Death of a Game: Dark Age of Camelot

Darker Age of Camelot
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#DOAG

[@epicfail5473]

As of today Endless Conquest has been released and the game now has a functional, though limited, free to play option. Enjoy.

[@CharlieKellyEsq]

Orly?!?!?!?!

[@thegumonyourshoes]

Interesting my dude.

[@arkeon27]

Free.... (free to shop you mean) is 100% unplayable, for real free to play (and real population/active gm ecc... ) the only option is Phoenix Freeshard

[@sbross9863]

thats false advertising - I went back to the game to see the state of my account, and every single character is unusable, Thidranki chars are useless (the free option that allowed you to turn off XP gains and RP gains is now a pay to access options) and my lvl 50 characters are also unusable (broken gear 0% condition, at least 5 items on every character - this was done by the devs because I havent played the game in 10+ years and none of the gear I had equipped was destroyed with 0% condition)... The game like most other game is falling into the hands of the cash grab companies. ANY of the features I looked into to help me come back to the game ended with the same outcome, you need to pay real world money or else you cannot play. I am truly truly sadened after installing the game and trying to test it out, the game is literally pay to play now, free to play is not a thing in DAOC sorry to say.

[@CharlieKellyEsq]

@@sbross9863 it appears your best option for daoc is still Phoenix. Unfortunate, because it's a shadow of its former self

[@WhiskeyTango0420]

This was the greatest MMORPG of all time. 8man Emain groups. Keeping your toons in DF until Hibs took it. Getting artifacts in Trials of Atlantis. Heading out to take Relics from other realms. Will never be realized again. I was a RR11 ML10 scout on my main. Mystic Council of Camelot guild. I used to lead 200 man raids into Hib and Mid. 15 hour raids. It was the best time of my gaming career. Thank you for the memories NerdSlayer.

[@LongToad]

Yeah, I had played every single class- a few times over. Nowadays I'd be lucky to even want to play 1 class past level 20 in an MMO. I think it was the pacing and the feeling of achievement, everything was such a struggle to accomplish (unless you got plvled). PvP had consequence, PvE was brutal, each class had something unique, I miss it so much :\

[@dangerous5953]

Same here, The RVR system was so good. The battles were EPIC . I can still remember the smell of my Melting PC during siege of lv 5 castles with hundreds of players. I was mostly leveling that way, defending my realm and dying for it. I miss that.

[@brigandboy1425]

Tristan Mid here. I still remember the ~800 man raid on the Hib RKs. I still remember holding off the albs at AMG, the catapults firing, the thunder hammers slamming into the ground, and in chat "We have the first three. Heading to second RK." I remember the goosebumps I had when the other two massive groups holding the hibs at the two BKs continued to report successfully keeping them out of the frontier. And then the servers crashed and reset. One of the most bittersweet and disappointing/awe inspiring days of my gaming life. No game has ever come even close to DAOC, and at this point, I doubt one ever will.

[@Zeonick1]

I had a very similar experience to you. I still keep in touch with some of the guys from my 8 man group years later. Crazy.

[@codyjames5189]

This is actually the greatest MMORPG ever you’re absolutely right. I miss it so much.

[@Sandwich1414]

Dark Age of Camelot was the first MMORPG I ever played, I played it with my dad as a kid. We'd be in the same room, on different PCs. I was Midgard, a giant rock troll thing, warrior and I remember there was so much...wonder to the world. I remember seeing this rare creature near a town called Nalliten, this kraken or loch ness sort of monster, and when we tried to look it up online, there was no information. The world was massive, it felt like every valley was truly unmapped and unknown.

[@em_bacon]

This is by far my most favorite MMO ever. I still go back ever so often to check it out. I still get goosebumps when the loading screen theme starts playing.

[@Buabtheisland]

Same, played until 2015.

[@gmonkman]

Ha, yes, not played for 5 or more years, but that intro music still gives me goosebumps.

[@Machinegunjoe-Viterbo]

Try phoenix best free shard. Some days 500people esch realm. Only to shrouded isles

[@DanArthurMMA01]

Agreed

[@farvosa8240]

Just hearing the Music bring back Great Memories!

[@skip2mylou470]

DAoC was the best video game I have ever played. I have so many great memories in DAoC. I still remember the day it was released in Germany. Back then people used to order physical copies of the game and you had to wait for it to get shipped to your house in order to play. I preordered the game on Amazon. I still remember the game released on a Friday in February 2001. I came home from school at noon, checking our mailbox first thing being home. There was the physical copy, shipped on time. I was so happy and eager to play. I installed the game and logged in for the first time. I still remember how the game drew me in right away, how amazing it was playing an RPG with other people online. I rolled a Briton Scout and had absolutely no idea about classes or meta builds. Just played the game the way I felt was the most fun. Chatting with people, forming groups, exploring the lands of Albion. It was truly amazing. A close friend of mine, who lived a few houses down the road, got the game too. He didn't have a PC at home, but we had multiple at our house, so he would always come over and we'd play together. I rerolled a Troll Thane. I remember how cool it was traveling around Midgard and steadily advancing my character. First time RvR, going to Svasud Faste, buying a Medaillon and being ported to the lands of Hibernia. There were a few Hibs camping MTK, I remember charging down the hill with some fellow Norsemen and engaging in an intense battle. I remember sitting there, my heart racing, the sheer excitement of facing members of an enemy realm for the first time on the battlefield. This was when everyone was only around level 35-40 and not many 50s were around yet. People still went to the frontiers, to explore them, to invade enemy lands and to defend the homeland. Later on, there community was what really stood out on our server. It was truly about realm pride. When the alliance leaders called, everyone rushed to the frontiers to defend the relic keeps or got together to carry out late night ambushes in enemy territory. And of course there were the famous 8 man setgroups, who already had a pretty good sense of strategy and organization back then and thus were dominating in RvR. I did not play that competitively back then, but it was great hearing about the deeds of them. There were a few infamous Hib groups on our server, who would regularly wipe 40 or 50 man enemy zergs with a single 8 man pbaoe group. The kill spams were glorious. You could really make a name for yourself on the battlefield. I remember taking walks with my friend, we could talk for hours about the game. We would talk about famous players on our realm, would theorycraft about setups and specs you could play, would relive battles that had happened in the frontiers or Darkness Falls Raids we were joining. DAoC was and is a fantastic game, I am thankful that I had this opportunity of playing the game in it's prime days. It will always be one of my great childhood memories and have a special place in my heart.

