Why you SHOULD use imitation vanilla

[@skypaw1373]

My chef father always told me that pure vanilla was more concentrated and imitation was watered down, so you can use imitation in baked goods where a lot of moisture evaporates, but in non-baked desserts/drinks it’s better to use pure vanilla. In classic dad fashion, it seems he was right for the wrong reasons.

[@Danielle_1234]

In the US most imitation vanilla extract is more watered down unfortunately. ymmv.

[@sheepketchup9059]

@@Danielle_1234 TV tropes enjoyer

[@VitoIsPuffBunny]

I get that, my family homemade ice cream was goated for me for years. But that's because we use pure vanilla extract and we don't cook the ice cream mix. Vanilla bean Hagen daz is the closest approximation to it i can find on grocery shelves in my area. But just like she mentioned in the video my family used artificial for baked goods. We never understood why baking vanilla made artifiacal and pure taste similar but know i now i have proper evidence.

[@trevorgray2287]

I've been looking into the difference between these for a few days now, particularly because where I'm at you can get a huge bottle of "Mexican Vanilla Extract" for like $20. This stuff is apparently regular vanilla extract, watered down, but then has added vanillin. So, it's like half extract, half imitation.

[@nlpascal]

The reason chefs like to use real vanilla in non baked goods is that the heat destroys many of vanillas compounds (there's a lot more in it then just vanillin) but if it's not heated much real vanilla really reveals it's complexity which vanillin just doesn't have

[@Calslock]

A lot of people discussing vanilin oftentimes ignore the fact that there are other aromatic compounds, which really make difference in cold food - THANK YOU for highlighting this!

[@iamagi]

I wish they would have added this to the title since I knew there were a difference but I did not recall the exact reason

[@mavinicesumaljag2023]

It's just like making alcohol, there's different types of beer, wine, etc. But essentially they are all ethanol.

[@travcollier]

@@mavinicesumaljag2023 Yeah, but no. The other compounds are way more important (and just literally a much higher fraction) in beer than the non-vanillin in vanilla bean extract. It is also odd that so many people think synthetically produced versions of flavorings (and other stuff) are somehow worse for health/dangerous. We know exactly what is in those synthetic products, but the natural ones have all sorts of random other chemicals in them. Yeah, that often adds to the complexity of flavor and introduces some randomness which can be interesting/exciting, but it is less consistent and certainly not "safer"

[@Tinil0]

@@iamagi ...the video is less than 5 minutes long though. The title is just a thesis of sorts, it doesn't need to explain everything in the video, and the video itself explains it fine.

[@Tinil0]

​@@travcollier I can't stand the people that think "Natural" is, in of itself, a good thing and "Artificial", in of itself, is a bad thing. Or even worse, the people that act like hard-to-pronounce chemical names somehow imply that it is harmful in some way? I understand it's an emotional reaction to the history of commercial foods and certain companies being shady surrounding food additives, but the FDA (And EMA in Europe) is highly trustworthy and generally speaking, everything that is approved for use in foods has studies behind them examining their safety. That's not a 100% foolproof guarantee that everything the approved won't harm you in any way, but it's a hell of a lot more likely to be right than you or your crunchy aunt's "feelings" about artificial ingredients (Especially in cases like this, where the product is chemically identical whether it is from a natural source or synthetically made(Talking about Vanillin here, not all the volatiles in Vanilla as a whole).

[@jugbrewer]

some of the lignin in wood products like paper slowly changes into vanillin as it naturally breaks down, which is part of why really old books smell so good

[@jakep.6205]

Wait really? That’s so cool!

[@sebaschan-uwu]

Ligma?

[@antimatterg]

@@sebaschan-uwu kzbin.info/www/bejne/kJLdf5V9lJigb6M

[@jamesestrella5911]

Lignin is wood. It’s a saccharide/sugar. But I didn’t know that paper transforms into vanillin as it degrades.

[@jamesestrella5911]

So wood molecules do that. It makes me wonder if the vanilla plant accelerates the process within its living self.

[@pedroff_1]

That's why I love the Brazilian system for classifying these sorts of products: They can either be "artificial", "identical to natural" and "natural" essences, and those terms are protected classes, meaning you have to fill the legal criteria to be able to use in your label at all

[@TragoudistrosMPH]

That's great, we could use that. The US system is a little too simple. Some terms are regulated by the FDA and others are free. Natural is free to use and is meaningless. Organic is a legal term. (A funny example: A woman sold cookies and listed Love as an ingredient. The FDA made her company remove it from the ingredients to avoid confusion. They could have it outside the ingredient list, for marketing, but not that one place haha) (Imagine some sinister/cheap company trying to label something bad as "love" instead in the ingredients list. Not so petty then. Haha)

[@lisasei-leise287]

That’s the same system as in Germany/Europe. However - “natural aroma” may still mean that it is distilled from a fungus “naturally” grown on sawdust :-) So if you really want the original thing, look for “vanilla” and no aromas.

[@b.6603]

Brazil has really great regulation and systems in some areas. We often don't realize it. I myself didn't even think about that before reading your comment.

[@b.6603]

Brazil has really great regulation and systems in some areas. We often don't realize it. I myself didn't even think about that before reading your comment.

[@firelow]

Some people still complain about it tho lol My sister said that it was "identical to natural" therefore "artificial" therefore "bad for you". Maybe I should show her this video.

