Making Sense of AMD's 9700X: SFF Perspective vs 7700 and 7800X3D

[@MrOnlinenow]

Reviews of high-profile products like next-gen CPUs or GPUs always put a lot of pressure on content creators, especially with the chaotic reviews surrounding AMD's current generation of CPUs. I've noticed many creators have posted follow-up videos. However, from a market perspective, if Amazon's sales figures are accurate, the 9700X has sold 50+ units on the platform since its release. Considering the significant impact of launch sales, this is a huge failure. I think we'll soon see a price drop for the 9700X. In fact, as long as the price is right, there are no bad products.

[@MrOnlinenow]

Of course, I also noticed that TechPowerUp mentioned disabling SMT could significantly improve the 9700X's performance. Due to my limited knowledge, I can't judge the reliability of this claim, but if it's true, it's a real tragedy for AMD, as software issues would have ruined the crucial launch of their hardware.

[@tacticalcenter8658]

I wouldn't buy an Intel that has a defect from the factory at any price. So there are some products at any price that are not worth it.

[@stennan]

Agree, AMD needs to look at the options on the market and get consistency in their product names. 65W CPU = non-X name and included cooler. X name 105W and you bring your own cooling solution. Also AMD told reviewers behind that their internal numbers showed around 5% gaming improvement... While AMD marketing showed 16% average IPC gain with 10-25% in the game examples in their slides. Go figure they will face backlash if they show examples that aren't representative and know that reviewers will find out on review day. Products are reviewed and recommended based on what alternatives are on the market. 7800X3D for 10-20$ more than 9700X and 20-30% better gaming performance? AMD got high off their own marketing slides when they set prices 😂

[@manusiaorang2842]

​@@tacticalcenter8658just buy those without defects then

[@weirdodude1173]

It's neat to see how the small form factor does change the variables for CPU selection. Thumbs up!

[@jporter504]

I think I would buy the Ryzen 7700 and use the money saved to upgrade to the 4070 super and better RAM.

[@MachinesMore]

For more of a gaming build, sure that would be one way to min-max. DDR5-6000 is going to be the sweet spot for RAM in an AM5 build right now.

[@ThrasherEscapes]

most people looking at the 9700x for a gaming build (sff or otherwise) should strongly consider the 7700 - almost the same performance for much less money. 9700x just doesn't make sense at current pricing with the 7700 still on the market.

[@Angel7black]

@@ThrasherEscapesit doesnt make sense for anybody besides data centers. Nobody should be buying it, they already launched with issues, they underperform and sometimes are slower than zen 4, they feel more Zen 4 XT chips. They have the same efficiency of the non c zen for while being only a couple percent faster over all. This launch is a waste of sand and AM5 continues to be a mediocre investment for anybody on AM4 what with the 7950X not being worth the upgrade over a 5950X realistically and the 7800X3D while being technically the best gaming CPU, again not being worth the upgrade over a 5800X3D/5700X3D. Based on architecture i highly doubt the 9800X3D will be much faster than the 7800X3D either. We’d be lucky if got to even 10 percent faster via power dumping. Not sure what the point of platform longevity is if it takes 4-6 years, near the end of its life cycle, for the platform to be work buying over the last one. People want AM5 to be a repeat of AM4 but catching lightning in a bottle is just that sometimes

[@cannotkazi]

Very quickly this channel has become one of my staple go-to's for temperature checks on bubbling internet opinions. Great up as always! Appreciate all the effort this takes.

[@ghost-type]

Pretty happy with my 7800X3D. I mostly use it in my T1 for gaming and streaming so I'm pretty set there.

[@ghost-type]

@alb9229 yup, definitely got my undervolt

[@phoenics2465]

Your videos are great but your thumbnails need help

[@alphasixty1316]

I understand the POV of the big reviewers. Yes, we would all like to see a 20% increase in gaming performance for cheaper. Instead, what we got is a more energy efficient chip that runs on the same platform of the previous gen. I am a bit taken aback that these same reviewers with all of their experience did not see this coming. Do they really just want more chips that are shipped eating as much power as they possibly can? Staying away from more cynical remarks... Machines & More, thank you for your great insightful and balanced reviews.

[@JomeFromWork]

It's not actually "more efficient" and it has been debunked by Hardware Unboxed, he also reiterated on his latest vid. No matter how you look at it, *it is a bad value CPU right now.* Until AMD cut prices for the next months, let's stay away on the 9600x and 9700x for now.

[@JamesSullivan-ru4op]

Different perspectives can be beneficial, depending on the topic. It 's good here. I am neither down on this launch or nor high on this launch. I am critical of AMD for their handling of this launch. They lied. Seriously. I do understand how a lot of people are disappointed because of this. This launch was more like a generational refresh of a mature process than a new generation of CPUs. AMD's own hype prepared enthusiasts and then underdelivered, big. It's not on techtubers necessarily, big or small. It's squarely on AMD. AMD pulled an Intel here. That's NOT a good thing. As per commentary on the last video, I still see the 7600 and 7700 as clearly better a better deal, even taking power draw into consideration and even for SFF. I run the gamut of PC builds from tiny to huge. I have a Caselabs Merlin ST10 Tower with dual pedestals and 5, 480mm radiators and I have a Louqe Ghost S1 Mk II. The 5000 and 7000 series CPUs have no problem whatsoever running full tilt in my Ghost. Even when one considers power draw, the 9000s don't make a ton of sense at launch pricing.

