Rhythm of War Spoiler Review

[@brianreck5971]

I’ll admit...when moash showed up...I’m glad Navani speaks faster than Elhokar lol

[@AmadinOgbewe]

Lmfao same!

[@ThanatoselNyx]

I know you are joking but the fact that she made her own light is what saved her. And the freezing effects of Anti-Voidlight.

[@MasacoteSenpai]

_Journey before destination, you bastard_

[@goodisgood153]

lmao yeah i didn't notice the parallel between Navani's swearing and her son's almost swearing

[@valecastrejon6571]

PLS IM SCREAMING 💀💀💀💀

[@Melancholy_Scholar]

I know I needed Eshonai's last flashback. I cried a lot.

[@MissMokate]

gods yes. she was my favourite and I was very happy we got to see those bits with her in this book, and had a closure.

[@henrywayne5724]

I was so happy she got closure. By far, my favorite flashback of the entire series,

[@Pi_Kappa22]

Me too. I was disappointed in oathbringer when she basically had no ending, she just fell into a chasm and died. So i was very glad when brandon gave her a real send off, and it made me tear up a little.

[@DanielDangerous]

She got to see the world ;-;

[@AyazHB]

For me...when the Stormfather said he showed mercy once and it cut back to Eshonai, I was hoping against hope, even though I knew deep down that it couldn't be true, that he had saved Eshonai somehow. Still very happy for her and her closure. She got travel the world at last, albeit briefly.

[@Arezoo298195]

I think that this is the book where you understand journey before destination. Yes we all knew that Kal would swear his fourth ideal and save the day when needed. Yes we all knew that there was no way that Adolin was gonna end up forever imprisoned by the honour spren. The destination doesn’t matter though. It’s the journey that counts. It really is the how and not the what. Kal could’ve accepted his fourth ideal already at the end of Oathbringer. It could’ve happened that way but it didn’t. Sanderson took us back to the honour chasm moment except this time he jumped. He had to be saved, he didn’t do the saving in that moment. Adolin could’ve won by Shallan impersonating Kelek or like these trials usually goes in these stories by coming up with some last minute argument or something. But instead it wasn’t about him, he won by being there for his friend and lending his strength when it was needed. He didn’t get to be the hero that saves the day, Maya did. It’s in the details of their journeys that they grow. Journey before destination.

[@kobbyquayson]

You're good. I appreciate Sanderson's brilliance soo much more now

[@sciencystuff2106]

I like your perspective of all this 😀

[@YouJGSousa]

Wits story

[@tennesseedime407]

So accurate

[@notthis9586]

Yeah... been having trouble getting into stories where the destination is foregone but I still have to go through the same old narrative steps to get there. I Like Sanderson and the book but I might have had a better experience reading just the last 3rd, cutting out the listener viewpoints and reading a summery of the journey... though that's probably just out of fatigue for classic story telling

[@RubenRodriguez-co9jx]

"This is life, and I will not lie by saying every day will be sunshine. But there will be sunshine again, and that is a very different thing to say. That is truth. I promise you, Kaladin: You will be warm again.” ♥️♥️♥️

[@keyamazed1038]

Why you gotta make me cry again?

[@c0barsm]

My favorite chapter is one of the last ones. Eshonai rejects the Void Spren and becomes a Radiant. Then sees the entire world. So wonderful.

[@justagirl...]

That moment almost made me cry...

[@crimsondemon6668]

I teared up at that part, not gonna lie.

[@EE12345]

That made me like the Stormfather a lot more

[@pranjanarahangdale9629]

I was so glad to get more about the parshendi and the fused and seeing their different views on everything that is happening. I felt for them do much in this book. The ending scene with Eshonai really really got me!!

[@jessetuttle9287]

I really liked the chapter with Wit and Kaladin. It cheered me up.

[@DanielGreeneReviews]

Wait... this Sanderson guy writes books?

[@Nasser851000]

is this Greene Daniel speaking? XD

[@rahilmoodley2505]

Whaat? I did not know who this guy is

[@MrLGDUK]

Yes, he writes books, if by 'writes' you mean 'pen's with a magic quill that moves faster than thought'. Seriously, how does he write so fast??

[@CamReeds]

No, he blinks and they appear lol

[@MrLGDUK]

@@CamReeds Hahaha! I'd love to believe it! However, knowing how much work goes into writing a book, it would be doing Sanderson a disservice to understate the time, effort and skill that he brings to bear on each one of his creations 😁

[@alexsantos-hc4io]

Book 4 basically: Kaladin is fantasy John McClane Navani is just the coolest now Shallan does her Tyler Durden impression Dalinar is kinda there Adolin does Adolin things Moash still's the worst Jaxlim the only reason to not hate Venli Lift has a chicken Taravangian is scary

[@CamReeds]

Best summary ever! Lol

[@deepdave123]

There was always a comforting hand watching over us but then epilogue proved that we are fked...

[@DanielDangerous]

Red Chicken is the key to all this.

[@rockybalboa2835]

@@deepdave123 I was kind of lost with what happened to Wit, BUT BOI AM I SCARED!

[@Hoid1990]

Lift has a chicken 😂😂😂

[@Antonia-hp5gg]

I almost cried when Kaladin spoke his fourth ideal and he finally accepted that he can'r save everyone. Such a powerful moment for me.

[@BR_SH01]

Me too, 😢

[@areeshaj2585]

Same

[@Rucotaku]

I was in tears especially after just visiting Tien.

[@DanielSClouser]

The spy whodunit is a little more interesting than one may at first realize(at least in what it tells you--if you weren't interested in how it was told, then you weren't interested). Pattern spoke with Hoid through the seon, but Mraize was not simply listening in--that's not how seon communication works. The spy, however, was on Hoid's end. In the one Jasnah POV, Hoid talks about how there was a cremling disguised as a pen among his things. So there was a Sleepless spying on Hoid for the Ghostbloods, giving that information to Mraize. Unless, that is, Mraize himself is the Sleepless. We are repeatedly told how his severe scarring is at odds with his refined demeanor. Maybe those scars are actually seams.

[@riley8385]

Oh damn, that's true! I didn't realized that when I read it (I really should stop reading until I can barely stay awake, because of that I ended up missing a lot of details lol)

[@NoTLucas]

Damm Oo

[@Dalenthas]

Maya's testimony killed me. I'm crying just thinking about that scene.

[@Kk-fj5tn]

"You cannot have MY SACRIFICE"

[@YouJGSousa]

Men do cry, trust us!

[@evergreen035]

I like how adolin trial reinforces his own confidence issues, that he doesnt matter. I hope brandon takes that someplace cool.

[@YouJGSousa]

How doesn’t he matter? Adolin being Adolin is what saves the day, no one else had ever cared about deadeyes. It was adolin that brought back maya to the point she could speak

[@Edward-W]

Adolin saved the whole world by literally just being a good friend and caring about people and spren. Kaladin probably wouldn't be alive if it weren't for Adolin. Adolin connected with Maya and gave her strength and believed in her so she could speak up and stand up for herself (thus winning Honorspren to their side instead of joining Odium) Adolin is just so GOOD and it disappoints me that people take his insecurity at face value and believe that he is useless when he's anything but that

[@hrbacon]

By someplace cool, i'm afraid this means Taravodium's champion.

[@LinkingYellow]

I knew Adolin was gonna win the trial, but I was afraid it might be by Shallan after killing Kalak.

[@riley8385]

Yeah, he really baited us with that epigraph lmao.

[@KevinHorecka]

Yeah it wasn't the outcome in question, it was if they'd keep their best natures intact.

[@skylersimpson8736]

@@KevinHorecka journey before destination

[@ryanratchford2530]

Spoilers for Rythme of War & Mistborn Well of ascension Vin: one of my friends is a spy for the enemy!! Who could it be Tensoon:...idk, not me!...maybe go talk to them & try catch them out? Shallan: one of my friends is a spy for the enemy!! Who could it be? Pattern:...idk not me!...maybe go talk to them & try catch them out?

