MovieBob Reviews: Iron Fist

[@BlackNerd94]

1. Danny: No more traps. No arrests. Now we deal with Bakuto the way we should have from the beginning! Davos: *kills Bakuto* Danny and Colleen: What the hell, man? You can't just kill people! There are consequences!! 3 episodes later Hogarth to Danny and Colleen: You two are wanted criminals. Either turn yourselves in, or prove your innocence now. Danny: I have to kill Harold. I WILL kill him and end this. Colleen: No, Danny. It's too risky. I have to be the one to do it. Danny to Harold during finale when he can just kill him: It's over. You're going to prison. *Harold then proceeds to get to his gun and shoot Danny. Ward arrives and shoots, kills Harold...* 2. Danny: I trust this person! Why don't you?! Danny 2 episodes later: What? I've been lied to! I can't trust that person anymore! Danny 2 episodes later: What?! I trusted you! Danny 2 episodes later: I can't trust you, but I need your help. Danny 2 episodes later: You betrayed me?! Danny 2 episodes later: *cries* You lied?! My parents!!

[@ArcaneAzmadi]

So, does this mean the DC fanboys will FINALLY stop with the "Bob's just a biased anti-DC pro-Marvel hater fanboy!" bullshit? No, of course it doesn't. Since when have fanboys ever been reasonable about anything?

[@AzureArc]

They clearly just forgot to pay Bob for this one, right? :V

[@Launchpad05]

Apparently, they didn't.

[@coreylucas5346]

Yes In my point of view Yes. People are seeing that critics are not Marvel only people.

[@coreylucas5346]

He said iron fist is suicide squad bad and that's saying something. He like Supergirl more than Iron Fist.

[@zaphero5518]

Yeah, seriously can the bias and tone claims stop? Marvel put out Iron Fist and critics hate it because it a bad show. DC made the Flash and everyone loves it because it is good. Lego Batman hit theatres and everyone loved it. Logan was dark and depressing and everyone loved it. People hate the DCCU because it's bad, not because of tone or company bias. Deal with it.

[@snatchX626]

I love how bob's boston accent really comes out when he's pissed off.

[@Peringon]

Quick questions to THIS version of Danny Rand: You're buddhist, right? Then why your whole story arc is trying to get stuff? Isn't "wanting" something that brings misery and despair? This show biggest fault is that it could've had a great story if it'd just had paid the slightest attention to Danny's religion (Much in the same way Daredevil does with Matt)

[@josephcorridon9314]

That sounds like a fascinating idea.

[@Altorin]

Jude Quinn to be fair, is he really Buddhist though? Cause.. He comes from kun lun and I'm pretty sure they worship dragons there. And dragons are all about getting stuff.

[@mortiferamorphasmus]

Honestly the could have just taken This concept and said "Hey, Danny, you betrayed your beliefs that said Stuff=Bad, so here is the consequences... Suffering." and have that been a character arc. Not so much learning something new but realising Kun Lun was right and the corporation is kinda worthless

[@theMoporter]

@@mortiferamorphasmus That was the attempted theme of Season 2, I believe.

[@erubin100]

Can we all at least agree Madam Gao was really awesome and severely underused? I really hope they include her more in the future.

[@JnEricsonx]

Yeah, I'd like to know WTF is her deal. She's been obviously alive hundreds of years, and isn't jumping to have Danny dead.

[@Talwyn22]

Agreed - Gao indicated she was originally from K'un-L'un which begs the question - why is she with the Hand now?

[@Azmodeus87]

She was a scene stealer from day 1. I hope she becomes Danny's arch enemy, with Davos as her right wing man.

[@Humphking]

erubin100 YES! She honestly creeped me the fuck out

[@Getwright-]

very underused. very. i mean she would open palm daredevil in season one but didnt even try to fight back against iron fist?

[@asukalangleysoryu7430]

Ironically, I got an ad for Iron Fist. Also, while CSI: Cyber may be bad, I still think Criminal Minds: Beyond Borders is worse.

[@pyrolee17]

Oh that's a train wreck

[@katanaridingremy]

It was amazing how they never showed any of the traditional Hand ninjas at all in this. It was all military men And YA types in training to be ninjas. I get it this was a separate sect from What Daredevil dealt with, but also not entirely since Madame Gao was still part of the original Hand sect That Daredevil fought, but none of Her Hand ninjas appear at all in this. Really weird in the martial arts TV show.

[@manjiimortal]

I actually think that was a good thing, because the whole "ninjas-flying-around-New-York" thing from DD just felt so out of place and bizarre. Sure, have Hand members use bladed weapons and stuff (which they did in Iron Fist), but don't put them on a ninja outfit, have them scale walls and use bows when modern weapons are 1000 time more convenient.

[@katanaridingremy]

I feel where you are coming from but at the same time, these are the qualities that make the Hand the mystical ninjas (some of whom are granted immortality) who they are. Otherwise they might as well be Hydra or A.I.M, but don't get me wrong the point of ninjas are to blend in, so modern black clothing would do as well as traditional black ninja outfit. The point is that there were no ninjas at all with the exception of Bakuto and a few others, everyone else were either soldiers or ninjas in training. Fighting students is hardly suitable opponents for the world's greatest martial arts fighter, as Colleen points out when he hits one of her students. Even Madame Gao, who in Daredevil uses fully trained ninjas, decides to opt instead for outsourcing the majority of her fighters for the duel that she has with Danny.

[@manjiimortal]

Could swear Gao just used fighters in DD, as Nobu was the one using the ninjas in that season (plus I don't think they ever hinted at Gao being part of The Hand, she always felt as having her own doings going). And some concepts just don't mesh well in modernity, with the traditional popular view of the ninja being one of them (and historically ninjas were peasants that would travel around as information gatherers and spies in the most extreme cases, no masks, martial arts or weapons to be had), which was painfully proved in Season 2 of Daredevil. The Hand being a cult like organization, deeply trained in martial arts, and yes they can even have some mystical elements, can work, but it almost feels like parody the moment they all start wearing black masks and fight only with medieval era weapons. Again, doing things like they did with Nobu in DD season 1, where their fight was treated as a special event with a almost ceremonial-like edge to it, thus having Nobu "dress for the occasion" as it may be, worked, much like Danny's gauntlet he was put against by Gao, where his opponents were dressed in a unique manner.

