Model Railway | The NEW Hornby APT is HERE! | Dean Park 292

[@6yjjk]

I remember having an APT as a kid in the 80s. Seeing that ball-and-socket contraption and those flimsy couplings on this one was a real shocker; ours had big chunky tongue-and-groove connectors, with the shared bogie split in half.

[@ewoodrailway]

The most beautiful train that never ran on the network. The beauty of your own layout, which by the way looks great

[@DeanPark]

Thanks. :-) it does look stunning when it’s running on the layout.

[@machoneboard]

Well, I was a passenger more than once from London - Glasgow and back and it was great.

[@ewoodrailway]

@@machoneboard lucky you, most of us can only dream

[@Slaithyte]

@@DeanPark Whats the cost? Sorry, im writing this before i finished the video

[@northamptonwest9077]

It's still too much of a toy compared to being a model for me. For the money we are paying I really did expect a much more superior finish quality wise. Great review Dave as always.

[@soundseeker63]

Really...? The quality of the finish is the best thing Hornby have done in years! And certainly their best application of Intercity livery to date. £500+ is still hard to swallow, however.

[@michaelgrey7854]

@@soundseeker63 Plastic pantographs though? Even the ancient class 91 has metal pantographs.

[@littleuikiku]

The APT is a very interesting train, very innovative for it's time. Here in Sweden we had similair challenges as in the UK with trying to run the new generations of high speed trains on ordinary rails, which in the late 1980's resulted in the x2000 also using the tilting technology, probably(?) inspired by the APT. The APT actually used Swedish motors aswell. As such an intesting piece of railway history I'd love to have it as a model, but with the price it unfortunately drops down a few notches on my procurement list. Great video and review! :)

[@Mickey-qq3dg]

Great upload.The detail of your layout,(background,buildings,people,trees etc) is second to none.The grey and blue British Rail coaches in the siding in the background and the high speed train that was going round,I feel need the black corridor consatinas to join the coaches (which passengers would walk through) to get to the next coach.I think the gaps between the coaches don't look right. As I said before an absolute stunning layout!

[@andrewpalm2103]

Your "vintage" intro sequence made me chuckle again. Thanks for going through the extra work to produce it. Cheers from Wisconsin!

[@colwichjunction3366]

Great video as ever...The APT certainly cuts it running around your layout Dave. The raised shots show well how beautifully the train snakes along, very impressive indeed. I’m not going to go on about the price that’s very well documented everywhere! It’s a very specific model for a particular time in our railway history & I’m guessing if it fits, then it’s one to have👍 Really enjoyed the review. Cheers John b😷

[@NTSCuser]

Love the period-correct music and the British Airways poster, takes me back.

[@george_kennedy]

Thanks Dave, great video and you’ve saved a lot of us a lot of money!

[@zoomer1979]

Hi Dave, just to echo what a lot of people are saying, a railroad model for a premium price. Even Charlie Petty from DC Kits says it's a throwback for those wanting to fit DCC Sound. A lot of the rolling resistance is caused by the wiper pickups and no bearings. My set is far from free running. I'm going to retro fit pinpoint bearings and change the pickups with wiring between the coaches. Good luck with yours. Neil.

[@clipperrail8988]

Good review Dave and it looks spectacular snaking round your layout. Part of the problem with the real APT is it’s a very lean design and there’s not much scope for detail that’d justify the price. There’s nothing I’ve seen that would make me want to upgrade my old 1981 model. I’ll fit some lighting and save myself a packet.

[@garylong7599]

Dave good review it is a stunning model which catches the real thing very well. when I place the new model next to the original apt model you can see how much they have improved the model. It is rather strange choice to include the test coach in the 7 car set I wanted one as I also model the rtc trains but not sure most people would want this coach. I pre ordered mine direct from Hornby and the kept with the pre order price for which I was very pleased

[@roystudds1944]

Great review Dave. Thanks for sharing. Roy.

[@DeanPark]

Cheers. Glad you enjoyed it. :-)

[@Kev5565]

Nice looking train but for the money it needs sharper mouldings, the access panels, vents and the door shut lines look too soft as though they were flooded with paint or the moulds are worn out. This standard of detail is ok for 10 or more years ago and the performance on inclines should have shown up in testing pre-release. Good review as usual.

[@soundseeker63]

You could probaly improve the look of the panels quite a bit with a light application of dilute black wash to all the little gaps and lines. It is always hard to get the really fine panel gaps to show through on the finished model - if the paint coats are too thin then equally that draws complaints from people. I think they got it ok overall but as with any model a bit of weathering in the right way can really bring it to life, especially with lighter colours.

[@EverardJunction]

Just like the real thing it seems to have been somewhat rushed and falls short of its intended goals. Most of the issues are fixable and I hope Hornby take that and improve the model in future production runs. As a fan of the real thing I remain tempted, but not tempted enough to purchase one.

[@DeanPark]

I’ll get a tarpaulin at the ready for the next time you pass my way! Lol back it up into the siding.

[@ClydebridgeStation]

A great review Dave. Couple of things I noticed. Firstly, the paint of the livery on the roof, it's slightly out of line, but not so noticeable from a distance. The other thing, with the body join you pointed out at the nose, that's correct, as that is where the nose would lift up, if emergency towing by a locomotive, as per a HST, was required. The idea of unscrewing a panel underneath to fit a decoder, is a great idea. How well such innovation could be adopted into the likes of a class 47, 08, 37, I'm not sure. But, it would be easier to fit a decoder that way, as opposed to taking the body off the chassis. And as for the sprung door, well Hornby have done that in the past on the class 08 as well, as mine has! I agree, a pointless exercise!

[@DeanPark]

Hi, yeah it would have been novel to have an opening nose!, to reveal a coupler.