[@SamChaneyProductions]

The fact that synthetic vanilla flavor is the exact same molecule as the main flavor compound in vanilla is also true for almost all artificial fruit and vegetable flavors. The main thing is that there are tens or hundreds of different aromatic compounds in any given fruit or vegetable that combine to create the natural flavor

[@ANPC-pi9vu]

Exactly! The natural extracts are so much more complex.

[@The1stDukeDroklar]

@@ANPC-pi9vu But if you're someone like me that cannot taste much if any difference, then paying 10x the cost does not make sense.

[@davidtrindle6473]

Doubtful

[@marianocolsin8968]

this is exactly why candies and such taste "like" strawberry or raspberry, but not exactly the same as the real deal

[@Lahorca]

In Argentina, I only found three labels: "vanilla natural extract", "vanilla artificial aroma identical to natural" and "vanilla artificial aroma". This last one is actually ethylvanillin which tastes just the same as vanillin but since it's stronger, you need less. But the molecule doesn't exist in nature, that's why it's not identical to "natural vanillin"

[@Tinil0]

The comment I see above you by Pedro Franca also mentions this system being used in Brazil. Evidently, you guys both use the same three-tiered system! Now I wonder if other South American countries follow suit. I am not 100% sure on this so take it with a grain of salt, but to my knowledge, Ethyl Vanillin is only used as vanilla flavoring in other products here in the US, while the Immitation Vanilla for consumers is usually just Vanillin.

[@willowarkan2263]

@@Tinil0 Don't know. I've only seen artificial and natural in Peru, though finding the latter last time I tried was unsuccessful.

[@maromania7]

Wonderful video. That's exactly why I have a little bottle of pure vanilla extract, and a bulk bottle of imitation.

[@rjstegbauer]

My wife uses "pure extract" for the best chocolate chip cookies. I'll ask her to try the natural or artificial. Maybe we'll be doing the same as you.

[@BoxStudioExecutive]

I just have a small bottle of rum to which I added 3 vanilla beans. $30 of vanilla bean has lasted me for 4 years and counting, and I'm not even half way through my bottle. Buying vanilla extract, period, is a waste of money.

[@thekingoffailure9967]

@@BoxStudioExecutive cool idea! I've soaked peppers in vodka for super spicy shots, never thought of using that method for Vanilla beans. Great idea!

[@Tinil0]

@@thekingoffailure9967 Soaking beans in vodka is pretty much the exact process they use for Vanilla Extract in the first place, so it makes sense.

[@greenmario3011]

The best tasting method I've ever had, which is a bit pricy but makes for an amazing taste - get vanilla beans , score them, put them in a bottle of decent white rum, and let it sit under your sink for at least a month. It has all the flavor of pure vanilla extract plus the natural sweet, butterscotch flavors of rum.

[@levieve7779]

That’s what my mother taught me to do! It’s so delicious

[@valritz1489]

Plus you wind up with a ton of extract. Whiskey is also a great vehicle for it!

[@marstar9410]

It's also very good with a nice bourbon :)

[@pennyforyourthots]

Funnily enough, I'm pretty sure the vanilla note to get from some aged rums and whiskeys is actually the alcohol stripping the vanillin and similar compounds out of the wood. These aren't present in white rum of course since it isn't aged, but I thought that was just funny.

[@gildedpeahen876]

I like this. Vanilla-real bean vanilla-is one of my favorite tastes in the world! Thanks for the idea!

[@RebeccaShores]

This is exactly why I have both in my pantry. Baking is always imitation, but for any whipped cream or ice cream or really anything else that is going to get little to no heat I always splurge and get fancy vanilla.

[@Lillith.]

Buy some beans and vodka. By the time you're out of the others you have cheap homemade vanilla extract.

[@thedudeamongmengs2051]

I wonder about making ice cream with vanilla. Some recipes need to be pasteurized. I wonder how much difference it would make to add the vanilla before or after pasteurizing it. And then what difference it makes between extract and imitation. Could be a fun test

[@Schadrach42]

In my home, we just split the difference and, well, split the difference. There's a company called Molina that makes what they call a "Mexican Vanilla Blend" that's basically imitation vanilla extract with some actual vanilla bean in it - you get enough of the other aromatics to gain some complexity but it's also fairly cheap because it uses way less actual vanilla beans than real vanilla extract by making up the bulk with just vanillin. It's less than $7/liter.

[@saimaxene7090]

THANK YOU FOR GIVING REFERENCES IN THE DESCRIPTION,,, I LOVE YOU

[@ElJosher]

Interesting fact about vanilla in hot and cold situations. I have both vanilla extracts and imitation in my pantry, but always use the extract because I thought it was just better no matter the application. Now I can save the good stuff for uncooked foods and use the imitation on porridges and baked goods. Thanks!

[@danielhenderson7050]

I have pure vanilin(crystal powder) and while it adds a hint of vanilla to some foods, it also adds a bitterness that is paradoxically overpowering and subtle. It does this when you try to add more to achieve the vanilla flavour you are looking for but can never reach as this flavour is so hollow compared to real vanilla. The smell from this stuff vs ground vanilla pods is absolutely amazing. When i open my litttle jar of ground vanilla pods and smell it, I literally cannot help but smile and feel happy. When I smell vanilin, I'm like "....I think it kinds smells like vanilla....maybe." I get the part about the volatility in combination with heat, but I wonder just how much of the natural flavour is REALLY lost with heating. How much is lost with cooking pudding on the stove under 100C vs baking at 180. I am eating semolina now that I made with real homemade vanilla extract and I can certainly taste it. I am sure the vanilin powder would be barely noticeable.

