Destiny 2 Lore - Taranis's way of wishing. Do the Ahamkara need to twist wishes for evil?

[@VISageCarter]

Why did that "O' audience, Mine" give me chills

[@Drake-ij1jx]

because O' Commenter Mine we are all trapped by the wish magic or other paracausal power invoked by such a phrase. (grinning ear to ear)

[@rindelzivas]

It's a phrase of grand evocation, to be sure. ... O reader, mine.

[@ahabthewhatifer]

Do not worry about it, O' Commenter Mine, you are just over thinking it

[@derekvenner4255]

Can we just take a moment to appreciate that Byf impression

[@casartherandom3010]

I actually thought it was him for a few seconds.

[@HundredType]

Bro got me 💀

[@LxciferXIII]

I won’t lie they had us in the first half…

[@kingjamos2422]

I have no idea who the guy standing in for Byf today was, but he did a great job. He had me cracking up at "O audience mine". He also brought up something that I was pondering, myself. Twisting a wish does not necessarily have to be a bad thing. I really wish that we get to learn more about Taranis. He sounds like an interesting character.

[@jacoblansman8147]

The opening confused me for a second because it sounded like Byf but also not like Byf at the same time

[@Drake-ij1jx]

Perhaps one day we shall learn more about Taranis O' Commenter Mine.

[@rindelzivas]

​@@jacoblansman8147In that case, my job here is done.

[@jacoblansman8147]

@@rindelzivas I think we'd be good friends if we ever met because I too enjoy confusing people for my own amusement.

[@oryxfirstnavigator4795]

Nah, it didn't sound anything at all like Byf

[@The5lacker]

The way I interpret it is: Twisting the wish reinforces it with more Desire. If you get exactly what you desire, wish granted, you're all set... you aren't going to wish again. But if your wish gets twisted, you're going to wish you *hadn't* made a wish. The Ahamkara feeds on the gap between Reality-As-Desired and Reality-As-Is, but simultaneously carves a new gap in the same motion. It's the difference between Foraging and Farming. Now, how Taranis seems to get away with it is this: By granting small, safe wishes, Taranis relies on the social network around people to draw more wishes to him. Instead of plain foraging or predation, he acted almost like a... pollinator, essentially. A Mutualism that encourages cooperation between species.

[@atomicknoob]

I agree! Also, as Riven mentioned, Teranis cared about those he bargained. I can't help but theorise he would go the extra mile and even burn some of his accumulated power to ensure a happy wish on occasion. I think all of this means Teranis didn't reach the heights of power of other Ahamkara. Their territorial nature might be why he's out in the black garden, it's the only place he would be safe from other Ahamkara

[@Operational117]

That's what I think as well. At the very least, by only granting small wishes, he keeps receiving wishes. And if he keeps receiving wishes, he keeps granting wishes, thus he keeps nourishing himself. Small meals, but often.

[@Bustuhh]

​@@atomicknoobthere's a difference between bargaining and wishing Bargaining is diplomacy, which we've seen this season with us speaking to Riven (Mara and the Vanguard making deals for Rivens help by rescuing her eggs), and her trying at every turn to get us to wish to make our tasks easier The wish however is a spoken or internal desire for something When Uldren wished for a Fallen ally to be saved, he did it not knowing Riven was near, Riven then made it possible for Fallen to be reborn as Scorn When Praedyth internally wished for a fight to last forever, his wish got granted in the VoG raid, and he ended up trapped fighting forever

[@Ghost_Toast5000]

My logic is this: If the Ahamkara choose to do what they do because it's their nature, then they are no different from any other wild animal. But if they're intelligent enough that they choose to be evil, then the Great Hunt was justified.

[@TimothyMark7]

basically this

[@acgearsandarms1343]

Twisting a wish just maximizes the amount they get to feed off of. Though not necessary to live, it is in their best interest to eat. Taranis breaks the mold. He’s very interesting.

[@iponce2]

which is better: to be good, or to overcome your evil nature by great effort? Either way, seems the very existence of Taranis means the hunt was justified. Probably never would have happened if most ahamkara were like Taranis.

[@S1erra107]

Tbh like… you just said that genocide of a known sentient species was justified. Lol.