[@gordonhanning476]

Reasonably good model don't know if it's worth the price hornby are asking. Very informative video Dave. I can remember the actual APTs sitting rotting in sidings outside Glasgow Central..

[@DeanPark]

Cheers Gordon. Yeah I question the value for money….it’s a nice model to see running but jeez it left a hole in my bank account!

[@robindow5742]

hi Dave i used to pass it every morning on my wat to work as it lay in a siding at the bottom o st Andrews drive in Glasgow for a very long time i dont remerber the dates but toward the end it looked dilapidated snd forgotten about Deanp Park LOOKS GREAT

[@peterfinch5077]

Thanks for the video. A great balanced review. I really enjoyed the retro APT music very atmospheric. Perhaps you will fit some C-APT balises in the track for some high speed sections of the layout (!) but seriously it looked super tilting in the curves.

[@onnomulder9775]

Awesome review Dave!!! Thanks for sharing. Cheers Onno.

[@mtty1988]

The platform level shot was amAzing looked so realistic the station the train and the man stud there. Can you do some more with diff locos stock etc as loved it

[@stocktonjunction]

I had issues with mine. Pantograph was broken on arrival although I managed to clip it back in. My ndm has a bouncy wheel so it derails and again as u said issues with inclines ..that I will be looking into to fix... On the end coach you showed at first it looked like yellow paint showing through the red on the roof although it could of been a patch of light catching it?? Glad you didn't have the issues I had with mine and thanks for sharing 😀👍

[@Degsie1975]

Mine arrived this week. It looks a beautiful model. However, the dummy NDM was broken on arrival. The plastic clip on top of the bogie which clips into the NDM was snapped. It seemed very flimsy consider it is the clip and pivot point for the bogie. I contacted hornby about it and got generic response about returning item, but typically never stated if whole product is to returned or just the NDM. Also the motor is quite noisy when moving off although it's not been run in and is quiet enough when moving at a higher pace. It has not been run in yet as I don't have a layout and only tested on a loop of track. I have the same issue with the pantograph not staying up. I have not had same issue with new class 87's. The development vehicle is nice, but I can't see the point of it. I won't be running it and would have preferred second NDM to be powered. Is the power enough to run a 14 car train at a scale 155mph?

[@derekmeller5873]

How do. I’ve had mine for a week now and I’m still totally in love with it. It’s needed a few tweaks, but I think Hornby have done a fantastic job here. A few things I’ve done and am going to do: 1. Remove the motor cradle from the second NDM. The performance increase is fantastic. Wheelspin should disappear too. Hornby recommend a second powered unit and I thought I needed that, but if you remove the cradle it’s fine. 2. Paint the inside. Add passengers. Add printed tartan to the seats. (I did this using Microsoft excel. ) That’s it. I’m so impressed with Hornby for this model. Yes it’s expensive, yes you can see the capacitors, but to include the apt u carriage was a touch of class, the look of it really rekindles happy memories of seeing one at full chat through WBQ, and the overall effort this model must have taken to me represents excellent value. Once you get the full 14 coach train running, you can’t help but be impressed. And it stays on the track even on my layout. 9.5 / 10 from me.

[@GracesGarden80]

Great video Dave. Whilst I love the actual APT and the original Hornby release, for me at least, there’s not enough to justify more than double the price than the comparable Avanti Pendolino. Yes, the Avanti model is starting to show its age but at £230 I can live with its shortcomings. Thank you for helping me decide and saving me the best part of £650 including decoders!

[@DeanPark]

Cheers. Yeah I get where you’re coming from. It’s not a cheap ‘investment’ but having had an original from Hornby I had to get this! :-) glad I did, but I won’t be buying a fleet of them!!

[@bionicgeekgrrl]

I think it is a case of them producing less than they would a pendo, I don't think it will be produced every year for instance, so that puts the price per model up as a result.

[@hovermotion]

Superb editing...this model has quite a few problems...but its still a stunning model which no other company has produced...

[@DeanPark]

Cheers. Yeah, If you want an APT it’s Hornby or nothing!

[@philsrailway5910]

Hi Dave. Just let you know changed back to old logo. Good vid as always very informative. Thanks

[@going2thedogs]

Great review Dave. Thks for showing how to fit the decoder & intel on the Hunt couplings. I will have to get myself some of those.

[@russellbenton2987]

Wow she looks good . I used to see the real thing sitting at Shields Road on my way to and from Glasgow . Definitely impressive train and model . A bit too expensive for something that would see occasional use for me , but I might still be tempted by next years model when they are doing a five car one with the black windscreen hood ( no doubt it’ll cost the same as the 7 car one by then !)

[@BritishRail60062]

Really enjoyed the video Dave. Although I am no longer using Facebook because of the way its going. I want to thank you for doing this video as its a model that I like but with a lot of the Hornby 2020/2021 range of models being sub standard. I wasn't prepared to take the risk and invest in a glorified lava lamp but I am thankful that the APT doesn't have this problem. May Hornby bounce back from the ordeals of the last two years. I have their HST DVT coming to me which I will be covering in April. I will consider getting the APT because it does look a nice train in my opinion. All the best Ash.

[@DeanPark]

Cheers. Glad you stopped by to watch it :-) no light bleed here… thank goodness. But I worry every time I get a new hornby model it will leak light! Got my HST DVT the other day… glad to report it isn’t a greeny grey and they’ve updated the intercity exec ‘beige’ near the same as the apt. There are issues with it, but it is an ok model.

[@cyberleaderandy1]

It was a gorgeous train and one i remember seeing run around the Derby area on test tracks and at Litchurch Lane as a RR apprentice during the early 80s. Sadly missed but its successor the Pendalino could have been British had the APT not been cancelled ☹️

[@DeanPark]

The British what the British do best….invent something and then sell (or give away) the technology to another country who fine tune it and then sell it back to us! The tilt technology picked up by the Italians and sold back to us. Even jet engine technology…given to the Americans who now sell us back Boeing planes! Shame. But we are very good at inventing.

