Howie Mandel: Never too Late to Make a Change

[@catherinefoster1481]

I'm 70 years old. At my age I strive for contentment. Anything past that is icing on the cake. Howie Mandel nails it. God bless him.

[@MajiMarji]

@Catherine Foster - Are you the Catherine Foster that I know? Asking from Shoreline, WA.

[@catherinefoster1481]

@@MajiMarji I moved up here in April from SF Bay Area so I kinda doubt it - but who knows? Where is Shoreline WA?

[@MajiMarji]

@@catherinefoster1481 - Just north of Seattle city limits.

[@questioneverything7582]

It's happening just as I said it would...the healing phase of being "scared to death" is pneumonia, aka "flu". So as people are released from the solitary confinement of their homes (because of media and government lies based on the fraudulent Germ Theory), and people begin to get happy and feel less stressed, the result will be the healing phase....of pneumonia, flu, colds, general sickness. You can also see the light sensitivity, appendicitis in some, numerous tooth problems and gum swelling, laryngitis, etc. The fear campaign has caused ALL the illnesses, not a Boogey Virus. Every disease is based on the Germ Theory, which was the theory of ONE man over 100 years ago. It was never proven to be 100% valid, and has not even been QUESTIONED again. Why? In order for a theory to be valid, it must be reproduceable in each and every person 100% of the time. Every single person exposed to a "virus" MUST get sick from it 100% of the time, over and over again. It's how you PROVE a theory is valid. This was never done. Scientists used to think witches and witchcraft were valid!! Educated people?? hahaha!! If you cannot "catch" cancer, arthritis or diabetes from another person, then you cannot "catch" a cold or flu. There is no such thing that only SOME diseases are communicable, but not all. It's either all or none of them...they are all based on the same Germ Theory. If you can't "catch" someone's lung cancer, you can't "catch" their colds or flu. Upsetting and distressing events in a person's life is what causes ALL cancer and cancer-equivalent disease, cold, flu, pneumonia, bronchitis, etc. A massive fear campaign will CAUSE people to be "worried sick", but sickness doesn't happen until people resolve their fears. Why do you think kids get sick in October? Because their fear of going back to school and being upset about it finally dissolves, and they get back into their routines. What the media and government is doing to people is criminal. So of course, when everyone is allowed to escape the hostage situation the governments have put their people into, and they start relaxing about the "scary virus" that's not in any way transmissible, they will begin their healing phase (get sick), and the corrupt governments will call it a different “scary” word, a different Boogey Man coming to get you.....repeat the same mistakes that never worked from the beginning, re-institute the same restrictions that only made people more traumatized, and more panic will ensue as well as martial law, a removal of all your rights, and you let it happen. The longer people allow this government to hold them hostage in their homes, the more severe the "sickness" will be. Western Medicine is pure fraud, and people's lives are destroyed because of it. Welcome to the United States of China.

[@good__enough]

Honey, some of your thinking is faulty; that is, incorrect.

[@marie-clairedelongchamp1330]

This proud Canadian loves Howie Mandel, not just because he’s funny, but because he’s so transparent with his mental awareness. I applaud him for participating in “Bell let’s talk day” regarding mental illness, removing it’s stigma. He’s a wonderful ambassador & a Canadian treasure! ♥️

[@pamburton9090]

Agreed!! I just love this man!!!

[@socialworkertravels169]

As someone who grew up in North York, it is great to hear Howie and Jonathan talking about my are, including the streets. We Canadians have the right pronunciation, Mayim!💕

[@WhosaidIrene]

Another great episode ‼️ My heart ♥️ began racing a bit faster when Howie said “My resting state is terror”. I live with ADHD, dyslexia, anxiety and have never heard a quote slap me with truth

[@lauraleecreations3217]

Have you read his book? Out of the very few books I have read and finished.... I absolutely loved the book. I learned about him, and myself from that book. I stuffer from, ADHD, anxiety, depression, OCD overlapping hoarding and PTSD from trauma/abuse. And I really appreciate his book.

[@WhosaidIrene]

@@lauraleecreations3217 thank you - I’m definitely going to read 👍

[@nonnidreams]

WhosaidCate? Love the cat in your screen name. Or at least I think it’s supposed to be one.

[@Cate7451]

@@nonnidreams me too.

[@Fvmarks]

This was so good.

