NEW Trickster Sub Rogue PVP One-Shot AFTER NERFS

[@ZorpoTV]

You know this spec is hot when it's the only one that has Blizzard nervous 🔥😎🥷

[@fimbulwinterphotography2162]

The invig shadow nerf is the ond that'll hit hard pve and pvp

[@ZorpoTV]

@@fimbulwinterphotography2162 that's unconfirmed on which spells it would affect and whether or not the change will be implemented at all yet. But it's good for people to be aware of that potential change as well, which would affect all Sub Rogues.

[@fimbulwinterphotography2162]

@@ZorpoTV i thought it made it to ptr and official notes, its missing on the 11.0.5 talent calculator aswell on wow head. Replaced by the extra charge of symbols

[@ZorpoTV]

I haven't seen any official notes on it and the only PTR notes I saw say it changed cooldown reduction from 30 seconds to 10 seconds. I'd love for anyone to link me an official statement on this ASAP! I don't have access to PTR.

[@ZorpoTV]

It would be interesting to see how extra charges of symbols of death would synergize with the Rotten talent in this build! If anything, a nerf to invigorating shadows is going to hit deathstalker a lot harder because they have longer cooldowns on burst (requires sepsis or flagellation), PLUS they don't get as much value from Symbols of Death as one would when using the Rotten talent.

[@Benny_gw]

Thanks a lot! I haven't played since wotlk and I'm 100% confused about everything at the moment 😅

[@ZorpoTV]

That's very understandable the game is crazy now! I have a whole playlist of Sub Rogue guides for retail if you want to take a look.

[@Opeth221]

Confirmed GIGACHAD build. I was sceptical at first but have achieved 1800 in SOLOQ with it. First time I have achieved this on any character. People in some lobbies were wondering how I was hitting like a truck.

[@ZorpoTV]

Glad to hear you're seeing some success with it! 1800 is excellent for solo shuffle as a subtlety rogue, especially this early on in the season! It's one of the toughest classes in solo because your teammates can mess up your plays very easily. Keep it up don't stop there!

[@Opeth221]

​@@ZorpoTV sorry 1600. It's low compared to pro's, but it's a lot of fun and this build simplifies openers. You need a PHD to get a good opener with deathstalker.

[@Osiris261]

made your macro as castsequence.. i like it. :D only thing i might consider is removing the second cheap shot. if you do a cast sequence.. because if you get cced.. you lose shadowdance timer.. and you cant cheapshot goremaw.. also the second cheapshot reset the timer for diminishing return.. and might give the team mate time to catch up and heal.. or cast some 3 mil shield... /castsequence reset=5 Gloomblade,Shadow Blades,Shadow Dance,Kidney Shot,Gloomblade,Cold Blood,Secret Technique,Gloomblade,Gloomblade,Cheap Shot,Symbols of Death,Echoing Reprimand,Cheap Shot,Goremaw's Bite,Eviscerate /cast Blood Fury(Racial) /use 13

[@ZorpoTV]

situations like that are why castsequence macro not good. You should just learn to press all your buttons so you can react to these sort of situation without having issues. if they don't trinket you're going to want to press the final cheap shot to maintain the stunlock. that final second is often enough to kill, especially when your team is helping to deal damage.

[@ZorpoTV]

I enjoy your comments but lets not encourage people to play with castsequence because it is not good.

[@Osiris261]

@@ZorpoTV i know.. would not recommend it if you want to climb.. but if you just farming honor in bgs and are a casual it is great ;D i really like what you did with the rotation. it fairly fast and high dmg. you could go higher.. but that setup is not very reliable.. so this combination is really good.

[@pmozzi]

Couple of questions: 1) echoing reprimande, does it trigger without hitting the animacharges? Seems like you dont hit them/don’t have them shown on combo points (usually blue). Second, the nerfs already active or will be active, i.e. Should we do this new build now or later? Ty for content, it is great to follow!

[@ZorpoTV]

Hello, the nerfs are already active, no new nerfs scheduled yet. As far as the anima points, I'm running the talent that increases echo hit damage, not charge 3 points. So it only charges one combo point, which you can see gets a little orange spiral around it on my purple combo points bar.

[@AWakeSleepY]

What’s combo do you use on your second shadow dance without shadow blades?

[@ZorpoTV]

using the rotation from this guide when shadow blades down: kzbin.info/www/bejne/d4K0fGyDhNOcqdE just need one combo point from shadowstrike, gouge, or cheap shot on an off-target before you start the shadow dance > kidney shot > Shadowstrike > symbols of death > goremaw's bite > cold blood secret tech > echoing reprimand > cheap shot > eviscerate > cheap shot > eviscerate

[@goblinslayer8299]

Hi, great video but the only thing im still wondering is what is rotation like after the opener, do you just spam gloomblade and evis and cc off dr and wait for next burst window ?