[@Tozzie50]

Me too, i do still taste a difference when i bake with real vanilla. Also cookies are baked at very high temperature in general.

[@81mysharona]

You understand that vanillin is the name of the molecule that is responsible for the flavor of vanilla? That means vanillin is the molecule present in both vanilla extract made from vanilla beans as well as imitation compound made in a lab (as well as naturally occurring in other natural products such as oak). You are using the word vanillin to refer exclusively to the compound made in a lab, but, as the video shows, that is not the case. Vanillin from a lab is the same molecule as vanillin from vanilla beans, is the same as vanillin from wood. It’s all vanillin that is responsible for vanilla flavor. What differs among the three sources is what other compounds go along with vanillin, and it is probably these other compounds you are noticing as tasting different between vanilla extract and imitation compounds.

[@pheresy1367]

So true!! You really only can add a certain amount of vanillin to get the "effect". But, if you try to "amp it up" by adding more, the results are VERY UNDESIRABLE. The bitterness you described becomes the main flavor and the "vanilla" flavor gets eclipsed by it.

[@danielhenderson7050]

@@pheresy1367 yes exactly!

[@jankoodziej877]

​@@81mysharonaIn real life no taste or smell is really made of just one tier of molecule. There are tens, hundreds, someone's thousands of them, that mix up to produce the taste and smell. It's like someone would take just one single component of a perfumes and claimed the perfumes are just that.

[@DarkOverture]

The bee drawing at 0:35 is _amazing_. Just like the rest of the video!

[@VideogamesPang]

I think people tend to assume that "natural" is an indicator of quality, purity, or authenticity, but all it really means is that the ingredients come directly from things that exist in nature, as opposed to being synthesized in a lab from other things. You might assume that if a strawberry-flavoured product says it has "natural colours and flavours" that the flavour and colour of the product comes from strawberries, but it just means the ingredients used for the colours and flavours come from natural sources. A famous example is carmine, a red dye sometimes made from ground-up cochineal beetles, which can therefore be labeled as natural colour. Even if the resulting product is the exact same down to the molecular level, the source ingredients are what determines if it gets labeled natural or artificial. It's likely that the distinction is only made as a marketing gimmick, as a way to sustain traditional industries that would otherwise be massively undercut by synthesized products.

[@deus_ex_machina_]

Traditional industries also keep a lot of folks employed, since no one would bother implementing a method of synthesizing a product that takes more labour than the natural method. Whether continuing to do something less efficient just to keep more jobs is a good use of resources us another matter...

[@superskrub4209]

I thinks it's funny crude oil is never considered a "natural source".

[@macsnafu]

Yeah, but what's weird is that some products made from "natural" ingredients still take a lot of processing to get the end result, and the "natural" tag gives you no indication of that.

[@pheresy1367]

Like natural imitation maple flavor is from fenugreek seeds (in modern times at least).

[@ElusiveZenith]

Very nice video. The heat removing many of those extra compounds that are in pure extract, makes a lot of sense in retrospect. As a side note, it is very easy to make vanilla extract. Just put vanilla beans and white rum in a jar and let it sit for 6 months. Tastes the same as what you buy in the store, if not better, and a fraction of the cost. I have a whole pint that cost me about $30, and that is using grade A beans and a decent rum.

[@UrbanPanic]

Where are you getting beans? $30 would get me 5 or 6 vanilla beans. Or does it just take a lot less pods than I’m picturing?

[@ElusiveZenith]

@@UrbanPanic Apparently this platform doesn't like me saying the company name because my initial reply got deleted, but the big online one with the same name as the rain forest. You can get 10 grade A Madagascar vanilla beans for $15.

[@Dashitishere22]

I thought you were supposed to use a flavorless vodka?

[@FunctionallyLiteratePerson]

@@Dashitishere22 If you want closer to the original flavor, I would suggest neutral flavored alcohols, the higher the proof the faster it will extract. Some rums are more neutral than others, but maybe some like the resulting flavor. Everclear can get it done fast, but sometimes has a bit of a renaming flavor. Additionally, doing it in the fridge can slow down the process.

[@nyxh.7567]

Grade B vanilla beans are more often used for extract, they have less moisture so you need less per the amount of alcohol, and they’re cheaper than grade A. Grade A beans are plump, which makes them great for cooking, but when extracting the flavor you don’t want that extra moisture

[@TheRealBeady]

"No chemical difference" is a little misleading, for all the reasons you mentioned later in the video. There are also byproducts in the chemical production of artificial vanilla that dont have to be filtered out (admittably, in small quantities), so while the vanillin may be the same; the whole liquid you get is certainly not

[@OzzieStorm]

I can see the labeling shenanigans being the result of FDA regulations finding it difficult to deal with an artificial end product that is the exact same as the natural one but not really. Regalrdless, thnx for the very informative vid!

