Marvel TV Officially Dead? - Hawkeye Episode 6 Breakdown

[@FlameThrowerDuck]

The part where Hawkeye got his eyes surgically replaced with an actual hawks eyes for brand synergy was wild

[@viswajithsaravanan4419]

Whyyy

[@FlameThrowerDuck]

@@viswajithsaravanan4419 i believe Kate told him having a gimmick like that would help him be a more popular avenger

[@arthand7672]

They were actually doves, to symbolize peace

[@Devon.with.an.i]

What episode??

[@PittsburghSonido]

@@FlameThrowerDuck He’s gunna have a face replacement with John Krasinski.

[@hellojonnyhoskinghello]

the part where kate bishop shoots kingpin in the head then flies away on a massive hawk saying ‘i aim to please’ had me trembling

[@JKissoon1]

As I read this I went from confused to amused to near death by laughter at "i aim to please" 🤣

[@mkocel]

LOL i loved that part

[@-MrFozzy-]

……..aims to Pin King

[@MixedTapeVideosNBA]

"This is a world where there's some pretty odd stuff" Cut to Jeremy Renner's haricut in Endgame*

[@kitaster1546]

Collings you sly Cooper you

[@johnnytee911]

Damn. I spent so much time trying to refind that line to make this same comment Lol

[@elijahblechman8633]

@casi dead internet example #1.

[@ashleytuchin7693]

I'm glad I'm not the only one who noticed that.

[@jikew7364]

i always thought yelena’s elaborate pony tail is to mirror Clint’s vengeful haircut

[@BrokenFingerParadise]

I thought this was a fun show and enjoyed it overall. My main complaint (mainly with this episode) is that they brought in Kingpin too late. It would have been better if he had shown up earlier and had a bit more menace around him, perhaps do some show of strength to show what he's like. I can imagine if you didn't watch daredevil this random large man showing up and being revealed to be in charge of everything may have seemed out of nowhere (especially when the show he's on is on another streaming provider and you are unsure what is and isn't canon now of the netflix timeline) Despite the hints being dropped about him showing up you aren't really given much of a chance to get to the know the character. For him to be introduced and be defeated in the same episode deflated his presence, just so they could have a big reveal later on in the series (even though I loved seeing the actor back and enjoyed the fight and his performance) I know it's a bit of a joke but having madame mask be the villain (or just the mum being revealed to be some fighting villain who could battle Kate) would have been a better use of that character at least and felt a lot more earned than the actual main villain of the show showing up last episode. Like I said it was still a fun, light-hearted show and I enjoyed it overall, but a few missteps held it back

[@zoser595]

I couldn’t say it better (or make the Swordsman the villain and having he and Clint some sort of master/student conflict ala Star Wars).

[@capness1228]

The MCU has always been designed to build on what has come before. If someone thinks the Kingpin isn't imposing because for some reason they started watching at what by my quick math is the 270th hour of a story so they didn't see him cave a man's skull in with a car door, that is on them. There has never been a good reason to think the Netflix shows aren't canon, and now there are two very good reasons to think they are.

[@snakekingblues3017]

kingpin could just be setup for him down the road no way they kill him they would be a fool

[@jorg3023]

This comment. Couldn't have said it better myself.

[@roboturtle5028]

@@capness1228 "Building on what came before", yeah and his appearance lacked any intrigue that made his depiction great to begin with. If you have to watch another property to find the character menacing, that's bad writing and direction. Let's not put MCU on a pedestal, a good cinematic universe builds on the past and adds to it.

[@PittsburghSonido]

The real hero of the show was Tony Dalton as Jack. His swordplay during the final fight was so amazing. Lmao

[@zoser595]

Hot take! He should have been the main villain of the show.

[@vapause7268]

@@zoser595 Honestly, with the way the show was portraying him, I thought he was gonna be the mastermind behind everything. Him being a genuinely good guy was alright on its own, I enjoyed it enough, but I think if they had gone into more detail with him manipulating the Bishop family, it could have led to something more interesting.

[@noahcooke5174]

I thought they could have done a better job with his character, he should have been a villain as Tony Dalton is magnificent at portraying a villain, like in Better Call Saul.

[@AngelA-mk5ty]

@@vapause7268 i kinda like his characterization he pretty much is just an aloof guy thats kinda like a puppy

[@SuperCrazyEstonian]

I hated him. He was so annoying. Everything about him rubbed me the wrong way. Until he started cutting fools left and right. "Oh shit, dude is executing guys on the street." Instantly fell in love with the character :D So goofy, such a badass, but also a moron. Loved it.

[@zsyounicorn]

With the musical scene, I was fully expecting a cameo in the audience, mostly with Paul Rudd. Like it zooms in and he's vibing but when he sees Ant-Man on stage he's like "I wasn't there?"

[@corn4090]

right ? 💀

[@jonathanross149]

The pulled out to the audience, and I was like Old Man Steve? Missed opportunities.

[@lil_sushi9663]

Or a scene of Kate and Yelena getting a drink like they talked about

[@ObiePictures]

I’ve been saying exactly this for the last 6 weeks

[@jlmurph2]

@@averyhofmann5612 The only movie that had a post credit scene save it was Venom 2. Maybe Captain Marvel. Others are just little treats for people that stayed.

[@directorliam]

Far out, Clint was the one who killed Echo’s dad, why does anyone think otherwise? He spent five years as Ronin killing criminals and said he was tipped off by a Kingpin informant. He did it.