[@nicktholl6352]

You hit everything on the money man..was nice reading your comment because i can relate. Awesome days..

[@loupfarceur3361]

search for phoenix daoc on google ;)

[@FaithlessDwarf]

Thank you for the comment. It's exactly that sense of community and wonder that made games like DAOC what they were. I played WoW when it first came out, and it was exactly as you describe. Nowadays gaming looks so very different when compared to that time; there's such a smaller emphasis in community, if at all.

[@looptroop2k8]

yea, playing on phoenix ;) it's a lot of fun! @Akenization

My first MMO. From the moment I logged into Cotswold village and gaped around at the world, it just blew me away.

[@hirumaredx]

WoW will be the WoW killer

[@landofsyn2980]

Aka blizzard will kill wow

[@goatsmiserable555]

Shadowlands is fantastic

[@landofsyn2980]

@@goatsmiserable555 meh

[@goatsmiserable555]

@@landofsyn2980 it is though

[@ВитяЩербина-е9в]

@@landofsyn2980 it is good but it is not WoW anymore which makes it actually not good. So, yeah. Meh

[@SixStringSamurai85]

How after all these years the title melody of DAoC still warms my heart. Played it 12 years and loved every single moment

[@MrImarket]

This is seriously my favourite series on KZbin, and I never even played that many MMOs. That’s how good your videos are. I just like understanding the industry and history of video games , and you are doing a fantastic job with those documentaries! Ps: I just became one of your patrons! :)

[@nerdSlayerstudioss]

Thank you for the support.

[@1884Winter]

So true

[@SigandGibbs]

Be wary of it. This series is full of horseshit. The guy who made this video didn't know much about DAoC and doesn't know how to read graphs

[@traxcanonch.2421]

@@SigandGibbs Then how is he supposed to make alot of videos if he spends months studying a game that he won't play anyway.

[@powermonger9090]

I shed a tear watching this. So many great memories playing DAoC. I can still vividly remember my first night playing when the servers opened at launch. Started as a Thane in Gotar running down the road killing bugs or whatever it was. I loved the aesthetics in the game. Over 4 or 5 years It was the one game I would return to. Wish I could relive that time again. So much fun just grouping up with random just leveling, exploring or PvPing in either the frontiers or battlegrounds. Main things that put me off the game was Visions of Atlantis grinding to be competitive, the plague that was buffbots that killed support class players, constant nerfing and community fighting. In all my time playing, I never played a Hibernian character once. Was always Midgard or Albion.

[@-----------5489]

camelot unchained's viking 'heavy fighter' will be a mjolnir - so thane v2.0 but in the place of the 'warrior'! :P and they are designing in mind to avoid buff bots as well, that was certainly a major problem with DAOC.

[@hydrox5947]

@@-----------5489 this certainly aged like spoiled milk

[@TantalusHelmgart]

I get goosebumps reading all the comments here. I mostly played a lurikeen ranger on lyonesse, he was RR11. Missing the good old daoc times...! Greetings to all DAoC veterans. I hope seeing some of you again when Camelot Unchained releases.

[@monicaclinton9680]

Camelot unchained got shut down lol

[@johnpoole3871]

@@monicaclinton9680 We just can't catch a break.

[@mordsythe]

My main was a RR21 healer Druid. I miss those days. Relic raids, massive PvP. Great farming and fleshed out characters.

[@kellerkind6169]

I used to play on Lyonesse too. My main character, although I had 80 lvl 50 characters at the time, was a Druid named Gomolg.

[@hellochris06]

DAoC’s wildly addictive PvP is what has kept it limping along for a long time. It is by far the most strategic, intricate and fast paced PvP I’ve ever played. I left and went back so many times because 8vX PvP is to this day the best online gaming experience I’ve ever had. Far more so than high-ranked WoW progression or WoW arena.

[@SkavenUK]

Yep. I'm hoping Mark Jacobs and his team will pull his thumb out his ass and finally deliver what I helped kickstart many years ago with Camelot Unchained, as it really has the potential to be the next DAOC

[@moobot7361]

@@SkavenUK this didn't age well

[@eldencircle7216]

@@moobot7361 why not?

[@GreedeeVids]

That theme song brings back a tear to my eye. So sad that this fell from grace.

[@Praetoro]

You gave this video the true attention and love it deserved. This game was and is still unlike anything else out there. No mirrored classes and 36 overall. Realm pride, RvR, great PvE and so on. If anyone was to go back now, just have a group powerlevel you to 50 in a day or two and go into the Frontiers. If you aren’t sold after your first Zerg battle. Then it’s not for you. But if you love it, you’ll know why there’s still people playing. Awesome video!

[@marksunne]

Zerg love? Sounds like we ha an alb here! 😅

[@j.s.8780]

Mauler is a class mirrored across all 3 realms.

[@Praetoro]

John Seigo we don’t discuss the Mauler. It also came about 6+ years later.

[@calvingoh9043]

Nothing can replace the experience of DAOC, the endless hours of fun setting up a relic raid... unmatched.

[@zstew]

I still remember the Christmas when I got DAOC. I played almost all of the Christmas break, showed my friends the game and by the end of the break I have 5 other friends playing.

[@TheAlja]

Best gaming experience i ever had. Serious emotions were involved here, real memories that stick with me. I am really thankful that i got to be a part of this.

[@canadianreserve]

that theme song almost makes me cry. truly the greatest game ever made

[@WarlogicGaming]

Accounts still active on DAoC. 17 years, 75 level 50's and hundreds of thousands of kills later I still find myself coming back when I'm bored. Best game ever made, can't wait for CU. Thanks for telling the full story from a business standpoint!

[@syoungn08]

Warlogic what’s CU?!?!

[@Hubertoser]

@@syoungn08 Camelot Unchained. A new failure from Jacobs.

[@bananamuntcher]

Nerdslayer and Mandalor crossover when? You make combined my favourite videos on gaming as they touch on the games I've never heard of but love to learn about. Keep up he amazing work!

[@XFreeStyleZX]

You should look into SsethTzeentach.

[@Redstomp]

Just hearing the title screen music gave me nostalgic chills. The amount of hours I have sunk into this game... no regrets!

[@Neceroe]

I absolutely adore your channel I somehow love learning about games that I will probably never play or for the better ones you cover play for a few hours and then probably never touch again.