[@TheWesterosiNinja]

Would a 7700x running in eco be more or less performant than a standard 7700 non-X in a Terra build? Thinking of pairing them with the same Noctua L21x77 cooler. Thanks.

[@pirotehs]

It doesn't make sense! I would choose 7700 and 4070 Super over 9700x and 4070. And my 7700 combo still will be cheaper and will provide more fps than "experts" 9700x combo in this video.

[@GlassPup]

That’s a very niche use case to justify the 9700X.

[@PeeraBJ]

7700x configured to 88w and CO at -15 paired with mid-tier graphic card that you usually used in SFF build such as 4070 or 4070S will be indistinguishable to 9700x at all aspects. Definitely waited for next gen Ryzen. Unless AMD lowered the price this is a hard skip.

[@kuzzzzzzzzzzzz7511]

Can you make a direct die for Axp120-x67 for 7800x3d?

[@mexicanhalloween]

now AMD only needs to make a GPU PCB that isn't 400mm long, it's crazy that the 4090 PCB is shorter than most cards they make

[@rachelcheung2247]

In your opinion, should we wait for the X3D of the AMD 9 series and the new motherboards?

[@Greenalex89]

If u wanna make actual sense of the CPU, check server type apps where its an amazing upgrade compared to previous gens. Gaming is only a very small part of the market. Small data centers, shops, small companies or even schools/unis are most likely a way more lukrative market than a few gamers.

[@DubravkoKovacduq]

If this is the best CPU for low profile cooler and high fps on low graphics settings for fast paced games, it is made for me. Please do more tests👍🏽👍🏽👍🏽

[@hwi7114]

I wonder if a cooler as small as a NH-L9 or AXP90-X36 could handle it. As a Velka 5 user I am always looking for CPUs that can run under those small coolers without being completely gimped. Looking forward to your future builds/testing with this in SFF cases.

[@MachinesMore]

Will be testing small and smaller coolers!

[@anthonyalfieri4154]

Hi for the close-up images of the bare CPU die such as at 12:04, what material did you place over the exposed components? It looks like some kind of wax or epoxy? I am getting a 7800x3d soon and am deliberating if I should use my extra IC Graphite pad or thermal paste. If thermal paste, I want to avoid covering those components. Thanks!

[@MachinesMore]

That is how the chips come by default from AMD with the epoxy over that part. I prefer paste, plus the thermal transfer off of the 7800X3D IHS is critical, since it’s very thermally dense. One small overlooked accessory for AM5 is a thermal paste guard- just a plastic sheet that helps keep the paste out of the non-IHS parts.

[@krazyfrog]

That's how all AM5 chips ship by default.

[@wkungYT]

Thermal paste is also safer than IC Graphite. I'll be running PTM7950 on my 7800X3D, which--just like most thermal pastes--is not electrically conductive. IC Graphite IS electrically conductive (which sometimes do touch those exposed components--don't ask me how I know :P) and most varieties perform a bit below thermal pastes. Even top performing varieties like Kyrosheet, for most users probably aren't worth the safety risk unless you need to frequently change out different CPU and cooler combos.

[@anthonyalfieri4154]

@@wkungYT yeah I’m lazy with pc builds so the thermal pads have been awesome over the last ~10 years for me. I’ll probably buy the Honeywell pad instead. It seems to perform a lot better. But looks tricky to install. Thanks.

[@anthonyalfieri4154]

@@wkungYT it’s going to take 2 weeks for the real stuff to get to me…Amazon seems to have fake thermal pads.

[@DrNoBrazil]

We need more M2 love... And please tell NCASE to have stock one day, that would be nice, thanks!

[@MrOnlinenow]

As an M2 owner, I have to say there's no need to have overly high expectations for it. The biggest value of the M2 lies in supporting mATX while maintaining a relatively small size. If you don't plan on using an mATX motherboard, I think there are plenty of other options available. The quality of this M2 is decent, but it has many minor issues, which is surprising for a product that has been iterated over many years.

[@crawfordbrown75]

As another M2 owner with some issues, may I ask what issues you came across?? ​@@MrOnlinenow

[@theopszone6775]

So will be great tht mood case.

[@MachinesMore]

Oh yeah, as questionable as the Mood’s fabric shell is, even there you shouldn’t have any performance issues with a CPU drawing down 88W at load.

[@gametime4316]

actually its wrong, the 9700X is not much more efficient then 7700 (mostly 7-10%) (it is more then the 7700X but that is only because the 7700X is inefficient compered to the 7700) look at the last review at HUB when compered to 7700 non X.