[@tedddenzel6769]

I'm sorry I know this is from 3 years ago but wtf?! Sigh...guess I'm going to reread all those books as I wait for Winds of Truth this year

[@Haxerous]

We couldn't have gotten Navani flashbacks though. If we did we would end up with two Bondsmith books back to back and would wreck the structure of the series as a whole. I think the problem is that we got too much Eshonai and Venli in the previous books and so their flashbacks didn't have a lot of new information and we already knew where the characters came from. I feel this is why we aren't getting much from Jasnah, Renarin etc in this book because we need to keep their mysteries unsolved or relatively untouched for the next arc.

[@ansalem12]

The biggest problem for me is that it made me want Eshonai to not be dead even more than I already did. Ever since she was confirmed dead, I was disappointed that Venli was gonna be the Willshaper and not Eshonai. Don't get me wrong, Venli has grown on me a *lot* since then, but so has Eshonai. But one thing I will say is no one has ever managed to make me care more about a character after they're already dead until RoW so that's pretty impressive.

[@Jay-kx4jf]

@@ansalem12 same, i loved eshonai a ton. so sad she left. the last chapter with her was so cathartic

[@Enndorii]

@@Jay-kx4jf I didn’t realize until I checked the wiki that Eshonai had bonded Timbre, but maybe I missed that detail while reading.

[@riley8385]

Fun fact, RoW was actually going to be the first time we saw Eshonai's POV, but Sanderson decided that we needed to know more about the Listeners in book 2 in a later draft.

[@ahri3887]

The ending of this book was ridiculous (in a good way). The Taravangian twist completely shocked me

[@ThanatoselNyx]

There is no real "good" way to ridicule something!

[@henriquelopesdonascimeto625]

There's many ways to ridiculous be good

[@EE12345]

The most crazy plot twist I've ever read. I never liked Odium as a villain and it all makes so much sense now that he was never intended as the main villain of the Cosmere. Taravangian on the other hand is the perfect villain as he's a foil to Dalinar and has the craftiness that Sazed and even Hoid are afraid of.

[@DoggyP00]

I didn't really feel like Kaladin saved the day though. Everybody that needed saving kinda already had their own arcs and became their own heroes. Kaladin was just a finishing touch

[@karissaomer2820]

"Boom, boom, boom. One thing after another and just...frickin Moash." This was my favorite line. It's so understated but perfectly sums up that part of the story.

[@vinceelreytolledo555]

I agree with you about Shallan. But the “I’m your veil, Shallan.”, moment with Veil was so great.

[@mariairigoyen2639]

I don't usually cry a lot, but I cried every time we got Kaladin's POVs. I /love/ how Brandon wrote Kaladin in this book and because I am so emotionally attached to Kaladin, I think Rhythm of War is my second favourite-though I also think Venli's flashbacks were not really necessary

[@JJJKKK445]

The bit about Kal and Adolin having predictable endings leading to lower emotional stakes kind of threw me off a bit as I was not expecting you to mention those as cons, I loved those parts probably the most because in a way the stakes where never about what actually goes on, but about how their characters grow and get there. One might say it was about the journey, not the destination (heh...) Loved your video even if I disagree on that.

[@havewissmart9602]

Predictable character arc endings were not the problem. The execution felt predictable. Kaladin can't stop getting depressed about people being killed earlier. I accept that I can't save everyone is a MUCH more monumental change for his character than him saying he will protect people he hates because Kal is empathetic. For example, in oathbringer Dalinar's ending was predictable. OF COURSE he won't join odium. Everyone knew that. But 'you won't have my pain' gave me emotions that I won't forget. Because it felt deserved. Old dalinar was a warmonger and then a depressed drunk. After memory loss, he fundamentally becomes a different person. He also picks up way of kings. It made sense that when he got his memories back, he did not give away his pain, because he changed over these 6 years I was feeling Lal's sadness as he jumped. I felt scared as syl was forgetting. My tension was high. Then he gets a vision of his magically resurrected brother( resurrected for the story, not physically), gets a pep talk that says nothing anyone hasn't said before, is able to say the fourth ideal(something that should be a lot harder), goes super Saiyan ( felt like that) and starts JOKING with his dad. Hello?? Teft just died. That pain doesn't vanish overnight. That's why I like dalinar saying you can't have my 'pain'. A lesser author would have written 'you won't have me'(predictable execution). It just didn't make sense to me, felt unearned and was predictably executed.

[@kingkylie9655]

i notice a lot of fanboys saying this here but i agree with her, its just predictable typical guy saves the day at the end of it, at least with a kids book like percy jackson the stakes feel so high that you dont even know if hes going to make it at the end unscathed.

[@imbored5951]

@@havewissmart9602 I disagree , yes people do say that Kal means a lot to them and that he is wroth sacrificing for but that isn't what he needed. Tien is someone who has always understood what Kal feels and is also what Kal sees as his greatest failure. To have the brother he loved so dearly tell him that he never failed means so much more to Kaladin. I'm not sure but if you have a problem with the connection thing Dalinar did, he's done this before with Nohadon and himself. Brandon has also earned enough trust from me to believe that it will be more throughly explored later.

[@mordirit8727]

@@havewissmart9602 in my opinion, Kaladin didn't change at all when he said the Fourth Ideal. He changed sometime before going to the Kholinar mission in book 3. He just needed to accept it in himself. Kaladin is the second most advanced Radiant in the world at the start of Book 4, being behind only Jasnah who has already finished her oaths. What's even more impressive in Kaladin's case, though: he _knows_ what the fourth ideal is. He has faced it at least since the end of Book 3. Now, why does that matter? Now, hear me out... It's kind of about Venli. Venli realized her second ideal all the way back at the scene where Mraize gives Lift to Raboniel. She realizes that she can't say the words yet, not before helping Lift... At least, that's what she _thinks..._ But eventually freeing Lift does nothing to allow her to say the ideal. Instead, she suddenly manages to say it when her mother is healed at the end. Now, think about this; the person bounded that Venli had to free before being able to say her ideal was her mother, who she didn't even have any inklings was still alive by the time she first tried and failed to swear the ideal. Her mother had lost herself inside her own mind and Venli had given up (or arguably never really tried at all) on saving her years ago. It seems to me that a radiant _can't_ swear an ideal with any past hangings on it. If Jaxlim had really been dead, would Venli's first attempt worked? Or would she only have been able to say the words after properly confronting her guilt and sadness over abandoning her mother? And, finally returning to Kaladin... Was he incapable of swearing the Fourth Ideal because he couldn't accept loss? Or was he incapable of swearing it because of _a past loss_ that he couldn't accept? In my opinion, Kaladin had been constantly growing more and more capable of accepting loss, ever since the day Tien died. As you said, Kaladin is empathetic. He is empathetic to absurd levels... We saw the way losing his first patient back when he was a kid demolished him. We saw the way losing Roshone's son broke him, then Tien... Honestly, even if Kaladin _says_ he never grew calluses, even if he _says_ every loss still tears him as much as the first one, that is simply not true. I think his problem with the Fourth Ideal was much, much more based on Tien's death than on the concept of any eventual future loss. To say the Fourth Ideal and mean it would be not only to say he accepted he would eventually lose more people, but it also meant he _accepted having loss Tien._ It would be to say, to admit to himself that his life hadn't ended with Tien's. And he could never have done that without what Dalinar did for him.

[@pranjanarahangdale9629]

@@mordirit8727 Thank you for this, though i do agree that the fourth ideal felt a little off but it did not fail to make me cry, also i kinda think that we all expect Kal to save the day at the end which i did not feel in this book which may be why it felt off. Kaladin's pov have always felt personal, like he's a character that has his own thing going on and it in no way feels connected to the story which i appreciate because Kal is my fav character in SA but i really wish BS can integrate his story more into the actual plot. Like the whole thing going with Taravangian, wit, dalinar, we again see that Kal is not gonna be crucial for it which i want him to be the same way he was in WOR. He always seems to be away from the more high stakes plot and with that i also don't want him to die but fight alongside dalinar, do something epic that is unexpected. Like Taravangian kept saying or even Rayse that Kaladin was an issue, a bigger issue and I somehow want that to integrated in the story because honestly his story almost never aligns with the plot.