[@katanaridingremy]

manjiimortal Nobu worked under Gao in the Hand. Gao would be like the Underboss and Nobu the head henchman who maintained direct control over the fighters. Nobu was trying to get his own sect in the Hand going in similar fashion to Bakuto though. To be clear though, both Nobu and Madame Gao are skilled ninjas. I think you are getting to hung up on the aspect of the outfits and weapons instead of what I'm referring to when referencing ninjas, which is being the fully skilled fighters. I don't care nearly as much about the weapons being used, other than to the extent that this is a martial arts focused character, story, and TV show. No one on this show is bulletproof (as Harold laments) so using conventional weapons means that the show ends in 30 min as someone just hires a sniper to put a bullet in Danny head from 200 meters out no fuss. The Raid is a perfect example of blending gun and martial arts, and as I've recommended, they should hire that choreographer for this show. The main thing is skilled ninjas (or just call them fighters if that is easier for you to process). Throughout the show Danny fights security guards, police (DEA), some form of military style soldiers, a bunch of students training to be ninjas, a varied group of fighters most of whom are (to be fair) skilled fighters, but only two Bakuto and the Drunken Master style fighter (maybe also the chic that poisons Danny) are actually the Hand ninjas. So again, for a show about the greatest martial arts fighter "...destroying the Hand" there's very little of that going on in this show.

[@katanaridingremy]

Dundrael I don't know if any of you actually read the comics that the Hand appear in, but this TV show is actually based on comic books and the Hand are a well known commodity in the Marvel universe. Now, in our real world ninjas are no longer a thing and may have been presented, used and looked totally different from Daredevil or whatever but I don't care about ninjas being accurate to real life, I care about them being accurate in the Marvel universe that these shows are based on. Daredevil had the most comic book accurate appearance. I'm willing to forgo the need for the traditional ninja outfits for the sake of modern sensibilities and making sense in the presented medium, but one crucial aspect that makes the Hand who they are is that they are Ninja assassins. Moving through the darkness silently and mystically [sp], kicking butt easily, and leaving without a trace.I grew up reading Wolverine, some Daredevil, I'll admit no Iron Fist until the last year or two, and various X Titles that occasionally featured the Hand as villains and they are always depicted the same. You need your best fighters to stand a chance against them,and the Hand aren't sending the c-squad still in training noobs to do the job. So change the outfits, use modern weapons sparsely when it makes sense but always employ the fully skilled fighters not randoms lol give us epic fight scenes where Danny employs his varied fighting styles to defeat this real hidden global threat. Yes I will admit that the fight scene at the end of Daredevil S2 really dropped the ball as well none of these shows are perfect but Daredevil isn't and has never been considered the Greatest martial arts fighter and we didn't get that with this iron fist show. I do give the show credit for giving us a glimpse into how the Hand are recruiting and assimilating throughout modern society into all forms of industry. I especially liked the Hand chic that worked at the hospital which helped explain earlier scenes and harken back to Daredevil as well

[@nitromagilou597]

Well, considering the high marks Daredevil, Jessica Jones, and Luke Cage has made, I guess it makes sense for people to be disappointed on how Iron Fist not being as good as those shows. However, this still got me interested in this show. Not just to catch up on the Netflix Marvel Universe, but I'm curious on seeing how "bad" it really is. I mean, I liked Suicide Squad. And I even thought it was pretty bad, but I still enjoyed it.

[@ThePa1riot]

Matthew Cool As a fellow enjoyer of Suicide Squad I can tell you you're pretty on point. Not as good as its sister shows by a county mile and could have been better, but what we get is still enjoyable.

[@VengadorDorado91]

3 episodes in, it's really bland and it lacks a certain thematic identity that the other Marvel/Netflix shows do have (vigilantism/religion in DD, feminism in JJ and race identity in LC). not to mention Danny is the least likeable of all the Defenders so far, not completely unlikeable for me but still. even Jessica Jones is more likeable in her asshole-ish behavior. even the villain is bland, he's not a scene stealer like Kingpin, Kilgrave or Cottonmouth. hell, he's not even at Diamondback's level.

[@tiralana8360]

I found Danny very likable actually. I actually have a hard time watching Jessica Jones, in part, because I finder HER to be so thoroughly unlikable as a person.

[@oscarramos5681]

Who's Diamondback?

[@Altorin]

Oscar Ramos diamondback is the actual antagonist from luke cage

[@ChloeAriT]

They should have just done a Heroes for Hire show.

[@JnEricsonx]

They better not fuck up showing the friendship between Danny and Luke-seriously.

[@CW257866]

Yeah, or just have introduced Danny as a supporting character in Luke Cage, like Cage was in Jessica Jones.

[@HarryLimeUK]

Probably the only reason to have Rosario Dawson's character in it was to provide some figleaf of a backstory for Luke Cage & Iron Fist. Unlike Jeri Hogarth, Claire had nothing else to contribute and it would have had no impact if she'd been cut out all together.

[@CW257866]

Well, other than that she was a breath of fresh air as far as the characters we must spend time with, I agree that she was pointless to the narrative, other than setting her up as the unifier in Defenders. I found it particularly painful how hard they forced her to be there and stay. The reason she had to go to China was incredibly flimsy. It's even worse that she didn't think about contacting Daredevil. And then they decided to have her hold her own when fighting along side Iron Fist and Wing. And I screamed at the TV when she went down to get the pizza by herself.

[@ThePonderer]

I think Iron Fist is around Thor 2's level, with Ward Meachum in place of Loki. I'd never compare it to Steel, Catwoman, or especially Suicide Squad (which on the technically level is far worse than even BvS) but it's certainly not a *Good* show from where I'm standing. The worst thing about it is easily Danny Rand himself; the first time the MCU has ever completely screwed up a protagonist, even on the level of casting.

[@IcoOst]

I sometimes wonder what ppl expect, I expected entertainment, and I got it, and it was okay, not great, but ok, I don't get the hate at all

[@ThePonderer]

People expect entertainment, engagement, good acting, decent writing, and didn't get it.

[@ThePonderer]

I think Iron Man 3 is actually a great movie, so o can't agree there.

[@ThatJaymsWisdom]

I expected all of these things and would say I got *some* of them. It's absolutely the worst Marvel Netflix show and Danny is indeed one of the poorest parts but i still don't think it's as wholly awful as it has been criticised as being and there were definitely moments and characters that I found entertaining.

[@ThePonderer]

You're free to that opinion.

