My Favorite Martin Guitar has competition! Martin 000-18 vs Martin 000-18 Modern Deluxe

[@dennism7532]

Definitely different. What do I like best? Can’t really decide. I do know I personally can make both of them sound like they have laminated tops and cost $200

[@DoDifferent]

LOL

[@MrShamus07]

Keep practicing. You've got a lot of competition trying to take that top spot away from you.

[@kolohe0782]

Classic reply 😂

[@jw_au]

You’re not alone mate!

[@TheStormwatch1]

I prefer the standard 000-18. Has a more comforting homecoming sound to me. You made a good comparison with the comfy t-shirts of jeans. Totally get that. Great demo by the way 👍🏻

[@richardwilson5709]

One additional observation: I REALLY like the appearance of the "INLAY" of the Martin logo on the headstock. It is very swag!!

[@DARKLYLIT]

Wow! The Modern Deluxe is SOOO much more bass-heavy than the standard. It's amazing how different the two guitars sound. Of course, you'd have to actually try them both in-person but from this review, if I had to choose, I would go with the Standard 00018. The tone is so much more evenly-balanced than on the Modern Deluxe. Thank you for the great review!

[@cameronurnes8355]

Thanks for helping me make up my mind. Ordered the Modern Deluxe today.

[@ConditionZero76]

They both sounded great. Having said that, the hyde glue talk and how it typically makes for more resonance and tone, etc. (which is true), but to me, it had ill effect on the modern. From what I hear while listening through my bose speakers is the exact opposite. The classic 000 cut through more and tended to have more color whereas the modern while sounding great had more of a mushy or like blended mellow tone. Call me crazy but I'd have to choose the classic. Great production as always. Merry Christmas, God bless...

[@aramichaelian7320]

you're not crazy and you heard it perfectly right, MD is way to glassy and sharp, not even close to warmth of STD tone.

[@bradmeredith7569]

It's amazing how you can tell such a difference with one strum, as you said Chris. I also preferred the MD model, based on the demos of the two. When I was shopping for my Martin a couple years ago, I played a D-18 and 000-18 (both standard series) at one store, and then went to a different store where they had a D-style with sinker mahogany. And, all it took was that one strum to hear the difference. Granted, it was way more expensive.

[@johnhayes111]

Outstanding review, comparison, and playing. Thanks so much for producing it! Both guitars sound awesome. I really wanted to prefer the MD (after all, it is both “modern” and “deluxe!”), but in the end my ear preferred the standard, especially for flat picking. Both great, but I’m going with the standard.

[@joequilit6454]

I love the sound of the traditional, but it’s all personal preference. Great review. The 000-18 is so underrated.

[@R.L.Humpert]

I think any Martin blows most all other brands away. Martin is truly amazing. I sold my Taylor’s and bought Martin guitars.

[@vitkrivanek9378]

The Martin D-18 (MD) guitar definitely has a brighter and clearer sound. However, to my ears, it resembles rosewood to some extent. The 18 Standard series, on the other hand, is all about that classic mahogany sound - deeper mid-range tones and a warm sound that, in my opinion, the MD somewhat lacks. Overall, they are both excellent guitars, but if I'm looking for that authentic mahogany sound, I prefer the Standard 18

[@aramichaelian7320]

you nailed it... MD sounds like a rosewood guitar, but if you want the warm deep midrange of mahogany, STD is the one... "old lived in t-shirt".

[@johnwbanjo]

Wow. The Standard sounds fantastic but the MD is just out of this world. Rich and full enough to give my D-18 a run for it’s money.

[@richardwilson5709]

a couple of points to consider:1) the reduced weight of the titanium truss rod is noticeable in my hold. 2) The upgraded graphite bridge plate should eliminate the need for a future repair/replacement of such, esp at some future time when such service may be hard to find or expensive at best. 3) the application of the Vintage Tone System treatment to the 1/4" Adirondack Spruce brace material as well as this VTS treatment to the Sitka spruce top, should greatly reduce the impact of summertime/winter humidity levels which could require truss rod adjustments. I think these 3 issues would greatly greatly enhance the longevity of these "modern deluxe series' guitars! 3 additional points ;1) I really am charmed by the MARTIN inlay on the headstock, 2) the satin finish on the neck is a very nice feel, smooth, 3) I am a great lover of a sunburst finishes and think an Amberburst finish would be much to my liking. Thanks for opening up your channel for exposure to your instruments.

