Me 264 Amerikabomber - Germany's Strategic Bomber Against The USA

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The Messerschmitt Me 264 is popularly known as the Amerikabomber. Join me as I explore the history of this machine that was developed to allow Germany to strike the USA. I go into all the details, the history, purpose and the practical hurdles Germany would have had to overcome.
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Griehl Manfred and Joachim Dressel (1993) Deutsche Fernkampfflugzeuge der Luftwaffe. Do 19 - Fw 200 - He 274 - Ju 89 - Ju 290 - Me 264 u.a, Waffen Arsenal Band 139.
Lufttaktik, Kampfgeschwader
United States Air Force Statistical Digest World War II, Dec. 1945
Neitzel, Sönke (1995). Der Einsatz der deutschen Luftwaffe über dem Atlantik und der Nordsee, 1939-1945. Bernard & Graefe Verlag
Schmider, Klaus (2021). Hitler's Fatal Miscalculation: Why Germany Declared War on the United States. Cambridge University Press.
- Timecodes -
00:00 - Me 264 "Amerikabomber"
01:39 - What was the Me 264
02:15 - What Is The Problem With The Me 264
03:52 - Germany's Plan With The Me 264
06:35 -Was The Me 264 A Realistic Project?
08:32 - The Luftwaffle "What-If"
10:32 - War Thunder [Sponsored Segment]
11:42 - Operational Strength
14:56 - Basing Requirements
18:30 - Fuel Situation
21:08 - The Amerikabomber
- Audio -
Music and Sfx from Epidemic Sound

[@tsegulin]

I appreciated tht the Me-264 may well have been an impressive long range bomber, but on raids to the US East coast, I never understood how they intended to protect it. The Americans had radar and naval spotting vessels and any 'Amerikabomber' would have been met by a formidable interceptor force long before it crossed the coast, rendering these suicide missions. Another interesting documentary, thanks Chris.

[@grizwoldphantasia5005]

Plus they'd have to cross the country to get to the west coast, plenty of industry there.

[@anthonywalker4108]

Just think pearl harbour they had radar and interceptors. The first raid would most likely get though untouched then you would be right.

[@aapje]

@@anthonywalker4108 At Pearl Harbor they detected the planes, but since they didn't expect a Japanese attack, they assumed that it were American planes. That kind of surprise attack only works once.

[@mpetersen6]

​@@aapje They also knew a flight of B-17s would be inbound from California that morning.

[@kleinerprinz99]

Pearl Harbour the allies in the Phillipines spotted the Japanese planes and forwarded that information to the US. No radar needed. Thatswhy some of the US planes were already in the air at the right altitude afaik. PS: Like stated in the video the purpose was never raiding but dropping propaganda leaflets.

[@SkyhawkSteve]

always good to get a sober assessment of a project, while other "history" sources just try to sell the sensational aspects. Thanks for giving us facts instead of "what if" scenarios unconnected to actual data.

[@ronaldbyrne3320]

A great presentation of facts. Thank you.

[@charliedontsurf334]

You mean the History Channel’s scenarios aren’t well thought out? Glad we have good ones today on youtube.

[@skeletonwguitar4383]

I like how you put it as sober lol, because I cannot be sober to convince myself that flying thingngamadoodle can even be used in any capacity other than scraps or future converted airliner after the war

[@williamzk9083]

With all respect to Claus Schmeider and Bernhard while they dismiss the sensationalism and myths around this aircraft they go to far the other way in dismissing it as a minor effort. This adds as much opinion as false information it debunks in my view. I will use information from the following sources: 1 Frank Vann's biography of Willy Messerschmitt. This shows that the aircraft was to start out as a long range stripped down maritime reconnaissance aircraft that was to evolve into a powerful bomber as new powerful engines became available to get the huge fuel load airborne on a short enough runway and carry a substantial bomb load to East Coast America. 2 Manfred Griehls "Leftwaffe over Amerika" which details the countless proposals to attack the US Eastern Seaboard and has many interesting minutes of meating with Milch, Goering and various engineers from the Luftwaffe over seeing these projects. It certainly shows that Milch went out of his way to sideline the project in my view. His endless scoffing and sarcasm is very unprofessional. The Luftwaffe had an extensive target list (mainly aluminium, ball bearing an, optics and machine tools) 3 Fredrick Forstyth superbly illustrated "Messerschmitt Amerika bomber Project" which is full of te4chnical details and dates. -1 I don't believe seriously in a hearsay in what Claudius Dornier Letter to one of his project engineers that the Me 264 was only supposed to leaflet the USA. Leaf dropping propaganda on the USA may have been the initial objective but its clear that Vann biograthy of Messerschmitt that it was being designed as a fully capable bomber. If they wanted to this there was already the Me 263 Adolfine available which had flown already in 1941. It was a long range courier aircraft but at 390mph it was faster than the Mosquito in 1941 and didn't need to be armed. -2 The Me 264 problem was that to lift the fuel required a runway of enormous length was required. For the Me 264V1 with 1500hp Jumo 211P engines This was over 2500m but as engines developed the fuel and bomb load increased and the runway decreased. Engine Power available to the Me 264 was 1 Mid 1942 Jumo 211J 1450hp (Jumo 211P of 1500hp planed but replaced by Jumo 213 program) 2 BMW 801D2 about 1700hp mid to late 1942. BMW 801E about 1800hp in 1944. 3 Jumo 213A and DB603A early to mid 1944 1750hp. 4 Jumo 213A with increased boost 1900hp October 1944. 5 Jumo 213A with MW50 2100hp about November 1944 All of the above engines entered service and could use nitrous oxide, GM-1. The Below engines had two stage superchargers. 6 Jumo 213E1 of 2050hp Feb 1945. Ta 152H engine with two stage 3 speed inter-cooled supercharger. Capable of GM-1 and MW-50 on Ta 152H 7 DB603LA of 2250hp March 1945 of Ta 152C capable of MW50. Two stage supercharger. 8 DB603L and DB603H of 2400hp probably around May 1945 9 The BMW801TJ-1 of 1800hp used on the Ju 388L was also entering service in March 1945 and had a critical altitude of 40,000ft using its turbocharger. -Forsyth books shows that the Me 264H3 with DB603H engines of 2400hp range was 15000km with 2000kg bomb load and 13200km with 5000kg bomb load with 2050m takeoff and 1200 with RATO. -The Me 264/6m (also known as the Me 364) with these same engines was expected to carry 5 tons of bombs 18000km and 22000km unarmed. The Me 264/6m was a simple stretch with plugs before and aft wing and 6 engines with inner wing chord extended. -Manfred Griehls boobs shows that the Luftwaffe had successful in flight refueling experiments in 1943 between the Ju 290 and Ju 252 that the Chief Engineer (Luftwaffe) for the Me 264 described as highly successful. -Had the war gone better for Germany (No Stalingrad) and the Caucuses oil fields captured and held the Me 264 bomber forced probably could have been built up.