[@TheTocuba]

Fun Fact, in the new Netflix show "13 Reasons Why", the thirteen reasons the girl kills herself are the thirteen episodes of Iron Fist

[@Netherfly]

There's a scene in the first episode where Danny is in a park at night, and is approached by a very friendly and helpful homeless man. And Danny is a complete dick to him. Which sets the tone for the rest of the series. I do disagree about the lack of comic-book silliness being a weakness. To me, all of the "heavy" comic book elements have been the weakest parts of the Netflix shows. Daredevil was may more fun as a legal drama than an action show; Jessica Jones was cooler as a Noir Detective thriller with supernatural elements, but even then the "hurdur I'm superman" bullshit got old in the first episode. So as far as I'm concerned, the whole drama about Danny reclaiming his old life absolutely was sufficient for a full arc... had it been written well. It wasn't. Also, it desperately needs to be pointed out how blatantly racist the show is. It's not so much a matter of "Wealthy White Man Is The Best Asian," so much as it is the writers failing to realize that "Asia" is not a single country/culture. They conflate Japanese, Chinese, Indian and even bits of Tibetan culture into the kind of broad racist caricature that I haven't really seen outside of Victorian literature. It's like writers don't know *anything* about Asia outside of what they've seen in comic books and shitty 70s Kung Fu movies with lazy English dubs.

[@tiralana8360]

Funny how you don't mention that Danny apologizes for his behavior and befriends that man. But then mentioning that would kind of interfere with the narrative of Danny being a horrible person wouldn't it? And there's that accusation of racism too. Only time I ever see this much fail in one comment is when Bob gets on his self righteous political soapbox.

[@BlindedBraille]

@Outerdimensionreviews It still shows how shit the writing is. If I turned in a pliot script like that it would probably go in the trash, not sure how that made it to shooting (probably because it's Marvel TV, but who knows). Plus, it's out of character for Danny to be a complete dick given the type of conditions he lived in for the last 15 years. It just comes off a bit werid from a writing stand point.

[@tiralana8360]

Did you miss the part where (SPOILER ALERT) they sort of straight up explain the reason for his emotional instability at multiple points in the show? You know, survivor's guilt and a great big heaping helping of rage because on some level he knew someone had set them up to be murdered? How the monks hadn't taught him to deal with those feelings but merely shove them aside so he could be their Immortal Weapon? I mean I caught all that from episode one and knew that this would be part of his journey from the trailers because it's in keeping with the kind of character arcs each show taken.

[@BlindedBraille]

You say they explain his instability in multiple parts of the show then say you say caught it all from episode one. I will take your word since I'm not done watching the show, but I still stand by the fact that the show started off very poorly compared to Daredevil. I can buy the emotional instability part but from what I can remember this isn't mentioned in the pliot. I will go back to check though.

[@tiralana8360]

The doctor, Claire, even Madam Gao all talk to Danny about it at different points in the series.

[@Gojiragon]

So what I am hearing is that, in this case, is that the netflix show's instance on following the source material while STILL wanting on keep things dark, gritty and realistic, even for a character like Danny (HE PUNCHED A FUCKING DRAGON), is its ultimate downfall. Making it this "realistic" just made everything either boring or even more ridiculous than it already is (In a bad way), from the sound of things.

[@JnEricsonx]

Sorta, yeah. Danny is supposed to be a much more bright figure, in this case, a more optimistic balance to the other three Defenders, who, let's face it, have enough issues to sell subscriptions.

[@drksideofthewal]

Either this should have gotten a bigger budget, and had most of it take place in K'unn L'unn, or they should have done Moon Knight instead. He's also a rich guy, but he's got interesting psychological issues including split personalities. He's also inspired by a foreign culture, he worships the Egyptian moon god, but they could have sidestepped the whole "cultural appropriation" thing. Also, it's sort of ambiguous whether Moon Knight has powers or not, which is yet another interesting dynamic. But now that they've done this, it's probably too much to ask for another series focused on a billionaire.

[@ThePa1riot]

julianarwen I liked this show, but oh yes you are right about that. My early predictions were this was going to be the equivalent to phase 1 Thor. The audience was brought in with the semi-plausible Iron Man and Hulk, now they had the chance to throw in the really weird and outright magical elements. Instead Iron Fist opted to outright abscond with the mystical Wuxia dimension and punching a dragon to death!

[@Altorin]

No the problem is they didn't want to spend money to set it in an interesting place or pay for actual decent fight choreography. There is nothing about iron fist that couldn't have been salvageable with a couple episodes set in kun lun or some fight choreography to match daredevil's.

[@francis6775]

I still wish that the main villains in Daredevil S2 had been the Irish new york gangsters instead of The Hand. Whether this is because I prefer gangsters to ninjas, or because Marvel just don't make Ninjas as interesting as they should be, I'm not sure.

[@manjiimortal]

Ninjas just aren't interesting, and they feel out of place in Marvel. It was one thing just having Nobu in DDS01 wear the ninja outfit for one episode, acting like a mid-dungeon boss enemy for Matt, while he was wearing a suit for all of his previous appearances, and his men did so likewise, which worked, it was another to have an army of ninjas using swords and bows running around New York city in a modern setting.

[@thedashboard9562]

Everything in season 2 involving Punisher and regular street crime and corruption was great. All that shit with Elektra and the Hand felt like something they should have saved for another season.

[@soyborne.bornmadeandundone1342]

I hear ya... They already did ninjas in the first season. Ninjas again in season 2 felt meh... And worst of all... The punisher didn't minigun the ninjas at the end! BOOO!!!

[@manjiimortal]

As amazing as that would have been, that's not something you could do, as that would prove within the narrative how inefficient the whole ninja deal was. Because if you have 20 guys with swords going against one guy with a minigun, lots of ammo, and a good distance between them, the guy with the gun will win.

[@erubin100]

manjiimortal It's always been odd to me how the so-called "big, scary, world-consuming Hand" wouldn't even consider using guns in their fights. You know what would be interesting? Scary guys in black that are a.) immortal, b.) know ninjitsu, c.) know how to conceal themselves from opponents with heightened senses, and d.) USE GUNS! Tell me that's not the scariest thing you've ever heard!!!

[@mercurywoodrose]

i watched 9 episodes recovering on the couch from a massive leg infection, on very strong painkillers. it wasnt bad, what i can recall of it. this is NOT a recommendation for the show. its a recommendation for massive leg infections with strong painkillers.