[@Ghost_Toast5000]

@@S1erra107 well they were actively dangerous, but then again even I have doubts about The Great Hunt

[@atsukana1704]

That intro was good, I did hear a subtle difference but I just wondered if that was his sickness for a moment. And dang the ahamkara voice

[@the_mochiking]

Thanks for all the great lore this year. Happy holidays!

[@wittyisme]

This is my first time hearing the vocal talents of Rindel Zivas and holy moly! I’m blown away! So, so good!

[@kevonhess9983]

I want byf to get better ASAP, but i appreciate the work that the community has done to help. The guest voice today was amazing

[@rindelzivas]

Thank you!

[@WDGabe]

​@@rindelzivas ITS THAT GUY!! be sure to listen to Rindel's other group works like Destiny Lore Audiophile (DLA)!

[@esma6748]

​@@rindelzivas can't wait to hear you back for a full episode on GoL... or in the ad if they make a TWOGL less than 10 mins lol

[@heyitsorchid]

Bet.

[@rindelzivas]

@@heyitsorchid ...It's gonna be an Ahamkhara maid cafe this time, isn't it.

[@koriusX]

Rindel, I'm naming an Ahamkara in my Dungeons & Destiny campaign after you. Excellent narration and lore analysis!

[@wmad202]

I've seen other ppl give their takes on how it all works and now I'm gonna give mine: When Riven says that all wishes have a cost, then that means all wishes just naturally have a Monkey's Paw consequence to them, which means the way a wish is worded is still heavily important to avoid calamity befalling the wisher. Twisting the wish only amplifies the amount of quantum chaos that a wish already has. However, it seems as though the Ahamkara granting the wish can *choose* who bears the brunt of those consequences, as we learned with Naeem and Hefnd. Hefnd made sure that Naeem would be the one who dealt with any of the negative effects of other people's wishes. I think Taranis did this same thing, but on himself, hence why Riven said "It must have cost him." Taranis was suffering for the sake of others.

[@EllieEars]

That was the perfect way to start the video, keep getting better man!!

[@twobee-1654]

"my status as whish dragon is a joke." Now that's exactly what an ahamkara would say

[@conmanay4563]

One thing I wonder is if Taranis essentially fed on the happiness he caused, since he cherished those that wished to him, or as you speculate, feed on twisting wishes in a positive manner

[@inquisitorichijou883]

Tho it does seem less potent in terms of nourishment than the way they normally feed.

[@acgearsandarms1343]

Happiness? So long as it involves what is desired and what is, I guess? Emotion itself is not what Ahamkara feed on.

[@conmanay4563]

@@inquisitorichijou883 the fact that Taranis could manipulate the black garden, a place beyond even the vex, and keep company with Riven, he would still have to be a very powerful ahamkara

[@AmandaMcCarterWrites]

They feed on the difference between what is wished and what is granted. The greater the difference, the greater the feast. So as long as the twisted wish was different enough from what was wished, but not something disastrous to the wisher, an Ahamkara could be sated.

[@stuffandthings617]

​@@AmandaMcCarterWrites isn't it the difference between reality as is and reality as wished? That's how I understood it until now. That's the reason why Mara wouldn't wish for much because she had the power to make her wishes true by her own power.

[@Equalizer74]

The Byf impression was spot on. Got me all excited when I heard it

[@screenysquirrel7274]

My personal theory is this, we know of the civilization that was destroyed by the hive that had the wish dragons and worshiped them, perhaps after their destruction by the hive, to escape and survive, the ahamkara resorted to twisting the wishes they once granted for their survival and eventually it became apart of their nature, learned and taught by the survivors. Perhaps Tarines is either an old ahamkara or, similar to Asha, was young when the civilization that worshiped them fell and when he escaped from it, kept to what he was and stayed in hiding before the alliance with the awoken

[@inktoxicant]

Not gonna lie, I thought that was Byf with the faint lingerings of whatever has him out resting bringing his voice out of wack a little bit 😂 Bravo!!

