2. Falling In Love

MIT 6.868J The Society of Mind, Fall 2011
View the complete course: ocw.mit.edu/6-868JF11
Instructor: Marvin Minsky
In this lecture, students discuss Chapter 1 of The Emotion Machine, covering topics such as love, infatuation, and the Self.
License: Creative Commons BY-NC-SA
More information at ocw.mit.edu/terms
More courses at ocw.mit.edu

[@SeanGuyDude]

27:45 he looks so happy that someone laughed at his joke😂 Totally lit up! And that in turn - makes me happy. 🤗

[@CarlosSantana-hu8nm]

Finally a class I can sit in , pretend i understand what’ he’s talking about , dose off, fall asleep, and come back tomorrow night and do it all Again without worrying about taking a midterm on the subject 😂

[@kirstinstrand6292]

This is called life 🤔😆

[@GrahamBessellieu]

2:12 ~ Sea of Mental Mysteries 11:30 ~ Ways to Think 31:35 ~ Six Layers Theory 51:30 ~ Self-Representation 1:17:00 ~ Number Forms 1:28:46 ~ Minsky Humor 1:30:10 ~ Cyborgs

[@dadaimiza]

Graham Bessellieu Thank you.

[@cleo6205]

Ty

[@michaelqiu9722]

???

[@gabymaliqilic]

謝謝課代表

[@imperialeagle564]

Goddamit those are some timestamps

[@charlesburger7973]

I am a lay person, and I am soaking this man up like a sponge. My brain is enlarging.

[@nopenope1834]

Mind* If your brain enlarged you would then have nasty migraines at the least...tumours even and potential death. I'm glad you are learning though!

[@charlesburger7973]

@@nopenope1834 ha ha. Touche'

[@kirstinstrand6292]

Where have you been, all your life?

[@nopenope1834]

@@kirstinstrand6292 me or Charles?

[@JesseAdamson]

Very interesting ideas. I bumped the speed up to 1.5 x and it's awesome!

[@cancoteli9669]

Jesse Adamson You are the man !! I was wondering about how can i enhance the quality of these marvelous lectures !! Thanks for the tip ! :)

[@avok23]

Jesse Adamson I watch all videos at 1.5 until an Indian appears then 0.5

[@zehsawa]

Thank you

[@joshuahoward3337]

If I ever go to MIT, I’m bringing of a bottle of water for the professors 😂

[@brandonml141]

fr man he sounds like he's malfunctioning

[@pkhtr]

Minsky as a researcher: 10/10 Minsky as ASMR: 10/10 Minsky as a historian and sociologist: *tips fedora* /10

[@MrGNX456]

The last 5 minutes Marvin talks about issues that we are experiencing now as a nation.

[@jeremyherring8164]

Re westeered

[@ladygreenlife]

Yes, it also explains the Muslim ban, doesn't it?

[@davidnoonan7893]

Yep, it’s the end of the world just like the Bible told us…. Every prophecy is coming to pass🙌🏼 Jesus is King and Lord😁

[@0ptimal]

I don't always agree, but I like this guy. How his thoughts branch out, and he has some really good insights.

[@Diego38425]

How do you not agree?

[@iamenta103]

Like at the very end when explained why we need the electoral college. Then he wondered if “the new social networks” with their instant feed back “which is what Hitler got” are getting dangerous. He said it’s creeping up on us and one day someone might be able to get “fifty million people to do something dangerous.” Dangerous like storm the capitol? Goosebumps!

[@Soulprismatics]

@@Diego38425 some of the things he dismisses became important, later (but though titled as such aren't his vision of AI, that's another intellectual stupidity being hyped ). I have other concerns though. His reasoning towards spiritualistic worldviews are rather funny in face of the multiverse's fine tuning. A missing physical description for consciousness... like for .. dark matter? Only because main religions messed things up, did and incited horrible deeds and never stopped people from religious madness? Should we allow us to derive from human failings that a misused concept is wrong in itself? Misinterpreting a bad application of an idea with the idea of spirit itself is not helpful. Listen a little bit to John Butler, also here on YT, it's quite an opposite point of view. Balancing both views is an artform.

