Expansion Vessel Testing and repressurise

[@akorika3]

Very informative presentation .

[@mrcombiBedford]

Dear Aymen, thanks for the kind words always helps to make the day better. 🤩👍regards George

[@leedaniels1468]

Turned video off because I'm not a registered gas engineer..but I suppose gas engineers will love watching something that they can do with their eyes closed.

[@mrcombiBedford]

Dear Lee, thanks for comment, unfortunately too many installers don't bother learning or bothering about external EV's. which IS a REQUIREMENT. They deliberately make systems to go from 1bar to 1.5bar or higher which course's sludge, pump failure, heat exchangers to block etc.etc. that's how they make money.🤠😓

[@leedaniels1468]

@mrcombiBedford sorry but my boilers doing my head in and I haven't got the money to get a professional in my apologies. I realise you need to state " gas engineer only" but I'm pretty stressed 😫

[@mrcombiBedford]

Dear Lee, finding a good trustworthy heating engineer is only going to get worse and more expencive. A lot are retiring or just leaving and not enough are joining thus a bit shortage to service or to repair heating systems this was the case in the 70's. Youngsters don't want to get their hands dirty which I can understand. 22 million boilers 80K engineers who can fix, not good.👍Take care.george@@leedaniels1468

[@worldofparker]

thank you, very useful. Why does water ever get into the schraeder valve?

[@mrcombiBedford]

Dear WoP, thanks for asking an interesting question, anything above water breaths AIR which is made up of about 66% nitrogen 12% oxygen 2-5% water the rest is pollution and other bits etc. At sea level its 5% top of mountain 1% we can't breath up there. As we get hot we sweat, in a bathroom it's called condensation, in a vessel its also condensation because the boiler gets hot. If it comes out the valve replace it because the tiny rubber/plastic O ring starts to rot and will fail in weeks, no one would ever find that fault. I have said many times if only installers OVER sized the vessel to keep at 1 bar No sludge / scale or burnt pumps and cold rads. Not many listen to me because a bad system make money. Hope that helps, lovely question, George staszak 😄👍

[@worldofparker]

@@mrcombiBedford thank you for a quick and comprehensive response.

[@brencostigan]

Air composition is 78.08% Nitrogen; 20.95% Oxygen; 0.93% Argon; 0.04% CO2 including some trace amounts of other gases.

[@brencostigan]

@@worldofparkerIt wasn’t comprehensive, he’s just bullshit you and dodged the question - again.

[@robi4387]

@Mr Combi Sales Thanks for your calm friendly presentation. You remind me of the fella who started me off 40 years ago. Just one thing though at 16:15 you say a 3 bedroom house boiler expansion vessel should be pre-charged to 1 bar and you go on to say a larger house will need 1.4 bar. However, the vessels often come with a label that suggests 0.75 bar. Other engineers say 0.9 bar some say 1 bar. Some work through lengthy calculations starting with system volume x coefficients from max - min water temperature = T and consider max & min boiler pressure to check if the expansion vessel is correctly sized, to work out pre-charge and recommend system pressure is pre-charge plus 0.2 bar

[@mrcombiBedford]

Hi Robert, thanks for comment, thing are always changing, what was 10 or 20 years ago are not allowed today, In the 1970 - 2000 no-one thought about CH expansion, even today in 2023 lots of installers don't bother, after 2000 manufactures asked for 1.5bar causing PRV's to open the it was dropped to 1.2 bar now it's 1 bar and will stay there. Unfortunately far too many installers are out of date with the latest rules or read the install manual or go on courses. No one today would fit an open cylinder and loft tanks, is it banned No, why? All systems MUST HAVE an external auto by pass is it done? no. All the best, I have a new video on Sunday 7pm, regards, George Staszak 🤔👍

[@stuartandrews8167]

Hi George. Great video. I recently tried to re pressurise an EV on and Ideal combi that was having pressure loss issues. I noticed that whilst re pressurising the EV, the needle on the pressure gauge was also rising. Would this suggest the EV needs replacing? Thanks

[@mrcombiBedford]

Dear Stuart, Thanks for asking a £100 question, Not yet, if this happens, just keep pumping until the gauge stops rising, replace EV valve re pressure + fill to I bar and see if it rises in 10 minuets if so either change or add a 12Ltr external which would be better, take care, George 🤩👍

[@stuartandrews8167]

Will do. Thanks George @@mrcombiBedford 👍

[@raylouis6231]

Hey great video Mr Combi , followed your teachings , and all tips ie: cling film ! removing water from expansion tank before a repressurise ! . draining down boiler ect. Heating running smoothly infact better than before , very quiet Thankyou

[@mrcombiBedford]

No problem glad to help, take care, George Staszak, 👍

[@b1h2u3p4]

Nice video, why continuouswater comes out the strader valve when pressed does is it mean vessels gone. Is it worth still pumping it up, understand if there a little water than stops than most likely just condensation.

