My Conversation with Rodney Habib...Pet Food Extremists

[@wendyangeles4747]

I recently found your channel in my search for new updated information on dog food. As a very hands-on dog breeder who gets a lot of flack from other breeders because I have a great relationship with my team of vets, I'm always open to new knowledge. My dogs are my babies, who have babies, but do therapy work for military families. Their health is my number one priority. Thank you for doing what you do. You are appreciated!!!

[@PetFoodPuzzleGuy]

Thank you for your work with military families. As a vet, I appreciate that. What kind of flack from other breeders because of your great relationship with your vets????

[@knitswithdirt]

I like Rodney and his content-for the most part. It's just no longer something I consume. I spent so much time, energy and money agonizing over what to feed my dog over the past 5 years. At the end of the day...NONE of the "high end" foods did anything magical for her. She has done so well on Hills and I'm staying here. I used to give her raw mixed into her kibble at dinner now and then and you know...she stopped touching it. Like flat out would no longer eat the food with raw nor just plain raw. It was really weird. But when I think back to all the stress I used to have based on so many other views on "what's best".....I realize what a disservice many of these dog food people do to everyday folks. And maybe they don't get that because they are trying to help. But it sure sent me into a deep spiral. If you told me a year ago I would be feeding Hills....I would have bet you wrong! lol

[@EauDeMichele]

I’ve had a similar experience recently.

[@coreylevine5642]

@@knitswithdirt I’m currently in the spiral - and I just cannot settle with how feeding any food that is in excess of Calcium/phos is in any way OPTIMAL for any dogs health…..where is the research or justification?!?! Anything you investigate about how excess minerals/imbalances affect both humans and animals - there is no clear argument that it benefits in ANY way.

[@PetFoodPuzzleGuy]

Thank you! You and folks like you are why I'm on this mission! I just might use this comment!

[@onceuponabanyantree]

You sound a lot like me! I saw Rodney's first posts. The first I believe that got it all roling was the post about the "horrible" ingredient list. From there I was bent on doing things differently with my current dog. I found a breeder who fed raw but she also started her puppies on Hill's. So I got my puppy. Went from Hill's to raw. Then he fortuitously got Giardia and wanted nothing to do with raw anymore. Looooooooong story short, almost 5 years later, he's on Hill's and is doing wonderfully on it.

[@PetFoodPuzzleGuy]

@ love it!

[@nutritionrvn]

What I think is really interesting, is that we are all (in the pet nutrition community) starting to come together again and have dialogue. I actually reached out the other day to make peace with another creator (that you've also mentioned before) and we've had productive discussion to move more towards middle ground and not be extreme in our views or live in echo chambers. I'm blown away at the timing of this!

[@PetFoodPuzzleGuy]

@@nutritionrvn well, a lot of company's advertising pushing guilt and shame needs to stop. Once people know it's all false, they will stop. A long hard battle ahead though!

[@nutritionrvn]

​@@PetFoodPuzzleGuy I totally agree, and it's something this really hurts my soul when I see it because all it does is worry pet owners. But, I am hopeful that if we continue to have constructive dialogue with those who aren't in the same camp as us, we might be able to make a positive change.

[@Midwestyorkie]

I’m Italian/Irish (also German) Catholic as well ❤

[@nutritionrvn]

​@@Midwestyorkie I'm Catholic also haha ❤

[@AmericanHuskyCash]

True dialog is how we ultimately work out our differences, this is what we need in a World of polarization

[@GardeningGroomer]

I love your enthusiasm and I’m very glad Rodney reached out to you! it definitely feels like there’s polarization/division when it comes to feeding dogs. I hope that going forward everyone will be kind to one another…. FED is best. LOVED is best. And finally, the dog gets the last word. If the dog is not thriving on whatever you’re feeding ,you owe it to them to find the right one.

[@Fabhuntress]

14:35 I don't know how many times I brought this point up that it doesn't have to go from Kibble to Raw. There are so many choices in between.

[@peteriwanec3472]

I was very much anti-corn until you challenged me through your episodes. I did the research and did a 180 on the topic.

[@knitswithdirt]

@@peteriwanec3472 same!! I remember my dad saying corn was a filler and if its sold in a grocery store its no good, back when I was a kid. It stuck with me.

[@Jfre2]

Corn is ok.. but it is by far not the best. I think that is the point one must consider. There are many alternatives that offer better overall nutrition. Corn is over used in many products. Corn gluten meal is used as a protein instead of meat but is not nearly as digestible. Products like Purina use too much corn and low quality meat sources/plant based proteins as a way of keeping costs down. That does affect nutrition, digestibility and overall quality of the product. The inclusion of corn is not bad.. it's how much and in what forms.

