What if Rome Recovered After the Fall of the West? - Part 2 | Alternate History

Part 1: • What if Rome Recovered...
This is an alternate history scenario on what if the Roman Empire recovered after the fall of the west, just like it had recovered from the crisis of the third century, and countless other crises.
More specifically, it's a scenario on what if everything went right during and after emperor Justinian's rule. So; no Justinian plague, no second invasion of Italy, a decisive victory against the Sassanids, and a successful halting of the Arab invasions.
In this episode I will be covering the Roman Empire today.

[@restitutororbis1216]

*Rome today, Rome tomorrow, Rome Forever.*

[@stanisawzokiewski3308]

ROMAE AETERNA PERPETVA INVICTA

[@jackdunphy9781]

Respect much Respect

[@emperorofwends8875]

AVE

[@pyrenees2695]

Rome all the time!

[@treekangaroo.7691]

George Wallace but based

[@Kunnis]

Balkans. Instead of being the Europe's powderkeg, is now a rich, peaceful peninsula.

[@orjelmort2330]

It’s based because there is no slavic identity there, based

[@eternal_riftz8801]

Tbh from part 1 it looks like the thracians and illyrian would survive today and there will be no slavs in the balkans

[@orjelmort2330]

@@eternal_riftz8801 more like romanized and hellenized illyrians and Thracians like what they already did way before in Anatolia

[@eternal_riftz8801]

@@orjelmort2330 yep

[@romanian_thief]

Finally, world peace

[@ivanf.482]

"Don't do that. Don't give me hope"

[@rostdreadnorramus4936]

A side effect that I'd like to see as a result of this time line, is many of the Ancient Roman buildings being better preserved and maintained, such as the Flavian Amphitheater, the Forum Romanum, the Circus Maximus, and others.

[@enderman_of_d00m24]

God wouldn't that be beautiful. Seeing such buildings not as relics, but as still functioning millennium old cultural centers

[@rostdreadnorramus4936]

@@enderman_of_d00m24 Agreed.

[@meneither3834]

Now this is straight up world-building, I love it. That said, I'm pretty sure the Hungarian would have assimilated into latin or greek culture, especially given how few Hungarian actually came to the region.

[@rodicamoraru3922]

They would rebel and form there own kingdom in the 19 century . Also no empire ever held provinces that where far from home would slowly be withered down to only core majority greek or latin cultere centuries prior.

[@fer1v0k41]

provinces that different in language, and that far from the capital would slowly desire more and more autonomy like we did from austria, we wouldve rebelled like 5 times. also im pretty sure that we wouldve stood our ground, just look at our history with the ottomans. we couldve maintained AT LEAST large autonomy.

[@Mana-xd2tp]

​@rodicamoraru3922 I could see Hungarian relations with the Romans being similar to the Ottomans.

[@aqui1ifer]

I’m imagining in this scenario that the Roman Emperors took after the example of the British monarchy that the Head of State is quite strong de-jure, but prefers out of necessity to not exercise its powers in an effort to maintains it’s public image & not alienate the masses. You could also characterize it as a return to form; as IIRC Augustus’ title of Princeps (Prince or otherwise First [Citizen]) didn’t have absolute power over Rome, but wielded immense influence over the Senate thanks to his control & authority over the Legions. Plus, we know the fates of Emperors that got on the Senate’s really bad side, an unfortunate date with the Praetorians... All in all excellent work!

[@AudioEsoterixxx]

For a sec I thaught he was just acting like Rome was still here and I was just living in a parallel universe

[@rebelinfarnape4030]

What i really like about your alternate history videos is your focus on narrative. I think you should implement more storytelling elements like historical figures and events like economic collapses or booms. Even if your alt history videos arent the most realistic i certainly find them more fascinating than other alt history scenarios

[@jgr7487]

I just loved this scenario! however, I have some gripes: 1) Coptic would still be alive & thriving, as it's the language of the Egyptian Church & it had never had issues with invasions until the Arabs got there, Roman Egypt could easily be a bilingual region where almost everyone speak Coptic & Greek; & 2) how come Britain & Russia have allowed Iran to stay so large?