[@shannonvermeulen9111]

I absolutely loved Navani’s chapters. Her and Rabonial’s discovery’s were so incredibly awesome pair that with their mutual respect and twisted comradery and I was up all night just power reading through those chapters instead of getting a good nights rest for the constant tests

[@ShirleyTimple]

Yeah, too bad she's responsible for Teft's death

[@bradenhazle4378]

Soooo we just gonna skip over Ishar being a monumental psychopath doing experiments on spren? Oh and being able to take another person's bonds at will? k....KAY

[@bzbzib]

Yeah he seem so OP. Didn't the Storm father basically say that he was responsible for burning the human planet( forgot the name sry )?

[@robertcoronado3085]

Yeah! I was like WTH!!! I feel like that scene is only hinting at something that will be a huge part in the upcoming books.

[@matthewdennis1739]

@@bzbzib Ashyn

[@jacksonfurlong3757]

I mean Sanderson pretty much skipped over it so...

[@vallano8970]

@@jacksonfurlong3757 No he didn't lmaooo he can't fit EVERYTHING into one book. It's going to be a significant plot point in book 5 for sure

[@kguentherart]

For me, the payoff in Adolin's part of the book was when Maya spoke. The trial itself was whatever, but her part in it was what made it feel impactful to me. I think there were several moments like that where the emotional payoff wasn't necessarily where you thought it was going to be.

[@yumyumhungry]

Breaking Bad Navani was everything I ever wanted.

[@cinxschannel9937]

It's about the journey not the destination, even if we knew or expected how some things would turn out, the journey was splendid :D

[@JC-ev2ns]

Love when Navani goes “journey before destination you bastard”

[@sebbarker3085]

It took me 3 weeks of waiting to watch this. Wanted to watch so bad but I was consuming in audiobook form and had to wait.. Gotta say. I LOVED Raboniel. Her interactions with Navani were *chefs kiss*

[@thorhammer737]

I think the flashbacks should have been all the singers. Give us some 7,000 years ago scenes, give us the pursuer getting killed the first time, give us raboniel, leshwi, el. Then end with the eshonai scene

[@carissanorris5399]

Oh, I really like this idea!

[@jacksonfurlong3757]

Nah, easier to rehash old plot points Much lower effort required

[@damonenfurst6662]

Nah, I think the final Eshonai flashback is only so powerful because we get so much of her throughout the book seeing that she always wanted to explore and see the world, and knowing that she dies before she can do that. If we only got a little or no Eshonai and more of the ancient singers, it would not be so impactful at all.

[@pranjanarahangdale9629]

@@damonenfurst6662 I agree ! I am actually glad we got more of the parshendi and I actually genuinely cared for them so much which I did not expect. Raboniel was such a badass character, loved every moment with her and Navani and as a Science student i absolutely loved their parts. The ending with eshonai broke me even more and the fact that it happened after Teft has left a hollowness in my heart which i know can never be filled if I hear or see their names again, both of them including Rock.

[@rishabhdave5773]

I can't believe I didn't see it.. Kelsier= Lord of Scars= Thaidakar. And the comment Hoid made about slapping him around... the Ghostbloods interest me way more now.

[@maxwelljohnson5221]

I know I love how subtle it gets put in there like even if you have read the other books wow you need to focus

[@alexsantos-hc4io]

The most mind blowing thing to me is that Thaidakar is mentioned in the prologue of way of king. Brando Sando likes to make some long shots.

[@andrewg5854]

I don't know how easy that was to spot...

[@ThanatoselNyx]

I didn't spot it. I am curious how someone is supposed to spot it based only on the main books.

[@maxwelljohnson5221]

@@ThanatoselNyx yeah I mean lord of scars could probably give it away but if you have read mistborn secrete history then their was even more hints

[@avi6837]

*Spoiler*spoiler*spoiler* Taravangian becoming odium is the best thing happened to not only Stormlight archive but the entire cosmere.. We hardly knew ATI and Leras... But odium being the main villain in cosmere I always wanted to know HIM more, not the power he holds.. Now things have changed and when odium/taravangian says "he is going to save all of them" it's more horrific than anything RAYSE ever said.. And funny thing is I can still understand and somewhat sympathise with him.. that's a villain I always wanted.. it's gonna be FUN

[@bluerectangle5794]

It's alright, no one would click on a spoiler review without finishing the book. You don't need to worry about marking a comment as spoilers.

[@Mjot101]

I know I’m so excited, I just hope the power doesn’t overtake him too quickly and we really get to see him being taravangian

[@riley8385]

I think cultivation's plan will backfire and Taravangyan will overpower her somehow. Also, apparently Cultivation is a dragon.

[@pranjanarahangdale9629]

CULTIVATION DEAR YOU MADE A MISTAKE. But also she touched 3 people so I am intrigued, i feel like next we are gonna see the nightwatcher bond with someone to make the 3rd and final bondsmith. Also do you think that maybe somehow Tarah might return in a badass way becs i am hoping for it.

[@kinglfc4life11]

Brando Sando said he originally wanted this to be all the reveal of the Parshendi backstory but he realised in book 2 and 3 he needs to show the readers at least some of the Parshendi or they wouldn’t be able to relate to them in any way. So because of this there was less reveals for the Parshendi in flash backs so he had to do them differently

[@MrNarcotix]

I cannot disagree harder about this being a character book. We see kaladin at his lowest, nevanis ambitions, rebonials tragic existence, would love to see her again in a herald flashback. Shallan confronting her past completely much better than the second book too.

[@riley8385]

Raboniel killing her doughter absolutely destroyed me.

[@hockeyhalod]

@@riley8385 Same. Dang..

[@havewissmart9602]

Kaladin's lowest was great. His highest(speaking the fourth ideal) was not done great. kal saying the third ideal felt more epic

[@matthewdennis1739]

@@havewissmart9602 I actually felt the vision was done perfectly. It highlights a complete shift of perspective that is reasonable given the emotional gravity of his brother's actions/reasons, which Kaladin was not aware of until that point. His demeanor afterward was the part that felt off for me. That he was able to speak the fourth ideal wasn't the problem for me, it's the degree to which he changed afterward. The jokes felt off.

[@deadfromhell1235]

@@matthewdennis1739 but he didn't change... he said it himself, what changed tho is his outlook on his mental problems and how he deals/will deal with them now

[@ducky36F]

Can’t wait to read the line “Thaidakar smiled” 😂

[@Ateeq98]

ahah, yes me neither!

[@pranjanarahangdale9629]

Same !!

[@mikem1585]

I was hoping for a lot more Jasnah. Honestly, I was expecting a lot more from her after Oathbringer. I really enjoyed the few scenes we did get from her, though. Also...”Journey before destination, you bastard.” So satisfying!

[@joshwilliams4286]

I believe I saw Sanderson mention in one of the annotations he did for this book that he wanted to continue setting Jasnah up in books 4 and 5 because he is going to have her at the forefront of the latter 5 books. He even hinted that he's considering making her THE main character of the second Stormlight Archive arc, or sequence, as I've heard him call it. I totally agree with you though, Jasnah is incredible. And to your second point... that scene. Chills. SO GOOD.

[@AJShiningThreads]

I loved her in this book - among my fave parts and my most highlighted parts

[@mikem1585]

@@joshwilliams4286 that is GREAT to hear! Thanks for sharing!

[@riley8385]

I don't know how I feel about hetero-romantic Jasnah tbh. She always struck me more as someone who didn't care for romantic relationships. She and Hoid didn't have enough chemistry to justify the relationship imo. I know Sanderson needs Wit to be more involved in the story, but I think the same thing could've been achieved making them just collegues who understand each other.

[@mikem1585]

@@riley8385 I read that relationship a little differently. I thought she cared for Wit because of his intelligence and thinking more than anything. I think she recognized the more physically romantic bits were something Wit needed more than her, but for her the stimulation was intellect. Maybe I read it wrong though, since I was reading so fast!

[@ghjong001]

The problem with Venli being the main Parshendi POV is that she's by necessity pretty passive - she's isolated from all of the main characters, and her main dramatic conflict is seeing how much she can say or do without attracting the attentions of the Fused. By contrast, Raboniel and Leshwi completely stole the show for me - and not just in the Parshendi sections. Furthermore, the flashbacks really didn't add show any new facets to the Venli and Eshonai (except for the last one, which I thought was beautiful).