[@StephenLeGresley]

I am a hard core fan of comic books and while trying to binge watch this show i found myself constantly distracted. When I watched Jessica Jones, I couldn't tear myself away from the screen, even for lunch or dinner. But while trying to slug through Iron Fist, even during the action scenes I was looking at my phone or switching over to facebook. It was a chore to get through and thats never a good sign for a TV show. If I were doing a "How I would fix this" video and I highly recommend Bob do that. I would start by saying that it's not that hard of a formula and theres basically two avenues I would've gone with it. 1) "Big Trouble" Think about it for a second, a white guy shows up thinking he's unbeatable and wiser then everyone else suddenly thrust into an area where he's clearly not is not only a source for some light hearted fun but also provides a good character arc. He has to get over his own ego and self interest in order to save his family and friends and find his place in a world no foreign to him. 2) "Tarantino" In other words, go old school kung fu movie style. It worked well for Jessica Jones using old school Noir elements and even more so with the Blacksploitation homage that was Luke Cage. Daredevil is gritty modern day ninja drama so make Iron Fist an old school out right kung fu samurai blow out. Basically go "Kill Bill"/Bruce Lee "Enter the Dragon" on this. Leave the corporate crap out of it for the most part, have it for the first episode or two and then let it fall to the backdrop, have Hogarth in the background working on it and then have a scene in the final episode where she let's him know it's worked out and he's now in full control of his company. And how hard is it to film his training? Nightmare on Elm Street 4 basically turned a garage into a dojo, so a low budget is no excuse for leaving out the most interesting aspect of his character background. Lastly, give him an enemy that has a chance of beating him. Danny never really gets defeated, he gets stabbed but then hes okay shortly after, he loses his chi but it never really poses too big of a problem, even one of the characters goes as far as saying "Hey even without that your still hard for us to beat" so theres no real stakes in him losing it and I have to ask, did that last fight scene between him and Harold not look and feel very much like the Affleck fight from the end of the Daredevil movie?

[@ThatguyP912]

That intro was a beautiful blend of spoiler warning and short summary of the review. Bravo Chipman, bravo

[@alialmuhanna4938]

Well, that's 13 hours that just cleared up from my schedule …

[@joshwilkins9138]

I think you were a little harsh in some areas but as always you defend your position so I'm not complaining by any means. Great video

[@AzureArc]

I'm five episodes in at the moment and while I'm not nearly as scathingly disappointed in this series as Bob is, I already knew for a fact by around episode two that this would be my least favourite of the Defenders solo series' so far. They made a mistake of spending all of the actual halfway decent Hand and Madame Gao content in both seasons of Daredevil for sure. You could have removed that content from DD S01 and just placed more of the focus on the issues surrounding the Punisher and the morality of Vigilantism and how it conflicts with DD's own faith and morality and conflicting belief within the justice system and how far one should be willing to go when taking things into their own hands in season two so it could also be cut from there and spent more time developing all of it to place into Iron Fist and the entire Defenders ecosystem would have been better served for it. But that's not what they did so as for what we've got so far. Yeah it's slow. I've been decently intrigued, the action ranges from pretty okay to kinda lacklustre but the Bulletproof Monk vibe it gives off helps me get into it a little more because nostalgia. Danny isn't likeable yet but I'm hoping that once we've slogged through all this origin crap he'll be more palatable in Defenders. Also hoping that the time spent between Iron Fist and Defenders has upped his action game a bit so he doesn't look so awkward trying to look like he knows how to fight. I like Colleen Wing, I like the Meachum siblings, appearances from Hogarth have been just great I love Hogarth as a character, and yeah I'm guilty of being a sucker for Claire content so I'm looking forward to her appearance. But I'm under no illusions that this'll rank highly on the scale of MCU related things I've least to most enjoyed. Doesn't even come close to touching DD Season 1 or Jessica Jones. And while Luke Cake had a bit of a weaker second half I still loved that show on the whole so it rests comfortably above DD Season 2 which itself is pretty high above Iron Fist for me right now, flaws and all.

[@swanpride]

Spoiler Alert: Iron Fist handles the Hand a thousand times better than Daredevil does. In fact, the show managed to salvage what was beforehand my least favourite villain in the MCU.

[@lady8jane]

What you describe is pretty much my main problem in this show: EVERY CHARACTER was more interesting than Danny Rand. :D

[@lizard450]

dundrael honestly I didn't think it got better until episode 11 .. and even then it was luke warm at best.

[@RubberyCat]

So very differing opinions and impressions.

[@Altorin]

swanpride spoiler alert Danny rand gives the hand exactly what they want because he just has to punch every stupid thing.

[@Steve0C]

I'll agree with quite a bit of this, but I thought that the arcs that Ward, Joy, and their dad took in the mid to late season kept me willing to watch in order to see how those arcs were going to unfold more than I did for anything relating to the hand or Danny.

[@kylev.1163]

I love bob but I felt like he jumped onto the same train as other critics. The show really isn't that bad, it's decent, maybe not as good as the other shows, but it isn't terrible. Something to hold people over until Defenders.

[@KingOfMadCows]

When you think about it, Danny achieved nothing except inconvenience the Hand. What did he do? He destroyed one drug lab in New York with the help of the Hatchet Men. He destroyed one drug lab in China. He captured Madame Gao, who was then captured by Bakuto. He helped Harold and Joy cut off the Hand's access to Rand's resources. He defeated Bakuto. So what's to stop the Hand from coming back the day after Danny leaves to put the screws to the Meachums again? Bakuto's death didn't matter since he wasn't a top leader and they can just bring him back. All the Hand's lower level followers are still around. Those assassins in the tournament are still around. Bakuto's teenagers with attitude were probably moved to another compound. There's absolutely no safeguard preventing the Hand from doing to Ward and Joy what they did to Harold. It made no sense why Danny thought he defeated the Hand at the end.

[@Pooltastik]

Well, to be fair, this is pre-ultimate-ninja-sage-bad-ass Danny, who is, yes, floundering through a series of increasingly terrible situations he was completely unprepared for. So, that part I can at least get behind. The pacing, though, oh god; whenever the plot didn't involve Danny, Colleen, Claire and/or Gao just dragged on and on and on~ Bakuto went the way of Dooku, being there just to be there and going out like a bitch. But speaking of Gao, holy shit did they expand her character; she stole every scene she was in. Definitely a big step down for Marvel's Netflix-verse, but still salvageable.

[@brianhogg358]

I just finished watching the season. Bob's impression makes me wonder if we both saw different shows.

[@drow_Lilith9940]

noit so much different show just come out with differnt views i myself really enjoyed it

[@tofu_golem]

Yeah, it's the weakest of the Marvel-Netflix shows, but I just don't get why it's getting this level of hate from critics. No idea at all.

[@MoreDakka545]

Paul T Sjordal most only got the first six episodes which really did drag like hell for the most part

[@IcoOst]

It was entertaining, thats all I wanted, it was better then the second half of luke cage, I wonder if bob is catering to his SJW audience

[@Kekkersboy]

Hans Olo I tried watching it. But the show was just so boooring. none of the characters are likeable. Are some people upset about the casting sure. But I'm one of the people that believed that changing his race would ruin the character of Danny. the actor just has no charisma. Luke Cage was a mediocre main character but at least he had the second best supporting cast of all of these shows.