[@shadowthehedgehog3113]

Maybe Iran is stronger in this timeline. IRL, Iran had the misfortune of being ruled by the Qajar dynasty-and still managed to resist being outright conquered. With better leadership maybe they could hold onto much of their lands in Iraq and the Caucuses.

[@LuciferMorningstar-uk7oh]

Consider the central role Persia/Iran would have in region it like become fairly powerful as it would consolidate the Islamic area. Along with Rome's proximity Persia would be unlikely to easily full under influence.

[@wargamesmaster]

Did you ever thought of writting fanfictions? I would absolutely read stories about alternate historical events, hell, time travel stories concerning Egypt, the Macedonia or Roman empire!

[@projectember728]

Hey neatling can you make a alt history of canada where It revolts instead of the thirteen colonies?

[@imahuman6880]

*Baguette Noises Increase*

[@beepbop6542]

The revolution was fueled by American culture, which was very different from Canadian culture.

[@EslayerTM]

or it also revolts along with the 13 colonies

[@Void_Dweller7]

@@beepbop6542 There was no such thing as a Canadian identity.

[@ls200076]

@@Void_Dweller7 Baguettes!

[@Counteris16]

Oh c'mon removing Corsica for no reason... Sometimes I really hate youtube comments.

[@aqui1ifer]

Yeah, if I was doing this, I’d have the Boneparte family have a falling out with the vicarius of Cisalpina & have them flee from Genua to Monaco or Marsseille in France prior to the 18th Century to still have Napoleon happen, yet still have Rome keep Corsica

[@TexasViking_INFP-t_5w4]

Youre doing the same thing

[@iSyriux]

Persia does not want to be the leader of the islamic world. I myself have seen many persians express their belief that shi'a islam is not enough for the persian cultural identity, and that the arabs forced the persians to adopt islam over a period of 200 brutal years. In this world, Rome would have in many ways liberated persia from islam and modern persia in this timeline would have its mesopotamian provinces islam, west provinces orthodox christian, and eastern provinces zoroastrian.

[@Char444]

that would mean no islam in india and central asia

[@Char444]

@Jamil Ebdeen no i mean that if persians are not muslims so arabs cannot go to central asia and india. Because persia is between arabia and central asia+India

[@shadowthehedgehog3113]

In this timeline though-Iran would likely be THE major bastion of Islam so its not far fetched to think that in this timeline, Persians would be less likely to view Islam as something imposed on them rather something that they made their own (which many do already).

[@CorsetGrace]

I agree. Persians are very proud, and I think Rome, being so close and against the Islamic kings for a time, would help prop Persia against the Islamic Empire so Persia would be even less Islamic since Islam wouldn't succeed in Persia. It would make sense for Rome to pit them against each other for Rome's safety and the safety of their shipping through the Egyptian Canal. And yes, that removes Islam from Central Asia.

[@F1RacingFans]

I would've expected the population to be a bit higher. Especially in egypt. I can understand you lowering it down because it would not have an insane growth of modern day. Also some regions most prominently cyreneika and anatolia have a bit small populations imo. I would also expect for GDP to be in the range you described with maybe a bit lower gdp per capita because of the larger population. I would expect this because of fierce traditionalism that would probably be deeply set within Romanian society paralleling the Chinese. So considering all that, considering as you mentioned that there was no second major ww i would expect Wester populations to be more traditional with slightly higher populations. Aside from that remark i really enjoyed your both of your videos on this topic. Thank you for making them.

[@drakonos79]

i would say the bulk of the populace might be in the anatolian peninsula (anatolia, pontus, cappadocia), as it was historically. This was the heartland of the empire that not only sustained it during the "dark" 7th and 8th centuries, but provided the push outward during the 9th and 10th centuries. then, during the 11th century, hurt the most when it was lost to the Turks. in the Alexiad, Anna Comnene discussed that the most heavily populated areas in the empire during her lifetime would be the areas of western anatolia. so, the calculation of 50mil for that region, compared to italy's 67 is very light. An Anatolia not ravaged by turkification would be very fertile and densely populated indeed.