[@rzh3443]

The sound difference to me was subtle but distinct. The VTS top seems to be the difference. Not so sure about those MD bridge pins though. Couldn't go way wrong with either guitar.

[@reneenazario9598]

I liked the modern for clarity, usually i like vintage, surprised me. Thanks for doing these videos. They are useful, because living in rual eastern new mexico. I have no guitar stores close to me.

[@rgs962]

I like the Standard 000-18 more than the Modern Deluxe. The Standard is more articulate and the Modern Deluxe has better bass response. I played a D-28 Modern Deluxe about two years ago, and it was incredible. With my sorry playing, it turned every head in the room. It was that good.

[@aramichaelian7320]

Hands down the 000-18 Std...! The modern Deluxe sounds thinner and glassy, not even close...! Love the analogy you used... "lived in old T-shirt that you're told to throw away but you never did", fits perfectly the STD warm tone. Excellent demo, appreciate it...!

[@swampdonkey33]

Gold frets aren't just gold, but longer lasting evo frets. Gold tuners aren't just gold either, they are Waverly rather than Grover.

[@ronmoore1219]

The Modern Deluxe sounded best to me. $3800 is too much money, in my opinion, but it was more articulate, a touch brighter, and the sustain and overtones were more evident to me. If it was in the $3.4 k range, I could feel more comfortable with the money. Even being a rosewood fan, this guitar could easily sway my decision. Great job, and thanks again.

[@richardwilson5709]

Iam being swayed, also.

[@jeffmark6157]

No question the Standard 000-18 sounds warmer to my ears. The MD is just a brighter, snappier guitar. If that is the sound you are looking for, go for it. I started out wanting a 000-28 MD and am ending up with a 000-18 Standard. If you watch enough KZbin videos, that is what happens. As always, you guys have the best guitar videos on the planet. Thanks so much!

[@johnoffutt898]

I have changed my mind!! I am buying the 000-18 Modern Deluxe in September 2024. Notes are more complex and beautiful timbre colours and flavors and sustain.

[@texhaines9957]

What I did was a Custom 000-18 with VTS Adirondack top and protein glue. It split the cost and very good sound. Chris is incorrect about the neck. Modern Deluxe has a different neck profile.

[@davestelling]

Did you do it, friend? I'm about to purchase one of these, from the Nazareth factory and am trying to decide...

[@davidmalley1014]

I like the modern deluxe! More articulate. Better base response too. I want one! Crap. You did it to me again.

[@ZionForman]

I have an opinion: they both sound great.

[@AnkitSingh-vx4dy]

Both are same woods

[@fenderman6519]

I may be a bit biased here as I own a D-42 that is absolutely phenomenal, and with that being said. For me the md sounded to "airy" as it were, listening through a Bose soundlink flex speaker; especially between that piece that starts 11:42- 14:06. Better blend and articulation on the 18 Standard for me. There were times I could see him playing the notes but very little sound on the md. I understand dynamics but the 18 Standard has it all day long over the md. The 18 Standard has a warm, full vintage sound that will only improve as it gets older. I understand what the torrefication process does; Yamaha has a great video on that, but I am more of a traditionalist and don't "want" carbon fibre etc in/on my guitar id I can avoid it. I would like to see them use the hide glue on all the standard models and see how that goes. It is shocking that a salesperson would like the more expensive model though. Peace.

[@GoofieNewfie]

Excellent playing! Reading through the comments, this is the perfect example of why you shouldn't shop via KZbin. Comments are all contradicting each other. I'll tell you my experience. I went to the store, and had my mind set on another Taylor. 724 actually. But, I played it for 60 seconds and that was long enough to know I didn't like it. KOA takes a while to open up, but it wasn't going to fix this guitar. So I tried other Taylors that day being I'm a Taylor guy. None offered anything beyond my 840 already did. So, I said, just start passing me guitars, don't tell me the model or price. I have only known and played D28/HD28's. knew nothing about the Martin lineup. I was passed several brands, but the one that got my money, and it took 3 strums...was the 000-18 MD. I had already played the non MD and didn't care for it literally just before I was handed the MD. My first thought was of course I fell in love with the more $$$ one. But there really is a difference. It doesn't sound ANYTHING like my 814, and that is what I was looking for. Now that I have had it about 10 months. It's incredible. Light, resonant, finger pick, strum, lead, it does it all. So comfy to hold. I do miss a cutaway, but honestly, one of the best I have played, and no regrets at all. Now, I could pick up 5 of these guitars and get 5 different opinions, so GO TO THE STORE and try them. While this video is great, each one is different, and your silly little headphones, phone speakers, or whatever isn't going to show off this guitar.

