Octopus Intelligent Has Issues For Solar, Battery & API Cars

[@malcolmfowler8972]

Well done on the 'Fully Charged Live' panel yesterday

[@NicolasRaimo]

Thanks so much Malcolm

[@garagewindowrailway]

We charge cars and house battery from solar from April to October. The zappi 30 second overrun (when clouds come over) is 1.4kw (id3) or 1.2kw (Zoe) for 30 seconds, approx 0.1kWh. We tend to use Eco and allow the givenergy battery (ac coupled) to top up solar and keep the car charging (usually 0.1 to 0.2kw) for up to 30 minutes on sunny interval days. In winter, we plug cars in, once a week each, for an overnight recharge. To be honest, the overnight rate is acceptable and the day intelligent will be a manual use. With smart plugs, overnight electricity can also be used for laptops, USB charging etc. I await the intelligent bit and will adapt to it, but overnight appliances and car/battery charging in winter is the big attraction.

[@Tony-Stockport]

I have zappi, solar (6.48) and batteries (20.8kWh) and am using agile. May has been a good month for solar and the agile tariff has got as low as 0.0p at one point. Your video makes me think how far we've advanced in the last couple of years but also highlights the obvious areas for improvement. I believe most of us with the solar and battery set up should be fine until September but next winter is going to be a tough one for managing energy and being on the right tariff.

[@TrevorHa]

I was on Intelligent over the winter. I ended up turning the smart charge off and just used the default 6 hours window. I use a Zappi. Also the delay for intelligent to stop the charge was rather expensive! Took up to 15 minutes to pause.

[@John-FourteenSix]

Thanks for the Tip = Done!

[@MrWobling]

This probably goes against Intelligent T&Cs - Octopus give you that low overnight rate, so that they have control over when the car charges.

[@nick81185]

You don't have to wait for it to pause, just stop it immediately via the car or Tesla app

[@iandickson5828]

Hi Trevor, I have a Zappi as well and probably just want the 6 hour cheap window. How do I turn off the “smart charge” function. Thanks

[@aldozilli1293]

I stupidly assumed Octopus 'Krakenflex technology' was auto charging at the low night rates. I've checked my bills which I do rarely and for months I've been charged by Octopus at higher rates!

[@bill_heywood]

Great point about the home battery discharging, if they don’t fix that it would make IO a non-starter for me. The last thing I want is my home battery to drain in my car leaving me paying for peak electricity the rest of the day. I’m waiting for my SEG to be set up and then I’m going to try Flux

[@johndoyle4723]

Thanks, just had an Ohme home pro installed and the switch to intelligent was very easy, I have a Kia which is not supported, but I agree if you can, use the charger not the car to control. The Ohme is well integrated with Octopus.

[@G8YTZ]

Hi! Your thoughts are exactly mine. We charge one of our Teslas on IO using the Tesla API, we also a a Model S and a Tesla PowerWall. It’s actually fairly seldom that we call on additional off-peak charging hours outside the Octopus standard off-peak hours. Right now, I switch the PowerWall to maintain 100% charge manually during those additional hours. I just set an alarm on my phone. There is a fairly simple workaround to the API issue, and that is to use a current transformer on the charge circuit that triggers an inhibit to the PowerWall. As you say, the real issue is the lack of supported APIs. Are used to have full access to both the Tesla cars and the PowerWall with Home Assistant, but I think using a current transformer and detecting charge current is a fairly straightforward method. I do also have access to the smart meter API through a third-party and that works very well. As you say, the real issue is not signalling when the cheap rate is active with that I could alter automate switching on the heat pump. The house has enormous thermal capacity due to concrete floors, ground floor and first and underfloor system so it’s a perfect heat store to run the heat pump during off-peak hours only. A friend of mine has developed a fantastic app for IO. I hope he’s going to release it soon but still the obvious API. As you say does not tell you the additional off-peak hours which is a pity, he uses the Ohme charger, so plan is to interface with that to detect the additional off-peak hours for the app.

[@NicolasRaimo]

You’d think pW and tesla being same app api octopus would pause powerwall for you

[@G8YTZ]

@@NicolasRaimo it is early days, and the intelligent octopus tariff is beta only. I’m quite sure these issues will be addressed in due course. When I can say about is that it is saving me a fortune, and I’m very pleased with it. Here we are discussing semantics and ways of improving the app and the tariff. It would be great if you could also link the power wall to it, and I’ve no doubt that octopus, have this in the roadmap, because it will make absolute sense for them. It is however possible that Tesla reserve in this functionality for an eventuality, where they offer their own energy supply company. I have it on good, authority It was Octopus that pulled out of the TEP, not Tesla.