[@cristyano6449]

I appreciated the idea of combining both the alternate and the actual history of the world, great video :D

[@ACGreyhound04]

As an American of Greek Orthodox faith and ancestry, I find it interesting how this series positioned a surviving Rome as a middling economic and industrial power, which became more advanced than Russia or Iran, but less dynamic than Protestant northwest Europe (where development more or less paralleled our timeline). Rome essentially became the political equivalent of our timeline’s Ottoman and Austro-Hungarian Empire, but with a political system becoming increasingly quasi-democratic and decentralized. I agree that it would probably be like this for part of its history - an antiquated and unwieldy political “sick man” beholden to more dynamic foreign powers despite its ancient pedigree, much as China was during the Age of Imperialism in our timeline, whose Emperors became feeble and humiliated puppets for a while. My Greek ancestry leads me to speculate, however, that the surviving Greco-Roman nation of this scenario would become quite a bit more influenced by ideologies like Communism and Fascism in the 20th century than this series posited. I can imagine a figure arising in the 20th century surviving Roman state who would sort of combine the characteristics of Italy’s Benito Mussolini, Germany’s Adolf Hitler, and Turkey’s Mustafa Kemal Ataturk, with a bit of Stalin and Mao thrown in. This Greek-speaking Roman authoritarian figure would, I think, create a peculiarly Roman sort of “Hellenistic fascism” with a religious revivalist, Romano-Orthodox bent, coupled with a crazed desire to drive rapid industrialization, and a tendency to ethnically cleanse minority groups and opponents, such as Protestants, Muslims, ethnic Germans, Communists, and possibly “backward” peasants. I think that such a fascist-nationalist Rome would side aggressively against both the German-American-British dominated Protestant hegemony of the West, and also against the avowedly communist USSR. It would, I believe, leverage its control of key trade routes like the Bosporus and the Suez (Rome, not Britain, would build the Suez Canal in this scenario) to become a “third superpower” (or maybe fourth, if you count China). Rome could conceivably start a Second World War, like Hitler did, but a bit later in history (the “First World War” in this scenario being the earlier and less intense “Russo-German War” discussed in the first video of this series). I can also imagine that, after communism fell in Russia and became less dominant in China, Rome could revive its cultural and religious influence over Russia to expand its “soft power” eastward, where a very Putin-like Greco-Roman leader (possibly a successor to the first fascist-nationalist Roman strongman, if that leader managed to avoid the open combat of a destructive World War with the Protestant-Capitalist West) becomes a key ally to Putin himself, or someone like him, in Russia.

[@buzter8135]

Please write a book 🥺

[@bobminon439]

tldr

[@A.G.798]

Soweit so gut, jedoch wird hier davon ausgegangen das Rom sich auf seine Grenzen beschränken würde (Justianische Reconquista) das glaube ich nicht! Nach Konsolidierung der Gebiete, würde Rom als nächstes das Sassanidische Persien, sowie die Arabische Islamisierung vernichten, und sich dann nach Afrika und Nord und Mitteleuropa orientieren, anschließend nach Osten, so wie Moskau auch das 3 . Rom genannt wird, würde Rom im Laufe der Jahrhunderte die Gebiete des Russischen Reiches in sich vereinen, und selbst eine Mongolische Invasion wäre zu Scheitern verurteilt, und würde das Imperium letztendlich nur Stärken. Desweiteren würde die neue Welt; Amerika, Australien und Neuseeland, von abenteuerlichen Männer aus den Nord und Mitteleuropäischen römischen Provinzen entdeckt, und für das Imperium in Besitz genommen, besiedelt und Kolonisiert. Die Welt wäre "Römisch" nur China das sich Südostasien, und Japan die sich Ozianien einverleiben würden,wären neben der römischen Welt noch eigenständige Staaten. Nicht zu Vergessen das die Energie Reserven der Welt sich zu über 90 % in römischer Hand befinden, und die 2 anderen Staaten sich mit der römischen Weltmacht gut stellen müssten, um Versorgt zu werden,gegen Bare Münze natürlich.