[@_SeaH0rse]

Minsky is a legend

[@YSANROCHEOfficialYoutube]

What exactly do you not agree with? 😂

[@prattcreekart]

RIP, Marvin.

[@toddjohnson2190]

He died? Oh no . . . Maybe the best generation of scientists.

[@billyworkman4204]

I appreciate the conversation leading to better understanding, such talk there's very little of.

[@gerretoutdoors3710]

This dude is all over the place. I love it.

[@IamthatIam97]

great lecture I hear how you are thinking

[@catherinerickard699]

Wonder if there is study on effects of asmr..... this man owns it! He makes so much sense , but I don’t have a clue what he’s saying, how does that work??? I’m totally captivated

[@jazdinojames3250]

His mouth is constantly making the weirdest noises lmao he is the king of asmr

[@simonmasters3295]

I suggest it's because he exudes confidence at slow speed. He also invites participation by asking the audience questions and links his content to popular culture. It's not everyone's taste but in this fast-paced world his delivery is different - Ekhart Tolle and Ram Das come to mind. I think the students realise they have a special kind of genius addressing them. For example "Oh and that mushroom hallucinogen guy" what's he called... ?" (Terrence McKenna)

[@cleo6205]

I am currently enjoying the video as I do my office work. ☺

[@aidahubbard7697]

I am soaking this man up like a sponge. My brain is enlarging.

[@UnconditionalLove777]

Words for thinking: cognizance, consideration, curiosity, criticism, comparison, contemplation, creativity, complaint That's just C words I scribbled

[@AllFormsElectronic]

oi don't forget cunt. The endearing, australian way of course. Ex: u beautiful cunt. (Cuh x nt) Arabic in foundation, but nationless in the modern day.

[@IvarKarm]

I love these lectures here, i can get stoned and have a beer in class

[@erikj2738]

emotion is the sensation of our degree of fulfillment

[@ladygreenlife]

The Persians (3500 years ago) and Indians (2000 years ago) knew the earth was around! Their mathematical approaches are documented. So much so that it is part of their religion. Zoroastrians put a Sour Orange (symbolizing earth) in water as part of their New Year celebrations.

[@daedra40]

- but Marvin is! As well as a great lecturer. Thanks MiT

[@TheCheikh97]

watching this on Valentine's day-my birthday! :)

[@billyworkman4204]

I just think his lectures brings about intelligent conversation rare in our society today.

[@timothydavis2568]

1:42:20 even in 2011 Professor Minsky could sense the trend

[@billyworkman4204]

To had seen the look on Melvin Minsky face when L Ron Hubbard told him, he didn't have time to go through the procedure himself would be absolutely priceless. 😅

[@pianoman5259]

This man's class probably has the lowest pass rates, he's so relaxing he probably puts everyone to sleep

[@ayanotanabe5220]

Getting my pHD soon! Theoretically!

[@mustavogaia2655]

I think I found the limit of my mind: so many people say how awesome this lecture is but the first 30 minutes of it is just a bunch of disconnected facts. I am reaching the first hour and I still dont get what is the point of the lecture. Besides of me being dumb, what I am missing?

[@jaydenp4975]

Fascinating

[@NachoMama7]

Plato and Aristotle studied at Kemet university.

[@fudgesauce]

Around 1:20:00, Minsky is talking about Richard Dawkins in response to a question about memes. Then at 1:24:40 or so, Minsky pokes Dawkins a bit by saying Dawkin's idea is quaint next to all the stuff we've learned about genetics since then. Both statements show Minsky doesn't remember what "The Selfish Gene" was about. I believe the section on Memes is just one chapter, late in the book. The vast majority of the book is about genes, the hard science that Minsky seemed to imply Dawkins was not informed on. The title of the book is also the main idea of the book: that the unit of selective pressure is the gene, not the entire genome (the conventional view). Often times the two viewpoints comport, but Dawkin's gives some examples showing where the gene-centric view diverges from the whole genome view, and how it explains some results that the conventional view has difficulty explaining.

[@ottodetroit]

1:45:20 logic can't make analogies. Perfect ending

[@khasmamad]

Great lecture! Do not be misguided by the title though, it has nothing to do with falling in love xD

[@Silvertestrun]

Ty

[@NothingMaster]

Whatever the sense of self maybe it is directly related to the sum total of our experiences and our memories of them. A person with advanced Alzheimer’s disease is often left with no sense of self. No memory, no identity.

