Rules of Thumb for Large Format Photography - Large Format Friday

[@imrannuri]

Large Format rule of thumb: follow Mat Marrash on KZbin

[@derekkonigsberg2047]

What I found interesting is that "expose for the shadows, develop for the highlights" is more than just a rule of thumb. Its actually right there in the ISO spec for film speed! (In other words, the film speed is based on the shadows, and the developing time is based on the highlights.)

[@andyvan5692]

not just that, it is more complex, you expose for the shadows, as this is chemistry, NO photons means NO reduction of silver ions to metal (how the image sticks to the base, the wash only removes excess silver, the fixer sticks the reacted ions to the base), and the enlarger (particularly the filters ) are where you can adjust the highlights more accurately, but also contrast, and dodge & burn to exposure correct.

[@RogerHyam]

Your thumb is Zone III. We have five digits and we are usually looking at about five stops of brightness to capture. I flip the light meter to measure EV and pick and area that I visualise about Zone III - say it comes at EV12. That goes on my thumb. I then know that my index finger is Zone IV must be EV13, middle finger is Zone V EV 14 etc etc. Basically I match the tones and EV measured in a scene to the digits on my left hand from III (thumb) to VII (pinky). That is the range of texture in the Zone system. Obviously if the highlights are beyond my pinky then I need to shorten development and if they don't make it to my pinky then I need to soak it a bit longer. I also have a little laminated exposure chart I made with EV, F number and time for a particular film in which I have already incorporated the reciprocity failure. Whatever the EV of my middle finger is I look up on my chart to get the exposure (reciprocity included). If I have bellows extension I reduce the ISO on my meter. I meter through the filter if I use one. Sounds complicated but I hate doing maths in the field and it is very simple and haptic once you set it up.

[@MatMarrash]

Hey Roger, that's a pretty neat way of visualizing the range of zones during metering, thanks for sharing!

[@toulcaz31]

You never looked as good as with your head between Sinar P2 standards. :) Good stuff

[@GreggObst]

The tip on using the rear standard tilts for controlling depth of field on cameras that lack front tilt is golden and I think one that not many know. I learned that a few years after getting my Eastman View No 2 8x10 and that made all the difference in how often and in what scenarios I used that camera going forward. Just a little tilt movement goes a huge way so the range of rear tilt offered by some of these older 8x10s and 5x7s are more than adequate in most cases.

[@MatMarrash]

The more I chat with you in the comments Gregg, the more in common I find our large format experiences! My 1st 8x10 was the Eastman Commercial B and learning on that simple, yet tough-as-nails camera taught me a lot about the process. Cheers!

[@ericweiss2913]

Matt, thanks again for a great video. I've been shooting large format since 1985. I started watching you a couple of months ago and was pleasantly surprised to see that we share many of the same processes, even down to the way we do "the dance" around a large format camera. I especially enjoy your meditation videos. Just watching someone work quietly and efficiently can be fascinating and educational. I'm not as prolific as you are but I still have a chemical darkroom I enjoy using as often as possible. Along with your technical videos, keep making those episodes where you look inward to that thing that drives us to create, gets us out of bed in the morning and makes us feel like we have purpose. Great work!

[@Narsuitus]

Thanks for the large format rules of thumb. One additional rule I must follow is carry a check list and use it. Too often I have skipped an important step that caused me to miss a shot and/or ruin an expensive piece of film.

[@BillMcCarroll]

I never stop learning something new every Friday! Thanks Mat.

[@ljames43230]

Oh man I could have used the focusing tip this past weekend. I’m going to use it with my next shoot.

[@bluur101]

Very clearly explained and well demonstrated. After years of sheet-film copy-camera work (everything parallel and simple) last century, I still have the occasional 'duhhh' moment as a large-format hobbyist when I tweak something in the wrong direction. The video helps with organising my thoughts a bit !

[@MatMarrash]

There has been many a time where I need to step back, look at how the standards are arranged and go, "wait a second, they shouldn't be like that!" before ditching a composition.