[@George.J]

@@Jfre2corn gluten meal is highly digestible and it’s not meant to replace meat but rather complement meat

[@StephanieStoudt-uv8nv]

I think Glenn or Dr Rae have a video on corn. Petfoodology , a site from Tufts university has an article about corn in dog food. It’s with looking into

[@StephanieStoudt-uv8nv]

Also if your statement was true about purina using low quality meat and too much corn, their nutrient profile wouldn’t be good

[@cgyang]

It's really wholesome to know things like this happen. People can collaborate that have different opinions and judge the other person with good-faith. I will have to catch up on the videos on this channel. I made a post years back where I was concerned with some conflicting information and received a very considerate response. So I subscribed. I'm all for productive conversations. Keep it up. Efforts like this heal the world a little bit at a time.

[@PetFoodPuzzleGuy]

Thanks for that!

[@edschulhof6303]

Your humanity really shows through here. I have said this before, the commercial pet food industry only has itself to blame for people turning away from them. I was feeding a stray cat wet and dry food for three years before she had four kittens in my backyard. I kept two, Colbie and Panda. They will be three years old in March. When Panda started throwing up anything I fed her, I took her to a vet who never even asked what I was feeding her. He just wanted to do $1600 worth of tests. I did some research on food and fed her nothing but raw ground beef for 5 weeks. Both cats have been on a mostly homemade diet for two years now. And I’m eating healthier as well. Happy Feline Friday.

[@MG-zv9od]

I also feel nutrition can play a part in the recovery and health of pets. But in my experience, it’s the medical profession as a whole that doesn’t regard nutrition as a prominent factor in wellness. I have taken control of my own health now for over 30 years, using nutrition and supplements to ward off the need for medication. This being said, I also do believe in concentrated nutrients through processed foods for specific health issues. My son’s dog was not receiving nutrition through raw or home cooked diets and did not begin to show signs of health until we started her on a dog food specifically created for her health issue. I try to keep a balanced view and not fall into the ‘religious-style’ wars of how to feed pets.

[@PetFoodPuzzleGuy]

Well said and agree 100%.

[@huhSHUA]

Holy shit half way thru the vid and you havnt said anything about the Skype

[@StephanieStoudt-uv8nv]

I’m more like you described yourself. I tend to go with years and years of research as well as proven results. I like brands that don’t use negative marketing. Rodney and Karen Becker’s videos many times have reflected negatively on vets while promoting books, tours, products. They give no credit to the companies that have done all the research. Constantly putting down those big companies. You were nicer than I would have been. But this was a great video

[@PetFoodPuzzleGuy]

I agree, and most vets feel that way.

[@PetFoodPuzzleGuy]

We will have to disagree. I agree with Stephanie. I have worked with lots of vets in 34 years. Their perception is the same as mine, right or wrong.

[@AnimalDocRea]

Great perspective!

[@Jfre2]

Learn from it.

[@PetFoodPuzzleGuy]

thanks Doc!

[@Fabhuntress]

So excited to be here 🎉

[@PetFoodPuzzleGuy]

Its great having you.

[@coreylevine5642]

Why do so many- and I mean SO MANY adult pet (dog) foods find it ok to be completely in excess of ca/p? I am so stumped on this issue - is it for marketing purposes - that feeding excess protein is just what consumers want? Being completely devoid of wellness? How do they arrive at their explanations for the benefit of these minerals?? I am so stuck on this - trying to find the best food for my new puppy (and eventually adult dog) Love the channel!

[@PetFoodPuzzleGuy]

Don't be stuck! You got it right! High Protein sells. No one is concerned about mineral excesses. In fact, food companies are happy to say exceeds AAFCO standards! Excessive nutrients sounds so good. Its disgusting though.

[@coreylevine5642]

@@PetFoodPuzzleGuy my thoughts exactly - how does this even make sense??? Let’s overload your organs with things that make them burn out and overwork? How is this optimal? I guess if it was an issue people could “see” they would notice it - sadly people do not test nutrient levels in their animals often enough - and it could be too late :(

[@edschulhof6303]

As Dr. Rea has said, once you add water to freeze dried, it's raw again. In a perfect world, raw ground beef would provide 100% of a cat's nutritional needs. LOL

[@PetFoodPuzzleGuy]

Yeah, a perfect world......

[@CarlosReyes-sx6ep]

What is your opinion on Natural Balance, Limited Ingredient? I was looking into the Salmon and Sweet potato. Seems like there are mixed reviews

[@AshleyKarys]

Dr. Rea has a video on Natural Balance. I think she rated the duck and potato food an 8/10. Go take a look I can’t remember if she reviewed that particular formula or not. Hope this helps.

[@PetFoodPuzzleGuy]

Thanks Ashley!

[@lawncaremadeeasy3183]

You mentioned blue buffalo has a pet nutritionist. Does that now group them in with the companies considered wasava compliant

[@Midwestyorkie]

I have seen Dr Rea say they do not do any feeding trials and she said she is disappointed to see that.

[@George.J]

@@Midwestyorkiethey have performed feeding trials on some of their veterinary diets

[@PetFoodPuzzleGuy]

He left and is now at Farmer's Dog. I still say there is a big difference in working with a nutritionist and having a team of them on full time staff doing research, and developing amazing diets. The WASAVA distinction, as I feared, is going to get watered down and be pretty meaningless. Which is okay if we'd just start looking at nutrients it would be better.