[@kirstinstrand6292]

Alzheimer's happens because tragedy occurs when one's sense of identity is destroyed, unless genetics causes the disease. IMHO.

[@kirstinstrand6292]

Unless one can understand why the experiences happened one still have no identity.

[@YSANROCHEOfficialYoutube]

They just live in a parallel dream world and there is no proof that this one isn’t as real as ours

[@neuroclusterbrainmodel9122]

The ideas presented in Marvin Minsky’s book “The Society of Mind” are further developed in “Neurocluster Brain Model” which analyses the processes in the brain from the point of view of the computer science. The brain is a massively parallel computing machine which means that different areas of the brain process the information independently from each other. Neurocluster Brain Model shows how independent massively parallel information processing explains the underlying mechanism of previously unexplainable phenomena such as sleepwalking, dissociative identity disorder (a.k.a. multiple personality disorder), hypnosis, etc.

[@erikj2738]

soul (consciousness) is a desire - a will to receive fulfillment

[@billyworkman4204]

When speaking on consciousness, Marvin stated that consciousness is sometime meaning that you remember it. I consider consciousness is simple being aware of what you about to do and aware of what you have done. Your thoughts?

[@michaelmoser4537]

Its so hard to make out what the questions are ; gets tiresome to guess from the answers as to what has been the question in the first place.

[@vp5633]

Attend the lecture then. Don’t complain about free education, be better.

[@sam5992]

@@vp5633 Oh yeah, let me just go back in time 11 years, fucking moron.

[@masteryehudi7031]

The claim MM makes at 1:01:30 about probability matching is super surprising. How can the optimal strategy not be to always bet on the higher probability outcome?

[@lukehall8151]

Minsky is choking on the devil's wang.

[@chrislesner2822]

Say you live in a northern region and have "optimized" your entire wardrobe just for warm summer weather. What might happen when winter comes? Will you survive winter with your summer optimized clothing? Likely not. Perhaps being optimal short term is not optimal for long term survival? What happened to all those that used your logic and went all in on Cathy Wood's ARK Innovation ETF once it had reputation for being best? Was it a good idea for them? Why not? Probability matching = diversification. The more optimized you are for current environment the more fragile you are when it changes. Nassim Taleb has a book called "Antifragile" about these concepts applied to life and investing.

[@masteryehudi7031]

@@chrislesner2822 do you have the proof?

[@chrislesner2822]

@@masteryehudi7031That this seemingly sub-optimal behavior exists after millions of years of evolution - how do you explain it? You wanted to know why so I shared with you the best available most sensible explanation. If you doubt that explanation better you do your own research and share with us here your own best explanation. Be sure to bring "proof".

[@masteryehudi7031]

@@chrislesner2822 lol you're an angry person. what you say sounds vaguely plausible. i guess i was interested in the proof that Minsky attributes to Solomonoff. trigger warning: it's still surprising to me 3 years later

[@austinpecchia6623]

anyone know what Robert Sawyer book he's talking about?

[@mathijazzz]

this teacher is dope!

[@nas8318]

I'm going to disagree with most people here. These lectures are of abysmal quality. It's just the ramblings of a highly opinionated man past his prime and with a superiority complex, with absolutely no structure. I highly recommend them as a sleep aid though.

[@kakaman715]

Thanks, that's the conclusion I've already come to. After only 1 lecture! lol

[@sebastianlenzlinger9291]

I love when he says the bit about people criticizing him cuz he proposed to many things because it elevates the mere idea above the evidence for the soundess of the idea. At least in a scientific sense, it seems valid to me(please correct any error in my thinking) to criticize someones opus if it only contains ideas. as long as they‘re not shown in any scientific sense to be more than plausible, in that sense they are useless as real explainations. this doesn’t mean the ideas aren‘t worth considering. any way forgot where Ibstarzed

[@jkst9864]

He confused some facts about von Neumann, who was born in a Jewish family in Hungary, not in Romania or Bulgaria. Prof. Minsky probably took Budapest for Bucharest. And I can't really see how any of these three countries is 'next to the Baltic'... Well, great lecture anyway.