[@johngancarcik5682]

Dude you did an amazing job in filling in for byf and as yul everyone involved with dynasty did amazing

[@SquirrelyDan6422]

You know you are the voice of destiny when Yul helps cover a shift when you are under the weather. Great vid 🤘

[@mr._.mav792]

I... how was I legit fooled by the intro for a moment

[@rindelzivas]

Space magic.

[@wolfdragon1170]

Your Ahamkara voice acting is phenomenal. I love it so much. Thank you for filling in for Byf.

[@3ndlessL00p]

Byf! We have it the wrong way around when it comes to why Ahamkara twist wishes! They do NOT feed on the "difference between reality as it is and reality as desired". This week, after Starcrossed, Riven says it herself. "My kind feeds on the difference between 'what is desired' and 'what comes to pass'. That is why we grant wishes the way we do" (Source on Destiny Lore Vault: "Taranis was always a sentimental fool") To me, that means they feed on the difference between **reality as it is wished to be** by someone else and **what reality becomes when the wish is granted** That is a notable difference from the previous statement. Do you see it? It's not the space from reality to wish, but the space from wish to granted wish ( which is a changed reality). As such it really is in their interest to misinterpret and twist the wish, as the more they can twist it, the more they feed. So I'm sad to say, I believe the point at 7:33 is wrong. It really does seem to be the misinterpretation of the wish itself that they feed on. A wish that is granted verbatim/as intended wouldn't nourish them. And when granting their own wish, as Taranin did, they apparently can't twist the intention, maybe because they know it and can't feign misunderstanding. In Riven's words, they eliminate that difference that they feed upon. Which apparently leaves them to starve and die, or pay the price of the wish with their life.

[@3ndlessL00p]

The theory that they might be able to twist wishes in a positive direction still works in this framework btw. But I think it's important to know that the twisting of wishes is literally what they feed on, as stated by Riven.

[@phibalt]

Yes! This! I was screaming at my screen!

[@Krugis-Punk]

Given his name, the way he mispronounces ahamkara, and the name of the mission, I sincerely hope that Aztecross gets brought on to read as well! All of these guest narrators have been stellar!

[@sdstewart87]

Aztecross can stay away. His voice makes my ears wanna bleed 😂

[@SnoipaH999]

@@sdstewart87 kinda rude tbh

[@oryxfirstnavigator4795]

​@@sdstewart87this is factual. Especially when he screeches at the end of his sentences

[@R.A.Meenan]

Lovely to see the intro. ;) i do love me some great Rindel narration.

[@ajgreen6550]

Rindel said the thing. Good man. Way too long without the outro!

[@Tom.morals]

Merry Christmas Byf! We miss you! These guest narrations have been great but I hope you are feeling better! Much love and respect! See you next year!!

[@Toffeehammer]

With Riven saying Ahamkara feed on the difference between what is wished for and what is granted I wonder what she'd actually say if somebody asked her "why not make the wish better instead of worse and feed on that difference then?".

[@PlatinumAssassin]

That's my thought process but also from the Dragon's pov it's kinda also like "why should I care". Id say to continue a nice supply of wishes but they also didn't seem to have a problem gaining those even with the dire consequences.

[@Bustuhh]

There's a simple solution to Ahamkaras wish granting system We make a wish that forces the Ahamkara to feed on giving the desired wish By forcing the Ahamkara to change their ways, both parties get what they desire

[@tenacity25]

@@Bustuhh But you'd need one who isn't going to twist that wish.

[@blueangels111]

I think the difference in a negative twist will always be larger. If i get something i dont want, then the difference is not only still wanting what i wanted, but also wishing i hadnt wished at all. If i get more than i wanted, i wouldnt wish i hadnt wished.

[@MeanAndPristine]

It’s not just food; it’s an enrichment activity. It’s like placing a piece of meat inside a pumpkin and giving it to a bored zoo tiger. They get a kick out of overcoming the challenge presented by the pumpkin, but they don’t just get into it, they tear it to shreds

[@dwarfwarriorgames9497]

My mans out here sounding like the tutorial guide on windows back in early 2000’s when I was in computer class as a child. Like damn, he brought out all kinds of old ass memories

[@heyitsorchid]

Good job Rindel!

