MD vs DO vs Caribbean Medical School

[@MedSchoolInsiders]

Thanks for watching! Let's have a mature and rational discussion in these comments =)

[@adonis2241]

Thank you for this video.

[@AaronTrillo]

Do you include IMG's in the Caribbean category?

[@zakiahxo]

Can you please do a video on Special Master’s Programs (SMPs). If they are worth it to improve your academic record?

[@andrewkelada6639]

Dr. Jubbal, please note that the overall match rate for DO's is 99%. It is 85% in NRMP but if you add the AOA it will be 99% according to American Association of Osteopathic medical schools.

[@أبومطلقآلمردوف]

Med School Insiders I’m obsessed with your content 💙

[@CrimPyro]

why the hell am i watching this, I work at taco bell 🤦‍♀️

[@kwzzy1916]

Because deep down we both know your potential is limitless. You can achieve in life any amount of goodness you wish to.

[@alisaharris8926]

It's never too late to start.

[@patrickstar4539]

Can I get a cheese quesadilla?

[@Mike-xv9zz]

Believe me , it's a better life than med

[@brad4908]

I didn’t start medical school until age 40, and I used to work at Burger King. I graduate in 9 months.

[@DrAdnan]

Dr. Jubbal’s not afraid to rustle some feathers if the data’s right 💪

[@MedSchoolInsiders]

You can take me out of surgery, but you can’t take the surgeon out of me

[@dsank2001]

Med School Insiders bars.

[@ThePejsa344]

Yo my boy Adnan, you’re a YT personality mate I see you everywhere

[@DrAdnan]

Justin Moran Lol, I just watch too much KZbin

[@liumq1]

Dr. Jubbal’s

[@binuramakasheva2018]

STATISTICS APPLY TO POPULATION, NOT INDIVIDUALS. - I want this merch

[@barackobama9958]

“Cousin’s goldfish twin father”😂😂😂😂

[@farazshaikh4967]

What are you doing "here" Mr. President?

[@jenniferbrown7539]

@@farazshaikh4967 haven't you heard? Hes not the President anymore. Lol.

[@adewunmiadekoya9247]

Barack Obama v

[@MrQuestiel]

@@jenniferbrown7539 Incorrect. Every national head of state retains the address for life. ergo Obama, Bush, Clinton etc are correctly "addressed" as Mr. President

[@jenniferbrown7539]

@@MrQuestiel wow, thank you. Welcome to the internet. Were no ONE is sarcastic.

[@christiancasteel5962]

Don’t pick Carib over DO bc you think patients are gunna be skeptical of a DO degree. 99% of patients do not even know the difference between their physician and their NP/PA. This is such a silly argument to risk being 400k in debt with no job over.

[@mnunezhk]

Christian casteel first of all DOs have been one of the best physicians I have seen and worked with. a Dr is a Dr

[@fn9959]

If you are in the US** DO's are NOT recognized outside the US. You'll end up unemployed or working as something else if you are NOT American and consider this route. But for Americans a reasonable choice. Don't forget many of us don't reside nor want to reside in the US. We are just watching this vid.

[@johngrey1074]

@@fn9959 Some countries do recognize American DOs as physicians, though not all.

[@georgelampros4593]

Christian you are so correct man could not agree more!! Carib schools are tase... I know people who have gone to them and say how bad they were

[@xplicitgoofy1015]

@@fn9959stop being toxic Switzerland allows DO to transfer to be MD

[@CottageLayout]

Every single argument made here is completely valid, especially the point regarding academic ability of the individual. I’m a DO student and I understand that if I want to match into a competitive specialty I’ll have a more difficult path when compared to my MD colleagues. That’s just the fact of the matter. That notwithstanding I am still humbled by the opportunity to become a doctor, and thankful to those who gave me the chance. One thing I would implore pre-meds to consider is what do they care about more: the career or those two letters after their name? I think those who are high performers in college get a sort of “credentialing high” when they think about all the cool titles and letters they can achieve lol. If your dream is FM or Peds (low competition) BUT you would rather go Caribbean instead of DO because of the letters you’ll get after your name then maybe you should reconsider why you want to be a doctor in the first place. Remember: medicine is a wonderful field that comes with some prestige and most doctors are in the top 5 or 6% of earners in the country. BUT if the only things you consider as a premed are respect (MD>DO) or salary (surgical>primary care) then you are going to have a rough go of it.

[@MedSchoolInsiders]

Well said

[@vnicknguyen]

Great post. As a new DO student I agree whole heartedly.

[@nathanlaw9510]

I agree exactly. I chose to attend a DO school this year because it was where I felt more comfortable and where I had the most connections to faculty. If I had a perfect GPA and MCAT, I'd make the same decision again.

[@nathanlaw9510]

yos There is more to life than just medical school, and much more to life than medical school reputation. (And there is much, much, much more to life than KZbin comment trolling)

[@TraceLight]

CottageLayout one of the main goals of it is the specialties. If DO were just as competitive and valuable to the hardcore surgical specialties, then sure. But it isn’t. That is not a good thing. Only thing is MD for that route (the preferred route)

[@lauriesutton853]

The thing about this is, I was born and raised in the Caribbean. This gives me a discount for premed. Also, as I am not a US citizen, I can’t get student loans. Thus, for me Caribbean is a much better option

[@MedSchoolInsiders]

Yes! As I said in the video, my recommendation for most, but not all, students is DO. You may be in a situation where Caribbean makes more sense

[@マルケシア]

same, but i really want the benefits US MD schools can provide

[@DJ_HRT]

@@マルケシア then i would consider trying to become a US resident first if that’s feasible and possible for you because your options and benefits will open up even more

[@deronsardlouis7554]

4 years later and I’ve finally found someone in the same situation as me

[@damilare2404]

Sincerely we all come here as pre-med for the truth even if it hurts. I am just glad we have people like this who still believe in delivering the hard fact and after weighing all these options based on concrete evidence, we are better equipped to properly make informed decisions. Thank you doctor Jabbal.