[@davestelling]

Appreciate your comment here - I am trying to decide which of these I'm about to give a very good forever home to...

[@philcottone2247]

First, great demo. I totally agree. I love the modern deluxe treatment. You didn't mention the titanium truss rod. The first time I played a modern deluxe it was an om 28. I immediately fell in love. My question for you is how would the 000-18 modern deluxe sound compared to a similar Martin made the exact same way but with Koa top, sides and back. I know that would have to be custom shop.

[@timmcgurl]

@pholcottone2247 Martin used Titanium for the Truss Rod "initially", when the first 4 Modern Deluxe models came out in 2019. I bought the first year's 000-28 Modern Deluxe and the Titanium Truss Rod broke a year later. It had to go back to Nazareth for a new Rod (and neck reset) after owning it just one year. Martin was having lots of problems with the lighter weight Titanium Truss Rods, they were breaking (like mine) and they had "sourcing issues" getting decent Titanium. So, they switched over to using the same lighter Truss Rod they are now using in the new SC-13 Series, with the new body shape and bolt on neck. Some adverts still say that the Truss Rods are Titanium, but thru personal experience with Martin, I know they stopped using Titanium 2 years ago. Just an FYI. I was pissed myself, having to be one of the first guinea pigs and having my Titanium Truss Rod break and not having my new axe for more than 6 months, as it had to go home to Nazareth for a new Rod that's being used in the SC-13s as well. Cheers

[@andrewhumphrey1047]

I played one recently and I was very impressed with the 000-18 MD. for all the features you get, it is worth the extra cost for tone and features. Just the hide glue would put you close to the cost in the Custom Shop. I usually don't care for thinner necks but I got used to the MD Neck carve after awhile. Do these use the Golden Era Bracing?

[@peterkaputsos4125]

Thanks for the video. I have been considering which one of these I want to purchase (lefty). Both sound great. I give the nod to the MD. Question is it worth the extra bucks depending on your individual situation and preference. I like that Martin is giving us the options and looking at the evolution of their designs. I wish they would have also offered MD in the 00-18. And also glad that they offer many of these models left handed at least to order.

[@pachacamacs]

When I started watching this video I expected (and hoped) I would prefer the Standard, because that has been my favorite guitar for years. Unfortunately, I have to admit the MD sounds better... just as lovely, but with more of everything in terms of volume, sustain, clarity. I listened to the video without watching so I didn't know which one I was hearing, but I knew it immediately. The difference is quite striking.

[@mitchelldelmar]

Excellent comparison. First impressions are usually correct in my experience. MD for the win.

[@roadapple66]

When will Martin come out with a D-41 Modern Deluxe? I would love to see that happen!

[@rickbroderick9146]

Strangely, I bought a new 1966 00018 at Manny's, and was stolen after 10 yrs and never thought a modern one could possibly be better, but I agree with you, shockingly.

[@chadkisamore3501]

I'm going to have to go with the standard myself.

[@DriftwoodBeachMom]

Both sound fabulous; however, I like the sound of the modern deluxe. Going to have to try one myself.

[@jeffreyhawk1080]

Both are great but I do like the MD more....not sure about the extra cash. I would love to hear the same comparison with the 00028 and its MD counterpart as that is where I am looking. Thanks

[@jeffw468]

Nice comparison! The MD may sound better in person, but the standard seems to sound better on the recording, IMO.

[@cmoreno12345]

Great idea. Thank you!