[@camethedawn683]

Awesome review. Moviebob reminding me why he's my go to critic for all things film and culture.

[@isg2015]

personally, I didn't think it was that bad. Danny did feel all over the place sometimes but I never felt like it was absolutely terrible. But maybe that's because I have so many hours invested into the Netflix Marvel TV Shows

[@oliviawilliams6204]

I actually did enjoy the stuff involving the hand personally

[@christophercano8032]

I just made myself cry imagining a world where they got the RZA to be the showrunner instead of a guest director, and basically made it a modern Last Dragon.

[@Jonatron101]

I liked the whole thing, except maybe Danny being an idiot. Grew to love all the Meechum bullshit and the show actually made me sort of interested in Hand after being bored stiff by it in Daredevil Season 2.

[@BigBangMike]

I actually like the angle that you brought up. The sleazy Abercrombie rich kid who spend a summer some where coming back as a unrealizing parody of the Asian culture. It would have been cool for people to think we was that at the beginning, then for him to prove them wrong and being an actual embodiment of eastern philosophy.

[@Roper122]

It isn't the best Netflix show. But it isn't terrible. I don't get the need to bash it so hard.

[@MagnusPrimeZ]

main character is white, thats it, the show its ok, but...the main character is white and idiots like this guy are triggered and bashed the show so hard it had 0% in rotten tomatoes for a while, BEFORE the show came out

[@timothydeshawn8050]

He gives multiple reasons for why he doesn't like it but you still think "white bashing" is it? Lol okay bro

[@redbigun]

Timothy Deshawn Idiots will always use the "sjw" excuse for this show. It's simple, Scott Buck is a shit showrunner. I'd love to see the bullshit excuses these people make up once Inhumans possibly gets slammed.

[@pyrolee17]

I was more interested in the mechem plot line then the iron fist plot. I had to skip whole scenes to get back to ward and his dysfunctional family problems. Danny is not very fun and comes off as kind of an doush.

[@thereccher8746]

Give me a break. I have yet to see on, not ONE scathing review that didn't end up mentioning him being white. People's view's on this okay show are being poisoned by the leftist regressive kool-aid and you'de have to be godamn blind not to see it.

[@SuperSongbird21]

I think they were trying to make Iron Fist a variant of the kind of character Star Lord is - and it didn't work.

[@KazamaFury]

I actually enjoyed the series and I can't wait till the Defenders to finish the fight against the Hand.

[@cr0nosphere]

That drunken master scene was one of the only things decent about that series.

[@RaviBMaharaj]

It's interesting that you didn't talk about the Meachum siblings, because they had probably the largest arcs of any characters in the series, and were thoroughly entertaining. Especially Ward

[@Jayfive276]

You gonna review agents of shield season 4 when it's done Bob?

[@joelmole3157]

Even so, the fact that it took them THIS long to a bad product is impressive. Let's hope it's just a fluke though and Guardians of the Galaxy vol. 2, Spider-Man Homecoming, The Defenders, Thor Ragnarok and The Punisher picks this up and- holy crap are Marvel busy this year!

[@trouper1127]

The only positive thing in the show for me was honestly the character Ward. Super interesting and complex character that was very well performed.

[@MeeplandHeights]

I kind of want to read the summaries of each episode so I can watch the last one and see what Bob was talking about

[@ForestFWhite]

When Arrow season 1 opened with the douche-bro/man-child main character, and then swapped him out for someone with some depth with the douche-bro/man-child as an alter ego, I watched that show every week. When Green Hornet and 21 Jump Street opened with the douche-bro /man-child characters and then spent the rest of their running time making fun of them, I loved it. That somehow marvel+netflix managed to not see these successes and do a douche-bro/man-child that does nothing but be a douche-bro/man-child is frankly tragic. I am glad I didn't watch it.

[@groovymovies390]

I have two things to say: 1) On the bright side, at least people can't accuse Bob of being biased towards the MCU anymore. And 2) If they want to fix Iron Fist, they should just go in a completely different direction next season. Maybe move away from the city and have Danny's arc be about him being more humble. Maybe have him be overconfident and have a new threat beat the snot out of him early on and strip him of his powers. Danny has to therefor learn more about being a hero and a good person. Something like that, I don't know.

[@jronsen9224]

Thank you. I thought that it was just me: I was paying more attention to surfing the web by episode 4 than to the show. I just thought it that there were three plots that each could have been interesting if each one was its own show (Rich kid coming back from the "dead" to reclaim his Father's business; Mystical kung-fu master; or bad Father in hiding and using his son to access the outside world). All three, together, didn't click for me and I think that I will take your advice and skip the rest of the season and go back to binge watching Buffy.

[@yatz57]

Spot on. I managed to make it through the first 6, hoping that it would somehow get better - nada. Problem is, now I'm real worried about The Defenders. Hope to god they don't go back to that unbefuckingily boring Hand storyline - but I'm not very optimistic...

[@lopresti101]

Really? Suicide Squad?! Catwoman?! It's not that horrible. I mean it's bad but not like shit shit.

[@lopresti101]

I will say though. It can be fixable for Defenders and can at least be...well...Defended.

[@TheShadowKiller97]

lopresti101 yes, as bad. When your character cant go into another tone of voice other than neutro and the twists are as obvious as they get.. yeah. And dont talk about the fight scenes. A couple of students with a camera and movie maker could edit something better. There where times the fists dont even connect. And lets talk about characters: they are so cliched, they look straight out of the arrowverse. Not to talk about making the worst decisions. The whole plot could have gone differently by Karen just saying "i could call some friends who would be pissed off if i got killed by the lamest excuse of ninjas since speedracer".

[@ThatJaymsWisdom]

Interesting you mention the "arrowverse" because it felt like Iron Fist was trying to be deliberately different to early Arrow episodes about Ollie returning to his farther's company having been trained to kill on an island. A very similar starting point for both characters which made a lot more sense in Arrow than it did in Iron Fist. They needed the training flashbacks and the willingness to kill that Arrow had early on in this in order for Danny to go from Kung Fu assassin avenging his parents to complex human hero who lives in a world where it's not all that cut and dry. But I think they avoided that route to avoid close comparison and it made the storytelling far to directionless and muddy.