[@khilorn]

Fantastic intro Rindel 😂

[@AtlRopeGuy]

I’m sick, in the downs, and not doing so great. But this intro and flavor made my day. Thank you :)

[@rindelzivas]

Hmm. That guy narrating sounds oddly familiar... All jokes aside, it was a pleasure to lend my voice to keep videos coming out. Well, one of them, anyway. I hope you all enjoy the video as much as I did reading for it!

[@jonathangarner4420]

You have a great narrator voice and great byf impression and happy new year

[@garrettviewegh9028]

Merry Christmas Byf! Hope you’re feeling better, or get well soon! Excellent work voicing/reciting the lore for Byf on this video. The, “O, audience mine”. Gave me chills! But, the lore so far, the story of the noble and selfless Taranis does leave me to ponder: could the Ahamakara, the next generation, be more? Could they possibly choose to be more? To be selfless, and overcome their nature? Through nurture? Change and be more as the Guardians do? We no longer view the universe in absolute black and white. We no longer see ourselves as heroes and monsters, but Guardians. Guardians that not only safeguard the security and future of Sol, but that of all beings that call this system home. Time will tell if the Ahamakara can become more. If anything, they, and we, should look to Rasputin, Taranis, Amanda, and others for the inspiration: to be more. We cannot let fear blind us again. As it did when enacting the Great Hunt, when Saint slaughtered innocent Elksni, when Guardians, in fear of the Darkness, was corrupted by it, and the Witness, which preyed upon our fears, in every other dark timeline.

[@kisukeurahara189]

Great Byf impression.almost had me. Great lore, heal up Byf. Thanks D2 community!!

[@aq5426]

I have to say that Rindel does a killer Byf impression. :D

[@Sellner82]

This was my favorite cover. Great job sir!

[@feralprocessor9853]

The more you know. Zeebus voiced Yul-the honest worm

[@sun012497]

I think part of why they twist these wishes into woe is because a happy person rarely wishes for more a person in strife will wish for it to end or spread that woe to others thus creating more opportunities to grant and twist wishes so the dragon can feed

[@ronin9380]

Thanks for the great hard work! Get well Byf!

[@13thGeek]

The wishing that feeds the Ahemkara read to be the metaphysical difference from what is desired and what comes to be from the wish. So it stands to reason that a Wish Dragon would seek out the most bountiful possibilities from any given wish. Generally this means the wish is twisted to be its worst possible interpretation resulting in the death of the wisher or worse. The “ I wish for wealth.” analogy used here is great because it can be interpreted in several ways. Enough material wealth as to crush its recipient. A wealth of enemies to overwhelm or hunt the marked soul. Even to have a percieved value through a unique ability that results in incarceration to contain and control the wielder. A feast for a creature that feeds from such perversions of meaning. And that’s what killed the Ahemkara, GREED. Taranis was different. He would grant wishes and bend meaning only so much as necessary. He would not feed as deeply to preserve those who would wish but perhaps also to give what they NEEDED rather than what was DESIRED. If they wanted wealth, a wealth of friends to support community or to remove anxiety from artistic expression for a wealth of recognition is possible. The WISDOM of Taranis to seek harmony over strife will be his legacy to the new generation of Ahemkara.

[@Zed-1213]

They probably wouldn't want their wishers to die because then they would effectively lose a source of nourishment. It would make more sense to bring them to a point of misery rather than mortality.

[@PixelleHearts]

Wait... so canonically, does that mean Taranis was the reason we got resurrected? I mean, Wish magic works in nebulous ways. Taranis wanting to keep his clutch safe by having a fated person make their way to safeguard the eggs could have contributed to all the necessary conditions for Ghost to find us... Now, I know the wish wasn't made until after the Dreaming City was taken... but there are also all the new lights who also have to experience everything POST Forsaken, meaning, canonically, Shadowkeep and beyond guardians who take it upon themselves to reach Taranis now would have been affected by this wish to make it here.

[@Zed-1213]

Damn, that's something to think about. Although, I thought Taranis made this wish in response to Riven letting Oryx wish to Take her? At that point, *many* more Guardians, if not all of them, had yet to be resurrected. I'm not sure how long ago that took place, but it was certainly before Kingsfall and The Taken King when we gave Oryx his final death.

