Negative Stats in Vanilla WoW and Why They're Gone (Warcraft mini Facts)

[@drekthedestroyer2115]

This was in everquest as well. My mom had a shirt that reduced your health in that game back in the day, and she always used to give low level players items for free. Well, she once gave the shirt to a low level character who put it on... and reduced his health to 0. His character was unconscious, and wasn't able to take it off or res. She basically perma killed him until someone came and buffed his hp so he could take it off. LOL

[@mwperk02]

rip

[@Disturbance42]

Yeah this is bullshit. When you die in Everquest, your body remains on the ground and you had to run back to it in the old days. He would've revived naked, and then been able to loot his body for his shit back.

[@kuro_kei]

@@Disturbance42 You didn't die when your hp reached zero, that was the point where you got knocked unconscious.

[@CallMeMimi27]

i never played this game but i don't need to be a psychic to see this is fucking bullshit

[@charlesc4511]

Warlocks even had a talent that reduced spirit in exchange for stamina.

[@nandornagyilles3290]

Not only did it exist, it was very commonly picked, as the low end of the demo tree sucked ass and the extra stamina (which is mana for warlocks) was worth it for the loss of a near useless stat.

[@BasilBeesLair]

What is kinda funny if you consider that, in lore, warlocks are +- like a shaman

[@tywinlannister8015]

I am 100% sure the heart is still in the game. I got it in Arathi Highlands during Legion and was surprised it still existed since I had not seen a negative stat item drop in literally a decade.

[@Lellianna]

negative stats were converted into positive ones when they were equipped by Gunther Arcanus

[@MrGrimfacade]

This time on " how can I explain the skull of impending doom for the 100th time " video. Edit: still love you hiru

[@kylebutler9865]

But no priest racial ability. lol. In any case, it would be weird if the skull wasn't in this list.

[@justinmyhan4419]

didnt mention gunther once, trash video

[@AppleAssassin]

impending

[@hurtigheinz3790]

I wonder if there's a history in RPG games of "cursed" items. Someone might make a video abou it.

[@supermel9]

@@AppleAssassin pfff

[@deathkey8108]

It has Necormancy in his Name, 10/10 reading

[@BigTuk]

There is a thing called the Jedi curve in game development. ls the zero-sum power. The idea is that you establish a baseline and the more something deviates from the baseline the moreextreme the curve. THe idea is to balance items so they never stray far from the curve. so for example, if you want to give an item a bonus, you give it a flaw as well. Keep in mind the rarity of the item acts as a defacto flaw. Green items are allowed to be inherently more powerful than any white item of the same level because they are rarer,. Same thing for Blues and greens. Now that said, WOW gave up onb this right around theLK and I suspect it ties in with the change in design philosophy because that was about the time blue became the new green.

[@FishTheJim]

I remember a lot of those items and I always thought I would wait for a better item rather then take neg stats. I like the idea of neg effects over stats .

[@RaptorJesus.]

in Guildwars 1 there were skills that made it so you couldn't take more than 10% of your max hp from a single attack, which doesn't seem too OP at first, but GW1 too had these negative stat items and people would use them to lower their health to 55hp so that they couldn't take more than 5 damage per attack, combined with a health regen skill it pretty much made them invinicible :D

[@dragoncloud5497]

Cool

[@Eexpers]

path of exile does the whole upside for a downside really well in so many aspects from gear to the passive skill tree - infact MOST build defining stuff have a downside i really love it you always making choices and trying to mitigate the sum of your downsides and highlight the positives its not perfect and there are passives / items that are strictly better but overall it does this exact thing really well

[@robc6022]

3:02 This is what you came for.

[@DerHody]

if you farm all -stamina items, its possible to get your stamina below 0. Did anyone test this on live server?

[@thalanoth]

not possible, even at level 1 in vanilla you have around 20 base stamina

[@michielankersmit8656]

thats how the undeads came to be

[@luckiness9500]

What about a mini fact about cleanses and dispelling and purging? There are somewhat of history around it.

[@denxx56]

1:41 "the assbringer"

[@visioneer68]

Was talking to someone just a couple days ago about items like this, so nice timing on the video.

[@decoma6338]

well the new items dropped from the mini raid in BFA can have negative effects on players for positive buffs. they are kinda similar to "-stam +other primary stats" concept :P

[@alifeofwynter]

Oh man, I actually remember using some of those items back in the day

[@elerius2]

Ratings replaced percentages in Vanilla, not BC. I don't remember when exactly, but it was definitely in late Vanilla. The vanilla gear system honestly seems more interesting to me. Sure, a lot of the items were complete garbage. But having to make a choice between stamina / dps is more interesting than two slightly different dps stats.