[@robconvery5274]

The comment about the cars 12v batteries being drained is very important one. It's also been observed on MG5/4s where people have written an plugin to HomeAssistant to query the API for dashboards - if it runs too often it ends up killing the car battery. Madness that the battery can go flat when you have such a huge HV one in the car.

[@rcourt1977]

Node-Red on Victron has saved me by being able to poll the Tesla to see when it’s home and charging and if so switch the battery to charging only. It’s not quite plug and play but saves wasting battery.

[@NicolasRaimo]

Victron need to be on my list of inverters to review I think!

[@johnwilde4953]

I'm just in the process of doing research in to possible switch to IO. I have Victron MP (and also the Victron Charge Station) plus a Tesla MY, so if I did this it would be via Tesla API. Been messing around with a few functions on Node-Red and was wondering if this might be the solution. So just to confirm - have you added the Tesla API access to Node-Red and that this pulls data on charge status of the Tesla, which you then use to put the MP in to charge only mode and prevent discharge? Presumably the only downside to this is that during those windows, it then means that other household use is also being pulled from grid rather than the battery as it can't discharge at all? I guess this is OK, because the whole house is on off-peak rates during these windows. However, in the summer that might be mean using grid (albeit off-peak) instead previous stored solar - small price maybe. Don't suppose you are willing to share you Node-Red flow for this?

[@rcourt1977]

@@johnwilde4953Before I got the zappi I had the Tesla API in Node red checking if the car was charging and was at home and if so charged the house battery etc. A bit more of a faf to program but worked fine. I'll dig out the old setup

[@Crazydiamond_1974]

I’m pleased the Zappi is coming into the fold. I’ll be switching in July when my Go deal ends. I’ve asked Octopus about how they are going to integrate with my battery but their response was asking if I had a charger and pushing me towards Flux. I will attempt to manage it manually with the old charger if they do start draining the battery though, I can’t live with that!

[@BiohaZd5]

Where did you see that Zappi would be supported ?

[@NicolasRaimo]

in the video...

[@nigelgarvey2046]

Getting the off-peak rate outside Intelligent's off-peak hours only happens when it's part of the Octopus "plan" you get for that night. When you initially plug the car in, it can charge for several minutes before a plan's produced and the charging's paused. Those initial minutes are at the peak rate (unless you plug in after 23:30, of course).

[@NicolasRaimo]

Cars API does that I believe on some cars but Ohme it passes

[@rhiantaylor3446]

I am with Ovo and the same issue exists so I set the car not to use the connected (plugged-in) supply except for a 1 minute window once a day which is the minimum I can set. Ovo then overwrites this car setting via the mobile connection and API to align with its own commercial interests and I get the charge I need at a sensible price for giving the supplier the flexibility to choose when to supply.

[@HaxbyShed]

I have Givenergy solar and battery. My GE EV charger is being installed tomorrow. The charger does not work with IOG (yet?) but my VW car does. With the GE ecosystem I have fine control over whether the battery charges the car (not a good idea I think). So I've prioritised getting everything from Givenergy as an integrated solution and we'll just see how it goes with IOG. I'm not so bothered about the last penny, but I'll take the IOG savings if it does not come with a high management overhead and is reliable. Cheers

[@cliffbowen5185]

Intelligent OI is win win for me. I have a Zappi, 9.5kWh battery, 3.7kW solar and hybrid inverter. I have set house batteries to charge from grid during the whole 6 hour off peak slot. During this time house batteries will never discharge and will be at 100% at 5.30am. When the sun rises, excess solar is exported to the grid at 15p per kWh. My average house energy (excluding EV charging) requirement is 7kWh, my annual average solar is 12kWh per day. Net result is 100% of my house load is at 7.5p per kWh and most of my solar is exported at 15p per hour. On a typical spring day i can earn £1.80 (12kWh @ 15p) from solar export and buy 53p (7kWh @ 7.5p) of energy to charge my house batteries, my standing charge is about 51p per day - net PROFIT of about 74p per day which virtually offsets the cost to charge my EV at cheap rate once every 5 days or so!

[@RahulParmar1978]

Use intelligent go with a Wallbox charger and it has has performed perfectly across my two EVs.

[@ionlywanttrains]

I'm glad it's not just me that struggled with intelligent octopus! I found regardless of what i did, the car would start charging in peak time and i was being charged at peak rate. I gave up and turned off the intelligent part of the tariff and i schedule charging over night. Which is not ideal. Time for playing with APIs as you seem to get this actually working.

