How Rachel Reeves can fix the budget black hole | Andrew Marr | The New Statesman

[@NewStatesman]

Watch next: Rachel Reeves WILL raise National Insurance - Andrew Marr kzbin.info/www/bejne/r36WgaKCfdydr5I

[@paulcarter4945]

The black hole is the lie to justify the diminishing returns of wealth redistribution, envy and taxing aspiration/success. The public services need reform, throwing endless money without will just lead to more waste.

[@colbr6733]

I sometimes think we are losing investigative journalism in relation to those in power and have become a public relations department for them.

[@timwoodger7896]

Yep 👍

[@davideyres955]

Sorry Andrew but the IFS did know about it. They were on record saying both parties were not telling the truth.

[@timwoodger7896]

It’s called economic gaslighting

[@whywowisdieing2604]

IFS are just as bad as the main parties.

[@cogsnbanjo]

Andrew Marr has really been taken in by Labour's narrative. He's an intelligent man and it's about time he questioned his own incredible bias towards Labour.

[@andybrice2711]

Though it is quite useful to have someone making these reasoned arguments in defence of Labour. Because most journalists are currently being very tough on the government. (As of course they should be.)

[@cybergornstartrooper2157]

You do realise the “new statesman” is a left leaning paper in the same way the Mail, spectator and the Telegraph are right leaning (some might say far right reform supporting). If you prefer your news to be all anti immigration, small state and Tax cuts then I’m afraid you’re in the wrong place pal.

[@josephgunnett7715]

This guy was on the unbiased BBC.

[@Ami-zo7mo]

Adding inheritance tax on agricultural business would make it impossible for most children to take over their parents farm. That would cause increase in food prices and even food shortage. Very shortsighted.

[@guystrong7218]

It would also accelerate the trend towards large land owners owning the entire countryside as family farms are forced to sell to big conglomerates

[@andrewkirk3522]

@@guystrong7218 you are correct and those who buy that land could end up putting solar farms on it or turbines and take that land out of food production and as the comment above says lead to food shortages and higher prices and screw farms and farmers over who know how to look after that land

[@YesYes-xb6he]

I'm currently just into the 40% tax band, if the limit doesn't raise in april and I get a pay rise I'll be taking advantage of flexible working and going down to 4 days per week because it's simply not worth it to me to work that extra day.

[@advocate1563]

Same here at 62% marginal tax rate. Not worth the effort. Feet up time.

[@nedgeson326]

Stick it in a pension. Sorted.

[@dobcsek]

@@advocate1563same!

[@Ami-zo7mo]

@YesYes-xb6he The government will get a bigger slice of the cake but the cake will get much smaller. Nobody wins.

[@gjames7798]

Smart pay into a DC pension to take yourself out of the higher rate band.

[@barrywalsh7926]

As the national debt is £2.7 Trillion and rising, £22 Billion sounds more like a rounding error that a scary black hole.

[@Pit5336]

And how much is to service that debt with current interest rates ?

[@adrianthoroughgood1191]

​​@@Pit5336 you don't pay current interest rates. You pay the rate at the time the bond was issued. New borrowing today will be at today's rates, plus old bonds that have reached maturity and need to be rolled over. Also the interest rates are determined by action depending on how keen or not people are to buy government bonds. That's not necessarily the same as the Bank of England rate which is how much banks have to pay to borrow from the BoE. When interest rates go up this takes time to feed into how much interest has to be paid on the whole debt, 10 years or more, if the rates stay high long term. If the only stay high for a couple of years and go down again then only a portion of the debt ever gets hit by the high rates. It's like how people have a fixed rate mortgage deal for 5 years so are shielded from rate rises until the fixed period rubs out.

[@EnergyMedicine2012]

Apparently our exchequer lied on her cv, she worked in the complaints dept. And not as as economist

[@nicksimmons7234]

You got a tin hat?

[@ecnalms851]

I saw someone say this on Twitter. It's incorrect. She did work for the Bank of England as well as having a degree in PPE from Oxford and a master's economics degree from LSE. She's definitely qualified whether or not you agree with her economics.

[@gio-oz8gf]

You're either a liar or you need to develop critical thinking skills. Don't believe everything you read or hear is a good starting point.