[@archdornan3068]

Aurelian would be so proud

[@Gamingmaster-jv9zj]

And Diocletian

[@imperialcolumbian.4087]

Nope because Romania in this scenario is Christian not Pagan

[@archdornan3068]

@@imperialcolumbian.4087 honestly lad Aurelian is the man who changed the main god of rome I doubt he cares as long as rome is standing he made a new god just to unite the people under it

[@imperialcolumbian.4087]

@@archdornan3068 Aurelian made policies to make the Sol Invictus cult the only legal religion in the empire

[@sketchye5943]

2:08 is that Nafplio? Also imagine how much money Rome would get from Tourism

[@Neatling]

It is! Low key put it in there because I remembered how beautiful it was when I was there during a trip to Greece a few years ago. And yeah it would by far be the most visited country in the world. Just Italy and Turkey combined dwarf the current most visited country France.

[@sketchye5943]

Hey I got it right! Same reason why I remembered it, oh and yeah the castle helped

[@Neatling]

@@sketchye5943 Yeah it's a pretty cool sight to see. Definitely worth the trip. It was built by the Venetians in the 1700's I believe. But the Ottomans got control of it not long after it was built. Walking up the stairs to it with my old high-school class was a real struggle though lol.

[@sketchye5943]

Yeah I’ve been there, it’s next to Argos and Tiryns I was super impressed with the 3 castles, it’s a super cool place and unique because of the number of rulers it had, also the first Greek Parliament was there

[@jgr7487]

"the Empire of the two canals & 2000 beauties"

[@trafichat]

If Rome is a strong well designed democracy by the modern day, I could see it and the US staying as allies, especially if both the US and Rome decide that China needs to start improving on that human rights thing. Both the US and a strong Rome pressuring China into not being evil is something to consider.

[@theman9048]

I guess they should be moral like the US that has murder millions of civilians in the last 10 years. As well as locked up more of there population then any other countries.

[@randomboys1000]

@@theman9048 the fuck are you taking about? lmao

[@theman9048]

@@randomboys1000 their own population my fault if I wasn't clear

[@ZettyLad]

@@theman9048 Large swaths of the Middle East are Greek and Christian in this timeline. I doubt the Middle East would be as unstable as it is in our timeline, aka, leading to less bombing.

[@theman9048]

@@ZettyLad the middle east is unstable because of colonization and the after effects of WW2. If this timeline is different it will be because of those changes not the religious.

[@nikosnikos5082]

what if the carolingian empire and byzantium united?

[@briishperson4555]

“Don’t do that, don’t give me hope”

[@janvancura8412]

kzbin.info/www/bejne/Y5O3ZaBubamhrK8

[@sylarstern8382]

Those two videos combine together are really something else ! Thank you for that

[@renatoquezada4173]

Loved it. Although I would have imagined Carrhage would have become one of the biggest cities in this scenario.

[@PSIRockOmega]

I appreciate you taking a detailed look at things like culture and language. It's not something I've seen in many other alt history videos.

[@diegodesouza5382]

I really like there in depth videos showing how the nation is today, and it looks and feels like it is real. Great job, Neatling!

[@grimlemngr2605]

Nice work and video

[@rokball4892]

This is so good and I can’t wait to see the new video. ;)

[@vikingen244]

Do “ What if Buddhism spread into the Middle East and Europe? “

[@Yanzdorloph]

They would turn it into a political tool to start wars

[@justinianthegreat1444]

Hahahahahahahahaha it won't since Christianity and Islam would be purging people who try to spread that

[@hetzarrow6957]

What a wonderful idea☸️💡

[@user_____M]

The Mongols.

[@kaloarepo288]

Actually the Greek kingdoms that were established in India and central Asia following the conquests of Alexander the Great were instrumental in the spread of Buddhism and messages were even sent to Hellenistic powers in the West like Ptolemaic Egypt,Greek Syria and Cyrene in north Africa explaining Buddhism but it never really gained any traction in the West probably because the Parthian and Persian empires were in the way and these were devoutly Zoroastrian.Later it was too late because of Christianity that more or less filled the same function.Many scholars believe that early Christian monasticism as was seen in Egypt,Syria and what is now Turkey may have been influenced by Buddhist monasticism and Hindu-Buddhist asceticism.

[@Onezy05]

Loved this. Always wanted to see how Byzantium with borders as rich as these would theoretically operate.