[@charliedontsurf334]

@@williamzk9083 The problem is the Russians torched the oil fields before the Germans got there. Don't get me wrong, the Me 264 is a great tool, but it really wasn't the right tool for Germany. I just roll my eyes are wacked out History Channel shows on planes like this showing New York getting nuked after about 10 cases of "if this had happened" all coming together. The Me 264 was no B-29.

[@Tigrisshark]

Chris is working on making wunderwaffle a scientific term- and I'm here for it.

[@grizwoldphantasia5005]

Pardon me for asking to explain a punchline, but beyond seeing "luftwaffle" as an interesting half-English half-German portmanteau, I don't know any German beyond ja,nein, and a few other words. Do "luftwaffle" and "wunderwaffle" have any clever puns as wholly German words?

[@pricelesshistory]

Does make for very tasty breakfast!@@grizwoldphantasia5005

[@c1ph3rpunk]

@@grizwoldphantasia5005only in Belgium, and usually early in the day.

[@Workerbee-zy5nx]

Was ist das Wunder wäffle? Was ist der Unterschied..​@@grizwoldphantasia5005

[@HauntedXXXPancake]

@@grizwoldphantasia5005 The German word for 'waffle' is 'Waffel' (pretty much same pronunciation). So you can make Luft-/Wunderwaffel "propper" German Words, but the joke is the same - It's derogatory.

[@CB-vt3mx]

what is ironic here (at least to me) is that the theater in which a long range heavy bomber could have been useful to Germany was not even considered. For example, a bomber capable of reaching the Volga in 1941 with a decent bomb load could have been used to strike the rail bridges on the Volga. How would it have helped Germany if the USSR was not able to get industrial plant moved to the east? Also, airfields out of reach of other Luftwaffe assets could have been attacked helping to keep the build up of the USSR's air force at bay. But nope, let's build a propaganda plane...this way of thinking was very typical for Germany--and thankfully so.

[@downix]

Much the same with the Me262. Fastest fighter built, and Hitler wanted to use it as a dive bomber.

[@kleinerprinz99]

Dunno about that. German Empire Luftwaffe heavily bombed British Airfield before and during Battle of Britain and didnt do much difference. Destroying bridges is only good idea however you can still makeshift bridges and Soviet rail system was set up for slow speed but long and many trains with wide tracks. Also found out that even tho German Industrial factories were heavily bombed from aerial photos they kept working in actual fact. Heaving long range bombers and having air superiority are two seperate things. One of them was the success for the Allies in the Western front and the Axis in the Eastern front, the other wasnt. 6000km round trip and 3000km round trip are two separate things as well. Allies used UK as staging ground and had drop tanks. So their long range bombers not really that long range.

[@MrLBPug]

@@downix Bomb carrying capability was already planned for the Me 262; most German fighters could carry a bomb load and be used as fighter-bombers. Most delays in the development of the Me 262 came from Hermann Göring, who felt that conventional aircraft could win the war and therefore diverted aviation engineering capacity away from the Me 262 project. Furthermore, strategic materials for the development of the engines were relatively scarce. That Hitler wanted to use it as a _Schnellbomber_ to harass the Allied forces after they had landed in France didn't help either, but wasn't the main reason that the Me 262 wasn't deployed in significant numbers earlier than it was.

[@stevepirie8130]

Another irony is they already had a means to reach out globally through their submarine force. They did far more damage over the years to the Allied war effort than a handful of these planes could ever have done.

[@T.efpunkt]

No matter what the nazis could have/'should' have done, they never had the economic power to beat the ussr, let alone the US. The only smart option would have been to not start the war at all.

[@grizwoldphantasia5005]

(Replacement comment without the URL) I found a great circle route calculator. Paris to New York is 5849 km, but the great circle route overflies Britain, a real drawback. Tenerife to New York is 5349 km, 8.5% shorter, which doesn't seem near enough to be worth the tremendous investment necessary. Tromso to New York is 5936 km, 1.5% longer, but already in German hands and with much more feasible logistics support. Tromso is the place to be.

[@johnjackson4322]

General Franco could not even be convinced to "sign on" to the Axis immediately after the fall of France. Post Stalingrad and Citadel the very though would be a bad joke. Great (and very sober) video.

[@chefchemist7343]

The B-29 was the most expensive project in WWII...there is absolutely no way Germany could have undertaken such a herculean task.

[@sc1338]

Well they could, but they couldn’t

[@DHBucsFan]

Looking at these failures of other air forces really puts some context and appreciation on what the allied heavy bombers like the B17, B24 and Lancaster

[@jackthorton10]

Really hammers home how such Aircraft no only flew but thrived

[@mensch1066]

I think that an underrated takeaway here might be that it is less surprising that Germany couldn't get a proper heavy bomber campaign going, but that Britain could, given the massive costs involved in terms of development, production, logistics and sustainment. Even with its empire (which was set up for mercantilist extraction of raw materials and cash crops - good luck immediately converting tea from Ceylon or jute from East Bengal into ships or planes), the British had a large navy, large colonial policing obligations, and a highly mechanized army. So fleets of Halifaxes, Stirlings, Manchesters and Lancasters seems an odd thing for the British to be able to specialize in as much as they did, given all the other areas demanding their attention.

[@zoompt-lm5xw]

Well said

[@memofromessex]

You're so wildly off with the wealth extraction side of Empire, the actual accountancy books show that Empire was a massive drain on Britain. This is what the latest research shows. What you have their is the Communist myth of Empire (which for me, as someone who has a keener interest in pre-modern history, lead into the hypothesis that the Roman Empire was extraction-based empire, it was not the Spanish Empire!) Essentialy, Britain used it's huge techological and naval advantage to expand using the money made by it's massively efficient industrialised core and energy extraction through its easily accessible energy dense black coal (previously using water-power, and we have the weather for that!) This meant those in the imperial centre had plenty of money to speculate, which thanks to the excellent British bookkeeping meant we can see how much money was wasted on wild schemes. Beyond that low-skilled and especially subsistence farming and transhumance does not pay enough for highly-skilled administrators and troops and boats. We can see in post-colonial period where much of the sub-saharan and Asian economy inside of Empire slumped - indeed the British Indian economy grew faster in the last 50 years, then in the 50 years after British withdrawal. Beyond that we have African economies that didn't reach the same size they had in the 1930s until lates in the 1980s. What actually paid for empire outside the centre was highly-skilled, highly educated, highly productive individuals (we can see that as a great example of literacy rates boosting an economy), so the Dominion states largely grew strongly following imperial withdrawal (indeed the Canadian economy outgrew the USA at points in the late 19th century because so many British - i.e. educated people - were moving there, whilst USA was drawing in less educated, fuctionally illiterate people slowed the economy. We can see to some degree post-Apartheid as example of what happens when a largely educated (white) minority abandon economy; or indeed Zimbabwe during the Mugabe era - we are now seeing attempts to draw the highly-skilled white farmers back. Please don't read this as some sort of alt-right argument, it just that illiterate people can barely sustain themselves - let alone pay taxes or work productively, but in an advanced economy they become a real draw - absolutely irrespective of the colour of their skin.

