Zone 2 Cardio - Debunked? | What is Zone 2 Cardio with Mark Sisson

Mark Sisson shares his thoughts with Brad Kearns on the surging interest in "zone 2 cardio."
Most conventional fitness wisdom will tell you that you need to break up your week in a regimented manner, spending a specified amount of time in different heart rate zones. But how necessary is that really? Is our obsession with zones just the latest revival of chronic cardio? Hear what Mark and Brad have to say. #ListentotheSisson

[@dave3gan]

I think the focus on zone 2 is about telling people that they don't have to go hard all the time. People are more likely to push too hard than too easy. It's usually paired with the understanding that most of your training should be zone 2. So zone 2 training is about taking it easy and not digging yourself into a hole.

[@igloozoo3771]

Yep, as you get older and fatter and think you can quickly return to the fitness of your youth, I think meaursing HR during training is very important especially at the beginning stages of training when a 10 minute mile shuffle drives your HR into danger zone.

[@Thelucky23]

No!!! There is clinical research on how important zone 2 cardio specifically is very important and provides longevity!!!! Imagine taking care of your barn animals your garden and then kids and walking to wells / water… that’s zone 2. It doesn’t mean don’t sprint it does mean get that heart rate up. Yes walking can even be zone 2 depending on your circumstances….

[@theworkethic]

You d um b as nails

[@karlpk3907]

Mark's a good guy, a smart guy, and obviously very fit. And the general idea of "moving around" a lot is certainly good for your physical health and certainly much better than being sedentary. And of course, the more you do, the better you will feel, and the healthier you will get and stay. And you don't need precision metrics to do all of that. But I do find the dismissiveness and sneering at "Zone 2" a bit much. The reality is there is quite a bit of real science supporting the benefits of working out at levels appropriately gauged your max heart rate. There's a reason that high performing athletes such as marathoners, Olympic level rowers, top level soccer players, and Tour de France level cyclists use Zone 2 as a key training tool among other obvious work out techniques: it is PRECISE in giving the you level of exertion you need to maximize aerobic fitness. So yeah you don't need to be scientific in that regard to get the benefits of "moving around" and being physically active and if you don't want to, that perfectly fine, or if you say it's not that essential if you consistently do basic stuff that's OK, too. . But pooh-poohing a clearly valid scientific approach to exercise is not helpful.

[@MrEckic]

Maybe these guys should ask Inigo san Milan about zone 2

[@bigrikstube]

OH THANK you. this was my first time on this channel and i wanted to check out the zone 2 concept i heard from another Dr. The dismissiveness turned me right off so i wont be watching them any longer but i wnted to thank you for your post.

[@thebestthingthatneverhappe6729]

did u read primal endurance?

[@Cloppa2000]

100% agree!

[@JOSEespinal123]

Agreed

[@pumasg]

Though their tone is very dismissive of zone 2, the general idea of getting lots of low intensity exercise is what they're advocating for much of the video.

[@lukewalker1051]

I'm 69 y.o. I can carry on a normal conversation aka zone 2 with my heart rate at 155 bpm. My lactate threshold heart rate is about 175. I routinely hit 180 bpm if pushing it on the bike. I bike and swim almost every day. Formula's simply don't work for those that have always been into fitness training and have a frisky heart. My resting heartrate isn't that low at about 52 bpm. Sometimes it dips in the high 40's but quite rare. I am a proponent of zone 2. I used to train with the fastest bike riders in my town and was always in zone 3 and 4 and found myself more exhausted. I still believe at age 69, my max heartrate is around 190 bpm but don't go there because I don't want to find out the consequence. Lower sugar aka limited carbs, intermittent fasting aka routinely 17 hrs fast, 7 hour window eat, good rest and sleep and lots of zone 2 with occasional HIIT thrown in for strength, light weights etc is I believe the key to longevity. People place me in my 50's for age.

[@BMinus0593]

Thanks for sharing, I also have a higher HR, but haven’t seen much concerning info regarding those of us who are healthy but can routinely reach 180+ HR. I’m not sure if this a concern, but I avoid going much above 185 as I am 63 yrs old and don’t want to create a problem.

[@aquamarine99911]

@@BMinus0593 As someone in between your respective ages, all I can say is "WOW!" Even Zone 2-obsessed Peter Attia works out at a HR of 142, and he's only 50 years old. What are your HIIT protocols? Not sure if you guys are genetic freaks, or just have been doing it for decades. I only just started regular exercise a couple of years ago, and some days I'm comfortable at a ~120+ HR, and other days I prefer it around 112. But that's still >70% of my theoretical max HR of 156, so I was assuming I was where I should be. I guess I'll have to determine what my lactate threshold is, but those meters are not cheap and none of the sports medicine clinics in my city have them.