[@MedSchoolInsiders]

Thank you daare. Just trying to help premeds and med students, even if it’s not popular to speak the truth

[@Fandomonium456]

I’m a proud D.O! And I matched orthopedics this past spring. I applied both the NRMP and AOA match. Took COMLEX and USMLE, and felt my curriculum prepared me well for both. LOTS of connections built along the way helped me bring me where I am today. Had 15 interviews total (average ortho is about 7-8). I wish you reported the amount of D.O’s that matched in the AOA match in addition to NRMP, which is always above 93%. Either way great video! Premeds please comment if you want advice on pursuing a competitive speciality going the D.O. route or if you wanna hear my story, (I chose my school so I can be debt free out of med school)

[@Fandomonium456]

Keep in mind I’m also super busy so I’ll reply whenever I can :)

[@fk4866]

Hey! I would love to hear the story of your match!

[@Gooner5]

Hello, I would like to hear your perspective on pursuing competitive residencies as a D.O. and studying for both board exams

[@joshualong5690]

Just accepted into LECOM!

[@OmarAbdulMalikDHEdMPASPACPAPro]

@@joshualong5690 Congratulations! I had considered LECOM for the accelerated PA-to-DO program. I wish you the VERY BEST!👋🧑🏾‍⚕️🏃🏾

[@DavidSmith-zf9lh]

I’m a DO medicine resident in an MD residency. All I can say is kids, listen to this video. I’ve had a bunch of premed scribes, undergrads ask which school they should go to and my first question to them is, “Well, it depends on what you want to do.” And most of them say cardiothoracic surgery, neurosurgery, derm, yada yada. I encourage them to go to US MD schools because facts. Also, the whole “holistic” thing is spot on. It’s as if a NP saying “well we LISTEN to our patients.” Commence triggering...

[@rygarisfun8164]

David Smith 100% agree. I am a DO, graduated at an MD residency in Emergency Medicine. In my undergraduate years I totally bought into the DO vs MD doesn’t matter. I only sent out a handful or applications to med school and got what I deserved. I had to jump through extra hurdles to get in to my program. I tell pre-med students “Just get in to the best school you possibly can”. I would do things differently if I could go back in time, but ultimately I matched to my top choice residency and I am in my dream job, so DEFINITELY do not avoid DO schools. You still have to be really smart (a 3.7 vs 3.5 GPA is not that big a difference) and it is 100% up to you the kind of physician you will become regardless of where you went.

[@AhmedMohamed-vc8pp]

Honest conflict is more important than dishonest harmony! Love your videos and the pre med roadmap course! I'm starting college this fall and that course has removed the burden of trying to plan every step, I now know exactly what I need to do and what not to do. Thanks Dr J.

[@MedSchoolInsiders]

Thanks Ahmed and glad you’re finding the course useful! Will be updating it shortly as well so stay tuned

[@jonmsweet]

From someone who has been a full-time educator in internal medicine residency education for 24 years, served as a residency program director, and worked with allopathic, osteopathic, and Caribbean students and residents for the same period of time...your video is spot on. 100%. Prospective medical students would be wise to heed your advice.

[@xplicitgoofy1015]

It’s spot on but he missed one factor , there is no difference between US MDs or DOs as the difference between them is going down each year when these old heads that residency programs retire allowing younger people to close thst gap off completely they are so annoying those old heads

[@nicoledijkhoff5097]

What would you recommend to Caribbean student wanting to study Medicine? Entering a medical school in The Netherlands is super competitive, you can only apply to 3 schools in total, 1 school per year.. I’ve applied twice and it didn’t work out both times due to personal circumstances and now I’m looking at other options in case my last try doesn’t work out, hopefully everything goes well and there’s no unforeseen stuff. Would the Caribbean be a good option for me?

[@YhormEG]

Totally agree. I feel privileged to attend a DO school, but it's not without its downsides and it helps no one to pretend otherwise. Also worth mentioning MD schools have, on average, better opportunities for research which helps tremendously with competitive residencies. I had an MCAT above US MD average at a 512 but a GPA fairly well below. Though my last three years of college I maintained over at 3.9 average with an A in virtually all the prerequisite classes, it wasn't enough to undo my freshmen year. I made an informed decision to not spend a couple more years fixing my GPA or attending a master's program and chose to go the DO route. Part of my personal equation was that I didn't want to do anything hyper-competitive, and every year you aren't an attending physician is a large chunk of money you aren't making that year. Going in with the expectations that I certainly can't count on just working hard and having competitive specialties open to me, being honest with what realistic goals could be. Being happy in life is all about keeping your expectations realistic, and I would never count on being the exception to the rule. The DO route is great, I honestly love it, but you just have to know what you're getting yourself into. At the end of the day what I'm getting myself into is the opportunity to become a physician, and I'm grateful there is a pathway perfect for me.

[@MedSchoolInsiders]

Wise words my man and well said

[@Gross126]

You could have gotten in to MD schools that accept lower gpas...

[@NovaDoll]

The best doctor I had is a DO. HONESTLY I was tired of MDs and the old thinking.

[@xplicitgoofy1015]

@@MedSchoolInsiderswhy are you being so rude to DO applicants? DOs do have similar opportunities now a days with the new merger honestly idk why any program director would be bias towards a DO applicant when they literally got the same training an MD applicant had and actually worked more harder then an MD applicant because they had to study for both the COMLEX and USMLE in order to specialize so idk why they would discriminate against DO applicants in any way

[@EGA-Delta]

@@xplicitgoofy1015 I heard that DO programs are becoming more like MD programs and the gap between the two is decreasing. this video was 4 years ago

[@joebrennan9023]

Can you do a video discussing MD/PhD programs?

[@kenechukwuosude6814]

Also MD/MPH!!!

[@kennedywilliamsdrums]

Or an MD/MBA video!

[@thefenerbahcesk4156]

Also MD/MS!!

[@tiannalee7962]

Yes I need this video!

[@tomsch.4259]

Why are there so many things in the us? In Germany you go for your approbation and then you can do your PhD and that's it

[@sophiesan4955]

The fact that you took the risk and make this video to help people is already amazing! thanks Dr. Jubbal! You are one a big inspiration of mine. I finish up nursing school this August and I hope to help out the nursing school community the same you do with med students! Cheers to making this world a better place!