[@Tinil0]

I don't think it's really an issue with chemicals that are identical so much as it is a lobbying issue. Producers of Vanilla Extract spent a lot of time and money protecting their advertising and writing the definitions for the FDA so that they could be protected and force competitors to not fight on a level playing field. I don't think it's entirely wrong of them per se, but this is why food regulations are so complex and bureaucratic.

[@alex_zetsu]

How are vanillin made from the actual beans still not enough to be considered vanilla extract? The arbitrary artificial and natural boundary follows some kind of logic even though it's still. I just don't get why some imitation vanilla that not only has the actual chemical but even from the same plant is imitation.

[@PsRohrbaugh]

I am happiest with a 50/50 mix of natural Madagascar vanilla and Mexican Vanilla. The latter has a very distinct flavor which I enjoy, but don't think is best by itself. The mix provides a nice broad spectrum of flavor which is 10/10 for me, especially in applications like homemade ice-cream.

[@algonice5894]

That Mexican vanilla probably has Vanillin in it

[@chris999999999999]

These days I just make my own vanilla extract. Score two vanilla beans going the long way, cut them crosswise into 3 or 4 pieces so they fit in a small jar, then cover with a pint/500mL of vodka. Let it steep for four weeks and it's usable, but several months is best.

[@rillyjo5810]

Becomes vanilla flavored vodka?

[@chris999999999999]

@@rillyjo5810 No. It becomes vanilla extract that's brown with an overpowering vanilla taste if you took a sip. It has the same relationship to vanilla vodka that fruit juice has to St Croix fruit-flavored seltzer.

[@thomasjunker5415]

I’m one of those people that has always refused to skimp on vanilla. I always go for a high quality extract, especially when making custard and eggnog from scratch. I’m definitely going to try using imitation when it comes to baked goods in the future, though(and maybe do a blind taste test for fun)

[@chairwood]

pls, don't hurt your eyes. your vision is more important than blinding yourself just for a taste test.

[@Rover1309]

@@chairwood I laughed but at what cost?

[@BoxStudioExecutive]

Why buy high quality extract? You can make your own by buying vanilla beans, splitting them open and putting them in a bottle of liquor. Let em soak in there for about half a year and you have the best quality vanilla extract that will last you YEARS.

[@raznaak]

@@BoxStudioExecutive because most people won't want to wait half a year to get what they want.

[@BoxStudioExecutive]

@@raznaak so plan better and try not to be poor?

[@jacktastick]

This is completely true. I was always doing this and didn't know why. I have the natural flavor vanilla that I use for french toast and I have the artificial one that I use for baking

[@nokiot9]

I was about to go OFF on secondary terpene compounds. Thanks for covering it at the end lol

[@tboogz284]

It's a bit pricey to start, but making your own vanilla extract at home using beans comes out really cost effective. Especially given that the beans can be reused practically indefinitely. I bake a lot and usually make about half a gallon a year.

[@Tozzie50]

💯

[@machfassett5749]

My family got vanilla beans while on a short vacation in Hawaii from a place that made actual vanilla (and vanilla ice cream, which, by the way, was *really* good). That was February of 2020. We're still using the same vanilla beans for our vanilla extract, and it's been going great.

[@mastod0n1]

How can the beans be reused almost indefinitely? Does each batch only draw a small fraction of the total vanillin out?

[@alquinn8576]

@@mastod0n1 the yield falls asymptotically towards zero, so at some point, the beans aren't doing anything, but that can take a very long time (many years)

[@mastod0n1]

@@alquinn8576 OK good to know. Thanks

[@jamesyoungerdds7901]

What a great channel - found it by MinutePhysics. I have a well-worn copy of Harold McGee's "On Food and Cooking", every episode of Alton Brown's Good Eats on DVD, and all 3 of the Good Eats books. So this is just right up my alley, thank you for doing this! The science of cooking for a whole new generation 🙌

[@zinnyhasagun]

Thank you for spilling the beans regarding vanilla flavorings!

[@andrewwmitchell]

Huh, thanks. That was fascinating. Useful to know, as someone who's always gone for the extract in my baking.

[@urooj09]

In India in local shops you most see vanilla essence which is basically imitation i think. Pure vanilla extract can be found in big stores or online shops . The difference between both of them can be more than 10 times the cost

[@adoxtnw]

OMG this video was SO USEFUL. I was always feeling bad for buying "fake vanilla". Thank you guys!

[@TheSpecialJ11]

This is true for so many food products, I basically exclusively use fancy aromatic ingredients for low temperature cooking and use cheap for high temperature. For example, I never cook with olive oil, but I love making salad dressings out of it.

[@Onl1neCooL]

Thank you Edmond

[@Adrischa]

I wish there is a patreon version of those videos with you cursing all the time. At least a few videos. So much fun

[@chawndel8279]

This was very helpful, thank you.

[@lordyhgm9266]

A further point, synthesised vanilla contains a portion of ethyl vanillin, which has the exact same flavour but stronger. It can have a mild metallic aftertaste but only in stronger concentrations so use a smidge less either way for the same effect

[@stem_196]

Love this channel!!

[@0Krawm]

sounded good, beside the coloring in your imitation being an absolute nightmare to findout about everytime i eat anything as the coloring E150 in it sends me to the hospital

[@christinacody8653]

I did an "America's Test Kitchen" style test between a generic imitation, "fancy" imitation (Watkins), store brand vanilla extract and "fancy" vanilla extract. I did cookies for a cooked test and smoothies for an uncooked test. The takeaway? Imitation is perfectly fine for baking but keep vanilla extract on hand for smoothies.