[@NicolasRaimo]

Beware they can kick you off intelligent if you don't allow it to work in the correct manner, I know tesla has a weird bug where you have to stop first charge when plugging in, I have a huge automation video about octopus intelligent THIS SUNDAY click subscribe and the bell and it will let you know

[@markglanville6495]

Thank you for being the first person I've seen on KZbin to mention the charging from Solar cloud problem. To minimise the amount of energy taken by my Zappi charger from the grid during the day, I slid the green power slider on the charger section of the Myenergy App to 100% green. However this caused a problem that is mentioned in the Zappi manual, unlike the Eddi that can warm your hot water even if only 100 watts of power is available, car chargers require a minimum of 1.4kw surplus solar to cut in. On my 3.4kw solar system, the poor charger an car have to switch in and out repeatedly, possibly causing long term reliability issues. With the green power slider on the default setting of 50%, I found much of the time 1kw of solar would be used and 400w from the mains. If on the Octupus Go Tarriff 9.5p kWh at night for that 1.4kw is probably cheaper than 400w of the more expensive 41p daytime consumption. I'm hoping the solution is home batteries that could supply the solar top up during the day and charge at night. For the time being I'm just charging my car during the night, heating the water on day time solar and letting the supplus go back into the grid! Thank you for great content.

[@bill_heywood]

Home batteries do manage this issue very well, I use no grid electricity when using Eco+ on my Zappi

[@rjmacf0015]

@@bill_heywood Do you have any figures on that and using what hardware is the latency (grid draw) avoided or rather minimised?

[@bill_heywood]

@@rjmacf0015 latency is always an issue, but in practice is marginal - a few seconds of grid draw is a tiny fraction of a penny in cost. If there is not a lot of solar excess avoid bouncing between charging/not charging by using Eco mode on the Zappi. I don't mind using a bit of battery power if it means capturing all the solar excess too

[@bill_heywood]

@@rjmacf0015 I’m charging my car now with excess solar. 5kW is going to the Zappi and between 40 and 80 Watts is being exported. 230 Watts is going out of the home battery but that is the BMS managing it as it got to 100% so it doesn’t like to sit there full

[@rjmacf0015]

@@bill_heywood Thanks. Very helpful

[@bryanlewens2068]

I switched from Go to Intelligent in March on agreement’s expiry. We have a Model Y and a Zappi charger. It may be a coincidence but using Eco+ and charging from solar only I have occasionally had to restart the charger when it is telling me it has reached the limit set when it has not. I didn’t have this problem when on Go but it doesn’t necessarily mean that the move to Intelligent is the cause. Thanks for this as I am hoping to install a battery soon

[@dnb466]

i have had exactly the same problem

[@davidfyork]

Same here (Model 3 + Zappi + Intelligent Octopus), had various issues not charging when it should, but was fine on Go. I was at Fully Charged Live North yesterday and was really pleased to hear from Octopus that IO is coming to Zappi. As EVNick says on this video, it makes more sense for Zappi to control it than the car controlling it, and hopefully MyEnergi will do a good job making sure it plays nicely with Eco+ mode for solar charging during the day.

[@bryanlewens2068]

Very reassuring to know I am not alone. At my age (later 70s) I am too well aware that issues like this could have explanations closer to home! I have installed solar on 3 phases , a large water heat store and an EV. I am considering a battery and heat pump but I am really concerned that the control systems will need to be reliable and easy to optimise. Things are going to get a lot more complicated as we are incentivised to help balance the grid. Interesting times ahead

[@michaelbirchall6307]

We have exactly the same set up and have started to have issues when trying to charge car. We have ended up switching IO off because it was too confusing.

[@rjmacf0015]

@@davidfyork and what will you do in winter when solar charging is months away and Octopus will void your contract with night charging using that tariff. Solution?

[@st200ol]

Sounds very complicated, so glad I didn’t bother with home batteries, I have the Ohme home pro I’ve never been allocated any extra hours in six months of being on IO.

[@NicolasRaimo]

Wow really? In first week of my reviewing intelligent I had it give me extra hours! A battery on GO may be easier but I might have a solution video coming soon to sort this issue

[@MrKlawUK]

I don’t care about extra hours for battery - you’re already gettin 6 hours which is more than go (4) or go faster (5). So no need to be greedy. You’ve likely specced your battery capacity and inverter to charge during 4 hours anyway.

[@jhern5173]

I tried to use Intelligent more than five weeks ago, getting it to control charging through my electric BMW. I tried it a few times but the charging plans it sent to the car didn’t even come close to charging the car enough. I stopped using it and reverted to just the four hours cheap at night (which is almost enough for a full charge). Octopus is still sending random charging plans to my car, sometimes only adding 6% of charge when plugged in overnight. I have to charge during the day at full-rate tariff because I have to keep going back to the car to tell it to start charging whenever it receives an update to it’s charging plans from Octopus. I’ve tried contacting Octopus multiple times but have yet to receive a reply. I can only assume their customer support has been overwhelmed with problems?