[@tudornaconecinii3609]

Honestly, as much as I hate Venli as a character, I would've liked some more Venli POV chapters purely on the basis of how BASED of a character Leshwi is.

[@EE12345]

I'm not really a fan of Venli or Navani, but Raboniel made all of those chapters enjoyable. I wish Eshonai was still alive as she's the only Parshendi "good guy" that I actually liked.

[@Nick_Zak]

Merphy: "When Kelsier shows up in this book--" Me: *Neck snaps from the violent double-take* "Wait... Wut." *Blinks twice. Dies.*

[@melissalarochelle689]

Me too! I had no idea. Where’d she get this info from? Or was it super obvious and I just totally missed it?

[@noahgolan603]

Exactly. If anyone knows when he appeared and can help us clueless people that would be great

[@youngstomach]

​@@noahgolan603 check out chapter 115. It's technically a theory, but a pretty strong one.

[@youngstomach]

@@melissalarochelle689 ​ check out chapter 115. It's technically a theory, but a pretty strong one.

[@noahgolan603]

@@youngstomach thanks!

[@DryBooks]

I did not notice kelsier🤦🏽‍♀️! I know, bad fan. And now I need to reread that part!

[@ibrahimmansoor5286]

lol same Im soo confused

[@elizabethdavis5661]

I missed it too. I need to reread everything now because I feel like I missed a lot.

[@15nicinho]

I think Merphy misspoke. He didn’t actually show up, he was just mentioned at the very end as the leader of the ghostbloods. “Lord of Scars”

[@DryBooks]

@@15nicinho yeah, but I didn't make the Lord of Scars conection until someone told me about it

[@bobbyhero123]

I didn’t make the connection either until Murphy mentioned it. She said that and I scrambled to google it. Never expected Kelsie to be the leader of the Ghostbloods

[@nerfinfineon5589]

I’m glad I wasn’t the only one who read the Formless reveal and went “oh...okay”

[@robertcoronado3085]

For me, I just didn't really care for the whole Formless thing. I'm still kinda confused about how Formless is Shallan. Additionally, I wanted much more about Shallan's repressed memories. Because of all of this, I just didn't have any emotional connection to Shallan in this book.

[@UdyKumra]

"I'm gonna have to edit this video, I can't let Korey see me saying that" 😂

[@GMFlute]

I had the same thoughts that it would have been an even stronger book with Navani having flashback scenes instead of Venli / Eshonai. It would have really centered the whole book and made it a tighter story. Maybe there are future plotting reasons Sanderson has for giving us more of the backstory for V/E, but we didn’t get much payoff in this book for the amount of time spent with them. Although I admit the very last scene with V/E was very touching and brought a tear to my eye. Thanks for sharing your thoughts, it’s nice to hear you go into more detail!

[@93siguy]

I totally agree. I feel like the moment they brought up she killed her first spren was amazing. But had no pay off at all

[@markmadden84]

Tien's death in the first book absolutely destroyed me so when they had Kal interact with his brother's final moments it left me in bits. For that reason alone this book is top tier.

[@TheDewaker]

I had to get a box of tissues to finish that chapter. It's small for a chapter, but reading it felt like hundreds of pages.

[@Melancholy_Scholar]

Shallan nearly succeeding in convincing herself that Formless the perfect Ghostblood assassin was the best version of herself was horrifying for me. The internal conflict worked for me, but it was certainly structured in a way where I can totally understand it not landing.

[@henrywayne5724]

True

[@jenniferhicks1711]

The real question no one is focusing on.... what in the world is up with Whit and Jasnah 😁😁

[@thomasray]

Right?!?

[@AJShiningThreads]

Oh yes we are!!! Lol

[@Mikus011]

IMO Wit is Brandon Sanderson's avatar in the Cosmere... He read so often in reddit how his thirsty fans wanted to be crushed by Jasnah's thighs that he put his avatar in the sexiest position a true vorin man could be... Kissing Jasnah's uncovered safehand.

[@Kk-fj5tn]

#WitNa...Shipping HARD!!!

[@rayedjualidan1504]

Am I the only one that cared about the dog that want to become a dragon more than Venli😅

[@anixoni]

Rayed Jualidan couldn’t care less for Venli

[@ducky36F]

To be fair to Venli the dog was nearly my favourite character overall, that dog is a storming hero 😅

[@rebekahjensen7248]

That was the part of the book that made my husband cry.

[@rayedjualidan1504]

@@rebekahjensen7248 I told it to my children as a bedtime story and they got pissed😅 They kept saying but he is a good dog and kept telling them but he didn't become a dragon so he failed.😂 Now thay want me to buy a dog😑

[@ThanatoselNyx]

@@rayedjualidan1504 please don't buy a dog. Have a look at the Rescue. Those dogs need love too and the dog breeders shouldn't be supported!

[@joaofarias9986]

Lady, if things don't go as they expect it to go, just because It's obvious, we have GoT seasons 7 and 8.

[@SnapDragon128]

Definitely! You can "subvert my expectations" in a clever way (cough Taravangian cough) without kicking me in the teeth. Like, sure, Kal was not going to die in this book. Still really enjoyed his fight.

[@matthewdennis1739]

@@SnapDragon128 I think Kal's transformation would have been perfect if he was characterized just a little differently afterwards.

[@Abunchaponys]

I feel like the high stakes isn’t always the actual thing being discussed. Such as Aldolins trial. To me it was more of what was being argued and getting into the fortress in the first place. Compared to knowing he would win. And that ink Spren that taught him and then crossed him and the. She crossed again lol was epic.

[@jupianking]

I just finished Rhythm and I have been waiting to watch this video!!! I’m really grappling with your high stakes comment. When I was reading I was always so scared Kaladin or Shallan would be corrupted that I was on pins and needles reading any section with them. Thinking about it though- it would have been interesting for formless to be dealt with in book five, or the war on the ghost bloods to happen at the end of five. I am ultimately happy with the outcome, but I can see how delaying the outcome (formless taking over, the herald be captures and Adolin being left with the spren. Miah maybe healing half way into book five and adolin really having to confront these demons. But ultimately he and Shallan reconcile and move forward together- just after a lot of dark stuff happening, work to fight formless, and some good ghost blood interactions) could have been beneficial for the series. I would have been so angry and hurt if Shallan was corrupted though.

[@TylerAldrich]

I feel like he could have trimmed 100-200 pages but then there would be riots in the streets if he released a Stormlight book under 1,000 pages.

[@gortniteasdfafds]

I honestly feel that the book could have been better if certain viewpoints were extended (like venli/adolin/dalinar)

[@meraxion]

On Formless and Shallan: To me, Formless never felt like a 4th personality. When reading I got the impression Formless was more a collection of the truths (about herself) that Shallan didn't want to face, and she gave it the form of a personality to be able to trick herself into keeping them contained for as long as she did. This means that for me, the buildup of Formless felt very good. Shallan was constantly waging against herself, and every time Formless was 'rising' that was her getting emotionally closer to confronting her past (and then quelling that, up until the end), and it legitimately felt like Formless could surface at any point in the book or even not at all. So to me, Formless reaching the surface was going to be painful for Shallan for a short while, but then she would deal with those ugly truths and be better for it (I do have an issue with the execution of that because I felt it was done too fast/offscreen but that's another thing). Part of this might just be because I don't have a good enough understanding of Dissociative identity disorder and Formless *was* actually supposed to be seen as a proper 4th personality, but the buildup for Formless was a thing that really carried emotional weight for me in RoW.

[@PhilipChaseTheBestofFantasy]

I respect Sanderson’s achievements as a fantasy author - truly spectacular. I also consider myself enough of a fan to be excited for anything in the main books of The Stormlight Archive. Other than that, however, I don’t feel compelled to read everything in the Cosmere. For reference, I’ve read and liked the original Mistborn trilogy but nothing else other than Stormlight Archive. But I’m not a super-fan. Like you, I feel that Sanderson’s writing might actually be better with some editing, particularly to weed out some exposition, and though I admire his character work in The Stormlight Archive, I don’t think he’s a natural at writing strong characters with individual voices. So, I’m going to miss a lot of those Easter eggs, but I’m okay with that. A book or a series should be considered great because it tells a great story, not because of embedded references to other books by the same author. Of, course, those references are fun for the super-fans. Thanks for the video!