[@mikehoehn1475]

Can ya tell me what strings are on em please. They both sound great

[@StevenColquit]

Hello Chris! I always enjoy and learn from your videos at Alamo. I am convinced you play the Standard Model better than the Modern Deluxe. You seem more comfortable and at ease. It is like you are home with the standard. Is there a difference in the neck finish on the back? Does one slide up and down more easily? I cannot put my finger on it but it contradicts your review of the Modern Deluxe. This video in particular is important for me as there are no editions of this guitar for me to audition. I am torn between the Standard and Modern Deluxe with 000-18's and 000-28's. I am leaning towards the Hog-back and sides of the 000-18 Standard or Deluxe. Making an informed decision is difficult when you cannot find either guitar nearby to play. Do you work with any trades? I hope to get to your store in person soon. I will ensure I have 3-4 thousand dollars of pocket money! Thank you

[@Mr.Bluesky1]

Wow! Thought the standard sounded good, but the MD sounded absolutely beautiful with deeper, richer tones. Like a completely different model all together...

[@richardwilson5709]

When I played the Modern Deluxe version I say the overall sound of the guitar was 1 full level higher on the grading scale of quality,

[@davestelling]

P.S. My initial impression is that the Standard is more resonant; brighter & longer sustained...the Modern Deluxe - richer, perhaps...more "Muffled?" I like the Standard; it seems to "Talk" better and with a tad more of that "Steely" sound? Ayuh - I have wanted to prefer the M.D. but no, I much prefer the Standard! Thanks again for doing this comparison, it has been the most helpful to me in trying to decide which of these to offer a very good, forever home to...

[@jimbrown1061]

Quick question to everyone, especially Chris. What are your thoughts on the HD28 versus the D28 MD?

[@kellyyorkiw2422]

From this video, I still prefer the standard, but I need to play both side by side

[@NickMcC]

I like the deluxe a little more! Both are lovely though.

[@slbolfing56]

Great demo! To me, the MD really has something extra. Don't the 18 series 000s also have 1/4" bracing?

[@richardwilson5709]

I agree is has a full level of extra

[@mrcards169]

Much prefer the colour of the top of the 00018 and sound . Not sure about gold frets really like the idea of a carbon fibre plate . Amazing playing

[@BonnieHess]

I am looking for a warmer tone and separation of notes/ tones. I have a beautiful rosewood guitar already. To me ears on an iPhone, the 00018 sounds warmer, more to what I am looking for.

[@sure5871]

tried a standard D18 against a D18 MD, that MD sounded like a frickin Taylor

[@zensational.]

In what way? Taylor's are too bright and treble-y for me. I usually play all mahogany guitars but searching to decide between 00018 MD or 00028 MD

[@sure5871]

@@zensational. that’s exactly what I meant, too bright and some might say it sounds too modern, hence the name “modern” deluxe : )

[@zensational.]

@sure5871 Thank you! There's none within a 1.5 hr drive of me to test. I assumed the liquid metal pins would make it too bright and I'd immediately change them to bone, but also the carbon fiber (even if after my lifetime) would eventually start letting off toxic dust. After enough videos I want an 18 - but will most likely end up ordering a custom bec I want the VTS system and wood binding. But.. may end up going with walnut back and sides if I do go custom!

[@georgekatechis628]

what song did you play during the demos?

[@krajpathak]

Here me out. I have the standard 000-18 but its a year old by now and irl it sounds much thicker and sweeter than the one being played in the video. Yes the MD (I did play) has more bass but trebles are not thick which is the whole point of mahogany. When I bought my 000-18 initially, it was a bit tinny like the one in the video but just a year of natural aging has done wonders and its just getting started. I’ve never been a big fan of any torrifaction anyways, natural aging always is best.

[@CrisGuitarBR]

I thought the Martin 000-18 comes with Grover tuners, while the Deluxe comes with Waverly ones. In my opinion, although they both work great, I would also consider this an upgrade adding also to the price diference. What are your opinions on these two brands of tuners? Does it worth the "upgrade"?

[@karlthefox4605]

I believe that the MD sounds best with a flat pick attack & im pleased to be the owner of the OOO18 ... They are very comfortable to play & sound quite nice as well

[@margiesplace259]

Protein glue sold me...thank you 🎶❤ Love Martin guitars!

[@billvillamusic3625]

As a vocalist, sometimes you can feel like you’re competing with certain mid frequencies, especially with smaller body guitars … the Modern Deluxe would be my choice to sing with … but both sound incredible 👍

[@Andriy023]

Cool! I like this sound!

[@brucebailey1371]

the Modern Deluxe has more of a 'presence' in the articulation of individual notes coming through cleanly.

[@ff7xce]

I still prefer the standard. The modern is brighter, but that's not the sound I want out of a Martin 000-18, esp. for recording.