[@ibeogaming773]

Necero try daoc!! it’s a game that everyone should try atleast once. it’s a classic

[@westernmist2808]

This game was amazing. Great vid, very nostalgic. My main was a healer and our guild would run 16-man groups to camp bridge towers before they were reworked. Iconic.

[@mlk4life]

"your spell has been interrupted..."

[@DreaMeRHoLic]

I have to say that the interrupt is what made me love the game, because you needed skill to make sure that you can cast and not get interrupted by a mob. It also made you look at the other players and your interrupt coult take heals and DPS of the enemy team or stop their CC. When the game "died" I took a WoW trial and was thought "what a noob game... mobs dont chancel your casts, this is easy mode... get on my level!" I think the only thing that i hated a bit was that i got bored from constandly pressing 31 31 31 31 31 31 31 because 3 was the "do if" attack and 1 was the "anytime" attack as a melee class and 2 was my stick macro, while 4 was my shildslam.

[@Rotinaj37]

Thanks for this video, this game has a huge place in my heart. I think the first MMO you play is always going to be special, but DAoC really was unique. Just hearing the ambient music is enough to almost make me cry. Shout out to everyone who played the Mordred server, I remember so many of you to this day. Even the people who griefed me.

[@originalgaming1663]

best mmo ever made edit: I feel compelled to reiterate this incredibly important bit of insight (since so many companies are obviously trying to capture this magic) that while yes PvP/earning faction RANK and extra abilities was the ENDGAME focus, it literally did everything else and exceptionally well.. Huge non pvp zones to level/gear up in, tons of actually interesting quests/dungeons (a PvPvE dugeon that required having control of to enter, but to get to the other factions sides you had to make it through a lot of high level mobs). Crafting, other unique ways to obtain gear introduced with ToA (artifacts) like swimming down to the bottom of the ocean for a staff that levels up the more you use it (better bring enough breathing pots) some of these encounters required a lot of help, raids, player housing with attachable consignment merchant, and faction alliances made up of multiple guilds. Each faction was completely unique in every way minus a few abilities. Sit down WoW, DAoC would never wipe my mf items and progress, tf!?

[@zephasysgaming]

The year is 2000. You come home from school, shun your homework, grab your favorite snack and boot up your computer. You open Dark Age Of Camelot and hear that timeless log in screen music. Life is good.

[@artemrasputin1831]

Oh my. You are incredibly close to 100k subs. You totally deserve then and many more. I never knew so many interesting facts about these games.

[@danieliorns4446]

I’ve never had a gaming experience that matched running a Midgard relic through the epic forest while my relic team got slammed into by a larger force. Hit the gates with 40 mid there but managed to jump the wall during all the chaos. My heart was pounding and my whole body was shaking as I was the sole survivor. Never forgot that moment.

[@andreflindttyrrell39]

Yeah those relic battles and keep fights were the best

[@movros99]

@nerdslayer Very well done video mate! DAOC was my first MMO love and I've been chasing that high ever since. I'm a backer for CU and I'm hopeful that it will release well. This video brought back tons of memories. Your 100k subscriber goal is just around the corner and pre-grats are in order.

[@RyanPace]

I'm sure Mark Jacobs will get CU done soon. - Kickstarter backer sometime in 2016 probably

[@Black-Dawg-Jesus]

22:15 "aquired by EA" well, thanks for the spoiler why DAoC died.

[@WhiskeyTango0420]

100 fuckin percent. That was the day DAOC died.

[@marsee9766]

@@jonahfalcon1970 im still mad at them for not making the games f2p. PVP/RVR games need a high population or else they do not work by design.

[@Boltron23]

ToA and NF back to back killed DAOC. To much change in a short amount of time. WoW was the final nail though

[@Th3Kingism]

"I am become death, destroyer of games" - EA

[@towatchvids]

@@jonahfalcon1970 Warhammer was also launched before it was done because EA was impatient. EA killed both games for sure.

[@creamdelight42]

Still the best MMO ever....and living on and on. Sure, we dont get the numbers we used to have, but its pretty amazing what the guys on the phönix freeshard do :) love it

[@bananasandwich8335]

How does one go about getting into this game?

[@majorgear1021]

Nothing beat Everquest!

[@bica1974]

Oh my! This main theme, sweet, sweet memories. EU Lyonesse Hibbi here! Thanks for this trip down memory lane. Surely one of the best pvp centric games ever. I just want to make one addition to the "why it fails" list. Besides the things already mentioned in the video and by various comments, one major flaw was the widespread use of so-called "buff-bots". This was in fact in the later stages of the game something almost mandatory for the sake of staying competitive. It requires a second or even a third account for just having a shaman (skald), druid or cleric standing around the border keep maintaining buffs for you and your group. But... but even with all its flaws, it was my best pvp gaming experience ever and will probably ever be. Thanks again buddy for bringing this up. Bye!

[@glukolover]

I'm glad you brought up Camelot Unchained. It could really shake things up in the MMO industry if it plays it's cards right. I'm looking forward to a solid pure PvP/RvR MMO that's been built from the ground up as that. I just wish I could test it. (not in my timezone)

[@nonnel0355]

Ptw elements scare me on that one

[@glukolover]

@@nonnel0355 Kind of laughable since there isn't any. Thou I've seen people see ptw in damn near everything theses days.

[@brokenserenity01]

Not sure modern gamers will make tha game as fun as DaOC was...too much influence from mobas and other games has turned most of them into toxic salty boys who dont have the abiity to organise in ways that would allow for true rvr battles...well unless you count huge guilds who basically ruin the experience for the rest with their shitty attitudes like archeage ended up with.

[@glukolover]

@@brokenserenity01 I get what you mean, however it is worth noting that none of these other MMO games with large PvP or RvR for that matter we built around it's RvR exclusively. They almost always have PvE or some other feature that massively drained resources. Or they just became pay to win. There are things you can learn from modern gaming to make the combat experience better, but there was certainly a grain of awesomeness that DaoC stubbed upon that absolutely should be preserved. And honestly, from what I've seen in CU, I think they have. Guess that is what happens when you have the same mastermind behind it all.

[@Max-zg1xz]

Except sadly it will never be released. They should have made a DAoC 2 without all the fancy features of CU..