[@ladygreenlife]

Many historical errors. But that's not why we listen to him. 🙂

[@G10293]

this is beyond amazing

[@Nrvous68]

"We're never gonna get two thirds. It's the end of America" (talking about Congress introducing any new amendments to the Constitution in the Social Media era) and he said that years ago before Trump and the effect of Social Media in the 2016 elections. He must be smiling in his grave or in whatever alternate reality he's now. HE WAS SPOT ON RIGHT.

[@pogger4649]

I guess he’s technically not dead.. he’s at alcor. Just waiting for technology to develop just a bit more.

[@elamaru9355]

@@pogger4649 alcor?

[@djtjpain]

@@elamaru9355 “alcor life extension foundation”. Cryogenic freezing shortly after death in the hopes that one day we will be able to clone, bring back, etc dead people, or something like that.

[@elamaru9355]

@@djtjpain oh i didnt know this still exists,i thought it had become obvious it doesnt work coz Unless they can soon revive ,heal and rejuvenate one they offer nothing exceptional Is it W,Disney who did it too?

[@djtjpain]

@@elamaru9355 I’ve heard that he did yeah, not 100% sure. And yeah it seems weird to me but I guess if you have the money, might as well. You’re dead either way lol frozen or not

[@csaracho2009]

Don't shoot me. I just wish Marvin Minsky resembled Star Trek's Captain Jean-Luc Picard.

[@Gforcebond]

Someone told me one time love is a decision not an emotion.

[@LungaMasilela]

Well that person was trying to sound insightful or smart by saying some different but nonetheless he is wrong.

[@Rio-mf7dx]

@@LungaMasilela nah this makes sense. Love is being willing to make sacrifices for someone you care about. It is by no means an emotion or feeling you have towards a person.

[@LungaMasilela]

@@Rio-mf7dx Wrong. Love by definition is a intense feeling of deep affection to someone or something. I may love someone however I take the decision if I want to ask her out i.e act on my feelings of her.

[@Rio-mf7dx]

​@@LungaMasilela What you describe is lust and attraction.

[@LungaMasilela]

@@Rio-mf7dx No it's not what I described is what love is in it's purest form. I sense you are a romantic and you wanna make love more than what it is when it's not. Love is a word we made to describe a feeling not a action

[@dillybug605]

His claim that religious people "don't want to go there" with regards to whom created God, creates an interesting paradox within his own atheistic line of belief. I wonder if he ever considered who, whom or what produced/created the elements necessary to form the universe or universes in the first place? And how long has that been going on? Our minds can't comprehend nothingness, so based on our experience, there must have always been something. Belief in an eternal God is really not much different than believing in an eternal universe. You either choose to believe that their is an eternal mind behind our existence, or you choose to believe that some unknowable eternal force is responsible. It's pretty mind blowing when you start to go down this path.

[@Cinderella227]

Yes, we are physical and spiritual beings. Great lecture. Thank you ✝️

[@jamesfox406]

I’m 40 minutes in and I’m still wondering what this presentation has to do with love 😅

[@ManyHeavens42]

love is a vibration.

[@TimD.Morand]

Is this a misleading title, or am I simply "simple"? 40 minutes in and nothing about the subject title. He's all over the place, but imho not anything about "love".

[@randy7068]

No you aren't. I was just thinking that this guy is all over the place.

[@maspoetry1]

maybe it's the name of the book's chapter

[@liadbaniel1536]

I think 'falling in love' was just a place holder for 'feelings' in general, which he touched on in connection to how the brain works. One slide read something in the lines of...'Is emotional and intellectual thinking really are that different?'

[@ArnesKlisura]

funny guy...he knows it all

[@boorhaave5880]

What does this have to do with falling in love?

[@sebastianlenzlinger9291]

„There are lot‘s of thibgs that don‘t into newtons laws these days“ As a rebuttal for psychologists not to be liky physicists is the best example for how precisely physics as a field evolved precisely because they didn‘t stick to what was before them. I‘m so torn with this guy because he‘s very nice to listen two but (at least these first two lectures) are so little about his theories and more about how ithers where wrong projected onto entire fields. And he used his explainations as a reason to discretit, which is a bit absurd because in the end on all things empirical one may or may not be right. He confuses frameworks of thinking with results of empiricism and it‘s obvious (and good for science as a whole) that many scientiest do studies that end up in a dead end. It‘s better when out there than when not.