[@ZombieSlayerTakashi]

Best Stand-in so far.

[@ZuluNinja]

I have 2 kids and were all taking turns with the flu. Byf get better soon and all your fill ins have been great

[@thedarkgenious7967]

you know at the start of this season I was thinking Riven was gonna be the one to grant the "wish" and give us passage into the traveler to follow the Witness but now I'm wondering if instead some of the eggs might hatch and it ends up being the first wish granted by some of the new dragon whelps, who follow their father's example and grant wishes to help rather than harm.

[@acgearsandarms1343]

Minor correction, young Ahamkara are whims. We might get help on a whim.

[@O-bearer-mine]

​@@acgearsandarms1343 It is honestly amazing that they're ACTUALLY CALLED WHIMS

[@vanguardgaming1779]

Having an Ahamkara as a voice for one of Byfs special guests would be an interesting thought. What’s the theme in the background? plz I NEED to know, been searching for it for a while. Merry Christmas Byf, get better soon.

[@armedkevin1178]

I'll see you starside... oh, viewer mine.

[@twobee-1654]

If you give me a timestamp for the "theme in the background", I might be able to help you. The music in the video is not always the same though

[@vanguardgaming1779]

@@twobee-16542:24

[@deadman3003]

The music in the background should be from the Forsaken soundtrack. Specifically, the Keep of Voices towards the end, I believe

[@vanguardgaming1779]

@@deadman3003nope that wasn’t it

[@fortescue95]

Chills at the end

[@ShadeyDuality]

we love how during his sikness byf has become byf of a thousend youtubers

[@Anton-zu3py]

This game never cease to amaze me,I been playing Destiny since 2014 . You always learn and find something new. Thank you and greetings from Mexico… Feliz Navidad amigos.🎄🎄🎄🎄🇲🇽

[@darkrebellion2598]

Wont lie. Im standing here at work and counting cigarettes when i just here " O audience mine" I damn near shat myself.

[@jamesstarks7630]

Don't play with me like that!!! I miss my BYF! 😢. I got so hype thinking our guy was back😂

[@firenzarfrenzy4985]

Smashing job on the Byf impression. However, the “O Audience Mine” with the laughter, had me in goosebumps. That was amazing!

[@brandenclark8797]

Boy I thought it was spike Spiegel for a second😂

[@lukebarroso449]

Merry Christmas to everyone in the chat! Hope you all have a great Christmas Eve, Day, and new years!

[@sirbeam9500]

Hope your doing good byf. I myself recently got covid and lost my own voice right before a dnd session and Christmas. I feel you man. Hope you get better

[@WhoisPersona]

I thought BYF was back for a moment there…

[@WDGabe]

Hi Rindel!

[@Ifyoucanreadthisgooglebroke]

This is exactly what first doing the starcrossed mission had me thinking about. If the goal is to feed on interacting with the difference between desire and reality through changing it with their wish granting, and not playing the djinn game could mean enough more "customers", then that seems like it could out compete the usual Ahamkara djinn-inspired meta of twisting the wish to make each one worth more difference between desire and reality. It seems that usual Ahamkara method is the result of some vicious game theory inspired cycles that led the wishes to be more rich for the Ahamkara, but at the cost of dwindling fewer and fewer in number and eventually outright inspired a reaction like the great hunt. Taranis could have really been onto something if he'd paired his method with not being a recluse so that he could really 'cash in' on the volume he'd be able to attract with his unironic wishes.

[@pieflakes718]

ayy why was that impression pretty damn good lol

[@Jacobk-g7r]

9:02 the reason they started is just like why we ate and drank and then understood more. Some humans and animals understand a little more and adapt the hunting method, some gain different insights but usually until you are met with another predator you don’t change behavior and think you’re the king but when you take in differences and reflect, then you can change the strategy and self and symbiosis occurs until something else. One must eat but one doesn’t need to eat everything.