[@FrankLeeYoung]

My dude Fisk took an arrow to the chest, was struck by an oncoming SUV into a brick wall of a building and then hit with explosive arrows point blank. That pretty much foreshadowed his survivability of taking that one gunshot. He's going to brush it off like Tuesday for Bison.

[@isaiahtapia287]

Maya shoots him in the face in the comics and he survives. Pretty sure it was a tease for the echo series.

[@Decipher13]

A Mercedes S Class is not an SUV lol

[@SceneWins]

We don’t even see him get shot. They may blind him like in the comics, but I think it’s just as likely that shot was him killing Maya.

[@Decipher13]

@@SceneWins Maya aka Echo gets her own show soon, so she's got plot armor

[@alexism9656]

@@polygoncoco I wouldn't call them morons. It did made it seem like he died. If you don't know anything about Kingpin because you only watched the Hawkeye series, then you wouldn't be so sure if he survived.

[@thebloodyaussie1458]

There's no way that they would bring back Kingpin and kill him off, especially off screen. The camera tilt is definitely done on purpose. Either Maya shot him in a non vital area like the arm or leg as a warning not to come after her or his pure muscle mass just stopped the bullet from penetrating deeply (like how he stopped Kate's arrow in his chest)

[@chrisevans3944]

In the comics she shoots him point blank in the face and he survives with damage to his eyes

[@comicbooknerd3570]

@@chrisevans3944 yeah he was basically blind for a short time

[@PittsburghSonido]

If she shot him in the chest, he did have bullet resistant suits…. All I’m saying.

[@Wico90YT]

Blindpin was a thing in the comics...and with Echo and She Hulk there's definitely areas for him to come back

[@Devon.with.an.i]

Idk I kind of feel like they brought him back to tie up his loose ends (in where he’s at in the mcu). His story’s already been told. I wouldn’t mind seeing him more, but I don’t mind this being the end.

[@bigchief2547]

Kingpin had guys offing themselves in Daredevil but then he wears a goofy ass hat, it’s probably the Christmas spirit

[@SceneComparisons]

hey look, it's the guy who knows nothing about comics, commenting about comics he wears the EXACTLY the same clothes on the comics

[@Knightfall182]

Now he has the tracksuit bros as his minions. He went from the Clancy Brown Lex to Gene Hackman

[@l0kumidit641]

@@SceneComparisons just because it was done in the comics doesn’t mean it will translate well in live action you dunce

[@christieblackwood7807]

@@l0kumidit641 you're the only dunce here

[@noamasaf2668]

Pessimist its just a hawaiian shirt under a suit jacket. its a kinda odd fit but its def not comparable to a skirt and the H on hawkeye’s mask

[@MrLarry]

Boys. Clint killed Maya’s dad. He said so. He said he was tipped off by one of Kingpin’s men. That’s why she’s offside with Fisk and Kazi

[@doomstadt2371]

Thank you. Sometimes I wonder if they watch the show or its just on and they're in front of it lol.

[@R2LEE2]

That's right, It's quite a bit of the focus for the first 4/5 or dare i say 6 episodes.

[@hastyscorpion]

He said he was there. He did not say he did it.

[@MrLarry]

@@hastyscorpion he was explaining why he was there - because he was tipped off. He wasn’t just saying “yeah I was here that night, separately from a different person who was also the Ronin who I’ve never mentioned and also they actually killed your father but I want you to think I’m the one who did it for some reason”

[@Ryan-0413]

@@MrLarry Also how he mentioned that rage can be directed, like how he (as Ronin) in his rage, was directed by someone (Fisk or Kazi or, I guess, both) to kill Maya’s dad and the rest of the group at that car dealership

[@NuxyrYT]

The last episode just left me with a "These guys must have an insane body count compared to other Marvel heroes" feeling. I doubt that most people Jack sliced open with a sword survived. Glad he had this much fun killing them though.

[@enriqueguang9843]

For some reason I got the vibe that Jack was tilting the sword and not hitting people with the edge. So just hitting them.

[@TheAserghui]

I loved how Jack just went with the flow and hopped into the battle like a kid in a candy store. So oblivious, amazing character.

[@micahwright5901]

@@TheAserghui he’s a heck of a lot of fun to watch

[@alexlemonds2838]

Speaking as a big fan of the 90s Spidey cartoon, I'd love to see Fisk show up in the next trilogy.

[@FrankLeeYoung]

Seeing Fisk fight Spidey would be the dream! A lot of dreams came true this week including Fisk simply appearing so I'm feeling good about these chances.

[@GrizzlyTank]

I'm super stoked to see Kingpin show up along with the classic spidey villains we saw in No Way Home like Doc Oc, the Lizard, Electro, Green Goblin. As the sky was breaking open we caught a glimpse of Scorpion, Rhino, and Kraven the Hunter. Plus we also got a piece of the venom symbiote show up in the MCU. It looks like we're going to get a ton of the classic villains from the 90's Animated Series and I'm loving it!

[@wmascolin]

I really wanted to see him hug someone to death

[@Dragoon77]

That show was really the best, it had EVERYTHING

[@BetaBreaking]

@@GrizzlyTank Holy shit man you just sparked an idea! I have a feeling they're going to have Rhino, Scorpion, Kraven and Venom as potential villian's for his next trilogy. Could easily have their own version of the Sinister Six. That's unless they introduce their own Osborn and Otto into the mix (which I'd like to see). Possibly Daredevil team-up against Kingpin. Shits looking bright going forward!