[@davidwebb4904]

TFL is criminally inflating their major projects, all of which are paid for by central government. Silvertown Tunnel costs £180 Million to build, yet we are paying £2.2 Billion for that project.

[@Carlos-im3hn]

go look at another fiscal tunnel (which may be very useful and required nonetheless) the Lower Thames Crossing (LTC).

[@davidwebb4904]

@@Carlos-im3hn You mean fiscal black hole…..

[@Carlos-im3hn]

@@davidwebb4904 I was trying to be positive ! a tunnel (while dark and dank) at least has an exit... we agree it is dismal finance either way. NS and NR should bone-up on the concept of "dismal finance" in a high debt MMT environment.

[@ianmarsden8568]

To be correct they are not paid for by central government, but by the taxpayer.

[@davidwebb4904]

@@ianmarsden8568 and theres no accountability…….

[@einseitig3391]

We are very poorly served by the politicians running this country. The standards shown by our parliamentarians is shockingly low. In the private sector the amount of incompetence shown by both Conservatives and Labour would have resulted in the sack. The Houses of Parliament needs refurbishment in to a modern arena that can cater for the number of MPs on the floor. The method of debate is not fit for purpose and is archaic. Should the chamber be required to stay true to its historical state because of the building's listed status then a new fit-for-purpose building should be erected in the midlands with the Houses of Parliament turned into a museum. The way the country's financials are debated is a complete farce with little visibility granted of the numbers banded about. How on earth the OBR, IFS and Labour party did not know about the £22bn is beyond a joke. How Labour could mention them without detail is amazing. The low point came during the Brexit negotiations when Michel Barnier turned up with a stack of papers and our lot turned up without even a BIC Biro or some A4 to write on. Everything here needs fixing, lets start at HQ.

[@nicksimmons7234]

Journalist are the problem in this country.

[@dobcsek]

Yeah maybe taxes are higher in Europe but salaries are also higher, pensions are higher, services is a better and prices are generally lower because basic things such as energy and transport are nationalised. I’m sorry but I can’t justify paying more taxes for the services I am getting here.

[@stevevenus1]

Borrowing is fine is you can afford to pay it back. If the market thinks we are borrowing too much they deem it more risky and put interest rates up on the debt , so can make it self defeating.

[@colinnewmarch1106]

I would not trust Labour to run a corner shop

[@HarkyOfficial]

Who would you trust to run a corner shop? (The UK)

[@fredatlas4396]

But I guess you'd trust the con-servatives, even with their appaling track record over the last 14 years. And don't forget who caused this mess

[@grafity1749]

We need productive taxes that not only raise money but also saves money in the future. Like taxing crap food (bringing down NHS costs) and taxing carbon emissions and air/water pollution.

[@Spludda]

How can there still be no public discussion of money creation? Ten years ago at least a few MPs were interested in the subject and the possibility that the current system doesn't work. Money created mostly via commercial bank lending, i.e. with interest attached... a school of thought claims it's mathmetically unsustainable, but the monetary system is so complex, so many interlinked vehicles, no-one has a empirical grasp of what's going on. There's a real chance that the process taking place is the slow strangulation of major economies because of that monetary disfunction, raising taxes while the government has to borrow in order inject money from outside the commercial credit creation process.

[@Carlos-im3hn]

yes, the inflation.

[@Ami-zo7mo]

Some European countries have higher income taxes but they don't have council tax and they provide affordable childcare and housing. It's comparing apples to oranges.

[@nicksimmons7234]

Our electorate don’t vote for higher taxes. Our journalists only ask Labour how will you pay for it.

[@Ami-zo7mo]

@nicksimmons7234 Exactly but people in UK are constantly manipulated into thinking they pay less tax then other European countries which is absolutely not true. And in other countries there is great infrastructure, affordable childcare, paid sick leave etc.

[@dobcsek]

Totally agree! They also have cheaper energy and transport because they are nationalised.

[@nicksimmons7234]

@@Ami-zo7mo yes and the problem in this country is our journalism. Only Labour get asked ‘how will you pay for it’. IFS have been off the TV and my podcasts for the last 12 months where have they been the last 14 years, on the news the day of the budget that’s it.