[@Muten1]

Thanks for that dive into my youth :D I loved that game and it's probably the most fun I ever had in a MMO. Kind of by accident 16 year old me found out about it when I was standing at the newspaper shop, deciding which of the big games magazines to buy this month. One of them had the beta of a mmo with knights & stuff on its included DVD. Decisions were made. Installed it, started a Highlander Paladin, started hitting enemies with my kilted buddy and didn't stop for several year. Nothing better than stealthy relic raids in the middle of the night, hoping that the enemy didnt see anybody and that the server doesnt crash or the usual 8v8 rounds through Hadrians Wall.

[@scifi_shop]

Best game ever, would go back for a remastered version.

[@jesamineleighkatzman2602]

what killed it for me was the gimping of certain character class to the point of making them useless. Bow class characters were strong, but now they can't kill a sitting "green" character.

[@oliviawilliams6204]

Ahhh DAoC... my first real MMO, good times

[@Zomgasm]

Recap for future dev's, key takeaways for PvP Games of what your player base wants: -3 Factions Promotes Balance, limiting to two has cause massive imbalance issues by shear population in almost every game (think WoW Horde/Alliance War Mode ratios 10:1?). -Players want UNIQUE classes, never mirrored classes. Just putting a new name/color to your faction doesn't promote replayability whatsoever. Think Rock/Paper/Scissors, beautiful design. -You don't needs loads of content updates for PvE to have a thriving PvP game, stat softcap/hardcaps worked extremely well with DAoC templates. You didn't have to play the game for years to get the best gear possible. It was more skill/player driven. -Add PvP Progression, the realm ability system was amazing for encouraging you to work on your characters, unlocking new ranks that allowed you to tweak your spec when you got +skill, such as lowering a requirement for Stealth and adding points to boost your Weapon Skill or New Styles at breakpoints. Getting rank points and overall skill points for PvP that you could either spend on Active or Passive abilities to strengthen your character, or unlock a new AoE CC/Burst Heal/Instant Root added so much more flavor to the base game as you got more veteran levels and points to work with. These abilities weren't guaranteed fight winners, but the abilities were strong enough to surprise your opponent. -Positional Requirements for Ability Chains (Mostly Melee), having positional abilities added so much flavor to the game. Having a dual wield class flying in to try and open with a side stun chain always felt rewarding if executed properly. There was a spell queue system with a main ability/backup ability, which allowed you to try and do a specific conditional style (as if your opponent evaded your attack) to strike with the conditional if met, if not you could use an "anytime" ability as a backup. Or if you knew you were going to get someones back or side positional, you could use those as the primary/backup pair to punish your opponent for your bonuses, or stuns/snares/dmg procs etc. This gets away from the "Hit the button that lights up - WoW Effect", you have to try and predetermine your opponents actions instead of having your UI make it so obvious on what button you should press next. -World / Roaming PvP is much more fun than instanced PvP. If the world is dynamic to the point where any faction can gain realm-wide buffs, then it gives incentive to rally people and get something going if action is dull during certain hours. Check out the DAoC Relic System for Reference. Roaming around with a group to take an objective or strictly find another group was a big thrill! You always had to be on your toes in the RvR areas. -Balance the classes enough so small groups can outskill the masses if they execute properly. DAoC CC was unforgiving, the element of surprise allowed 4-8 man groups to completely topple zergs running around if they didn't try to counter-play the opening AoE CC. AoE Mezz was so rewarding to land on clumps of people, then assist everyone down. Not to mention taking on the masses raked in the realm points! This encouraged the realm point hungry players to use risk/reward of being outnumbered to get a bigger cut of realm points. While zerg surfers could still do their thing and have fun. Solo/Smallman/8man/Zerg all had a place in the game, and could gain realm points effectively. -Don't allow spammable CC, DAoC did it completely right putting immunity on a player for that CC type after it wore off or was removed/purged. This encourages landing the Surprise CC and punishing a group if they don't counter-play it with purge and dispelling group members. This also doesn't force players to sit in rolling never-ending CC chains like RMD/RMP in WoW Arena. Believe it or not, people do enjoy playing their characters more than 20% of a fight. -Caster Interruption when taking non-dot damage, this forced everyone to learn how to CC for eachother and promote synergy/skill whether it was Melee or Caster damage, this forced players to learn how to kite. I remember how weird it was going from DAoC to WoW, and just sitting there getting smashed on by mobs and being able to spam cast without interruption. This allows you to create a game that doesn't require every class under the sun to have some sort of kick interrupt. It organically happens if your casters or melee are dmg/cc'ing the proper targets. Realm abilities opened room for counter-play with uninterrupted casts (Mastery of Concentration), or a baseline Quickcast for a single spell with a static 3 second cast to get off available every 30 seconds. Choose your spell wisely, whether it's to CC, Remove CC, Heal etc. It could be your last for the fight :) -Don't show enemy cast bars/buffs/debuffs. This encourages players to visually pay attention to what classes are casting which spells. In DAoC, if you were trying to dispel enemy buffs, you had to know what buff type you were going for specifically to shear. You didn't just spam a single button to removed every "magic" buff on a character like WoW until it says nothing to purge... This adds flavor to the game, not to mention the dedicated cleric/shaman/druid roles loved having some offensive nature to them outside of being a healbot. Buffs were a BIG deal. The underlying metagames felt very good, not just focusing on outdamaging/outhealing your opponents to victory. Create many ways to outplay your opponents, not just focusing on who lasted the longest mana bar wise. This ended up much longer than I thought, I'd be happy to elaborate more if there was ever a real project looking to recreate the DAoC finesse that we all wish still existed. The creator of the video did an EXTREMELY good analysis/breakdown of what the possible causes and facts were about DAoC falling behind. Everyone I know that played DAoC still gets that "DAoC Itch" that they can never quite scratch when it comes to other games and lust for the same style of PvP, but with a modern engine/UI. People were happy to pay 30/month for a main and bot buff account for many years, I don't think the monthly sub was the issue, it was mostly the aging engine/UI that made it unable to attract a newer generation of gamer. I think the energy focused on DAoC Maintenance should be energized into modernizing the game with a DAoC 2 using Unreal Engine or something of that nature. The core mechanics, realm rank system, progression and PvE to PvP ratio's were fantastic. This would get lots of crowd funding if they stayed true to existing DAoC mechanics, and a fresh environment/engine with modern functionality. We just need to deliver on a clean/modern looking game, on a streamlined engine and platform so it can allow new people to be attracted to the game.

