]

So I get that the excluder keeps the queens from going at each other, but what's the bee-ology behind why the workers are fine sharing half a hive? I thought bees would kill a queen they perceived as foreign or "extra," so even once the workers have integrated, why do they still tolerate two completely active queens in what they now consider a single hive?

[@UoGHoneyBeeResearchCentre]

Hi bigsky If bees are slowly introduced to each other they get along well. The colony smells merge and the bees seem to go back and forth from the honey supers to their own side of the brood chamber. It's likely more complicated but that's the best I can explain it.

[@krispapas9834]

I am doing double nuc for the first time. If the supers are taken off will they have enough honey for winter?

[@RonnelVP]

Great video and I've modeled my splits this year with this method. To winter them in these double nucleus boxes, what is your method in preparing them for winter after removing the honey supers?

[@UoGHoneyBeeResearchCentre]

Hi Ronnel We winter them in our indoor overwintering room ( see our video 'indoor overwintering') or out side. For outside wintering we 1. put two double nucs beside each other 2. wrap the sides with bubble foil insulation and cut a hole over the upper entrance 3. place a 6" thick insulation pillow on top 4. put a Wellington County Beekeepers Association 2 hive corroplast wrap with upper entrance holes over the works 5. put the two hive lids on top. 6. place a brick on each lid We should do a video on this topic.

[@RonnelVP]

@@UoGHoneyBeeResearchCentre Are all supers removed and wintered as a single (double nuc) brood box? If so, how are the bees shaken down into the one box? Thanks so much for your quick reply. Great videos.

[@daver8393]

I really like your videos because they are very informative and it is expanding my knowledge about different methods of bee keeping. Would you be willing to make a video that goes through the numbers? For example, how much weight a single or double nucleus hives should be at before entering winter, what are your percentage loses of bee hives coming out of winter comparing double and single nucleus colonies, what pit falls bee keepers should avoid and the amount of honey a strong bee hive is able to make in a season. Also, anything else that might be a good thing to know. I think that would be very helpful.

[@UoGHoneyBeeResearchCentre]

Hi Dave Thanks for the suggestion. I'll add that to the list of potential videos to produce. Great to hear you have found the videos helpful.

[@jamesm4539]

Thanks for the videos. Very nice. Do you ever move the queen excluder up above a second deep box and continue the division into that box? I'm considering this for two reasons. First it provides room for each queen to lay more eggs and second in the winter wouldn't there be more room for the colony to move within the hive, following the food source without leaving the queen behind because she would not do able to migrate into the top box with the excluder above the first box.

[@UoGHoneyBeeResearchCentre]

Hi James We'll do a video about managing colonies in single brood chambers. That's our preferred method.

[@jamesm4539]

Thanks. I'm looking forward to seeing the video. I'm wondering if the number of brood boxes should differ based on geographical differences such as the harshness of winter

[@CryptoUPSman]

Hello, I hope you’re still into making videos because I think yours are some of the best out there. I was wondering, are your boxes normal 10 frame deeps with a partition or are they slightly bigger to accommodate the divider and still get 10 frames in the box. Thanks, Christian

[@UoGHoneyBeeResearchCentre]

Hi Christian Thanks. We are making some more videos this summer. Good question. They are normal size boxes. The partitions are only 1/4" thick so we can still fit 5 frames on each side.frames - as long as there isn't a wax/propolis buildup on the frame shoulders.

[@goofoffbert]

Loved the d. nuc videos - thank you! How do you keep the bees from swarming with these doubles? You have 5 frames, each side, then a queen excluder. You mention that both hives grow quite well producing a good amount of honey ..but those queens should fill each those 5 frames quite easily and not have anywhere to lay ....so what do you do to manage swarming and growth ... thank you kindly! Robert

[@UoGHoneyBeeResearchCentre]

Hi Robert I just saw your question. Swarming isn't a problem in the first year with the double nucs but you do have to get them transferred out to full size boxes early enough the second year. The young queens aren't interested in swarming the first year and supering prevents crowding. The queens could certainly lay more with more space but I like to think they last better in future years since they are only working half time in their first year.

[@davidweale9621]

Thank you for these videos, very informative. As an aside your tool belts look very useful, may I ask where you source them and if it contains a magnetic holder for the hive tool?

[@UoGHoneyBeeResearchCentre]

Hi David You are very welcome. Glad you find the videos helpful. I make the Bee Belts. You could see more information on the websites of the following bee supply companies. Dancing Bee, Innisfil Creek, Backyard Bees and Hungry Bear.

[@davidweale9621]

@@UoGHoneyBeeResearchCentre thank you, I'll check out the sites. All the very best, stay safe David

[@stevenakers8145]

Paul, could you make a video on the stool you sit on, and the tool belt you use. I love your vidies.

[@UoGHoneyBeeResearchCentre]

Hi Steven Maybe sometime. I make the and sell stools and belts and some other things I find useful. If you send me your email address I can send you some pictures of the stool for you to copy and also information about the belts and how to purchase one. Nice to hear you enjoy our videos. Thanks Steven.

[@beebob1279]

since we are south of you, it would be easier for me to schedule the nucleus splits with the flowers in bloom. Is it dandelion? apple? thanks. I know it's late for us now here in Southeaster Pennsylvania to look at honey flows, but there is still time for making winter double nucleus colonies. Thanks,

[@UoGHoneyBeeResearchCentre]

Hi Bee Bob We typically make up our splits around the time that bees would consider swarming. For the same reasons bees pick that time. This is late May to mid June in our area. That's after dandelion and before basswood and clover. This year we had to do some of our splits later so we made them up stronger.