[@bill9763]

It’s good to know there are so many financial experts out there offering advice to the new Labour chancellor but remained silent for the 14 year when the economy was being trashed under the Tories. High inflation and crippling interest rates didn’t happen overnight and the inherited black hole would have to be filled no matter which party gained power.

[@bernhardgroeneveld7318]

I think there had been plenty of experts offering their opinion durong tory rule. Whether they had been heard is an entirely different question.

[@jezlawrence720]

What on earth makes you think that the party that gave us "we've had enough of experts" would be listening to any? Bizarre.

[@UKsoldier45]

No black hole but let’s borrow more money anyway! Changing the anti bankruptcy rules so we can go bankrupt, great plan! Financial credibility reputation on the floor. Recession here we come.

[@chrishurst965]

New Statesmen - stop referring to the balck hole - this is technically impossible for a Gov and keeps the false narrative about Gov finaces is just a bigger houshold budget. You should know better.

[@butlerpa100]

You can’t fix something that doesn’t exist

[@LAJZful]

Tax is the opposite to growth, look at Ireland.

[@jamessmith1652]

Reform the public sector. Productivity is too low hence the wage and pension bill is too high, and taxpayers ultimately pay that.

[@wumurphfu]

40 hour working week and sick leave / annual leave and pension in line with private sector

[@buzzukfiftythree]

I am one of the fortunate generation born in the early 1950s. I have two final salary pensions (career change in 40s), a state pension and more savings than I ever had in my working life. It is time for those of my generation to contribute more, if we're financially able to do so (that's the important caveat). I could pay an extra £100 per month or so in taxes, and would still be able to lead a very comfortable existence. It is time for us of the boomer generation who are doing well financially, to put a little bit more into the pot. A contribution towards the extra we consume in NHS treatment or future care perhaps. Unpalatable yes, but if there simply isn't enough in the national kitty to pay for adequate services, then the money will need to come from somewhere. If my partner and I can afford to spend thousands on cruises, then we can put a bit more into the pot to help those less fortunate than ourselves.

[@TimComley]

Do it then rather than talk about it

[@Cosmoscosmos1]

🤮

[@bernhardgroeneveld7318]

@@TimComleyIs he supposed to raise his own taxes? How does that work?

[@stormytempest6521]

​@@TimComley GROW UP.

[@ianmarsden8568]

@@TimComley Spot on.

[@martineyles]

3:35 I'm perfectly happy to criticise the monarchy. One way we could raise some of the money would be to fund the monarchy less.

[@simony2801]

Give it a break comrade

[@davidsparham658]

I keep expecting Sean Connery to walk through that hole in the thumbnail.

[@stevekirkby6570]

I have to ask the team at The New Statesman... do they actually understand how a fiat currency works (or doesn't)?

[@rezwhap]

What is your criticism of their understanding?

[@stevekirkby6570]

@@rezwhap I'm wondering how they define national debt. In the light of fiat currency.

[@janeknight3597]

Are the “manifesto promises” only for this year or for the whole 5 year parliament? I can’t see how they can keep those commitments for 4 years.

[@kevingeoffreydunn9864]

Most people say that there never was a black hole

[@cybergornstartrooper2157]

Black hole or no black hole the reality is the Tories were addicted to borrowing. The amount they borrowed over the last 14 years is astounding. Even if Labour wanted to continue borrowing at that rate they can’t. partly due to Liz Truss but mostly due to the fact that the Tories borrowed to that magical 100% of GDP so any further borrowing will scare the markets.

[@francesbarratt993]

Congratulations to Ben for demystifying a lot of the jargon and hype around government and political financing decisions. It’s the first time I’ve understood even half of it. Well done. Let’s hear more from Ben!

[@tomburton8239]

The concept of a “black hole” is Orwellian: it’s overwhelmingly Labour choosing to spend big money rather than avoid speding - as always it’s Labour tax-and-spend. It’s in their blood. Spend, spend spend, tax, tax, tax

[@PMMagro]

The UK economy is in bad shape. You can cut spending or increase taxes or both. Alternativly increase your debt even more adding future stronger need for cuts, taxes and/or loans...

[@stormytempest6521]

Taxing and Spending WISELY.... is the Key !

[@peteresher4580]

Andrew is wildly left-wing. He would always say Labour on the right track. Don't believe him.