[@DJ_Dermo07]

Best guest

[@Zed-1213]

This is how I understand the Ahamkara's motivation to deceptively fulfill one's wishes: We know they feed off of a type of chaos described by a wisher's disparity between their true reality and their desired reality. If I make a wish that is fulfilled as I expected it to, the disparity between what I desire and what I have shrinks, leaving less chaos upon which an Ahamkara can feed. However, if my wish is twisted maliciously, the gap between my desired and true realities grows, providing more nourishment for the Ahamkara because they have generated more chaos as a result of my wish being granted unfairly. This explanation satisfies Riven's comment about Taranis' wishes costing himself if she was referring to opportunity cost, while keeping a consistent logic with nourishment and the motive for malicious deception.

[@feralprocessor9853]

Thank you Zeebus

[@CMRonin]

Even though I don’t even play this game anymore for now the lore is still so riveting

[@imbadatgamesree]

You sounded like nezarec with the ahamkara part

[@Jacobk-g7r]

8:00 the nourishment is from all the potentials. It’s not the chaos that they feed on but all the differences.

[@strider2175]

Going to bring up an idea that I've mentioned before. I feel the Ahamkara were around when the Gardener and the Winnower were playing the Great Game, and when the Gardener stated they wanted to change the rules... I wonder if the Gardener actually said 'I wish I could change the rules', and if one of the wish dragons heard this, and decided to twist that wish, which is what led up to where we all are now.

[@zakeeros1663]

The only problem is that the whole Gardener and Winnower might just a metaphor for the conflict between the Witness and the Traveler or just a flat out lie.

[@submachinegun5737]

If the gardener and winnower are real and not just a witness trick, then they existed before time as a concept and the universe, so the ahamkara probably didn’t exist at that point, and you don’t need an ahamkara in order for your desires to cause unintended consequences.

[@RyuRaeArashi]

I'm kind of curious exactly how the timeline lines up with our guardian, in terms of Taranis and his wish. When exactly did it happen, and did it coincide with any of our power boosts? I'm curious about the idea of his wish having some positive influence on our guardians power, so that we would be powerful enough to take care of the eggs when we would get to that point in our story. Also I kind of interpreted the "it must have cost him" line with the voice tone of Riven to mean it definitely cost him in a way that made an impact on him negatively in some way. Like draining something from him almost, like he had to put a little more into the exchange than the others and it would slowly over time wear on him. Not that it would be impossible for Ahamkara to live like that, but it might be able to compare to a human living on rice and beans for the rest of their lives or something. You'd live, but you wouldn't be as strong as other people eating full, healthy diets and over time it would definitely impact your health.

[@dynojackal1911]

Taranis granting his own wish happened after Oryx bargained with Riven to Take her. So the sacrifice he made for his eggs was possibly around the time we (our Guardian) were discovering our third Light subclasses.

[@RyuRaeArashi]

@@dynojackal1911 Yea that's where I'm not sure with the context we're given, how long after she was taken did he wait and the like.

[@steveeymann6374]

They did a hell of a job on this last cutscene.

[@vgernyc]

Did Byf wish for a 1000 voices and lost his as part of a faustian bargain? Now Ahamkara have taken his place.

[@TinaMcCall.]

Nice work!

[@green_in_black]

My headcanon is that when the Witness began it's War of Shapes, it began the wholesale destruction of intelligent life that could feed the Ahamkara. The act of twisting could have been taboo for them until the war and the twisting became the only way they could be sure they were fed and could survive. I don't have a lot of evidence, but it's a compelling thought.

[@flamboyantgastropods4266]

Happy christmas and holidays everyone!

[@danielleshanahan4668]

From all this, it sounds like if the wisher was super vague, then the Ahamkara could twist the wish and receive lots of nourishment without creating a "bad" wish.

[@calebwithak]

I imagine the Ahamkara twist the wishes negatively because that fosters more wishing opportunities. If you grant a persons wishes faithfully you will likely run out of wishes with that person quickly. If you twist their wishes you will eventually destroy that person but in the process you will be able to grant more wishes and greater wishes and with greater twisting to grow even more powerful from.

[@RobertHouse-uk1vi]

Another aspect of twisting the wish in a positive way is that if many ahamkara did this then more people would trust them and go to them. So not only would each "meal" be increased, the quantity of wishes would also increase. So even if you are a selfish, greedy ahamkara it would be in their own self-interest to do this. Also like the video said people might not hunt them down and revile them.