[@lauraweiss7875]

I discovered Watkins a few years ago, and it’s excellent.

[@lovetherain3x3]

Thank you Edmond Albius, you did great work❣️

[@Artifying]

This is good timing. I just used the last of my vanilla and need to buy more!

[@hugo.t.]

extracting vanillin from cow poop sounds like something NileRed would do and then proceed to taste it and bake a cake with it

[@WarrChan]

Thank you for this explanation.

[@Anakianaj]

This kinda lines up with what I found over the course of time as well; putting whatever in something you bake is usually alright; haven't found someone who could tell the difference (provided you didn't put too much of whatever concentrated product you used in). If it isn't baked... using a whole vanilla bean makes a huge difference. Biggest difference I notice is with crème diplomate; it just tastes *so* off if I use anything other than a whole vanilla bean.

[@carlblewlan7314]

Thank you, Edmond Albius.

[@vinceoldenhof7117]

Buying real vanilla also supports developing economies like that of Madagascar, where I live. Tourism and vanilla are one of the only significant sources of income here, and a fall in demand for either is the last thing we want.

[@DaGizza]

I agree. The profits of buying vanillin or artificial vanilla goes to wealthy countries and corporates whereas buying vanilla goes to the farmers in Madagascar and Mauritius. The taste of natural is richer because of multiple flavour compounds, not just one, and you support people moving out of poverty.

[@metamorphiczeolite]

Interesting! Thanks, Minute Food!

[@Yupppi]

All this is cool chemically, but there's a couple of reasons I prefer using actual vanilla beans (even though it's weaker in aroma and less cost effective, although it seems like I in Europe get it for maybe half the price or less from US): it's the main source of income for most of people in the Madagascar and their economy revolves almost purely around that. The harvest brings a year's worth of income, but they have to do traditional farming as well to feed their families. Furthermore the processing of the bean is what makes the price tenfold and the profits go to the importer who processes the beans to say extracts. I recall the farmer gets around $20 per kilogram while the processing company gets around $200 per kilogram. Their government was trying to stabilise the market price so the farmers would get reasonably paid, but it backfired massively when the western companies looking to maximise profits turned to buying the vanilla from other regions for cheaper price. And as with every organic source, it has many many more chemicals that enrich the flavour besides that one molecule linked to vanilla flavour. Have you ever cooked vanilla syrup from vanilla beans? That compared to imitation molecule is quite a difference. I'm willing to claim that most people get surprised if they get to smell and taste real vanilla bean aroma when they think that the vanillin sugar or similar flavour products are the taste of vanilla. Which might also play a role with how people use vanilla to describe extremely basic and boring things. In the end this discussion makes me draw parallel to local grocery shopping where the distributor of many local products like milk, meat etc has started auctioning the producers: they have a product brand specific for the grocery chain and as such it gets a lot of push. They extort the producers in the way that whoever offers them the lowest price gets to be the producer for the brand for the time being and increase sales a ton - albeit on a barely profitable price. If the producer doesn't stomp their prices, they get a massive hit on sales. If they do, they get a massive hit on profit. They're in a lose - lose situation where they don't have any reasonable options and the local producers are quitting one by one because they can't sustain their living as farmer anymore. Meanwhile the consumers, as expected, only look in their own wallet and how many iphones they can buy if they save that not at all insignificant money on the grocery prices. They go for the cheapest option saying "it's the exact same stuff in a cheaper package, why would I pay more??" And one more thing the store brands have done is naming the brand "domestic" so people in the store look at it saying "oh this is domestic product, it must be a good thing!" My personal decision was that if I'm in a position where I get to choose from all kinds of vanilla products to bake a delicious cake that has a luxury aroma, I can invest that much every now and then. Or if I can't afford that, I'm in a place where regular cake can do just fine. The decision happened when I was looking at my life and saw all the luxury I can afford but in the end don't need, but I was always saving on things that were somewhat meaningless and didn't make a big difference in the big picture of spending, but where my decision might make a difference for someone else than me. Also I asked myself if things like food that are a treat to myself (I'd be eating bare chicken breast and plain rice all day if the food I ate wasn't enhancing the enjoyment of life) are worth trying to be maximally efficient and compromise in experience and skip the extra chance of feeling good from my decision. All this sounds quite pretentious and like coming from moral highground, so I'll just tone it down by saying this video sparked my thoughts surrounding vanilla and food, but there's no disagreeing that the artificial vanilla flavouring really is better for baking. What a rant just to agree in the end. But real vanilla beans for homemade vanilla syrup with some other spices is awesome in a cup of coffee. Really suggest trying out a syrup with vanilla and cardamom.

[@polythewicked]

I’ll often use a “baker’s extract” which uses components from multiple sources, including some actual vanilla, to mimic the depth of flavor you get from pure vanilla extract. And honestly, it often tastes better. Mine uses vanilla, chocolate, caramel, cream, and oak flavor components. Smells heavenly.

[@rozchristopherson648]

Excellent explanation. Thank you.

[@dawsie]

I have always bought the beans or the vanilla paste which is the seed pulp, I never use it for baking I don’t like the taste that’s left behind, I only use it in my cold deserts and just maybe in my coffee once in a blue moon. When I make my custard I add vanilla paste to it after the custard has been cooked, it gives a better taste to the custard and I love the look of all the specks in the custard.