[@ThatJaymsWisdom]

Interesting you mention the "arrowverse" because it felt like Iron Fist was trying to be deliberately different to early Arrow episodes about Ollie returning to his farther's company having been trained to kill on an island. A very similar starting point for both characters which made a lot more sense in Arrow than it did in Iron Fist. They needed the training flashbacks and the willingness to kill that Arrow had early on in this in order for Danny to go from Kung Fu assassin avenging his parents to complex human hero who lives in a world where it's not all that cut and dry. But I think they avoided that route to avoid close comparison and it made the storytelling far to directionless and muddy.

[@mikejonesnoreally]

The thing that gets me about the "Defenders" is that there aren't any of the Defenders in it, so far this just sounds like a Heroes for Hire (sort of) that doesn't want to use that name.

[@Aiddon]

A few thoughts: 1. Really awkward this should come out the same month as the American Ghost in the Shell movie, because now we have two instances of bad productions that have been accused of whitewashing or co-opting Eastern cultures 2. Like Bob was saying on his Twitter, this is an instance of where the Binge Model's flaws are apparent. Had this been a broadcast show you might have had a course correction after a couple weeks of bad reception. 3. Depending on how The Defenders goes down, this could show the problems with the team up model (see also: the DCEU). If one entry is bad and one character is REALLY hated it casts a shadow on the project. Not a great way to lead into the crossover

[@bend2211]

The show was atrocious. Danny was an idiot. David Wenham's weird insight into how Danny might be useful in the first few episodes made no sense and came from nowhere. The personality flip at the end where Ward is the reasonable one and Joy is entertaining the idea of killing Danny make noooo fucking sense. Claire freaking out about the hand and then *not* immediately calling Matt makes no sense, regardless of however they left each other in DD season 2 (I forget, I even forgot LC ended with him going back to prison.) Closest thing to a good scene was the fight vs the drunken master, closest thing to a good episode was the one The RZA directed. They shoulda made him showrunner, because at least he woulda gone balls deep on the kung fu stuff.

[@lizard450]

OMG I love you. Your review is on point and hilarious subbed.

[@Elderahn]

The biggest problem for me was how the story faceplanted after Gao was dealt with, because the other villains/antagonists were not even vaguely compelling. That and yeah, more Kun Lun would have been great.. I did dig the Thunderer guy from the internal dialogue going on with Danny. At least I think it was the thunderer.

[@leoschue8071]

That was an excellent cold open.

[@nimbex117]

"Coming back after being presumed dead, spends the vast majority of its runtime on an incredibly tedious storyline about trying to regain his family company, that requires a bunch of supporting characters and a ridiculously-convoluted conspiracy narrative that is simply impossible to care about and adds nothing to the STORY" ...why do the words "Oliver Queen" keep popping into my head all of a sudden?

[@Light-Rock97]

None of the advertisement got me excited. Not even the first one. My favorites are still Jessica Jones and both Daredevil's. And Luke Cage just didn't respect my time, and kept shifting tones like crazy.

[@marikotrue3488]

Tried to do a "pure" (consecutive /realtime) binge. Had to give myself a 48hour break between episode 6 and 7. Yeah, writing, editing and stunt fighting could have and should have been better. The actors who shine in this series are, Jessica Henwick as Colleen Wing, Rosario Dawson as Claire Temple, Wai Ching Ho as Madame Gao and Carrie-Anne Moss as Jeri Hogarth. Yup all supporting characters, but they got me through all 13 episodes.

[@Altorin]

Watching that guy go insane enough to kill his father and then his response when his father came back was almost worth it to me. Like, that's what luke cage and iron fist were to me. Watching the tertiary villains go batshit insane and kill off the secondary villains to make room for a primary villain. Those two scenes were far and away the best parts of the series. And the more i thought about Danny rand as a character the more i appreciated his portrayal in this. Sure when i was watching it i wanted to rip my own throat out to end it all but as i tried to explain what made him so terrible all the pieces fell into place and the realization i came to was that all of the terrible things about him are basically accurate to his story - that horrible person is exactly who iron fist would be if he actually existed. He might not be comic accurate but he acts just like a kid that was swept away at a young age to learn kung fu from angels. None of that can excuse the fight scenes though. After the brilliance of the stuntwork in daredevil season 1 it just felt like a total slap in the face. The show is called iron fist. If you can't get a-list fight choreography and pull out some hong kong long take fight scenes in a show called iron fist, there is no reason to even bother. I *hate* the guy that plays Danny rand. I hated him in game of thrones. I think I'll hate him in everything. Everytime i see him in anything i just feel like Chris Griffin crying "how does finn jones keep getting work?" it's hard to blame him for what he did to loras tyrell (believe it or not my favorite character in the whole 5 song of ice and fire books) - that falls on the directors.. But I'm starting to see a pattern.

[@arrovor2546]

Yeah Iron Fist certainly had some massive pacing issues, and I don't get what Netflix has against super hero costumes xD

[@roganzar]

So, question Bob, if they take this Danny Rand and Luke Cage and did Heroes for Hire, having them play off each other in a proper buddy movie kind of way, do you think that would improve the Netflix version of the character? Assuming of course better focused narrative and writing in general.

[@sullysosavage365]

Am I the only one who actually liked Iron Fist?

[@bretts8070]

Nope, there are plenty of us! I think Rotten Tomatoes is ample proof that the review community doesn't come close to representing actual opinion on the show. Compare the audience grade to it to see why!

[@plucas1]

IRON FIST currently has an 8.0 on IMDB and an 86% Audience Score on Rotten Tomatoes. Audiences seem to like it almost as much as critics seem to hate it. I wonder what the disconnect is?

[@umjackd]

Honestly, audience scores for anything in a big franchise tend to be skewed. People in general are just loyal to franchises. The numbers on MoS, BvS and Suicide Squad were all skewed like this out of that same fan loyalty. They want to like things because they want to see their heroes do cool things in a big way, despite it maybe not being an actually good film. In short, people are forgiving when it has a big brand attached to it. You can make a bad movie as long as you don't piss off the fans. It worked for Star Wars, after all.

[@Warphorn]

Because (and I'm being generous to both sides here) audiences watch and critics analyse.

[@sjhmagic1]

the disconnect is called fan-boyism, horrible disease.

[@luf4rall]

because most people don't vote, especially if they don't really like it

[@lizard450]

Yeah somehow there are more audience reviews for Iron Fist on RT than there are for DD S1

[@Zarastro54]

Can we also mention how totally impotent Dany's Iron Fist is? He can never "get it up" so to speak when he needed it, and when he could, it was at inopportune times in short bursts. Yes I suppose they were going for "he hasn't mastered it yet" angle, but the execution just made him seem weak and useless. Combined with the fact that he always acted like tough shit despite him hardly having control over the fist, made it all the more annoying and pathetic.