[@robertsmith9810]

Alongside his mates on the Wonderful BBC

[@themsmloveswar3985]

Of the last two practical intelligent ideas of the British Labour Party, Andrew Marr praised all 400.

[@hughcaskey9542]

Just saw Reeves being interviewed on 6 o’clock news nice blue attire and starmer as well nice suit freebies come in handy

[@nicksimmons7234]

You seem easily gaslit.

[@martineyles]

Regarding income tax thresholds, they should unfreeze the peronal allowance, which affects the poor, but I wouldn't object to them freezing the higher rate threshold (doing so is likely to affect me during the next few years - you could introduce a rate in between if you want to tax me now). I think they should harmonise the capital gains rate. If this was announced as something that would take place in stages over the next five years it might encourage some extra cash this year, whilst waiting for growth to take place.

[@dragonfly6908]

I remember when Andrew Marr couldn't wait for Labour to get elected. I wonder if any members of his family have had their winter fuel allowance stopped?.

[@Its.all.a.game.m8]

So basically lies and dodgy projections from government. No one wants to talk about dept and physical responsibility. How can they talk of 22 billion black hole and in the next breath talk about spending 22 billion on carbon capture technology? People have been casually stating that “taxes have to rise” but if the government is not being seen to spend wisely and save where they can, this house of cards will come crashing down. I thought Ben made some cracking points.

[@whywowisdieing2604]

"No one wants to talk about dept and physical responsibility." Learn basic grammar.

[@Its.all.a.game.m8]

@@whywowisdieing2604 Is that all you’ve got. Throw low ball insults rather than debate. Try harder, kind regards

[@miller2624]

We've had their crap for 14 years, so let's all get stuck into these tories .

[@mbrough2799]

Failure to invest in sustainable infrastructure - cancelling public transport schemes, insulation, energy saving - will leave us simply rearranging the deckchairs on the Titanic. The tough choice is to raise the money using the obvious sources - income tax, corporation tax and VAT, beside which the other taxes (CGT, IHT and others) pale into insignificance. By the way we don't need a single yard of more road building - the climate crisis should be directing us elsewhere.

[@rexmundi1812]

Sack Ed Milliband and cancel all his projects and there you go, problem fixed.

[@chris-vn6sw]

Apparently, according to sources she’s been creative with her CV 🤔🤔

[@electorn450]

Which "sources" are you referring to?

[@nicksimmons7234]

@@electorn450Guido Fawkes I think. In covid they also found facts all doctors and scientists missed!

[@nicksimmons7234]

Guido Fawkes isn’t a ‘source’.

[@stevenwilliamson6236]

What about the border poll?

[@janeknight3597]

Well said Ben in your comments about headroom and black holes.

[@peteryates7505]

Every business has to make tough choices to survive and thrive…governments just don’t have the backbone to manage finances effectively

[@alanbradley9621]

There is NO black hole. It is s handy method of Labour clawing tax from the electorate for its own vanity projects..

[@arfurchance10]

I worry in case we wake up one morning to find Lammy has sold Britain.

[@adrianthoroughgood1191]

The black hole is that even if no policies were changed at all more money was needed to cover the existing spending than was being got from taxes. I the Tories were already running a deficit so taxes bed to go up even without any extra spending.

[@johnwoods7650]

Labour seem to be fascinated by their holes - black ones at that. Can I suggest how they can fill them?

[@johnlongford1734]

Easy to fix the black hole. Own up and admit it was a lie in the first place.

[@paullewin8615]

Big social government spending printed fiat paper. To pay unproductive people. It's that simple.

[@matty506]

It's always taxes that is spoke about but never about increasing resources. How much money we have will never make a difference as the market always settles at the max price people are willing to pay regardless of how much money they have. If theres 1 house and 2 families want it then 1 goes without no matter how much money they all have.

[@notsure855]

Liking this Zaranko fellow.

[@colinthompson3111]

I find it incredibly offensive to see the IFS on the program. Three letters masquerading as knowledgeable about the economy. Who provides their funding, please?

[@nareik00]

They have details on their website if you click ”about” and then “How we are funded”. I’m surprised you seem so bothered by this when it is so easy to find.

[@simonhart2186]

Are you confusing the IFS with the IEA?

[@chriswyles553]

Just want to commend the new statesman for their analysis of this labour government. Fair, balanced, thoughtful. We could do with much more of this in the political discourse.