[@pranavroh]

I agree. I actually read everything by him but even then I feel his references to the Cosmere are getting more heavy handed as the series progresses. Which is fine I guess, but i feel it does detract from character work and storytelling at times.

[@PhilipChaseTheBestofFantasy]

@@pranavroh The story should always come first, and if there’s extra stuff that detracts from the story or ruins the pacing, even if it seems cool, it’s in the author’s and editor’s best interest to weed it out. Still, it’s hard to argue against Sanderson’s success!

[@pranavroh]

@@PhilipChaseTheBestofFantasy No doubt. His success speaks for itself. But i still feel his strongest books of the series were the first two. The strongest part of book three was the wonderful and deeply affecting character study of Dalinar. The cosmere connections are just going to get more obvious after this book I am sure.

[@PhilipChaseTheBestofFantasy]

@@pranavroh I completely agree - the first two books were the best so far.

[@riley8385]

I really recommend The Emperor's Soul, it's about 150 pages long and it is one of the best books Sanderson has written imo.

[@marklowry4431]

Ok, late to the party here. First, agree that Shallan needed more page time for the payoff. But I'm glad that formless was Shallan in disguise. I was so afraid that Shallan would be another Alia Atreides who is just controlled by another personality that lives inside her. Too much Sci fi/ fantasy (especially the older stuff) is like "women are unstable and can't handle themselves properly with powers like the male characters can" (looking at you Dune). But, Shallan being formless was an active decision by Shallan to take control of her destiny (i.e., i won't let my past actions keep controlling me; I will make my current self match those actions), albeit in a the wrong way. Just like Kaladin's was to jump off Urithiru (i.e., i wont let Odium take control of me; not being able to save others means I shouldn't be able to save myself). The parallels in their arcs was refreshing to me.

[@coren216]

I want to thank you for putting into words what I've been trying to figure out - why I wasn't as big a fan of this book as everyone else seems to be. The odium twist was by far one of the greatest plot moments in the cosmere, but outside of that, I agree 100% on the character-driven lack in this book. You said that, and it just clicked. I've said other places, overall this book felt more like a setup for book 5 than anything else, and perhaps in retrospect I'll enjoy RoW more, but for now, not my favorite.

[@carissanorris5399]

I feel the same.

[@MissMokate]

I only read one series by Sanderson that had a clear ending to its era and if that was any indication of what he's capable of then the 5th book has the potential to murder us all

[@Arezoo298195]

I actually think the whole book felt very tightly paced except some of the flashbacks. Those slowed me down some. But I felt like I experienced multiple Sanderlanches in this book.

[@bekis109]

thank you for helping me understand some of my mixed feelings with the book! I loved some parts so much - like the Navani and Kaladin storylines - but others, as you say, didn't quite give me that emotional payoff that I wanted. There was some really cool set-up for the next book though and I'm looking forward to seeing where Sanderson takes things from here.

[@michaelnelson2976]

I feel like all your points have very justified backing in the text. I'm with you. I did find it interesting the examples that you used for the Lack of Emotional Stakes. I very well am in a more emotional place than normal, but Shallan's overtaking by herself, her own self-destructive tendencies, not even an external personality, had me gasping. I very much thought that Kaladin was going to give up entirely. I thought he had his stage and he had just been pushed too far. I was heartwrenched and sobbing, not sure if I have cried to a book before. There was issues as you mentioned: Shallan's payoff and the result of Adolin's trial. But I still feel like the process of Adolin giving himself over and getting rescued by Maya said a lot about those characters. I do agree though, there are a few systemic issues seen in RoW and OB. I feel like people overlook them a bit more after the entire buy-in on characters with Books 1-2. And I'm a world-reader, so this interconnection heavy novel was still kicking off for me personally. I think all your critiques are valuable and I understand where you're coming as a personal experience too! Thank you for sharing it all

[@mehazc]

Most of the emotional beats landed for me, which is generally how all books are. Adolin and shallan’s whole thing didn’t really make me feel too much, but everything at Urithiru and even Eshonai’s final flashback chapter really landed. I’ll take it. I like that we have an in world based mechanism for scenes like Moments and Eshonai’s death. There isn’t just pages of emotional stuff that is supposed to be happening instantly in our characters heads. The dichotomy between Teft’s death and Kaladin’s fourth ideal really highlighted that.

[@katieamarsh]

I really want to reread this, I was tempted to right away when I finished, but decided to reread the cosmere first to really make the worldhopping moments pop out. The parshendi back stories were okay. I loved Rabonial. I loved seeing the humanity in the “bad guy”. I wish there would have been even more about Navani. She’s an incredible character.

[@rahilmoodley2505]

And BTW Merthyr i just finished reading The City We Became by N.K Jamison. It’s an amazing fantasy and i definitely recommend it to you.

[@sarafina1263]

Haha three weeks later and I can finally watch and comment!! I agree with pretty much all of your pro and cons EXCEPT the emotional stakes. Every single moment you mentioned i had such a strong reaction to and I love seeing how people responded differently. I feel like I would not have responded the same way I did if Kaladin's suicidal thoughts (and tien) were not explored ALL the way in WOK, so it all coming to a head here was very satisfying. Also, while Adolin's trial did not have quite the same impact, at least his bond with Maya was once again set up before ROW so I was satisfied with it. Of course, not saying you are wrong, but I place ROW as second in the series so it is always interesting to listen to other perspectives :)

[@sarafina1263]

But I also COMPLETELY agree with what you said about Shallan. I do not care about her as a character that much so I suppose that is why it did not disappoint me that much, but her resolution was lame.

[@smaug1234]

So many wtf points in this one lol. I thought the pacing was better this one then Oathbringer. I really liked what we got for Shallan and Adolin, it felt like the right amount to me, and Shallan finally started moving in the right direction to healing. Kal got the epic action stuff that Sanderson does so well, but he also got that emotional point with Tien, and again he is moving toward healing. Not much Dalran this one, but that part in the tent with the spren is so cool and creepy. I cant wait to reread this one, there is so much that happens and I want to take my time and really look at this

[@harrythompson1927]

Reading Kaladin in this book was like watching a friend struggle through mental health, you know from your POV that it’s just a rough patch and they will make it out in the end but convincing them and helping them to get there is a difficult journey. While we could all know the 4th ideal was coming I think viewing the situation through Kaladin’s eyes makes this scene so much more impactful as he truly had given up, making it surprising to him that he was able to do it if not to us as the reader. It really perfectly encapsulates the journey of recovering from a mental health condition, while we often won’t have a moment where everything changes, more a gradual healing, the way we can surprise ourselves with how strong we are even when we have reached our weakest is what this scene meant to me. This hero complex had been a core character flaw for Kal since book 1, and I felt the entire book was like the end of this series long arc that had a predictable but very satisfying pay off.It’s the only scene in any book that has made me cry.

[@hotsaucesteve3433]

Thanks for the video. I enjoy both your video and Daniel Greenes spoiler review.

[@ahri3887]

I also think the stakes thing doesn't really matter because the way they get to those happy endings is really well written and really interesting. The only time I got annoyed at it was when Navani bonded the sibling, it felt too obvious to me

[@bluerectangle5794]

When you realize the "not in-depth" spoiler review is 25 minutes long, that's when you realize the scale of the Stormlight Archive.

[@BobSmith-ci9mv]

In depth is like 10 hours

[@luminaryprism75]

Okay finally coming to this after having just finished the book. SO good. Second favorite in the series thus far. This is the first book that’s made me cry. Hoid is too good at getting to me. Kaladin is a character I relate to harder than I’ve related to almost any other character I’ve ever read and reading the words- “you will be warm again” made me cry. So excited, but this is the first time I’ve got to wait for a book. Guess I can explore the rest of the Cosmere in the meantime. Thanks as always, Merphy!

[@eagamezz]

I think the "what other way could this have gone" is a great confirmation/hindsight bias bait.