[@HS99876]

👍🏻🏃🏽‍♂️🚴‍♀️🚴🏻‍♂️☀️🫀

[@BMinus0593]

@@aquamarine99911 as far as I know, max heart rate varies depending on the individual. I’m not sure high HR means anything as far as performance goes, but my HR is higher than most I ride with (some slower and some that are faster riders). The fact that I seem to be on the higher end of the range is a bit concerning.

[@fourcubed47]

Same here, I'm 65 years old and my maximum HR is 185. I test it every year by doing several sprints up stairs or a steep hill. I can walk at a normal 3 mph pace wearing a 17-pound weighted vest and be in zone 2 according to most HR zone charts. I feel exercising where I can comfortably carry on a conversation, my HR could be about 30 beats per minute higher. So if I try to calculate my VO2 max using heart rate, it just doesn't work.

[@davidpenwell3432]

Zone 2 is the max I ever do to get in shape. I can do longer distances and longer training sessions. I even last longer at work than people who do high zones for lower amount of time. Also.. it doesn't destroy me knees so I can train harder in lifting

[@rckptt0076]

Yeesh. Not a single mention of the mitochondria which is the entire reason for zone 2 (the zone before lactic acid kicks in ) It takes a half hour to get back to mitochondrial training the monent to switch to lactic acid. Thats why zone 2 matters. Not generic overall "health". What was the point of this video? Utterly ridiculous

[@Jagged_Ice]

You nailed it. These guys have never listened to Dr. Peter Attia cover Zone 2. This video is pointless.

[@chrismonsen]

Exactly. Felt for emotional instead of scientific.

[@thebestthingthatneverhappe6729]

he literally talked about everything u just said in his primal endurance book that came out way before attia and others popularized zone 2 to the masses

[@mikecar52]

@@Jagged_Ice Kenneth Cooper long time before these wankers.

[@precisionmarksman5761]

Two points. At 72, #1 I remember it used to be called "LSD" Training- "Long-Slow-Distance" #2 If you are relatively fit, a better formula to use is 210-1/2 your age. This gives you a higher heart rate threshold.

[@DR_1_1]

Not easy to define thresholds, some say 20 minutes or even 1 hour at max intensity will define your max HR but that's quite subjective, and might even be dangerous if you are not already trained. Then they define the upper limit of Z2 as 83% of that average HR. Those who use ( 220 - age ) define Z2 as 60 to 70% of this number, but obviously both of these systems are approximations...

[@knotwilg3596]

I think the main point is: - professional athletes will get appropriate expert training - amateurs don't need much information, they just need to move If "zone 2" is what motivates you to move, why not. As long as we don't substitute moving with watching YT vids about Z2 or debunking it.

[@richarddrummond9867]

Personally I think it’s quicker and easier to say zone 1 or 2 rather than “low level cardio activity “ what a mouthful 😂

[@JJBpilot]

The point of many coaches on the 80/20, zone 2 stuff is many do their zone 2 to hard, and don't do the 20% (zones 4/5) hard enough. You need to be rested enough from your 2 training to hit the hard days hard!

[@thebestthingthatneverhappe6729]

dude I've run hundreds of vo2 submax test on clients and your comment literally sums up how most people train lol

[@mikafoxx2717]

​@@thebestthingthatneverhappe6729 Do you think sprints + zone 2 is a good combo for VO2 improvement? I'd rather do strength training than prolonged threshold runs.

[@thebestthingthatneverhappe6729]

@mikafoxx2717 sure thing... if muscle is important to you try 1-3 minute threshold intervals on the assault bike, "feel the burn" will release a ton of growth hormone... as long as your healthy enough for intense exercise

[@HS99876]

When it come to being active , people think of walking, going to gym or running!!! Most do walking, it is easy, less injury, less stress on body, time flexibility, ….. But there is also slow jogging, ( nobody talk about 😲) which is as easy as walking but it puts you in zone 2 or higher faster, it is running at speed of walking, much more beneficial than walking, it will raise your heart rate faster which is the goal of doing exercise !!! Doing 40 minutes slow jogging twice a week is more beneficial than same time in gym or walking!!! At 58 started slow jogging last year, now I do three to four runs a week 10 to 15k, 👍🏻🏃🏽‍♂️☀️🫀

[@rj421]

My goodness! A complete lack of scientific discussion on Zone 2 training and its benefits. This is embarrassing, Mark...

[@Funkensturme]

He wrote a book about that.

[@ickdon7999]

Ya, real scientific you are 🙄. Start doing 30 second sprints. When you walk for 3-5 minutes between your sprints, your heart rate will be in your precious “zone 2” lol.

[@ytzmark]

If you ignore the oddly dismissive tone on "zone 2" they are actually in favor of zone 2 training. But they aren't very clear in distinguishing it from "chronic cardio" which I understand is essentially over training at higher sustained HR. I wish they were more clear on that. Also, Mark and Brad, bring back primal con!