[@Lordturisas1]

It was patch 2.0, I believe. So, the very end of vanilla.

[@Silamon2]

@@Lordturisas1 Well 2.0 would be BC pre patch, not really a vanilla patch though.

[@akhsdenlew1861]

Vanila does have a primary stat. Spirit.

[@cattysplat]

Spirit is so weak it's often considered a secondary stat for most classes.

[@TimmpahS]

Are we going to talk about white item with stats soon too? Like the Battered Viking Shield

[@TheBunnyb0y]

Warlocks still have a speed boost that damages you, and they shud fits the warlock "trope", and why not.. why not items too.. owait.. glass cannon items is too much fun

[@ipvp4fun]

Psychobunny /sigh any reason to bash blizz eh? Go watch some asmongold

[@nandornagyilles3290]

Bloodvine set has not stam and is BiS till AQ40 full set

[@ipvp4fun]

@Goldmanschnozsteen sixtrillionberg ..... of course they aren't perfect dude, this guy is complaining about not having stam reduction gear and how that ruins fun. my point is people just complain about the most pointless shit because blizzard is the one doing it

[@RazanaArcclaw]

warlocks are not about being glass cannons, also taking the "take damage to move faster" takes up a place of a "defencive" so instead of becoming stronger, you become weaker TWICE, but faster.

[@ken1195]

I don't think the "fun" has anything to do with them being removed. Glass cannon items are the most difficult to balance.

[@arforafro5523]

I kinda liked negative stats as it allowed you to have an even stronger bias towards your main stats, that neck for example was complete beast as a warlock, strenght didnt matter, spirit was meh, but 13 stam on a green neck was amazing.

[@livedandletdie]

Basically cost over benefit... which they should re-implement. And now I don't talk about some meager drawbacks, I mean massive drawbacks, such as an item that prevents you from using any other items... etc... items that literally tries to kill you hard and fast. etc.. with benefits such as life steal or stuff that keeps you active in the content... And literally impossible to unequip. Items that can kill you if you go offline, etc... it's so lovely, coming up with drawbacks for items, that actually makes the whole idea of item progression actually mean anything...

[@hornyfuckinturtle]

Negative stats allow for other effects to become more powerful without completely destroying the balance of the game. It allows for more complex and varied builds

[@firedrake110]

There was that proc trinket from tomb of sargeras that summoned a shark to attack a target, and if you were too close or your current target died the process would blast you as well/instead as another recent drawback item

[@angellicus1779]

I think they should do more cursed items, I've always really liked the idea of cursed items in RPG stuff. I think the negative stats thing as a "curse" is a bit silly though, they should just stick with negative effects equivalent to a positive effect.

[@werbistdudenn1078]

take a look at the items from crucible of storms those items are funny and "cursed" in their own way

[@JustAChinesePleb]

I remember Ring of Scorn! You had to kill Valdred Moray for revenge and then in cataclysm he's raised as a forsaken and when you talk to him he says that an orc killed him and that these hands are not his 😅

[@randomusernumber1]

i wish there were more items like the whispers in the dark trinket , to add more exitement to the game , , like a ditch effort last stand kinda thing , your back is against the wall so you roll the dice ,get that haste buff and see if lady luck will smile on you for risking the penalty or if you will be massacred while being crippled by your hand

[@nightvisiontv1847]

50% chance to either get 1000 primary stat or get crippled by the void.

[@rdsasuke1]

I could have sworn i had a staff or a wand with a negative stat, it had that red scepter icon that you would see in green also on other items. But i guess i imagined it since you didn't talk about it.

[@Shikaschima]

Well, negative effects will come back with Crucible. So I guess that's why you did this video?

[@RazanaArcclaw]

there is a fair bit of gear with negitive effects, but this video is about negitive stats. none of the gear in crucible is negitive gear.

[@Shikaschima]

@@RazanaArcclaw ... did you read?

[@Kazpariuz]

There's also Tear of Grief from a quest line in Darkshore. Held in off-hand +5 int for the cost of -3 spirit

[@jeffreyarnold2626]

really took me back with this. i still have some of these on my mogs, i had forgotten the sources. i may even have some on alts in bank if theyre not removed from database.

[@coacohover]

well back then there was also a thing as item stacking bug which could be abused with said items to cause a power underflow to give you the most power in said negative stat. I think that is the reason why most of them were taken out.

