Navigating the PJ Pipeline with Nic McKinley

[@jollypirate23]

I am a former United States Air Force Combat Search and Rescue Flight Engineer. All my hours were in the HH-60G Pave Hawk. We work extensively with pararescuemen. I remember doing night water training operations with these guys in the open ocean on low illumination nights. We would come in low and slow (10 feet off the ocean, no more than 10 knots forward air speed) and helo cast these guys into the water. We would then sometimes go do aerial gunnery (within 2 nautical miles to maintain radio contact and return immediately if something went wrong) and after an hour return to pick them up. So for an hour or more, these guys are in the open ocean, at night, conducting patient medicine and movements while treading water wearing fins and helmets with IR strobes attached. We would come pick them up after throwing out chem sticks from both sides to form a "lane" for references. We would start by throwing out a 15 foot rope ladder into the ocean that was weighted on the bottom. They would climb up, get in the cabin and we would be on the go for the next iteration which would be a 30 foot fast rope infill right back into the black water. On the next pass, I would hoist them into the helicopter under night vision goggles from 40 feet. The entire time I am trying to get the the hoist cable hook into their outstretched hands, our helicopter is beating them in the face with ocean spray. Once I would get them in the helo, we might do this whole sequence two or more times. Helo cast, rope ladder, fast rope, hoist. They never even looked tired. The mental and physical fortitude to be that competent in the open water is something I can't even begin to comprehend. In Afghanistan under the call sign Pedro, we would fly with them to points of injury to pickup seriously wounded individuals. I watched them from no more than an arms distance away perform trauma medicine by nothing more than a small pen light in the back of our blacked out helicopter, sometimes while taking rocket propelled grenade fire. They call the pararescuemen pipeline "Superman School", and those very few who are permanently awarded the maroon beret are indeed, supermen.

[@vandrosia]

What about great white sharks swimming at night?

[@a7x91]

@@vandrosia what about them?

[@nonacdesign]

@@vandrosia Yeah, poor guys having to be in the water with PJs

[@Contractnik]

Wow. Amazing.

[@laurencealvarado9958]

❤

[@AllanSitte]

"These Things We Do, That Others May Live" Says it all about PJs. They have a purpose everyone can understand, related to, and appreciate directly.

[@Thebootstrapped]

One job i knew from the start i could never do. These guys are amazing and never get enough respect. made my day running into one of these guys. Screw meeting celebrities id rather sit down with a PJ and listen

[@kmessiah1]

Finally some air time for USAF. I was TACP for 10 years til I was medically discharged. Nice to see AF Special Forces get some spotlight

[@StayHydrated-wd5ic]

Any tips I’m training for The tacp Pipeline.

[@georgewashington7982]

Bro called it special forces kinda sus you were a tacp

[@okievet]

​@georgewashington7982 thats exactly what I was thinking.. dudes full of shit.

[@musafa101]

@@georgewashington7982agreed

[@Mango10449]

“Air Force Special Forces” I was a an Aircraft Armament Tech and I know this is bullshit.

[@leftyjedi1970]

Went to Airman Leadership School with a PJ. We PT'd together one day doing laps in the base gym pool. He swam 1.5 laps for every 1 of mine to start and then kept pulling away from me.Crazy fitness. Salute to all PJ's, Combat Controllers and Air Force SF.

[@prisonfinger]

I thought the swimming would be easy since I grew up on the ocean, nope, I washed out first day,

[@214bands8]

@@prisonfingerdid you practice a lot?

[@prisonfinger]

@214bands8 no I thought it would be a piece of cake got half way thru and it was harder than i thought and gassed out

[@Bloo22]

FINALLY a PJ video

[@ByronJames7]

Washed out of combat dive a year ago and everything obviously he is saying is spot on the water confidence training and selection and pre-dive is brutal and the number one thing that gets guys in the front end of the pipeline is water con.... and it's not always the best swimmers that make it through it's usually guys who are at the bottom half of the top third tired in the selection class.... and even if you make it through selection there is no guarantee that you will be selected at the end... it's not about surviving selection but thriving in selection

[@jmat7000]

Getting into selection in of itself is ballsy and something most people cant say. good luck to you and if you get to go again apply the lessons learned and keep your head up

[@focusedfowl8981]

I was a PJ stationed with Nic and worked together on several missions. As our careers progressed, he went to the Agency and I commissioned as one of the first Combat Rescue Officers...Years later, I commanded the rescue/extrication team dedicated to Nic's OGA team during Unified Protector. I can attest to everything Nic stated in this interview except one...PJ's could operate unilaterally as Guardian Angel Teams in the years after Nic left the teams. Today, the USAF is building AFSPECWAR teams to unilaterally accomplish it's missions in multiple domains. Great Interview, Mike and well done Nic...That Others May Live and Return With Honor

[@StarWarsObservation-vs2sg]

Do CRO's get to be trained as technical rescue specialists like PJ's are?