[@jhern5173]

I’ve also started receiving warnings from the car about my 12V battery not holding enough charge. Coincidence?

[@benskiddle]

You can turn off smart charging in the octopus app if needs be

[@jhern5173]

@@benskiddle Only if you’re still on Intelligent. If, like me, you left intelligent and went back to my previous tariff without removing the device/car then there’s no way of doing it and you’re at the mercy of Octopus customer support.

[@rjmacf0015]

@@jhern5173 Octopus is not your friend? They are in the business of profiteering in an energy/cost of living crisis. Your experience deserves to be more widely understood....but the media platforms are full of their advertising without any crucial detail. They are very clever at hiding their profit generation in complexity and T and C of their ever changing opaque deals

[@andy-nash]

​@@jhern5173Surely when setting Intelligent up you'll have told BMW you authorise Octopus to control your car? You should be able to revoke that permission on the BMW side of things. We have a VW ID, and that is certainly the case for us, but I can't see how it could be any different for BMW? And if it isn't the case, BMW have a serious problem too, for which they should be held liable.

[@twelvebears1971]

While I agree that not having easy visibility of the additional cheap charging slots is a pain, the simple solution is just to move the CT clamp used by your solar inverter. I had exactly the same problem and was having to either limit battery discharge current and/or restrict my Ohme charger to just 23:00-05:30 which is against the principle of Intelligent Go which allows the very cheap off peak rates in the first place. Relocating the CT clamp too less than 5 mins and now means the inverter and battery cannot ‘see’ the load from the charger and so they are set to charge in the fixed off peak and the charger is free to charge whenever Octopus need it to. I do still need to work out how get the Ohme integration to trigger my battery to charge when the charger is active to benefit from those extra cheap hrs.

[@SteveLoughran]

a big part of this is "the car manufacturers need public documented APIs" and octopus need to expand theirs. I don't ge the car manufacturers as they need to recognise they are just one more device in a bigger world-apps like ABRP should not only be able to get detailed live info, they, should be able to publish/update route plans to the cars. Maybe as Android Automotive takes over the UI, google will provide a good API -but there's a risk they'll do something which works with google maps and google smart home kit only. Anyways, thanks for the video -made me add some more criteria to the battery I'm scoping out

[@terrymackenzie6784]

I have a Zappi and for now will be sticking with, in the summer it's ok as I work from home so charge the car up on solar during the day and top the house batteries up at night. March was the last month I charged the car overnight but I am a low mileage user

[@rjmacf0015]

@Terry Mackenzie See the thread above by Alastair Lambert....Octopus will void your contract if you charge EV overnight only....then you are open to having your battery drained by 9am in winter!

[@DaveBrown1]

Very clear information thanks for a 1st class video. Very informative.

[@5kram]

I have solar PV an AC coupled home battery and a Nissan leaf and wanted to go on the intelligent tariff to get the 6 hour off peak window so purchased an Ohme charger. Found out that the Nissan API does not work with the Ohme so had to set it up as a unsupported vehicle. Then found that when I plug the car in and Octopus decides to give some extra off peak time it discharged my house battery. To cure this problem I set the Ohme to only charge when it's 7.5 P this restricts it to the 11:30 to 5:30 window. As for Solar charging the car I think the best solution is to use the Granny cable and have a longer slower charge and let the AC coupled battery take care of the cloud effect..

[@plasticcreations7836]

The problem is Octopus dont tell you about these extra hours when you sign up and last time I looked the Intelligent Octopus web page didn't say either. Ive got an Ohme charger and it doesnt tell me when the extra hours are so not sure if they fixed it. As I have a home battery and dont want it drained ive switched off the smart charging as others have done.

[@SouthlondonAl]

Have an Ohme Pro charger. The screen on the charger itself tells me if the charge is going to start before 1130pm. The app just shows a load of bars without timings, so will be useful if they get this amended. I also have a Moixa battery which, when i was on Agile, worked perfectly with the price fluctuations.

[@NicolasRaimo]

issue is if you have older ohme product or their new untethered charger you only get the bars.... But Ohme promised me they will sort it 4 weeks!

[@SouthlondonAl]

@NicolasRaimo well they already have! Just plugged in and the app has notified me of the actual times that the car will be charging, very useful 👍

[@NicolasRaimo]

@@SouthlondonAl always keeping promises to me happy to see

[@patelkamdar1554]

@@SouthlondonAl where exactly on the ohme app does it show you this?

[@BlaineOliver]

I don't really know that this is really an issue if you plan your install correctly. Have your EV charger CT clamp over the mains input. But have your energy monitor or CT clamp for your inverter split from mains before EV charger that means the inverter never sees the load from the ev charger but the charger can see excess solar export and draw from that.