[@yuliyasherstyuk842]

Phoenix 3K population in prime time. This game will never die :P

[@Evrydai]

just joined pheonix today

[@katokhaelan4881]

Oh thank you for doing this game! It was my first MMO. Some of the best times ever in PVP

[@vincentthekeeper2163]

So much of this stuff is the golden age of gaming. It'll never be like this again gents.

[@WhiskeyTango0420]

You are correct sir.

[@Sevier7777]

Unfortunately yeah

[@adams7597]

Back when PC only titles existed. Back before companies limited their game's potential so they could sell it to filthy fucking consoles.

[@justinc882]

Hold out a little longer, Camelot unchained is supposed to be coming out in 2019/2020 it's by the same guy that did DAoC with a similar set up.

[@hydrox5947]

@@justinc882 This didn't age too well.

[@Eijianthony]

Having started DAOC in October of 2001 - I still return once every few years to rekindle old friendships. I keep in contact year round through FB with my guildies. I miss the community of DAOC. Hib Guinevere! Thanks for the your work nerdSlayer!

[@MarkyDav]

I'm glad DAoC isn't literally dead, Broadsword has been such a blessing for the game.

[@kiergantyrloc6777]

Great vid! 4 year vet of DAoC here. A couple things to add. 1 - They never had that many subs. It was inflated because of Buff Bots. I would guess that 1/3 of those subs were bots. 2 - Trials of Atlantis was a great PvE expansion that forced PvP players to leave the frontiers and grind PvE. That pissed both sides off. I still think PvE and PvP shouldn't be in the same game. It dilutes content for both sides, changes fundamental gameplay (i.e. crowd control, healing, stats, etc...). Camelot Unchained looks like a step in the right direction for PvP'ers and i hope it does well. PvE is covered by every other MMO on the market (some good, some bad) and I'm looking for that next step in PvE MMO's. Not sure what that'll be yet (Lost Ark maybe?) but hopefully we can see some evolution in the genre.

[@rihohiiepuu131]

Awesome video :) I have played DAoC nearly from launch, I played WAR from launch to almost when it was closed and ESO etc. But I always return back to DAoC and play to this day. It is so unique with its combat mechanics like casters cant cast when attacked, etc, that there is no other MMO that even comes close. When WoW launched, DAoC really dropped a lot in population, but what kept people around was the pvp and the look. A lot of people just didn't like the cartoony look of WoW (including me, never played WoW :) ). I currently play DAoC on private servers but from time to time I resub back to live and i hope to do so for years to come.

[@ScaerieTale]

Former news editor for DAoC IGN Vault here :) It's more impressive than it sounds. But, I just wanted to say, hearing that brass intro again gave me cold chills :D As a non-PvPer, I still thoroughly enjoyed this game back in the day

[@bobbyiello7066]

QQ, I have tens of thousands of hours on DAOC from 2001-2016 I played this game everyday pure addiction. Ywain right when broadsword took over was the perfect DAOC ever, like 2011 or 2012 I think. Didn't take long for Broadsword to change the fundamentals of the game into the ground, hasn't been the same since. Never got into the Phoenix Shard, the slow cast speed and melee of OF isn't my pace when It had been years of TOA meta. Great times and memories

[@jegvilhais]

Another great well researched video. Keep it up, man. No one does this like you

[@Hogscraper]

Holy shit. Just sitting here letting videos auto-play and I hear the music that instantly gave me chills. Great video!

[@JombieMann]

The thing I remember most from, and have missed in all later MMO's is coloring equipment and especially capes. The guild I belonged to (and most other guilds) had a guild color scheme. You were expected to color your armour to that scheme. ALso, guild crests on capes were recognizable. You really could identify guild members visually.

[@JohnDL212]

This was fantastic to watch. I just downloaded DAOC and look forward to seeing what it offers. Thank yoU!

[@astrithaurelia]

as a former DAoC player, i would make the claim it never failed... it lived it's time, it did the thing it was meant to do, and then it grew old and venerable, and is now mostly retired, being more a cozy reminder of what it has been than a giant...

[@nerdSlayerstudioss]

Morrowind launched in 2002 LUL. That aside, as I explain in the video. I don't hammer hard on specific details with the games patches/expansions on purpose. There's a much bigger story here, and frankly DAOC game design choices don't really even tell a fraction of their problems (budget, market saturation, good competition, abandoned for another MMO development). So whatever "story" needs to be told, in this case a less game detail specific one. As long as we can try and piece together why something failed, that's our ultimate goal with this series :). Here are some of the pop charts I used in the video. gaheris.net/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=1447 www.granks.com/daoc/statistics forums.darkageofcamelot.com/discussion/886/population-update-year-on-year smmobl.wordpress.com/tag/mmog-chart/

[@HawaiiAdventures808]

daoc did not fail, it set the tone

[@zstew]

Great video. I played a lot of DAOC and I think they found themselves in a weird position where the industry was moving towards a more approachable MMO. DAOC was in a place where if they went that route they probably would have lost even more players.

[@nofuxgivens2797]

DAOC was the most demanding in skill and teamwork for PvP and will always be a benchmark for hard core PvP players in MMOs. It's always been my favorite online game. I even think warhammer would have been great if they had kept the 3 realm model because the mechanics were good. But the 2 realm model always sees lopsided PvP population which causes server hopping. My first server on DAOC had me there for 3 years before wanting to try another realm

[@Squigibo]

@@cg5081 No, prior to EA, Trials of Atlantis, pretty much did them in. and They screwed up RvR - To only have Mythic screw up Warhammer Online when the team went there.

[@Rhewin]

This game is nothing but nostalgia for me. I picked it up about 4 months after the great Atlantis debacle. There were still tons of guilds and players everywhere. To be honest, I didn't know what I was doing most of the time, but I loved the experience. Every now and then I'll log in to one of the legacy shard servers and play a solo class just to wander around my old stomping grounds.

[@cinforammi8543]

Just hearing that music again brings back so many memories. This was hands down the greatest video game of any kind of all time. Midgard and Hibernia rip. Albion can burn in eternal flames.

[@RT-qz5ci]

LOL! Facts bruh. Albion was the worst. Hibernia for life

[@nicholasfarrell5981]

Thanks for making these videos. I could only imagine being able to play most of the games you cover after reading about them in magazines, so this gives me a slight ability to see what they were.

[@mikeferguson1879]

It died because of Trials of Atlantis. Everyone that played already knows this.

[@edwino6655]

This.