[@Ukraineaissance2014]

German air strategy was pretty much all geared towards supporting the army rather than strategic bombing in 1939 and they never caught up. The British brass had too much faith in strategic bombing, the germans had too little.

[@kleinerprinz99]

Well Britain did go bankrupt and had their own working class & their colonies and the working class of Germany and pay for it. Afaik most of proper Territorial army was guarding the homeland while the colonials did all the fighting and dying, too. And some are even proud of it doing their masters bidding.

[@Simon_Nonymous]

@@kleinerprinz99 not so much... but I am struggling to get the full sense of your first sentence.

[@frankbarnwell____]

What ifs? Boeing got another half billion to finish the B-29, and Consolidated the go-ahead on the B-32 . A bomb bay of what ifs. The leaflets might have been used to wrap fish for customers... Excellent Chris

[@Fang70]

Yes, assuming that the Me 264 could have been made operational at any level to carry out its original propaganda mission before December 7 1941, it would have most likely had the exact opposite of its desired effect.

[@Simon_Nonymous]

Or like leaflets dropped by the RAF in 1939/40 used for something a little more basic.

[@grizwoldphantasia5005]

I have to confess to a giggle in the beginning. I assumed it was Chris speaking, but slowly and with a strange accent, as if the playback speed was garbled. Then I wondered if he had a cold and was using some AI to read the script in some poor simulation of his voice. And then it turned out to be someone else, and the real Chris was perfectly fine! I love these little brain farts.

[@bikercuz69]

You're not alone- I very quickly checked my own phone settings!

[@jcorbett9620]

Me also. I went and checked the video playback speed to see if it was playing on 1/2 speed or something! Then I thought there might be an error in my browser, causing some error in playback. I was only when Chris started narrating, that I realised it was another narrator. lol

[@michaelinsc9724]

What an excellent analysis of the logistics behind this plane! Far, far too many ignore this aspect of history. Well done!

[@williamzk9083]

-The supposed fuel shortage assumes the Me 264 doesn't alter the course of the war. -The primary effect is to provide much better reconnaissance for the u-boats. There will be more intercepts of convoys by greater numbers of u-boats more understanding of the size and power of a convoy. The tonnage of allied shipping getting through will be less. The Me 264 is far less vulnerable than the Fw 200. The allies were still routing convoys without escort carriers in some northerly routes as they were out of range of German aircraft. That would come to and end. -The Luftwaffe would be able to attack the Russian Factories beyond the Urals and for instance effect T-34 production and steel production. -The German Army might be able to hold and capture Grozny and the oil of the Caspian. -Nuisance and Hit and Run raids would force the US to dedicated vast resources to its own defense. -Mining operations of the US coast and some harbors rivers would have an effect without to much risk to the bombers. -To conduct 500 bomber night raids against the US the Germans need to capture and hold caspian oil. They might just do that with a 4 engine bomber if it were available around the time of the Halifax.

[@jimdavis1576]

I think the Bergen airport that the germans were using in WW2 (Herdla) is a shorter distance great circle wise than anything in France. Was even chosen as a site for an airport because an HE111 landed there in an emergency.

[@martijn9568]

An issue with flying out of Bergen is the weather across the north Atlantic.

[@harveyhams1572]

Once again, you come up with some really interesting information. I really don't think Adolf understood that when the American industrial machine started to flex, he was going to be looking at numbers he couldn't comprehend.

[@GreenBlueWalkthrough]

To be fair to Mr. mustanche the US had entered the war as soon as he did... Just with resorces and not boot on the ground.

[@naamadossantossilva4736]

When you mentioned basing issues i thought of Kongo and Haruna shelling Henderson Field.That almost put the base out of comission,and that was on an airfield that mostly hosted fighters and naval bombers.

[@pat8988]

A lot was said about reaching New York with a useful bomb load, but nothing was said about the return trip. I don’t think that even a B-29 could make that round trip, could it?

[@grizwoldphantasia5005]

B-29s were about at their limit getting to Tokyo from Guam, which Google assures me is 1500 miles, 2400 km. The great circle routes I posted are 5800 km. The B-29 ferry range was 9000 km, so it couldn't even make the round trip with no payload.

[@nobodyherepal3292]

No. Not unless it has a reduced Bomb load *and* external fuel tanks. Which wasn’t available to the WW2 era B-29s

[@gotanon9659]

​@@nobodyherepal3292They Dont need external fuel tanks. They could probably convert one of their bombbay to carry a fuel tank

[@jesperlykkeberg7438]

"...but nothing was said about the return trip." Doolittle: Hold my bomb!

[@Orly90]

This was what I was thinking. Not just the aircraft, but the aircrew. That’s a long trip to make.

[@thethirdman225]

Great video, Chris. Sensible analysis always wins over hype in the realms of better understanding. It’s also worth wondering how these bombers would be protected over the Atlantic, surely a 20-odd hour mission. Germany never really had a strategic bomber force and 1940 was probably too late to start one. The Me-264 has always attracted attention, particularly from Americans but not always with enough scrutiny that has allowed for realistic interpretation.

[@Nik111333]

the most comparable aircraft to the Me-264, which is flown in numbers was probably the B-29, the American "Germany Bomber", the B-36 was finished after 1945. The development cost of the B-29 was twice the cost of the Manhattan Programm, Germany has simply not the resources to make such a project happen. As i was interested in such questions, back in the 90s, i remembering to be in lecture about the "deutsche Luftrüstung" and the conclusion was, after the dead of General Wever and the and the end of the "Uralbomberprojekt" and the change to the Bomber A (Ju-88) there was never again a chance for a heavy long range bombers like a Me-264, Ju-287, Ta-400, Ju-290/390 or some of the other late war projects. Germany was probably closer to build the A10 Rocket (a two staged A4/V2) than a aircraft like the B-29 in numbers.