[@NicolasRaimo]

Which is fine if your wiring is split like that but some installs are fed from 1 consumer unit feed or may have been installed prior to intelligent so have not been installed in this manner and most people wouldn’t feel happy in clipping the CT and moving it

[@JohnR31415]

Moving the CT is fine - it’s splitting the feed from your main tails that really needs an electrician (at at least needs one to certify your work, and they don’t like doing that for obvious reasons).

[@rjmacf0015]

I guess that comes down to selecting a good installer....I was just lucky!

[@jsouto77]

@@NicolasRaimo Hopefully this should work out fine for me. Both my chargers (a wallbox and a Zappi V2) have their own tails and consumer units and im having solar (with enphase micro inverters) and a tesla powerwall being put in this week. Ive also ordered the two extra CT clamps to go onto the zappi. My 7.5p on GO is not due until Mid October at which point Im hopping Zappi at least will be implemented and Ill them move to IO.

[@S_Curves]

Thanks Nick. I thought this battery thing would be a problem too but my power wall knows not to charge the car during cheap rate periods if you tell it when they are. This is a lot of faff for additional hours though, so I just let intelligent Octopus work after 11:30 pm. Before then my pod point blocks charging. I have a Kia and Octopus doesn’t control them too well and wakes them up when they don’t need to be woken, but it kind of half works and they have not kicked me out of intelligent yet! The free electric hours Octopus do are also an issue.

[@mikek6049]

its a tricky one and i am in this boat too - or will be come autumn (am on flux at moment and will charge car at work). if Go Faster was still a product i would probably go to that, but as it is I am just crossing everything that by the time autumn comes there will be a solution in place for use with my zappi. (Solar, home battery and EV owner that i am)

[@crm114.]

As I couldn’t envisage a time when I want to charge my car from my solar panels, I got my battery installers to wire the car charger such that it’s never seen as a battery load.

[@waqasahmed939]

05:55 I think that's why you'd want an AC coupled battery, so that shouldn't be an issue. You also need an inverter that doesn't dump your battery power into your EV. I'm waiting for GivEnergy to make their own charger that works similar to the Ohme AND Zappi charger

[@IMrDangerI]

I use the Octopus Intelligent integration in home assistant. It uses the octopus API and let's you know when there is a cheap slot active, and for how long. I can then get home assistant to put my home battery to sleep during those slots. Same when solar charging the car.

[@NicolasRaimo]

the api doesn't report the extra slots currently

[@davidfyork]

Yep, I’ve found the same. The “current rate” reading from the Octopus integration on Home Assisstant stays at peak rate even when an extra IO slot is mapped. I assumed it was just because it is showing old data (it typically says the reading was from several hours ago, so not up to date). Nick, have Octopus said that they’re going to sort this?

[@NicolasRaimo]

@@davidfyork I sent this video over to them prior to release and said it’s really needed… I last complained about the mini not sending data to api and they fixed that so let’s see!

[@IMrDangerI]

@@NicolasRaimo That's weird as it worked last night, I have it set up to send "cheap rate electricity started" to my phone and it worked at 11pm when the Tesla started it's charge early. It's not an official integration but one someone made specifically for intelligent.

[@NicolasRaimo]

@@IMrDangerI I wonder if Phil changed API shortly after my contact with him on this issue Thrsuday but last I checked it didn't do this so ill give a nudge

[@twelvebears1971]

Also I’ve just seen (as of 15MAY24) the Solar option appear in my Ohme app, but because of the ‘grid top up’ to meet the minimum charging power, plus the fact I would get 15p to export solar while I can charge the car at 7.5p, using the solar integration doesn’t make any sense other than for the idea of actually running the car on totally clean energy. Of course it probably won’t be totally clean because there is likely to be at least some grid power mixed in there on all but the most perfect days.

[@davedevonlad7402]

The drain of the battery can be easily overcome by changing a setting on the my energy zappi or by Henry blocks and the CT clamp in a certain place. It's not difficult and most electricians know this. My car is sometimes charged by the octopus app but you only need a few hours not 100% of the time like he said in this video. My 4k solar, Solis hybrid inverter and puredrive 10kw batteries power my home and I charge my EV overnight for a very cheap rate and it all works well. I even have my surplus going into the car while my battery stays charged for my home. I also top up my batteries with the cheaper overnight rate if I need to. Octopus is not difficult to use and it's very adaptable to whatever system you use, it just takes a bit of a work around if needed.

[@NicolasRaimo]

Depends how the house is wired if the battery and the car charger on same split of tails won’t help

[@MrKravmagadude]

Please give us the summary headlines first, it gives us a destination of where we're heading in the conversation. This is what's known as an inductive ramble. Definitions might help too.