[@jamesmash3927]

As far as prisons it costs over 20K a year to house a prisoner in a minimum security prison. We don't have houses for many to go to when they come out, so many of those being released early have nowhere to go and want to re-offend to get off the streets. This is crazy as it's cheaper to pay for simple accommodation than to put them in prison. We also need to be able to reform prisoners; rather than them spending most of their time locked in a cell learning how to be better criminals, we should invest the money to make them more productive members of society when they get out. Better yet build suitable and affordable housing and invest in education and jobs so they have an opportunity in life before turning to crime. Solve the issues leading to the problems rather than treating the resulting problems. but that takes long-term thinking and planning, something that doesn't fit the election cycle so will never happen.

[@jeanetteeftekhar6762]

She could resign along with the Labour party.

[@nicksimmons7234]

They won. Get over it.

[@roryoneill9444]

I could save the Uk £15 billion a year and that is £75 billion in 5 years..... Put a border poll on Irish Unification on the Horizon.

[@stevekirkby6570]

Is this not what labour always has to do; borrow to invest to make up for the rape of the economy by the tories? And then when it is all on an even keel with the investment the tories come back in to skim the benefits of the investment (and sacrifice), so the cycle starts over again. And the tories obviously come back in and complain about the borrowing to invest. The system is basically a broken pendulum, interupted every 5 years for a reset of its swing. No equilibrium, which is the danger of a two party system.

[@mrsulzer66]

They’ll come for the unprotected middle as always, those who can’t/dont have the ability to skip to around the mines.

[@fredatlas4396]

Why do they need to raise more tax when we already have the highest taxes in 70 yrs thanks to the previous tory government since 2010. Why not just leave things as are and watch the extra money come in. And wouldn't it be better to stimulate the economy instead and that would also bring in a lot more tax

[@joescott54]

Invisible black hole...

[@RealDareel]

A country with its own fiat currency but let’s talk about it like we have to go and dig up some gold to fund things

[@chris-vn6sw]

22 Billion black hole.. Borrow 50 Billion.. You couldn’t make this up..

[@michaelrogers4847]

Maths ,was never Reeves best subject at school.Some would say she is thicker than two short planks.🤣🤣🤣

[@Mr.Lemonhead]

Owen Jones knew all about it months ago, Andrew. This is all just poorly produced propaganda

[@nicksimmons7234]

Quoting Owen Jones😂😂😂😂😂😂

[@Fre667Roger-Ring]

Get a Chancellor who's actually qualified, she's more suited in the company complaints department. CV ?

[@christopherstaerck1112]

Could have watched an hour of this - too short! Great piece, thanks

[@geoffreynhill2833]

IDIIA! I'm drowning in indecipherable acronyms! 😵‍💫 (From a Marr fan)

[@geoffreynhill2833]

PS: Bring back council housing !!!

[@MARTINA-gc3tq]

Shouldn’t black hole be in quotation marks?

[@alejandro_mery]

Could NI, income and capital gains be merged?

[@Carlos-im3hn]

ahhh...the expensive bits.

[@FranzBieberkopf]

How about legalising drugs and prostitution, then taxing them?

[@sathim11]

Will Ms Reeves blame Brexit anywhere in the budget?

[@stevetaylor20]

Mote spending, higher debt, pay rises = inflation. Isn't complicated stuff

[@KillingTime1986]

You know, until recently i thought this channel was a breath of fresh air. Now you're talking about raising a non-progressive tax instead of just rolling NI into IT like it should have been in the 70s. Shame on you Andrew.

[@Binns57]

Marr employed by the bbc for decades as an impartial political commentator 😂

[@michaelrogers4847]

Your having a laugh, Marr impartial. Probably a Labour voter, since he was old enough to vote.

[@TootlinGeoff]

​@michaelrogers4847 Generally more impartial than the current right wing crew in the BBC

[@michaelrogers4847]

@@TootlinGeoff I just give up watching the news now, it's all gloom and doom. Get away from the rubbish spouted by the msm, and enjoy life. Embrace nature ,and your friends, and family.

[@davidlundrigan1435]

Surly increasing the minimum wage which has a knock on effect on wages as a whole but leaving the tax threshold of £12500 where it is would raise quite a lot in taxes without raising taxes as such.