[@dalecoffing8655]

Modern! Not a big fan of Martins but WOW! Beautiful sound.

[@alanlittle8817]

I prefer the original, primarily because of the lower tones, less tinny.

[@johnwashburn3793]

First thoughts: I like the pick guard on the standard better and yes, it matters. I know of a guy who had the standard and now has the modern deluxe. These are few and far between, so act quickly. Sometimes you just gotta get a new pair of jeans or that fresh Alamo Music t-shirt! Very noticeable difference between the two and I own a lot of mahogany guitars. I prefer the MD, both are great, but...the MD is only $1000.00 more and well worth it. IMO I remain content with what I have Great to hear Chris today. Did you ever get a resonator?

[@johnwashburn3793]

I did notice that the specs listed the strings on the standard but not the MD. $40 strings could make a difference.

[@johnoffutt898]

I like the 000-18 better and I would replace the bridge pins with size 2C bone which would improve the overall timbre colours and flavors. You can always change out the phosphor bronze strings for either Aluminum or Bronze strings to get a similar tone of the modern deluxe.

[@radimvasol168]

You're absolutely right. I bought liquidmetal pins, put bronze strings and have an MD sound and I can always take it back.

[@john15333]

They both sound great but I actually like the standard more.

[@roadapple66]

I liked the 000-18 MD best. The bass has more, fuller notes and the rest of the notes ring out true; with more clarity than anything else with this body shape and tone wood combination.

[@richardwilson5709]

The VTS treatment minimizes the impact of fluctuating humidity levels

[@LFF_8w3]

Is one new 000-18 MD worth the trade in - or near - of one Standard Series D-18 full gloss and one 000-15SM?

[@alexandergray1977]

I bought both because each is amazing!

[@martyc4906]

Immediately knew the modern take was better. You should get rid of the standard one. I can get you my address so you can send it to a nice home. 😊

[@LegsON]

It also costs A LOT more.

[@dirk8092]

What’s the name of the song around 12’. Sounds beautiful.

[@robtangent4664]

I tried both. Although both have the same nut width of 1-3/4", I felt the deluxe's neck is a little smaller and easier to play.

[@mikec3454]

The Modern Deluxe is an additional $1400 CAD over the standard 000-18. I don’t see the value personally. I’ll likely pickup the 000-18 shortly to pair with my Taylor 317e.

[@criscreson7673]

Am I hearing a more pronounced upper midrange or enhanced articulation with the modern deluxe

[@jimmeymcgee2840]

The Original model is calling my name it’s so alive and responsive

[@cmakely60]

Chris, thank you for another great demo. Is it true that the neck profile is the same? I thought the MD line had a unique neck profile. In any case I do like the MD better overall. I think another nice comparison would be the 000-18 MD and a custom shop with golden era bracing, adi top and sinker mahogany. 😁

[@JustVinnyMusic]

I think there is a difference but to my ear, the most significant element is the hide glue. Any of Martin's models made with hide glue, witrhout the other modern amenities listed here, is going to have a livlier sound for sure. For the right music, it is probably better, but I prefer the more subdued sound of the standard version. If I played Celtic music or bluegrass though, the modern version would be a better choice.

[@Pop_Hockenbush]

The deluxe sounds brighter and less woody to men.

[@Kujinu]

Men just love bright and less woody guitars.

[@cfire99]

I prefer the vanilla 00018

[@lukesteverything627]

I think the torrification makes a huge difference but I wonder if the older version might sound better in 10 years time. I'm not sure that we know what torrified wood does to tone over a 30 year period. Maybe that's a negative but instant gratification does make the modern deluxe tempting.

[@vandamme211]

Why it would that matter 30 years down the road? You want to enjoy it when purchasing not in 30 some years… would go with deluxe for sure

[@rabbadatz]

Modern Deluxe sounds more lively and reactive. With fingerstyle this is it. I am pretty close to buy one as a second option next to my HD-35.

[@azymuth3715]

I'm curious about what is your favorite strumming guitar around 5000€

[@startreker8591]

This modern de luxe I will purchase y thanks dude❤

[@vancesnyder2426]

There is something that the Modern Deluxe brings to the table. I do like the sound better and there is a noticeable difference.