[@paridecorsetti7022]

my rules of thumb: 1. finish to 3D draw my 4x5 camera 2. get I printed 3. assembly it 4. rewatch most of the LFF episodes

[@jimwlouavl]

These are great tips. Thanks so much. LF Friday is a highlight of my week!

[@MatMarrash]

And it's my highlight to see so many folks enjoying these videos! :)

[@AlexLuyckxPhoto]

All excellent rules, the one I follow the most (thanks to you) is the third one, expose for the shadows, develop for the highlights.

[@MatMarrash]

Thanks Alex, this new Reveni Spotmeter has me feeling like a Zone System evangelist over here!

[@rtdg4419]

Hello Matt. This video has been out for a while but just saw it for the first time. My first rule of thumb is to ensure that all of the movements are zeroed out and the camera is in its default set up. This prevents me from having to correct things that I should not have to. Basically it gives me a known starting point for the composition. And once I am finished with the photograph I again set all my movements to their defaults. The initial check is to ensure that I did zero out all movements after the last photograph. Eventually I will catch with all of your videos but I am enjoying them as they come up on my suggested videos. Thamks.

[@ferdinandmarkcruz21]

what is that spot meter you are using here?

[@andyvan5692]

Mat a warning to everyone about the sinar Vario backs, as part of the Rules of thumb; Read the manuals of the film backs, I just shot a roll of 120 Gold 200 in 6x12 but did a mistake, I Wound on straight after the counter said to switch to "EXP.", DON'T, when the exp. shows SWITCH the lever over...STOP, take your FIRST shot!!, then WIND up, to shot TWO, this one cost me the first exposure, got the other 5 thank goodness, the 6x12 has 6 exposures, all worked ok after, NO problems leaving a roll in 3 weeks straight, no film flatness issues. The manual isn't quite clear on the markings, so as above, fire as soon as the lever is switched over to EXP. and as soon as you see the RED triangle of the colour change and the word 'LOAD', ITS SAFE to wind-off, no more shots left. just be carefull if this is LOADED with film, as that EXP/LOAD lever arms/trips the counter system[to wind off a partly shot roll], so store it safe, so nothing can touch it!!

[@wabashamj]

Thank you for this video

[@ChillMusicRingo]

Thank you teacher! I'm in the deep hole of large format photography.

[@MatMarrash]

The road you now travel is paved with big sheets of film and little disposable income. ;)

[@joeditchett210]

Great explanation and video. It's so hard to find this information synthesized this well. Thank you!

[@MatMarrash]

You're very welcome!

[@Adrian-wd4rn]

You should make some rules of thumb for those of us with supergraphics and such, including shifts and tilts etc.

[@patefermente]

Wow Mat… picking up from Ansel Adams’ books, this is literally the tip of the iceberg on many subjects. You could film a whole season of videos on each of these rules of thumb. That said, thanks for a really great video. I, for one, need a refresher…

[@MatMarrash]

Totally agree on how much Ansel Adams' writings could fill out a video master course!

[@russellyoung2852]

Tell me more about that funky little light meter, please! And say howdy to Jim A...

[@MatMarrash]

Hey Russell, thanks for the comment and I'll tell Jim you say Hi! The funky little meter is the Reveni Labs Spotmeter. There's a collection of videos on Reveni's site including a first-look from yours truly: www.reveni-labs.com/

[@russellyoung2852]

@@MatMarrash Duly viewed, thanks! "Concealed carry", lol...

[@andyvan5692]

I have a rule 5,6&7, 5) Always test fire the shot, and do 'idiot checks' , to see if the shutter speed is correct, Lens is closed, movements and tripod head locked down, slide out, metered correctly (while setting up has the light changed?); 6) Practice, esp. with new gear, film loading, packing gear (what bag for what shoot)-for ease of moving around; 7) if you get something new, use 120 film to test it!, for light leaks, or a film stock, I have wasted enough film to know, use cheap SIZE to see if you like it, then by all means go full sheet, so you KNOW you use it, and it gives the look you like. 8) {bonus}Also if in DOUBT USE lens shades, or an ND filter, these formats are GLARE sensitive, so be carefull, know what light you are going into, and what your film/s can take.