[@crystalpowell8619]

Having worked in the Orthodox Jewish community for many years, I can really appreciate Howie finding 9 men to make sure there is a minyan so that he could say Kaddish. I also really appreciate what he said about tzedakah and how seeing your name on a plague or in the newsletter is the opposite of what giving should do. Great episode!

[@astridx7485]

I have OCD and hearing Howie talking about it makes me so happy. He described it perfectly. It's a really hard thing to live with, glad to hear he's working on it, we all should 💪

[@robertlaminsky7815]

Thank u as always i have shared your podcast with former students because of your focus on mental health. I taught for 20 yrs and so i saw a tremendous amount of trauma in my former students. I have a degree in history and minor in political science 18 credits out of 138 in psychology. I was not prepared for those kids trauma. I was prepared for the war of the roses or the civil war. I was not ready for an eleven yr old rape victim In My class. I am 52 now i was 25 when that happened. I have much more life experiences now and could have done a better job. Your voice is heard more than former teachers. Please continue to do this. I found u bc of big bang but i stayed for your empathy and intelligence. Peace and happiness for u and your family.

[@nathanieI]

Went to my first meeting about mental health this week. I'm 38. Feels good hearing that Howie got help late too. I'm not alone.

[@2be1am]

I feel so much joy when I wake up to a new episode. Mayim & Jonathan, thank you SO much for allowing a space of contentment, healing, learning, laughing... I send you both Gratitude. *From Breakdown to Breakthrough...* (again) Thank You.

[@silvijarosandic7485]

Anither great episode, thank you guys for all of them. Amazing guest, conversations, q&a, everything. :) Greets from Croatia and happy 2022.!

[@59Zeta]

Stratford --- I live here now - which hotel bar ? I met you when you were a young teen taking swimming lessons (in your Gramma's pool?) Bathurst /Dufferin Finch from Ken Uffen ? You were funny and sweet Howie

[@Amber24426]

I love Howie for how open he has been regarding his experience with OCD. As someone who also struggles immensely with OCD, I find a lot of comfort in what he shares about his mental health and the various ways it has impacted him throughout his life.

[@tjmcguire9417]

Mayim. I am speechless. You guys just helped my entire family. Grew up with Howie. Same age. Same schools. Same place. I am safe to say we are all proud of him. Saw him at Yuk Yuss that first night. We were both 22. Please thank him for me and my family.

[@julietvelarde3816]

I told my sons " Everybody's different ". My younger son is high functioning autistic. My big "boy", 34, is gentle, kind, as my younger son. I so very lucky . Thank you for your show. Please have a happy new year!

[@Historian212]

What a fantastic episode. I love how Howie explains OCD, and what it does to your state of mind and life. His description of Jewish teaching is lovely. One thing for people to know is that in Judaism, tzedakah is just charity in general; the anonymity of the giver is considered the highest form of tzedakah, but is not the only form. Also interesting: the word tzedakah is related to the word tzedek, which means justice. So charity and justice are closely associated with each other.

[@CatLittlepage]

Wow♡♡

[@catherinefoster1481]

Historian212 - thank you for the explanation. Concise and to the point. Perfect!

[@CarolynMatyjanka]

I'm so glad you spelled out tzedakah. I thought it was Sedaka as in Neil then wondered if he was still alive and if it was a stage name and thought 'I gotta Google him and listen' then somehow snapped back to the video/podcast but kept wondering too... (PS was just diagnosed with ADHD as an adult at 58!! Constant.state.of.terror!)

[@thorsonnanc]

Love Howie Mandel! I was around at the start of his career & everyone was SO shocked that he became a Dr. on St. Elsewhere!!! He was great on that show!! I'm Canadian!

[@oneirishpoet]

I was aware of Howie since the 80s but I don't remember him being on that show St Elsewhere? Of course I don't watch much teevee either so I never see his game show stuff either

[@coffeeboy71]

I’ve watched this a few times now, and honestly I still almost scream “that’s it” when Howie says his “resting state is terror”. It’s so accurate for how I feel most of the time.

[@thejackal007]

I feel like there is still so much more to talk to Howie about. I hope to see him back again!