[@JTCamper]

Not sure about the API bit. I have Agile and using the Myenergi and Octopus API and MQTT broker with GivTCP all integrated through HA. I set the minimum ppKwHr I would like to charge the car and HA does the rest including turning the storage battery off. If HA sees plunge pricing the battery charges from the grid.

[@randomjasmicisrandom]

Well, I’m confused! I’m still getting my head around Octopus Agile, I’ve learned how to use my Solis inverter to charge my battery at the best times (now it’s winter this is before the morning and evening peak periods) and I have a zappi charger ready for when my EV (Skoda Enyaq) arrives in April. I have no idea what tariff to move to or whether to stay on Agile, how this will affect my battery charging or ability to load shift. This stuff needs to be simplified to get more of the skeptical public to adopt this technology.

[@NicolasRaimo]

Look into getting HOME ASSISTANT it will take some time to get it right but once you config it your forget its there and it will automate everything you could get it to automatically charge battery now on agile for cheapest hours which will find the cheapest hours... For intelligent with the zappi however you can have it stop the battery discharging and start charging during extra allocated hours, THIS WILL BE CHEAPER for you when your ev comes!

[@randomjasmicisrandom]

@@NicolasRaimo thanks for the advice. I’m aware of the Home Assistant system and I think it will be a project for the new year. I’m just wondering whether to get the ready made kit or to do a self install on a raspberry pi or something similar. It’s certainly something to look into.

[@NicolasRaimo]

@@randomjasmicisrandom I did a video on here converting an old m17 tiny computer to run it fairly cheap way to get it done

[@MrKlawUK]

this is one reason I moved away from intelligent to go faster. You can work around it with manual effort - check the extra hours and then set the battery to not discharge during that time (like you do for the regular 6 hour window). A pain if the extra slots have gaps of peak between them that your battery won’t cover.

[@gavinnoname1424]

Where did you see the extra time slots? I'm wondering if there is a way to reverse engineer a way if obtaining them.

[@rhiantaylor3446]

I use Ovo which also has the supplier controlling the timing of the charge, within a window set by me. Surely this has to be the future.

[@NicolasRaimo]

The ovo anytime is more expensive per kwh at 10p a Kwh it also is ONLY for the car not for the entire house and your standard rates apply all the other times including when the car isn't plugged in. The future is what octopus are doing which is asking you WHAT % of battery you need when you plug in and what time you need it by 6am for example. When your car chargers isn't import its only important its charged for the hours you need it for. Ovo anytime means you could be charging at 6pm when the grid is EXPENSIVE to ovo so how long do you think a deal like that be around if everyone decides on working via that system? Intelligent is MUCH cheaper and with there latest announcement of higher export rate for its customers its now the BEST deal to be on. When my cars not plugged in I get 7.5p electric from 23:30 till 5:30 when my car is plugged in I might also get 19:00 to 23:30 for 7.5 for the car PLUS the home but then I also get 23:30 to 5:30 at 7.5p for car and HOME again my AVERAGE cost per kwh is CHEAPER than your ovo anytime car rate am averaging 9.95p a kwh currently! thats BEFORE my export is taken into account!

[@nick81185]

have a Tesla M3 with LFP batteries. These must be charged to 100% regularly so that the batteries recalibrate. I've found that normally the car continues to ' charge' even when at 100% and the current draw gradually drops during this time, which is when it's calibrating. I'm now on octopus intelligent and find that as soon as 100% is reached, charging stops immediately and the normal slow wind down doesn't happen. I'm therefore worried that OI is not giving the BMS the opportunity to recalibrate. I actually tend to put the car back in charge in the morning and it usually takes another 1kwh and appears to then go through the balancing process. I'm worried that this problem is not generally understood or talked about. Any thoughts?

[@NicolasRaimo]

Video about this with Euan on my channel a few weeks back, I’ll also feed this back to octopus

[@NicolasRaimo]

Ps you don’t need to charge to 100% that regular and I’ve fed it threw my channels if I get a response in a few hours I’ll send it o.

[@hamoudsudan]

Having a pod point smart “dumb” charger I was looking forward to switching to intelligent octopus once I switched from EQC to iX. Week 1 and the integration via API has been a nightmare to say the least. Car doesn’t stop charging during unscheduled hours and doesn’t charge during allocated hours. I think I am going to bite the bullet and buy and Ohme. Sucks as it will eat to the potential savings but I am just about had it with podpointless

[@jasongolweather2401]

Thanks for the video. If I may ask? We don't have EV's, but sign up without a charger option, in theory could we still charge house batteries at the lower rate? thanks.

