Michael Shermer with Dr. Carol Tavris - Mistakes Were Made, But Not by Me (Science Salon # 10)

Listen to the Podcast (audio) version:
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Why is it so hard to say “I made a mistake”-and really believe it? Social psychologist Dr. Carol Tavris, one of the most influential thinkers and writers of our time, explores in dialogue with Michael Shermer cognitive dissonance and what happens when we make mistakes, cling to outdated attitudes, or mistreat other people-we must calm the cognitive dissonance that jars our feelings of self-worth. And so, unconsciously, we create fictions that absolve us of responsibility, restoring our belief that we are smart, moral, and right-a belief that often keeps us on a course that is dumb, immoral, and wrong. Backed by years of research, Mistakes Were Made (But Not by Me) offers a fascinating explanation of self-justification-how it works, the damage it can cause, and how we can overcome it. The updated edition of the book features new examples and concludes with an extended discussion of how we can live with dissonance, learn from it, and perhaps, eventually, forgive ourselves.
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This event was recorded on February 19, 2017 at Science Salon, hosted by The Skeptics Society, in California.
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[@deeveevideos]

I just found this person and she is very insightful. I have always had the sentiment that the most dangerous thing that humans posses is the ability to justify anything. That is what caused most of the horrific things to happen to people. People can say "I'm the good guy they are the bad ones!"

[@sh4mst0ne]

Claim @ 1:03:50: "Women are immensely victimised in Science". What does victimised mean here? Can I have a scale here between Physical Violence or Stupid Comments, Native Bias between perpetrator and the victim, or something I'm not understanding. What does it mean to be a victim here, How? And at what level? Blatant shouting in the workplace or meany trolls online or micro-aggressions?

[@jameshollomon44]

On the arc versus the wheel argument, I think you are both right. The wheel rolling generally uphill is a good analogy for the arc of moral progress. It's just as Leon Trotsky obesrved, "Revolutions have always in history been followed by counterrevolutions. Counterrevolutions have always thrown society back, but never as far back as the starting point of the revolution."

[@IllPropaganda]

Nice to see this after reading about the book so much in the magazine.

[@whoatethechocolate]

The host's loud laughter and booming voice detracts from listening to the guest.

[@FizzleFX]

The audio book was worth it's price

[@ThePharphis]

Is this a reupload with better sound quality?

[@SquatFull]

That is Trump's attitude " Mistakes Were Made, But Not by Me"

[@GuestU2]

I wish Carol would offer us the Trump phenomenon and how he is able to fool so many? How dangerous is this for the future of our country?

[@zacharysbrennan5376]

liberal idiot

[@MsHojat]

*"it's far more costly [to kill someone] than to incarcerate them for x number of years"* That's not true. It's an extremely widely misunderstood statement. The only thing that costs more is the large amounts of extra judicial process which occurs *before* the person is executed. If there was only a little bit -or no more- extra judicial work involved, it would be far far cheaper than life incarceration. The proper statement is that *"The entire judicial process for death penalty **_in USA currently_** costs more than the judicial process and incarceration costs of life incarceration"*. In fact, I think it maybe even includes the incarceration cost of death row inmates, which -as Shermer mentioned- is a very long time. This is a secondary minor point, but also consider where the money is going: to lawyers and judges and other things like that which will get reinvested into the economy, vs a prison which spends some of the money they get on basic necessities such as food, utilities, and shelter, while the rest of it may go to the private prison hosting them, so that they can make more prisons or stuff more prisoners. It's not particularly advantageous for them for prisoners to be rehabilitated, nor for them to run out of a supply of prisoners.

[@MarkHidden]

Wow, There is some heat there Michael, Nice. Going after a feminist? However, she handled the heat well, Yet I did detect some cognitive dissonance going on too. The Better Angels of our Nature angle really seemed to get under her skin a bit. People really like the cycles theory a lot, probably do to how common cycles are in nature. I see some real growth and refinement of your thinking, and I think you showcased some good constructive conversational skills, Considering how wide your disagreements really are. I know some of your commenters don’t like the fact you pushed, I like it. Keep it up.

[@GuestU2]

I wish Carol would offer us the Trump phenomenon and how he is able to fool so many? How dangerous is this for the future of our country?

[@lycantico]

55:40 she should read her own book.

[@StefanTravis]

Judging from the comments, this video touched a nerve. It's made a lot of people uncomfortable enough to try to change the topic.

[@babalaksa]

WOW. This whole video is a fascinating confirmation of the opening thesis. She perfectly demonstrates the cognitive dissonance, rationalization, and doubling down that she herself described at the beginning of the talk. It's fascinating to watch the growing dissonance of a dissonance expert in real time, every time Michael Shermer presented a challenging viewpoint or asked a probing question. Shermer is trying to tell her there is no mothership and to come down off the mountaintop, and her reaction is to talk about the Johnson administration and about how women in science are oppressed, with laughable explanation of why women are underrepresented in the physical sciences but overrepresented in biological/life sciences.

[@CraigCastanet]

Wow! What a blockbuster slander of the military. PTSD derives from murder? She should have been much more careful, and Michael is chuckling? Why did that comment get a pass? I'm not inclined to slander guys that got involved in the ugliness that is war, when I spent my lucky ass, sitting stateside.

[@jhonroberts2897]

This guy makes the questions and answers the himself not slowing her to talk

[@thomsonmaclean2041]

Ouite a bit of cognitive dissonance going on in this interview/discussion.

[@CraigCastanet]

Is is asinine to claim, with the benefit of hindsight, that the Iraq was a mistake. Of course, we know that now- that's easy. The relevant question was, and remains, given what we knew, AT THAT TIME- NOT NOW, do we err by invading, or err by not invading, and hope they don't disseminate potential weapons to terrorist entities. I think you can make a case either way, so long as you are accepting of the potential repercussions. But it takes cowardice to pretend that correct answer was always known.

[@crowesarethebest]

The big elephant in the room that nobody wants to talk about is the political movement (particularly islam) that wants to destroy all that is Western. You could see how uncomfortable Carol got, when Micheal brought up the nightclub shooting and the connection to islam. She champions women's rights and easily recalls the plight of women throughout history. It would have been interesting to hear her views on the co-opting of 'feminism' by American islamofascists.

[@ForeverBleedinGreen]

First, Islamic people are not our enemies. In fact, we have no enemies except for those our 'leaders' have concocted in the past, such as the CIA-fabricated 'Al Qaeda' and the latest bunch of boogeymen, 'ISIS', who they can't even show us a picture of. Second, to those who WILL trash-talk this comment I will say just one thing: research cognitive dissonance. Why? Because you got it, and the only cure for it, is to seek, learn, and most importantly, accept the truth in the fact that our government and big business are intentionally driving this nation into the ground as you read this.

[@MichaeldeSousaCruz]

Michael Shermer needs help. Anybody?

[@zacharysbrennan5376]

Boring interview.