[@ZorpoTV]

Situatioanlly yes, either keep up pressure to try to finish or force more CDs, and try to keep up the cc chain and stop heals, kick spell casts. Sometimes good to shadowy duel the healer then after burst and they have DR on other cc. Or just try to peel and kite until you have more damage. You can also shadowstep to a teammate to get away faster or reset. We don't have a ton of pressure outside burst, but we do have decent damage with just shadowstrike and eviscerate too, if you have dance at least without goremaw or echoing reprimand. It's really important to try to kick heals before you vanish and maybe get a 2nd kick to keep up the pressure and the vanish will help get damage CDs back too

[@ZorpoTV]

forgot to mention I made a whole video about this topic kzbin.info/www/bejne/hqnPe3qfqbyXotk

[@morrey4]

i dont have the set bonus yet. do i need to hit 2000 rating to get both of them?

[@ZorpoTV]

No, you should be able to have enough conquest by now to put 2 gear pieces into the catalyst. You can also get one by hitting 1600 rating, not 2000. If you only have the one from 1600, you should buy another piece from conquest vendor to put into the catalyst.

[@opthomas.prime4]

What damage text font add on are you using?

[@ZorpoTV]

@@opthomas.prime4 MSBT aka Mik'sScrollingBattleText

[@paulo8301]

The only thing blizzard can't nerf or do shit is the paladin and rhe new added classes.

[@Osiris261]

feint will no longer trigger global cooldown.. we getting buffed boys ;D

[@ZorpoTV]

😂 yea that's just what we needed!

[@Osiris261]

@@ZorpoTV now they just need to make gloomblade not proc perforated veins.. if they do that.. weaponmaster might actually be a talent point.. that is worth to consider.. as it is now.. avoid it like the plague.. dont know who would use that talent...

[@SPVC3D0UT]

whats your combo point WA? like the purple color ya got

[@ZorpoTV]

NugComboBar (standalone addon)

[@SPVC3D0UT]

@@ZorpoTV ty brother!

[@charlesmanil6617]

why symbol of death after your secret tech and not deuring the window "shadow blades + shadow dance" ? because the 2p set gives the additional 20% damage for secret tech

[@ZorpoTV]

Because you need to save symbols of death to press right before echoing reprimand. It causes a gauranteed crit on the next 2 combo builders. If you use this before secret tech then the crit gets wasted on gloomblade. It's worth saving for echoing reprimand. Hope that makes sense. The damage bonus +50% to echo is worth not using it for tech. When you don't have shadow blades up, just use the original burst from my first guide, where symbols will be applied to secret tech (do this when shadow blades is down). Hitting a 3 million Echo gives more overall value than a +20% tech. But requires shadow blades for the build up rotation.

[@ZorpoTV]

Using secret tech early in the rotation takes advantage of the Disorienting Strikes talent to cause the next 2 gloomblade to proc an unseen strike. All these extra damage make up for not using symbols with it, and symbols provides way more value saving for the echo. But ONLY with the shadow blades rotation. Without shadow blades, just use the rotation from my original guide which is still very good!

[@AWakeSleepY]

What are they replacing invigorating shadow dust with?

[@ZorpoTV]

Supposedly being given an optional talent for an additional charge of Symbols of Death

[@AWakeSleepY]

@@ZorpoTV damn that’s going to suck I love doing my burst combo then getting the cds back up to do it again

[@AWakeSleepY]

@@ZorpoTV why are they removing it?

[@ZorpoTV]

@AWakeSleepY Hard to answer but doesn't seem like a healthy move for the game

[@TheDhac]

Too bad I switched to outlaw trickster, its rough in pvp out here

[@ZorpoTV]

Haven't got around to trying that one yet, but I have played a fair amount of outlaw before this expansion.

[@rn_lech]

Which gladiator offhand would be better? Fist with mastery or dagger with crit? As far as stats go I would guess that fist is better, but there are several high rank players that chose dagger over fist weapon.

[@ZorpoTV]

Most of those players are using a different build that does more damage with finishers than combo point builders (which mine emphasizes). So it really depends how you've built your character if you want more versatility or mastery. For me, since less % of my damage comes from finishers I'll take more versatility over mastery.

[@ZorpoTV]

Also, you can get the fist weapon just for the weapon quest turn in, but you have to craft the other offhand dagger with mastery if you want it. It's only a small difference in stats either way. But the weapon quest is a good way to save conquest and get the fist weapon offhand.

[@rn_lech]

@@ZorpoTV Relly appreciate you response! Bought both of them anyway, since I only needed offhand. The difference in versatility is only 35 and you gain mastery instead of crit, so i tend to equip fist more often. Your guides are goated. Looking forward to your take on 11.0.5 rogue.

[@ZorpoTV]

@rn_lech FYI you can craft a dagger with versatility/mastery for your main hand, and I highly recommend adding the "Blessed Weapon Grip" embellishment to it if you do (make sure to use algari missive of the harmonious too to guarantee vers/mastery stats and Forged Gladiator's Heraldry from conquest vendor to make scale up to highest pvp item level)

[@rn_lech]

@@ZorpoTV Already have one on my human rogue. Recently crafted a dagger with vivacity on alt, and it slaps as well.

[@nickamato3021]

How come we don't want to use cold blooded with our echoing reprimand? wouldn't that guarantee a MASSIVE crit?