[@lalalaurenlibby]

Although I agree and would’ve LOVED Navani flashbacks - I’m happy about the flashback chapters from Eshonai/Venli just because they gave us that last chapter with Eshonai and the Stormfather. I thought I was done crying and then that chapter had me in tears again. Especially after reading that the Spren left the Singers, and knowing that Eshonai helped bring the Everstorm - that moment between her and the Stormfather was really special and I’m glad we got it. I was upset we didn’t get more from Eshonai when she died so that chapter gave me closure for her character.

[@henrywayne5724]

I agree. I thought I was done with crying but Sanderson comes with that flashback. Never would I have thought that my favorite flashback would be an Eshonai one! I’m so glad we got closure for her character. And also, people should just learn to accept that Sanderson can’t please everyone. Sanderson has had a rigid outline for seventeen years now and making Navani a flashback character would mess everything up because that would mean two Bondsmith books, back to back. We could all use some more Navani, but I trust that Sanderson knows what he’s doing. Hey, he is very accessible and we can always pester him for a Navani novella. But for now, he has an outline that has always worked for him, where he chooses one order per book, let’s let the man do his thing.

[@farahmajeedrasool4544]

What you said about the plot for Kal and Adolin's plot being kinda predictable was on my mind from the start,but then I remembered the first ideal of all knoghts radiant ,specifically JOURNEY BEFORE DESTINATION So it's their journey that counts . Of course Kal will swear the fourth ideal but how he got there is what matters.

[@angelamccollister]

OMG! How did I not figure out Kelsier is Thaidakar? I just finished RoW two days ago. I knew I probably missed many of the Cosmere connections but I can't believe I missed this one!

[@pretendtheresaname9213]

After reading it your advice in the last video was on point, if you liked Oathbringer you'll like Rhythm of War, if you didn't the same issues are still here..

[@henrywayne5724]

Well, it was different for me. Oathbringer was my least favorite and THIS ONE is my favorite book of all time. I mean, I expected to really not like it, but all the cons Merphy listed weren’t even mine. I mean, I found that this was the best paced book, characters took center stage, the page count was justified e.t.c.

[@Haxerous]

Gotta disagree. This book is more WoK than Oathbringer. Especially in terms of structure and the Sanderlanche is a lot more low scale compared to great epic battles that we see in WoR and OB. It is feels like a set up book for book 5 like WoK is to WoR. OB felt more like it's own separate arc while this felt more like a laying of the different pieces for the big match to happen. It also had a bit of Well of Ascension feel to it in some areas.

[@henrywayne5724]

@@Haxerous THIS! Especially when Adolin and Shallan weren’t present in Part 3 of the book and then came back later in some chapters in Part 4 and then only had one chapter at the end of Part 5 that sets up the next book. That structure reminded me of Shallan and Jasnah in TWOK where but in this case, Sanderson made Shallan take center stage in Oathbringer as buildup for her finally coming to her own in ROW. Plus, I felt that there was a greater focus on characters and also plot somehow.... Honestly, the responses to this book don’t even make sense. I’ve seen mixed reviews of books, but with this one, it’s really up to the reader’s interpretation and patience. I mean, people have COMPLETELY OPPOSITE views on this book, like watching reviews of this book don’t give you a true picture of what the book is, because everyone just has completely different thoughts! Collectively, people consider WOR the best and OB the least favorite , with this one, the reviews are just all over the place. I was so ready to not like this book since she said it was similar to OB, then I read it, and it didn’t really feel like OB at all, and it became my favorite book of all time!

[@Haxerous]

@@henrywayne5724 I see people complaining about pacing, but I felt this was faster than OB. For me OB was bit more of a mixed bag than this one. I feel a lot of people had set their expectations too high for the "main" character and the related flashbacks because of how great Dalinar flashbacks were. Which I don't think is repeatable, at least not easily. Also, I don't see a lot of people talking about great antagonists that we got to see Leshwi, Raboniel, and Lezian. People seem more fixated on the few things they wanted to see and didn't get. 🤷 The Shallan/Adolin plot line is definitely a "To be Continued" thing. Especially because they are still in Lasting Integrity and Ishar just a hopped into Shadesmar right around that same area. Also, the hundreds of dead eyes accumulation over there hasn't been dealt with yet either. So we probably are seeing a set up for potential conflict between Ishar, Shallan/Adolin, the Honorspren (if Stormfather reports to the Honorspren about Ishar's experiments) and the dead eyes. Not to mention, Ishar told Dalinar to come meet him in Shinovar, so may be he is heading there even, if he does he might come across Szeth again too. There's a lot of loose ends and dangling threads there. For Dalinar this is a very self introspective book, just like it is for Navani, Adolin and Venli as they trying to figure who they are, what they can do etc. It makes sense thematically. He does take a step back like he did in WoR and setting something big for him in the next book.

[@henrywayne5724]

@@Haxerous Yes, I agree with everything you’ve said. People are mad because they didn’t get what they expected yet if you look at things keenly, you’ll realize that what was done in this book was just O.K. That’s why I said this book is more of a mixed bag than the others, because it’s like there are two factions, the ones who love it so much, and the ones who were disappointed with it as if you look at both factions, you’ll notice they offer very valid arguments on their views unlike with OB where almost everyone agreed in some way or form that the pacing was off.(I had SERIOUS issues with Part 3)With this one, it’s either people think it’s the best paced book and others feel like it should’ve been trimmed down. Same case with the Sanderlanche, some people say there was no Sanderlanche, others say there was. Some say that character work was at its lowest here, others say character work is at its finest here. Some say there were no emotional stakes, others say this book has the highest emotional stakes. Do you see what I mean here? And I agree with you about the Shallan/Adolin plot line, it was definitely a ‘To Be Continued’ and I have a feeling we’ll spend a lot more time in Shadesmar with them in the next book because Ba Ado Mishram’s imprisonment will be a HUGE plot line in Book 5, because for some reason, her imprisonment led to the Sibling’s downfall and I have a theory that Ba Ado Mishram has something to do with Jaxlim’s memory loss. And again, it was obvious that Dalinar would take back stage in this book after Oathbringer, I mean, he was less prominent at the beginning of the book, then as we approach the end, we start seeing him more and more, which means big things will be happening with Dalinar in the fifth book, starting with the contest of the champions. Another thing is that we’re headed to Shinovar in the next book and I’m excited to see Kaladin and Szeth interact/ trauma bond. With Shallan, it really didn’t irk me as much as it irked some people because there were literally THREE BOOKS of buildup to where we got with her. Plus, I think Shallan actually took a big portion of Oathbringer and her development had actually started way earlier, after Wit’s advice to her, you can see she doesn’t use Veil at all, then the battle of Thaylen Field happens, and you see she’s using her personas but in a conflicting way, where unlike where if it was Veil, it was Veil in Oathbringer, you can see them seeping into each other more and more, hinting at Shallan’s internal conflict, where rather than refusing to remember completely, she’s grappling the decision that she HAS TO face them, for her own good. I honestly don’t understand why people are bothered when Shallan and Adolin we’re gone for pages to no end, yet the same thing was done in TWOK and also Warbreaker. I remember reading a Sanderson annotation where he said that he chooses which character arcs to focus on more as per the initial nature of the character, that’s why Vivenna took a more center stage at around the 30% mark in Warbreaker. I don’t like how people are just flossing over these great antagonists we got to see. Like, am I the only one who cried when Raboniel died? I mean, COME ON GUYS, Raboniel deserves more love! She’s like my favorite villain of the Stormlight Archive now, it takes a great villain to make me cry at their death. I knew from the very beginning that these flashbacks were not going to work as well as the other ones because of the WOR interludes. However, the choices made were actually for the greater good of BOTH books. If those interludes were not in WOR, there wouldn’t have been vicarious suspense and the finale wouldn’t have been all that. Had they been included in ROW, pacing would’ve been a problem because a lot was happening in ROW. The flashbacks we got were just O.K. they served to show us that the cause of the war even goes PAST ROSHAR and it really wasn’t the Listeners’ fault. Plus, I don’t like how everyone is glossing over Venli’s character development. I may like her least of the main characters but she still had GREAT character development, I can’t fail to acknowledge that. It may not have been as grand as the other ones, but it was still fine. I really enjoyed seeing Venli’s downward spiral, the same way I enjoyed seeing Eshonai’s downward spiral in WOR. We also learn that at their core, all they ever wanted was freedom and their efforts in trying to keep it led to their near extinction. It’s really tragic. In a nutshell, I see this book being rated higher in people’s lists upon rereads. This is my favorite book of all time because NO BOOK has had such a profound effect on me emotionally. It’s like my emotions went through a paint mixer.