[@helo8859]

Damn, kinda want to see this as a mod for a paradox game

[@andreiciustea]

As a Romanian, this video brought me tears of joy! I wish we could have had this in our time...

[@projectember728]

Yes a upload keep up the work also you can try Germany,france or even canada

[@NoVisionGuy]

Would've been more possible if this Roman timeline had bigger population, maybe at least 450million people.

[@deviatedhistory4340]

Nice video

[@connorpieroni234]

I really wish this series went on definitely one of the better neatling videos

[@mariusthomashoutvedkristia7129]

a napoleonic what if could be nice, as nearly all of them on youtube are unlikely or quite old. However my fellow scandinavian you could also make a WHAT IF THE NORTH SEA EMPIRE SURVIVED, AND MAKE YOUR ANCESTORS PROUD!!!! (it doesn't need to be forever just a 100 or 200 years so they can actually influence the world ;)))) PLZ do this :O

[@Neatling]

Funny you mention that because some of the scenarios I have been considering are exactly those. So stay tuned! It will be a bit before I move on to a completely new scenario, since I already have several videos in the works. But I will more than likely do both of those scenarios at some point.

[@brunobrunelli176]

Amazing video! Only point I disagree with is that Greek and Latin cultures haven't merged in all those centuries under one nation. They are much more similar than different, also having a significant variety of cultural minorities within Romania, the nation would've been perfect for a Melting Pot. There are historical evidences for Greek and Latin cultures being open to other cultures, for example Alexander with Persian culture, the Ptolemaic dynasty and Roman Emperors adopting foreign gods. I believe that given industrialization neither caused a Civil War nor other existential crisis in Romania (e.g. Industrialized Yankee vs. Rural Dixie that couldn't coexist mainly because of fundamentally different economic and ethic systems), economic growth would've caused a huge amount of migration and cultural integration inside the nation. It's improbable that Romania wouldn't have a dominant language, like "Grego-Latin". Of course nations such as Canada have more than one language, but it's clear that English is dominant, because it's essencial that one nation speaks the same language in order to do business, create laws, educate children and disseminate culture in order to stay unified, especially in the mass media world we live in nowadays.

[@gamingdealer9514]

The romans were assimilationists. "When In Rome, do as the Romans do". There would most likely not be a melting pot but other cultures would assimilate to the much more dominant Greco-Roman culture.

[@CorsetGrace]

I agree with you about the Grelatin language being spoken through the empire. I also think, that while many autonomous areas may still harbor some who spoke their old languages, most would assimilate and speak Grelatin. It would help all those regions to think of themselves and Romans.

[@allliquid6320]

I need more!

[@whateverthisis389]

Justinian would be proud

[@familyguygaming_]

amazing quality as always! your demographic maps and outlining of the cities is always my favorite part. do you think that next time you could go over the ethnic demographics of the nation? great video!!

[@CorsetGrace]

I was hoping Carthage would be mentioned as one of the main cities of Rome.

[@avyay9818]

I think the Emperor would probably not be a complete figurehead, but act more like a president, where they control the army and have control over pardons, passports, etc. while also having large influence over the supreme court and the federal departments (so less power than the president, but still huge influence over many sectors). They can also be formally impeached by Senate, but in practice this does not happen much. I also think the Rome would probably own some colonies (similar to the modern colonial holdings of France and Britain) with island chains and ports in the Indian Ocean and the Horn of Africa.

[@eternal_riftz8801]

maybe for part 3 you can talk about the weapons ,technologies they use and their education system

[@hetzarrow6957]

I can't wait to see more from @Neatling😀

[@ALIHQG]

I am wondering why Egypt and turkey have a smaller population than irl, did u do that because of the decreased birth rate in more developed countries? I would argue that the countries within the Roman empire would be more populated than irl cause of the more centralized government giving better stability and less likely hood of fighting between each other, along with better development due to a greater spread of knowledge and safety, along with better trade and regions that have problems with trade irl would no longer have that problem in this world, emigration would also play a huge role in bolstering the population since Rome would be a safer place to live in than other places. I would atleast increase the population of Constantinople, Italy and Alexandria since they would get a lot of tourism and emigration along with having a long history of relative peace, I would put them at 21m, 80m, 18m respectively.