[@hegerwalter]

Chapter 3 kzbin.info/www/bejne/aHzFp31pnsajmMU

[@doglover-sv4zi]

We are a spirit we have a soul ( mind will and emotions ) and live in a body

[@StyngRay1]

Mind/ego/personality is not the soul.

[@geraldinemckeogh]

Amen 🙏

[@josephbreeden7011]

Came her to sleep in class but, I’m needing a need pen and note pad because I need to pass this class

[@erikj2738]

mind calculates how to be fulfilled

[@killing2jars]

The 'father of AI' just asked if anyone knew how to make WORD to make it's pointer not to disappear LOL!!

[@billyworkman4204]

A well spoken speaker is an industry, so true.

[@chrisc1257]

Is this a class for humans, or robots?

[@mrmetaphysics9457]

This was a man who did believe in robots so all who believe in him could be one!

[@inchworm9311]

1:41:45

[@JonathanDecelles1990]

The hypnotic devil 😈

[@oldsachem]

Explain the evolutionary advantage of schizophrenia.

[@chrislesner2822]

Full schizophrenia may be a malady but having that trait in small amounts may offer evolutionary advantages. Stanford professor Robert Sapolsky's lectures on this topic may be useful to help you understand. If all you see is what is real you are bounded and somewhat blinded by reality. If you can see things that are not real (as long as you do not lose control) suddenly you can see into potential realities and your creativity can be useful to discover things that do not exist. The machine you are reading this message on and all the machines that moved it from my mind to yours are the products of millions of "crazy" ideas. High intelligence often comes with small doses of madness.

[@larrodaking2729]

Wait his shirt tucked in

[@jesus123510]

rip

[@StyngRay1]

Love? Another epigenetic control mechanism !

[@ElmaN1375]

13:05 heaven

[@AmeerFazal]

This guy knows everything! How come he knows everything?

[@TheRocknrollmaniac]

He does not know everything and neither he should. To be honest his knowledge on anything other than AI, programming, maths is very superficial. Do not get me wrong a guy Marvin does not have time to know that Romania is nowhere near Baltics.

[@MAndre-gk6ye]

@@TheRocknrollmaniac And that ethics is useless, that should have set all the alarms with red lights blinking. Try no ethics to get rid of Nazis. Nope.

[@mrnobody1321]

any cool book on AI these days?

[@colinwar]

This is the secret place in youtube, where ive found a sleep aid, that works every singke time. Haha.

[@reneebaxter9933]

Are you part of the real internet or tjis subnet im only allowed to watch

[@sherwanbarwar4435]

Wich book he explain it ?!

[@mitocw]

Minsky, Marvin. The Emotion Machine: Commonsense Thinking, Artificial Intelligence, and the Future of the Human Mind. Simon & Schuster, 2007. ISBN: 9780743276641. The text is also available online on Professor Minsky’s homepage. See ocw.mit.edu/6-868JF11 for more info and materials. Best wishes on your studies!

[@bobsim8007]

Free will is not an industry you are under control yourself mr professor

[@bobsim8007]

@@earthlingandextra there is something more radical behind all this. School industry, the medical industry, the health industry, it's all in the corruption. I have just found out through one of Jordan Peterson lectures the genocide is apparent. We have proof.

[@bobsim8007]

@@earthlingandextra thank you for your reply.

[@JSprayaEntertainment]

48:00 1. first you dont know if the mind is creating thought or receiving thoughts ..( like a radio ) why can i speak other languages in dreams ? etc... 2. when Lord Ganesh Came to me , ( when i was awake) i had no CLUE who Lord Ganesh was ... so you theory is flawed , in major ways

[@parrotraiser6541]

My inner little voices like this subject. Lorenz has a rather questionable history involving the Nazis, but it doesn't appear to have contaminated his work. Psychology isn't the only "social" science with physics envy; economics has a really bad case. There's an interesting phenomenon, that a good way to learn a subject is to teach it, but if you're a real expert on a topic, it can be hard to teach it to beginners because you know it too well, and can't remember what it was like not to understand it thoroughly. Mathematicians seem particularly prone to it. ("It will be immediately obvious to the reader...."; no, it bloody isn't, that's why I'm reading this book.)