[@mrcombiBedford]

Dear WS, thanks for the question, a lot of boiler firms are asking for the X Vess. to be checked EVERY year which I support, most installers will not do that and can't be bothered to do this required job. It makes the system work 100% efficiently lower bill save money, stops sludge AND they earn more money, which I cannot understand. If water comes out of the valve the diagram is OK, most installers don't understand that basic situation.take care, george

[@brencostigan]

@@mrcombiBedfordYou still did not answer the original question. What is the cause of water coming out of the Schrader valve? That’s a lot of condensation from the charge air and the valve is half way up the expansion vessel in many cases.

[@mrcombiBedford]

Dear Brencostigan, thanks for the question, must have missed it, all factory sent are filled with 0.5bar of NITROGEN then we top up to 1bar same as the filling pressure that causes a problem because AIR has 66% nitrogen plus 1to 4 % WATER. When we press the schroeder valve that now is CONDENSATION so we have to pump all out change the valve and pump to 1bar. this is now recommended annually +£120 ( not always with a boiler check) Hope that helps, George 👍@@brencostigan

[@petercavaciuti571]

If you go into KZbin settings and set speed to 1.5 ,,, the sppech sounds normal :-)

[@mrcombiBedford]

Thanks will do, george

[@paulbentley849]

Adult videos lol

[@paulbentley849]

Adult videos lol

[@lydiaayoubi3778]

I really like your videos

[@ismaelpedro1938]

Excellent explanation, you're 5 stars

[@mrcombiBedford]

Hi Ismael, Many thanks for your comment, glad you liked it, take care

[@jayseabie215]

Is this guy having a laugh? Bag of sweets indeed.

[@jsarratt1]

lol

[@gjmheating8857]

Hello would a combi filling to 1 bar within a second indicate blockage on expansion vessel the vessel is fully charged, when boiler is on goes from 1 bar to 4 bar within seconds

[@mrcombiBedford]

Yes definitely you have a blockage, isolate the boiler and any water going in and remove every water part including the main exchanger flush the lot to find the blockage, if you have a plate to plate might be wise to replace. Often the pipe from EXP Vessel to manifold is blocked, just take you time it's there somewhere. regards, George staszak

[@Burncash1510]

Wow! Very nicely explained sir thank you great video.

[@mrcombiBedford]

Thanks for liking kind of you to comment, george

[@mrcombiBedford]

Hi Ruman, thanks for the nice comment we do like feedback, take care, george

[@HH-H-H]

EXCELLENT REAL MASTER

[@mrcombiBedford]

Thank you very kind comment 👍

[@---wl3bi]

Having worked on pressurisation units 10 times the size of this boiler, it is really interesting that a gas engineer who does not have electrical qualifications is allowed to touch electrics.

[@mrcombiBedford]

Hi Thanks for your comment we appreciate your input, regards, george

[@---wl3bi]

Cheers, having read my comment again, please don't take it as personal, just a remark how gas engineers have managed to seal the area exclusively to themselves, whereas many faults are electrical/controls not requiring any input to gas. Also a company which is corgi/gas safe can allow someone to work on a boiler as I did on the electrical side without issue ie 3 phase supplies, control systems etc on large sectional boilers. I agree someone without any competence should not fiddle

[@mrcombiBedford]

Thanks for reply, I don't understand why you expect heating installers to know about 3 phase? it's not our fault the 22 millions homes are single phase an zero are 3. To be Gas Safe we have to go to a Skill Centre pay a few thousand just to got to work and this happens EVERY 5 YEARS, who else does that skarkies? We only have a 3 amp fuse the very cleaver people above us have decided we don't need Part P just ACS which 100% registered get. If you ask electricians to wire up an S Plan most will say NO, you say we should not do it so who? Gas Safe installers spend a lot of money on improving knowledge for their customers. 90% of house fires are electrial not gas, far more sparkies are killed the G Safe. Take care, george

[@---wl3bi]

@@mrcombiBedford fair enough 👌

[@andy9962]

thank you sir ,this's a great help. but draine the boiler isn't easy for me since I don't want to mess up , so for get the pressure out of the boiler, instead can I draine the whole lot system water out which I know quite well

[@mrcombiBedford]

Hi Andy, you do need to drain via the return of the boiler because that's where to problem is, best thing, get a local factory recommended engineer to do this, if the pump is over 6 years change it, a VERY good investment also add Fernox F2. ALL pressures at 1 bar, expect to pay above £300, take care, George Staszak

[@samcatalous515]

very helpful and detailed video thank you

[@mrcombiBedford]

Thank you for the lovely comment, take care, George 😀

[@GasTraining]

So to understand this, if you’re called by a customer who says they have water leaking out of their PRV, you check the expansion vessel first and check the Schroeder valve, if there is water coming out of the valve, you check if you’re able to successfully inflate the diaphragm, if you are, then you simply replace the Schroeder valve, if you can’t, then you have to replace the expansion vessel. Correct?