[@cyberleaderandy1]

Even Russia got 10 Nene jet engines in 1946 with government approval. They later sold derivatives to their allies who fought against the US and UK. Crazy.

[@chelmswoodjunction]

Hi dave I did notice at the 22 minute mark there was a squeak and was going to let you know but you already did. Great model I would consider buying this set but like you said with having to fit 3 decoders works out rather expensive. Great video as always can't believe I've been subscribed to you from near enough day one. Hope you and the family are well. Peter

[@paulrb894]

Good video,. But each side of the motor coach will always be the half coach, not the full open coach as you have it running with, last 3 coaches correct. cheers

[@DeanPark]

Cheers, and thanks for that info. I didn’t have the full rake on the track for this one. As I didn’t want to burn out the new motor :-)

[@TATICMOOR]

It was great to see the new APT out on the 00 mainline and seeing it action. It looks like it runs very smoothly with the clickity clack and swooshiness on your well laid lines. On close-up it looks well but plain as there isn't that much detail really along the sides for any added separate parts that could have been introduced. Shame about the paint bleed between the livery, as the colours of the livery look excellent. The bogies could have been picked out better with added separated detail than moulded frames to help give them more depth. A diecast panto would have been nice touch to give it a sign of added quality. If I remember from other Hornby panto's Dave, the underwire was a spring like affair to raise the panto upward. In this case it isn't doing its job properly and a bigger plus would have been if the pantographs were operational with a flick off an underbody switch. The decoder area is extremely limited as you have pointed out. Which one could remedy by cutting and shortening the wires to the decoder? That is if one was good at, and happy to resolder the cut wires to the PCB pads. The APT-U 48204 test coach looks great too, but will many want to run it prototypically like that and having to buy the extra coach? The couplings seem to be a bugger and with all the, pushing, pulling, and tugging, how long will they last before breaking point? At least West Hill Wagon Works has a fix already for that issue, but will need to have plenty of stock in of those Hunt couplings, as I would think the demand will be high for those investing in getting the APT. Which brings us to the issue of the cost of the set. At £478 for the 5-Car Unit and £587 for the 7-Car Unit, plus, if adding the APT-U test coach at £55 and any of the APT 2-Car coach packs costing £109 each. It is going to be an expensive train to pull together. That is if it even can pull its own weight. Judging from what you have said Dave with your own 7-car set not getting up your layout gradients. It might be okay for the 5-car set (you should retry it without two coaches), but the 7-car set sounds underpowered, and maybe it should have been fitted with a motor in the second NDM. Which makes me think that Hornby took it for granted they would go up inclines without a problem and didn't bother to test them for this issue. Also, if someone did what to have the full working train. Will it even pull a 14-Car unit on a flat level track running session? Depending on how many sets Hornby is making and at these prices. I think I will wait and see if the price drops under the strain of their excessive price rises lately. For the 7-Car set, I think they will have to supply (if the second NDM has the same innards) a second motor upgrade kit to give it the power it needs. If not that, then a swap out the NDM motor for a replacement with more motive power and better traction to correct the problem of getting itself up a hill. Make me think now that the APT-U could live up to its name, as U for an underpowered train, LOL.

[@Cliffjumper24]

It looks like a nice model, though it's inability ro get up your inclines does take some of the shine away. The livery looks vastly better than previous versions of InterCity! One part that bothers me about this model, was when you were installing the R8249. The decoder sits over the circuit board leaving the possibility of having electronic parts on the decoder touching solder points on the decoder. This is likely to create a short and potentially frying the decoder!! It's really bad design! The 'hack' would be to pus a thin piece of plasticard between the circuit board and the decoder... and don't forget to snip off the end of the purple floating wire to avoid another short.

[@DeanPark]

Yes he design of the decoder area is poor….I’ve added some insulation tape to the back of the decoders. The motor does feel powerful enough, but lacks torque to get up the gentle incline.

[@harpinson]

I couldn't agree more with your comments about this model. The pantographs are very flimsy, just spent 15 minutes putting one back together after I got it caught on my cardigan sleeve. The couplings are a bit of a faff, fine if you've got room to leave it set up all the time, but if you need to put it away occasionally not much fun. Not DCCd mine yet, just gave it a run in my brother's DC only layout but I'm guessing the individual chips in the NMDs only provide directional lights. If that is the case I feel they've missed an opportunity. They could have provided us with a choice of daytime/night time running lights and a cab light too.

[@DeanPark]

Yeah it’s a good model, but could have been an amazing one! :-(

[@harpinson]

@@DeanPark opportunity for someone who knows what they’re doing to produce some after market replacement metal pantographs and update the lights on it, and perhaps a kit to motorise the second NDM. All part of the fun!

[@jamesscobie1395]

Enjoyed your review and glad Chris and myself decided to get the Azuma rather than the APT

[@DeanPark]

As a model it is fine. The real thing was pretty simple, even minimalist so hornby have captured the shape. There’s very few extra fitted parts Hornby could have fitted to it. However, they may have missed an opportunity, the interiors could have been higher quality and far more detailed, the vestibule ends more realistic and less plastic looking, not to mention the basic bogie tilt mechanism. So the azuma is far superior! There’s much more there that can be modelled, more complex. It lends itself to looking good in model form, and it’s a superb Hornby model. Can’t help think, even if I do think the hornby APT is cool, that there was a missed opportunity here. Unlikely we will ever see another company try to do it, now that hornby will flood the market with them, although by the number of people sending them back due to faults… maybe someone at hornby will get a pasting by the big boss! 😆

[@andrewstevenson5449]

Good review. Bit surprised that you gave it 4 for performance when it wouldn't go up your inclines (which I suspect are hardly the steepest on a model railway in the UK!). Personally, I thought the pantograph looked a bit coarsely represented, but trying to find a photo of the APT where you could actually see the pantograph isn't easy. Presumably the LEDS in each coach are the same? in your running shots, some looked much colder than others - I guess that's down to the colour of the seats.