[@marimedgal]

I love his openness and honesty. It’s so cool that he has a podcast with his daughter. I would LOVE to hear one of Howie’s conversations with a telemarketer. 😂

[@manevolujia7558]

How the hell does this episode not have millions of views?! Blossom is interviewing Bobby’s World right in front of us!! This is wayyy passed 90s kid’s nostalgia-nut allergies, get me the mayor!1one

[@hiphiprenae]

As a person who has OCD, I truly understand what its like to like with the hell in your head. I have done many years of Exposure and Response Prevention and although it has helped me, there are still days that are horrible. Thank you for bring this disorder to the front. Many people think of this disorder as "quirky" or "annoying". Its life altering and I hate it.

[@beeheart6529]

Mayim is so good at interviewing. She listens so well but also keeps the interview focused on mental health. I’m thankful for this podcast.

[@archaprice3372]

Mayim, I agree with this commenter, you are a great interviewer!

[@juliaoverlinmslpccncc1982]

To consider someone so funny having such an internal dialogue of "terror" that his presence is built on breaking that monotony with laughter through authenticity, was amazing to hear about, his journey, "clawing my way back to Acceptance." Accepting oneself gives rise and potential to others doing the same. Such a great interview!

[@archaprice3372]

I’m in total agreement with you.

[@johntirado-glover3574]

Howie Mandel is an icon, but it is for his raw, and honest depiction of his battle with Mental illness. Thanks Mayim for giving us a voice, the struggle with Mental illness is no joke. You are helping so many with this podcast.

[@heatherglover7789]

I HAVE NEVER NEEDED SOMETHING MORE IN MY LIFE (that a youtube channel has advertised) ! This could be life changing! Thank you!!!

[@kristinewithak8265]

I grew up in the 80s and Howie was a favorite comedian for my brother and I. As an adult and relating to his issues with germs, I can't help but to feel not so bad about never touching a door handle without a tissue or holding my breath when I pass by someone or startle jump when in public and I hear someone sneeze or cough and get away from the area. I too have been prepared for covid before it even came along. Excellent episode!

[@nataliesirota2611]

LOVE, Love, love Howie Mandel!!! He, Mayim, and Jonathan are awesome! Loved watching you all have such a great time and deal with difficult topics at the same time. Thanks so much Howie for helping us all know that "just getting through the day" is okay. Also, helping us find the humor in life, always!

[@orland0110]

It is so awesome that you have Howie Mandel on your podcast, and it is so awesome you upload another episode! Thank you so much Mayim!

[@nancytrautman9155]

I lucked across this podcast and was very happy to see Howie talking at length about his background and experiences. On his podcast his ADHD takes over IMO but here he has the chance to truly be himself, which is beautiful. I saw him at YukYuk’s in Toronto in 1978 and have been a keen fan since. His success and honesty makes him our mental health superman. What a mensch.

[@chanakornfeld7575]

I am a craniosacral therapist based in Israel and helping the body (soma) feel more comfortable . I have a specific type of brushing technic that along with the therapy can help. Hoping both you and Howie Mandel can feel safe in your skin.

[@Crystalspanda]

OMG 💗 mental health Parity. Thank You Howie💙 As an independent mental health peer advocate I went to DC & Juneau to advocate for parity. Over 20 years now. Awesome Coverage ❤️

[@janeenerbaneener]

Possibly my favorite Breakdown episode! I've been a Howie fan since the late 1900's; finding out what created his stand-up makes it even better! Such a beautiful and candid interview

[@stacyfabiszewski4633]

Howie Mandel is a gem and an icon ! I am so proud of him sharing his struggles with mental health, it's good to share and be open about it. He's all around a great guy and I could listen to him talk all day. I can sympathize with you, Howie and Mayim what you are going through. I honestly do. I'm so happy that you both are talking about this, however I do feel terrible for How Howie lives his life, because when he's alone he feels misery. Though I understand that. Mayim, I would love to see you have Howie back on the podcast with you. Mayim, you do such a great job with your podcast and everything else you do, I am in such awwww of you.

[@oranjmusemeyer968]

It's so funny to see him do what he did on stage so many years ago when I saw him live! It was so funny when he did the rubber glove on his head, or him singing in his funny voices! I saw him many times live when I was young and I would never have guessed any pain or discomfort behind his actions. Just loved him!

[@AliciaDearn]

When Howie discusses how annoying it is to have people compare their normal behaviors or experiences to a real health condition, or when they make jokes about it, I feel this in my soul. I have narcolepsy and PTSD so I experience this a lot.

