Mixers Inside: Omnitronic TRM-222 + TRM-202 comparison

[@DocFUNKist]

This individual is truly brilliant and deserves the utmost respect. Keep up the excellent work.

[@nanmillion]

we concur!

[@fbarrillon]

Great video, man! I just found your channel through a recommendation on Reddit. Working in the music industry designing audio products myself, it's refreshing to finally see a channel that shares REW plots and THD charts instead of highly biased, unfounded opinions. Thanks so much for taking the time to review this new mixer and making this content available for free, for all of us gear enthusiasts!

[@mixersinside]

@@fbarrillon thank you, appreciate your words!

[@zaremba8025]

Lovely review and even more lovely outfit 🐍

[@dubdjnelson]

Always excited when a new video comes out. Thanks for sharing your knowledge and insights with us 😁👍

[@ACCOUNTANTB]

Great Tech reviews about DJ Mixers !! - Im cheking every time you do a new video - Thanks for helping us !!

[@danieleden1856]

Awesome video - love the technical breakdown and numbers.

[@lektroandroid9855]

Gracias por tu analisis perfecto de esta maquina, buen dia!!

[@nvp-music]

Great video again! Would love to see what you make of the popular pioneer stuff like the a9 or v10

[@Piotr64527]

Thanks a lot for this knowledge Kamil!

[@gainstage4497]

Damn I love this channel! Cheers from stateside

[@gabefm1]

Love the review, wish you didn’t have bias with cross faders as I was hoping you would go a little deeper on it. Thank you for making this video.

[@mixersinside]

@@gabefm1 thanks for watching. What are you curious about regarding the crossfader circuitry? It's just a simple VCA crossfader circuit - that's the main reason why channel volume control is VCA based.

[@gabefm1]

@ comparing to other cross faders on the market to predict breakdown.

[@mixersinside]

@@gabefm1 how would you do this?

[@gabefm1]

@ compare parts used in other mixers? Not sure, you are definitely more knowledgeable when it comes to individual components. I am in the difficult position of enjoying analog sound but most analog mixing boards are geared towards people that do not use cross faders. I have to take in to account the life expectancy of a cross fader as in my early years of DJing I had to buy multiple replacements when purchasing mixers as they would eventually breakdown. Maybe it is based in past components and not the reality of newer ones.

[@mixersinside]

@@gabefm1 testing endurance of a crossfader will require to use it for years or build a mechanical tester that will slide it couple of thousands of times and it's too much hassle. Most often you can't judge parts durability just by touching them couple of times. As you noticed i also didn't comment potentiometers used - this mixer was released couple of months ago and time will show how they behave.

[@ObaidliRecords]

excellent work mate

[@Astroboytoy]

Always loved your reviews ....Keep it coming.

[@danielbazaco4397]

Great job! Thank you

[@richardwilsonartwork]

Excellent work! Great video!!

[@lowpitchorchestra]

Thank you..keep making those videos happening!

[@moket123]

Thanks for another great video 👌

[@Skaratak]

Well done! We need videos like that. Subscribed.

[@СтефанАтанасов-у5ы]

Great Job as always !

[@aaronchincano2874]

Man, love this video. gonna watch all the others. Can you help me out with the clicking when filter is engaged?

[@mixersinside]

@@aaronchincano2874 without modification of filter circuitry it's impossible to get rid of the click. It requires PCB redesign.

[@tomasabella452]

👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼

[@ignacykorus220]

Another great one!

[@dedondigital]

Another great video, thank you! For the PH/LN Switch, Omnitronic is switching the RIAA out of the feedback loop of the Op-Amp, right? So there is a long feedback trace which goes to a switch? Is that why there is more distortion or what is your explanation?

[@mixersinside]

I'm almost sure that it short circuits the inverting input with the output. There is another way of doing it and it can be seen in my Rane video.

[@dedondigital]

@@mixersinside okay, that's not really clever :D

[@mixersinside]

@@dedondigital turns out that making it right is equally simple.

[@RaquelFoster]

But how much roll-off does an OG Xone:92 have if you leave the filter on & all the way open? They've been making those so long they're probably not all identical, but now I'm curious if it's ever a good idea to leave an analog filter on (which you gotta admit is a pretty legit positive mark for a DJM-900). I guess you just gotta solder a zero-crossing mod in 😂

[@justblendnificent]

Great review. Thank you. I have the 202 and was thinking of buying the 222. Should I mention if I can have one that doesn't pop when powering on/off?

[@mixersinside]

@@justblendnificent that's the question to one of Omnitronic representatives. Thanks for watching it carefully!

[@sergeyknyazev7066]

Thank you for the great video! What opamp in ria stage is used in trm222?

[@mixersinside]

@@sergeyknyazev7066 4580

[@sergeyknyazev7066]

​@@mixersinside Thanks!

[@crispu.s.thrift409]

Thank you for this breakdown, Do you know if there is a switch for 120V in the states compared to 240V in UK? or does the power supply adapt within the range 100-240V? Also, how do you Iso Boost to hear Master Isolator in the headphones?

[@mixersinside]

@@crispu.s.thrift409 thanks for watching, answer to your question can be easily found in the manual or technical data available in the web.

[@FloppyFeel]

Alright Kamil! Starting to get some special treatment for your hard work I can see, nice. When do we get to see those sexy Electra 905s again? Keep it up!

[@mixersinside]

@@FloppyFeel thank you ❤️ My lovely sexy Electras have other owner right now, but i think i will get myself a pair once again in the future.