[@DeanPark]

Exactly!, The inclines are only 3%, not steep at all. Everything including a steam loco up to 4 coaches makes it. Lol It lost a point because of the incline. It held the track really well and did well on the level. The panto… the hot topic! It is well represented..but perhaps coarsely made! Once it’s up it’s fine, but as I pointed out, that’s a challenge! Yeah the lights and interior seating give an illusion that they differ.

[@cannybearsed]

It feels like a rush job from Hornby. I don't know what part the pandemic played in final development and into production, but after 40 years I thought they would have pulled everything out for this. Continuity through coaching to the DTS from the power cars. 2 powered NDM in the 7 car set (required for the full 14 consist). Meaning you don't need to buy another powered NDM after purchasing the 7 car pack and the additional 4 car packs! Some thought in the design around sound fitting. I know Hornby probably won't produce a sound TTS, but already chips exist, fitting being a real hands on affair (even TTS would present the same headache). Hornby should have considered this from a modelling customer perspective. Use of decoders have caught a lot of folks out, going by reviews. Hornby should have been more clear in the enclosed instructions. Pantograph sucks. I'm not commenting further on the capacitors! I've bought this and the additional coaches. Excited and nostalgic, as the original was an Xmas present when I was a kid in the early 80's, and I loved it. I will love this too, as it's a big kids dream. Cheers.

[@bionicgeekgrrl]

The pantograph gives opportunities for the smaller suppliers to produce a good quality etched one. May Mr Edge of Judith Edge models could be convinced to make one like he has for others, such as the 71.

[@fatwalletboy2]

I like the you get a complete train from the box and the finish looks lovely but feel its been rushed. The big capacitors visible in the coaches are badly thought out.....3 decoders needed to get it dcc.....

[@markwilson4052]

Very 70s documentary music there. I like the observation. Saw the APT at Stafford in ‘85.

[@DeanPark]

Hi, cheers. Yeah I like adding in some cheesy music. It’s actualll called “apt theme”!

[@modelrailwaynoob]

I'm not a passenger person but this looked fab on your layout Dave. Good review.

[@squeaksvids5886]

It does look fantastic but the price is way out of my range. By the way, only one pantograph was raised at any one time. Great video. 👍🏻👍🏻

[@rorycunningham6278]

Stunning model and a stunning train. The chance of me ever getting my hands on one are basically zero, Hornby sadly priced these models way out of a lot of people's price range. Maybe one day they will bring down the price or make a railroad APT, however, I feel that would still be overpriced.

[@bennickss]

They’ll soon rehash their 1980s APT set, give it the crappy motors from the class 66 and quadruple the price, for a 5 car set i bet they’ll expect £170-£200

[@jimmyduncan7650]

@@bennickss $200 plus 20% 5 minutes later add another 20% 😒

[@bionicgeekgrrl]

@@bennickss if Mr khoeler is to be believed that will never happen, as apparently moving the tooling for the 1980s apt was deemed unacceptable under health and safety grounds. It is possible it was amongst the tooling scrapped between the time Simon left and returned to the company.

[@115steve]

Hi Dave. Firstly, great video & very interesting. I must admit I am feeling very slightly tempted and I'm N gauge although (secondly) I find myself listening to your words and remembering the experience 10 years ago with the Hornby class 423 4VEP. That model would stall through lack of power (although at least yours was trying to climb up a gradient) the VEP would stall on the flat on curves, squealing from the wheels, couplings that were a right PITA and I just think have they learned nothing. The new couplings look very promising though. Interestingly given my comparison with the 4VEP model, as I write this Hornby have just given details of the upgrades to the VEP model so hopefully when this model arrives later in the year it will be a marked improvement over the original releases 10 years ago. Hopefully it won't take 10 years for Hornby to make improvements to the APT. The finish of the APT does look very good. Thanks for the vid.

[@mikeking2539]

I think that the "join line" no the nose cone, is because on the real APT this part is where the 'emergency coupling' is housed and the nose cone is 'hinged' and lifts uwards. As well as the emergency coupling, there are also buffers etc. Although it might be too heavy on the model! Edited. I beleive that the windows on the real thein were double glazed windows!

[@DeanPark]

Yes I think that’s the look they were going for with the nose. Would have been amazing if it had a Mechanism to allow it to slide up like the real Thing. But I suppose some people would have moaned that this was a gimmick that was ill fitted and pushed costs up!

[@jamesbradshaw4675]

Great video as always Dave 👌

[@bryanlane62]

Thanks Dave, that’s a very interesting review ahead of my model arriving from Kernow in the next few days. Interesting what you’ve said about inclines, I’m wondering how it will get on with my helix when I build it in the next Phase of Pevenbourne. To resolve this, I’ve purchased an additional NDM (as well as a 2-coach pack) and will do a body swap with the dummy NDM so that my APT will run as an eight car train with two motored NDMs. So that’ll be 4 decoders then ! I look forward to getting my model.