[@ashutran06]

To quote Paarthunax: "What is better to be born good or to overcome your Evil nature through great effort"

[@Kaijugan]

Taranis reminds me of Parthurnaxx. “Is it best for a being to be born innately good? Or to overcome one’s evil nature through great effort, study and selflessness?”

[@BigClownLuv]

I look at it this way. If they grant a wish without twisting it it’s like eating food with no seasoning. It’s bland and tasteless. But by twisting the wish they get seasoning on their food that adds flavor making it taste better

[@StarWarrior7567]

Identity theft is not a joke, Jim! 😂

[@ac4th371]

I like to think granting wishes is the food and twisting it simply improves the flavour.

[@deucedeuce177]

byf take your time, dont rush❤️

[@DANNYTWISTER46]

Excellent work!

[@Oblivion9996]

Maybe positive wishes can work like that but wouldn't it make sense for a positive twist like that to bring reality closer to the wisher's desires thus reducing the strength gained by an ahamkara? Maybe it could be worth it though, if a wisher makes more wishes after being so blessed by the ahamkara, leading to better longterm growth for the ahamkara because of their increased quantity of wishes granted

[@demonsorrows]

My current evolving theory. Just my thoughts on it. Sorry for the length. If Ahamkara feed on the difference between what's wanted and turnout, their existence could be tied to and were turned from being the caretakers or feeders (like pilot fish) of the Traveler and Veil. Some abandoned The Veil, after the separation for greener pastures, so to speak. The balance shifted from light and darkness, the physical separated from intent and desires rooted in consciousness, but they maintained that adaptation after the separation. Their ability to shapeshift coming from their intent and feeding (you are what you eat kinda thing) and their feeding on the Veil. They evolved to be deceptive because intent VS outcome is a ying and yang thing, one side winning out and not a whole anymore. Some left to follow the Traveler, keep an eye on it, feed on Light and Darkness wish magic being twisted intent. Other Ahamkara saw no purpose to it or desired the "flavor" of the Veil-side and entered the Veil. Their physical presence removed, but consciousness still lives within The Deep. Their influence, they're whispers of The Deep. They manipulated Oryx and taught him how to Take. Earlier in the universe, they manipulated The Witness with promises of the Final Shape: reuniting the two to "remake" the universe, but it's more their means to bring themselves back from The Deep. The entire conflict between the Traveler and the Witness has been a long drawn out war between the ancestors of Ahamkara who stayed in-universe, and those who entered the Veil that want to bring back what was or start anew by any means necessary. The difference between what the Witness was promised with the Final Shape VS what will actually happen to the universe= the biggest Veil-Ahamkara feeding that could ever occur on multidimensional, universal scale. Enough feeding to break free of The Deep prison and as a byproduct, release the big baddies that once lived in the Ascendant plane that are trapped their as well. The Light from the Pale Heart, the purest of the Light untainted by the Darkness, being used to give them the ability to manifest a physical presence once again.

[@andimion521]

I personally believe, and I always did, that the negative twisted wishes are a defense mechanism by the species to stave off manipulation. Other beings wont as actively seek out selfish wishes if they are afraid of consequences. I mean you could hold a dragons clutch hostage yo get all the positive wishes you want. And over the many years became their nature, to which they as a species forgot it doesn't need to be twisted negatively to survive themselves. Cause remember in the lore they were originally from another world with another intelligent species.

[@kenseavey9165]

Damn close brother, one hell of a voice actor I hope you’re doing cartoons and not commercials.

[@AyokaiW]

From what I gathered Taranis was the outliner, not the norm. Even Riven was skeptical about how Taranis granted his wishes, and knowing that she did not change her way of doing things. And can you blame her if she didn't want to starve? I think the nature of Ahamkara prevented them from following Taranis's way, but the Great Hunt, I feel, was a bit of an overcorrection to the fear. Personally I hope Riven gives Mara the eggs so she can raise the next batch of wish dragons to be better than the previous generation. Mara herself has changed, and I doubt she wants another Riven. 😅

[@ThatKid22101]

It's possible but I think riven might change as well, I get a feeling there's going to be some discovery on rivens part that taranis wasn't struggling at all and she can still feed and grant wishes safely. This will come to the climax of granting mara her last wish, instead of twisting it in a bad way, she makes the wish even better. This will solidify newfound trust between ahamkara and everyone, especially between riven and mara who throughout this season have shown serious trust issues between each other. It's partially healed now since riven has realized it wasn't mara who hid the eggs and mara helped get them back. It's a good step but more needs to be done on both parts.