[@MyViolador]

new trinket in shadowlands. gives you a lot of armor but makes you 50% slower because you turn into stone. they are bringing back some of those "cursed" items now.

[@candlestyx8517]

The shriveled heart was actually supposed to be part of a wuest in ST. But it got scrapped before the vanilla beta was released

[@nightvisiontv1847]

I wish they would’ve added this back in legion. Made perfect sense too.

[@matthewjackman8410]

I was really hoping this would have been some integer underflow exploit on stamina back in the day, like somehow reaching negative health on a level 1 character and ending up with some obnoxious amount of hit points Top video as usual though my dude

[@cattysplat]

That whispers in the dark trinket is not necessarily a negative stats item. Many talent/gear builds for classes especially sub rogue focuses today on dealing an extreme amount of burst damage in a very short time window, activating all trinkets and cooldown to buff themselves up during this time, then having to wait out those cooldowns until they are back up again. I am talking 50%+ of their dps takes place during these very short windows of cooldowns all being active. I remember you literally needed a macro to activate all of your abilities and trinkets to actually make sure you got most of your damage done in those 10 seconds to make sub rogue actually work in raids in WoD.

[@whycantijusthaveausernameo3993]

I think there's a big gap left out of how negative effects are usually used to balance out powerful items. I can name a few card game and video game effects where you trade a flaw to get a much stronger effect that makes it worth it in the end. I feel the removal of these negative stats because they weren't fully implemented. Paying life for power can be strong. One of most power cards in Magic: The Gathering has an effect where at any time you can pay 1 life to draw a card. Which meant people could pay seven life to get a full hand of cards at ANY time. It was a draw back to use but very powerful. Another thing is that WoW was doing a lot to streamline and simplify the game for better or worse. This meant pruning skill trees, removing old awkward items and negative stats.

[@lepsielogo2733]

I just received an item called Raptor Punch as a reward for the quest "It's gotta be in the horn" in Ratchet, Northern Barrens. It Increases your intellect by 3 and decreases your stamina by 4. It's a consumable, though. Can be used 5 times. FYI

[@metropolismonke]

Except the negative part of the skull of impending doom was the best part

[@unkleism]

supported the kickstarter for the wow diary, best 40$ i ever spent great vibrant pictures ect well worth

[@LycanWitch]

I still wish Blizzard would put back these negative stat items.. it makes sense for them to have continued.. certain items with high stats in damage, should come at the cost of making you more vulnerable to damage taken or whatever. Also the negative stats also helped with determining who's best to get the item in more detail than today's "the item has agility and mastery it should go to the rogue, hunter, shaman, etc" where as before, oh the item has agility and master but also has negative haste and causes you to take damage which breaks stealth, and lose accuracy.. give it to the hunter, fuck the hunter.

[@LycanWitch]

@Sixten Nilsson lol 8.1.5 bfa, had to google that. i had quit wow during 8.0, wont be returning until 8.2.5 to see the new worgen and depending on if blizz improved the experience, will determine if i stick around or not.

[@LycanWitch]

@Sixten Nilsson facts about BFA can go get fucked. noone cares about BFA. Blizzard needs to get their act together.

[@Abfallentertaiment]

Would've been nice if you mentioned the new crucible of storm items since they're also related a "dark power" so it makes sense That beside love your work keep it up!

[@supermel9]

why would he, it's a video about vanilla wow.

[@ChaoticMarinMusic]

I miss this. It's an example of how Vanilla WoW was more of an RPG than modern WoW. and when I say RPG, I'm putting emphasis on the Role Playing. Where Modern WoW is more of a toy that you pick up, play with and put down. Things like buying arrows aren't good gameplay, but they are good Role Playing.

[@_Lis25]

You have hairloom from argus. For 10% of health you get 40% speed boost for 10s.

[@josejuanandrade4439]

Great video. You could have mention at the end the new gear coming with the Crucible of Storms, as it seems all of the items have efects that are trigger negative effects along the positive ones, or after them. :)

[@kalsizzle]

Eye of Paleth had +shadow spell damage on it so its only fair to have a downside to using it. Especially since its pretty op for a low level item and most warlocks will use it until they get Spirit of Aquamentas.

[@caboose.20]

These vids are making me more and more hype for Classic!