[@mrcombiBedford]

Hi Saqib, thanks for asking, Yes you got it correctly. also find the reason why did the PRV open at 3 bar? maybe another external vessel is also needed, or the filling loop is letting by, remove the flex cap both ends, or the plate to plate has a pin hole, or just was filled too high and vessel was flat. All the best, George S👍⭐taszak

[@sohailaslam8970]

Great video

[@mrcombiBedford]

Hi Sohail, thanks for your comment, Take care, All the best, George Staszak

[@tonytonetone7404]

As always view several different peoples view and take a bit from all

[@Gaming-Legends]

Thanks, very informative. Just had a boiler engineer out, said water coming out of schrader valve so I need a new EV! Also he said that as the system is almost 15 years old, it would be more cost effective to put a new boiler in for £2500.... he didn't even try to re-pressurise the EV, I mean WTF??? Are these guys trained to any level of competence or just trying to scam?

[@mrcombiBedford]

He is correct, at that age best to start again, as I said many times rip the lot out pipes boiler etc. and start again, pay about 3K - £4K use a factory recommended installer for a longer guarantee get 3 quotes W- Bosch, Intergas + one other. Do NOT put a new boiler on that system Thanks for asking, Happy New Year, George Staszak

[@sandstau]

just had the very same thing happen to me/ new boiler he says 2500. didn't even have any tools on him other than a screw driver of mine.

[@mrcombiBedford]

@@sandstau Very sad to hear, 🤠I would not let anyone near my boiler, thanks for info. George Staszak

[@micmac69]

Nice video. Old school tips. Re adding silencer. Hopefully only on an older boiler but observe and ask customers first. First time look on site but have known about your excellent training for years 👌👌

[@mrcombiBedford]

@@micmac69 Thanks Michael, It's not old boilers but when you drain F1 inhibitors then refill with F2 silencer, also I NEVER asked my customers anything, I said what I was doing and how much for, and are they paying card or cash today. That's how to run a highly profitable company, ask them the answer is normally No. all the best, George 🙂

[@plumbertime]

So where does the condensation from the air side get released when you pump it with water coming out the Schrader valve ?

[@mrcombiBedford]

Good question, air contains water vapour, which we see in the bathroom as condensation, in a X V the same happens but under high pressure, as soon as cold water heats up the problem get even worse, when the Schrader valve is pressed that condensation is released. Many installers think its the water from the rads and change the vessel which is completely wrong.Take care, George Staszak

[@plumbertime]

@@mrcombiBedford ok so you’ve pumped it up and wasn’t able to pump anymore then you pressed the schrader and water came out. What’s the reasoning for then replacing the schrader valve. Not digging you out I just like to know why, Was it just precautionary good practise incase it leaked air

[@mrcombiBedford]

Hi again, water vapour is in air, at sea level could be 5% on top of a mountain 1%. Because its an air valve any water contact it has to be replaces or it will rot then fail, regards, george

[@brencostigan]

@@plumbertimeHe’s bullshitting you, he’s made this BS statement and now dodges everyone asking what his reasoning is with pseudo science.

[@Ultraread]

Exactly this problem i have right now. Now i am sure what i have to do. Thanks a lot.

[@mrcombiBedford]

Hi Kresimir, Thanks for asking, as video, boiler needs draining to check the vessel pressure should be 1bar and fill the system to 1 bar. Replace the air valve should do the trick, if not a 12Ltr. vessel would be needed that is NOT a DIY job. take care george

[@Ultraread]

@@mrcombiBedford actually i was on half way to buy a new expansion vessel. after watching your video i've decided to follow your recommended procedure. my boiler also suffer from water leaks from from expansion vessel. After repressurising the vessel my boiler is ready for new season. you saved me a lot of money. ones again thanks a lot. kresimir

[@mrcombiBedford]

Glad to help, take care

[@MediaEasier]

great video, only watched it as I got a boiler problem on a 2-year-old system. Heating on = everything fine but when the heating goes off pressure drops and boiler useless until you repressurise it. No visible leaks anywhere on the entire ch system, any ideas?

[@mrcombiBedford]

Yes the vessel should be re-pressurised to confirm it's OK, or you do have a leak. When the system cools down must return to the cold start about 1 bar and depending how many rads rises to no more than 1.8 bar, it can take an hour to go cold. It might need a 12ltr. external for support which is always recommended. Take care. george staszak

[@mrcombiBedford]

Hi Media, note the pressure when cold then on MAX heat then after it cools down, should be the same, if it drops below the start pressure check as per my video maybe another 12 ltr could help. regards george staszak

[@abury21]

Thank you sir for your nicely explain and easily understandible about combi boiler expansion vessle topic.