[@wuliwong]

Yea it was weird, they seemed so salty but also seemed to basically be in agreement with what they were salty about. 😂

[@thebestthingthatneverhappe6729]

They've been pushing this style for a while but others get all the credit and now it's a huge craze lol... worth being a tad salty over😅

[@trotskyite1]

It's all a con😂

[@Funkensturme]

They were being funny about it because they wrote a book about this method in 2015, it was called "Primal Endurance", in accordance with his brand diet, the "Primal Blueprint". Now they're seeing it becoming popular with a different name and are getting a little jealous.

[@shoqed]

The self importance is strong with these two

[@karenfletcher3153]

I love the concept of listening to our bodies. Rest days are ok. Having soent years tracking numbers, I am ditching the HRM and fitness watch for now! 😊

[@lululove6175]

Mark, I think that you were also on vacation, enjoying a new beautiful environment, eating food that even though they had more carbs, were more from farms, from better soil, and NO stress and maybe unplugging from social media. Most probably had great sleep too from all the walking :). Many factors to be metabolically healthy. Time for all of us to slowdown…its not a bad thing

[@1975normal]

I’m 48 5’11 205lbs. I’m here to learn from your experience. I work out 5 days a week. I do strength training, hiking and walking and the treadmill (with the incline at max) , I listen to my body. I do need to work on my endurance training 🤷🏻‍♂️ I like to push myself physically. It’s very rewarding to see my body respond to each workout, rest days 👍💪🏼

[@jota55581]

I train at zone two twice a week 2 hour long runs this is My base it helps My endurance when i do My Sprint , hills and strength training .It's also very good for mental strength.

[@wuliwong]

These guys are so salty about the zone nomenclature. They are basically having an argument with nobody. Who is saying that you HAVE to do zone 2 to improve cardio? They are doing what is known as a straw man argument.

[@Janus1000]

In fact, if putting something into terms that makes it easier for someone to understand and ends up being the path that enables them find an entry into a fitness regiment that works for them.. what’s the problem?

[@slumking112]

Wisdom comes from experience and this guy is giving you the blueprint to becoming better physically....becoming intuitive about training and recovery comes from years of studying your personal performance through years....great video...

[@amyhoop9651]

Thank you for these great examples and the good advice.

[@quengmingmeow]

I think the issue with the zones is that people tend to think that the zones are like body switches when instead they are like faders. Point blank, it isn’t that you get “no angiogenesis” in zone 3…..it’s just not as optimal as zone 2. Looking at the zones through the lens of “what is optimal” is absolutely essential for those looking to get the most bang for the buck when investing the time in exercise. If I have 90 minutes today to do exercise, I want to make every minute count to achieving the goal I am after.

[@dmk5n1]

'faders' is a great analogy

[@MikeSzekely]

Wow. This has answered a bunch of my questions & has given me much clarity. I’m NOT going to get hung up on my “zone”, but keep the emphasis on being consistently active…THANK YOU!!!

[@cwoza5]

Peter Attia has left the chat.

[@richardmiddleton7770]

It was Andy Coggan who came up with the zones but they were measured by power on a bike based on lactate production or FTP. They were then correlated to heart rate. As power is more accurate and immediate he had 7 zones, but anything above zone 5 (vo2 max) is impossible to measure with heart rate so for training with heart rate we stick to 5 zones. Zone 6 is anaerobic (20-120 seconds or there abouts), zone 7 is neuromuscular (all out sprint, 1-20 seconds).

[@richc8095]

It was Sally Edwards that came up with it IronMan competitor

[@AA-gw6wd]

The jealousy is palpable. The reason for zone 2 popularity is the combo of science and a particular personality. If you truly cared about public health you’d be celebrating not getting snarky because it doesn’t happen to be centered around you, you didn’t do the mitochondrial science and you didn’t communicate it in the most relevant way. Sorry.

[@Funkensturme]

Spot on, man!

[@johnsapplications]

Zone 2 is quantifiable. it is handy. it prevents injury. so long as you improve who gives a shit what you call it. what you used to call it or what it is called now is just nomenclature I can't be bothered with. It works for me and can be easily programmed into my Garmin.

[@timshel011]

Thanks for reinforcing something I ""always" knew...

[@frankd1682]

In other words for those of us in our 70’s, do what you can but do something!

[@nanthilrodriguez]

The "revelation" about "zone 2" is about the ratio of zone 2 training to training in other zones for an increase in endurance performance, rather than about the discovery of "zone 2" itself. The idea being that you aren't actually gaining as much by going harder for shorter periods aka "hiit" training. Many, including myself would bypass baseline cardio training, thinking if I just hammer it all the time, then I'll increase my performance, but the research has demonstrated that by increasing the floor, your baseline cardiovascular fitness, you're increasing your total capacity, thereby increasing endurance performance. This is a revelation to me, as I was always taught I needed to give 110% all the time. Well, actually, you don't. Your body gets more out of longer periods at lighter loads than you do out of short, high intensity loads.