[@eastcoastdcc]

Great review Dave. I wonder if Hornby can really justify the cost of over £1000 for the full 14 car rake. I’d love to have one, still might be persuaded by the 7 car set. You have to ask if one power car could cope with the full rake though. I think I’d prefer 2, adding further to the cost! Would be good if one decoder could be used. As you pointed out, 3 decoders adding another £60+ to the investment…! I guess the connections between the coaches and power car will be quite complex if inky 1 decoder was used. Get video and some really nice shots of the APT, although I loved the shot with the HST in the background…. Fab! Cheers Ross

[@jimmyduncan7650]

22:10 👏👍 Dave you did a lovely job on the video, watched it a few times over. Might be a stupid question but with the space being so tight is there no chance for sound? Such a striking model that a high speed pass with 2 tone is all I can think it needs. All the best, Jimmy

[@DeanPark]

Cheers. Glad you enjoyed it Jimmy. There will be space for sound in the power car in the middle. But do AC electrics make sound worth listening too 😆

[@axeman0073]

Awesome vid again mate. 12:38 maybe the manufacturer with the pantograph is putting out a 1st prototype so the model looks somewhat authentic against the increasing modellers that have overhead wires on their layout, but this model has just enough clearance and will not corrupt or catch the overhead wires????? :)

[@delticsarebest]

looks good im old and I seen the real think at Nuneaton running well and also remember the carton strip in the news papers of it leaning and all the food flying out the windows and all sorts of things was not true but I think it ended ever running again because of that

[@898688tim]

it does look spectacular and adds a great deal to any layout but you need the space to run it as a 7 car unit. If given the choice with a Bachmann Pullman I think I would do that instead

[@duncancampbell452]

I'm not a fan of the Apt but it's a cracking loco way before my time when it was on Britain's railways another fantastic review again .

[@cedarcam]

What I call the greatest train we never had. A train far more advanced than anything we have had since and could of revolutionised rail travel as they were planned to run on many lines not only the WCML. I was lucky enough to see some but sadly never got to go on one of the few that went into public service. After waiting so long for this model I finally got the 5 car set I ordered on Friday to go with the extra coaches I had bought and the test car. At around £800 for the whole thing I really expected a top class model. The external finish looks great and detail well represented but internally I think the huge capacitor which seems to do nothing as the lights go out in an instant on dirty track or insulfrogs and plastic looking seating spoil the over all look. The biggest disappointment came around 45 minutes after putting the 5 car set on the track. OK my layout boards are very old and not all my track is super smooth but I did expect it to run OK like the Rapido APT-E which has no problems at all, the power car does not like diamond crossings and derailed several times but then it stopped and I found one drive shaft had, I thought, broken already and it had not even run up to half speed. Saturday morning I took it back to the model shop where I was told Hornby have no spares and if they returned it it would be at least April before I got it repaired or replaced. Luckily a man who does repairs was in that morning and said he would see what happened. When we got it open we found the drive shaft had not broken but somehow just fallen out. as if it had not been fitted correctly in the factory. It took round 2 1/2 hours to get it working again. We both commented on the fact it needs 4 x chips when one in each power car could of been used. The lack of function control of saloon lighting and no cab light although I would not want one that is on all the time as the HST has. The chips are easy to fit but as others say fitting some types will not be possible in the small space, I chose the Hornby ones. The pantograph is nicely detailed but like the 7 car set does not stay in the raised position, a metal one with the option to work would of been far better, the old Lima 87 had a pretty good metal one that worked all those years ago. The couplers feel like they are going to break putting them together, maybe that's why spare ones are included in the power cars and test coach. So if you stayed with me my verdict is Yes it is a nice model to display but unless you have a layout with track as good as Dave's no diamond crossings to derail on and don't expect a model with all the features of the Rapido one its worth considering. If it had not been one of my favourite trains and I had seen the problems others are having with them I don't think I would of bought one. Once I have replaced a bit of track and got a new crossing I hope it will run OK on my layout.

[@plymouthtoleedsonaxchst9537]

I,ve just got the Azuma LNER.Excellent model.

[@DeanPark]

The azuma is a stunning model.

[@geordielad9636]

I received my (7 car set) on 26.1.22 and the couplings had me puzzled but eventually I worked it out, your video explains how it's done perfectly, I also have ordered the Hunt couplings. One of my pantographs decided to self destruct, I managed to piece it together but what a pathetic pantograph, the worst on any model. I have gradient on my layout and have had no problem but they are very gradual rising to 4" height in 30' length. I did have a derailing problem with the unpowered NDM but after a adjust to my track (which is far from perfect) it is now running fine. The only big problem I have is the squeaky wheels which I thought was the axles needed a touch of lubricant however I learn't from you, it is the contacts on the wheels for the lighting that is causing it. Dave you mentioned you were going the lubricate them may I ask WHAT kind of lubricant will you use? and where to apply it, so I can do the same. I pre-ordered the class 800 Azuma 2 years ago which has just arrived and this is a real classy model in comparison to this APT which I think is a bit cheap and chatty, as I said compared to the Azuma. Don't think I am not pleased with this APT I am, it's just in my opinion too expensive, has poor pantographs and has a mouse in some of the carriages. Well Mr Watson that my review, thanks for doing your excellent video, Bill Watson. P.S. please let me know what lubricant to use to kill the mice.

[@DeanPark]

I’m working on the lubricant thing! Not sure myself yet. I’ve not used the hunt couplers yet but it says they work on 2nd radius…so I’ll try them when they arrive. :-) I find that the wheels don’t squeak…when is either stationery or going fast!

[@michaelgrey7854]

I considered the 2022 version not value for money due to the lack of power and huge capacitors. The 2023 version will be the one I get as I understand that Hornby has at least attempted to improve it. Still it takes up my whole years model railway budget to get. ($1078 here in NZ).

[@DeanPark]

I covered the updated APT in my recent July update 2023 video.

[@zekesamazingtrainsandmore.1163]

Hi Dave, they have fixed the many missing details but it's sad how I need to wait a few years until I get an apt either that I could get on old set that's mint condition from eBay for about £180 anyways how did you get a £500 Hornby pack I might get the £250 5 car set instead. anyways amazing video as always from Zeke ☺️

[@mattp1337]

I've never been a fan of the APT, but this model looks great. As for the issue with inclines, it would help greatly to know what percentage gradient you have that defeated it.