[@marinaereva2365]

Hey Kev, I am a medical doctor from Bulgaria, working in Switzerland and writing PhD in Germany. I quited my residency in Cardiovascular surgery in the capital of Switzerland this year. Your videos inspired me so much, just the specialty wasnt what I imagined, but it foesnt mean I am a bad doctor or a broke. Thank you :) :) :) You and meds insiders helped me soo much

[@CNNRNNTransformer]

There is literally UWI medical school as well. Which is not for profit and is very comprehensive

[@AA-jk1es]

My dermatologist is a DO. He Messed around in College so that prevent him from getting into MD but in DO school he really got his shit together a& was top of his class so as long as you work hard & prove yourself in Both comlex & usmle its possible but It would have been easier for him to get into dermatologist if he went to MD school. Agree with dr. Jubbal.

[@vincentnguyen5013]

"messed around in college" bruh DO school GPA averages are 3.5 cumulative, getting As and Bs in BCPM courses is not messing around"...

[@jojokiri]

@@vincentnguyen5013 Lol that's the average. There are lots of people way below that average and lots of people way above. Newer DO schools especially accept people with very low scores. I have classmates with a sub 3.0 GPA and a 495 MCAT

[@AA-jk1es]

@@vincentnguyen5013 According to him he did. because otherwise, he would not have gotten into Derm if he was not smart to begin with and do well both in comlex and usmle

[@AA-jk1es]

@@jojokiri where did your friend get into? lol

[@barrypollack2079]

@@vincentnguyen5013 Current GPA and MCAT scores are close for MD's and DO's. If your dermatologist went to school more than a decade ago there may have been a bigger gap. I'm pretty sure there was a bigger difference in the 1980`s when I was applying.

[@lorraine5800]

The graphics are fantastic! Thank you Dr. Jubbal, your enthusiasm for truth shines through & I’m glad you’re putting this content out there despite the outrage culture overtaking our social media feeds/outlets. Truth doesn’t bend to appease everyone who disagrees amongst themselves; truth shines a light on what is & what is not. And that’s the message I’m most glad you included!

[@eduardorivas7175]

Puerto Rico medical schools are considered U.S MD schools, all 4 medical schools on the island are LCME accredited.

[@MedSchoolInsiders]

👌

[@xavieraltori5428]

Thank you, for the love of God I have been researching this for days trying to figure out if the med school's here in the island were consider US MD or caribean 😂🤦‍♂️

[@Zengo38]

I keep thinking that he is either oblivious or is doing it on purpose as many commenters in previous videos with the topic have pointed out and he keeps making the same mistake

[@Zengo38]

@@xavieraltori5428 They are thankfully and they also give residency match both for here and in the mainland.

[@xavieraltori5428]

@@Zengo38 🥳

[@livinglou7140]

I'm a FM resident. From my experience there is no difference in practice when I've worked with other MDs and DOs. DOs match slightly less than MDs. Caribbean school grads match at a much lower rate. However, one thing that was not covered in this video was that the number of places you apply to for residency after medical school affects your chances of matching. MDs typically apply to 20-50 places for any given specialty. DOs apply to around the same amount of programs. Caribbean grads apply to WAY more. I've spoken with people who have applied to >200 programs. Bottom line is that they can also match, but they generally have to work harder (and pay more for applications).

[@raymetal7]

Dr. Jubbal, you’re completely right! Facts are facts, you cannot just ignore them cause they hurt your feelings. I’m applying to med school (30+ MD programs) this cycle. Even with a 511 MCAT and 3.81 GPA, I’m still applying to a couple of DO programs as a backup. MD admissions are very competitive nowadays and I don’t wanna wait a year to apply again if i don’t get accepted in any of them. If I end up getting accepted only in DO programs, I’ll become a DO. Either as an MD or DO, i will work my butt off to be a great physician. But as you said, I am aware and acknowledge the limitations of becoming a DO. Thanks for providing objective info on your channel!

[@paulscheinberg2414]

Excellent! Well Done! I’ve watched both videos and agree with all you’ve said. No need to ever apologize for truth telling! I’m a retired MD Pulmonologist/Intensivist and former CMO at a major Academic Hospital. In my >40 year career I’ve had the pleasure to work with excellent DO’s and MD’s as well as a few suboptimal from both groups. Each of us has the opportunity and obligation to be the best practitioner we can be while others have the right to judge our performance and behavior. My gravest concern about newly minted doctors is not whether they’re bright enough, but whether they are sufficiently committed to their patients to overcome the stifling pressures of mass production imposed by their corporate employers.

[@arwinterlyn]

I'm a senior in high school going pre-med, I'm glad I watched this video to be prepared for my future. Thank you Dr. Jubbal, love your videos!

[@ThePresentation010]

The more in time you go back the harder in general, life was for people. Way easier for all the zoomers to reach their potential. With all infinite information givin out for free these days+.

[@justtoolit6051]

Love the fact that you double down with facts and don't like to take anything back due to hurt feelings. Integrity at its finest, good work !

[@LUKE-vq5yr]

Here goes all the FRAGILE EGOs...🙄 🧠🧠🧠🧠🧠🧠🧠🧠🧠🧠 Whether you’re a MD DO DPM DC NP PA DDS DMD .... WE ALL CHOSE HEALTHCARE TO HELP PATIENTS IN TIMES OF THEIR NEEDS. Put your egos to the side because there will always be some one better than you and learn to work with one another or the sake of bettering humanity !!!

[@miguelbarrera4383]

Man, this video doesn't make me mad at all. It was super informative, in fact, you made me realize a lot thanks for the honesty. At the end of the day, nobody likes to hear the truth. You can't appeal to everyone that is life. All in all, I appreciate the quality content so keep em comin' Doc.

[@samiralsalek1363]

Unapologetic and straight to the point. Love it!

[@tyler4915]

Your talk at the end was incredibly refreshing and something we need a lot more in both our conversations and our culture.