[@NicolasRaimo]

You can’t sign up for this deal without an electric car you need FLUX or octopus intelligent flux

[@rugbygirlsdadg]

It seems to me that my best option is octopus Go. EV, 9.5kW PV, 9.5kWh battery. Zappi, Eddi. I can set everything to charge between the standard off-hours (Zappi, Eddi, Solax AC coupled batteries) and set the myenergi kit to "do not drain battery", which I have anyway. I'd only have the car plugged in once or twice a week anyway.

[@NicolasRaimo]

They fixed issue this week… paying you 15p for export so not you don’t want to use your solar and you should fill battery during offpeak hours

[@broadsword6650]

Did Ohme ever update their system to display push notifications about peak hour charging (or extra offpeak hours)? We are eight months on from the release of this video and I've not seen any notifications.

[@NicolasRaimo]

Yea it happens week I did video! Make sure you have notifications turned on

[@broadsword6650]

@@NicolasRaimo Hmmm... all notifications on but haven't had any messages about extra hours in the two months I've had the charger. Had other messages, though (eg: to authorise plug in)

[@NicolasRaimo]

@@broadsword6650 you shud get another one with the given hours it’s usually very long, try turn off confirm charge but the extra hours are not always extra sometimes it might be regular hours but text will say when car will charge

[@broadsword6650]

@@NicolasRaimo Cheers

[@gwynnej3]

My best workaround for the battery discharge problem is to avoid plugging in the car until I go to bed.

[@solarpanels2022]

Im on intelligent octopus with ohme charger i get home about 1pm and car wants to charge have to switch solar battery on to charge so it doesn't empty it first. Also set to charge solar battery at night.

[@NicolasRaimo]

Your find my lastest video on this subject interesting Get Paid More- Export Your Solar Don't USE IT! kzbin.info/www/bejne/fpTPmIVjYsSdZ6s

[@jj_EHP]

Interesting about the ping issue. I have a Ohme Home Pro charger and keep having battery issues with my MB C-Class hybrid. I wonder if this has anything to do with it. Had no problems since they've given me an EQB loan car 🤔 I only tend to plug in later at night ready for the 6 hours off peak and set the price cap to only charge if under the 7.5p/kWh rate.

[@bozwellboyce8364]

If I'm on intelligent, can i just top up my home batteries at the 7.5p rate, between 11.30 and 5.30, without my car plugged in/charging?

[@NicolasRaimo]

Yes

[@umersiddidy]

I got ohme epod last week and trying to get octopus inteli but octopus app doesn't seem to find the ohme app on my phone. Both apps are working on there own. Sent octopus amd ohme emails but no reply yet. Any advise

[@dinofash]

I’m buying a Hyundai IONIQ 5 and was planning to go onto Octopus Go tariff as Hyundai is not on the system because there is no API available at the moment I’m I doing the right thing ? 17.30

[@NicolasRaimo]

Depends… if you hasn’t got a charger yet pick one that does intelligent

[@John-FourteenSix]

According to the Octopus EV helpdesk people, they are working on a new smart tariff for Solar/Battery/EV. This could be useful, but I would rather have control of everything myself personally.

[@NicolasRaimo]

Yes octopus intelligent flux, it’s due for release very soon for now givenergy products only

[@michaelhorton6881]

I have 20kWh batteries no solar. I am on intelligent octopus, I let octopus manage the car charging. Home Assistant detects the Zappi charger start charging and changes the minimal SOC level to 100% causing the house to switch to off off peak grid mode. This makes the house use grid not batteries and the batteries charge up from the off peak grid. When charging finishes house goes back to Peak mode unless it is in the normal off peak period.

[@patrickwilliams2556]

Hey Nick! I noticed you said in your video indra chargers will soon become compatible with octopus intelligent, do you have any idea when this will be?

[@NicolasRaimo]

I’d not invest on buying one based on my soon, they are on ovo anytime and myenergi I believe just started public beta on it I think indra are next but am getting conflicting info from my sources on this

[@patrickwilliams2556]

@@NicolasRaimo the only reason I was asking is I already have the Indra installed just annoying it’s not comparable yet

[@nickmurphy7177]

I’m with Octopus intelligent and have a battery. But always having a issue after plugging in my car. The app does not respond with a charging plan. So after several minutes I have to try again.

[@NicolasRaimo]

You using car API? Or charger?

[@GrahamH-e3u]

Great video - thanks Nick. I'm just a bit confused about the issue regarding potential conflict with the house battery during the 'extra off-peak hours' feature. Why would my house battery discharge at such times? I'd assumed if my car charger is plugged in and the car was in need of charge, then I'd benefit from the extra low cost electricity to charge the car - but that's it! Am I missing something? Thanks.