[@tariqtareyy1370]

Best information on KZbin. Thanks Mat!

[@MatMarrash]

My pleasure!

[@samehfahmi2068]

Fantastic tips!!

[@JeremyVS]

This was a great little video, thank you Mat! I really need to get my 4x5 out more often 😀

[@MatMarrash]

Thanks Jeremy and happy LF shooting!

[@MattWeddis]

Great tips. I learn something valuable with every new video. Thanks Mat

[@MatMarrash]

Matt thank you so much, and I'm glad the content is reaching so many folks!

[@FatGourmand]

I wonder is there a good book that has these find of LF skill and knowledge that professional commercial photographers used to use.

[@MatMarrash]

Hey Dave, there's lots of awesome reference materials out there, with Steve Simmons' "Using the View Camera" being a great place to start. Your comment had reminded me that I need to do a large format book round-up one of the these days. Cheers!

[@FatGourmand]

@@MatMarrash Fantastic, thank you. The seed was started in the video you did a while ago, mentioning a small amount of tilt for a portairt and this video reminded me that I need to know more, to be better.

[@ghosttownsentinel5288]

@@FatGourmand Ansel Adam's book, The Camera is a great reference to have. It is a very detailed in the how-to series in the use of a view camera.

[@regaling]

Great video, Mat! Thank you.

[@MatMarrash]

Glad you liked it!

[@LRPhotographer]

And there's the Scheimpflug principle. Something that's a standard capability of large format cameras that requires specialty (and incredibly expensive) lenses in smaller formats that also don't work as well.

[@B3D5X]

I have a couple 1909 Senecas (5x7 & 8x10) and neither have front tilt; just rear. I was shooting some roses today was trying to get both the roses and the vase in focus. My brain instinctively went to tilt for the front standard but then I realized it was reversed 🤦‍♂️

[@minutepress2629]

Join us Every Friday as we walk you through the "How to" of the Printing Industry!

[@brineb58]

Great info as always!!!

[@tseumd58]

Awesome lecture

[@MatMarrash]

Thanks! :)

[@sgroadie6367]

Cool. Thanks

[@MezeiEugen]

What camera is that. I like that all movements are geared.

[@questor62]

What is the spot meter you are using? Love its compact size and clear readings.

[@MatMarrash]

The Reveni Labs Spot Meter: kzbin.info/www/bejne/iHPPkpZ8ppxngKMfeature=shared

[@olafwDE]

Re 1, would it be more precise to say "front standard controls the focus *plain* ?" I'm asking because if you need to have a specific scale/image ratio, the rear standard should be used to dial in the fine focus. It's no contradiction, just a complement. Therefore and in theory, a monorail large format camera with a moving back standard is better suited for focus stacking than other camera layouts. BTW, kudos for the editing, Mat.

[@chrischow7398]

I always have the hardest time focusing. I've read to focus on the near and tilt for the far, for axis tilt view cameras?

[@jackyleecs]

Apologies, I have a question but do not know where to post it. For large format, is there a need to compensate for exposure when the bellow is extended too long? Take for example the Mamiya RB67. We need to overexpose according to the graph on the right of its bellow. Thanks.

[@MatMarrash]

Hey Jacky thanks for the question! Whenever bellows are involved and there is no electronic communication from the lens, you will experience loss of light to bellows extension. Here's a link to my LFF video dedicated to calculating it: kzbin.info/www/bejne/bXvcfIyqatt8js0

[@Dikaiosune02]

Does anyone have any info on that hilarious tshirt?