[@thebestthingthatneverhappe6729]

for endurance improvements yes u r spot on... but a college basketball player can develop a great vo2 from so much HIIT on the court without having great endurance capabilities

[@nanthilrodriguez]

@@thebestthingthatneverhappe6729 incorrect. you can only raise your ceiling with relation to the floor. You need to raise your floor before you attempt to raise the ceiling, not to mention the capacity for high intensity will increase with a higher cardio baseline. Basketballers run at zone 2 all the time, it just isn't dedicated training. It's just playing the game

[@thebestthingthatneverhappe6729]

@@nanthilrodriguez I've measured hundreds of vo2's... how many have you measured???

[@nanthilrodriguez]

@@thebestthingthatneverhappe6729 Measuring? Neat! How many training schedules have you planned?

[@thebestthingthatneverhappe6729]

@@nanthilrodriguez hundreds

[@chrislamkin9647]

A little petty because "primal" didn't take off like Zone 2 has.

[@Funkensturme]

Yes!! Hahahaha.

[@edtechspecialist]

IMO, the snark of their attitude toward the zone 2 terminology was a bit beneath Mark. I love his videos and overall message in his fitness journey, so I'm disappointed in their mocking tone regarding the popularity of "zone 2" as a sweet spot for training. For runners, the term LSD became popularized in the 70s and 80s and helped athletes maintain a form of zone 2 training. It's a truism in all fields that terminology comes and goes even if some concepts are universal. Besides Mark Sisson, other health and fitness influencers I follow include Peter Attia who has touted the benefits of zone 2 training. I wonder if he and Mark have ever crossed paths.

[@takakonobe]

It's basically a cadence run. It got my time up in the military.

[@BB-gj8ck]

Peter Attia is always talking about “zone 2”.

[@btownshreds1]

And he’s damn right about it.

[@thegearboxman]

What if you simply don't have time to spend hours in "zone 2" or whatever you want to call it? Studies have shown that you get a bigger boost to VO2max and LT by high intensity training. No shit! My take on that is that if you only have a couple of hours available per week then it seems to be pretty much a waste of time spending that very limited time in this zone 2 area at the expense of sufficient speed work. Pro athletes whose job it is to train for several hours per day can't really be compared to a recreational runner who squeezes in the odd run between life's constant distractions.

[@blissfulbrain80]

This. Most people don’t have near enough time for a true “aerobic base” through low intensity training. I think even Maffetone recommended a minimum of 45 min daily to see results. Most people don’t have that much time to do aerobic training. Further you still have to do the hard work to see real improvement in performance.

[@likearollingstone007]

They are so arrogant it’s almost funny

[@patpatmoomoo5524]

I read about this concept in Dr Barry sears book “ the zone” when I was a teen in the late 90’s

[@elidas1008]

Regarding the weight loss, the quality of the food in Europe has its effect too.

[@dang2523]

Mark was right the whole time and everyone ignored him! Pooey on Zone 2 zealots!

[@Funkensturme]

To be fair, it wasn't Mark, he just rebranded it as Primal Endurance and promoted it. The real inventor of this method was Dr. Phil Maffetone and Mark gave him the credit.

[@youknow6968]

What's zone 2 in RPM on a stationary exercise bike?

[@Cloppa2000]

I think you guys are missing the point of the zones! I am totally sedentary but lift weights. For me walking is zone 2! I listened to Bart Kay who says LISS is useless and to just sprint! But this is only for fit people! For the last two sundays I sprinted 8x20s 1st week and only managed 6x20s 2nd week. I think I'm lucky that at 60yrs old I'm still in pretty good physical shape and so haven't killed myself yet! However, I went for a walk/jog 1min off 1min on yesterday and it was very hard for me! Also previously after long layoffs from any exercise, the thing that got me back into it was when my car broke down and I had to walk 3 miles from the mechanic's home and then back the same day! After this one-off event, I started walking more, then jogging then got back into boxing which is extremely hard! So my theory now is.. if you move a lot and walk a lot you are already doing your zone 1 and 2 and you don't need to do any extra of this.. But , if you're like me and sit all day and then maybe lift weights 2-3 times a week you need to do some specific zone 1 & 2 training and the zones are there as a guide to intensity. I like to know what zone 2 is for me and at the moment it is slow jog/walk to stay in range. Hopefully I can improve this to where zone 2 will be constant jogging. Boxers and footballers still to this day do LISS. Their zone 2 is fast jogging!! which for me is zone 4-5!! If you don't move and then just do sprints it's like fitting a nitrous kit to your clapped out 60yr old engine! It's gonna blow!! So basically we need to do zone 1 & zone 2 training (unless you already do this naturally in your normal days activities) and then we can add the zone 5 or sprint training onto it.