[@bludaizee24]

I was a kid in Vancouver BC, and the first time I saw Howie was on The Alan Thicke show. I was instantly in love with him! I've loved Howie for at least 40 years! 💕💕💕

[@atphoenix2020]

Need to bring Howie on again soon. Could have listened to him for hours. Sending a virtual hug.

[@edlinton4113]

Thank you so much for this episode. I don't know why but listening to Howie helps me understand what my Son goes through even more. I am also a proud Canadian. Thank you Mayim for being such a real person.

[@irenegold9744]

I'll listen to Jonathan and Howie trade Toronto stories all day!! I'm in the great white north, east of TO, but grew up in Scarborough! ❤️🇨🇦

[@VelenoPuddin]

As a Canadian from north York who is 10 min away from where howie grew up, and as someone who was just diagnosed ADHD at 40, it was exciting hearing those street signs from J & H! I’ve been a fan of Howie’s for decades so this is really cool. Ok - back to the episode, my coffee is getting cold 🤗

[@CarolynMatyjanka]

Just diagnosed at age 58!! Love and respect!! And 'OH THAT'S what that is!!!???'

[@VelenoPuddin]

@@CarolynMatyjanka that’s what what is? Haha sorry I wasn’t sure if u were referring to something I said, or if u were expressing that you’re experiencing the same thing I’ve been where life is the same but now I have ADHD awareness 😂 Congrats on your diagnosis 👍

[@CarolynMatyjanka]

@@VelenoPuddin the weird stuff I do due to ADHD...also the ever present anxiety due to undiagnosed ADHD...

[@tinahinsperger6582]

Thank you so much for this episode. I am grateful for Howie Mandel’s frank and open discussion about OCD. My youngest brother had ADD and OCD. He suicided in 1998 because he could no longer manage his intrusive thoughts and the pressures of just being in this world. I still miss him every day.

[@wendya.k.a.louise6927]

Thank you that pod cast was so informative. I have an adult son with a similar disorder profile as Howie. Boy, as a mom it is difficult to understand his thoughts and feelings. Wow now I get it.... I had my son come and listen, it was truly eye opening for me. Again thank you

[@atphoenix2020]

And, he just shared about how the rubber glove came to be. I remember how he talked. Too funny!! Blind person in front row and why? I went with 20 blind people to a play at the Smith Center in Las Vegas. It was audio described and we sat in the nose bleed section in the last two rows in top balcony. Makes sense! Loving the program and only a half hour into it. Best guest ever!!!!

[@atphoenix2020]

Before even watching this episode I was so excited to see your guest for the show is Howie Mandel. I saw him early on in his careee and he did the routine where he puts a surgical glove over his head and blows it up like a rooster comb. It was the funniest thing I ever saw. I probably peed laughing. Have loved him ever since!

[@livingitup9647]

Loved this discussion with Howie! I've never heard him being this calm, serious and philosophical... even spiritual. But, most important was his wonderful honesty and candor about those particular issues, and to hear how he keeps persevering with multiple strategies to manage it all. It was very informative. 👌🌟💞

[@Margar02]

He was on Conan O'Brien's podcast some weeks ago too. Very cool.

[@gayleford8277]

I remember seeing Howie at Yuk Yuk's in the late seventies, what a blast..ok ok alright....and the baby voice...the best! ..He is amazing given what he dealt with.

[@LJ-uq7eh]

I have liked Howie Mandel for a very long time but this presentation has made me like & respect him even more.

[@the1ladytammy]

I love that Howie's podcast is on KZbin. I cannot handle listening to podcasts. I can listen if I'm watching.

[@pattyjoyce4461]

Unbelievably beautiful. He brought me to tears.

[@FreckledGemini]

I absolutely love you two. You’re great at doing this podcast and I feel very felt and heard when I watch. I grew up w a little brother w severe OCD and he committed suicide 2 years ago. It’s a hard hard thing to be a helpless bystander that loves that person so much. ❤️

[@taramcdonaldortiz4810]

Great interview Loved it when he smiled, he has a beautiful smile 💜💜💜

[@danabrewer3676]

An endless chorus of thank you for having this individual on your pod. I read his book "here's the deal: don't touch me" the year it came out. He was a house favorite in the 80s and beyond. This has been so enjoyable.