[@George.J]

My issue with the fresh/raw manufactures is that they want to have us believe that this type of feeding is superior but they don’t want to perform the studies. Brands like the farmer’s dog do have the money to be involved in research but they choose not to. Whereas the science based kibble/canned brands have contributed tons to research and perform proper controlled feeding trials and bioavailability-digestibility studies. I know Instinct was involved in research in Helsinki but the study they did was survey based and very disappointing.

[@PetFoodPuzzleGuy]

Ask yourself, why do research when you don't need to. Misleading marketing is a whole lot cheaper!

[@George.J]

@ True! it's a lot cheaper and gets customers to buy the products so it's a win win situation for the companies.

[@peteriwanec3472]

Glenn, I emailed you the two vegetarian kibble brands. It's funny/interesting to see that the only thing on the two sides that was the same was vegan and vegetarian.

[@huhSHUA]

Why would you feed you dog a vegan or vegetarian diet? Is it because that’s what you eat?

[@peteriwanec3472]

@@huhSHUA There are a number of reasons why people put their dogs on vegan diets; dog allergies, human allergies to dog food ingredients, nutrition, intolerances to food additives, etc. For dogs, vegan diets are linked with lower medication use, fewer health disorders, and less frequent visits to the vet compared to meat-heavy diets. In the last two decades a number of studies have shown that dogs on vegan diets were much healthier than dogs on meat protein diets. A study published in July 2016 in the journal Animals found and I quote ...""A significant and growing body of population studies and cases suggest that cats and dogs may be successfully maintained on nutritionally sound vegetarian diets long-term, and indeed, may thrive. Such diets have been associated with benefits such as improved coat condition, allergy control, weight control, increased overall health and vitality, arthritis regression, diabetes regression, cataract resolution, and decreased incidences of cancer, infections, hypothyroidism and ectoparasites (fleas, ticks, lice and mites). Deviations from normal ranges within blood test results do occur, but are uncommon, and rarely appear associated with clinical signs of disease." -Dr. Andrew Knight They also examined the prevalence of 22 specific health disorders based on veterinary evaluations. The results showed that dogs on vegan diets had the lowest prevalence of health disorders (36%), compared to those on raw meat (43%) and conventional meat diets (49%).

[@PetFoodPuzzleGuy]

It's funny how those extremes meet!

[@PetFoodPuzzleGuy]

Some do it for moral reasons, like their own diet. Others might have a dog with really bad allergies so trying to eliminate typical protein sources.

[@JesseDavis]

Pet Food Extremists - would that be Kibble'queda ;b

[@PetFoodPuzzleGuy]

Hey! That's funny!

[@JesseDavis]

or maybe, raw'queda would be more appropriate, lol - i find it humorous, either way

[@PetFoodPuzzleGuy]

@ me too!

[@innaviron1990]

My cat and I from the Kibble hate tribe.☹️😠 Made of who knows what, that is coocked to the state of plastic, with a mile long list of cheap, not absorbable vitamins and minerals, even more plastic, and sprayed with something addictive to trick my cat to eat it. And no matter how much lipstick your precious Science trying to put on that pig, it's still a pig, and always will be. I think it should be illegal, especially for cats. Dehydrating, with carbs overload, and useless vitamins and nutrients. My cat will enjoy simple fresh food, naturally nutritious, that is easy on the gut, and pleasant for her taste buds. Because, shes maybe not a tiger, or a lion, but she's still a part of the family and deserves the same respect, and care. You can take an animal out of nature, but you can't take a nature out of animal. I'm all for raw, if you can handle it responsibly, and there's nothing wrong with gently cooked home made food either. Especially if you have little kids. But you, and that other guy can enjoy your trips to your galaxies as much as you want.😄

[@PetFoodPuzzleGuy]

@@innaviron1990 I can't help but see in my mind the pet food marketers smiling ear to ear reading your parroting everything they've told you. Just about everything you said covers every key marketing myth to manipulate pet parents.

[@ZaryaTheLaika]

Not sure why you didn't read Brennen McKenzie's posts. He always gives Rodney and Karen benefit of the doubt when he criticizes them

[@George.J]

I love Dr McKenzie’s blog. He was one of the catalysts that brought me back to the light regarding pet nutrition.

[@ZaryaTheLaika]

@George.J Just surprised Glenn believes he (Glenn) was too overly judgemental when Brennan explains what Habib and Becker got correct and where they went wring.

[@George.J]

@@ZaryaTheLaika maybe Glenn doesn’t read his posts

[@PetFoodPuzzleGuy]

I love the guy but haven't seen his posts on Becker and Habib. is it a website, not KZbin? Would love to read them.

[@ZaryaTheLaika]

@@PetFoodPuzzleGuy Yes, he has a blog called SkeptVet and made several posts about them. He's always very kind when he criticizes them and explains why.