[@beebob1279]

Thanks. Our flows as so short and don't go as long as yours its difficult to split and get a crop.

[@ericshipplett3517]

How do you keep from getting stung.

[@TheFarmacySeedsNetwork]

In the first video of this series, you used queen cells. Did you graft those to get all those queens?

[@UoGHoneyBeeResearchCentre]

Yes we did. You could see our playlist of queen rearing videos.

[@Tuner9069]

If I were to make a double nucleus colony do I have to move the double nucleus hives to a separate apiery or can I keep them on the same apiery. I recently had an accident and won't be able to drive for 6 months maybe longer.

[@UoGHoneyBeeResearchCentre]

Hi John It's better to move them to another apiary as you don't lose bees back to the original hive. If you can't move them to another location add extra bees but not extra brood.

[@gamingnarrativesandstories1700]

Thanks for these videos. In order to build and maintain a strong colony, you need loads of bees. And the number of bees in the colony much depends on the ability of the queen to lay and keep laying eggs. Do those five frames in eighter side provide enough cells for the queens to keep laying at all times?

[@UoGHoneyBeeResearchCentre]

You are welcome. The queens could lay more eggs if they had more space. They don't get used up in their first year that way. Since there is a queen on both sides of the partition the double nucleus grows quite populous. The supers above prevent the comb in the brood chamber from getting bound up with honey so there is enough brood rearing space. It works well for us and I've been managing hives this way for over twenty years.

[@jwbarker81]

What material to use for your tarp on the inner cover?

[@UoGHoneyBeeResearchCentre]

18 oz. canvas

[@michaelfayhead]

Thank you very much

[@UoGHoneyBeeResearchCentre]

You are most welcome Michael. :)

[@KevinsNorthernExposure]

are you talking 27 days from the day the cell was installed or a 27 day old queen? Queen would be 43 days old the way you described it then right? 15 days old when installed and another 27 days. How on earth would they be able to make their own queen in that time? There should be no way as there wouldn't be any two day old brood for them to produce their own queen, right?

[@UoGHoneyBeeResearchCentre]

Hi Kevin Yes we check on mating 27 days from when the queen cell was installed ( cell installed at 10 days from graft). See the chart below from Wickedpedia. The larvae the bees rear into a queen cell will be at day 4 or 5 when we make up the split so you can subtract as much as 5 days from the day 23 and up Egg Laying figure below. They have the right age larvae to work with for up to 4 days after the split is made up. I see various mating ages ranges recognized - anywhere form 4 to 10 days from hatching but it's likely close the average so say 7 days. Thanks for the challenging question Kevin. Metamorphosis of the queen beeEgghatches on Day 3Larva (several moltings)Day 3 to Day ​8 1⁄2Queen cell capped~ Day ​7 1⁄2Pupa~ Day 8 until emergenceEmergence~Day ​15 1⁄2 - Day 17Nuptial Flight(s)~Day 20 - 24Egg Laying~Day 23 and up

[@OuiskaRunFarm]

How do I get in touch with Paul to order Queens??

[@UoGHoneyBeeResearchCentre]

Hi LXX Thanks for your interest. We don't export queens out of Canada. If you are in Canada contact [e-mail] We are sold out for this year.

[@brandonsnyder9627]

are you guys on patreon?

[@UoGHoneyBeeResearchCentre]

Hi Brandon. I had to look Patreon up so the answer is no. It would be good to come up with a way of generating enough income to pay a videographer to help us with more videos. Our current video series was crowd funded through our University alumni association. Thanks for the thought.

[@mottv6506]

Wow..i would love to do this..

[@UoGHoneyBeeResearchCentre]

It is fun to do!

[@khawk7365]

What paint do you use to mark with

[@UoGHoneyBeeResearchCentre]

I Like 'Painters' brand made by Elmers. We get the neon set and purchase the white separately. We buy them from Amazon.

[@khawk7365]

@@UoGHoneyBeeResearchCentre thank you

[@gbat6727]

I know someone asked about the transfer of frames in between hives and the answer included that you like to change them out every three years. With so many hives and frames how do you keep track of when it was created? Or do you use other methods?

[@UoGHoneyBeeResearchCentre]

We juts change them out when they look old or are damaged. We could do a better job of this though. The only good opportunity to cull frames is when a hive dies.

[@kyguy-wr6bo]

I staple my partion right down it so it stays sealed good no worries. Thats what I found to work best for me anyway

[@UoGHoneyBeeResearchCentre]

H Jeremy Ours canvas inner covers were originally fastened down. I found that inconvenient when making up nucs, shaking out the boxes and for supering the nucs. I guess it depends on your goals with the nucs and I'm sure you have sorted out what works best for you. Thanks for your comment, it may be a better way to go for some other viewers.

[@kyguy-wr6bo]

Yeah we all have what works best for our needs. I did order that wax coated duck cloth last night though I do like the looks of that more then my feed sacks. Good videos

[@OSSlavik]

Hello from Ukraine) How to spend the winter bees in double nucleuse? Thank you

[@UoGHoneyBeeResearchCentre]

At the U of G we winter these indoors and will be doing a video on indoor overwintering soon. I have a bunch of these in my own bee operation and I winter them outdoors by wrapping two double nucs together with insulation on the sides and top. It's hard to explain more than that here.

[@Tj-ot4jp]

Strange that you should call a queen that the bees have raised "wild" I would have thought natural would be more accurate.

[@davidreynolds9649]

I think in the video he was using it to mean that the queen could fly out and mate with drones from anywhere as opposed to a carefully controlled mating on an island.