[@williamzk9083]

The Me 264 had the ability to do the bombing mission with plenty of reserve, bomb load, armament and range from about February 1945. This marks when the 2250hp DB603LA engine entered service with the Ta 152C and the 2400hp DB603L which used C3 100 octane fuel was also fight testing. The bomber version of the DB603L was called the DB603H. With these engines the Me 264 needed 2050m of runway and 1200m with RATO. This was the real problem of the Me 264 was dubious, trhe Germans didn't think they could maintain a 2500m sealed runway from allied air attack thereby necessitating RATO each time. In flight refueling would also have worked, which the Germans had tested successfully in 1 43 with a Ju 290 and Ju 252. -Earlier version with Jumo 211 and BMW801 could do the mission but only if carrying light armament and 1-2 tons of bombs. -So the Germans could have done it if they persisted. If they captured the fuel at Grozny there would be plenty. -There was a 6 engine stretch version of the Me 264 called the Me 264/6m or Me 364 that could have done the job with eas.

[@TheCcponyboy]

A little too late. The Me264 would have made sense developed in 1938/9 but not in 1942/3. It may have been useful as a Ural bomber, hitting Soviet production with better range that Do117 and He111. But like the V1 & V2 projects for U boat launching all pipe dreams once the USA entered WW2. As always a thourghly reseashed video.

[@davidjernigan8161]

The only plane that had the range and bomb load that was built during the decade of the 1940s was the B-36 "peacemaker" and it was not available until after the war.

[@matthewhuszarik4173]

The reason the B-36 wasn’t ready for the war was the reason it was initially asked for. It was a back up plan if Great Britain was overrun. After the US got involved in the war that became highly unlikely so the B-36 was put on the back burner and the B-29 for use in the Pacific was focused on.

[@TheBattleMaster100]

I love your take on this aircraft. Thank you for separating the reality vs myth. It looked awesome for its day, but in every category the B29 far outclassed this machine.

[@Allan_aka_RocKITEman]

*Chris: **_"...or an Allied carrier task force going on one of their famous drive-bys."_* 🤭🤭🤭

[@TrickiVicBB71]

Great video, Chris or Bismarck. I remember watching you long ago when you still played War Thunder with The Mighty Jingles. Also, great job de-bunking the "What-if" scenarios.

[@michaelguerin56]

Hello Christoph. Thank you for a realistic examination of the myth. By the way, I caught the Me ‘262’ error just before 8:53 and again at 21:15😁!

[@MilitaryAviationHistory]

Thanks! Sadly it was bound to happen, easy to overhear that mistake when the brain automatically translates it to 264

[@michaelguerin56]

@@MilitaryAviationHistory Been there, done that. Lost count!

[@EngineeringWizard11]

The concept of the "Amerikabomber", more correctly the aura surrounding it, has made less sense to me the more I learned about WWII. It was often presented as this checkmate scenario where "OMG, Hitler could have bombed New York City with it!" But, as the US had quickly learned in the Pacific, the days of the uninterceptable strategic bomber were over. A few squadrons of even P-40 Warhawks vectored in by radar would have been completely sufficient to deal with the unsupported Amerikabomber. The Germans would never have been able to produce enough to make it worthwhile. Ironically, the Amerikabomber would have been much better suited employed against the Russians. Bombing those factories or allied support ports might have prolonged the war at the very least.

[@MrLBPug]

The Luftwaffe leadership was aware of that. The 'Ural Bomber' was therefore a concept in the late 1930s.

[@raseli4066]

I am yet again very thankfull for how you site your sources. Theres so many people who dont show where they got their information from. and its always feels like a breath of fresh learning to me

[@retepeyahaled2961]

Hi Chris, good video! You really got me thinking... and the more I think of it, the less odd the Amerika bomber looks to me. If I put myself in place of the German high command in late 1941, this bomber would make sense to me. The war for Germany looked all but won; the Russians had lost millions of men and Germany had conquered a very big part of European Russia. Germany had the entire military industry of Western Europe at it's disposal and an enormous part of the globe with it's raw materials. So they must have thought ahead, don't you think? Germany also had plans for an atomic bomb and at that point it must have looked as if Germany soon would have the resources to accelerate the pace of military production to an entirely new level. Then, when Japan attacked America, the Germans must have thought that America would be too occupied to make any move against Germany in the near future. So I believe that German high command must have believed that they were in total control and that an America bomber was a logical next step to persue. Now, what do you think of this train of thoughts? And... best wishes for the new year!

[@EddietheBastard]

Yes, the Azores would have been out of the question, my Grandfather flew in Sunderlands from there, so the chances of Portugal allowing Germany access were zero. The Canaries - again, your analysis is excellent Same goes for basing, personnel, and fuel. Fine video as usual. One wonders as to the scarce materials needed for manufacture too.

[@paultraynorbsc627]

Thanks for sharing Chris

[@PL-rf4hy]

Sehr gut gemacht! Thank you.

[@TR4Ajim]

The more plausible bomber “what -if” would have been a true 4 engine version of the He-177 being built at the outset, rather than that awful “paired engine” version that was built. This could have had a true impact to Soviet supply lines. BTW- do a review of the video as you refer to the 264 as the 262 a few times.👍

[@williamzk9083]

-The He 177B was a 4 engine version of the He 177A that flew with 4 x BMW801 engines. The aircraft was OK but it was established that the tail was not big enough to handle the extra power of the engines. A fairly minor issue. Rather than a modification of the already being produced He 177 into a He 177B This lead to the deeply modified He 277 which apart from twin tails had a new enlarged wing and cockpit. The wing of the He 277 derived from the He 177A7 wing which was enlarged over the He 177A5 and designed to handle either 2 DB613 engines (paired DB603) or 4 powerful seperate engines like the Jumo 213, DB603. Range of some versions was about 5700 miles so with 2 outward bound buddy in flight refueling could have made a round trip the East Coast USA. Germans had developed and tested in flight refueling on large aircraft in 1942/43. It was a hose drogue system. -Ernst Heinkel begged the RLM and Luftwaffe to allow him to make a 4 engine aircraft in 1940. Had his advise been followed the He 177B with 4 separate DB601,DB605 or Jumo 211 would have entered service around the same time as the Lancaster (Jan 1942). -The effect would have been to rapidly displace the Fw 200 and Ju 290 in the maritime reconnaissance role allowing these aircraft to join Luftwaffe transport squadrons. By November end of 1942 these were sorely need to supply both Rommel's Afrika Corps and Stalingrad. The He 111 would also be put out of production (or retained only in the transport role). -The dive bombing requirement was only rescinded in 1942 By that time the StuVi 5B shallow dive bombing sight and the Lotfe 7 computing bomb sight were available and were MORE accurate than dive bombing. -When Fw 200 attacked moving merchant ships from 15,000ft they achieved hits a remarkable 60% of the time for each bomb run (See Convoy Faith). (Bombsight like the Lotfe 7, SABS II and Norden were very accurate below 12,000ft. -So unless a convoy had an aircraft carrier (not all had this luxury) they could be severely damaged by He 177B. -Allies would need to deploy fighters further north in Britain. -More bombs would fall on Britain. -Russian Factories in the Urals would be effected by attacks probably significantly. -Production plans for He 177 100/month which would probably allow the Germans to keep 400-600 on the books and 300-450 operationally ready at any time. -I don't accept the argument regarding fuel. 4 engine aircraft carry more bombs for the same fuel load. -The He 177B would have easily converted to more powerful engines like the BMW 801 by 1943 and Jumo 213/DB603 by 1944.