[@leedegnan2040]

Wow, thank you, Mr Mandel, for being so real and a great proponent for mental health and awareness (you too as well, Ms Bialek!)

[@sarajean1861]

Wow. I always respected Howie... this gave me goosebumps. I really love him more. 🥰🥰🥰 love this episode

[@Cesar-pq2ck]

Didn’t know this Howie Mandel; he’s such a cool person! I love people that are honest about their struggles and their mistakes in life.

[@jacklheureux1488]

I love Howie and his outlook on life and religion.!!!!

[@keo1221]

This was one of your best interviews and I cried laughing when he talked about the school prank.. smiling as I type this. Didn't want this conversation to end

[@jeaninerobinson964]

Really enjoyed this. Thank you! Blessings all.

[@wannabetrucker7475]

This was very enlightening on a personal level, can't wait to listen to his podcast. 👍🏽

[@sandram6913]

What a magnificent interview. This should help so many people get the inspiration to venture out for adventure in their lives. So much fun. It's amazing that people like are amazed that they have anxiety yet are so publicly admired and famous.

[@Dpmallett]

I just love this episode. I love all your episodes I have watched so far. I just found you about 3 weeks ago so now I am catching up. Thank you so much for doing these podcasts. ❤️

[@LorraineinPNW]

I found Howie's anecdotal evidence of his school experience helpful! I'm a teacher, so...

[@kathrynoneill5862]

I got diagnosed with all those things Howie has in my 30s it's a pain but I'm glad I finally got a diagnosis.

[@Crystalspanda]

Thank You Again. I created a Wellness toolbox. After a few years, I realized that my home was filled with tools to stay well. Then I knew the whole universe is my tool box. Full access 💗 I still get Triggered, so part of my plan is identify, talk about( with my Peer Supporters) and be Aware for future hits to my brain. Awesome coverage ❤️

[@roxycuster6943]

I am so excited for this interview. I was thinking Howie would make a great guest. You have such amazing people.

[@Mercurychyld1]

Aww, I wish this interview were longer. I adore all of you guys. I related to so much.

[@Fiawordweaver]

Thank you. A moment. Coming from you is so rich and depth

[@deborahhobson9682]

Absolutely fantastic show! I could have listened for another 2 hours. So much to take in and learn and was entertaining at the same time. Thank you ❤️

[@7dazeaweek]

excellent conversation between you all- thank you!

[@lypscratch]

Thank you for this segment. I had no idea about the genetic component of this condition. This opened my eyes to why I feel this way right now and searching for serenity in the moment.

[@TaylorBishop8890]

I loved the Savannah GA shout out. I grew up in GA my whole life, moved to Savannah at 11 and that was the first time I ever met anyone Jewish!

[@wowwee0]

Wow this is one of the best interviews. Howie is amazing.

[@tracyalbert6056]

Mayim, I recently found your channel and I am thoroughly enjoying all of it. I especially enjoyed this episode, being a Canadian myself and following both your career and Howie's. Beaches is one of my favourite movies and I saw Howie's Watusi tour. I love you both and this was awesome to see and will continue to watch more. Thank you for sharing and helping those in need. :)

[@belladominick3250]

Outstanding interview, I now understand Mr. Mandel better!

[@jillsimpson1577]

So impressive. In insecurity and fear you pull it off over and over.

[@clairedouglas1726]

Really enjoyed this episode as usual Mayim was fantastic I love this podcast show been watching your KZbin videos for the last few days Mayim since I have covid and are isolating in my room where iv been since last Wednesday 🥲, watching and listening to you has cheered me up love u 😘 xx

[@lorazick7966]

Thank you for your honesty.. I would love you to have the both of you do Another episode together.

[@marisamartinezolivera]

WOW! We’ve found today here a kind of “real Sheldon Cooper”! Asking myself if Bill Prady put himself along with Howie Mandel’s to create our beloved TBBT character! Anyone here remember him there while hight pitched Bernie’s voice cried “Howie, Howie!!..???😍

[@pokemonfanthings4444]

Thank you so much for saying that your mental disorders don’t serve you, that you don’t consider them as positive gifts that fueled your success. I am tired of neurotypical people talking and writing about how their ADD, anxiety, and other stuff made them successful. It’s not realistic for most of us

[@melrox8809]

Howie Mandel is a funny guy. This is a great episode.