[@crazeeaz]

Having a conversation about zone 2 that doesn't mention mitochondria or lactate isn't a serious conversation and can be ignored.

[@thomasslagle9715]

Maybe they are snarky, but I appreciate anyone questioning the utility of the 80/20 model for everyone. I think it's great for endurance athletes. But it did not work for me. I hated the 80 % part -- jogging for an hour was just for me incredibly boring. But I loved the 20 % -- I just love to sprint. And I love to compete. I compete in masters events in the 200 (because I love sprints) and the 800 (because thats where I'm most competitive). I'm 71 and did not start running until I was 64. The first couple of years I used an 80 - 20 model and it didn't help my times at all. And I can promise you there's not much out there on training a 71 year old 800 runner. So I'm forced to come up with my own plan. 1 day is almost always hill sprints or running stairs (just 8 to 10 of normally 20 seconds each). Plenty of walking between each one. 1 day a week I do fartlek for an hour or hour and a half -- guess that's my long run for the week. Other 2 days that I train I will do either 4 x 200 or 8 x100 at my 800 goal pace. The rest between depends on how I feel. Since I started this sort of 20 -- 80 training I've knocked 20 seconds off my 800 times. But only 2 seconds off the 200. Who knows? Maybe I could improve my 200s by adding in some really short super intense sprints ( 10 to 50 meters). To the extent that these guys are saying we each have to find our own way I have to agree. One thing I think I've learned is that the more you enjoy the training the better your performance will improve.

[@rebeccaw68]

I agree with you!! This "new" type of exercise was called brisk walking , vigorous housework 😂😂

[@aethylwulfeiii6502]

Polarized training it the Moto of elite endurance athletes the world over (80 percent zone 2 5% tempo, and 15% vo2 max- neuromsucular) The zone 2 phase is done becuase riding 20 hours a week is a lot. This is what works for people training for any event over <a href="#" class="seekto" data-time="120">2:00</a> minutes in length. This isn’t an optimal strategy for sprinting it’s for slow twitchers.

[@iancarson8614]

So many errors in this video. Totally unaware of what the point of Z2 actually is.

[@leonarddomingo341]

I would’ve listened more if you actually read some of the scientific studies around “zone 2” or low intensity steady state without having to make fun of where the name comes from. There’s studies around it that you completely ignored and dismissed.

[@At3nT]

<a href="#" class="seekto" data-time="280">4:40</a> Dont forget the food is way more healthy, less sugar and all

[@3morecats]

See Alan Couzens or Joe Friel for definition and how to use for training. Not a new idea.

[@jjjjames5824]

I still think if you're a competitive athlete (in just about any sport that lasts 1 minute or more) then a prolonged 2-4 months period of aerobic base only (as outlined in primal endurance) is the way to go

[@kennethmorris219]

Obviously didn't get the memo Dr. Inigo San-Millan PHD.

[@slowcyclist4324]

Never a finer example of how inadequate knowledge of a topic can lead someone to totally misunderstand an issue. Zone 2 is more than just about fat burn or specific heart rates, it’s about optimising your workout zones to train specific muscular and aerobic adaptations, with mitochondrial functionality being a big factor. You could be constantly active, but have a shit energetic system that still pre-disposes you to many illnesses despite all that hard exercise, a point which you completely missed.

[@davidflorez1196]

Can you please expand in the mitochondrial functionality improvement with zone two training?

[@thebestthingthatneverhappe6729]

Mark talked about this in his book and a lot ties with diet, he just didn't touch on it in this video, if not efficient at using fat as a fuel source u can train zone 2 a bunch and still have a hard time using fat as a fuel source... if u eat carbs right before zone 2 workout u will still have a hard time using fat as a fuel source

[@MoneyStrategiesSOULutions]

​@@thebestthingthatneverhappe6729you mean one must eat a low carb diet in order to have zone 2 work?

[@thebestthingthatneverhappe6729]

@MoneyStrategiesSOULutions don't have to be, just depends which fuel source u want to use

[@y.g.1313]

zone 2 mainly promoted by P. Attia... seems that Mark missed the crucial element of it, kind of dumb? and that is: lactate threshold, meaning to perform just below the level of intensity where your lactate start rising, so you can keep going ~45 minutes, which will deliver MAXIMUM cardiovascular benefit for the body. Hey, you can go at 'any' speed, much slower, but that will not deliver maximum benefit, which bring us to the main point: Attia was in pro-level sports for many years (that's like training 5+ hrs per day, and now being near 50) he intuitively tries to find modality with maximum benefit, which will put you somewhere nr top 1% of performance level in your cohort. THAT is the point. If you are ok being in mere top 10% or somewhere above 50% mark- never mind, do anything random and you can be better than average. Mark's philosophy now is: ok to be near top 10%, but not good enough to be in top 1%.