[@fighterace316]

Great video Chris

[@bohuslavhumplik6744]

Great Episode!

[@SergeantFarmer]

Great Content! :))

[@jts0221]

Historical Geo-Politics are so fascinating. Great video, I have not seen much from this perspective.

[@ThrawnFett123]

I love "What If's" personally, but I view them as the fantasy they MUST be. This almost always results in pessimism. Retooling the entire Luftwaffe Fighter Fleet with ME262s sounds awesome... until you realize they couldn't fuel the ones they had and had to consistently limit their flights. Nothing changes but giving them the fighters 1 for 1.... and German sorties go down. Maybe more panzers are fueled when they remix the AVGAS. So you're either reimagining the entire war machine, or you're not doing anything. My personal "holy grail" I've never really found myself, is "what is something so easy to reproduce and effective, that it WOULD change a situation". The closest I can think of would be "what if the AK-47 was given to WW1 country". Its the sweet spot where it COULD be made easily, could give an insurmountable advantage, and doesnt require massive advances in its core technologies, just experience in using them that HAD to be reduced to the lowest common denominator

[@cannonfodder4376]

Despite all of Germany's mistakes and failures, their choice to forgo further development of the Me 264 and focus on other immediate and useful projects is most un-German of them. As always often though it's those who uncritically look at something and turn it into a Wunderwaffe, who then promote sensationalist takes and market that as "History".... So much myth to dispel. A most informed video on the topic Chris.

[@tomt373]

Along with the Me 264's other shortcomings, one major problem they would have to deal with the Republic P-47 Thunderbolt's eight 50 cal. guns as well as the February 1937 specification from the United States Army Air Corps (USAAC) that resulted in the famous P-38.

[@michaelwoolaver6113]

Nice painting.

[@sandgroper1970]

Your points on the Group Flying FW200 and HE177 operations against allied shipping, how they struggled obviously to maintain operational capabilities. Especially with the manpower demands, considering the losses of men, material etc, which would have already started the steady decline. move forward to 1944 / 1945, you had Luftwaffe and navy personnel assigned to adhoc army units for defence of Germany itself.

[@williamzk9083]

The Fw 200C was very effective in 1942 against allied convoys. In that year the Fw 200C had been equipped with the Lotfe 7 computing bomb sight which could accurately attack moving ships. In 1942 Three Fw 200C mad 5 attack runs on Convoy Faith from an altitude of 15,00ft while receiving AAA fire from escorting sloops, coverts and destroyers. . Out of the 5 Attack runs they stuck 3 ships eventually destroying them through fire. The two misses were against Royal Navy Warships which maneuvered out of the way of the bombs. -Fw 200C bombing from 12000-15000ft were deadly and immune to AAA, the only way to stop them was aircraft carriers. Had the He 177 been available by 1942 the war of the Atlantic would have been seriously effected. Earlier Fw 200 attacks in 1940 were from low altitude and eventually thwarted by AAA.

Very interesting Video an Plane. Thank you

[@Shaun_Jones]

Another fun one to look at is the Horton entry to the Amerikabomber program, an 8-jet-engine-powered flying wing. People love to fawn over this thing because of its supposed stealth capabilities, but what about those engines? Never mind how much fuel it would take to keep those eight Junkers turbojets running for a full trip to America and back, the 004s would have exceeded their time between overhauls before the aircraft even reached the East Coast, never mind the return trip.

[@angrybirder9983]

And they seriously thought they could fly that far with the notoriously fuel-hungry early jet engines, even if none of them quit mid-flight? LMAOOOO.

[@robertsolomielke5134]

This was fun-TY for the work. On the ' what if's", a U-boat launching V-1's at the US Eastern coast would have been far cheaper, easier, and likely quite successful, given what we know of U-boat operations. Supposing the German atomic program was achieved , the end of 'Amerika" easy to imagine. This scenario has never been looked at in depth, and a great alternative history.

[@urishima]

Man, I could go for some waffles right now...

[@mpetersen6]

If only Hitler was a failed chef. Instead of Wonderwaffe. We could have had Vundervaffles 😛

[@kleinerprinz99]

Now that book recommendation I take to heart as I saw another good video about importance of fuel quality citing that Calum, Douglas (2020) The Secret Horsepower Race: Western Fighter Engine Development By the way Mortons Book now have xmas sale with 20% off as well, however probably not combinable with your 10% off unfortunately :D

[@donaldduff-mccracken448]

Yes that is a great book!!

[@raymondyee2008]

You didn’t include the JU-390?

[@MilitaryAviationHistory]

Even a bigger pipe dream

[@alphakky]

The counter to the Me-264 became the B-36. The USAAF wanted an aircraft to reach Europe from North America when it looked like Britain would fall early in the war.

[@cherokee43v6]

There was another vid I saw recently that sums up the thought processes of the Germans pretty well. It was interviews with German POWs who were brought to the US for internment. They were shocked by just how BIG the US was. Dropping bombs on a single (or even multiple) east coast cities would have had a similar effect on the rest of the US as the Pearl Harbor raid had. Cold fury followed by a redoubling of production and training. First of proven interceptors like the P-38 and the newly on-line upgraded P-51s (with Merlins instead of Allisons). The airpower buildup in Great Britain would have slowed while the East Coast defenses were shored up. Some carriers intended for the Pacific would have found themselves on defensive patrols off the East Coast... and then Britain would have been swarmed by American airpower as an unsinkable aircraft carrier (as was the actual case).

[@MrLBPug]

Perhaps, yes, although it should have already been clear to the US military leadership that German industrial capacity was not set up to produce strategic bombers to sustain an air campaign against the Eastern Seaboard. They were well aware of the strategies employed by Germany, which wasn't based on strategic bombing but on supporting their ground forces (in the broadest sense of that term: hitting targets in rear areas was part of that as well) and eventually securing resources, which Germany was generally lacking in. Even with Japan they knew that it relied on delivering one knock-out blow to the US Navy, which only worked 'sort of' at Pearl Harbor. Japan didn't have the industrial capacity nor the domestic resources to sustain a protracted campaign of attrition either.