[@pamelaconstantine170]

I love you Howie even more than I already had. ❤️❤️❤️

[@CallMeGailyn]

Ahh, thank you, Howie, for rekindling the memory! I remember laughing heartily with my father & stepmother, and that was over a Carry On film. We laughed over Carl Reiner & Mel Brooks, too, and they were indeed inspiring for the future. All I ever wanted to do after that was to make them laugh.

[@lalah9481]

Great show! I could totally listen to you guys chatting with Howie for more hours…. Weekly would be AMAZING 💖

[@m_brokenleg]

While Howie was speaking here about his germophobia, OCD and his other akward quirky symptoms..I was truly picturing Big Bang Theory’s Sheldon! “Enjoy the moment” as some solution. Such a big motto. And how true all you’re explaining from 52:00 to 54:15 about teens being responsible human beings! That must be extended to all religions and life philosophies! Thank you Mayim & Jonathan 💜for another brilliant but truly funny episode! Happy New Year! 🔔

[@Gobi512]

One of my favorite interviews.

[@geralynivettepereznegron2167]

Love love this Podcast. Very informative, very raw, real. Thank you.

[@belynmejia5117]

Yes you are the chosen, blessed, favored people!!! Gifted in intellect, humor, peity, looks, beauty, creativity, business, finances, family, & friends - God's promise to Abraham whether you believe it or not!!! Praise God - 😇🙏👼🌹💖

[@melissahodgson1958]

OMG! I totally shrieked!!!! I watched Bobby's World on Saturday Mornings!!! That's how I got introduced to Howie! Loved his mom!!!!!

[@SL313]

I loved Bobby’s World!

[@medicinaemdia4895]

I do remember Howard Mandel from the tv show St. Elsewhere from MTM. Not that I’m old, I watched it on Hulu during the beginning of last year.

[@lorimurphy1295]

What was Howie's job when he wasn't or hadn't found his comedic career? This podcast really is enlightening and helpful!

[@joyharmon1110]

I'm old! I remember the rubber glove thing. For years, whenever I saw Howie Mandel on TV, right away I would say, "It's that guy who puts the rubber glove on his head!¨

[@seasonalmommy7173]

I love howie so much! Great interview

[@QuixLand]

Love LOVE LovE this episode Mayim...!! I grew up watching Howie do his routine... not at the club but when he finally appeared on tv. I so remember the hands and the 'what?;.."... I have always said my most favorite comedy routines were Howie's baby voice singing.. Its my potty ..... and Steve Martins' arrow on the head and banjo playing. I think I identified because they both appeared to be afraid.. and seems to be more common than you realize, that that is how most people really ARE.! I have had all the same struggles Howie had, but i think a little milder version.. But it rings true, no matter what level. Thank You.!!

[@BunnyCc]

Ps. Howie brought me here …I was only so very happy to see Mayim as the host so of course I subscribed!!🥰

[@Historian212]

Literally waiting for the episode to upload. Thanks!

[@hwy138]

I have seen Howie Live and it was so hilarious !!

[@ernestvenn8291]

Howie, I can remember seeing you in your early days in Toronto at Yuk Yuks.

[@zsuzsa456]

Love Howie ❤ Appriceate his philosophy,how to be a better human being❤

[@snappyintentions9354]

One of my favorite breakdowns! I will take away some great tools from this one. Thank you!

[@michelleslifeonrepeat]

Lovely conversations. Thanks guys.

[@reneepavlus6791]

Love Maya, love Holly, biggest fan, love love love, respect, respect, respect, and appreciate their honesty, your care, their cleverness, and the way they deal with all kinds of mental illness. I’m not a famous person, but I love your spirit, your energy, your ability to be empathic, and not judge mental. I’m an older woman, in fact how his age. I’ve always been a square peg in around hole, never quite fit again. I’m also a clinician, a person with several disabilities, and would love to share my philosophy is “love to scan you were born in, warts at all quote and also that God doesn’t make mistakes, and none of us on the steaks. Pride, dignity, honor, expectation, Respect, and knowing that everyone is valuable despite of disability, difference, uniqueness is what really matters. Let’s slow down, take a fresh look at each other, and learn to understand that what we struggle with the most is what makes us who we are, authenticity at the deepest level.