[@richc8095]

It's good to see that we have the two old Muppets for the Muppet show discussing health based off of their experience from the 1930s😂 who developed the zones was Sally Edwards Ironman competitor, developed a five training zone system. You understand technology gets better and better as time goes kind of like a black and white TV. I figured this is a great analogy for you guys can understand. You're bad advice is going to end up to long-term injuries by dismissing certain zones to train in

[@randomgirl-lj3xi]

Whats he talking about its from maffetone not a machine brand. Ive decided to quit zone 2 focus as i find i improve quicker

[@noosphericaltarzan]

I think the problem these two don’t mention is that base training (i.e. lots of zone 2 cardio) to improve mitochondrial counts and capillary density with the goal of improving VO2Max and endurance seems to reduce your max speed. If you care about sprinting, as I believe the man on the left does, then excessive zone 2 cardio may not be of high value to you - especially since type 1 muscle fibers have little use to you anyway. I am very interested in sprinting and middle distance to 5k. I am unsure exactly how to thread this needle.

[@Funkensturme]

Peter Attia says that top athletes, even from these categories that you mentioned, train in Zone 2 for 80% of their training volume, the rest being high intensity training. I didn't fact check this but you could look into it with this information I just said.

[@samueleketorp2628]

If you don’t do your high intensity work properly, only mooching around in zone 2 will make you slower. But if you want to be able to sprint 5 k, a solid base will let your body absorb the high intensity work much better at reduced risk of injury. 80-20 really is a good way to go about it. But do keep the low intensity stuff low, and the high intensity stuff really tough.

[@samueleketorp2628]

If you don’t do your high intensity work properly, only mooching around in zone 2 will make you slower. But if you want to be able to sprint 5 k, a solid base will let your body absorb the high intensity work much better at reduced risk of injury. 80-20 really is a good way to go about it. But do keep the low intensity stuff low, and the high intensity stuff really tough.

[@aaronpeta]

Mark Sisson eating pasta! What did I miss?

[@jl3567]

Strava taught me zone 1-5

[@nielsnik]

Since you guys have not mentioned anything about the relationship between Zone 2 training and mitochondrial efficiency, which in turn, according some latest scientific research, is the ONLY way one can multiply mitochondria and also enhance one's VO2 Max, which in turn is the sole variable that is highly correlated with low mortality rates for any reason, I'm afraid you are missing the point.

[@3Unique]

I had never heard of Mr Sissons before KZbin fed me one of his videos but he sounds as though his thinking is a bit siloed. And frankly his smiling in a dismissive way to obviously leading questions about zone 2 doesn’t not make it likely that I will listen to him or take him seriously. Don't get me wrong he looks in great shape and as though he has a lot of fun, but that is probably down to mindset and money as much as anything else. I would rather take on board what the likes or Peter Attia, Andrew Huberman, Rhonda Patrick have to say (and there guests) and also Iñigo San Millán. They have a much more scientific and research backed approach to living longer and increasing your health span. Zone 2 works for me. I have been running for about 17 years and mainly in zone 2 since I bought Rich Roll's book in 2014 and read about the MAF (Phil Maffetone) method. So contrary to what Mr Sissons implies Zone 2 training is not something that has just popped up on social media, it has been around for 30+ years.

[@dallasball6624]

Thought max was 220 minus age equal max heart rate and then take percentages from there.

[@danielryan3442]

Do some homework. Polar was talking about training zones in the 1970s. You must decide to train for either healthy or fit. Simple way is 80-20 just put it together any way one wants. 80 is the 180 minus age the 20 is reaching within ten beats per minute of max. Why spend all this time on nothing. For what it is worth I have been at it for over sixty years. As to food come on carbs stripped from nutrients will kill you. Protein is necessary for increase fitness. Balance of food just natural of course will work. finally do 500 minutes a week with interval fasting with protein entry into the ending the fastng stage will lose weight. Forget all the talking it is very simple. Do the work and it happens. Stop talking about junk.

[@thebestthingthatneverhappe6729]

u r right lol

[@y.g.1313]

zone 2 mainly promoted by P. Attia... seems that Mark missed the crucial element of it, kind of dumb? and that is: lactate threshold, meaning to perform just below the level of intensity where your lactate start rising, so you can keep going ~45 minutes, which will deliver MAXIMUM cardiovascular benefit for the body. Hey, you can go at 'any' speed, much slower, but that will not deliver maximum benefit, which bring us to the main point: Attia was in pro-level sports for many years (that's like training 5+ hrs per day, and now being near 50) he intuitively tries to find modality with maximum benefit, which will put you somewhere nr top 1% of performance level in your cohort. THAT is the point. If you are ok being in mere top 10% or somewhere above 50% mark- never mind, do anything random and you can be better than average. Mark's philosophy now is: ok to be near top 10%, but not good enough to be in top 1%.