[@tehPete]

Quality review as always, Bob. It's not that bad imo, but it's clear they've no idea what they want to do with the characters or story - it feels like it was thrown together in a hurry by someone who was just doing it as a hobble between jobs. Fingers crossed they can bring someone in to sort things out for season 2, because there's a good story in there somewhere and with some proper direction it could really come together. AoS season 4 though is getting awfully close to dropping off my watch list entirely, it's all over the place and the breaks don't make it any easier to follow. I never thought I'd say 'I miss Ward', but here we are.

[@DuhNile]

So no wierd Mystic Kung fu, no immortal Dragon, no great fights, and no sense of grand scale of the mystic city. Oh but it's got court cases. Who thought this was a good idea?

[@Stanlos]

I think I am the only person on the planet that liked more than disliked IRON FIST. Love the HAND especially Madame Gao, Love the shared characters especially Claire and Hogarth, and really Loved that he didn't just get his company automatically upon returning. Love the Meachams and the storyline with Harold.

[@JnEricsonx]

My only real problem with the action is that Danny is supposed to be a fighter whose power is on par with or above Captain America. He's literally a superhuman fighter in that sense. He should be one-hitting mooks like freaking Bruce Lee, and even Bruce understood why in his films.

[@pirksaddict]

I actually like Iron Fist better than Luke Cage. It honestly kinda feels like Iron Fist is trying to make you dislike everyone in an effort to turn the tables at some point. That? I actually kind of enjoy. I personally like to corporate cloak and dagger bits that made up the meat of the show. It forces a square peg,the hero, into a round hole, a battlefield that he is in no way trained or prepared for save for the few things he picked up via osmosis as a kid. Basically, he shows up as the chosen hero, convinced he's the chosen hero... And precisely nobody believes him or gives a single solitary crap about it. When he is forced to step up, he does so in a battlefield he is woefully unprepared for and gets is ass kicked. He's the guy with the sword in Indiana Jones. all those fancy moves and training... only to get blown away by things he never even began to consider as viable threats.

[@Errughor]

why does every critic says its unwatchable and super shit? its not a sandler movie, its not suicide squad, its not agents of shield season 1.

[@mickeleh]

I'm an episode three dropout. Glad to have my choice corroborated by an expert.

[@Morbos1000]

I really hope that having the other three main heroes in the Defenders will make Danny Rand more tolerable. Ideally we get through Defenders, Marvel realizes Iron Fist isn't working and they dump the character and instead bring in a different second tier hero for future series.

[@Juel92]

You know you have a great kung fu superhero series when the most interesting part is one of the supporting characters drug withdrawal.

[@Sue_D_Nymn]

I think you are overstating Bob. Yes it suffered from massive flaws and I think the biggest is overthinking what would be a good story. The fight scenes for Danny lacked that seamless flow that should have been present. They obviously had trouble finding their footing and relied heavily on villains that were not nearly strong enough personality wise to keep the audience engaged. Overall I think it was a weak installment, but that it wasn't quite as bad as you did. I'd go 2 stars with hope that they get the hint and tighten up the next script and season.

[@heavycritic9554]

I guess it had to happen. I disagree with Bob. To me, it's a 2.5-3/4. I think it captures pretty much everything it needs about Danny, and advances the whole thing about the Hand being an elusive and nebulous - fluid, as it were - organization, but nevertheless really dangerous. Danny doesn't really know why he's in New York, and feels completely out of place in every setting he ends up. He doesn't even belong with his old comrade-in-arms. Alienation like that is going to be jarring and make things feel disjointed - if you look at Danny's own reactions to things, they mirror that. He's not sure what's going on or what his place is in all of this, and is trying desperately to get a grip on situations and people that keep slipping through his fingers. This show doesn't feel as grounded and direct as DD, JJ and LC, because it isn't as grounded and direct. It's extremely fluid. The fights, I think work well. His fights are not meant to feel as meaty and bruising as the fights in DD, JJ and LC. He is so far beyond the skill level of most of his opponents, that he just flows through the fights. That's why the Drunken Master fight feels so different, and more engaging - he's being truly tested for the first time in the show, by a man with even more fluidity in his movements. Fluidity is a major theme in the show, btw, as showcased by the opening credits. A lot of flying through the air. A lot of spinning kicks. And, of course, the fluid effect that follows his every move - he ends up completely surrounded by it. Colleen Wing could have been given more agency, yes, but then it would have gotten easier to figure out the twist. It wasn't very hard, but it would have been even easier. She feels a lot like "just a love interest" because of that, and the fact that Danny sort of just sees her like that; a bit of a damsel in distress, even though he knows that she's a badass. Btw: the Iron Fist costume _is_ shown, but not on Danny. It's in the footage from the Chinese attempt at an incursion into K'un-Lun. Is it perfect? Not even close. But I'd say that it's on par with Luke Cage, with the caveat that Finn Jones isn't close to being as charismatic as Mike Colter.

[@norcalroamer5774]

A Moviebob review on a Monday? Damn! I thought is was Friday!

[@CitanulsPumpkin]

I'm 7 episodes in and the best excuse I have is "It's Dynasty with ninjas and heroin." Iron Fist will be better once they wrap up his solo series and he becomes Luke Cage's sidekick full time.

[@ciarannihill]

This is one of the few times I feel the need to disagree with you, Bob. It had plenty of flaws, and could probably have told the same story better in 7 episodes but the moments where it works, it really works. For me, anyway.

[@DwRockett]

I wonder how this one ended up a failure. Marvel is usually pretty good about picking up on stuff that doesn't work, but then again, everyone has to fall at some point

[@armjjb5189]

What kind of production problems? I honestly don't know, I'm just curious.

[@MonteCreations]

How about making the first half the review spoiler free? That way you can give people your opinion on the show without spoiling it for them in case they are interested in watching it but were also interested in your opinion.

[@yozoramikazuki5927]

I still like this show as a guilty pleasure.

[@MarkusObrist]

Am I the only one who really enjoyed the show? I liked Danny and his character, it seemed to make sense...he tries to follow the teachings of the monks with all their wisdoms, but he still is the hurt little American. So he's going through different emotions, that's not bad writing to me.

[@rmeddy]

This wasn't as bad as the critics made it out to be but yeah this was a mess overall, characters and plot didn't work which I didn't mind or expect but the biggest sin is the bad choreography and editing. This was really a weak outing for the Marvel Netflix.

[@Darluk]

There was a CSI cyber? Genuinely surprised by that one...