[@OverlordGrizzaka]

I like how you say "the real history" when the Amerika Bomber was JU390.

[@TysoniusRex]

Fascinating; I had not realized any were actually built! The logistics requirements appear to have been overwhelmingly intimidating, though. Still, it was an attractive design. Too bad the Germans never had the resources or will to take it from a prototype to a working, practical design. It could have been very useful as a reconnaissance aircraft over the North Atlantic, but then, the Luftwaffe barely be bothered to use the Condor for that.

[@pricelesshistory]

Those that were built was equipped for recon, but no (existing) records show it was used in those missions.

[@MilitaryAviationHistory]

I don't think that 'too bad' is the right wording here but regarding long-range reconnaissance - the Condor and He 177 were used for this but by 1943 when this started to get priority, the initiative in the Atlantic had largely turned against the sub war. Also, at those distances and area to cover, finding convoys was exceedingly difficult even with a large number of aircraft. Unless you could intercept and hone in on a radio transmission, it was more down to luck even along the 'usual' routes.

[@TysoniusRex]

Yeah, not the best wording on my part! I meant that it's unfortunate the plane was never fully developed; it's an interesting shape with intriguing capabilities (especially the fuel load and range...). I have to wonder what the plane might have been able to do with a couple more years development. But yes, probably for the best that the Germans were too preoccupied with other events to focus on successfully producing a long range bomber. @@MilitaryAviationHistory

[@johnking6252]

In some of my readings the long range bomber concept was usually if not always connected with the atomic bomb scenerio, making the idea somewhat more plausible. Just an observation. Thx. 👍

[@tt_ttflap]

Just a thought. If you ever get the chance, you should consider doing a cockpit video for the rafale. 😀

[@MyLateralThawts]

I was reminded of another heavy aircraft from Messerschmitt, this one a transport, the Me-323 Gigant. Its failure to supply the Afrika corps is well known, but I’m curious as to why it wasn’t used in the Stalingrad airlift? It coincidentally became operational the same month (November 1942) that the Sixth Army was encircled. There must have been discussions on using the aircraft and I’m curious as to why they didn’t use it. I can think of several reasons, including the need for additional fighter support to escort them (as happened in the failed Tunisian airlift), that they were considered too vulnerable to Soviet flak, that the airfields, especially the short runways, would not be able to accommodate such aircraft. What were the actual arguments?

[@williamzk9083]

The Stalingrad Airlift and the Airlift to Support the Afrika Korps occurred at the same time. The Luftwaffe was over stretched and it was one reason it failed both. The most effective transport the Luftwaffe had was the He 111 due to its fuel injected engines starting reliably whereas carburated radials on the Ju 52 needed to be warmed by heated air ducts. Preheating the engines on the Me 323 would be very difficult as it was hard enough on the Ju 52 3m. In addition the Soviet air-force was aggressively intercepting the German transports and the Me 323 was probably too vulnerable.

[@scifidude184]

Where did you get the footage for the photo reconnaissance from the German aircraft!!!!???? Sorry I like the more nuanced footage on technical aspects.

[@jamescurry6798]

At 8:40 you accidentally refer to the "Me-262" instead of the Me-264. Love the channel and your attention to detail. A stickler for detail myself, so thought I would bring up a little constructive feedback.

[@Mag_Aoidh]

Oh man, when you cut to the professor I thought to myself, that dude really sounds like Bismarck!

[@BleedingUranium]

On the plus side, it's a beautiful aircraft. :)

[@whya2ndaccount]

What is the point of "100 bomber" raids on the US when the RAF is doing "1000 bomber" raids on the Reich? I suspect the impact on US industrial production would have been minimal, even if the 100 bombers had the range to penetrate US airspace to US industrial centres, not all of which are on the shores of the Atlantic.

[@polarking888]

this is perfect timing ,i was just reading about this aircraft the other day 😂

[@odonovan]

8:40 - 262??? OOPS! I'm surprised there were a couple scenarios which were TOTALLY ignored. 1 - The bombing of England... If the Reich had ANY long range bomber after Dunkirk, they could have bomed the British factories which had been relocated as far as possible away from mainland Europe, where they were out of range of the Luftwaffe. The factories which produced the Hurricane and Spitfire could have been seriously damaged or destroyed, and the RAF could have been defeated. 2 - Dirty bombs... It would only take a few 264s to carry bombs loaded with radioactive material to the US, to bomb New York, Boston, and Washington, DC. They would only have to do it once, so the US would have no procedures in place to protect against it. Since it would be very easy for submarine crews to listen to American radio stations to get weather reports, the bombers would only have to drop a few bombs on the outskirts of each city, and let the wind blow the radioactive clouds over the cities, sickening or killing hundreds of thousands of citizens.

[@Narses_the_aremnian]

I need a video about Miltary hellicopters in korean war!

[@Terrados1337]

So the 264 used radial engines, right? I assume, these are BMW801s, aka the same engine the FW190 used. So a single one of these flying gas stations prevents four 190s from existing. That's some easy maths for me! Great Video!

[@mpetersen6]

They only look to be radials. Jumo inverted V-12s using a circular radiator.

[@Terrados1337]

@@mpetersen6 oh that's interesting! Any reason for the circular design? Thanks for the info nonetheless! Anyway, either 4 engineless 109s or 2 engineless medium bombers? I think my silly calculation still holds true :D

[@jbepsilon]

@@mpetersen6 At least per wikipedia it used BMW 801's. Now wikipedia can of course be wrong (shock and horror!)..

[@jbepsilon]

@@Terrados1337 Junkers was quite fond of the annular radiator design, it was widely used on e.g. Ju 88, and late in the war in the FW 190D. It has it's advantages, for instance it doesn't increase the frontal area of the engine, and engine + radiator is all in a compact package (less likely a random hit somewhere on the plane bursts a coolant pipe), and can be easily removed for service (so-called 'power egg' concept).

[@RetroGamesCollector]

Great video Chris. Nice to see a balanced and realistic view of a plane and its capabilities without the usual 'Nazi-superiority' hyperbole.

[@mikeross14]

If you want to see the Motor for this bomber it exists in L.A.Gene Autry's "Train town Museum!"In Griffith Park I saw it there inside the museum. It'S Gigantic I'm sure mostly Aluminum! saw it in 1985! This is the small museum !They have historical vehicles, a V-1 on a stand etc.... i

[@kryts27]

Hi, I know Chris jokes in his game promotional section about driving tanks etc, that why would you be driving around in a target for a warplane, and after all, his interesting and well researched channel is called; "Military Aviation History", not "History of Tank warfare". However, jokes aside, there is a reason why different arms are used in a battlefield space; it's called combined arms warfare. I've heard nonsense that tanks are obselete now because of drones carrying shoot-and-forget HEAT missiles. While these drones are a significant problem for tanks, there are countermeasures, there are almost always at least one. That is why a commander deploys combined arms tactics. Planes can dominate airspace and bomb or shoot at will, but they can't occupy ground.