[@keithdoherty8809]

What I want to see is this and the previous model side by side and clear and detailed comparisons to justify, or otherwise the outrageous prices demanded by Hornby (and Bachmann) today ! Nothing more

[@DeanPark]

Check out my top 10 of 2021…I have the old apt car along side the new one

[@Leonard_Smith]

For those of us old enough to have seen this running during its trials, this will always be a case of "what could have been" if only the journalists had been tea-total...

[@DeanPark]

Yes tabloid journalism really stuck the knife in! Sad.

[@Xantec]

@@DeanPark and now we have tilting trains - built by the Italians, trains with more plastic bodywork than...... the APT - Advanced Passenger Train = Attractive Passenger Transport.

[@michaelh6064]

I never saw the real thing or studied pictures of it but the model looks to lack the detail you would expect for a premium product. Toy like as others have said. How do you fit a sound decoder to such a space? Does it have speakers factory fitted? I am curious as to why the lighting looks different across the carriages? Is that how they were?

[@DeanPark]

Sound/speaker could fit in the power cars. Lighting different? The color of the seats is different, I think that’s what’s making it look that way. The level of brightness etc is the same in each coach. Cheers.

[@timsully8958]

Great review Dave. It certainly looks very much at home on your layout 🤓 A bit disappointing in the failure to rise on the inclined track but as you say I suspect this is to do with the power being administered from the middle of the set. The couplings do look a bit of a mare but I have magnetic couplings on quite a few coaches now and they work really well, so if they look that good I’d say that would be a wise investment 🤔 I actually love the APT but it is really stretching my era a bit too far to justify buying one, especially as I am constantly reminded by my better half that in biblical terms there’s “no room left at the inn” and even the small “stable (or shed) out the back” is rammed 🤷🏻‍♂️ We will be moving somewhere bigger so who knows. Maybe. If I’m feeling very generous to myself 😜 Great to see you layout in all its glory again. Not Ben on KZbin much recently so it is nice to catch up with an old favourite 😎 Cheers 🍀👍🍻

[@peak45]

Bogie frames look good.

[@DeanPark]

It’s a pretty minimalistic design over all, but I think it looks good on the bogies.

[@clivecobbold6815]

Hi Dave anther great video mate I really injoy it every interesting I may have to take my layout out for the loft because my back is bad now and build a new smaller layout in one of are bedrooms using the Stranraer Harbour part of my layout on top of the new and air line running down to a 2 track mainline on the top part of new layout I got my new heljan class86 4/6 locos this week goodbye for how clive in N Ireland

[@simonbradshaw3708]

It seems the coach flickering issue with the initial coaches doesn't seem to be a problem any more, have Hornby increased the capacitor size? A nice model from Hornby although sad they didn't decide to go with a 21 pin decoder socket. Thank you for another interesting video.

[@DeanPark]

Cheers Simon. :-)

[@eisenbau]

Hornby never get it quite right, so disappointing it can't manage a small incline. (Would have been good to include that in the video). The number of decoders always annoys me as well. If it only has 1 motor then there should be connections between the cars so you only need 1 decoder. To be fair, not just Hornby that does that. I guess you could use function decoders in the non power cars, but they aren't much cheaper. Great and fair review.

[@GWRcustomweathering]

Your channel, layout, stock and instagram are absolutely excellent. Does this layout travel the exhibition circuit, Warley, Glasgow etc?

[@DeanPark]

Hi, thanks :-). No it is a permanent loft based layout. I’d need to take my house roof off to get this out and about 😆

[@GWRcustomweathering]

@@DeanPark It might be worth doing that sometime lol!! just edited my previous comment, I'd said execution circuit 😆

[@geordielad9636]

I thought I would add my recent experiences. The hunt couplings work great but when tightening the screw after fitting the Hunts I found I had to turn them back a touch to allow movement, just hope they don't work loose in future. The squeak I cured by adding a drop of Gaugemaster oil to all the axles. Unfortunately my NDM has packed up I think one drive shaft has come adrift, so the car is going back for replacement, fortunately I bought a second NDM just in case of any problems and am running that. I cannot understand why the dummy NDM is so heavy, it is adding unnecessary weight to the rake and maybe the cause of my loose drive shaft? I tried to get inside the coach to remove any unnecessary weight but gave up as worried I might break pantograph. How folk can run a full set of 14 cars with only one motor driven car seems a lot of work for one small motor?

[@DeanPark]

Remove the pantograph before trying to access the ndm’s. Not easy to remove the body, tight fitting. I have not tried 14 cars…..don’t know if I’ll bother. But I’ve got the spare ndm to help. Not ideal though. Concerned to hear about the fragility of the moving parts too.

[@geordielad9636]

Thanks Dave for tip removing pantograph. I managed to remove body and inside is a huge cast iron cradle but empty , the same cradle is used to house motor on powered NDM. Hornby cutting costs again? surely they could have designed a better lighter system instead of using existing parts.

[@cedarcam]

My NDM lasted 45 mins before a drive shaft fell out. I returned it to the model shop next day and they said Hornby have no spare parts. One of the people who does repairs was in and asked if he could have a look at it. It was as Dave says not easy to get into the clips are very tight We manged it eventually without breaking anything and found the shaft was not broken but had somehow fallen out. We can only think it was not fitted correctly. It was not easy to fit it back in, he said it clicked in but lining it up to do that took ages as it has 2 x universal joints next you have to slide the thinner end into the other and get that to engage with the bogie gear tower. It took 2 1/2 hours to get it all back together. So far it has not run with 12 coaches without derailing both NDM are powered I got a spare and even now one of them derails I think it climbs over the top of the rail due to trying to push 6 coaches and the other NDM, seems they do not run at the same speed all the time but it derails on 2nd radius in a tunnel so up to now I have not worked out the reason Nothing else I run has a problem in there. interesting to see I am not the only one who has had this happen to a drive shaft. I hope like mine it is not a broken part and can be fitted in again.