[@sachikiriyama6705]

I honestly didn't even pay attention to CSI all that much, really. I think the only CBS shows I was actually interested in was The Big Bang Theory (both ironically and unironically), the early seasons of Two & a Half Men, How I Met Your Mother, Intelligence, and Hawaii Five-O.

[@Rabidchu]

So what kept the iron fist comics going? Obviously it was significant enough to build a show on (in somebody's head at least). "Narratively", what does the comic have that the show lacks?

[@Kronical69420]

Form your own opinion. Myself and three other friends binged watched it hungover after St Patrick's Day and we enjoyed it. It actually was the first Marvel Netflix one of my friends had watched and they are hooked now.

[@litterboxstudios]

Haven't seen it yet, still plan to, but the minute Scott Buck was announced as showrunner I got very concerned. That dude is flat-out awful. The last 3 seasons of Dexter were stunningly incompetent. It's amazing he got hired after that fiasco.

[@MagneticSymbiote]

I still don't see what everybody's talking about. I watched the first TEN episodes of Iron Fist yesterday with my friends and we all agreed it was fine! And two of those friends had never even seen a Marvel show before. I'd like to say "Maybe none fans just don't get it" but then I thinks about my other two friends who dont even watch Marvel, and now they're so impressed they wanna try Daredevil out! So with all that in mind, WHAT is everybody complaining about???

[@davidresnick]

As someone who watched the first 10eps and thought it not more awful than I expected, just be warned that the upcoming twists/"surprises"/conflicts kill it 3 or more times over, sorry to be the bearer of bad news

[@Greatkingrat88]

What is everyone complaining about? Um... it's extremely dull, and all the compelling characters are corporate yuppies, whereas Danny and friends are bland at best. The series drags on, the first half of it is completely uninteresting, and the second half is badly executed. Who the hell makes a superhero show whose chief theme is corporate responsibility?

[@Sheepy007]

Well, Iron Fist is a Character completly centered around Kung-fu. Netflix's Iron Fist is at least 60 percent Boardroom drama. Do you see the discrepancy? It wasn't too bad as a show, but it definately was not the kind of show it should've been

[@arklestudios]

This show is so bad. Iron Fist I mean. It is, in my opinion, the first true dud of the MCU. Yes, really. I mean, okay, yeah, Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. sadly peaked early but I still watch it and still enjoy it (mostly), and Doctor Strange was just okay (which was disappointing for me because except for Captain America and Daredevil Doctor Strange was the Marvel Studios character I was *most* looking forward to seeing on screen). But that's *way* more than I can say for Iron Fist, which in all honesty, I probably would've quit at around episode 8 or 9 if it weren't for The Defenders.

[@DakNJaxter]

I can imagine a 4 hour cut of this Series that would have been a lot better.

[@ataridc]

you know it's bad when you watch an entire season and never figure out what tone they were going for or what the show was trying to be about

[@joelcastro4368]

the glasses Bob !THE GLASSES!!!!

[@woolfel]

As a chinese person, I am sooo glad they didn't cast an asian actor. Cuz the producers and directors clearly didn't give a crap about writing, choreography or pacing.

[@Spar10Leonidas]

I actually rather liked what I saw with the Hand this time around. In Daredevil, we saw very little of their leadership and the organization's power structure. We mostly just saw a bunch of nameless, faceless ninjas going up against Daredevil and Elektra over and over again (and this was made up for by the fact that their fight scenes were great). Here, we actually see more of those who make up the Hand, particularly those fighters that we see in Episode 6, and also that power struggle later in the season. That being said, now that I think about it, I don't really understand what their goals were. It seems like all that they cared about was selling drugs and controlling Rand corporation, which isn't very compelling compared to what we saw in Daredevil.

[@Sperium3000]

I would be able to overlook most of the bad stuff if at least the actual kung-fu was well done, but boy is it not.

[@WilliamLevasseur]

I enjoyed it... But I watched Iron Fist with zero previous knowledge, so I wasn't going in expecting anything specific...

[@frankm.2850]

I could have told you Iron Fist was a flaming turd and I didn't even make it through a full episode. Felt like they were trying to do Green Arrow but with magic martial arts superpowers and failing. Right down to the son of a multi-bajillionare businessman is thought dead in a horrific accident but reappears as a badass shit kicker only to find out that evil fucksticks have taken over his dad's operation. Except Arrow did it better.

[@Scorpio3002]

Is it too much to hope that Marvel does an "Edward Norton/Mark Ruffalo"-level recast?

[@Ian_sothejokeworks]

Yeah, they really should never have done this show, at all. If they HAD to put Iron Fist in the N-MCU, they should have made him a plotline character for Luke Cage season 2, much like Elektra was for Daredevil season 2, but more platonic, less sexy. After all, that's really what people most know and like about Iron Fist: he's Luke Cage's buddy! This could have been the expansion of Cage's world that would have been much better to have BEFORE The Defenders, if only to make Daredevil's "odd-man out" role feel more in place: it plays a lot better when everyone but Matt already KNOWS everyone else. Anyway, yeah, Iron Fist was terrible, but that's what happens when you give a weak character a weak series.

[@darmok6556]

Are you going to review the Punisher?

[@EAKugler]

It wasn't that bad. Still way better than Catwoman/Suicide Squad levels. Still, it had a lot of problems. Better fight choreography and direction could have salvaged it. The script was weak and disordered, but not horrible. I think the major stumbling block was just a failure to realize how bad Danny Rand is as a character to begin with.

[@zack2dafuture]

Netflix blew it when punisher didn't unload on the hand at the end of dds2

[@qlipothian]

The only real problems I had with Iron Fist was: The first four episodes had were incredibly boring, the overuse of plane crash flashbacks, the budget and the fact that I was always more interested in the side characters far more than I was interested in Danny.

[@wdcain1]

Ouch! You really drop the ball when the dopey _Ultimate Spider-Man_ cartoon did a better job presenting Iron Fist and his mythos than his own television show. I grew up on Kung-Fu movies and anime so Danny Rand's whiteness never bothered me. But making what should have been a _Bloodsport_ TV show into a corporate suit drama is the wrong way to go with this series. My favorite Iron Fist run is the _Iron Fist: The Living Weapon_ by Kaare Andrews and it is the second most off-the-walls crazy comic I've ever read with ninja nurses, cyborg zombies, D-cup demon spider-women, and the Rand skyscraper transforming into a Megazord to fight a giant dragon! It's like what if Robert Rodriguez and Quentin Tarantino got together to make _Grindhouse_ into a Kung-Fu flick!