Morality

[@trumpbellend6717]

A few basic questions that you will hopefully answer for us all 👇 Is the "unaliving" of babies and children ALWAYS objectively immoral *YES or NO* ? 🤔 If "unaliving" babies and children is alledgedly carried out or instructed by your subjective "God" is it moral *YES or NO* ? 🤔 If "unaliving" babies and children is alledgedly carried out or instructed by a different subjective God is it moral *YES or NO* ?? 🤔 Is your OPINION regarding the "correct" God who's allegedly the basis for morality a "SUBJECTIVE" one or a "OBJECTIVE" one ?? 🙄 Let the mental gymnastics ensue......

[@trumpbellend6717]

My morality tells me that *"Buy your slaves from the heathen nations that surround you"* Is not nor ever was a "moral" instruction and certainly not a moral reference standard that anyone should adhere or aspire to. Do you agree *YES or NO* ?? 🤔

[@trumpbellend6717]

Morality is the cognitive process of differentiating between human intentions, decisions, and actions that are appropriate from those inappropriate. The recognition and evaluation of the consequences our choices have with regards to ourselves and others. My NOT believing in a mythological god in no way impedes the ability of forming such moral assessments. We are self aware conscious pain and emotion feeling individuals capable of love or hate, incredible acts of altruism or depravity. It's how we navigate through life and these potential extremes that define us, not our belief ( or lack of ) in anyone's specific subjective invisible "God"

[@trumpbellend6717]

Let me give you a scenario to demonstrate that moral "good" does NOT depend on any "God" 👇 let's say the there is indeed a "creator god and let's say we all become aware of this one true "creator God" and understand implicitly and precisely how he wants us to live our lives and the rules that govern this but .................. We also learn that following said rules would infact lead to humanity suffering an eternity of torture and suffering. 😱😱 Would it still be a "GOOD" thing to follow said rules ??? Would we be "justified" in following them ?? 🤔 *I would emphatically say NO to both questions* Indeed the total opposite would be the case following the rules would be a "BAD" thing and we would be entirely justified in NOT following them. This is because the words "Good" and "Bad" in actuality refer to our desires with regard to "WELLBEING" and the actualization of a situation that conforms with said desires, regarding wellbeing and the values it incorporates not the perceived desires or nature of a "creator" Now let's change our "God" to the Christian one, now we recognise that *EVEN IF* he exists and the things he tells us ( his laws ) would lead to an eternal paradise, it would only be "GOOD" to follow said laws because of their conforming with *"OUR"* perception of "WELLBEING" Now call me fussy but I don't think its "Good" to kill children for making fun of baldness ( as the biblical God did ) Nor to own people as "PROPERTY" for forced labour. For the life of me I can't see how the execution of people who gather sticks on a sabbath could ever be said to be "Good" 🤔 I could go on and on and on .....

[@trumpbellend6717]

The word _true_ means something is based on facts, not imagined. _Truth,_ on the other hand, refers to the real facts about something. It's *_"objectivley true"_* that the world has believers in many different subjective invisible "Gods" but the *_"objective truth"_* of said believers beliefs is a different matter 😜

[@orthodoxws]

Thanks for all your questions! I appreciate the dialogue and the logical approach that you are taking. We'll try to answer them in the next video. Did you watch the whole first video? It lays the general framework for understanding the specifics. Would you agree that your underlying questions could be summarized/synthesized as follows? 1) Can the killing of innocents be considered objectively moral solely because it is commanded by a deity? 2) Is morality objective only if rooted in God, or can it be defined by human well-being and universal principles? 3) How can one reconcile the biblical God’s actions or commands with a consistent and universal standard of morality? 4) Should moral goodness be defined by alignment with divine will, or by its consequences for human well-being?

[@trumpbellend6717]

@orthodoxws 🤔 Hmm no, surely the most pertinent questions must be ...is your "opinion" with regards the "right" God subjective or objective?? Can we ground morality in "any" God or just the particular one YOU determined is the "right" one out of the many thousands man has invented ?? If your answer is the latter then in actuality its *YOU* and YOUR SUBJECTIVE OPINION that is determining morality dear. if your answer is the former, then asserting objectivity to any moral claim based upon a "God" becomes a completely vacuous useless concept

[@trumpbellend6717]

@@orthodoxws 1) Nothing more than the ultimate appeal to authority. This same reasoning can and indeed HAS been used to justify a plethora of attrocities carried out by the religious. Indeed using this reasoning if God were to order the boiling of children alive it then becomes moral to do so. So those doing the child sacrificing to Moloch were merely carrying out the wishes of their God. They too just like you could then say any action ordered by our subjective God becomes moral.

[@trumpbellend6717]

@@orthodoxws 2 ) Morality is subjective, we set the rules HOWEVER that does NOT mean we cannot make objective statements about morality. Let me give you an analogy perhaps then you will understand........ Our metric reference standards for weights, distance ( kilometers, meters, centimetres ect ) was originaly a man made concept, arbitrarily concieved with no divine dictate involved. Yet once it becomes accepted and a pre- agreed consensus reached it functions perfectly. A "meter" is not some vague "about this big" concept that varies dependant on culture or God. We can OBJECTIVELY measure things "from within our pre-agreed metric reference framework" 😜 Precisely the same applies to our moral reference standard, it too requires only an agreed upon reference standard in order to function. Can you think of a better standard to aspire and adhere to than one based upon human well-being, empathy, equality and respect ??? 🤔

[@trumpbellend6717]

@@orthodoxws 3 ) One cannot, don't forget we have multiple examples of God changing his mind on moral issues in the bible. So if tomorrow God were to once again demand we _"Buy our slaves from the heathen around us"_ Or kill people who worship another God then slavery and genocide are no longer abominations, but moral dictates. 🤔