[@Neatling]

The region that would make up modern Turkey doesn't have a significantly smaller population. It's almost the same. But Egypt's is lower because it develops a lot earlier than in the real world. This makes it so their industrial population boom happens alongside much of Europe, when their population was smaller. As a relatively developed region during the late 1900's, Egypt's population doesn't soar into the sky like in the real world. Since richer and developed countries tend to have lower birthrates. For the record Egypt's population was around the same as in my scenario in 1998 in the real world. So it's not even that crazy of a difference all things considered. Egypt's population has just grown at insane rates in the real world, partially due to it not being particularly wealthy.

[@ALIHQG]

@@Neatling those were just two examples but what about the rest of Romania, Italy would have a better time in this alternate reality since Rome doesn't get sacked and it would likely have a massive influx of migrants from Africa since people can cross the border so much easier through the desert and there would be many more boats going from Rome to the other parts of the empire making it easier to board one unlike irl where there isn't as much trade back and forth, and time would also would be the cultural, and religious capital of catholicism making it get similar amounts of migrants to London so 4.3 mil is hard to wrap my head around. I like how u made dacia and Syria more populated since romania in real life is losing its population mainly due to a need for better education and work which would both be significantly better in this alternative world, while Syria would not suffer from a civil war and Isis but instead thrive and make use of its geografic position. I would like to ask what happened to the jews and if they were made part of the Roman empire and given part of Israel although not full independence.

[@jgr7487]

don't forget the influence that Islam has on the birth rate, as women are expected to marry in their late teens & start pumping out kids asap.

[@Random7303]

@@jgr7487 Islam wouldn’t get into Egypt, the Romans/Greeks held them off in this alt-history.

[@rmar127]

With Romania being a mix of orthodox and catholic Christianity, I seriously doubt that Ethiopia would exist in this timeline. I’d be more inclined to believe that Romania would have backed the Christian Abyssinia in campaigns against the Islamic Somalis and Yemeni

[@gamingdealer9514]

There would be no schism so there is only one Christianity.

[@thess6327]

I just wanted to say , I don't think Greek would be as united as you say Egyptians wouldn't speak Arabic or really a berber influenced language but would speak Coptic A minority language in Egypt today , mostly used by Religious Orthodox Christians in the country but a majority in this world Also the South Italians would speak a more stranger but understandable dialect of Greek influenced by Latin

[@aleksasimovic2985]

And with the slavic migrations, the people living in Dalmatia would atleast have some kind of a dialect

[@nicoaramocanu7226]

I wish this was real. Great video bdw 👍

[@drewsify552]

It would be cool de see the difference in technological advancement with no dark ages

[@CorsetGrace]

With no Dark Ages I honestly believe man would have landed on the Moon in 1869 at the latest.

[@conflictsexplained9276]

What software do you use to create those maps?

[@user-mr3hu2jo8e]

Once again great video! Just a guestion thought, why did you chose to make the romans lost Iberia?

[@Drewski-hw1yi]

A perfect world doesn't exist. Sadly.

[@northenwolf247mapping5]

Can you do a Gran Colombia scenario?

[@monarchblue4280]

Nice video. It would be Interesting to see a what if where Justinian decided to recreate Alexander the greats empire instead of the Western Roman empire after conquering the vandals.

[@JTL1776]

PLEASE MAKE A ALTERNATE WORLD SERIES.

[@blaz2892]

Fascinating video. Ave Roma!

[@LordWyatt]

You forgot how armed Jerusalem would be (and how sacred it would be held by the Jews, Christians, or Muslims...). Great video though, very realistic👌👌

[@JTL1776]

@NEATLING please make a video on what if Canada joined the 13 colonies in revolt.

[@kingkj5567]

Can you do a video about arabia conquered by the romans

[@jacobonate2859]

Neatling can i ask? How large is the land area of this Roman Empire?

[@romanian_thief]

It's confirmed, guys! Romania is he true successor to the Roman Empire!

[@weepingscorpion8739]

Very nice. Except as in the real world: RIP, Coptic. :(

[@green6180]

oh wow this video is amazing. i have one question, why didnt judea keep its distinct cultural identity as it always did under rome?