[@kinggenghis9192]

Lovely video, I wish more people understood this! Well put! :)

[@sjenkins91812]

If you use it often enough what you need is vanilla paste, which is basically just the whole ground up bean into a paste with just enough extract to facilitate flow.

[@doomcheeks]

Thank you for giving me a video to post when people push back when I recommend imitation vanilla. I try to explain to them that it's molecularly identical, but they still think it's from beaver butts and sawdust. I get it if someone likes the flavor of the extra aromatic compounds and alcohol in a fresh food like buttercream. Personally, the artificial has a more pure flavor to me that doesn't mess with the rest of the recipe, and I'm cheap, so I'll stick to the 'fake' stuff.

[@SeekingTheLoveThatGodMeans7648]

There are supposedly only about 300 pounds of beaver behind extract (castoreum) harvested in the whole world in a year, most of which goes into perfumes. It seems unlikely to me that it would be worth using it to amp up synthetic vanilla, even if it could.

[@Chocomint_Queen]

Even if it _is_ from beaver butts and sawdust... like, who cares? It's chemically pure. A shocking number of chemicals most people eat on a regular basis are made from "sawdust", and everyone drinks water that was someone's pee once.

[@dalahast06]

00:47 this is incorrect. In Their natural habitat they have bees that are large enough to do the pollination. Its only the pollination outside this region that is hand pollinated.

[@rileynicholson2322]

I'm surprised you didn't mention probably my top reason to use imitation/artificial vanilla, which is that it's production most likely has less negative impacts on the environment and less reliance on poorly paid labour.

[@jg5755]

And what of the countries, such as Madagascar, that actually rely on growing commodities such as vanilla? Buying genuine vanilla supports their fragile economy.

[@alquinn8576]

@@jg5755 nah, better that the madagascarites be unemployed and starve to death rather than not make enough money by riley's judgment

[@djsgravely]

😂

[@beelzebub3920]

It’s staggeringly annoying how people don’t understand that it doesn’t matter where a molecule comes from; no, your organic, plant derived vitamins aren’t any different from vitamins made in a lab mom

[@Akalilly]

I just buy vanilla beans in bulk, slice them down the middle, soak them in (cheap) vodka in jars, leave them for 3 months in a cool, dark place (like a kitchen cabinet), and voila: vanilla extract. Super easy. Super cheap when you consider the per ounce price, and a nice gift to give friends and family that like to cook.

[@misaonthefly]

Wow videos should be made like this one... so easily expleained and with drawings and all

[@Laeiryn]

"Why is it so much more expensive!" Well you see, one's created in a lab and the other is the stamen of a tropical orchid, so one has a supply problem and is therefore much more expensive. Like most spices throughout history, the more exotic and rare it is, the more it costs to grow and source.

[@Fourestgump]

“Clusterfruit” 😝

[@diablominero]

"wood that's been burned and boiled" is very similar to the process of barrel aging spirits. The inside of the barrel is charred and then left in contact with liquid for long enough to let the flavors dissolve out.

[@MannyXVIII]

Recreating flavours is really like playing the lottery. If you have a flavour that is mostly or even fully one molecule( the latter hasn't happened as far as I know if the original is a plant) then recreating it (even if it is a bit complicated) will yield great and probably cheaper results when compared with the real thing. More often than not though, you end up like the people trying to find the flavour of cappuccino. The scientists had such a hard time nailing down what the composition of this flavour is that they used Chomatography. Chromatography is the science of splitting a mixture of things apart so you can perform tests or even just identify the parts. Usually a specialized sensor at the end of the machine would check for a property of the molecule presented to him and you can identify them that way, but this wasn't enough for the scientists. They added a sort of snorkle to the outlet so one of them could smell what the sensor is identifying. They ended up with the weirdest set of smells that make up the capuchino flavour. I sadly don't remember the details of the lecture, so I don't recall what smells they made out, but I am certain that it was all sorts of smells you would not expect to find in foods.

[@rph_redacted]

that confused / angry bee is the best part about the video

[@Kualinar]

Even in the best case, not everyone can distinguish between the best natural vanilla extract and artificial vanilla.

[@_frostypaw]

You should do a blind taste test of the two types in cold and warm foods!

[@brothermine2292]

Three types were mentioned: artificial vanillin, natural vanillin, and natural vanillin plus the other aromatic molecules found in vanilla beans.

[@Pepli]

Thank you edmund

[@spik330]

The answer to this video, Vanilla is not just a single compound and has a lot of other compounds and flavors in it. Where Vanillin is the primary flavor, imitation Vanilla is basically just Vanillin with out all the other compounds. Selling imitation Vanilla as not imitation, would be like trying to sell honey as honey flavored syrup. Where I live they are total fine to sell Vanillin (imitation Vanilla) labeled as Vanillin, no extra labeling required. With that all said, real Vanilla is great and has a bunch of nice flavors to it, but I would only really recommend it for smaller simpler things like whipping cream icings, as it very easy to over power the background flavors or even the vanilla flavor. For things like baking or fillings, I would actually recommend Vanillin due to is stronger flavor (obviously its cheaper) but the stronger flavor means it doesn't get lost in all the other flavors.

[@deejaydubla]

Fastest subscribe ever. This channel is right up my alley.