[@jordancurl8074]

I would very interested in a detailed video about the residency match! I’m sure many medical students already know this stuff, but I have tons of questions and NO clue how it works. Not only would I be interested in learning about HOW it actually happens (with the algorithm and all), but I am even more interested in 1)how many programs to apply to 2) how many programs should be on your match list 3) do you apply by specialty or specific program? And if it’s specific program, could i apply to 1 radiation oncology residency, 3 internal medicine residencies, 1 general surgery, and 1 family medicine? And what is considered normal with respect to that. Sorry for such a long comment, but I think it could be a great video that pre-med’s would enjoy + learn a lot from! Great video today, btw!

[@MedSchoolInsiders]

Great idea

[@zacharyfischer5220]

I just so happened to pass by this and will share a current applicants perspective. You pick the specialty then apply to programs in that specialty. You can apply to multiple specialties but people usually do only one plus maybe a second for backup (If you broaden too much they maybe less interested in you over someone who wants only that field so it can hurt your chances). Number of program varies between applicants due to strength of application or specialty chosen so cant really give you a set number (but it cost money and the price increases the more places you apply to). As for match list, you rank places you interviewed at. The line people try to reach to be in good shape is around 10+ programs but people have matched with less. You'll come to learn more as you get to that point but good luck in the meantime!

[@oak3785]

I think you should make a video explaining what the matching process is and how the matching process actually works because, it seems that lots of people in the comment section don't quite fully understand it, me included, which makes the argument regarding the matching rates and possibilities harder to grasp/understand! It's why some people are asking why not do Caribbean if you just want to be a family doctor in the end and aren't interested in competitive residencies.

[@Leanne_is_not_okay]

“I went to school in the Caribbean I don’t speak Caribbesian” -Dave Franco, Scrubs. Only reason I watched this video.

[@lucasdavison3272]

My man, you’ve gotta write a book on your journey as a pre-med and medical student. Guaranteed best seller...especially if you use similar language to this video😂😂😂

[@MedSchoolInsiders]

😂

[@AaronTrillo]

I was extremely "lucky" to get into an MD school despite some pretty low stats compared to what is presented here. I was a weaker applicant by stats but strong by EC's and Personal Statement. Thank you Dr. Jubbal.

[@MedSchoolInsiders]

Awesome! Good luck

[@joker123344]

If it’s not much, would you mind telling a 3rd yr pre med your stats :)

[@Nora_Malloy]

@@joker123344 check out Aaron's channel, he revealed all in a pretty recent vid

[@Pegasus257]

Good video. I’ve been accepted to 3 DO schools and been waitlisted to 2 MD schools so far. I’m out of state for all these schools and I think that’s been my biggest hurdle to overcome. I did well on the MCAT and my gpa was good too-I think you nailed it with a being a good “holistic” doctor doesn’t mean you’re md or do or whatever. It just means you’re a good doctor. On to MD vs DO video now.

[@wakittalesgooo3045]

Can you do a video about changing the USMLE from scored to pass/fail? And the impacts that would have on MD, DO and carribean students? Thanks!

[@JH-py5vx]

I appreciate your honesty so much!!! I have asked so many people for advice on this, all of them saying there’s no difference even though I felt deep down this must not be true. I’d rather hear an ugly truth any day over sugar coated information. Thank you so much.

[@MedSchoolInsiders]

Welcome to 2019 when everyone wants to be a candy ass. I’ll always keep it real :)

[@Jv4735]

Curious your thoughts on the Residency Physician Shortage Act of 2019 (once it's finally passed) and the impact it would have on match rate percentage.

[@savagemedic30]

Joshua Vail me too 🥶

[@MedSchoolInsiders]

Great question. Maybe the topic of a future video 🙃

[@greysongan3410]

YES!!!

[@aurorarising1945]

Yessss i want a video on thisss

[@JM-gy1ev]

maybe they will make it so us-md/dos are guaranteed a residency instead of the shitshow the match is with foreigners applying by the boatloads clogging the system.

[@sonaljoshi1385]

Lol "Dog's friend's owner's sister..." Thanks for your honest and informative videos, Kevin. They're exactly what I need!

[@bruceylee8670]

Finally.. a voice based on stats and facts.There are too many DOs doing a disservice to pre-meds by stating DO offers the same opportunities as MD

[@Pharm213]

I find it ironic studying for the P/S section about disparities, biases, and stigmas, yet applying to medicine and even once you are in the field (DO, MD, or Caribbean MD) feels like one big disparity in itself. It's sad that not everyone is treated equally but like you said, it's just reality. Dont shoot the messenger. I personally have my eyes set on D.O but who knows, maybe i'll apply a few M.D just incase.

[@MedSchoolInsiders]

Biases are fundamental to human nature. There’s good and bad that comes with that

[@AmericanWarrior6]

I felt the same way. There's a stratification that occurs where students who are of lower SES do more poorly in college, thus having a harder time getting into MD schools. So they turn to DO or Caribbean MD. The bias just perpetuates exactly what we're being told to be aware of and fight against.

[@naval3066]

Remember kids: MSI wants you to invest in their tutoring Which is superb, you should do it.

[@ingridcely4642]

Thank you for your straightforwardness about this topic. I appreciate and support your honesty and it’s unfortunate that actual facts offend and even outrage others. As a premed, I would rather know where I truly stand with my academic history and make a sound decision to improve my stats or pursue an alternative such as DO or Caribbean. Personally, knowing the different medical school options just motivates me further to improve my stats to become MD competitive. So thanks!

[@MedSchoolInsiders]

Love your mindset

[@trientspires6424]

Second-year DO student. I watched both videos and I think your spot on. Great students do great things! Speaking of your great aunt's second cousin..... that's not me..... but we do have a pharmacist and NP in my class. I honestly believe any US medical student has the capability to be a great doctor.

[@ruslansaidov2000]

I'm not a premed, and what I don't understand is this..there is expected to be a 100 thousand physician shortage by 2030 in the US, and the competition to get into medical school is always increasing; so many aspiring physicians! High competition to get into medical school, followed by a high rate of decreasing number of physicians.. Am I missing something, what's going on...Dr. J what's your answer?