[@anthonybogdan5502]

I hate musicals but the line in it where they said “if the city is trashed when you take a bow we will blame you then but you’re good for now “ made me laugh so hard

[@kronemerj]

Same

[@R3DSH1FT196]

A subtle nod to the Sokovia Accords...

[@erikuu96]

worst end credit scene ever

[@zoser595]

Someone on Twitter said this and I absolutely agree: Netflix Marvel had a fascination with 13 episode seasons and they often ran too long. Disney+ Marvel has a fascination with 6 episode seasons and they run too short.

[@ShmuckLord385]

Amazon usually goes with 8, from what I've seen of their equivalent shows, and It might be the magic number. The Expanse and The Boys feel perfectly paced each season, no second half boredom and no rushed development, for the most part *COUGH* Wheel of Time episode 1 *COUGH*

[@hevykevy316]

@@ramihearts yeah, but the early episodes of Wandavision were pretty short.

[@levels1937]

No Hawkeye has the pacing of a 13 hr series but is less than 6.

[@CloneMalone]

Coming right off watching Daredevil for the first time, seeing Fisk just flop people around with no blood, no bone crunching, or no 11 minute one shotters, was very bizarre and weird.

[@nicholash1691]

Got to tone it down for the m she u

[@elijahblechman8633]

@@nicholash1691 did you have a stroke there?

[@dr.s8972]

@@nicholash1691 it's a bad use of the character

[@codagaming9186]

People do realize he is also a spiderman villain right? Even in the comics he isn't always super gritty. The grit is more of a staple from Daredevil.

[@kmc4816]

@@codagaming9186 a regular human using his bare hands doesn’t make sense as a Spider-Man villain in the MCU. There is no way he should be able to compete with spidey and if they do try it it’ll just look ridiculous on the big screen. He needs to stay a minor villain that combats people with no powers

[@Chaotic_Monk43]

Maya's boyfriend really seemed way too confident in his abilities, he seemed to think he should have her job but got hoodwinked and had the shit beaten out of him at every turn.

[@Mitsuraga]

"Boyfriend"? I thought it was pretty clear that Kazi was her brother.

[@FullMetalB]

@@Mitsuraga hahahaha

[@hastyscorpion]

@@Mitsuraga I thought he was a cousin.

[@Mitsuraga]

Maybe? I could have sworn he also referred to the dead leader guy as his father, but I guess I could be wrong. In any case, it's obvious to me that his specific relationship to Maya was not made terribly explicit, or else we wouldn't all have gotten completely different ideas of what that relationship was.

[@sagetemitope]

lol exactly!!! he talks too much shit for a nigga that got his ass beat every battle

[@EthanG298]

Kingpins obviously not gonna get killed off that quickly, he's a major villain and literally just got introduced to the mcu. It feels kinds cheap to pretend to kill him to get some kinda shock value when everyone knows he's gonna come back, feels like it was done kinda poorly, if they were gonna do it they should have waited until we'd got to know him in the mcu and he'd completed some character arcs then we'd be guessing if he's actually coming back or not

[@IvyMarieArt]

This exact thing happened in the comics! She shoots him in the face and he comes back

[@jaredgorrell1108]

I think it makes some sense because him getting shot would result in his having to go to the hospital or at least a back alley surgeon, delaying his potential revenge. Otherwise he'd just go right after Hawkeye.

[@Eyecyou64]

@@IvyMarieArt that's also dumb but has the history of the comics

[@SuperRONDALE]

@@IvyMarieArt Would’ve been better if they waited for her series to do that. Or even a movie featuring her or something

[@kmc4816]

@@IvyMarieArt yea but he’s a major part of the story in that comic

[@MrLarry]

They definitely kept Kingpin’s fate deliberately vague in case Vinny D chooses not to come back

[@SirJokerMcDuff]

@@lemonferret Yeah, I was assuming that was part of the hook for the Echo show since there isn't another Daredevil project announced yet

[@martesdeo]

Echo shpots him in the face in the comics basically same scene and doesn't kills him only blinds him soo I think him and daredevil will be a major part of the echo tv show

[@omgitsbort5805]

The king pin was op like crazy in this no way he’s dead

[@Knightfall182]

If he was THAT OP, Kate should be crippled for life.

[@hartfantom]

@@Knightfall182 he wasn’t actually aiming to kill her. If he wanted to, he could have.

[@Brams2777]

@@Knightfall182 Tbf Kingpin had just been hit by a car and he didn't really seem to be trying very hard. He was treating Kate as more a nuisance than an actual threat.

[@lewaproductions]

@@Knightfall182 He ripped a car door with one hand, casually.

[@FrankLeeYoung]

@@lewaproductions Right?! Last time we saw him he was using a car door to smash a guy's head to bits... still stronk, but not THIS stronk! My dude has been hitting the prison gym hard! Just in time to fight the Human Spider.

[@Jack.A.C]

I wasn't aware that Echo shooting Kingpin was something from the comics, so this makes me much more confident that they will be bringing him back.

[@lishtins]

I hope swordsman comes back he was actually fun towards the end. I also like seeing Hawkeye as the leader like the go to guy.

[@blyzer7373]

I love the little perspective tricks they did to make Willie De look massive

[@nova2512]

*9:18** He doesn’t shoot an arrow that splits into 3. He fires 2 arrows, the 1st a wooden arrow and the 2nd he pulls back the bow even farther and he splits the first arrow into 2. It’s a callback to when they were decorating the tree in an earlier episode*

[@cleo3228]

The implication is that the main track suit mafia guy, Kazi, was the informant who tipped Hawkeye/Ronin off for kingpin. That's why Maya was suspicious of him and why Hawkeye told maya that Fisk wanted her father dead.