[@atkgrl]

Read more!

[@chrislesner2822]

Stephan Pinker calls the phenomenon you describe the "curse of knowledge" and uses it to explain why so many experts are terrible communicators to non experts. Having patience raising children and dealing with other ignorant people similarly is helped when you are able to see the world from their unknowing point of view - why they do what they do becomes predictable and compassion replaces anger.

[@jm096]

Marvin Minky

[@lukehall8151]

Delightful lecture from a tolerably arrogant zombie!

[@kirstinstrand6292]

Charming absent minded professor.

[@rajatmodi1573]

resources: [1] Aristotles rhetoric

[@stefanomarchesinij7746]

sono in casa sono il live with meeting

[@atkgrl]

22:12 whale song. Exactly as I’ve said for years. We are demanding travel to mars, sending out advertisements and maps to meet and encourage aliens and cannot even communicate with dogs ! Yes we eat even our best friends but still after thousands of years cannot speak their language.

[@mrnobody1321]

who has a theory of that?

[@NeatuOvidiu]

Is the woman who makes those cool theories-questions married?

[@annmargaretruss5089]

+Neatu Ovidiu Not sure--but I'm not! ; )

[@annmargaretruss5089]

Hi Max, I'll be in internet range for at least a few hours. Call anytime.

[@NeatuOvidiu]

If you guys decide to marry please invite me to the wedding. Thanks!

[@AmeerFazal]

How did it go? :D

[@thirtythreeflavors]

Do you have a 3 year old now?

[@mrecrc]

Oo

[@LiamPorterFilms]

Why does he defend Freud? I missed the point.

[@JamesGrahamJames]

Freud's critics accused Freud of never having cured a patient when Freud never claimed to do so; it was random, and they had no basis for the accusation

[@LiamPorterFilms]

Thanks. What criticism of AI does this then correspond to?

[@LiamPorterFilms]

Max Hodges Are you paraphrasing Minsky's defense of Freud or is this your own take?

[@Scootrmacl]

8:27

[@TheRocknrollmaniac]

In the first lecture he gets more into it. The cure does not have anything to do with it. Freud did a great thing to emphasize our unconscious. He is not the first nor last, but he dedicated his life to learning about the unconscious so that is why Minsky mentions him. Minsky knows that our cognitive processes are not all consciois

[@oldsachem]

If the dark age swoops upon us, do we having omens to alert us in advance? Is this an inherent deficiency of humankind/

[@selvamthiagarajan8152]

What has this lecture got to do with 'Falling in love'? Falling asleep yes.

[@redbrick9634]

Interesting, but too bad the topic wasn't covered.

[@nononouh]

4 14 17

[@melissasherpa]

This lecture is completely mistitled. Then, right out of the gate, professor insinuates as dangerous the idea of the soul/self. So why should we vare he likes science fiction but not questions of faith. Danger and faith are not necessarily yoked together. Intellectual arrogance is hubris, where humility is the greater servant of mankind. We living beings are witness of the cosmos and our meaning is what we make, learn, and do. Our creativity and ultimate aspiration are sublime and true. Analysis fails when it postures as superior to that which is analyzed. Emotion, inspiration, talent, bliss and the magic of life and the universe are still not understood. Respect others, their equality and their personal freedom of conscience.

[@cleo6205]

50 minutes in: dogs and cats

[@billyworkman4204]

So why does people believe and proclaim in the the self made man, when true there been so many around him helping him. Isn't that made up?

[@mrecrc]

Oooo

[@hackerhesays731]

use science for self and help others nit end life....

[@chrisleventis488]

Playback speed 1.25. Thank me later.

[@ace6285]

1:42: 56. It easier than that. Just say that a poll has been taken and the majority of voters want Joe Biden to be president and presto, nothing more required if you have the media in your pocket.

[@hackerhesays731]

luffet x tco