[@ZorpoTV]

@nickamato3021 it's already a gauranteed crit from the Rotten talent and Symbols of Death, so cold blood there would be a waste. Need to use with secret technique.

[@nickamato3021]

@@ZorpoTV ah I see, thank you!

[@ilevitatecs2]

Can you link the nerfs you’re talking about?

[@ZorpoTV]

Here is the 2nd nerf, which is to the same talent as the first. This talent is the only change applied to Sub Rogues over the last 2 updates. They nerfed the same thing 2 times. Both nerfs are already live/active in the current game (note the date) - www.wowhead.com/news/upcoming-class-tuning-on-september-24th-fire-mage-shadow-priest-resto-druid-346795

[@AWakeSleepY]

Doesn’t the 2 piece bonus go down from 20 to 10 % in PVP?

[@ZorpoTV]

I've never heard that before

[@AWakeSleepY]

@@ZorpoTV ya man go into a BG or arena and look at the bonus

[@AWakeSleepY]

@@ZorpoTV also what burst combo do you use with your second shadow dance outside of shadow blades wombo combo

[@ZorpoTV]

@AWakeSleepY when shadow blades down I'm using the rotation from this video still kzbin.info/www/bejne/d4K0fGyDhNOcqdEsi=dnP7hTbhRfF9DhON just need one combo point from shadowstrike, gouge, or cheap shot on an off-target before you start the shadow dance > kidney shot > Shadowstrike > symbols of death > goremaw's bite > cold blood secret tech > echoing reprimand > cheap shot > eviscerate > cheap shot > eviscerate Interesting note on the set bonus in pvp I wasn't aware. The burst isn't dead from this spec though. Seems to scale well enough with gear that I'm hitting similar health percentages to what I was before any nerfs. It's definitely not as big of a hit, but it's not really necessary if you set up a good kill with your team like sub rogue is supposed to. It would only really kill the spec if we didn't have enough damage for that but we do, and often.

[@ZorpoTV]

@AWakeSleepY I appreciate you interacting with so much of my content bro ❤️ hope it has helped you out or provided some entertainment at the very least!

[@Vibratebalance]

why the auracancel?

[@ZorpoTV]

Because the rotation I showed already gives the exact amount you need. If you were to already have stacks of the buff before doing the shadow blades rotation, you would end up triggering the effect too early and have it be applied to the wrong spell.

[@AWakeSleepY]

Do you know if vers and mastery is the same in pvp at 639 or does it only increase agility and stamina?

[@AWakeSleepY]

And are you going to use the 4 piece bonus or just the 2? Because you lost out on vers and mastery

[@ZorpoTV]

@AWakeSleepY all stats scale up with gear except enchants, so you want to get max rank enchants. I'm just using the 2 piece (shoulders and chest with vers) and using the versatility pieces for the rest of the set for now since my build doesn't benefit as much from the 4 piece and get more benefit from versatility. Most of my damage doesn't come from finishers. I'm also using the goggles and bracers that only give one secondary stat (all versatility no mastery)

[@horenzodipartendo8225]

is this build good? i always played rogue, just came back since shadowlands and rogue seems gutted. im not doin damage

[@ZorpoTV]

Yes it's great! You should check out my other guide on this build as well to get the rotation when Shadowblades is on cooldown, as well as some more information about the playstyle and goal of this spec. kzbin.info/www/bejne/d4K0fGyDhNOcqdE I've got a lot of other Sub Rogue guides too that you may find worth checking out!

[@horenzodipartendo8225]

@@ZorpoTV shit still seems gutted, doing dmg with combo builders just feels wrong. and i dont like using rupture in pvp

[@ZorpoTV]

@horenzodipartendo8225 nothing wrong with doing damage with combo point builders... why would that be a problem? Ambush has been rogues biggest burst ability for the first 15 years of the game. Did you play Vanilla/TBC/Wotlk/Cataclysm? Also, rupture isn't a part of this. Only for spending combo points outside of burst to get shadow dance back. I'm not having any issues with damage and I know many other rogues doing quite well, so maybe you're just not executing things correctly, or too hung up on the idea that you have to play a certain way. Sub rogue is pretty good right now honestly. It's only burst based damage like it's always been, not big sustained damage outside of the setup/kill window. It's all about setting up cross cc and bursting with your team during a stun with your big cooldowns. Combo point builders are insane you shouldn't attach yourself to the idea that you have to emphasize finishers if you can push out more burst damage with the builders. You should do whatever makes the most damage numbers altogether...

[@horenzodipartendo8225]

​@@ZorpoTV classic pvp i ran hemo lol, and i was reading on the deathstalker builds that utilize more ruptures, but im gonna try your build later. shadowlands just seemed simpler i guess

[@horenzodipartendo8225]

@@ZorpoTV and how do i get the spelunker supreme to buy the armor? i just downloaded this expansion like 3 days ago. TY

[@zayon0170]

sub gonna be dead with 11.0.5 😭😭

[@ZorpoTV]

Let's see what happens before we react to it!

[@bogdanrotaru6101]

please don't tell me you play wow with a controller!

[@ZorpoTV]

I play WoW with all sorts of devices, stay tuned for more!