[@MatMarrash]

Thanks for the comment, t-shirt made by ShootFilmCo: www.shootfilmco.com/collections/apparel

[@darrylroberts5235]

Awesome

[@bipinvarma3249]

❤❤❤

[@garyclennan2993]

Great video! How do you know how much to reduce your film dev time by?

[@MatMarrash]

Gary this is a fantastic question! Typical N minus times are reduced 25% from Normal time, but all of these values can be arrived at specifically by testing film (like featured earlier in Season 3). When properly calibrated, the N- time will produce a negative in the step wedge test that has the high density values reduced by 2 steps = 1 zone.

[@garyclennan2993]

@@MatMarrash Thanks Mat. I know I need to do this with high contrast scenes but never do for some reason. :) I am printing a lot now and realize this could be a huge benefit. Thank you.

[@MatMarrash]

@@garyclennan2993 modern films are pretty amazing but for some scenes, the reduced development can help with the amount of time spent burning in those crispy highlights!

[@dongxu2059]

Hey Mat, I keep wondering how are you lighting the scene when you filmed the RuleOfThumb #3. The reflections on the lens is just "crazy"

[@MatMarrash]

What you're seeing there is a guy that needs a brighter LED light! Had to pull the diffusers off my softbox so you're seeing all the interior creating specular highlights.

[@mariusleicht]

I just tried Rule 2: Focus to the far, tilt/swing to the near. I placed two magazines on the floor and pointed the camera down to them. When following that rule, I couldn't get both in focus. I focussed to the magazine further away from the camera and then tried to get the nearer one in focus by tilting the front standard. I could not get it in focus at all. Then I tried the opposite: Focused to the closer magazine and tilted the lens to get the further away magazine in focus. This worked perfectly. Am I confusing something here?

[@ghosttownsentinel5288]

I think your camera has axis tilt. In axis tilt you focus to the near and tilt for the far. Base tilt is the opposite. Matt's Sinar P does base tilt.

[@wadebird1812]

Sorry to bother, but what spot meter are you using?

[@MatMarrash]

Hey Wade, this is the brand new Reveni Labs Spotmeter. There's a video I did earlier this year on the Kickstarter prototype and a full review of this model coming soon!

[@wadebird1812]

Thanks for the response.

[@isaacazulay]

👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼

[@SaschaHirschner]

My today's wisdom: Use the aperture you need, not the aperture you may get.

[@MatMarrash]

Oooh, that's a good one! :)

[@SaschaHirschner]

@@MatMarrash I have my moments ;)

[@healthid]

Really enjoyed these rules of thumb! I'm wondering, do you have some kind of mnemonic or memory aid to make sure you do all the stuff that needs doing before you can take the shot? Close lens, cock shutter, set f/stop, set shutter speed, take dark slide out, yadda yadda?

[@MatMarrash]

Thanks Michael! I don't really have a mnemonic, but have practiced a good amount of "the dance", all the things that lead up to the shot from camera bag -> exposed film.

[@Francois_L_7933]

And then there are also the obvious blunders to avoid... like don't forget to close the shutter after you're done focusing 🙄 Not that I have ever done that or anything...

[@MatMarrash]

Agreed Francois, I think the blunders version would include nearly 100 tips! >__

[@AnniE_1000]

I know exactly what you mean 😁😁

[@neffknows1]

Great video, but your shirt is making me uncomfortable. 🙂

[@olafwDE]

😅 I didn't even notice until I read your comment.

[@craigfouche]

Ilfortra 400 🤣

[@MatMarrash]

You can thank Mike Padua and the folks over at ShootFilm Co for the amazing/infuriating shirt!

[@-adrienblanc]

this T shirt is really confusing ah ah

[@drdirt8276]

Rule #4 - If you have FitBit don't wear it in the film changing tent. :(

[@MatMarrash]

That's a big rule in my B&W film classes, no smart watches in the darkroom/tent!

[@andyvan5692]

@@MatMarrash also don't forget normal watches, the iluminating faces are just as bad ( iridescent paint).