[@MedSchoolInsiders]

Check our my video on why is medical school so competitive

[@dr.g.k.chilupe9479]

I was a loud and outspoken critic of you from the M.D. vs D.O. video for the problematic wording. But this video is fair and I appreciate that as a 4th year D.O. student. Thank you! Pre-meds the D.O. overall score difference was an average. The GPA of my class is just as high as you'll find with other M.D. programs in Ohio, it's also not easy to get in. Do your research on individual schools! Don't be afraid to apply to both as I did! :) choosing D.O. route after the fact

[@sabrinachen298]

To whoever is watching this video now: the residency merger was great for DO’s, in 2022 DO’s had a match rate of 91.3% vs MD of 92.9%. Don’t let this video discourage you from pursuing a DO degree! If you’re worried about prestige- president Biden’s White House physician is a DO

[@waytogo7948]

Thank you. I just got accepted into an DO program after many years of not having a chance at all due to financial and immigration issue.

[@leanniezuniga5820]

Can you please do a P.A vs M.D video 🥺

[@goosedom]

Yesss

[@rodrellgreen167]

Why? 🤦‍♂️

[@goosedom]

@@rodrellgreen167 it'd be interesting to here his perspective on the differances and what role they play with physicians

[@oreman011]

One is a doctor the other is not. Hard to make a whole video on that

[@goosedom]

@@oreman011 okay poop tard

[@iEhabz]

can you talk about M.D, D.O, and Caribbean schools for international students who want to study medicine in the U.S

[@rovsdfghnjhgtfcv]

I am also curious

[@luisespinoza9277]

or also US students who want to study abroad for that matter

[@agendi3160]

I did that! I went to medical school in another country then immigrated to the US and went to DO school here and my friend who went to the same medical school with me oversees went to US MD school :)

[@syedfawaz1650]

A Gendi you mean you did your MD twice?

[@マルケシア]

yes please

[@QuynhNgo-so7sl]

Thank you for saying it. Many people can not accept the fact of life for what it is. I love all your videos because you deal with stats versus emotion. Appreciate it a great deal.

[@Happypappytappy]

still gotta be a stud at an MD school to get into some crazy competitive speciality. And it just so happens that being a stud in your DO program will get you into those doors as well.

[@coolabrar10]

There are many options to pursue a career in Medicine. Thanks for the informative video Dr. Jubbal!

[@medgirlstudyhourmusic]

Thank you for this informative video!! As a premed student deciding which path to take this has really helped me out.

[@ToofanStorm737]

Woah an honest video regarding this topic. Its very refreshing to see. Hopefully this video will help lots of student make the right choice.

[@Beck-Stein]

Stigma of being a do, dds, Caribbean md, or np will never die. There will always be a hierarchy even among specialty.

[@thomasstrasser2882]

Disclaimer: I am a DO student. Everything here is accurate, if you want to maximize your chances for residencies, go US MD (if you can). With that said, I think the point made about how going to the Caribbean would eliminate the DO stigma (which is true) doesn't speak specifically to the stigma of being a foreign grad. Matching as a US DO is (as it was said in the video) much easier than as a Caribbean grad, I could go onto argue why its better not to go to the Caribbean at all, but thats another topic. In my experience speaking with and working with practicing DO's, the stigma is not something that really follows you beyond residency/fellowship (from my experience / what I have seen). Yes, sometimes you will have to explain to patients what a DO is, but this seems to be rare (in my experience) once you are a practicing physician. The stigma against Caribbean students is bad, just look at top residency programs, you are more likely to find a DO there vs a Caribbean grad, and this doesn't just apply to top programs, but entire specialties. Please do your research before even considering going to the Caribbean, it does work out for some people, but at some/many schools down there, their is up to a 50% chance you won't graduate, and on top of that a 50% chance you won't match and will be stuck with hundreds of thousands of dollars in debt (Caribbean school are expensive).

[@EJF0085]

The degree you choose impacts you even less than you think. I'm a DO, my sister is a DO, and she's an oncologic orthopedic surgeon who did an osteopathic residency, and I'm an AP/CP and cytopathology board certified pathologist that trained at Memorial Sloan Kettering Cancer Center. This type of success is common from my particular school. When I graduated my school had a 98% match without the supplemental match, and many of us went into competitive fields. Look at the schools individually and you'll do better then just lumping all osteopathic schools together. Remember, we've had an explosion of new and easy to get into osteopathic schools recently. Also I didn't apply to allopathic, I only applied to osteopathic schools because I liked the approach and the education in OMM. I think preference matters more in what you should choose than the perceived cons of going DO, because if you're going to succeed in an MD school, you'll succeed at a DO one too.

[@Soulfi1]

Same thing with researching/picking a DO school, if you’re NOT American do NOT consider this option! Osteopathic schools are simply NOT recognized outside the States (maybe now in some parts of Canada) but globally no! Also going to a DO school would present many challenges for non-US DO grads looking to complete residency in the US as many programs simply do NOT sponsor visas. The Caribbean option is a better route for non-US citizens who want to work in their respective countries after.

[@Akula114]

Truth tellers always reap hate from the uninformed. As long as you BP is OK, take what the haters say with a grain of salt. This is a fair and balanced view of the MD/DO preconceptions. I am reminded of why I searched long and hard to find a DO for my GP. I don't mean that as a dig, it's just what I wanted for my family doctor. You are a treasure. While I hope I never need your services, I can't think of anyone I'd rather have if I did.

[@Zengo38]

Great video, however it fails again to include Puerto Rico (a caribbean US Teritorry) medical schools that give the same opportunities and accreditation as the schools in the mainland. Also the cost of studying is lower here (well at least as low as med school can be), especially if you are a resident of the island.

[@marind10]

to be honest I work in a hospital , which is the biggest health provider in NJ and level 1 trauma center and almost every resident here is from a Caribbean medical school.