[@SpartanJames113]

Thats how I read it too. I thought they made it clear without outright saying it.

[@72Guyman]

I was mad at kingpin's death at first but then I saw someone post the comic frame where Echo shoots him and he comes back blinded, so I figure that's what it'll be.

[@chand911]

come on man, TV 101. No body.

[@72Guyman]

No body, no crime

[@comicbooknerd3570]

@Astroless yeah and he ripped a car door open with his bare hands and got smashed by a ramming car and survived 💀 this dude got stronger lmao

[@FullMetalB]

@Astroless Even in the netflix show it was pointed out that he has armored suits. I don't know why everyone is acting like he took an arrow through his body or something and was fine...

[@internettraveler8666]

@Astroless In the show he had a guy who made his suits out of a special blade proof fabric

[@FTNChicken]

James always says they're gonna figure out a way to make this simpler, but I think Collings' edits have gotten more elaborate with each Marvel show. idk how he does it, amazing

[@MrLarry]

I can’t believe this is the final instalment of my favourite KZbin series talkeye/hawktalk/talktalk

[@danielmckeown3290]

James and Nick's impression of Clint explaining what happened on voromir reminded me of that bit in community when Troy is taken to the air conditioning school and black Hitler is there to make it less believable

[@TVREdits]

Hearing the Swordsman say “onguard!” As he fights aside a team of Larpers solidified him as a character I’d like see return

[@FrVitoBe]

Yea I want so him return as a hero

[@JoshuaWillis89]

*En garde

[@TVREdits]

@@JoshuaWillis89 weird place for fencing but I accept 🤺

[@CitizenoftheWorld1]

I love how OP Kingpin is in this episode. Reading the comics he always reminded me of the Marvel version of Bane

[@MartinOlminkhof]

I was half expecting that a DareDevil baton would knock the gun out of Maya's hand at the last second

[@java_bean]

Marvel tries not to do cameos that would confuse new people except for in after-credits. I feel like if you don't know who Daredevil is a random baton flying at the end of Mayas last scene you'd just be like "...wot?"

[@FullMetalB]

@@java_bean I was hoping since they left the entire finale of Loki up to peoples knowledge of Kang AND their knowledge of the actor who had been cast as Kang that they would move passed worrying about people not understanding references/cameos/more obscure character stuff but I guess not.

[@NerdRahtio]

That would be a great way to start the echo series, go back to that moment and Matt rescues him, takes him to jail, and Echo spends the series with Daredevil being her antagonist as she wants revenge on him for stopping her revenge.

[@palaniuki]

We know Clint did kill Maya's father. That's what he explained to her, he was full of anger and a weapon wanting to be used, but it was "Uncle" who pointed Ronin at her dad.

[@andyboy8352]

I really hope king pins death was a fake out I’d love to see Spider-Man and dare devil fighting him 🙏

[@Knightfall182]

I wanted Kingpin as the Spider-Man 4 villain before..... but not so much after seeing this version 😕 He sucks

[@metalliholic]

He most likely will come back with one eye. Like in the comics Also they say “an eye for an eye”

[@logandh2]

There’s no chance he’s dead. They made a point of showing that he was wearing armor when Kate shot him. In the comics Maya shot him in the head but here I reckon she shot him in the chest, assumed he was dead, and left.

[@tristanburchett]

There was a Daredevil comic where Echo shot him point blank in the face and blinded him for a while. I think that's what they're doing. I think in the MCU maybe she shot one of his eyes out or something.

[@noamasaf2668]

Logan Huntley idt he was wearing armor. he was just buffed from daredevil, his muscle mass just doesnt let arrows pass through him

[@kieran10202]

There's a reason the Ant Man suits and vehicles are pressurised, those guys will asphixiate long before the owl eats them. Probably won't be able to break into the car either.

[@Miirorman]

For the Pod, if James and Maso see this: I just started my new job, it was mostly pushing grocery carts in 5°F for 6 hours, and when I came home my cat had peed on my bed. I cleaned everything, I’m exhausted, but you two talking about Hawkeye gave me my first genuine smile today, and I appreciate it. Take care.

[@MrBucketlist]

With how much Kingpin was OP in the MCU the bullet probably bounced off his forehead then he knocked Echo out and ran into daredevil.

[@AdThe1st]

6:30 "Collins ye don't have to put all these in.." Collins: "Yeah, but I will"

[@Mind4orLease]

I'm calling him "Kingpeen" from now on

[@Alex_Penjamin]

19:22 man that editing is on point 🤌🤌🤌

[@CinemaKnight]

I liked seeing Vincent D'Onofrio again, but the Kingpin stuff did feel a bit rushed and tacked on. The hints towards him earlier were a bit too vague and to go from not really knowing who "the boss" is to "its Kingpin, this is Kingpin, you know Kingpin right?" went too quick for me to completely appreciate the character. I did really enjoy the fight scene Kate had with him though, really showed why this guy is a threat regardless of whether he has henchmen or not and gave Kate a great opportunity to apply the stuff she's learned so far. I think they should have made it a bit less ambiguous whether Maya shot Kingpin; he's this massive dangerous New York crime boss who crosses paths with basically every New York based superhero, he's been actually introduced only just this episode, and immediately he gets taken out by just someone shooting him with a gun? There's no way they'd just waste a character like that, but it kinda just feels cheap to make it ambiguous.