[@YesYes-xb6he]

@davidlundrigan1435 Excellent idea, let's bring in the poorest in society to pay more tax

[@UKsoldier45]

She will see the destruction of industry and commerce. There is NO black hole. Labour re just committed to overspending as usual. Debt, debt and more debt. Wait for the Standard and Poors credit rating! That will put everyone’s mortgage and loans up! Thanks Starmer!

[@jagjitsaundh3571]

Well your going pay for Labour Taxes she is not paying from her Pocket

[@stuartrobb673]

Stop wasting billions on useless Net Zero? That would be a good idea!!

[@nj9888]

What black hole?

[@advocate1563]

The one that's getting bigger by the week

[@kevingeoffreydunn9864]

Why not just tax the super rich it won't even touch the sides for them people.

[@nicksimmons7234]

Good point, the ‘super rich’ won’t see this coming at all.

[@TootlinGeoff]

​@nicksimmons7234 There are super rich people advocating this. Politically, the right wing hangers on of those super rich will make a lot of noise, bleating about tax and spend.

[@nicksimmons7234]

@@TootlinGeoff there are super rich advocating for this and for every one of them there is 50 avoiding it.

[@TootlinGeoff]

@nicksimmons7234 At the end of the day, the vast majority of those will pay up.because they'll barely notice it.

[@nicksimmons7234]

@@TootlinGeoff which is why she’s putting it up for them.

[@alecdurbaville6355]

Reeves can fix the black hole by admitting that there isn’t one.

[@james3098]

People were saying for ages the Tories were setting Labour up with poor finances and that's why Rishi called the election when he did. The Tories have completely screwed the public finances. Don't forget the highlights we got from them were stagnation

[@terrystokes7047]

Stop taking so “Many” freebies?

[@tommygunadam]

Marr has been replaced by an identical Labour AI bot.

[@robertsmith9810]

Andrew Marr needs to apply for a job with Simmon Cowles new show Rachel Reeves douse not have talent along side the new statesman

[@nicksimmons7234]

IFS have been very vocal and all over the TV and podcasts over the last 12 months. Can I ask where the IFS have been over the last 14 as the Tories screwed the country. As always double standards.

[@alcord2540]

Was that the black hole created when they drove all the billionairs and millionairs out of the country.

[@AlanMatthews-r4j]

Well done chancellor, devaluing Sterling even more. Start the printing presses 😂🎉😂. Gold up, Crypto Up.

[@linrichardson8250]

Land value tax. The answer is always land value tax. It doesn't breach any manifesto promises and now is the time to design and implement it.

[@searchingfortruth4783]

You seem to be under the misapprehension that the tax system is set up to help the working class.

[@lilianandersonmayne4968]

Bunch of outlaws good for nothings what did labour government spend as soon as they were in what did they put on the ele forms living in mansions belong to someone else

[@davidmulliner829]

Ben talking a lot of sense here, Andrew not so...

[@virtualal]

Andrew Lefty Marr completely unshackled from balance and impartiality feverishly defending his darling Labour Party

[@MrThelocalpsycho]

Everything I dislike is left wing a guide to internet arguments for the right.

[@RobertThomson-y4m]

What black hole?????????

[@matthewharding-ew1ts]

Yawn.............same old BS.

[@DavidJames-p9f]

Poor analysis from Andrew Marr. Not for the first time.

[@aficio698]

The vegetables are in charge! Vote REFORM.

[@nicksimmons7234]

Please do, keeps Labour in power.

[@Cosmoscosmos1]

I know how she can fix the black hole. Get King Charles to dissolve parliament and get a new government in power.

[@themsmloveswar3985]

Yes. Chuck will be representative of all holes.

[@Cosmoscosmos1]

@@themsmloveswar3985 🍟🏊🏻‍♂

[@mhobson9478]

She can't becouse maths don't lie

[@RobertThomson-y4m]

Marr is a biased 🤡. Reminds me of Campbell......

[@egg-sk8kp]

They talk about filling to bucket, but the bucket is still full of holes! Stop giving away our money to foreigners and other countries.

[@jonkayl9416]

sick to death of seeing putins face. puts me off the video

[@rexmundi1812]

Surely the term black hole is racist. It has connotations of negativity. 😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