[@geordielad9636]

@@cedarcam Thanks for the reply with your info on this troublesome APT, we are not alone. I sent my NDM back to TMC and am waiting a new replacement. I ordered another powered NDM coach only and I think I got the last one in the universe. I have been running this but only as a 5 car set, so no heavy non powered NDM and touch wood it has been running fine, Bill.

[@nigelweir3852]

Price is the major problem for the latest models , considering lack of dcc onboard and the simplicity of the model under body and bogies can see this will be a highly profitable model for Hornby , but likely only affordable by a niche group. Think Hornby have missed a trick and could have made this more affordable but this may come but not sure how a rail road version possible as not much to take off without leaving it practically toy like.

[@phillipsiviter2024]

It’s just a shame that BR couldn’t get this to work - another seven to eight years would have seen it through. Would I buy the Hornby set? Perhaps - it arrived towards the end of the period I want to model - mid seventies to mid eighties. She is a lovely model though.

[@andymacmac9151]

Thanks for posting Dave…. Could this be the one model recently released that doesn’t have bad light bleeding? Patiently waiting for mine to arrive…

[@lj03oem]

I got my seven car set for the pre order price and feel like what i received was was rushed into production before all the problems had been sorted out.How Hornby can charge more than another £100 for the same product under the new pricing scheme defies belief.My first train set was a Hornby GWR goods set in 1974,i have grown up with Hornby,i want them to survive,but with the quality of the models they are supplying for the new asking prices,i really feel worried for the brand.I can no longer justify the cost of a Hornby loco when the likes of Accurascale and Cavelex and their pricing and value for money push Hornby premium products to their Railroad range as far as detail and quality control is concerned.I really hope that my Hornby experience has been unique,sadly,i feel i may well not be alone.

[@clivecobbold6815]

Hi Dave anther great video mate I really injoy it every interesting I have ger two of the m now I am every please them far better of the old hornby APT mate goodbye for how clive in N Ireland

[@thebritfarmer]

Mine should be here on Tuesday, can't wait. Yours does look great zipping around Dean Park, classic traction!!!

[@WestRail642fan]

my one blew its motor as soon as i put it on the track, its currently on its way back to Hornby for repairs

[@DeanPark]

I’m hearing all sorts of horror stories! Not good at all.

[@radders261]

Fantastic review! As I'm not a modeller, I have a question... Are there model trains in the guage that you use which actually pick up power from overhead lines as opposed to the rails? Sorry if this is a silly question. Keep up the brilliant videos matey!

[@davidstrains4910]

Brilliant video Dave the APT looked fantastic running round your layout, I think it looks nice but it I do think it requires improvements to make it really worth what hornby are asking for it which in my opinion is far too much especially as I will be getting hold of one of Rapido trains APT-e units very soon for just over £300, one improvement I would definitely want for something like this is for it to have metal pantographs, plastic pantographs in 2022 is not acceptable especially as other manufacturers are fitting metal ones which can be done to the correct scale and another improvement I would definitely make is the capacitors because that is just one of the stupidest things hornby have ever done. I have my 1980s one which i am very happy with because I made some improvements to it which was improving the lighting to LED lights although these are only in the forward direction at the moment but will hopefully be able to fit the red lights one day and other cosmetic things like the overhead warning flashes on each vehicle and the destination boards in the small windows. Overall a very good showcase of the APT.

[@lapiswake6583]

It looks good. However, I question the addition of the development coach in this 7-car pack, instead of its own release. The pantograph looks very flimsy, and it's a shame there's no electrical connection between coaches to allow for continuous pickups and DCC operated coach lighting, a feature I'd expect on something so expensive. And it's a gimmick to sell a dummy NDM when a 2nd powered NDM is required for a full set or inclines. I think I'm going to stick with my 1980s model. However, it needs a new pantograph (I might modify it to have a bogie mounted one, but then the question is how to do that without the pantograph rotating with the bogie), it lacks traction on part of my layout, it has no lights and the yellow of one DTS end is problematic. I am also wanting to get a 6th coach so somehow acquiring a single articulated bogie and building a coach around that, and maybe I'll get a 2nd motor car (which I may through wire for 1 chip, maybe requiring both to have CD conversions). I believe 8-pin chips have harnesses because they were the first type of chip introduced, so were designed to fit in the first DCC ready locos as well as a simple 'chop off the plug' conversion to be added into non-dcc ready locos. Personally, I prefer wiring 8-pin sockets to locos without sockets, like my APT-P, because then it's a simple plug and play if the chip dies for some reason.

[@harpinson]

The pantograph is very flimsy. Just spent 15 minutes putting one back together after I got it caught in my cardigan sleeve.

[@MrMattMWH]

To be totally realistic you need to pay the full rrp , wait years for delivery then flog it cheap to an Italian neighbour. 😆🤣

[@tomlee9534]

The price put me off getting this and seeing the model reviews I think I’m glad. One part of the livery you didn’t seem to pick up on was on the roof of the DTS cars. The red and white bands have weird kinks at the curves on the roof as though they’re not quite aligned properly. And the dark grey has a band of what looks like it could be double printing like the blue on the MkIII coaches. As for not having the grunt to manage seven cars, that’s appalling from Hornby. Their diesels can pull a house down and they can’t even make a chassis to move seven cars? As I said, I’m glad I didn’t get one although I do really want one, just a better one than this. A wasted opportunity from Hornby. I’m not usually so negative but this is really disappointing. I think you scored it kindly.