[@lackluxury4824]

This is one of the many reasons this show is garbo. The creators of this show are feeding off the success of the DD show, but they completely disrespect everything ab it. They’d rather sacrifice the masterful show that was Daredevil for this Mickey Mouse bull

[@Christo2k]

I feel like this would have been the perfect show to release in the week leading up to Christmas, one episode a day. Mirrors the timeline and keeps the momentum.

[@8ulls3y3]

I absolutely loved the show's atmosphere. Very obviously a 90's Shane Black-ish christmasy buddy cop homage. it has its own distinct style. Lower stakes, more character-focused, it took its time developing Kate and the relationships between her and other major characters. Yes, it was silly at times, but that's fine. We have enough moody broody stuff to deal with, we are allowed to have fun watching a superhero TV series, fellas...

[@D_Fyre]

Best comment. 👍🏽

[@micahwright5901]

Kate is amazing

[@MynameisJoey]

In the post-credit scene, they should have put Yelena in the audience. That would have been so good. Perhaps even sitting with Echo

[@katydid9]

Bravo to Collings for those graphics...I could TalkTalk about them all day!

[@Sleazyslacks]

Collings's editing for the "Ah no, you've slipped" part at 8:16 is pure comedy gold. Had to rewind that bit and watch it over and over. Watch until the fears in me subside.

[@micahwright5901]

A+ edit

[@heisenberg6142]

Kingpin will definitely be back

[@Knightfall182]

And will get humiliated again

[@heisenberg6142]

@@Knightfall182 yes, he gets humiliated every time he returns

[@theirishpotato6588]

@@Knightfall182 no

[@capness1228]

There is a 0% chance kingpin is actually gone

[@NigelLam375]

He's not dead Mephisto took him to the corn of coblin's base of operations to discuss their next move involving john krasinski while wearing his goofy ass hat.

[@The_Reel_Demon]

Bro, he probably caught the bullet in his mouth, spat that shit out, body slammed Maya, took out a cigar and lit that shit and walked away to have a lovely Christmas Day with his wife and kid.

[@highlandus]

He is dead deal with it

[@PirateCat822]

@@highlandus remember this rule,if we don't see them die on camera,they're still alive

[@SceneComparisons]

I told weeks ago that this series was paying homage to Planes, Trains & Automobiles, but some dumb nerds doubt it the ending of this episode was EXACTLY like the ending of that movie. only thing missing was the song Everytime You Go Away

[@CraigNull]

Remember when Clint point-blanked that car rental guy in the head with an arrow Actually just had a vision of Steve Martin showing up as Hawkeye's dad and now the show is huge letdown

[@PatheticApathetic]

If this is how Kingpin dies, that would be incredibly disappointing. Mostly because I just didn’t care all that much about Maya, and didn’t really have a good handle on her relationship with Fisk

[@niallobrien6130]

... I'm very inpressed by the creativity involved with coming up with alternative titles for this but I personally would have stuck with the original 'Hawk Chat about Hawkeye Chat with your Chatty pals Nick and Maso wearing tuxedos (and possibly with swords)'. Happy Holidays!

[@a.t.3192]

Collings cutting to Clint's endgame hair when James says 'pretty odd stuff' at 10:56 is why he's a great editor, lol

[@HistoryBluff137]

When you hear the gun shot, you see a faint shadow outline of Kingpin on the building and it looks like he's still standing afterwards

[@derekteter982]

Loved the part where we sat through the entire end credit scene waiting for it to be worth it and it just wasn't. It was only pain.

[@OtaconAlonsus]

Of all the things they settled with for the post credit scene, that was just...

[@joshuabonesteel2303]

I fast-forward through it and was still disappointed I wasted that much time.

[@Simbabweman]

A little sad about the new portrayals of the kingpin and I'm guessing daredevil in the future as they can't go as jardcore as they had before because now they're a bit more family friendly. For instance, when kingpin is standing between Maya and the other guy I felt like he was meant to be intimidating there but it's not the same as the netflix show. I felt like in the netflix show he could've turned any moment a lot of the time and completely destroyed someone on the spot, as he did often do such as crushing someone's head in a car door. Here though, I didn't think he was going to do anything really. He's just not able to create that tension anymore due to the platform. I think daredevil will have a bit of that is too but probably not so much. He won't really be able to be as brutal as he has been in his fighting.

[@jimjimjim6841]

Are they really aiming to make all their shows shit pg 13? Disney plus already has a bunch of violent content on it. So fucking stupid.

[@Simbabweman]

@@jimjimjim6841 most of their marvel stuff I reckon will be family friendly. I feel like one day they'll make a more adult version of one of them and people will lose their shit and call them amazing and completely forgot about the stuff that was already done i.e. daredevil, punisher, Jessica Jones, etc There are more adult shows on Disney+ I'm sure, since they realised after a shirt time that they needed variety for it to succeed but with marvel stuff I just have a feeling. Look at Moon knight for instance. His trailer looks alright but he's meant to be a darker character and the shot where he's being violent he has his back to us so we won't get to see anything.

[@jimjimjim6841]

@@Simbabweman Moon Knight can be ok without R. I worry more about people behind it being capable enough to pull it off. This effectively means we might not get a DD or Punisher series or a while, he will instead be showing up in the other shows.