[@RuiNDieM1988]

I wonder if twisting a wish is akin to seasoning your food. To that effect maybe part of the sustenance is the negative effect the wish brings to the wisher. If you're satisfied with your wish then the difference between reality and desire shrinks. To that effect its better for the Ahamkara to negatively twist wishes rather than positively twist them. Regardless this plot line is great and I cant wait to see what story threads this spins later down the line.

[@blueoysterboi4742]

The difference between desire and reality empowers them maybe twisting the desire grants them more long term power

[@keon2703]

O AUDIENCE MINE!!!

[@dakotagarcia997]

Haven't seen anyone point this out but Is the Ahamkara Illusion in Witch Queen possibly a prep for Taranis ? There's a few similarities with the model, the Cinematic depictions and what we've seen from Riven. The anchoring point for me is the fact that Riven is Blue/purple and Her ring/ Buff in Star-crossed is blue, Taranis's was Red, the Hands on the Illusion model are also red.

[@WrathNebula321]

While I cannot confirm or deny that the Hunt was justified, the fact that Taranis wanted to protect those who bargained with him shows that there are good dragons who simply want to feed, but not hurt those they grant wishes. I would even say that Hefnd falls under this category as well because of how he felt about his friend, Naeem, even though he was technically dead, Naeem still made a bargain with him through his bones, to accept the consequences of the wishes from the people she protected. We even see that Hefnd honored his friend's last wish, even if it meant poisoning himself with Taken energy, and once we were almost finished with collecting his remains, he says that he would reunite with his friend, Naeem. If the children of Riven and Taranis do eventually hatch, I hope that they follow in Taranis' path. Get well soon, Byf. And thank you, Rindel Zivas, for providing this lore for us.

[@apricotcharms4126]

Imagine if after final shapes year of content we got a new familiar slot and could use the robo pup, the war beast, or a ahamkara hatchling

[@skylenxander4768]

Hehe I laughed with you when you used your real voice, O [narrator] mine

[@burritojack893]

the queensfoil censer's back must be fkn hurting from carrying all these vids.

[@adamsmith1904]

I view the whole wish = nourishment thing as would you rather eat a spoonful of peas or a full course meal with peas

[@reamoinmcdonachadh9519]

If a 'twist' adds piquancy, some savor or seasoning to the nourishment a granted wish provides, then one can understand the temptation. But doing so IN THE KNOWLEDGE that the wisher would suffer as a consequence....and being indifferent to that...or worse, taking PLEASURE from it.....kind of justifies the Great Hunt.

[@MacRae013]

the Intro xD

[@feralprocessor9853]

Taranis is like a humpback whale. Despite not gaining anything back they'll still give you kindness.

[@DeathsPit00]

Everyone keeps taking time to talk about Wish Keeper while seemingly not realizing the relevance to the facts that It's a bow that was given by an Ahamkara that is based solely in the Strand subclass. The fact that it's a Strand bow I believe is actually a great hint as to how the Ahamkara do what they do. They either weave, reweave, or pluck at the Strands of reality. This is also probably how they shapeshift. If you pay attention to the animation on an enemy when destroyed by Strand you'll see that their corporeal form Unravels from existence, but if we take into account that Ahamkara can most likely rework these Strands than that would mean that they can reweave their own physical form as well. With this information we can surmise that the way that Ahamkara exist is as partially Inter-dimensional entities that need a physical host body in order to anchor themselves to our(The Guardian's) reality. This why they can still die, but still have the ability to interact through their bones. They simply have a stronger anchor and more strength to do what they do with a living body, but destroying their bones would fully cut their tether to reality UNLESS it were put into a different form, Like a Bow.