[@mrcombiBedford]

Thanks Abdul, glad to help, regards george

[@mrcombiBedford]

Hi Abdul, thanks for the comment, we have a new updated video in a couple of weeks, take care, george

[@ismailyilmaz5039]

Warm greetings from Turkey, first of all, I do not know your language, I would like you to help me by using the miracle of Google translate. I am using the "lidya compact 25 kw" pellet heating system made by Kozlusan Turkish company. The expansion vessel (flat expansion vessel) inside this device is used. Water is leaking from the edge. As a result of this water leakage, the manometer is 4 bars and water is constantly coming out of the tank. Even if the device is turned off for a week and we close all the valves coming to the device, the mano meter rises above four bars. What I want to ask is whether the device is active or not, if the expansion tank leaks water, the mano meter Can it be increased to 4 bars, thank you..

[@mrcombiBedford]

Hi Ismail, Thanks for asking, re place that EX tank I think the fault is it's filling via a filling loop and domestic heat exchanger has a pin hole, I will translate to Turkish, George Merhaba İsmail, Sorduğun için teşekkürler, EX tankını değiştir. Sanırım sorun bir doldurma döngüsü yoluyla doluyor ve ev tipi ısı eşanjöründe bir iğne deliği var, Türkçeye çevireceğim, George

[@ismailyilmaz5039]

@@mrcombiBedford First of all, I would like to point out that you made me very happy by giving such a short answer to the question I asked. I will change the expansion tank based on your advice. We did not receive any response from the company that sold us the device. I was very happy that you answered this problem in a short time. You are a wonderful person. Also, you translated it into Turkish using Translate. Thank you very much

[@mrcombiBedford]

No problem, glad to help👍@@ismailyilmaz5039

[@nareshsonithaleshwar3197]

Hi, your this video really helped understanding detecting fault with pressure created by expansion vessel, however I am little confused as EV in my boiler looses pressure slowly (or is it called fast?) that’s once re-pressurised it looses pressure in roughly 2 days time, could it be schrader valve? Also I get on and off hot water in bathroom upstairs, what could be happening?

[@mrcombiBedford]

Hi Naresh, Thanks for the question, if you remove the dust cap to see if it's from there, probably not, if you have followed the video then the leak must be on the system, 2 days must be a big leak under the floor, good luck. A thermal camera may help as long as pipes are not too low under the floor boards.regards george staszak

[@mrcombiBedford]

It could be the schroeder valve. If the membrane has a hole you cannot pump it up. Do the job again with new valve at 1 bar. but wait one hour and retest should be the same, if not replace EV or add external 12ltr. just leave the old one inside. regards. george staszak

[@MrBarrytommy]

A British Gas service only pumped up the expansion vessel didn’t do half what you did they only seem keen to sell you another boiler that’s why I want to find a decent local guy

[@mrcombiBedford]

Hi Tom, as in my other videos, have a look at the boiler site for a local hero, check out 3 who live near you. regards, george staszak

[@andyrichards4802]

Why replace aav as well?

[@mrcombiBedford]

Thanks for the question,As you saw it has been leaking so much it's gone black and blocked up

[@yensabi]

Your having a laugh.... 😀 Checking the EV is part of a full boiler service and usually just needs pumping up..... The two things go together and a full service takes about 1 hr if you know what your doing.... 👍

[@---wl3bi]

Bag of sweets? Can I pay a boiler engineer with a Mars bar

[@mrcombiBedford]

Thanks for taking time to comment, all the best, george

[@1000Mikey]

So why does water come out of the valve if its just air, not split?

[@mrcombiBedford]

Thanks for the question, all air has some water, the air we breath is 3% water the same in a EV, but under pressure it looks bad, it's normal same as condensation on a bathroom window but worse and bad for the vessel, undetected rust will start to appear in the end will destroy the boiler. That's why we do this every1 - 3 years MAX. Regards george staszak

[@1000Mikey]

@@mrcombiBedford Thanks for getting back to me George and for making this video. I just added an external vessel on a job recently but will be definitely be doing this first in the future. Thanks mate 👍🏻

[@mrcombiBedford]

@@1000Mikey Thanks for the reply and comment, very glad you saw what a difference it makes, take care, george staszak

[@johmcinally3521]

What happens when it is constantly leaking water.

[@johmcinally3521]

Just to ask George, are you the the gentleman that produces the gas training courses. regards, John.

[@HH-H-H]

Nice hair cut 😂

[@mrcombiBedford]

too short, but thanks👍