[@edwino6655]

I'm aware of the fact that the data doesn't seem to show that the Trials of Atlantis isn't the reason DAoC failed, but if a lot of people were like myself, they stopped playing while staying subbed for quite a while after the release of Trials of Atlantis. I pretty much stayed subbed, but stopped playing. The big failure of ToA was that it destroyed in what was (and still is) the best community I've ever been part of in an online game.

[@gymrat2883]

Hated trials

[@AcuRobbie]

It died because of paying monthly to play and their huge accounting issues when they released the eu servers

[@nicolaslenclus7032]

If u had a big play time like 20hours+ a week TOA was amazing but yeah for casual player TOA was terrible.

[@korbell1089]

"8 man pre-made groups...all about strategy" I still have nightmares about the Hibernian 8 man groups consisting of 1 minstral and 7 enchanters. The only warning I got that they were coming was when my computer locked up and by the time it started running again everyone who wasn't an elf or lurikeen was dead

[@grudgeon]

Hibernia had Bard ;)

[@michaeljames8010]

God I feel so old now....DAoC will always be my first true love. Waiting for Unchained tho is also adding to my age tho >< lol nice video, it's great to go back in time 17 years sheesh

[@bigpun4332]

We will get a classic server before we get Unchained

[@michaeljames8010]

@@bigpun4332 I've given up on Mark J. and his BS. It was a wish to think he would do what he said lol

[@davidko3913]

Jacobs ruined his reputation.

[@eversforgeworks]

Played from launch till 2015 I will never find a more rewarding gaming experience. Ever. How I will always miss you. Made life long friends even.

[@hoshi314]

while i am not a fan PVP games in general at least it's always good to know DAOC is still alive and kicking as a spirit (or a poltergeist depending on the definitions), CU might be the new body DAOC needs and i'm kinda interested to at least see where this might go, i mean i burned out on BDO means i am not suited for PVP centric MMOs but seeing is still nice

[@Aristel25]

The fact that you actually somehow found and USED the DAOC soundtrack was absolutely fantastic for this video. Considering it's not really overly easy to find, thank you for this.

[@tbone9474]

Getting close to that 100k mate, though it should be 100 times more. Great vid as always.

[@zombiescreed6007]

I got reccomended your Death of a Game Heores of the Storm video for years just shrugging it off, a couple weeks ago finally watched it, then binged a lot of your other videos and love this one. I've always been a PvE player and still am but this is really interesting, I'll probably be trying to get into the Camelot Unchained beta next payday, this could be my new PvP adventure and it's all you nerdSlayer!

[@redsyphon]

Ha! That's my mana ment defending the keep against a bunch of pooka npcs at 1:36 lol... I almost forgot about that trailer. Great video, and a great game.

[@artdependent84]

I love you for this. I remember talking shit to a friend who stayed at his computer for HOURS and I told him that he would die in that position. After about a month of me bitching he told me to sit down and play. This is on Mordred server btw. I got to level 10 and made it to PKB. I see SEVERAL NPC's and he said No... those are players. To see and communicate, back stab and just have a shit ton of fun.. It was everything to me. 1 year later I got my own account... So yea thanks for this vid. --Midgard for life

[@kinoman1668]

Always looking forward to your videos!!

[@mathieub6192]

What makes this game so great is: - asymetrical classes, making for great strats and synergies and lots of replay value - the interrupt and CC system which enabled a small skilled and organised group to wipe zergs

[@HellcrushPlays]

Greeting Nerdslayer. Another great investigation. With the trend of crowdsourced, RvRvR games or PvP centric games (such as Camelot Unchained, Ashes of Creation, and Crowfall), coming to the forefront of the mmo landscape, what features do you think will capture the mmo audience? Many mmo fans seem to be drawn toward player created cities and housing, meaningful crafting, and a general sense that the player themselves with control the game space. This perplexes me because other games with these system haven’t been able to make them central to the actual gameplay. For example, crafting has never, as far as I have experienced, effected endgame loops other than potion crafting, enchanting, or minor stat gains. It always feels like once a player gains his endgame setup, that all progression stops and crafting becomes superfluous, save for minor consumables. I would like to hear your thoughts on professions or crafting within the mmo landscape as a whole, and if time allows specific games. Thanks again for the video, much appreciated.

[@Esidar]

DAoC had arguably most boring crafting, but it was essential for PvP (before Trials of Atlantis that is). You were almost guaranteed to have same quality of armor as your opponents. You could create your own character build simply by spending gold on items. In contrast, WoW had very imbalanced PvP because your performance was hugely affected by items gained in PvE grind. If you didn't have good PvE guild, you couldn't compete in PvP either. Thanks to crafting, PvP in DAoC was more reliant on a player skill than gear.

[@terran33]

This actually makes a lot of sense

[@MrAlvery]

_38 year old here. This is the _*_first time_*_ i gave a like to a youtube vid. GJ mate. Most amazing mmo experience ever..._ Alvery-Guinevere

[@Drithe]

I played from the beginning up until 2010. In the beginning you could only play one realm per server. So when you finally got to level 50, which took months back then, you got into the big boy rvr. There was true realm pride and people would really get into it on the IGN forums, til IGN took the sjw route and banned everyone. I could go on for a year but I wont. It's the greatest mass pvp game ever. It's pve was awesome too. Salute to all DAOC pkayers. Hail to Hibernia.

[@pychohobo1832]

50? As I remeber top level was 20. And it really wasn't a bad grind. The game was made to play at if 20. Up to max level was designed to get you to know your charactor. Which was nice. However RvR was 100% set to favor Albion. Hibernia was ok. And Midguard severely penalized. As if to say if you are a weak butt pirate you will win. If you are a fearsome Viking. You will lose. In between, Hibernia you have some chance. But butt pirates rule.

[@Drithe]

@TripleHerbals nope

[@michaeldpa1333]

DAOC is alive and well on the EDEN Private Shard Server! Free game download and NO monthly fee! EDEN staff is working on a UnReal Engine 5 update to the game graphics. DAOC is alive and well on EDEN!

[@jettro8523]

14.95 a month for a game this old is to much, if they dropped it to $5 i bet lots of people would come back. Yes i know its free now but you only get to play a few classes for free.