[@EmerilHuang]

Would have been cool to talk about how you can make your own extract with the leftover vanilla pods and some liquor. That can make the steep price of beans more palatable for some :D

[@noob19087]

One trick I've discovered is that vibrations help quicken the extraction. Just put the jar on some vibrating appliance (I used an air purifier) and leave it there for as long as you have, it will extract quicker. If you have an ultrasonic cleaner (designed for cleaning jewelry and such) that will work _really_ well.

[@SaheeliRai]

@@noob19087 Any movement should do the trick. In chemistry reactions work faster with more mixing of the molecules. So higher surface area, heat (what would not be great for this certain product) and moving the mixture with stirring or shaking

[@brothermine2292]

@@SaheeliRai : Since Brownian motion and random kinetic energy are ubiquitous, is it more important to increase surface area (by slicing & dicing) than to add artificial motion?

[@noob19087]

@@brothermine2292 Both help, of course, but I'd say artificial motion works even better in my opinion. Though I've ever only tried the 2 in combination, so I can't say for sure. I made an oak tincture for wine making that was supposed to take weeks overnight with the vibration trick. I used dice sized pieces that were toasted and crushed with a mortar. In just an hour it was an amber colour and tasted like whiskey, overnight it was almost coffee coloured with a very strong taste.

[@hustler3of4culture3]

@@brothermine2292 I love Brownian motion from the cream in my coffee

[@robb4044]

Read the ingredients. On a bottle of pure vanilla extract it will say vanilla and alcohol. Imitation vanilla flavoring has a LOOOOOng ingredient list, and it includes propylene glycol. Propylene glycol is used in aircraft de-ice fluid, among other things. I'll just spend the extra and get real, pure vanilla extract.

[@baileyjerman5573]

Why does it matter where glycal is used mahy chemicals are used in many things, glycal is a type of sugar, it's used for de-icing for both it's low freezing point and it's high evaporation point

[@goodman854]

There are many flavonoids in pure vanilla extract that you wont get in imitation vanilla. You can also make extract yourself with vodka and it will save some money but not time, takes 6-12 months. The intimation contains vanillian, not vanilla, the array of things found in vanilla extract that include but are not limited to vanillian. Maybe to some they can not tell the difference but I can tell you I much prefer the pure one. EDIT: You do mention that later in the video but I can tell you right now it's a HUGE difference in cookies despite what you said.

[@DPedroBoh]

Here in brazil labels on products like this have to say it's not the original but can say it's identical to the original. Usually it goes like: contains vanilla flavorings identical to the original. Which implies it's not from vanilla but it's identical.

[@marcosfelipe99mfc]

vanilin is not the only aromatic compound of vanilla beans. if you have ever bought a bean you know that. that's one very valid reason for calling it an imitation.

[@undergroundman1993]

I switched to imitation vanilla during the pandemic because the natural stuff became impossible to find. I wasn’t able to tell the difference, though I use it solely for baking so I’ll probably continue to go with the artificial

[@Joy-zz8wz]

Vanilla has a very distinct, deep taste. Please try vanilla tea. It is worth it.

[@soilnrock1979]

Love your videos, especially the one about crunchyness/crispyness! Quick remark to this video: at 2:38 there's some double bonds missing in the right molecule ;-)

[@brusicor02]

And systematically forget the H of the aldehyde.

[@soilnrock1979]

@@brusicor02 Oh, didn't even notice, good catch! - could have been a methyl in theory, obviously I didn't check the whole molecule :-) To be perfectly honest, I find it kind of disappointing, I hate 'scientific' errors in 'science-videos'! :-/

[@rJaune]

Thank you, Mr. Albius! And thank you, MinuteFood!

[@Drmikekuna]

I learned this vanilla secret a few years back, but my wife and kids insist on buying the extract stuff. I think they have been influenced by all of the cooking shows that laude the "complex flavor" of vanilla. Great video!

[@somerandomperson6511]

No, actually, a lot of people can taste the difference. Dip a bit of fake vanilla extract on your finger and real vanilla extract as well and taste it, the fake shit tastes mild as hell

[@cyrosgold7]

You could also go to the Ethnic section of most supermarkets and find cheaper pure vanilla in the hispanic section. It also comes in larger bottles.

[@horrorhotel46290]

The idea that all secondary flavour compounds of the vanilla bean leave your dish when subjecting it to high heat only held true if none of those compounds reacted with any of the other ingredients in your dish, didn't dissolve into the lipid fraction and didn't form any azeotropes or weren't complexed, which is an oversimplification that doesn't hold true. Even if that were the case, foods such as dough etc. tend to self-insulate leading to a different core temperature than the exterior, allowing some of the compounds to remain inside parts of the dish. They might also trap forming gases/vapours (that is how bread rises after all) inside the product, allowing them to condense again when they cool down. Chemically there will always be a difference. Now if that difference translates to a superior tasting product is a different discussion entirely, and that is up to each individual person to figure out for themselves

[@DanielleStarks]

Thank you Edmond!

[@Mykasan]

interesting as always. thanks.

[@ethan-loves]

Wow, fascinating! I wonder how the other aromatic compounds in vanilla beans affect the flavor.

[@ferociousmaliciousghost]

Not too much. That's why we have vanilla extract, but we can't get anything like roast beef extract. Not only does it sound gross, but there are so many chemicals that cause the smell and flavor that it would be very hard to even try to emulate it.