[@thomasdamico3120]

Nice video. I'm a DO (hospitalist) with 20 years experience. Not to split hairs, but in NY the "DO stigma" you refer to is not significant (my subjective experience). I absolutely would NOT dissuade anyone from applying DO if (like you stated) want to be a rank-and-file primary care physician. If you are more ambitious, well I still don't think it is a factor until you start eyeing those glamour specialties or elite academic posts. I feel I've earned the right to pass along some advice. Take the following for what its worth... At 48 years old and with the humblest of medical pedigree I'm not to far away from financial independence (e.g. I go to work because I want to, not because I need to). Being financially mature matters more then an MD from the most prestigious US medical schools. I have no student debt, credit card debt, car debt and own my house. I pay myself 80-90K per year and have invested the rest for a decade. THAT is what matters at the end of the day...your net worth and financial independence. NOT MD v DO v Caribbean school. But to reach that conclusion only comes with years of maturity and self discipline. I'm fortunate for coming to this realization sooner then later. It's made all the difference! :)

[@elizabethcortezgarcia3354]

I’m entering into my first year of college. I’m going to start my journey at UCI and I love that these videos help me through it. Can’t wait to go to med school!

[@MedSchoolInsiders]

Good luck!

[@elizabethcortezgarcia3354]

Med School Insiders thank you!!

[@pg8982]

I'm about to graduate from a DO program and just matched into a competitive speciality. Let me start off by saying that the curriculum in DO schools is the exact same as the curriculum in MD schools, except DOs have more stuff they have to learn (OMM) which likely cuts down slightly on clinical lab experience relative to the MD curriculum (but this is, at most, a minor curricular difference). At my school, we had a number of MD professors, and at my brother's (well known) MD school he had a number of DO professors. The majority of DOs take USMLE in addition to COMLEX, although for many years now over 70% of residency programs have been fine with just COMLEX scores. I just took COMLEX and, again, matched into a very competitive field and will most likely be at an academic medical center affiliated with an MD school. The entire residency match process has just been unified, but for decades DOs have been completing residencies at MD institutions and programs. So just to be clear, the practical educational differences between MDs and DOs are nearly non-existent, and anyone who says there are major or meaningful differences is simply wrong. The vast majority of patients have no idea what the difference between an MD and DO degree is. In fact, most people in the general population wouldn't even be able to tell you what professional credentials the following degrees confer: DVM/VMD, DDS/DMD, OD, DPT, and even JD. If you walk into a room and say "Hello, I'm Dr.___" then to most people you are the doctor regardless of the letters after your name. And in many specialities you don't even wear a white coat with letters after your name (like in my future speciality). The belief that DOs overwhelmingly go into primary care fields is so utterly and absurdly outdated. To be clear, I am in no way denigrating primary care fields as they are absolutely vital components of our healthcare system. Significant percents of students from every graduating class of DO schools match into speciality fields every year. There are indeed historical and philosophical connections between DOs, primary care fields, and the more "holistic, view patients as a product of their environment and not as a singular CC or disease process," but this mindset in medicine has been taught by MD schools forever as well and is not unique to DO institutions. In any competitive work field that's populated by large numbers of egomaniacs, like medicine, there will of course be unfounded, unjustified prejudice that helps insecure figureheads maintain their sense of self importance, and this culture can trickle down the ranks at certain departments of certain institutions. So is there prejudice against DOs because their degree differs by one letter? Absolutely. But is this prejudice widespread nationally? No. It's usually limited to random departments at random medical institutions that are nearly always headed by old men (yeah, men) who've maintained some grudge against DOs for over 30 years and honestly just need to either retire or die. These are the doctors who you could imagine waking up from a 30 year sleep, seeing women walking around in white coats, and saying out loud: "women can be doctors now?! What about their tendency to hysteria and their inferior intellect?" 1. People need fucking doctors 2. Our healthcare system is broken 3. There's a shortage of all doctors, especially in impoverished regions. Thus, most patients (clients) don't give a fucking shit what letters are after your name as long as you can make them better. So in short, go for a US MD school b/c that is truly the "default" and most recognized path to becoming a doctor, but absolutely do not rule out nor discount DO schools, because for most doctors and patients the differences are meaningless. The two degrees are, under law, the exact same. An MD and a DO in the same field do the same exact work, and receive the same exact pay (at least if you're the same gender).

[@xplicitgoofy1015]

Hey thank you for this I have a question when residency did you match into exactly ? Plastic surgery ?

[@waytogo7948]

Thank you so much. I just got accepted into a DO program. I plan on taking the COMLEX and USMLE at the same time, so that I can match into Internal Medicine in a school that takes more MDs than DOs. I intend to move on to a fellowship in Oncology. I am happy I got into Medical School, and I can live my dream in this life. I do not care what letters and alphabets that will be stuck after my name.

[@savannah4439]

Dr Jubbal: “I’m here to present the cold hard facts!” Also Dr Jubbal: “that is an idiotic point of view!” Yeah, I agree that having an MD vs DO doesn’t dictate whether you treat patients holistically. But I have a feeling that people are upset not at the data, but at being called idiots because they believed in a misconception lol

[@tarasheets3561]

Can you make a video about volunteer, clinical, and research opportunities pre-med students have as well as what ECs are best for med school applications?

[@MedSchoolInsiders]

I have a video on extracurriculars. Check it out!

[@armandosolis3560]

All 3 get paid the same regardless of their title. In the end, patients really only care how good you are and can you take care of their problem. Can you earn their trust? I worked with 2 Neonatologist-1 from Pakistan and 1 from El Salvador-both FMG's-MD's. Who ran the Neonatal ICU? American Medical School Pediatricians or the Neonatologist? Many times they were consulted to Pedi ICU by their American trained Pedi ICU Docs as well. Pediatricians weren't even allowed in the Neonatal ICU. We had some pretty top dog Pediatricians in our hospital but the Neo's were the experts and had the extra medical residency training. SO who's higher? The US trained PEDI or the FMG with more specialized training? The experts would be the FMG Neo's. To be a Neo you have to be Board Certified in Pediatrics and Peri-Natal Medicine(Neonatology).Too many factors to look at than just what school you went to. Residency is just as important.I like your video but remember, there will always be someone bigger, faster smarter, stronger, meaner, quicker. Just be the best you can be!! Warm Regards!!