[@CreatureOfGoddess]

My D&D campaign was five of seven people short one weekend, because DAoC had spawned. I was less than pleased. Then for the next two and a half weeks everyone I knew at the time, a raging bunch of tabletop/anime neckbeards and scrawny socially awkward brothers in arms, talked about it when they weren't playing it. I finally gave in and created a character on a friend's account/PC and was hooked. When the class lists went live, before they had even introduced realm points, I was #4 of 10 for warriors at level 45 and the other 9 at level 50. I would run the frontier solo and got ganked a lot, bit I learned and adapted. It was absolutely glorious. I met and joined a guild from Sweden, learned a smattering of Korean, successfully led a half dozen or more off hour relic defenses with battles of 5k or more people in which we would have even the lowbies running repair materials to frontier gates to be relayed to where they were needed. The crazy thing is of the thousand or so players in our realm on at that time of night there were easily six different languages being spoken. During the first year we had server crashing battles which pumped me with so much dopamine and adrenaline it was comparable with jumping from planes in the Army, I shit you not. Kudos on this video man. I may have to go play The shard now lol Be blessed y'all! 🙏

[@brigandboy1425]

Man... that opening music gave me chills. I miss that goddam game, even if I did hate a lot of it.

[@pfarabee]

For Albion!!!!! One of my favorite gaming moments of all time took place in DAoC. I was an Albion Highlander armsman in the PvP battlegrounds, and our group encountered a group of Midgard players. I happened to be the player closest to the enemies, and waved at them. This tiny Norse woman waved back and approached me. We started jumping and waving, and tensions lowered.. and we all started having 1v1 fights. The Norse woman seemed to consistently stand close to me during the festivities and wave a lot, emoting things like dancing and blushing and the like, and I returned the flirtation emotes, even though we couldn't understand each other. I had an alternate account, and hadn't selected a faction on that server yet with it... so I logged it in later and made a Norse warrior that looked very similar to my Highlander one.. with an almost identical name.. and had written her name down. I caught her online and messaged her in "very broken Norse".. and we had a fantastically fun RP experience of me sneaking across the enemy lines to meet her and attempting our best to communicate with each other. Turns out she was actually a woman in reality, and we became friends for many years, even having an online romance for a while. She eventually did meet someone and get married.. and we remained friends for years but eventually lost touch. FANTASTIC MEMORIES.

[@zlatanmorrison8182]

TOA killed it. I played in beta, I played since the very beginning....and TOA killed it, to the point that eventually even the makers admitted it was one expansion they would like to go back and 'un-release'. But it was my very first MMO and has a special place in my heart with some fantastic moments/memories/battles. Plus Darkness Falls is one of the best things put into an MMO full stop :) I remember on Excalibur when what seemed to be the entire Albion realm was waiting for us Midgardians at the bottom of the steps at Mid entrance when DF was first made available....those where the days....

[@dmsephiroth]

Not rly. Newer mmos and WOW were the reasons. I rly liked TOA ^^ not ALL features, like only 1 artefact +could+ drop for a whole grp/bg...and rly rly long ML raids...but i loved the areas, the atmosphere e.g. Sadly i did not know..how BORING wow was vs the depth daoc at that time...and so i tried wow too ofc :// WOW just killed the social elements Daoc features so much! Maybe there will be a more oldschool mmorpg in the future :)

[@scifi_shop]

Mordred was the most brutal pvp server I've ever played. Couldn't even get to level 20 for a long time because of the constant ganking. But I loved it so much. My guild all shared phone number because defending our keep was serious business.

[@MariaIsabellaZNN]

I'm kinda like a grieving widow for this game who has waited so long for my husband's cause of death to be solved. Thank you Mister Detective, now I can finally re-marry. ...he would have wanted it, too. That's what I realize now.

[@Benfalk1982]

The sudden drop of 3k players you talk about near the end of the video is/was due to a popular "freeshard" called Uthgard. It sucked a fair amount of players from the live server and at one point had a max concurrent population of about 4.5k players. Another up-and-coming freeshard called Phoenix launches for DAoC this January and may have a similar effect.

[@SilverFoxGaming]

Great video! I love this game so much and it’s sad to see what has become of it. I still keep my account from 2002 and won’t stop until it really closes. I’ve played this game since I was 15 to 32 years old.

[@LastOneLeft99]

Damn thats hardcore. I quit live in 2003 but went to Uthgard in 2012.

[@SilverFoxGaming]

Svperstar I’ve thought about trying uthgard but with DAOC going FTP I don’t see myself doing it. Thou I wish DAOC would have a classic server.

[@LastOneLeft99]

@@SilverFoxGaming you could do the Phoenix beta and get instant 50. It is competing with Uthgard.

[@kunafox]

just saw this in my recommends and shed a tear for all the memories i had with DAoC and even Warhammer online. Enjoyed both and even as i comment, looking at re downloading the DAoC client. Thanks for this video

[@TheCosmicStarmen]

I'm a returning player.. haven't played in 5 years or longer. LET'S START THIS BITCH UP!.... just hope I'm not the only one there.. LOL

[@HansJoachimMaier]

I loved DAoC. It was my first MMO and I still have dear memories about it. I played on the European/German servers under the french company GOA. A friend of mine worked as a GM there. I remember a funny situation. I had some trouble and contacted the GMs. I got help and at the end of our conversation, the GM told me „Oh, and could you please order 3 slices of pizza for me?“ The GM who helped me was my friend who I played a pen and paper RPG with. I know, it is not much but for me it was a kind of funny situation I still remember today :D Why I left DAoC? The final straw was New Frontier. I was already a bit detached from the game and as a bard, I was used to lead the group through PvP. And to play New Frontier, I would have to relearn anything from scratch again. I was already too detached from the game to go through this effort.

[@Trygvar13]

I never felt it was centered on pvp. I did participate in pvp from time, especially to unlock Darkness Falls, but it really was the pve that was appealing to me. I wasn't aware the game was still around. I might have to give it a try.

[@originalgaming1663]

df was so good

[@zeathedaocgaming]

The good news is, the Private Shard (classic) community is alive and well for this game in 2022/2023! It truly has stood the test of time with custom/classic servers fixing what happened in Live.

[@mirarift]

Ahh that brought back so many memories! especially the Hibernia music (it still excites me). I did leave for EverQuest2 and I'm still there though I have tried several other MMOs. Now looking forward to Ashes of Creation. The flaw so many games had after DAoC was not having 3 factions; 2 just doesn't have staying power. I have to admit I was more into the PvE side of the game, but when I was in the mood, RvR was a blast. I did briefly go back to DAoC, but I noticed that the same bugs that were there back in the day were still around. It just wasn't as exciting anymore, and not being guilded, and the low population. Good luck on Camelot Unchained.