[@0reo2]

This is the kind of review that makes me appreciate this book even more. A book that I just read myself. Amazing review

[@markravetto4619]

On your interpretation of no Stakes? With Kalidin falling. You said "well of course he's gonna live" but thats the best message about depression. Things will work out, you always have hope. You just need to believe in yourself.

[@Hisdudeliness0330]

I feel like the most notable think to take from the part when Kal said his forth ideal is the fact that he actually jumped. Looking back at WoK and remembering him on that edge, and he made it through all of that. Did so many incredible things then he arrives back at that edge and he doesn’t walk away from it, he actually jumped. It was chilling and so heartbreaking. I agree with what you’re saying, I wasn’t necessarily surprised when he got out of it, but just the fact that he jumped this time. Straight chills. Love your vids! 🤙🏼

[@Dalenthas]

Spoiler alert: the dog does not become a dragon.

[@snakebagel9729]

That dog is more of a dragon than you will ever be

[@Hoodles321]

I started two years ago with mistborn books 1, 2 and 3 then moved onto Stormlight and literally just finished RoW but already know about Kel being alive, that reveal shocked the hell out of me!

[@Avix04]

I read Era 1 of Mistborn before jumping into Stormlignt. So hearing Merphy mention that Kelsier was the leader of the Ghostbloods nearly gave me whiplash 😅

[@berlineczka]

I think the Kaladin and Adolin subplots, although predictable with regards to the outcomes, were still satisfying. The journey before the destination. We KNEW Kal was just before his fourth ideal and chickened in the previous book. I was kinda expecting him to say it with each Tower safety knot being discovered and he running to the rescue. C'mon, that would be the obvious solution - get more powers so that it can push through the blockade and actually stand a chance. Instead, we got each and every fight or an even more exhausted Kaladin, but yet he persisted and adjusted to what he got. His creativity with using Navani fabrial in fight was really fun to read. He was a soldier, after all, and this, together with his conflict with his father and his realisation that Pursuer was no soldier - but HE was - was really satisfying. And I loved both visions/stories within his arc, the one about the dog by Wit and the one with Tien. Honestly, it was not really about the Fourth Ideal. He could have just fallen out of the reach of the radiant suppression and saved his father and himself with his Third Ideal skills. This would have been just as good. As for Adolin, I enjoyed the Shadesmar part more than in previous book. Mostly because it had a clear goal and a sense of direction. I didn't care for Shallan (and she used to be my favorite character), her struggles were repetitive for me, and not interesting at all (how many times do I need to read that Shallan is hiding and it's Veil or Radiant, both equally passive?). The Formless concept was not developed enough, and resolved too quickly and randomly, without a proper set up. Adolin's part, on the other hand... I loved that there were hints that he IS damaged somehow by his upbringing, but consciously compertmalising this part of his. I liked his idea to be judged, and his struggle to separate himself from his father's image of him. I actually liked the trial. Notum's "Honor is not dead as long as he lives in the humans!" hit me hard. It was a very Kafka-esk situation. And then, the thing that happen with Maya... The resolve wasn't a win for Adolin, it was a plot twist. The reveal that the spren chose to sacrifice was big, and made the whole trial (and the whole high horse attitude of the honorspren) a sham. I liked that Adolin didn't really WIN the trial. Maya did.

[@riley8385]

The plot twist at the trial was weird for me because for some reason I always assumed it went without saying that the spren chose to sacrifice themselves, I don't know what made me think that, but I was actually surprised when I found out it was supposed to be a twist.

[@thomasray]

With each new Stormlight book, I'm reminded of how I like each installment for completely different reasons. WoK is a perfect introduction to everything. WoR is a thrilling, conflicting adventure. Oathbringer is devastatingly beautiful. Rhythm of War was twenty steps forward in the dark, with higher stakes than ever before and more secrets and revelations than I ever expected. I mean, Oathbringer is my fave, but none of these books are objectively worse or better than the others

[@ErikratKhandnalie]

Could not disagree with you more with regards to tension and stakes. The tension of any story is never "will the protag save the day?", and it isn't even really "how will the protag save the day?" though that is closer - it's, "how will the act of saving the day change the protag?" And in that we get a lot of really amazing moments from RoW. All of the moments, such as Kaladin's fourth ideal, or Adolin's trial, that you say had little tension were never really about whether or not they were going to overcome the challenge, but about what this overcoming will reveal about them, or what this will teach us about the characters.

[@aneonfoxtribute]

Technically Kelsier doesn't actually know up in person in this book. He is mentioned but he doesn't SHOW UP

[@ahemlol]

Maybe in next book..

[@ShirleyTimple]

Semantics are fun, huh?

[@Valiguss]

After this book kaladin and navani are the best The scariest thing in this book wasn’t taravangian becoming odium to me, it was the reveal that roshar was odiums training ground and the fact that cultivation got taravangian to become odium. Roshar is in my opinion the scariest and most dangerous world we have seen in the cosmere. Imagine a rosharan army rampaging across scadriel or nalthis would be scary, the armies of roshar especially the alethi are on a broad scale battle hardened from 7000 years of near endless war, the fused and radiant are far stronger then any other magic systems we have seen. Taravangian isn’t the main villain, cultivation is who we need to be worried about, I think rn based on what happened to taravangian dalinar will become honor and what about lift?

[@JPK314]

I'm pretty sure that scadrial is way higher tech than roshar is and the disparity will only continue to grow. Roshar has the numbers and battle tactics, but can they stand up to actual aerial mobility, guns, etc.? I don't think so

[@pranjanarahangdale9629]

Cultivation ? Yes i want to see more of lift and how the old magic might affect her also i really really want Kaladin to play a part in the plot

[@9Flatline]

I feel like we need so much more of Shallan and Adolin (separately not as a couple) to have the emotional impact those chapters are supposed to be giving us. I was constantly wanting to see more of what was happening and seeing how they were developing. I also felt like how long it was between their sections was a real disservice to their plot line in this book. He left us on cliff hangers but it took so long to get back to their perspective that it really drained away the anxiety that you are supposed to be feeling for them because the stakes for Kal and Navani are whats on your mind 90% of the book.

[@henrywayne5724]

I think that’s what you’re supposed to be feeling. I don’t understand why people were bothered by it so much yet Sanderson literally used the same tactic in TWOK where we focused on Kaladin 90% of the time because his plot had the most stakes while Shallan’s, though it was low stake, was still at the back of our minds, and when that plot line came to a close in the book, we ended up getting a new unexpected plot line that was a lot more interesting, . ROW follows this same formula, where the expedition to Shadesmar is more low stake than the Urithiru plot line, and so it takes a back seat for a couple of pages before coming back stronger than before and then we end the plot line with the introduction of a new, far more interesting one, with Shallan and Adolin hunting the Ghostbloods and finding out what the deal is with Ba Ado Mishram and Kalak. The structure of this book really reminded me of TWOK. And also, I feel like this book solidified why Shallan and Adolin are good for each other. If you think about it, in the other books, they didn’t hang out as much and so were just seeing as this cute couple. But this book makes sure we see that they are ride or die for each other, not just a couple that likes one another for being hot. I’d be fine if we see them individually in the next book, but I’d also be fine if they were together. Personally, I feel like for all the three books of buildup, I’m pretty satisfied with the way things played out, but hey, that is just my take.

[@rriggs6547]

I get that the character study in this book was on Navani who was not a main before this. I honestly thought this was the best character study from any of the books. I was disappointed that we had so little Jasnah and Dalinar. I also thought the Shallan stuff was overly predictable and there was not enough time spent on Adolin. But as for a character study, I think the Navani/Rabonial interplay was the best of any of the series.