[@sealdoggydog]

I like by the end of the series Clint has basically turned Kate into a stone cold killer. I mean, this college girl is now straight up shooting people in the chest and blowing them up. She's killed in the double digits... Blood on her hands. No going back. Will she ever be able to look at a red tracksuit again without having PTSD flashbacks? Cheers Hawkeye, merry effin christmas

[@PirateCat822]

I mean she did just cause 8 people to die a slow and gruesome death through the shrinking of the van

[@micahwright5901]

I kept thinking during the action sequences “so, all these people are definitely dead, right??!” I mean, they were attacking them, but they were real people and probably just going to apprehend them. This was way too low stakes for the body count Hawkeye and Kate racked up 😂

[@Dannihilate]

I absolutely loved the Hawkeye show. It had just the right balance of comedy and action, but the banter between Kate Bishop and Yelena really sold it for me.

[@scoobingtonmcwigglesnatch9985]

So I'm still confused as to why Elaine from Seinfeld hired Yelena to take out Clint but here in this series George Clooney's lover from Up In the Air was the one that hired her???

[@mathiaswalker350]

Eleanor is the Client so she goes to someone who has the Ressources to do so: Vinnie Dee! He's got his grubby little hands in all kinds of pots including some dodgy governmental superhero building agancy run by Elaine from Seinfeld. So she then goes and gives the dodgy assignment. It's called bureaucracy.

[@tristanstieber6499]

I guess Selina Meyer from Veep was the intermediary for young Livia Soprano from The Many Saints of Newark?

[@GreenHatAnimation]

when hawkman was in the tree, and asks ladyhawk to help him, i thought she was gonna use the "shrink next door" arrow to make the tree a smaller tree, then hawkgent would just be there standing by that small tree.

[@MediocrMrFox]

Wild how Kate has 100% killed people with the giant arrow on the bridge, and definitely the van guys that got shrunk for sure died badly, probably the drone arrow that flew that guy into the air too In general a lot of heroes have that thing though, like "Oh I'll most likely kill these henchmen" to "I COULDN'T KILL MY ENEMY, IT WOULD MAKE ME JUST AS BAD"

[@thread6971]

Another reason why I love daredevil. It's got way more brutal depictions of violence and killing, yet the main character has a strict no killing rule. It's insane how many MCU heroes can just murder a bunch if bad guys then immediately quip and smile. (NO WAY HOME SPOILERS) now that that really good lawyer is back, hopefully they treat him better than they did kingpin. I get it'll never be as dark or gritty but I wasn't impressed with the way kingpin was brought back, only saving grace was Vinny D coming back for the role. Charlie Cox's cameo was great in NWH. But we won't know for sure until he has a larger role.

[@extremetoast5723]

Yeah it’s kinda wild that Hawkeye is all anxty about being Ronin and killing a load of people, but in that final fight he must of killed almost everyone he shot an arrow at.

[@jakubrejak1114]

@@thread6971 As for the quips and smiles. Some of them are probably not right in the head, and some are trying to stay sane.

[@FlyingwithFire]

@@extremetoast5723 you see its different because as Ronin he killed them with a sword and as hawkeye he kills with them a bow from another room

[@extremetoast5723]

@@FlyingwithFire good point, something I didn’t consider. He’s also wearing all black as Ronin when he’s indiscriminately killing tracksuits, which is presumably different from when he’s wearing purple and indiscriminately killing the tracksuits.

[@JakeFromYoutube]

I just keep imagining the first episode of Echo starts with her trying to shoot Kingpin but Daredevil steps in because he had heard the explosions from the arrows. Daredevil would want Kingpin brought to justice, not killed. So a fight ensues between him and Echo. Kingpin heartbroken and feeling betrayed because be genuinely loved her leaves during their fight.

[@beardupbeerdown7355]

They introduce Kingpin to the MCU and have him attack and get his ass kicked by a teenage girl. Wild.

[@lja3966]

You’re totally right they absolutely should’ve had kingpin I dunno crush her skull or something

[@TheDelinear]

I thought Rogers the Musical was a fun addition to the show, here are my only issues: 1) At least give Hulk a muscle suit or something, he's just a guy in a green hoodie? 2) massively missed opportunity in the post credits to cut from the show on stage to Yelena in the audience eating a giant bucket of popcorn smothered in hot sauce.

[@NerdMacVideos]

I liked the moment where one of the mafia guys thanks Kate Bishop for the advice she gave him for his girlfriend and the interaction between both of them.

[@RAA12485]

I love the scene where they use the Pym arrow to shrink the van. I laughed so hard haaha

[@delmarfrazier2727]

I called it you could see it coming

[@meukowkang7355]

2:20 u guys FN nailed it lol 😆🤣 edit was supreme 🤣😂😭

[@Travisman123_]

There is no way that owl would be able to pick up that truck. It's smaller, but only the distance between the atoms is smaller, not the amount of mass it has. So it would weigh the same, and the owl wouldn't be able to pick it up

[@nvcomics]

They play it pretty loose. Even in the antman movies, like the Tank Keychain. Even if its a toy it breaks the rules

[@madmexican1072]

Yes, but in Antman Hank Pym has a tank on a keychain and he is able to carry that around so the physics has never really made sense and you're just supposed to assume its possible

[@carlosguillen5683]

They said that in the first movie and have never respected that rule

[@Theycallmethek3]

Nah antman got flicked a few times when he was small didnt he?

[@lucasistrom]

The Pym particles are pretty inconsistent at this point, so I've pretty much given up on making sense of them.

[@kimm6589]

I didn't know Collings was your Golden Retriever. That's so sweet of you to take him in like that.