[@focusedfowl8981]

@@StarWarsObservation-vs2sg Yes they do, SWO. The exception is Paramedic. In lieu of, CRO training focuses on Planning, Command, Control, Intelligence.

[@Ace_Finance1]

Before you came a PJ did you have a background in sports? And how were you able to push through that grueling training when others quit?

[@focusedfowl8981]

@@Ace_Finance1 No, but I did surf, skateboard, scuba dive and parachute. So, I had water confidence which as it turns out, was THE critical skill . The USAF trains you to accomplish the rest. Most notably, they will push you to perform at a higher level than most can ever push themselves.

[@markharbour7469]

Working with others makes you good. Training others makes you better. Being a humble warrior makes you best.

[@raymondjoseph7177]

When i first got to my unit in the army we had an old guy working at the building. RET CSM 5th group in Vietnam. Spent his entire career on the teams, did 5 tours. Quiet guy but would talk to me, just a PFC. Was told by my senior NCOs he liked me and i was lucky to have his ear and advice. I figured it was the cigarettes lol. I asked him once who the best of the best are and his comment always stuck with me "The PJs are the best SF in the world. True rambo trauma surgeons. When shit hit the fan, 2 guys are down and you're in the middle of no place. They'll get you home to your family. They're the best." I didn't know of the PJs then. Looked them up when i got home. I'm since retired after 20 years. Supported Delta, 7th SOG and the PJs in the stan. They were all great guys but the PJs were always nice to be around. I would think "no better guy to have next to me then a couple of PJs. If i get shot, they'll take care of me."

[@bradbarton8087]

Kudos from a former A.F. medic (not P.J.) that is the best compliment anyone could get.

[@greggwilson492]

Always good to see a Mike Force Podcast pop up in my notifications. 🎉

[@mattz2900]

@Mike Force / Glover. F*****g brilliant. Thanks for this video. The PJs are amazing. Like angels. “I have control!!” F*** yes!!!! “End up saving this guy’s arm.”……. “this is why I am here”

[@xArtoriasTheAbysswalker]

I tried to be a PJ myself and couldn’t even make it to the point of quitting at Selection. Dealt with an enormous amount of admin bullshit because of my time in Marine Corps Reserves. But I got to be in Development for nearly 2 years and got a small taste of what those guys have to deal with. I have two buddy’s from T3I made it all the way through the pipeline. One is a Controller and the other PJs. Bad Mfers those dudes.

[@christopherhazell420]

Are you still in? What do you do now?

[@Jun-eo8ky]

I remember back in 1997. Went to Navy recruiter asked him about the SEAL poster on the wall. He literally said go home get your sister’s red lipstick and put a red circle 🔴 on your forehead because that’s what a bullet wound looks like. Than went to Air Force recruiter next door asked about PJ poster on the wall sounded really good. Than the Marine recruiter sold me a bill of goods and I signed an open contract and became a poge or diary clerk. Man I always wondered if I had the stubbornness and no quit to make it. Glad you both made it through everything God has a purpose for you both.

[@boburwell9921]

Met an old PJ in jail. Dude looked like a wizard and had card tricks that rival Chris Angel

[@MansaMusa-v5q]

😂😂😂

[@gew9487]

PJs truly dedicate their lives to save others. Great men!!❤❤❤

[@russelldaily2275]

Proud to have a family member who is a current PJ.

[@tuckerfamily4]

Thank you for saying this

[@deepbludude4697]

Good PJ story!

[@mk-xe2cd]

Truely excellent. Thanks.

[@RoloDacat]

My son went in around 2013 when it was still brutal-especially Dive. He was a surfer kid from Socal and he excelled in the pool. Would tell us so many stories of huge cornfed boys from midwest that could not get past the pool. He loved the Halo and thats where he got hurt the worst. He absolutely loved Dive-Got is bubble. Went through SEER-loved that. What finally got him was actually the medical test-he was always a C+ student in high school and like i thought going in, he just could not pass that final test. He has some wild stories of doing field meds in ABQ. I hear its completely different now they were just nuking these kids for so long and hardly any were actually getting their beret. Now you get LOTS of help! Great discussion, cant help think the early days guys were real monsters, not so much now like the rest of special forces.

[@StayHydrated-wd5ic]

It still sounds brutal. All the random injuries people get in these selections was an eye opener for me.