[@draztikzyt8992]

Games do some weird things when you reach a negative stat value. If you were to theoretically have NEGATIVE strength it could do some weird shit like actually make you oneshot stuff lol

[@asdqwewow6037]

there was an exploit on privs long time ago, you could equip negative agility on druid or rogue and back your stats below 0... and what happened? 999999999 agi 1 hit hack or swapping ress with some dps skill usable on boss, so when u casted stun for example the actual spell that has been casting was ress and it spawned new boss with 500hp :P sorry for my english

[@chaoslance4959]

"Blizzard Is not afraid to put negative effects on gear even Now." Looks at Crucible of Storms loot - yep.

[@zbrembo]

They still had some glass cannon gear in tbc, I had a black set of hunter t5 with no stam.

[@NoWayToHell]

On one server I was playing on, negative stats was not scripted. There was like an exploit possible Smthg like -1 stamina = +1000 stamina lol I was soloing donjons ..

[@Korelock990]

I remember this in a wod server. Some level 30 green

[@anonymousjeffry1864]

Arcanum had Hexed items, they were pretty cool too. Like you will run faster, but have a fatigue dot.

[@SvenS2]

Are those really all of the items? I remember there being a pretty good off hand that had an active which acted like water and regenerated mana while you sit down and had negative agility slapped on. Also a demon heart trinket which drained a small amount of HP every second

[@eier3252]

Here's a complete list of all negative stat items in Classic: classic.wowhead.com/items/quality:2:3:4:5:6?filter-any=21:23:22:24:20;5:5:5:5:5;0:0:0:0:0 bar Petrolspill Leggings (-10 fire resistance), the only item in the game that has negative resistances. classic.wowhead.com/item=9509/petrolspill-leggings

[@iliyauryupin7923]

Hey I just wanna say, thank you for all your videos ! Even with WoW doing poorly lately.

[@jari2018]

There where stats that didn't make sense back in vanilla -knives with + to holy damage (mine) , sheilds with + to frost (sold in aH) and Im not shure if I saw a shield with + to shadow in aH once.

[@joeydraaisma4385]

Great vid as always, I do think that explaining how the shrines in island expeditions work. Would have been nice to add to the end of the vid.

[@D3Z3R7]

It's very simple. Why they were implemented: SOUL Why they were removed: SOULLESS

[@retroprogamer7009]

I always wanted to see if its possible to get to 0 Stamina and die that way^^

[@dorping_Wolf]

well wotlk still kinda did the "good offense but no stamina" stuff, with the plate "Spiked Cobalt *** " gear. even today you can wear this (non) set while leveling ~71 to 81+ without getting better offensive gear.

[@morthim]

that is likely not why. my guess is someone managed to find a time when the character could have negative stats which would underflow the variable and lead to being effectively in the thousands. edit i checked the math and it would have been 214 million, not thousands.

[@pseudosanct5253]

I used the mindthrust bracers from 19 to 50, because i put a stam buff on it

[@avalanchesj]

Haha, I remember opening a GM ticket because my spirit stat on my warlock was red and I couldn't figure out why I was missing a stat. The GM, in typical roll play style, told me that the shriveled heart that I was wearing around my neck must be cursed and I might want to find a replacement soon. :-)

[@frostamatus]

I like these videos on groups of special items. Can we get one for equippable quest items? Or usable quest items that you could keep like the furbolg rod from ashenvale, archmage vargoth staff, etc?

[@BitterComments]

Very well made video. I never knew about any of this before I watched.

[@Algodosin]

Your wrong about Yugioh cards, in this game you build a deck around an specific activation condition, there are cards that send your own cards to the graveyard, since that can be the activation condition of a more powerful card, so sending a card from your hand to the deck may be good depending of the strategy you are using, maybe you need as much cards on your deck as posible, or you need the card to be on the deck to activate its effect, or there might be infinite options, I know it was just an example, but just wanted to point it out

[@nesto2947]

In wrath of the lich king wasn't a gun with negative stats added to the game?

[@pwnolero2686]

Yo hiru, I remember you saying in one of your livestreams that you were sick in that your KZbin voice isnt your everyday voice. Is it so different from your normal voice that if we were to meet you in person that we wouldn't know it was you?

[@AngDavies]

He slips into it in livestreams sometimes I think, recognisable but much less energetic, like madseason on sleeping pills.

[@MacDaniboi]

All I remember is making a warrior "tank", put all my points into prot while leveling and would always wear the gear with most stamina on it because "I'm a tank, I only need to survive and to do that I need all the HP I can get, strength and hitchanse is useless on me"

[@Froggeh92]

I leveled from 1 to 60 as a holy priest. i was young and i loooved to heal

[@MarcoS-eg6uj]

I think Negative stats made sometimes sense like on the corrupted Ashbringer

[@yoonmandu]

hey, could i ask what songs are playing in the background of this video? they sound beautiful, i'd love to listen to them~~

[@667fusek]

Actually the negative effect of skull was the most important thing in classic pvp. It breaks cc’s like sheeps etc. And the debuff last for 10 sec, and for that time we were immune for those control effects

[@adamgmitrzuk5336]

Look up Sulfuron Slammer!

