Mindscape 257 | Derek Guy on the Theory and Practice of Dressing Well

Patreon: / seanmcarroll
Blog post with audio player, show notes, and transcript: www.preposterousuniverse.com/...
Putting on clothes is one of the most universal human experiences. Inevitably, this involves choices; maybe you just grab the cheapest and most convenient clothing available, or maybe you want to fit seamlessly into your local environment, whatever that might be. But maybe you choose to dress more consciously, putting a bit of effort into crafting a personal style and creating a desired impression in others. Derek Guy has, to his own surprise, become well-known as the menswear guy on Twitter. He has put a lot of thought into both the practicalities of clothing (how to find a suit that fits) and its wider social impact (how fashion acts as a cultural language). We talk about both sides of the coin.
(Picture is not Derek, but rather former US Attorney General Elliot Richardson, whose dapper image Derek uses as his avatar.)
Derek Guy is a fashion writer living in San Francisco. He blogs at Die, Workwear!, and contributes to a number of publications.
Mindscape Podcast playlist: • Mindscape Podcast
Sean Carroll channel: / seancarroll
#podcast #ideas #science #philosophy #culture

[@jonathanbyrdmusic]

I love the idea of not trying too hard. It reminds me of a well-worn Japanese story of the gardener who meticulously raked his garden path, then shook a few branches to make it look natural.

[@ilikenicethings]

I didn’t think that I’d want to listen to this topic at first but started listening to it anyway. I kept listening and listening all the way to the end and I’m glad that I did.

[@anth2]

Sprezzatura. Sprezzatura. Just here to say that word! Great conversation, thanks Sean and Derek

[@KirkpatrickSounds]

Well this one caught me by surprise - I'm an avid mindscape listener and, by some complete coincidence, just started following Derek on Twitter yesterday evening. Couldn't believe my eyes when this just popped up!

[@Bullypulpit]

The definitive study was published in 1983 by Gibbons, Hill, and Beard who demonstrated that every girl crazy bout a sharp dressed man.

[@scrubjay93]

@@jimmybaker4821 Not true - my dad was born in 1924 and his casual dress was the same as described in this video - Dockers chinos and a blue chambray oxford shirt, plus a variety of sport coats for slightly dressier. I still wear the same Levi's 501s I have loved since the 1960s. Classic dressing is timeless.

[@scrubjay93]

I can see why many regular viewers might not be interested but I found it a very good guide for being a well-dressed man. Reminded me a lot of how my father dressed - born in 1924, WWII vet, college-educated and VP of a small family business. His everyday casual tended to be Dockers chinos and a blue chambray oxford and that is what my mom chose for him to be buried in. Also Levi's 501s, which I grew up in as a girl in the 1960s and still live in today in my 60s, lol. My Swiss grandmother, born in 1900, was a live-in seamstress for Ludwig Wittgenstein's sister in Vienna as a teenager and traveled with the family to the USA around 1920, then ended up staying in America when they returned to Europe some months later. My mother was also an accomplished seamstress and sewed me many fine clothes growing up. I remember my first plane trip with my parents to Mexico in 1974 - mom made me a pastel seersucker pants suit for the occasion and my dad took me up to the cockpit to meet the pilot before our flight. Those were the days!!

[@HarryNicNicholas]

twice in one day i've been able to say "brundlefly"

[@jonathanbyrdmusic]

This is amazing. Thanks for not staying in your lane.

[@dukeallen432]

Thank you Sean for spreading the knowledge.

[@odinata]

What knowledge is in this video?

[@kishoreacharya9384]

Can you get Dr Peter Attia

[@nashitaha5961]

I dress up for personal pleasure and to cheat on my older age. Great episode, thank you.

[@mikethek5494]

Fred Astaire wore a tie as a belt: Of course he WAS Fred Astaire of whom Mikhail Baryshnikov said, "Fred Astaire is the most influential dancer of the 20th Century". Mr. Astaire was the ONLY Hollywood "type" who was admitted to the upper circles of Polite Society - May I also point out that they stopped wearing powered Wigs in British Law Courts a few years ago. Sen Fetterman did wear a suit when he was Speaker Pro-Tem of the Senate...

[@luizarthurbrito]

I absolutely loved this episode. Been following this guy for a couple of years, now. Putting thought into clothes is too underrated in the nerd circle. I've always thought how silly it was to not care about clothing at all being seen as rebellious or intellectual or anything other than boring.

[@mikethek5494]

The Rule is: you dress for whom you want to impress. Job interview: a dark suit; an audition for Black Sabbath would require something else. Actors have dressed as the part they are auditioning for, in order to add effect.

[@dukeallen432]

Dress as you please unless you are selling or buying, then adjust if need be. Done.

[@mikethek5494]

Good advice mr. Guy, but it's too late for me... I am Sartorially challenged! They seek him here. They seek him there, His clothes are loud, but never square... It will make or break him so he has to have the best. He's a dedicated follower of fashion.. Oh, yes he is, Oh yes he is. The Kinks circa 1960...

[@publiusrunesteffensen5276]

Okay, you lost me there, temporarily. You can teach me quantum mechanics, but dress code is too difficult a subject for me.

[@leeFbeatz]

❤

[@mcwulf25]

There is one future where I become the best dressed man in this city

[@HarryNicNicholas]

i think you missed a golden opportunity to emphasise the importance of clean underwear, just in case of an accident. call yourself a scietismalistamismist.

[@EWischan]

"Everyone knows what that is." lol I don't.

[@czerskip]

Meanwhile, as a gay man, I couldn't care less about what I wear, as long as it's comfortable & practical 🤣 A fascinating topic, though 🕴️😉

[@aosidh]

Do the different suits actually clock differently? They all look like samey overpriced blue blobs to me. Very American Psycho 😅

[@raginald7mars408]

the more you SHOW the less you know Show Man No Man Nar Cissist Pro Motion

[@bentationfunkiloglio]

A $4000 suit as an investment? Oh, Hell no! I have naturally broad shoulders and a barrel chest. No suit jacket has ever looked good on me. However, an ill fitting suit still looks better on me than the sloppy hoodie shorts combo. My ill fitting suit looks better on me than any expensive suit worn by a short, fat man who thinks his waist line and nipples are at the same location! In Fetterman’s place, I wouldn’t give one single damn if my ill fitting suit became a topic of conversation.

[@pinkfloydhomer]

Fashion is random historical accidents. A deep discussion about the evolutionary roots of fashion and of how it affects groups and hierarchies would be interesting. But this podcast episode is not that. In this episode we just get an unexplained value judgment on clothes, some are apparently "better" than others and more "correct", even though all of this is random historical accidents and random human decisions, not deeply rooted in anything. The most important mechanism at play seem to be the need to fit in, hence wearing what, by random, society has come to see as normal or nice or whatever, and then the mechanism of wanting to stand out, especially from people not dressing as "well". The random state of affairs, whether some tie knot is "better" than others is not particularly interesting. The tie itself is a weird non-practical piece of clothes. Also, some of us use a lot of money on clothes, but not by the value judgments in this episode, but rather expensive quality practical clothes for different kinds of activities, weather, hiking, camping etc. Mind you, we are still vain and we still pick what we think looks nice among the quality options that tick the relevant boxes of practicality. But at least these clothes are extremely useful in various practical situations. When I see a "dressed up" person I am always thinking that they spend a lot of money on something that has a very narrow usefulness, if it's a bit too cold or hot or it rains etc, you're fucked.

[@rajeevgangal542]

Oh nooo..

[@bryandraughn9830]

Ahhhhhh no. No no no no no. No. Bad podcaster.

[@leeFbeatz]

❤