[@Mango10449]

2013 when it was still brutal.. 😂 cmon

[@FIGGY65]

@@Mango10449My brother observed their their training in 1986, in Texas. He still is in awe of their conditioning/training .

[@rpdx3]

I went to PJ Indoc school in 2000. Blew out an ear drum during Indoc, but never quit. 😂 Was a sh*tty swimmer… did Masters Swimming and worked out 3 or 4 times a day for a year before that. Fond memories. 😎

[@hyperobelisk9593]

@@rpdx3 did your ear drum exploded for not equalizing properly? I’m concerned it might happen to me lol, my left ear drum struggles a bit when pushing air 💀

[@Somewhat_Damaged]

Mikeeeee where did you get that jacket brooooo

[@M77775]

Patagonia

[@Tomhawk3]

Dedicated high ready was probably the dive team.

[@buck3336]

If the Airforce special operations units work so well and or do everything that other branches can... why not just have PJs, CCTs and other elements in the Airforce just make their own Teams to go do missions? Just real curious as to why the Airforce decided to Become the Help or extra hand type of thing.

[@MansaMusa-v5q]

Because we’re in the air other branches are foot soldiers but now the AF has a tactical (ground unit) think it’s called special tactical

[@John-or9ccUndauntedRaceCars]

Because then the Air Force would have to let the Army fly attack jets. Basically, everybody stays in their lane for the most part.

[@mountaingem6]

No one is saying or claiming to "do everything that other branches can", we have a defined role that is an asset to teams we may be imbedded with. A USAF CCT, PJ, TACP or SR may not be needed on a particular mission but if the mission or situation requires it they are great to have on a team. They may save a life, a team or a mission with their access to firepower, communications, rescue and medical capabilities. Your part of a team that is there to succeed.

[@AndrewGasser]

I love PJs - they just don't understand failing.

[@aisforaaron]

3rd comment also??? 🤷‍♂️ anyways I needed to hear that it’s no standard to be a civilian. That was like a slap in the face and brought me to a place. Thank you guys for how you’re articulating these things. I think I get what your saying, I hope so anyways.

[@mrbigw100]

Mike can we get John Stryker Meyer from MACVSOG on the joe Rogan podcast while he’s still with us he wants to go on but dosent know how to

[@scottmartinez8723]

Our Team Leader used to be Army Golden Nights

[@RahimLadhajuma]

Love this 🎙️

[@kenshindoman9757]

I watched on some other KZbin video that a PJ who was part of a SEAL team for a while was treated like crap by those guys at first. I would've thought that any team taking on board a PJ for a while would have a great deal of time and respect for them, but these guys apparently looked down their noses at him and some wouldn't even speak to him. I get that experiences vary, but is there any truth to any SOF team not really welcoming having a PJ with them? And if so, why would that be?

[@CertifiedClapaholic]

Beign Air Force, we have a reputation of being soft. Chair Force is a very common term that's slung around derogatorily and sometimes lovingly. If SEALs are acting that way, it's likely one of two things, either pure ignorance of the Air Force's SOF capabilities or if they do know about the USAF SOF capabilities, they are extremely jealous of the PJ's capabilities.

[@keenynthewise]

More then likely it’s the fact that their mission is to seek and save not seek and destroy like seals as opposed to Air Force air combat controllers who are always implanted in seal teams.

[@jeffg3975]

In my experience, every SOF team had their own unique culture. The SEALs always welcomed me with open arms. Same with the MARSOC and ODA studs. I only had issues with Ranger leadership. Those guys went out of their way to push me aside. They also had an air of superiority about them which I always found amusing. Anyway, like Nick said, if you were professional and good at your job then the di@k measuring only lasted for a day or two.

[@CertifiedClapaholic]

@keenynthewise PJs have extensive weapons training and are fully capable of destroying anything a SEAL would need to destroy in order to rescue and evacuate.

[@scottmartinez8723]

I miss the pool 🤷🏻‍♂️

[@AaronAustin-d9i]

That time Dave Bautista interviewed some dude about pajamas

[@TEM1]

No, Mike

[@KGSpradleyAuthor]

Nick!

[@abbynormall207]

ROFLOL. „cia = accident prevention“. LoL. 😂. Riigghhhttt

[@ericthomas9915]

[@scottparish6666]

TOML

[@Logan2070]

Didn’t the PJs get lost on one of those ultimate races....

[@adambeley227]

No, that was a Marine. Someone put yellow and red crayons on a trail for them.

[@aisforaaron]

1st comment

[@Logangil515]

Holy shit 2 mins in please wear headphones so you know when you’re talking over him, or even better, don’t HOST a podcast and literally talk OVER your guest as he’s talking.