[@sciverzero8197]

You've missed an important point. Vanillin is only ONE molecule that contributes to the flavor of vanilla, and it does not cover all of the flavor complexity of vanilla. For quite a lot of applications, vanillin alone is probably sufficient to flavor your food, but for some it will produce a very flat and artificial seeming food. What's more important than knowing chemicals involved is knowing the chemistry involved. Vanilla, when heated to specific temperatures, can lose many of its flavor notes leaving only vanillin behind, however when not heated beyond that point, and not sustained at nearby temperatures for too long, you can taste a noteworthy difference between the vanilla natural, and the pure vanillin. Its the same reason sugar alcohols and corn syrup don't taste QUITE identical to cane sugar, or why processed sugar and brown sugar taste extremely different. There are literally _thousands_ of chemicals that contribute to the flavor of something, and a single synthesized chemical is not necessarily sufficient to replace the real grown plant in a recipe... However, it might be. I'm NOT saying "real farm raised is always better" I'm simply saying that both "natural is better" and "artificial is identical" are completely and utterly false statements and people should stop trying to oversimplify things. Its not as simple as "this chemical is all that matters." Its not as simple as "natural grown is better." They ARE different products, and one of them is inferior in some applications, while being superior in others.

[@rockspoon6528]

They're "artificial" or "imitation" vanilla because they're imitating vanilla. That they contain vanillin is irrelevant, because vanilla is more than vanillin.

[@xemmyQ]

i never use anything other than vanilla paste. all the flavor, PLUS the little seeds inside the pods for a texture and flavor experience

[@TeacupTSauceror]

love how vanilla markets itself as "hand-pollinated" like it's special when that's just how you grow vanilla. this is my artisinal bee-pollinated carrot

[@berangereduquesnoy5780]

Love you videos

[@romainquintosol4575]

Great video, I'll definitely follow your advice! Let's not forget that Edmond Albius got rewarded with not being a slave anymore, and nothing else!

[@LordPhobos6502]

I was always warned to use vanilla extract for making icecream, to never cheap-out. Now I know why vanilla essence is fine for baking, but not the best for icecream. Thankyou! 😊

[@Danielle_1234]

In the US vanilla extract varies quite a bit in flavor. I don't care if it's artificial or not, I just want it good tasting. Unfortunately the only way I've found to tell how good it is is to buy it and try it out. What I've found more times than not is the real extract tastes better even in baking, not because it isn't artificial, but because it's less watered down. For whatever reason in the US most of the artificial vanilla extract I can find is watered down. Also, maybe it's just me, but I prefer vanilla extract for making ice cream and custard over vanilla bean. They're two different flavors and I both enjoy, but I just like the extract a slight bit better. *shrugs*

[@LFTRnow]

That was interesting. I wondered how I was able to buy a large amount (about a liter or 2) of vanilla for little money when it was listed as "natural". Makes so much sense now. Thanks! (I'm keeping and using it, it is great, I just wondered why it was so cheap when I thought it came from the beans)

[@w5527]

From my personal experience I can tell the difference between pure vanilla extract and imitation in baking. I had one of my coworkers make me the same thing with h the vanilla being the only difference and it was very apparent which was which. It was blind too so I couldn’t see anything nor did she tell me which was which. That’s just my experience tho

[@no_rubbernecking]

This sounds like another situation like the diamond industry, in which they intentionally limit the production of an otherwise plentiful product to maximize profits. Creating a perception of scarcity is enough to get most people to pay a lot for something.

[@MermaidMakes]

I'm surprised you didn't mention that the majority of synthesized vanillin comes from crude oil. Or if you did, I missed it. I wonder if the world eventually switches to solar as our main form of energy, would imitation vanilla prices go up because of this? Also in the US, once something is labeled as synthetic or imitation there aren't as many regulations they have to go through to source the materials so it's a possibility that trace amounts of compounds or molecules from the synthesization process could enter and the FDA would not require them to be labeled. So even though the molecules are identical, sourcing them from petrochemicals could have a detrimental effect on health. If it doesn't effect an individuals health, then they can tolerate it and be fine, but studies have even found that for a few people, these molecules derived from petrochemicals could triggers allergic reaction and headaches where natural vanilla would not. If people want imitation I think it's important to consider that you may want to make sure it comes from sources like rice instead of crude oil.

[@tristang8929]

as the old song says "I like vanilla, it's the finest of the flavours"

[@tedweeke9988]

We make our own. We’ve practically quit using straight vanilla and have adopted our recipes to either rum based or bourbon based. We use Kraken 94 proof for the rum and Elijah Craig 94 for the bourbon. Way better than any commercial vanilla.

[@witheld4975]

Vanillin is the primary taste of vanilla- but it’s not the entire flavor profile of real vanilla, and they are distinguishable. That being said I mostly use vanillin.

[@TheKickingDonkey]

Thanks Edmond!

[@homecookingwithtom]

This was surprising to learn. I would never have guessed that the imitation vanilla has the exact same vanillin molecule as the "real' thing. Thank you!

[@brenorocha6687]

"Vanilla extract is no the same as sintetic Vanilla, but I don't agree that they need to be sold with different labels."

[@brendawalton2518]

Thanks for the money saving tip!🍦