[@suprfurryanimal]

I have a question: was this train ever used for real? As a kid in the 70s/80s I seem to remember they broke down all the time. I love the video by the way!

[@Then.72]

The problem was that they counter balanced the passengers level which caused seasickness

[@daviemaclean61]

All decoder chips should be that easy (relatively) to install. No idea why it seems acceptable to have to virtually take apart a brand new expensive loco to do the job. There is a lot of design and engineering goes into these models - why not go a little further and design in an access panel? Still a shame that only certain decoders will fit. Rant over!!! ;-)

[@aljonflavin6760]

The flush fitting windows on the hornby 80s model were much better.

[@StormmyStormmy]

Great honest review, i have the 5 car set, i will make mine a better model, firstly upgrading the lighting system then the interior, looking forward to it, by the way i got mine for a great price, its a piece of history that i really like. The new jubilee hst is a total rip off, its not real!!!!! just a money spinner for Hornby in my opinion.

[@DeanPark]

I’m interested to see how the HST jubilee turns out. I actually like the look of the power cars. 🤔

[@CHESEABUN]

Does the nose panel retracted and slide up so you can tow it with a loco?

[@DeanPark]

No. It’s fixed on. Such innovations seem to be reserved for steam locos from hornby with opening fire box doors, etc. while the new apt is good, it isn’t as detailed as many would have hoped. It’s not an all signing, all dancing high tech model.

[@CHESEABUN]

@@DeanPark are you disappointed with the model? I have seen very varied reviews.A friend of my has it a going to bring it around for a run when he has finished fitting the decoders. Will be interesting. He said legobiffoman has various ranges of Sound decoders for this model? Should be interesting? Cheers Richard.

[@WilliamHBaird-eq2hp]

Nice paint job, but still a little too toy-like for my tastes. Rapido may do one later on. Their APT-E is outstanding!

[@DeanPark]

I just can’t see a market for another company doing one. If you look at rapidos apt-e it’s a bit plasticy looking too. Think it’s something to do with the generally smooth and simple shapes of them, does make them look a bit toy-ish.

[@darrenbutcher6684]

Hornby should have done this great job😊

[@DeanPark]

It is a Hornby model.

[@Dill_Pickle1997]

Does this model tilt on corners like the real APT?

[@DeanPark]

Yeah. It does. :-)

[@cossie118bmk]

nice loco ..... what static grass and applicator did you use as your grass it stands up well 👍👍

[@DeanPark]

Cheers. I use a noch gras applicator. I find it excellent. :-)

[@soundseeker63]

So....Hornby CAN do intercity colours properly after all! Who knew!? After YEARS and YEARS of really dodgy renditions of IC livery with very strange shades for the lower beige band and striping that was neither the right colour nor the right thickness (look at their IC liveried Mk2Fs for instance) they have finally nailed it. Good colours, good finish, striping correct, good glazing, nice interiors...lighting a little too bright perhaps but overall, very nice! It's just....THE PRICE!! :-/ Totally out of my range unfortunately BUT.... If Hornby could somehow transfer this rendition of Intercity colours onto their other IC offerings, I would snap a few of those up for sure! Guy's if you're listening....this quality of IC livery on your Mk2/Mk3s and DVTs please!!!

[@DeanPark]

Yes they have nailed it on their class 91 as well in the Swallow intercity livery. Fingers crossed this continues! Oh please Hornby!

[@seanfleming6196]

hi , may i ask have you designed your lay out on seperate levels , meaning that certain tracks run independant from each other, if that makes sense , sorry for the lamen terminology , i am new to this hobby.

[@brianmcaleer3958]

this layout is on two levels yes

[@marvintpandroid2213]

APT, Its the future

[@ScottDowneywoundedbear]

Not sure why they are still using a 8 pin plug these days when you can get a Next18 decoder the same size as the 8 pin.

[@BoaFilmsPlc]

I recently got my 7 car set. My biggest issue is the lack of decoder space. I like to sound fit all my models and the APT is going to be, how shall I say it? a bit of a pain in the backside. A bit of a faux pais there Hornby, a very expensive model with no easy sound fit! A tad shoddy.

[@bennickss]

This, while it looks good initially, isn’t for me, mainly because my layout isn’t based in the 1980s, but other reasons include: Insanely expensive, I’m not prepared to shell out £500 for something that I’d have to spend another £40 or whatever to DCC fit when I could get 3 or 4 sound fitted locos for the same price Not a prototypical length without paying an additional £300 for additional coaches (my main problem with Hornby multiple units eg pendolino/javelin/eurostar) Very basic detailing (no opening doors, indicator lights, really cheap pantograph)

[@Hanzo.Azmodan]

Is it me or does the colour of the lighting in the coaches vary? Or is that correct?

[@DeanPark]

Hi, it’s down to the colour of the seats. The light reflects off them differently depending if they are blue or red.

[@fredashay]

Question from an American: Had the real train gone into passenger service, would passengers be able to pass through the power units to get from one end of the train to the other? Plus, if it is electric, why does it even need power cars at all?

[@kevatcrewe]

No there was never any provision for passengers to transit through the power cars, because of the limitations of electric traction at the time I believe and thus the size of the equipment and the fact the bogies on the coaches were shared between the units. The pendolino for example has distributed power throughout the train, not seperate power cars. Plus as in the review the pantograph assembly was fixed on a frame to the bogies so didn't tilt . The APT was developed on a shoestring budget, I've always been in awe of what the engineers achieved everything considered.

[@davidhall7811]

Thats a great question, something I was wondering myself

[@Paul-dr8tq]

Great video but the comments on here from some about the price are laughable when a diesel locomotive from Hornby or the like are near £200. I have one of these, and the additional coaches and I think it's a great model but it's just that, a model so not everything is going to be perfect