[@rawcollings]

woof

[@christopherbf1197]

maybe through the 5-year time gap, King Pin could've enhanced himself and that's why he was able to live all those hits.

[@saintniccage2818]

He also tore the door off a Mercedes, but we all been there and done that right?

[@vodkavecz]

Maybe he got some black market diluted version of the super soldier serum in those 5 years.

[@christopherbf1197]

@@saintniccage2818 lolol

[@christopherbf1197]

@@vodkavecz My thoughts too!

[@the25thprime]

More than 5 since season 3 of DD. If this is the same kingpin, all the defenders stuff takes place in 2014-2015, so its been 8 or 9 years since we last saw him.

[@ChrisSonPEI]

Kingpin lookin like he shouldn't have disclosed his clients secret illegal accounts.

[@jackdailey5238]

Hawkeye 100% killed Echos Father. He said that but he also told her he was a weapon pointed against him by Kingpin

[@earthwormjj]

The editing again is amazing and hilarious in this one!

[@rawcollings]

Cheers JJ! Top weekend to you mate

[@earthwormjj]

@@rawcollings legend. Merry Christmas 👍

[@phillyredsox]

13 episodes is too much and 6 episodes is too few. They need to hit a good 9 or 10 sweet spot and they could flesh everything out and give the villains the due they deserve. Kingpin was a little disappointing in this last episode.

[@grahamstrouse1165]

Yup. He only Netflix Marvel show that really needed the full 13 episodes was DD S3. The six season D+ shows are basically a long movie. I liked Hawkeye but I hate what Disney is doing.

[@WAMTAT]

"a universe with some pretty odd stuff" Cut to clints haircut just beautiful editing

[@matthewhazzard409]

After this, I just want a weird team consisting of; Hawkeyes, Yelena, Red Guardian, Jacque, Bucky and Cap - Bucky and Clint as the straight men to the others super heroic lunacy.

[@playgroundchooser]

You got Go Picture my man! I'll expect to see it in theaters by 3rd Quarter 2023.

[@arvelcrynyd6311]

So did Kingpin get some of that Super Soldier Serum? He's surviving being shot in the heart with an arrow, hit by a car, and blown up. That ain't normal person shit.

[@Wico90YT]

It'd be easy to have multiple characters be "Mockingbird"/"Agent 19". Laura can be first and then Bobbi. Idk why people online seem to think it invalidates AOS

[@PJAvenger]

Exactly. We had Steve Cap, now we have Sam Cap. The title just goes with the position. Like Spider-Man goes from Peter to Miles. The Mockingbird designation might be for the kick ass under cover woman known for infiltration.

[@RokNDragon]

Right. When Hawkeye's family was revealed in Age of Ultron, he already had teenage children, so Laura clearly retired well before the first Avengers movie's events. Bobbie Morse wasn't introduced on AOS until after the events of The Winter Soldier, easily 10 years+ since Laura would have retired. Very possible in that many years, another agent could be given that number/codename, even without a direct link to the previous agent. Also possible that Laura could have been an older sister/cousin/aunt to Bobbie, making the handoff of the number/codename more intentional.

[@PJAvenger]

@@RokNDragon It's also cool to have a codename - like Star-Prince

[@mavrickindigo]

The Darkhold is f Different

[@PJAvenger]

@@mavrickindigo The Darkhold can appear in any way it wants. It's not a typical paperback

[@SimonM7TV]

I thought the penultimate episode was a little wobbly and I was worried the show would pivot into fanservice too hard when it had arcs to follow through, but the final episode stuck the landing, and I honestly think this show is top tier MCU. Character-driven with proper development and true payoffs. The Ronin suit acting as the embodiment of the darkness haunting Hawkeye but also the cause of his survivor's guilt and his real belief - not just in the regular clichéd way - that he doesn't deserve to be regarded as a hero. It came together perfectly in the finale. How Kate's life has literally been shaped not just by randomly seeing Clint, but by what he as a person represented in the Avengers. Him coming to terms with the fact that he couldn't save Natasha, and earning the forgiveness from Yelena in the process of articulating that realisation. This is coherent, steady handed storytelling that isn't afraid to slow down and have people just chill and hang out. This is a show that gives every scene and element a number of extra layers and quirks and personality, not content with simply getting the job done in the most rudimentary way. Remember when he lost his hearing aid and they weren't content with just having a communication gag, but got like three genuinely affecting scenes out of it. Letting Kate basically channel the love between Clint and his son in a short scene that immediately made them close in a way that isn't just generic buddy movie stuff. I could write an essay about all the things that impresses me and moves me about this show. Fantastic. I hope Disney reconsider physical media for these shoes so I can put Hawkeye on my shelf and watch it every year for the winter holidays.

[@SimonM7TV]

Had to like my own post for autocorrect suggesting Disney should consider physical media for shoes. It's not wrong! Not-physical shoes are pretty useless.

[@D_Fyre]

Great comment! I think most of this stuff is lost on most viewers because they're so wrapped up in whether or not Kingpin will return or why the physics of the Pym arrows work the way they do.

[@thedoif2540]

More than likely Fisk isn’t dead. They did this exact scenario in the comics, and he did get shot in the head. He was just blinded for a bit. It’s kingpin he’s too big of a character to kill.

[@AndyJP]

It has bugged me throughout the whole series that Ronin's sword is retractable (somehow) yet he is always shown with a scabbard in Endgame

[@DimaJeydar]

Tony probably “improved it” on his coffee break from making the Infinity Gauntlet.