[@Sarge714]

Flying out of Norway might solve the problem. But you still have to fly close to Iceland, who being occupied by the allies would have a problem with that. As pointed out, the 264 just didn't have the range for a round trip. Question, would Germany consider a flight to New York, drop the leaflets and then ditch the aircraft near a waiting U-Boat a couple hundred miles off the coast? Its the only way I can see to get the mission/PR Stunt done.

[@gotanon9659]

Ironically the Americans had the same idea except theirs actually flew and went into service in 1946

[@jesperlykkeberg7438]

"As pointed out, the 264 just didn't have the range for a round trip" Doolittle: Hold my bomb!

[@BillViall]

Scheiße Christop! At first I thought that voice was yours and you’d had stroke! So glad to be wrong! That would have put a dent in my Christmas! Now I can happily enjoy your promising video…

[@JohnSmith-jj2yd]

There is nothing fundamentally irrational or stupid in the idea of developing a heavy bomber broadly comparable to the B-29 or Avro Lincoln, and I suspect many of the same people labelling the project as dumb will also decry the failure of the Ural Bomber concept pre-war in the next breath. It is simply a combination of the facts on the ground whereby the strategic situation overtook the development process, combined with the fantasy sales pitch put forward by Willy Messerschmitt to win the contract (every other bidder pointed out how impossible his proposed specifications were, as well as those within the company - proposals from other companies were more realistic in range-payload forecasts). These factors, combined with the hindsight reality that it (the actual metal) never actually worked, are what leads to the overly negative commentary on the *concept*. We could just as easily apply similar logic to all manner of projects in WWII, the B-29 and the Manhattan Project being probably the two best examples. If neither cane to fruition we would tar and feather them in the same vein as other laughable projects like Maus or Ratte (or the Amerikabomber) too.

[@paulbeesley8283]

Have you ever heard of the "Uralbomber," concept? It was said to be a plan for a long-range aircraft, able to cover all of European Russia.

[@johnathanburke4872]

War thunder I can’t get away from war thunder it’s everywhere

[@tim71pos]

To put things into perspective: most people are familiar with the statistic that developing the atomic bomb took 4% of us gross domestic product Much less well-known is that developing and producing the b-29 took 6% of us gross domestic product. Germany couldn't even supply rations to its soldiers at Stalingrad let alone put a thousand four engine bombers across the Atlantic. And they didn't have anywhere close to enough fuel.

[@robertedwards1416]

Just watch slip to Me262 instead of Me264 and other than that an excellent presentation.

[@jacknapier9026]

The Horten HO 229 was also considered as an America bomber but never developed.

[@Ostwind1944_]

Interesting plane for possible video… the IAR-80/81. Romanian Domestically produced Fighter/ Jabo.

[@ernestcline2868]

In order for the Canaries to be a basing option in 1943, Franco would have had to join the Axis by 1942 at the latest, in which case it's plausible that Gibraltar (and Malta) would have fallen, affecting the North African campaign accordingly. But that also makes the plane a minor component of its own what-if.

[@leoarc1061]

"Hitler's fatal miscalculation" The fatal miscalculation was Barbarossa. Yes, the entry of the U.S. cut the war short by, at least, 18 months. But the fatal miscalculation had already been done earlier that summer, in 1941.

[@Narses_the_aremnian]

We need more korean war content!

[@michaelcoe9824]

The 264 falls into what I term as the "Loretta fallacy"... As in the Python screenplay. "I want to be called Loretta, want a baby etc." "Where is it going to gestate? In a box?" So, as you correctly point out, the "What ifs?" are a tad fantastical.❤

[@emanuelancuta3866]

As a possible what if scenario, perhaps the only one which would make sense would be the one in which Germany developed the nuclear bomb in late 1944 or .45. in that case some sort of America Bomber, not necessarily the me 264 or a submarine towed V2 would be tworth considering as a single bomber surprise delivery vehicle. The weight requirement could be met as by comparison the Hiroshima bomb had around 4.5 tons less then the expected bomb load of the 264

[@waynemathias8074]

I had thought Germany really could have used long-range heavy bombers early in WW2, not against the USA, but against the UK & USSR. But I hadn't considered how much those squadrons would have cost in personnel & resources compared to medium bombers. In any case, we're lucky Germany did not develop the atom bomb: the real "What If?" scenario.

[@JagerLange]

I honestly thought that intro was Christoph doing a voice :O

[@gj1234567899999]

Ironically the U.S. did create an actual bomber - Corvair B36 peacemaker which could fly from America to Europeans back. It used world war 2 tech piston engines. 384 of these monsters were built.

[@Aubury]

I do wonder, looking at the Dolittle raid on Tokyo, very very little damage materially, but the strategic military consequences ( Midway) enormous. What effect a German one way attack might have had on America ?

[@jean-francoislemieux5509]

the japaneses were caught with the same problem, but they had the jet stream and paper ballons

[@merafirewing6591]

But you got to admit, their proposed bomber design is the true definition of very big.

[@Kirktalon]

The most interesting thing to me is the way the front cockpit looks the same as it is on the American B-29 Superfortress which I'm happy to say my country developed during the war. I'm sorry to say that Hitler's delusions of grandeur and thinking he had it all set up in 1939 was a tragic thing.😢

[@Kumimono]

I wonder if the Germans ever considered, a Doolittle Raid. Get just few of these ready, fuel for one-way trip, and rest just bombs and leaflets, with minimal volunteer crew. No military value, but neither had Doolittle. Huge expenditure, for dubious propaganda value. But those guys were all about that propaganda....

[@davidbrennan660]

No carrier or culture of carrier use made this not likely.

[@jesperlykkeberg7438]

@@davidbrennan660 The B-25 used a carrier to close to 600 miles from Tokyo in order to drop a small single bomb. However, both German and Italian planes flew from Europe to Japanese occupied China non stop.

[@robertdshannon5155]

I believe Goering hated anything but 2 engined fighters. Also Goering worked against the 4 engine and no air craft carriers

[@lestergillis8171]

I was under the impression that the "Amerikabomber" was the JU390... What am I missing here?

[@legoeasycompany]

It's really crazy to hear that Germany loved the idea of the bomber really didn't know how to plan on anything more than the present. Between this and the Bomber B project it really makes you wonder where did all the priorities go, was their lack of direction allowing it to be split on way too many projects or did they put too many eggs in baskets like the ME 210?