[@maniesh]

Feedback: The symbol that was used for the MD is the Caduceus, it is not the symbol of medicine. It is often confused with the rod of Asclepius (single snake, rod with no wings) which was historically used as the symbol of medicine. The symbol that was used for DOs in this video is used by all medical professionals.

[@dskim24]

I came here to see if anyone was going to point this out. I wonder why and how the people who made this decided to assign those symbols like that. I've seen the caduceus plenty in that incorrect medical, but I don't know any reason to put that with MD and the proper one with DO.

[@ZAZA-pv1pg]

Hey Dr. Kevin Jubbal. Great video! Would you consider making a video about career change post bacc routes? I’m almost done with my undergraduate in humanities and it’s too late to change majors or get all my pre-med in. but I’m very curious about going that route of career change post bacc. Your videos are very insightful and I would love to see one. Thanks for all the great content!

[@MedSchoolInsiders]

Good idea!

[@faiyazsaqifkhansummit792]

@@MedSchoolInsiders Can you make a video for non-resident imgs on Residency?

[@trevormorrison3441]

I just finished an SMP and have officially begun my OMS1 year. I’d be happy to answer any questions on the topic if you need anyone!

[@amerikansk8r]

Try to find one that has been around for a while and has data on previous cohorts such as MCAT scores, gpa, and schools they were accepted to. Medical schools begin to notice the caliber of the students that come from certain post-baccs. Check if they offer a committee letter and if they have a linkage agreement with a medical school. While the linkage may only offer you an interview, it’s nice to have especially if it’s with a school you’re really interested in.

[@christiancasteel5962]

Another aspect to consider that isn’t widely publicized is that the DO residency spots that were lost bc they couldn’t make acgme standards have largely be replaced by the AOA increasing residency class size of the programs that did make their merger. In in my schools sga and have met with the AOA president and he provided data that showed there are actually more raw residency spots in the former DO programs post merger due to class size increases.

[@grwaitemd]

I have been a physician for 42 years and attended a medical school in Mexico. My patients rarely ask where I went to medical school. They judge me on the patient doctor relationship and how I take care of them.

[@jjp4119]

Here's my two cents. I'm a neurologist in solo practice in S CA for the past 18 yrs. I do not remember the last time I was asked what a D.O. is. Most pts are well informed and I assume that they have already googled it if they didn't know already. It is true about the data presented here. But premed students should not fear that they are becoming a second class citizen by going into an Osteopathic school. Please realize that good clinicians are respected and seeked out regardless of what and where their degree came from. BTW, do you really want to take an advise from a gentleman who dropped out of residency? Plenty of other MD/DO residents who love what they do and are out there to make a difference. Sorry, but something to think about.

[@asianichole1099]

James Park do you permit students interested in DO to spend time shadowing you? Asking for myself

[@rayanrahmani9838]

he purposefully dropped out of residency to pursue his business, that doesn’t change how much he know. he wasn’t kicked out or anything

[@agoodspottorelax]

Puerto Rico is part of USA and the students have good matching rates. Remember we are in the Caribbean but we have the same rules as USA.

[@jamesdompor-tran8656]

D.O. here (trained at California academic ACGME programs). Great job. I agree with the pretty much the everything in the video, with one caveat. Regarding the DO stigma, especially when considering Caribbean MD vs DO, I don't think most people understand how much more difficult the Caribbean route is. From what my Caribbean grad colleagues that went to the big 4 there tell me, Caribbean med school students have to pass an in house pre-screening test before the school would even let you sign up for the USMLE. Also, in addition to the horrible attrition rate mentioned, it is not uncommon for students there to be held back a semester (or two) for failing a few classes or not passing that screening test (meaning more tuition $$$). Of the ones that do pass, they have to obtain considerably higher USMLE scores and apply to way more residency programs (sometimes 100+ programs for IM and FM, still only getting 10 interviews with above average USMLE scores!) to get consideration for comparable residency programs, even when compared to osteopathic med students. The FMG/IMG stigma is much, much, much stronger than DO stigma, and I would take some serious caution before even considering the Caribbean route (if at all). My Caribbean MD colleagues are fantastic (just like my US MD and DO colleagues), but they went through hell to get where they are and at considerable risk given the odds. So, when it comes to ease of matching/placing into residency, MD > DO >>> Caribbean. Once in residency and especially after training is complete, we're all colleagues, regardless of route.

[@thomas.02]

aunt --> dog --> goldfish.... "this is not my final form!!"

[@wyattmorris4755]

"cousin's gold fish twin's daughter" 😂😂 I'm dying man.

[@luisespinoza9277]

I love the no bullshit attitude in this video

[@blackheartgaming6121]

A lot of people will be sad to get chosen for a different specialty but what they don’t get is that they could all get more training early while knowing more stuff than usual so they may get to do their specialty later while knowing another specialty to help more people out

[@ThomasdeHoop]

Come again?

[@bruceylee8670]

Dr Jubbal.. true scientist. always sticking to the facts. great content

[@CarlosHernandez-qw8xd]

Got into MD school, but chose DO school. Scored better than most MDs on the USMLE…but it doesn’t matter, the stigma is REAL. If I had to chose again I would have accepted the MD admission; not because the education would have been better (again, I scored better than most MD students at 84th percentile) but because people don’t know what DOs are I’m tired of explaining it.

[@favourodubamowo2790]

me: I need to study... also me: clicks thumbnails on how to get into med schools and continues to procrastinate

[@agendi3160]

DO here and I 100% agree with every word you said. You said it wisely and fairly just stating facts :) Knowing all the info. that you said before applying to DO schools, I made my informed decision to apply because I didn't want to wast a year or two doing research/retake my MCAT. I had a GPA of 3.98 and MCAT score of 504. I wanted to start Med school right after undergrad and thought that I'll accept the disadvantage. Applying to residency now and with good USMLE score, I think I have a good shot at average to strong programs. Definitely there are some programs that don't take DOs no matter what, however to me and my specialty of choice I don't think it is a big deal. To others who want to go to super competitive specialties at competitive programs, they will have a big disadvantage as DOs. However, your PERSONAL efforts as a physician will make the difference after that. I know a lot of FMG who are among the top docs in the country !! Do your best and be a good doc. as an MD or a DO or a Carb grad. Patients want someone to take care of them and make them feel better and won't care much about your impressive USMLE or MCAT score.