[@demonicar]

The Maya/Kingpin shooting scene is taken directly from the comics. In the comics she blinds him but he doesn’t die.

[@Shadowpaw67]

This show tried to have its cake and eat it too with the tone. It felt like it wanted to be a grittier show like the Netflix stuff, but with everything sanitized to Disney+ standards. Having Kingpin show up for one episode only to immediately maybe-kill him just felt like a waste when he was such a well developed and well acted character in Daredevil

[@orange2591]

I assumed that Kingpin took the super soldier serum from Falcon and the Winter Soldier.

[@ghosthead84]

Merry Christmas to all and to all a good night.

[@GomerJ]

My only lingering question from this series: I still don’t understand why Ant-Man is in Rogers:The Musical unless… It’s a teaser for Quantumania- considering Kang & Quantum Realm shenanigans Ant-Man ends up fighting in the Battle of NY and that’s just the history everyone remembers now… And Marvel felt the need to tease it almost 2 years early. Check back with me in 2023.

[@scarletspidernz]

maybe its gonna be a retconn and that antman was there just tiny so we never saw?

[@rhodrage]

Musicals based on history always take liberties

[@TopTwom]

Current theories: 1. Scott has been spreading rumors that he was there but just too small to see. 2. Someone saw him in the time travel section of Endgame and this is that timeline. 3. (Most likely) Ant-Man has become popular and has been inserted into the musical for fan service. Remember Ed Sheeran in Game of Thrones?.... a bit like that

[@diywrites8703]

"This a world with some pretty weird stuff" *cut to shot of Hawkeye's mohawk mullet thing* Brilliant edit, Cullings.

[@cenobitecenobite7380]

I wasn’t aware of the comic book involving echo where she wounds kingpin but I am aware of the tv rule that if there is no body then their not dead. So he’s coming back.

[@jackrogers5308]

Only exception to that was Stannis Baratheon. I held out hope for so long he wasnt dead because you never see his body but ultimately disappointed when the show ended and he was truly dead.

[@cenobitecenobite7380]

@@jackrogers5308 Forgot about that one. I had just finished reading the books when that season aired so I was doubly pissed off. I"m sure there are other examples.

[@rickybryan1759]

I wanna add Kingpin who is a bad man learns sign language to be a good colleague. Be like that part of Kingpin!

[@TheJesselopez1981]

So you guys called the part where he takes Kate home for christmas, and his immediate turn around of, "you are my partner." Good job.

[@aitch2d2]

Excellent work - as ever - Collings! Thanks for all your hard work during the Hawkeye series.

[@rawcollings]

Incredibly cool of you mate, thank you! Have a top weekend holiday chill time friend

[@ashleytuchin7693]

I really loved the series as a whole and I hope that we'll be seeing more from Clint and Kate in the future.

[@java_bean]

Leaving a like for Talk Talk, I hope this new format is picked up and proves that you are truly the disruptors of the status quo that we always knew you to be.

[@codemanthe2nd343]

I think you were right about the momentum. I binged all the episodes up to episode 5 then watched episode 6 when it was released. The break between episodes wasn't good for it.

[@grahamstrouse1165]

Think you’re right.

[@rickybryan1759]

A ranking video of all arrows please 💙💙💙💙💙💙

[@GomerJ]

I was really upset when Echo “killed” Kingpin but then I remembered it happens off-screen so they can explain it however the hell they want. She missed, she fired a warning shot, it bounced off, he took the gun and killed her (Echo series cancelled confirmed) etc

[@AntonioHernandez-tj6er]

Love how when he goes this is a world where there is some pretty odd stuff the editor put clints Mohawk in the frame lmao

[@Mitsuraga]

I feel like the fact that the larpers were basically all cops was completely forgotten about pretty quickly. And maybe I'm just a real big dummy, but how is it that we know Agent 19 is Mockingbird?

[@vodkavecz]

Agent 19 = Mockingbird is a comic thing, I think,

[@Mitsuraga]

I figured that to be the case, and though I don't have many comics in which Mockingbird appears, I had never seen that stated. My other guess was that it was from the Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. TV show, which I've never bothered to watch.

[@OldWaveKid]

Daredevil threw a baton at Echo's gun. And then the bullet missed Kingpin

[@Lynch2507]

Everything about the actual story/conspiracy of the show was extremely mid tbh, besides the reveal that Laura Barton was a shield agent, thats cute. All the character development, the Hawkeyes and Yelena especially, was REALLY good, all the actors did a great job. Do really think Marvel learned the wrong lesson from Wandavision with the habit of the series villains being kept unknown till the end, it doesn't work all the time

[@Dr.HooWho]

Idk about that

[@extremetoast5723]

I don’t think any lesson was taken into account here because this was shot before wandavision was released. Kinda the issue with these shows, for the time being they can’t learn from the mistakes of the other shows cuz they’re mostly all already planned and/or made.

[@siddhant...]

Wanda Vision >>>>>>>>>>>>>> this shit of a show. Wanda vision worked perfectly well, the mystery and intrigue made it interesting. Imo it’s the best marvel show out of all that came on disney plus.

[@elusana]

@@siddhant... wandavision did NOT work perfectly well. that show is like losing a double digit lead in a game

[@Bambi113]

My theory is that after getting beat up by Daredevil so many times, Kingpin used his pull to get some super soldier serum from the Power Broker. That would be some brand synergy and power him up to fight Spider-Man later on.