[@MilitaryAviationHistory]

It was a strange mixture of both. I aim to make a video about this at some point.

[@legoeasycompany]

@@MilitaryAviationHistory Really now? That seems.... almost impressive of how much a screw up of that could be. But then again I forget this is the same air force that wanted the He-177 to be able to dive bomb so....

[@jbepsilon]

Then again, if the alternative to canceling these 'silly' R&D projects is that the involved personnel is sent as a grunts to the Eastern front, I'm sure all the involved engineers were highly motivated to present their projects as absolutely essential to the future success of the German war effort.

[@gotanon9659]

​@@jbepsilonEngineer in the US had propose some silly proposal the same as german engineer except the US had a board that directed R&D effort in useful projects

[@julianmhall]

I think the problem with the me-264 is two-fold. WRT aircraft Hitler and Goering seemed to prefer numbers to size, hence nothing over two engines - except the Condor - was approved. Secondly, the 8000 km range. That's 5000 miles. There /and/ back, so roughly half the required range, and as Christoph alluded to, that's with a reduced payload. Incidentally that kills all Luftwaffle stone dead before you start. The me-264 couldn't reach America in /any/ numbers. That's not even mentioning that the Luftwaffe was a /tactical/ force and had no proper means to employ a /strategic/ weapon. Probably because all conflicts were envisaged as being confined to continental Europe in direct support of the army. Britain being an island knew that the air force would almost always be operating over foreign soil / in enemy airspace. On the subject of manpower in the Luftwaffle scenario, what about crew? Surely a four engined bomber would require a bigger crew, so the 90 aircraft would require many more aircrew than 90 twin engined bombers.

[@frankus54]

In the days before aerial refueling, this project was a dream. A second model with a tanker capability may have made it possible, all be it a suicide mission.

[@parkebridgeman7223]

Even if the Germans had air superiority all the way to the US, the US could just move their wartime industrial sites more West. The Russians did the same as they moved East and that worked out for them.

[@alexscott9809]

On one side a German nuclear weapons programme, which was secret and highly compartmentalised within Germany but known to the US and the Allies. On the other a bomber that could deliver it. Couldn't really tell everyone why you were making it?

[@Caseytify]

The first allied atomic bombs weight 10,000 pounds. The 264 could carry that weight, but at the cost of severely limiting range to the point where a trans-oceanic attack was impossible.

[@jesperlykkeberg7438]

What a load of crackpot nonsense. There was never any such German nuclear weapons program. The Germans always knew the chain reaction theory was mumbo jumbo.

[@mikepotter5718]

Think about the battle of LA. Imagine how they would have reacted to a 100 plane raid on Monowi,Neb. :)

[@jackthorton10]

AA guns with Extreme Predjudice

[@calvinmasters6159]

For comparison, one could consider the Doolittle raid on Japan. The damage inflicted was relatively minor, but the raid was a PR stunt, aimed at buoying the low morale of US citizenry.

[@josephgallacher3729]

Did Germans ever consider Air to Air refuelling? I have read after German Surrender that RAF intended to send 800 Lancaster Bombers to Pacific to bomb Japan , obviously A Bomb halted that, but 250 of the 800 Lancasters were to be used as Air to Air Refuelers as distances were so large and Lancaster designed to bomb Berlin. The RAF had experimented with Air to Air refuelling so presumably would the Germans.

[@drudgenemo7030]

And it's not like the bomber would be operating with impunity above American. Training flights on the Eastern seaboard were routine and the Americans had a pretty good aircraft for bomber intercept in the P-38 which was being deprioritized over Europe in 1943. And there is ample documentation of how vulnerable unescorted bombers are.

[@nobodyherepal3292]

And that’s assuming the navy’s Wild cats/hellcats don’t intercept them first over the Atlantic. Because US carriers would definitely see Luftwaffe formations on radar from miles away.

[@Dewydidit]

These might have been effective if used against Britain or Russia, but they were never a threat to the U.S.

[@jcorbett9620]

I'm not sure Britain would have suffered that much. For a start, the defences were much improved by 1943, the radar was more advanced and the fighter defences were all cannon armed, instead of the 0.303 MG days of the BoB. Plus there were the US fighter squadrons present as well. I think the Me264 flights would have had a tough time of it and with only 100? bombers would have been lucky not to have been annhilated in a very short period of time. Even the US with all it's production might, had cause to think hard when a single raid lost 60 of the participating bombers (one of the many on the Schweinfurt Ball Bearing factories) on 14 October 1943.

[@Dewydidit]

@@jcorbett9620 yeah, without a doubt they would have struggled over Britain, but their range would have been useful in the USSR when Stalin was relocating his factories. The whole thought experiment (in my opinion) assumed they would have numbers like the US and Britain had performing bomber flights over Europe. When you start injecting FACTS the whole premise collapses. Amazing that the tech and discipline Germany showed in so many departments falls flat on a 4 engine bomber. They could build a Bismarck but not a B-17. That they could out tank and tank crew the entire world for 4 years, but couldn't get a bomber wing together.

[@rhpuchner]

well most likely the plan was more to concentrate on the america rocket A9/A10 which was in test stage at near end of war. The development of the uranium bomb was also completed but they had no detonator for the A9/A10 rocket which was still in development. thus the plan was to drop them by parachute but not with the A9/A10. So the last resort of plan was to develop a new bomber and many concept exists including the horten and saenger concept. finally time ran out and only a few A9/A10 were produced still waiting today in hidden bunkers (revealed by a short test flight movie and ground radar verifications a few month ago). The detonator was never completed. the uranium bomb was later droped over hiroshima as it was catched at end of war in a submarine and with a silent contract between US military and SS leaders. That was the reason US military was not heading towards berlin and instead infiltrated silent bunkers in ordrop. but that is another story revealed long after war.

[@marksmith8928]

It is interesting that this sort of aircraft is a very good counter to the U.S.S.R. moving production facilities east while being a good variation of the Dolittle raid on Tokyo that caused the Japanese to keep a large amount of military men and material at home in addition to causing the U.S. and Canada to expend quite a bit of resources further protecting shipping crossing the Atlantic which, at the time, it wasn't known how effective high level bombing would be. Though likely just adding to the length of the war, even by as little as a few months, it is worth studying.

[@jesperlykkeberg7438]

DOOLITTLE´s raid. Lieutenant Colonel James Harold Doolittle Dr. Dolittle had nothing to do with it.

[@marksmith8928]

@@jesperlykkeberg7438 You knew what I meant, didn't you? Take a hike with that crap. DOlittle DOlittle DOlittle. 😂