[@Thejoeordinary1]

Relax. Don’t overthink it. Move more. Eat less. It’s just not supposed to be this complicated.

[@kenwilliams8067]

Umm, if you’re going to critique zone 2 training interest, you’ve got to critique the research findings.

[@cossamaximus8770]

Yeah yeah okay!!! Whatever, tell Dr iñigo san millán, coach of many a professional cycling teams that his riders don’t believe in zone 2! His riders compete at the highest levels and zone 2 is a HUGE part of his training methods. Let’s see , zone 2, outlined by devices like an Apple Watches and the likes are well basically rubbish, but professionally lab tested zone two heart rate zone training is one of the best tools we have to improve our overall health, endurance and cardiovascular performance. Debunking a proven method of train to me seems like a way to draw people into a video on KZbin, it drew me in lol and yes the video had some value and good points, but for people in the know, it doesn’t debunk zone 2 training at all!!

[@simonrankin9177]

The guy in the yellow shirt ,has the body i wish to look like ...

[@JJBpilot]

Ex professional triathlete...

[@simonrankin9177]

@@JJBpilot great update thanks...

[@jacksondnj]

This was a completely lame video. 1. Make a clickbait title 2. Talk about how science doesn’t matter, just do what “feels right”. 3. Be snooty and condescending. 4. Give no actionable advice. 5. Push the ‘publish’ button

[@hamidaabdenour9092]

200-age 😂😂😂😂 what a scientific declaration

[@thebestthingthatneverhappe6729]

no 180 minus age, works much better than you would think... I've run hundreds of vo2 submax tests on clients

[@allnewnow2023]

Let's not call anything anything. Surely it's all trying to refine understandable concepts for people. Health isn't this complex!!!!!!!!!

[@mikecar52]

Kenneth Cooper introduced me to zone 2 in about 1970. Long time before you 2 clowns.

[@jumpropestairs6129]

They come up with lables and new packaging. Noyhing new ub Nder the sun

[@btownshreds1]

This is trash. Zone 2 is scientifically proven to build a strong aerobic capacity. TF!

[@mattprince6858]

Thanks for selling out primal foods, just anther disappointment ! I will stop buying, such a bummer.

[@mrmrlee]

These guys probably spend most of their time in Zone 2 and don't even know it.

[@Yarradras]

Whats the point this video wants to make? The content has nothing to do with the title. 1. Obviously all exercise does exercise the heart. But training the heart is not (or solely) the goal of zone 2 training. See point 3. 2. Depending on what adaptation you want your body to make, your training should include more of one kind of training and less of the other. 3. Training in Zone 2 is essential to train the metabolism and the slow-twitch fibers in your muscles and as a result build aerobic capacity (the ability to use oxygen and fat to produce atp which in turn is used in the muscles to move). But it also depends on your overall fitness. If you have a very well developed aerobic capacity you are better off training less in Zone 2 but more in Zone 1 because your Zone 2 effort will have a higher biomechanical strain on your body compared to your training effect. This is why amateurs should not copy pro athletes. You are not trying to achieve the same thing. 4. Heart rate zones are not arbitrary. They describe what happens in your body at certain intensities. The heart rate is a mere proxy for that. What actually is interesting is the lactate buildup in your muscles. The whole point of Zone 1 & 2 training is to delay the lactate buildup. 5. The rule of thumb formulas they are talking about are wrong for most people. Also the Maffatone formula and the max heart rate formula calculate two different things and are confused in this video. If you really want to know your zones, do a lactate threshhold test. Or if you don't want to do that, go out and do max effort test to find out your actual max heart rate to calculate the percentage based zones. For most people this will suffice. 6. Your max heart rate is NO indicator of fitness or performance. My own max heart is around 220 and has barely changed in the last 10 years. But I am much slower runner than 10 years ago because I barely worked out for the last 5 years. 7. Walking is indeed very beneficial for your health. Depending on your aerobic fitness, a brisk walk might already put you in Zone 2, especially if you have no history of aerobic base training (Zone 2 training) and/or are overweight. 8. As I said in point 2, depending on what you want to achieve, Zone 2 aerobic training might not be a priority. But it barely hurts, especially for general fitness and health.

[@allnewnow2023]

Yes...but...a basic routine, and discipline saves you from thinking too much. Then use common sense! NOT COMPLICATED!

[@someguyusa]

Dude is showing his grumpy old man side. He’s wrong and clearly doesn’t understand the concept nor cares to actually learn about it. What utter ignorant comments. Disappointing.