[@mariodriessen9740]

I have a 000-18 and it’s my favorite guitar. When I heard the 000-18 in this video I thought mine sounded better (lucky me), but it did sound like a 000-18, where, in my opinion, the Modern Deluxe didn’t. Nothing wrong with that sound, but it just didn’t really feel like I was listening to a 000-18. In this case I would choose the standard 000-18. There’s more woodiness in that sound.

[@TheULMOnaut]

The MD reminds me of a Larrivee OM40 I played once and the sound was too deep and not as woody as I would have liked it.

[@CarlosCandidoMusic]

Both are gorgeous sounding.. the modern deluxe sounds older, rounder in the bass. I think that’s the selling point of the MD: lighter, more resonant, and sounds older out of the box. The standard will eventually get there with time and play, but it’ll never get lighter. The question: Is the increase in price worth it for what you want right now? I’m still not sure which I’d get if I could afford both. That says a lot about what Martin is doing.

[@TheRyanshamowski]

Honestly having owned an martin om 28,00018, taylor 416ce, 814ce, 816ce and many other expensive guitars I can say with certainty no guitar is ever going to do everything. But honestly the only guitar I still own is the 00018. Sure the deluxe may be better but I don't care the 00018 puts a smile on my face everytime. Notes just pour out of it with little effort and for the price I don't think theres a better guitar. After 15 years of playing I'm content with what I have.

[@josephlawton1203]

Definitely the modern deluxe 🎉

[@padbender2972]

picking really made the MD pop

[@dabrezman]

I like both

[@irmgardhajek6929]

Modern deluxe - no doubt. I own the 000-18 and love it but the MD sounds clearly better in this video.

[@worldwide1376]

I'll take the Standard. The Modern Deluxe sounds 'nasally' to me.' I also hear more low end 'boxiness' on the MD.

[@Nowandthen-zen]

That’s it. I’ve made up my mind . I’m buying the standard

[@scouser2230]

I would select the Modern Deluxe for its brighter sound.

[@TomZola1]

I much prefer the sound of the Standard. I'm not convinced that the differences you list make much difference. At best, differences like the use of hide glue are minimal and to many of us inaudible. These two guitars do sound different: but so do many guitars of exactly the same model.

[@scottf2199]

Modern deluxe seemed slightly brighter, and projection seemed slightly better. As I don’t like bright tone, of these two, give me the standard and save $$$

[@modern.day.meditations]

As a recording engineer that is passionate about acoustic guitars, I can tell you that the original is way more melodic. The modern deluxe is great, nothing against it, but its sound is... more modern. If you are going for that original Martin sound, the old model is the way to go. If you want a more modern sound... well, I guess it's obvious.

[@robforren406]

I prefer the look of the ooo18. The better sound I think is the deluxe! But I'm no expert.

[@artrogers3985]

Standard please 🎸

[@maplebones]

All other things being equal, a lighter guitar will sound more alive than a heavier one. Even a deaf person could tell that because of the feel of the vibrations when playing it. The major manufactures know that but they hesitate to make them light because they don't stand up as well and they don't want any warranty issues. I'm glad to see Martin moving in that direction because I find most of their guitars to be overbuilt and laking sweetness .

[@craigbaugher3230]

A little late to the party. However, I think the Modern Deluxe is definitely more articulate, and thus makes for a better finger and flat-picking guitar. Since we didn't hear the two compared strumming, I cannot make a judgement as what is the best strumming guitar. HOWEVER, and the problem is, I have purchased guitars in the past based on KZbin sound demos and have been highly disappointed once I had them in hand. So, I would NEVER buy another guitar again without first playing it.

[@randyeckhoff3334]

I can hear pic on strlings. On slow picn

[@alancousins846]

Well, I can't really te ll any difference between them. I have a 000-18 standard which I'm more than happy with

[@markstaggs7342]

Im a Taylor guy but i also have Martin and Gibson and others,I like both of these guitars i would have to definitely have to play each guitar several times over and over and see which one plays easy like a Taylor guitar does and the feel of the guitar while im playing them,Every guitar is different in playability and how easy they fret then choose from there and if i still couldn't decide i would get some one who is a fairly good guitar player and then see if i hear my choice,I had to do this with a couple of 614ce guitars and bought them both because they sounded different but both so wonderful.I was one Happy guitar lover and one husband who was lucky the wife didn't hang me out to dry but she sure got her say in the matter lol.