[@user-iu1eg2pt7i]

I think even if we considered the best case scenario I don't see Rome making it all the way into the Modern Era keeping lands outside of Europe and maybe Anatolia.

[@juliuscaesar7120]

Caesar is here!

[@Shusiareed]

Now we need something with the hre

[@AshleyGravesreal]

Why you removed corsica as a roman province,it was in the video before and actually the romans would call Milan Mediolanum/Naples Neapolis probabily

[@Void_Dweller7]

What if the Western Roman empire survived while the East collapses?

[@arthemis1039]

A-ma-zi-ng ! Will you expand more onto Europe ? How did WW2 happen, and is there a European Union, and if so, is Romania a part of it ?

[@Adrian-rb4qp]

Watch part 1

[@jonathanlaulund3027]

interesting video, im just curious as to what makes you think nato and the cold war would even be a thing in this alternate time line? also soviet union also is a thing? i dont have enough knowledge to argue about most of what you said and it seamed reasonable but yeah anything you said post 1900 seams a bit presumptious to me as i didnt hear and justification for your assumptions at all regarding how rome/byzantium surviving would effect world history... if you have some reason to belive why the rest of world history would still play out more or less the same id be interested to hear why :)

[@CorsetGrace]

Communism would still rise because the German and Russian Empires would have still existed. In those Empires and Rome too, regular people were considered "serfs" or "peasants." They were treated horribly, worked six days a week, 12 hour days. No safety concerns were considered. The rise of socialism, which led to the abomination of that was communism, stems directly from mistreatment of the people. With the massively horrendous mishandling of finances and war strategy, Russia in the with Germany, would begin to fail utterly leading to revolution. Allowing Russia to eventually become the Soviet Union. I do question whether or not Rome would invade Russia at this time to reconquer Southern Ukraine and Crimea. During our timeline, many western powers invaded Russia to stop the communist takeover.

[@jonathanlaulund3027]

interesting, dont really have any issue with this reasoning but i see communism as something the woulnt come about without the british empier as they were at the fore front of most humane ideas, end of slavery etc, if rome survived england and britain would not be what it was to us, and i wonder if this might not compleatly removed the idea of humane treatement or atleast delay it substantualy... and if it was developed where would the seeds of these ideas come from, id argue the english got it from the bible and from having a huge empier and the conflicting mentaly that came from being a good christian and having horrid conditions in large parts of your empier... also the parliment was probably instrumental in this push as an emperror or ceasar or monarch could ignore the common folk. the senat?@@CorsetGrace

[@CorsetGrace]

@@jonathanlaulund3027 In the United States the impetus for reform began with the progressives led by the Republicans and Teddy Roosevelt around 1890. he first began addressing the problem and allowing unions, etc. to some extent circa 1902. The main push came from Karl Marx (1818-1883) a German born philosopher and a revolutionary socialist. He wrote the "Communist Manifesto" and "Das Kapital" both works are collectively known as Marxism and even though their basic premises are flawed, if not completely incorrect, exerted enormous influence. Assuming in this timeline that the same people are born, then it stands to reason that this train of events would still occur, and the British Empire would not be needed. In fact, the British Empire policies played no part in the reasoning behind Russia's fall to communism in our timeline.

[@alextan4608]

How did u keep Rome so big

[@nathan-iz2bq]

bro how do you get your maps

[@Neatling]

I make them myself

[@nathan-iz2bq]

@@Neatling what programs do you use?

[@silver_kitten]

I find it highly unlikely that Rome wouldn’t form a greko-Latin hybrid language

[@CorsetGrace]

Exactly. 'Grelatin' would be the prevailing language over time. You need a single language to cement a nation's identity.

[@reiryghts639]

i think you should've given them some parts of spain and france

[@shadowthehedgehog3113]

In this scenario, they lost Spain and France.

[@HeadsetHatGuy]

They couldn't hold onto them in the first part of the video

[@angemalaurie6074]

During the napoleonic time Rome should have gone republican and might have lost some lands. Or even better, Rome would have corsica (where napoleon was born) and Napoleon might actually be a Roman.

[@CorsetGrace]

Napoleon would eventually become the Emperor of Rome and reconquer the Iberian Peninsula.