[@arksine]

The way I saw it, Adolin didn’t actually win the trail. He and Maya definitely had great moments in there, but the implications of Maya’s speech about spren willingly sacrificing is actually more terrifying. Now we know the recreance happened because both radiants and their spren likewise thought that giving up surgebinding is actually the better thing to do for the planet. Now, the minority of honorspren who were willing to bond humans have to wonder if making new radiants is worth the risk of harming Roshar in some way. Before the series is done, I believe we will learn how surgebinding destroyed humanity’s previous home and maybe it will almost destroy Roshar too.

[@dunnejos8423]

See I completely am the opposite when it comes to his info dumps on fabrials. One thing Sanderson is a MASTER of in this book is weaving in the science/magic to Raboniel and Navani's story lines. He really really really shows the scientific method over and over, making hypothesis about the different kinds of light and whether they can mix, testing methods on paper on how to extract the lights, learning about extraction from The Singers/Raboniel and the revelations of sound and the lights being connected and how the singers are LITERALLY drawing power from sound, testing drawing out different kinds of light, Navani LEARNING to hear the tones of the Singers and manipulating them herself, finding out the "immulsifier" in her humming with Raboniel. Aaaaaaaaa, it was so amazing. If Sanderson weren't this thorough would I believe that Navani is much of a scholar or scientist? I don't think so. it was Imparative for him to be very thorough, because science is thorough.

[@thomasray]

Precisely

[@henrywayne5724]

Exactly. I love how Sanderson is THOROUGH with this things.

[@Coreyjness]

WHAT!? Kelsier is the leader of the Ghostbloods?! How did I not notice!? Also, I was worried I was the only person reading the trial scenes thinking, "Hmmm, I wonder what Sanderson's gonna do to win him the trial?"

[@bradenhazle4378]

Leader is Thaidakar. Also called "Lord of Scars", wink wink. And had a previous altercation with Hoid, WINK

[@richardviguurs5488]

I always felt the only way the trial was going to be won would be because of Maya somehow :D

[@JC-ev2ns]

I’ve been waiting for this video!!!! Love you Merphy!

[@UdyKumra]

If he really wanted to do a book about the singers, he should've made Rlain a major viewpoint in this book and given him the flashbacks. Spying on the Alethi? So cool!!

[@DoggyP00]

Spying on the Alethi in dull form not doing anything for years. As cool as Rlain's spying could have been, there really isn't anything there.

[@15nicinho]

Every book has flashbacks on a Knight Radiant. So at the start of this book it couldn’t have been Rlain.

[@henrywayne5724]

What exactly would Rlain even do? He spied on them in dull form for years, there isn’t much material there. People need to understand that Sanderson can’t please everyone.

[@Liesmith424]

I think people were annoyed by the Venli/Eshonai flashbacks because there was a *lot* of shit going on in the "present day", so every flashback chapter wound up being a bit frustrating. Either way, I was glad for them--we had to know the depth of Venli's mistakes and betrayal in order for her own path and ideals to have any weight.

[@arslangungil2923]

2 years late, but Jasnah and Navani are my favorite not main characters Navani's magic science was AWESOME to read. Gimme more!

[@the_ricku]

I finally finished this book in preparation for WoT releasing this year. I definitely agree that giving Navani the spotlight/flashback treatment in this book would have served the book (and character) a lot better. I understand that Brando may have felt the need to give us the singer/listener lore, and while that was appreciated, I still think he could have done that in this book while maybe giving us a Venli/Eshonai novella a la Edgedancer/Dawnshard.

[@Astropuppers]

I swear if Thaidakar officially makes a true appearance and give that signature smile of his, I'd probably lose my mind.

[@Williamtolduso]

I remember finishing that chapter when formless took over and freaking ouuuut. SO i stopped reading for the night until the next day and that helped a lot for the whiplash I think. But yes I agree with you on all your points I think

[@patricehugs6423]

I personally, really enjoyed the Eshonai and Venli chapters. It took a while though, it felt like the early ones were just rehashing stuff we already knew but as they we got the chapters of modern Venli struggling with that past and interacting with Rlain I felt it made those early chapters more necessary because they provided context to Venli's current struggles. By the end of this book I became much more invested in Venli as a character than I had been before. Also, Eshonai riding the storm really hit me very well and I don't think it would have felt as deserved without the early flashback chapters.

[@pranavroh]

Navani is one of my new favourite character. This should have been Navani's book. However everything we got on Venli and Eshonai has already been mentioned. I completely agree with your thoughts on Navani. It could have been a great character study on the level of Dalinar's in book 3. Or, unpopular opinion, this should have been Raboniel's book!!

[@henrywayne5724]

Sanderson can’t satisfy everyone’s whims. I too like Navani a whole lot but the man has had a rigid outline for close to two decades now, ONE ORDER PER BOOK. A Navani book would mean two Bondsmiths books back to back, husband and wife, and that would mess up the whole series. This was the Willshapers book, so it just couldn’t be Navani’s book. It would ruin his life’s work. This couldn’t be Raboniel’s book, because this was her debut. It would have messed up the pacing for Sanderson to introduce a new main character and make us care for her, THEN make her a Willshaper as well. This would’ve brought a whole new set of issues for future books. Raboniel is my favorite villain of the series thus far, and to me,she’s fine as it is. There will always be a character you like more than another, but Sanderson is a meticulous person and he knows what needs to be done for the greater good.

[@fangoram29]

The whole honour Spren subplot felt like a waste at the end of the day. I love my sweet prince boy and was happy to see the deadeye thing happening but now that the war is supposed to end in 10 days do we need more wind runners?

[@henrywayne5724]

It wasn’t a waste to me,and I feel like what the honorspren subplot did was to show the various divides among the various spren. With Taravangian being Odium now, he is going to exploit those divides, just wait and see. Plus, it really gave Adolin a moment to shine, like, there were so many Adolin moments in this book. I don’t buy into the idea that Book 5 will take place in just ten days, that’s not enough time for plot, for worldbuilding and for character work, especially because not only is this book ending this first sequence, it’s also setting up the next one. I think Dalinar will lose the Battle Of The Champions early on in the book and the rest of the book will be spent figuring out how to get out of that mess.

[@Rowan3733]

Spoiler: the war isn't gonna end in 10 days. T.Odium is going to make it a cosmere-scale war.

[@henrywayne5724]

@@Rowan3733 I actually believe that's true. Just yesterday, I found out Brandon said that Stormlight 5 is the halfway point of the Cosmere. Plus Rayse was intent on training Roshar as the perfect weapon for the wars of planets. I also think other Shards may be making their way to Roshar.

[@Merlijn1994]

Spoiler . . . . . . . . . . . So, I get it, we all knew Kaladin wasn't going to just fall to his death. But we're not even going to mention his reversed flashback/vision/idk with Tien? That's cold man. That scene absolutely totally broke me

[@ivysudweeks1550]

Adding to the High Stakes discussion. Brandon Sanderson always writes very competent characters, which is delightful. They'll (mostly) always make it out okay, so I never look for stakes there. What adds tension/stakes is the question of HOW they are going to make it? How is Kaladin going to keep all of Bridge Four alive? How is Vin going to bring down the Lord Ruler? This results in amazing payoff in the end when you see incredible characters overcoming overwhelming odds through methods the reader could never have expected. It's so gratifying in the end, which is what I read Sanderson for. However, in RoW, I never thought "HOW in the world is Adolin going to convince the Honor Spren????" or "HOW is Navani going to free the tower?" The answers were the obvious, in-hand fixes--Adolin is going to be a good guy and Navani is going to overcome her prejudice. I feel like the stakes in this book were like a house on stilts--really tall, but only half a house. The characters have to do AMAZING things, but we only get half the payoff because the answers are obvious.

[@adamahoonie]

I think Brandon would have made this Navani’s book, but she’s not a Willshaper, she’s a Bondsmith, and we already got our Bondsmith book. I really liked Venli’s flashbacks but I think Brandon was determined to stick to the structure he set, and I’m ok with that. I also think that we’ll be more character focused in books 6-7 after the big plot-focused finale of book 5. I think those who loved Way of Kings and Words of Radiance will really like the books that come out after the long break, and like Oathbringer-Book 5 the series will become more plot focused for books 8-10.