[@AzIgaziMakk]

Oh that Ashbringer not only gives you -25 Stamina there is a higher downside. Inflicts the will of the Ashbringer upon the wielder the character becomes darker which corrupts you and makes neutral mobs to attack you even critters!

[@themightytalkingsalamander5169]

there was also the dunce cap. it had -25 int

[@MrAntAve]

Swifty's Skull of Impending Doom

[@dirtylevel]

I thought this was a segway to the crucible of storms raid which is filled with negative statts loot

[@KuddlesbergTheFirst]

Does anyone remember the one hand staff from the tauren starting zone?

[@stickyone11]

So in classic Ashbringer will be ava correct? or did they take it away before 1.1.2? (i think that's the patch they are using for classic but could be wrong, please someone correct me if I am).

[@howto3764]

Hey, interesting video! Btw, can you name song playing on 6:20 please?

[@ClausRow]

Is this all the negative stat items? I'm tryin to make a list for an RP run.

[@Spongeyknight6491]

So that's why things have a -X ammout of X start on them I always though it was because the item was so good that it needed a draw back quil

[@rashid2898]

1:41 the assbringer. FFXI had some cancerous items with alot of - stats just to sue for macros :( and a necklace that has poision and can kill u within 2 minutes, ppl found out it was a good item to cancel sleep lol

[@nandornagyilles3290]

Having low stamina doesnt really make you die less often. One crushing blow from a loose mob and you are instantly dead regardless, so there really isnt a reason not to go a glass cannon build in raids. 5mans maybe you dont want to, but even there an extra 15% hp makes much less difference than the extra damage would. That being said, negative stat items generally suck, but not because of the negative stats, jsut that their positive stats are still shit.

[@Froggeh92]

loose mobs are the tanks fault. Boss AoE or those damn bats in ZG are a mechanic. (dead rogues at bat boss LOL)

[@batamata4659]

Hello,a new guy here but played wow since i was a kid(complete noob btw) i was just wondering is it possible that if you buy the game you can still play vanilla wow and stuff like that?or is it gone forever on the real servers and only way u can play is go to private ones

[@TheZombieCurryKid]

Gone forever, but they're releasing old vanilla servers soon. The rumor is they will come out this summer, but I don't think anyone knows yet.

[@Marunius]

This game used to have so many cool RPG / D&D like elements. Could have used just a bit more balance and a slightly faster pace, not tons of RNG layers and every class healing like crazy.

[@AndrevusWhitetail]

My favorite negative stat item is still the offhand mug from Dire Maul with a -4 intellect on them. I mean...you get drunk, you become dumb, duh.

[@BattleForcePvP]

Don't forget the "Feminist t-shirt" which gives you +20 spirit at the cost of 500 intellect.

[@maxchenmusterhausen5311]

i remember picking up wow way after vanilla and being pissed off at the crit-rating and all the other similar stats. coming from other rpgs i expected that if i want to raise my crit i will find items that have effects i can actually feel. 2% critchance is a number anyone can work with. Not 3694 crit-hit which is saying fukk all, but not what i get.

[@isaacvalmont7672]

What is the song that you always use on your video? i must know!

[@dwarfgod163]

I think they should bring them back. Corrupted/tainted items give a unique feel to the game

[@sazam1966]

These items will come back with the Crucible of Storms raid. Every single item from this raid has an interesting passive, but each with a drawback (damage to self or allies mostly)

[@Sovice223]

didn't mention the new items from the mini raid.

[@B-...]

Hate to point out the obvious, but given how recent this video is, I expected it to mention the new items from the new raid that have negative effects.

[@Artrysa]

*And those who tasted the bite of his sword named him... The Doomsayer.*

[@dodgykebaab]

Another great video

[@JARGIDAN]

Had that trinket on my war.

[@ear322]

Hey can you do a video on shadowflame and the cloaks?

[@jacobrobbins7039]

wonder if we will see a return in classic?

[@michixlol]

hm. i liked the old stat system. and i would have liked the minus stats to evolve more. I guess I just like RPG elements very much. It's one thing that made WoW special to me. Nowadays it seems, there is no real mmoRPG anymore.