Modulation Effects: Front or Loop?

Time code below! Use it to navigate around the video to watch what you'd like!
On this episode of "Tone Exploration Tuesday", we take a look at the oft-pondered topic of where to put modulation effects. Do they go in front of the amp or in the amp's loop?
0:00:46 - What we're doing in this live event
03:06 - Don't forget to subscribe!
04:44 - Concept: What's the difference between putting a modulation effect in front of the amp or in the amp's loop?
07:25 - The rig/setup you're hearing
07:52 - Hearing the amp with no effects
08:19 - Playing the CE-2 in front of the amp
10:29 - Playing the CE-2 in the amp's loop
18:33 - Playing through various effects in the Strymon Mobius in front of the amp
25:21 - Playing through various effects in the Strymon Mobius in the amp's loop

[@DAVEWEINERGUITAR]

Thanks for attending another great live event! Any questions/comments, leave them below!

[@MK-tj5bf]

Very interesting and useful video. Thank you Dave! Every month you are becoming better in better on the screen.

[@albertplaysguitar]

Great point at the beginning... Need to try it out with your own stuff! I have the Digitech Ventura Vibe, for example, and I would usually put it after dirt, but turns out I like it better before dirt. Who would've thought?

[@MK-tj5bf]

I’m so sad that could not watch your live stream and ask some questions If its not late yet I would like to ask one question I’ve noticed that some good “pedalboard guys” having really nice Mobius modulation pedal still use separate Phase pedal (mostly MXR Phase). I can not understand why. They are not satisfied with a sound quality of Phase built in Mobius or there is another reason why the put extra Phase pedal?. Thanks. Stay safe.

[@DAVEWEINERGUITAR]

Yeah maybe they just enjoy an effect from a specific, single pedal. Simple as that.

[@kevinr.3542]

Or it can be nice to have similar pedals set at very different settings and being able to quickly access either without having to fiddle with a bunch of knobs. You got you're "light phase" and "heavy phase" both ready to go anytime.

[@josephsocco8277]

Great video. I have my chorus in the loop. I've been thinking about moving it to the front. But after this I'm leaving it in the loop. Thanks. My BIGGEST concern is this dam MXR noise gate. I have it in the loop. Problem is I have a OCD pedal that gives me NOISE when activated. Do I move the noise gate to the front? Do I move it before or after the OCD?

[@mcg413]

Gate before any and all distortion or compression effects, overdrives always in front of the amp; noise gates react weird when they’re placed after, since those effects amplify your noise, making it harder for the gate to distinguish between your playing and the noise. Your issue is probably the wrong noise gate. The MXR gate isn’t the quietest noise gate out there, nor were they ever meant to be (they only reduce noise by 20-26dB), meaning they were definitely not designed to function properly in an amp’s FX loop. I like noise gates where you can run the 4-cable method where the gate is triggered by your guitar playing but applied to what you choose to run into the effects loop of the said noise gate pedal (either the noisy boost/overdrive/distortion/fuzz/compression pedal, or my personal preference, the FX send and return of the amp so it gates any and all possible noise from pedals AND the noise caused by the amp’s distortion). Best ones for this that are extremely quiet and also don’t affect your tone much: -GUPTech SUN (my personal fave, the most tonally transparent of the list, extremely quiet, and just happens to be the cheapest one currently) -TC Electronic Sentry (not the most transparent, but definitely the quietest and would be the cheapest if production wasn’t halted) -Fortin Zuul+ (what the SUN is based on, works just as well, just pricey since it’s coming from a boutique brand; the regular Zuul and Zuul Mini can do this too, but require a 1/4” Y-splitter cable at the guitar input) -ISP Decimator G-String -SMG Cock Blocker (if you can find one, since it was a limited run)

[@thomasestrada5215]

Hi Dave,just had time to catch the end,how can I get a list of gear your selling?

[@larryrock11]

way late to the game here, but i am wanting to run an Eventide H9 in the effects loop. I've heard about the line level from the send peaking out the H9. Do you know of a work around for this issue? Love, love, love your work Dave!

[@DAVEWEINERGUITAR]

Ive run an H9 in amp loops on many tours. I’ve never experienced any peaking issues.

[@larryrock11]

@@DAVEWEINERGUITAR that's awesome! I am excited to run them. I am getting a boss IR200 tomorrow and will be incorporating it on my board for noiseless stages (it is an amp/cab sim with an fx loop). Thanks so much for the reply! I will be seeing you twice in February with Vai and I hope that I have the opportunity to meet you in Charleston during the Evo experience!!!

[@TheTektronik]

My 15-watt amp has an effects loop and I think it's going to be handy since I use amp distortion.

[@acemodean]

Dave, have you checked out the Andy wood compressor from wampler?

[@DAVEWEINERGUITAR]

Not yet.. as I’m currently not using any comps.. but when I’m interested in them again, I certainly will.