[@xplicitgoofy1015]

Now a days most programs take DO applicants because 3 years later from your comment that’s all the gap is over and we are all happy remember that DO applicants and MD applicants are the same and there is no disadvantage if you want to apply to PLASTIC surgery residency which is 6 years not 8 then it is competitive for everyone one applicant doesn’t have an edge over the other if there is a strong DO applicant who is way stronger then an MD applicant unless the program director is an old fart then chances are they will take the DO applicant and same thing goes the opposite way. I hope you understand this don’t be discouraged because you are a DO

[@youreokay7888]

I especially love 12:38 to the end A universal message honestly applies to so many things

[@RianKashfi]

This video really cleared up a lot misconceptions. Thanks doc. Could you do a video about RN to MD?

[@akarshlal8132]

Can you please make a video about the process of applying to medical school in Europe and whether it’s worth it or not? Thank you!!

[@solimansalem7719]

Agreed, my uncle was telling me to apply to a FMS, get good grades, and come back for residency, as of now, I’m still focused on getting my MD.

[@akarshlal8132]

Soliman Salem Hey Soliman do you mind explaining what an FMS is?

[@solimansalem7719]

@@akarshlal8132 Foreign medical school, an FMG is a foreign medical graduate, someone who got his MD outside the US.

[@seanchang1741]

Totally agree that there is a difference between DO and MD. The higher caliber is the right description. There is a question that DO adcom likes to ask "why do you choose a DO school?" One can answer "I want to be a doctor but look at my GPA and MCAT, that is why I am here" which is the wrong answer, but it is the fact, another answer is " I like to concept of a holistic evaluation of a patient" that is the answer that DO adcom likes. In the video it explains very well. and remember it is a general description, yes, there is some exception.

[@itschelsey6340]

The way he spills the tea is impeccable !!

[@mitchelllyons8421]

Went to SGU, transferred to a US MD school, repeated my MS3 year, and matched into Plastic Surgery. Anything can be done remember these are averages of populations. Great discussion. If you want competitive things you have to be a competitive applicant, and a Carribean medical school will bring you down. Looking back I am exactly where I should be, but I have an extremely high price tag for this education, one that could have been cut in half if I had just waited.

[@musicenthusiast19]

Hello, although it’s been 3 years since your comment, could you provide some details about how to transfer into MD schools? (Is it possible for all of them, and is there a centralized website to see all the schools?) thank you!

[@abdulrahmanabakar7049]

I love the fact that you really everyone to take the right path, and thanks!!

[@mike112693]

Good video for the most part. I think it wouldve been nice to say you should only prioritize going to DO than MD if you have a real interest in OMM. Just going by statistics and saying everyones first priority should be MD is kind of ignorant when the main difference between the 2 is OMM.

[@mihirpanchal5754]

Getting into DO is damnnnn hard to get into as well.

[@TahirDahrouj]

Nobody: Dr. Jubbal: I went over this in a previous video

[@anthonymarquez6493]

I was thinking of sgu. Thanks for the info I think I will explore other options. I was a really bad student and f*d up my gpa I recently realized that I want to become a physician and have to work on fixing the mistakes I have made.

[@112doc]

This is a very honest video. I am an MD but I know good DO doctors. The first problem is schools want to admit people who will finish. Secondly, they don’t want problems in the first two years which are predominantly sitting on your behind and studying. Most MD programs are affiliated with research institutions and universities, while DO programs are more community medicine based. Last, research universities are interested in attracting researchers and medical students are ripe for that interest. So, if you’re interested in research aim for an MD school. There are DO’s at MD medical schools but fewer as a proportion. Know your strengths.

[@Bbbbbbbbbnb]

I like how he goes out on the career advice blogger/influencer/guru guys

[@kachan1457]

Hey Dr. Jubbal, i got accepted into med school and i am starting in september. Could you please do a video about your experience with dissecting a corpse for the first time? The dissection of a human body creeps me out but also excites me at the same time. Your video would be very useful, thanks!

[@MedSchoolInsiders]

Cadavers are intimidating at first but you’ll be fine!

[@CYLiu13]

US MD >> US DO >>> Caribbean MD (Avoid Caribbean if possible; more than half of my classmates kicked/failed out) USMLE >> COMLEX (COMPLEX is a joke) I graduated from a Caribbean MD school and finished residency; 95% of my colleagues are DOs and their COMPLEX is a joke; ex easy and its only 1-day exam for COMPLEX Med School Insiders does give accurate information. Keep up the good work.

[@syedfawaz1650]

C which carribean school if i may know?

[@CYLiu13]

@@syedfawaz1650 It was Sint Eustatius; now it's called AUIS; not big 3 or 4. Avoid Caribbean at all cost. I think it was 2015, the year when they are pumping more US Med Students (MD+DO) out than residency spots available to match. The year I matched 2014 was the the last year.

[@hconf]

I really, really appreciate you bringing me the facts. I am so new to this topic, but NEED the truth in order to make the right choices for myself. I really appreciate what you do.

[@jangodarkblade3360]

How your cousins gold fishes twins father went DO and matched plastics 😂😂😂. Facts are facts.

[@AmyStylinson]

I worked in one of the biggest EDs in the US and many of the EM docs and surgeons I had the privilege of working with were DOs. I just don’t think this “stigma” exists much off the internet.

[@maraudeljunior4139]

Could you make a video about international student ? Because I’m an international student Pre-Med and my advisor told me that’s going to be difficult to attend to a Medical school so could make a video about it ?

[@laurab.6638]

It would really be helpful!!

[@User-rj8gy]

Yesssss