[@Thelucky23]

This is silly, you’re speaking about an experience of you being on vacation for 4months. And trying to compare that to people who work at McDonald’s (high cortisol; on more than average), barely have a home, and making it sound like it’s super normal to walk for 8 hours a day and take breaks doing nothing for days in a row…. Get real. Andrew Huberman has many guests from many walks of life all Dr and scientist (PhD recipients) explaining the different reasons for the different “zones”, the different heart rates ( I don’t know why you’re being petty?!?! ) you know these things though. Also your zone 2 cardio because of your age is low…. So you probably were in zone 2 and didn’t even notice it. 😅 I like to watch both sides and the opinions in the middle sometimes you learn the right the wrong and ignorant… 😢😮😂

[@RunningMan87]

These guys are all over the place...

[@tonyb.3902]

It’s funny how this guy is actually advocating for Zone 2, but the video is titled zone 2 debunked.😂

[@stephanel4770]

“never heard of it”? about Z2? He SHOULD know as it is all over the literature and he is a longevity specialist. He lost me right there. If you haven’t read about it or studied it, that means you are stagnant in your research and not interested to increase your knowledge. Disappointing.

[@Funkensturme]

He was being sarcastic. Watch it again and you will notice it. He wrote a book about it. He was just pissed because it didn't became popular the way he branded it like zone 2 is popular now.

[@PaulRamen]

what's with all the sarcasm of the host

[@PatrickDale1968]

So many of your own recommendations put people into zone 2. You’re just dissing your own training recommendations. Your vacation brisk walking was probably Z2. It’s a shame you feel the need to tear down training methods that oppose your own, when you should be encouraging people to exercise in whatever way they enjoy.

[@jdhaole7650]

Completely pointless video!

[@samueleketorp2628]

Two old farts whining about scientific progress in a field they thought they owned. Of course progress can be made at all heart rates. The point is that the aerobic base is very important to building a body capable of absorbing heavy training without the need for recovery associated with higher intensity. Call it what you want, zone 2, low intensity, recovery run. Your body doesn’t care what you call what your doing to it, only what you give it and ask of it.

[@GregariousAntithesis]

Fuk zone 2, the majority of my exercise is at around 140 bpm for an hour 3 times a week and even the other 3 days when i do a walk/run interval of 3 miles still cycles my heart up to 140 a number of times during the exercise. Yes lower heart rate exercise is more fat burning percentage specific but higher heart rate exercise in general burns more fuel so you still can end up burning as much or more fat because of the large amount of fuel at large burned.

[@aquamarine99911]

What is your age, roughly? Peter Attia (at age 50) does his Zone 2 at 142. I personally don't think Zone 2 is high fat burning. That would be Zone 1. At least according to my Polar HR app.

[@osint6372]

80/20

[@relevantbrother8964]

The thing ive found is that i used to do a lot of HIIT and weight training but when i tried zone 2 i had crap base cardio fitness..as i got fitter in zone 2 ,it helped me increased ny fitness at higher levels ie hiit and weights but the reverse didn't apply.

[@aklakahmed8637]

I swesr its 200 minus your age, when did it become 180-age lmao

[@trotskyite1]

He's a lazy git😂

[@WYNNBETS]

Zone 2 is for sophisticated & retired-rich people because they have the time for it. The rest of us have less time and bills to pay. Lol.

[@MrTantriq]

How can these guys be so arrogant and so (scientifically) wrong, at the same time. Dude has no idea what he’s talking about. Wow.

[@timk404]

Wow, Sour grapes much? Mark, I have a lot of respect for you and your message but this comes across as pretty weak. Sure, you have been pushing the same message under different terminology for a long time. However, the fact that it took off because someone else did a better job of marketing, articulating it and getting the message out results on you trying to disparage or mock what they have obviously done a better job of demonstrates a character flaw, not superiority.

[@RLekhy]

No science only blah blah....

[@davidjd123]

better your wife find out you're into cross training than into cross dressing.

[@ronstorebo5634]

Your bitterness from not doing a better job marketing your research is nauseating. Grow up ladies.

[@jascfdrac]

Non cientific opinion.

[@matthewthehawk1066]

This is really bad science. It’s frustrating to keep watching this garbage. The heart morphology changes are completely different from zone 2 training as opposed to “weightlifting”. Doug Mcguff is unfortunately wrong and this video misses the point. Probably because both the people in this video are not exercise scientists.

[@brannonferguson5936]

You should probably have and understand of what Zone 2 is before you can debunk it😂 It’s definitely not 180 - age. Anything to make a dollar.

[@mr.samson6850]

Zone 2 4 and 5 should be combined if u want to be shredded

[@danielryan3442]

finally just train to a heart monitor at every age. As we get older and our max heart beat comes down then the sweet heart rate moves lower. Especially I am 78 so must watch it because walking can result in too high. No you cannot get great results just ignoring the rules. I did HIIT for six months driving heart rate to 110% an wound up throwing a clot and almost lost it. For history and warning just google Jim Fixx.

[@wmp3346]

Brad should use some grecian formula on his hair

[@flyingosom202]

you did yourself a disservice here by all the smug mocking of "zone 2"