[@FloppyFeel]

@@mixersinside I see. It's important to share your wealth. Regarding the I/O board components, Im guessing the 6,35mm jacks for send and return are Amphenol even though they might not have the logo on them. As for the others I'm not even going to guess.

[@mixersinside]

@@FloppyFeel i didn't want to comment much and focus on connectors and potentiometers (mechanical parts) because best time to review them will be 5 years later from today.

[@Cinarossi_priv]

Great that You can remove X-fader

[@czystyr]

kozak!

[@Merstheman]

What advantage is there in using ALPS pots for channel volume if they are acting as volume chip control vs affecting the signal directly? thanks for the videos, by the way!

[@mixersinside]

Good question! I think it's the "feeling". ALPS RK27 have some mechanical resistance that is different than other potentiometers.

[@ioth303]

@@mixersinside definitly feeling and also longevity. The volume is the most used parameter I guess, so that pot being the sturdiest makes sense

[@RaquelFoster]

I assume they can dial in the breakpoint of the fader curve a lot better with VCA volume.

[@jacobrosen]

Did I dream or did you do a OP amp tierlist at some point? I can't find it now

[@mixersinside]

@@jacobrosen for sure not.

[@jacobrosen]

@mixersinside then I'll keep dreaming!

[@minimlt]

Can you tell something about why the this mixer isn´t that powerful on the output? I have the TRM-222 at home and compared to my old DJM707 the maximum volume is very low. (using the same speaker system) Maybe you can also help to fix this 🙂

[@mixersinside]

Why would you need higher volume? In my opinion lower output voltage (not to be confused with power) is a sign of a GOOD gain staging and thanks to this you're protected from distorting the inputs of your amplifier. A lot of mixers have way too high output voltage and this mainly cause problems and usually doesn't bring anything good. Output voltage level of Omnitronic is sufficient to drive any decent amplifier. Is your amplifier too weak and you have problems witch achieving volume you want? Crank that volume knob up in your amp!

[@minimlt]

@@mixersinside Thank you for the fast reply! I´m using the mixers on the Funktion 1 SB8A (self powered) with the F5 tops. Unfortunately there is no volume knob to crank up :D.

[@mixersinside]

@@minimlt check the input sensitivity in the amp data to have image what range of voltage do you need to provide. You didn't answer one important question - do you feel that your gear is too silent because of this?

[@minimlt]

@@mixersinside Yes, I feel it is on that system, compared to the DJM707, too silent. I just found this value: Sensitivity (1W at 1m) 96dB at 2.8V

[@mixersinside]

@@minimlt i see. I didn't expect that - just be careful not to overdrive the input stage of your amp. The mod would be super simple, it requires just changing 2 resistors in the output section that set the gain. I can do it for you if you are willing to ship the mixer to Poland, but any electronic engineer will be able to perform this mod.

[@HOPCOUNT]

Good mixer, I prefer the Bozak style knobs more than these.

[@ritchxmusic]

Hey I don't think sound is fully subjective when you can measure that things do such as with so many youtubers like Paul Third for example using plugin doctor to understand what EQ/phase shifts are occurring. SSL vs NEVE and all others, huge differences and measurable.

[@mixersinside]

@@ritchxmusic plugin doctor is a measurement tool, not ear. Describing phase shifts is describing data, not sensations. There are ways to conduct listening tests in scientific fashion - ABX and simmilar, but they are impossible to do on KZbin. I had a trial to do such thing in my Omnitronic upgrade video but nobody really cared about sticking to procedures. What i want to avoid on this channel is testing mixers in a way most reviewers do it - using only subjective terms to describe the sound. This is warmer, this is more smooth, this is more harsh etc. I know it's needed and I appreciate putting effort in describing sound sensations but arguing about what is warmer or more smooth is hard when you don't really have a solid point of reference (for example data or something objective).

[@ritchxmusic]

​@@mixersinside You just talked about objective measurements. So yes, of course i am talking about data in that case. There are objective measures of sound engineering

[@mixersinside]

@ritchxmusic for sure, i was talking about them most of this video!

[@ritchxmusic]

@@mixersinside Have you tested the play differently mixer? It seemed to sound quite different than the Xone

[@mixersinside]

@@ritchxmusic i didn't have opportunity to test it.

[@tomekpeki]

Szef :D

[@miba_81]

Very Great and interessting Video ! Personal I dont like the look of the 222.

[@breakz187]

Looks like its made very similar to the Xone 96 - same company perhaps?

[@mixersinside]

@@breakz187 yes, the boards are also green 😅

[@breakz187]

@@mixersinside The way that it is all modular, the op amps, the connectors and ribbons, the push switches - many components are similar

[@breakz187]

I know they're all going to be modular, just really reminded me of the insides of my 96

[@mixersinside]

Is Xone 96 also using 4580 op amps? 96 has also way more advanced power supply, not to mention the whole USB/DAC section and obviously clickless filter. Making filter clickless is not expensive so i think that it was not done by the company with the same know-how. If by any chance someone had know-how and decided to cut costs on such important issue anyway that was a very dumb decision. Also the potentiometers in Xone 96 should be ALPS (to be confirmed by you). The modular design is a common thing in many mixers and Xone mixers deal with it in nice way by making board to board contacts without using excessive number of cables. Will be thankful for confirming this info by you, cause i don't have 96 available to check at the moment. I serviced one in the past. Cheers!

[@miamiwax5504]

what do you think is the best quality mixer with faders?