[@zicobennett8564]

Can You do What if the Viking never converted to christianity

[@pixydust4112]

Rome would fit very good in the modern world wow

[@cadengrace5466]

Fun but not very likely. This conglomeration would never have survived the waves of Bubonic Plague. But, let's assume it did, the next major challenge was in the 14th and 15th century when Europe underwent civil unrest based on religion and the spread of literacy. but, let us assume it even survived that some how. Then comes not just the unification of Germany, but World War 1 and World War 2, but the Cold War with the Soviet Union. It is not going to roll a perfect die through each of those cataclysmic world events.

[@shadowthehedgehog3113]

In the end, it all comes back down to the Romans vs the Persians. lol.

[@yesman6559]

Yes

[@archdornan3068]

Oh yes

[@S.P.Q.Rrespublicas]

Here, would the romans have restored the old structures in Rome? Most where destroyed in the sacks of Rome, bar thr Colloseum, which is why they are either gone or in ruins today. The Colloseum would be fully intact aswell, at the least.?

[@Scafary1859]

Does the name "Romania" come from the "Roman Republic" , like how its for the Czecs? (Czech Republic / Czechia)

[@AlxzAlec]

It had forever left when the king and queen of greece were dethroned

[@monkedo7088]

what if the persian empires lasted for way longer,meaning the Iranian ethnic group would be huge.

[@oceanman4029]

The good ending.

[@ALDB]

Well sir, I'm disappointed Slovaks did no get also territory of Czechs and Poles! But divide and conquer, I guess.

[@sylviamontaez3889]

in terms of languages, I don't think attempts to assimilate the Albanians would succeed. also coptic would be the dominant language in Egypt. In fact the middle east would be a patchwork of languages under roman rule

[@talos2384]

if I ever get a time machine I’m gonna cap Brutus in the head

[@timothylee2772]

If I ever get a time machine, I am going to warn Majorian of Recimir’s treachery.

[@TheoneandonlyVaken]

Roma Invicta!!!

[@TheoneandonlyVaken]

Damn.... someone beat me

[@theicelandicnationalist2.023]

Wait wouldn’t Georgia be called Lazica? Like it was called IRL in the Byzantine empire

[@Neatling]

Perhaps. But the names I use for the regions are generally the English versions. Since the video is in English. All provinces and cities would also have both official Greek and Latin names in-universe.

[@theicelandicnationalist2.023]

@@Neatling eh good enough of I guess, hope you have a great day

[@ActualGoatUnicorn]

@@Neatling Similar to how cities in Finland have both Swedish and Finnish Names? like Turku, being called Åbo in Swedish.

[@georgeevernight2814]

Lazica is ONLY south-western Georgia.

[@odin....]

What if Sweden kept finland.

[@Gamingmaster-jv9zj]

What would be Romania's capital? Rome or Constantinople?

[@Neatling]

Constantinople

[@Gamingmaster-jv9zj]

@@Neatling ok thank you

[@alessandrogini5283]

Where I can find part 1?

[@Neatling]

kzbin.info/www/bejne/Zomyga1voc98gbM

[@jasonskeans3327]

i feel like the Greek and Romen would fuse into a single culture's

[@koki3292]

Damn bro I'm Romanian in real life and in this fictional scenario

[@doltBmB]

Absent islamic attitudes toward pagan monuments, is it conceivable that the pyramids would still have their covering stones and the current entrance would not have been dug out? That would perhaps be the biggest win for this timeline.

[@onemoreminute0543]

Imo, the borders would be perfect without Pannonia, Dacia, Georgia, and Armenia

[@slibertas1996]

Jerusalem should be a major city with at least 2 million and the main city of Judaea

[@dgv6967]

Corse should be Roman because Napoleon doesn't steal it

[@Maxzes_]

If the United Arab emirates still existed then no one would call nejd “the emirates”

[@aaaaaaaaaaaa2673]

Germany should have a colony in America and Africa since they became a unified country much sooner I suggest making them colonise Venezuela and later expand in Colombia and Ecuador since l think they tried it in our timeline but failed because the mainland wasn't unified and couldn't properly support them...