[@davidr.t529]

2001-2007 here. Best MMORPG by a long shot. This game in early 2000s had no equal. It was a real community with fantastic players/guilds/realms. Plus the engine and interface were top-notch. Fond memories.

[@nunezmartin7441]

I loved this game back in the day! Greatest PVP MMORPG _EVER_

[@sandrabourland5774]

Without a doubt, the best game EVER. I played non stop with my husband, still remember when I had my son and the guildies were celebrating in game LOL The sense of community, the friendships, the huge zergs, playing until the wee hours of the morning. Everything about DAOC was perfect, and I have not found a game that has made me want to play it since then. The theme song always brings me to tears, wish so much that it would make a come back. I still remember my husband and I driving an hour away at night after a long day at work to go pick up Shrouded Isles the minute it was released LOL I preferred PVE but absolutely loved the PVP in DAOC, many weekends spent at Thindranki, which at the time was one of the busiest bg's. I want to give Camelot Unchained a chance but just not sure I want a purely PVP game to play. May give DAOC another chance when it becomes free to play. Thank you for such a brilliant video, I learned a LOT about my all time favorite game.

[@StridahsAngels]

i loved this game growing up! Never found a replacement still looking!

[@natalia0900]

I like DDO I came back to it and has a great atmosphere of dungeons

[@Bancheis]

My favorite memory of this game was raiding the enemy realm. Managing to storm the Albs frontier keep with a hundred players, and with some luck, managed to get a few players to the other side inside the enemy realm. I was a Hibernian Light Mentalist. Ended up running around the enemy territory for something like 6 hours. Only 3 or 4 of us made it through the second gate, but I was one of them. Most people failed to kill me since I could charm high oj/low red pets, and had massively powerful nukes. I would politely greet enemy players, wave to them. Killed a few that had the nerve to attack me since my pet didn't like that. Eventually a group of 4 hunted me down, but not until I had a lot of fun in Albion. No game really feels like they have ever done pet classes right since that game... Not even WoW. I want to charm random things and make them fight other random things while I buff and heal them. Pretty simple stuff. Second favorite memory is probably my nightshade stalking around Darkness Falls after the enemy realm took control, slowly ganking people are they tried to solo or fight in small groups deep into the dungeon. If I got caught and killed, I would be ejected and could not return until our realm took it back. So I used guerilla tactics and did a lot of hit and run for a few hours. After taking out about 20 people that were solo or duo, I decided to be risky and try a 4 man group. I stalked around, following them until they did a massive pull. Tank started handling the aggro, mage blasting away, healer sitting in the back of everyone keeping them alive... 4th, I don't remember what it was. So anyway, I took out their healer, as you do. It took the others a while to realize they were no longer getting heals. I picked off their mage next, then the other 2 came after me with monsters hot on their heals. I pulled off a sick copperhead strike which slowed the tank down. Since he still had aggro, the enemies took him out. Made the last one bleed and ran off. Not sure if he died because I started training mobs as I ran past them myself, and eventually ended up dying. But I at least took 3 down with me so I was happy. Got the adrenaline racing in that game, something I don't get anymore in games sadly. I miss it a lot.

[@VogelMagic]

Just the theme music alone almost brings tears to my eyes. I loooved this game.

[@Irraptured]

Grats on 100k buddy. Been with you for a long time now. I haven't even played some of these yet I watch the videos. They're too good.

[@zonyae29047]

31:46 OH MY GOD I USED TO RUN AION INTO THE GROUND! Now a DoaG on Aion??? Makes me sad that some say its dead but I CANT WAIT for the vid nonetheless!!

[@tro4026]

One of my favorite moments when playing DAoC was when we crashed the server when 500 players from all three realms went after one castle. Fun times.

[@BM03]

I very much regret missing out on DAoC and I really hope Unchained delivers. I absolutely love crafting in MMOs and the idea of having good spontaneous PvP sounds very fun in a scenario where it isn't just getting griefed by very high level players in world PvP in games like Tera or WoW.

[@echoview]

The population count after the release of Trials of Atlantis is deceiving. While it appeared population jumped based on subs, the truth is PCs were getting stronger which made running multiple accounts more accessible to the average player. ToA lost a lot of players but a large portion that remained began running bot accounts to buff their toons which not only made the subs appear to increase, but also curtailed the sense of community by negating the need to group for xp. ToA was an atrocity and when NF launched afterwards the irritated player base had enough. It was Mythic's own greed that did them in. The game could have grown so much bigger but the problematic formula in place quelled the potential for further gain in the market. Loved the video, sir. I just had to iterate the hell that ToA was.

[@Mamiya645]

Darkness Falls was the greatest dungeon and if an MMORPG wants my attention they'll implement something like that, right down to the PvP system of telling teddybears to [DEMONETIZED] off. I could crack one off to reminiscing about DF adventures of ganks. You right about sold me on CU at the end there but I need my DF, and CU needs to perform well enough to let old machines turn settings down and roll a solid 60fps to get the greybeards in. Great video!

[@-----------5489]

camelot unchained will have its own take on darkness falls called "the depths". and they've stated system spec wise gtx 770 should be minimum for playable fps even in a large [hundreds+] fight.

[@christophwhiteyz9787]

Nothing was more fun than relogging in gray trash in a lvl 40 lvling area i had a spot with my elf enchanter and going MOC and wiping out 2 fgs of mids filling DF with kill spam then logging out before SB brigade shows up ...... like a boss!

[@christophwhiteyz9787]

ALSO there where usually buff bots in that room and id slaugher them too for big REALM POINTS like 5k in 60 seconds lol. SO MUCH FUN!! ALSO was the Hunter Brigade not the sb brigade that would kick u out of df lol for mid. HIb was Ranger and Alb was scout.

[@HeyApples]

DAOC is like that first romance in your life. You'll never love again quite the same way. And even when its gone, you'll look back and sigh and ache just a little bit for it. Great documentary although I think an underrated factor in the decline not mentioned is the /level command. /level allowed veteran players to bypass the first 10-20 hours of game content when making a character. New players did not have access to this command, so theoretically they would have to play for 20 hours to be able to interact with their realm mates. It was convenient for retaining the veterans but created this very divisive learning curve for anyone who wanted to come into the game later after the initial player surge had passed.

[@gluecksbaerchie9032]

HeyApples yea thats right