[@NicolasRaimo]

You home battery just try’s to meet the load so when car chargers it sees the load and starts discharging

[@GrahamH-e3u]

@@NicolasRaimo Ah, I get it now - thanks for explaining! Looks like the Intelligent option isn't going to work for me then.

[@GrahamH-e3u]

@@NicolasRaimo actually, I'm now wondering whether I could make this Intelligent tariff work for my needs. I have a zappi car charger, 4kw of solar panels and an 8.2kWh GiveEnergy home battery. I'm a low mileage EV car driver and would only need to do occasional overnight full recharges (probably over 2 nights to fill from empty), or otherwise 'top up' charges overnight from time to time. Could I turn off smart charging in the app, then when I need a charge, plug the car in, set the zappi to charge between 1130 and 0530, while also setting the house battery to not discharge over the same time period? Possibly even also set the house battery specifically to charge from the mains between 1130 and 0530 too? Apologies for my lack of knowledge and any dim questions, but I'm a novice and keen to know whether this makes sense, whether its feasible, and whether Octopus T&Cs would allow! Thanks.

[@NicolasRaimo]

@@GrahamH-e3u try looking at evnick.com/energy new deal called octopus intelligent flux it’s a hybrid of flux and intelligent for battery owners with givenergy systems

[@cals.9269]

hey folks - can you not get round this by a) charging your battery between 0230 and 0530 and also telling Octopus you need the car ready by 0530.@@NicolasRaimo

[@reeshar1234]

The bit about not interfering with Intelligent Octopus when using the car API isn't quite correct. Unless i missed it, you don't mention that when you first plug in your car (a Model 3 in my case) the car starts charging immediately at peak rate until Octopus works out the schedule. That can take 15 minutes or more - expensive at peak rate! So it's important to stop the car charging immediately after it is plugged in. Octopus will then restart it when the appropriate timeslots are reached.

[@NicolasRaimo]

Another reasons I say using the charger for intelligent beats the car, Thats an API issue with tesla it should stop it ASAP sometimes I know it does but it should be 100% of the time

[@hragile]

Thanks for the video but it’s a bit over my head! I’m on octopus go with an EV (not supported by Intelligent) plus solar, 5kw battery and Hypervolt charger. I’m getting a Tesla so will be 2 EVs now and was planning to switch to Intelligent Octopus as the Tesla is supported. Would really welcome your steer on best energy plan please and/or any workarounds I’d need. Many thank!

[@NicolasRaimo]

Switch to intelligent for Tesla and charge the Tesla and let Tesla/octopus control when it charges…. When you want to charge the other car do so between 23:30-5:30 and your get lower rate… just be aware when charging the Tesla you may need to manually change what your battery does, There’s another video I did about how you might want your battery to behave now with octopus intelligent released 2 weeks ago

[@hragile]

Magic thanks 👍

[@subby28]

Im using Victron, Wallbox and home assistant. All integrates perfectly with IO and infinitely controllable with automations. Ive even got the MG api to integrate into HA thanks to someone doing some reverse engineering. Also, why bother charging the car with solar now the feed in tarrifs are higher than the IO off peak rate?

[@NicolasRaimo]

Subscribe big video on this today

[@pepermintpilot1694]

If the battery drains into the car you have "lost" control of your system. YOU should at all time be able to prevent this happening.

[@paulf3353]

Sorry guys, but where do i see those allocated times in the app? I can't seem to find it.

[@NicolasRaimo]

If your using cars api or wallbox it’s in octopus app under devices when you set your % charge…

[@gavinnoname1424]

​@Nicolas Raimo so where is the Octopus app reading the extra slots from? Is there a non-published api? Perhaps we could reverse engineer the app?

[@richardharrison5797]

Having issues at present with Tesla M3 and intelligent not playing nicely, zappi integration can’t come soon enough. Hopefully v1 is still supported

[@NicolasRaimo]

Announcement recently said they are stopping supporting v1

[@leeroychang]

Is this the case with Tesla cars and Powerwalls too? I thought the Tesla system promotes itself that it can rapidly change sources/demands? If I'm charging my car on a cloudy day, I'm basically only charging the car when the panels are in direct sunlight? From the grid when they're in the shade?

[@JohnR31415]

Power wall probably picks up the load.

[@NicolasRaimo]

Issue happens with powerwall, tesla customer above in comments

[@mikejoseph425]

I have Intelligent in conjunction with a Zappi and it has never worked outside the 6 hour slot which is fine as I charge over 100 miles on that 6 hours and I rarely drive more than 100 miles in a day. Any cheap charge during the day is irrelevant as my system is designed with a large enough bank that never drops below 15% by the time 11.30 off peak starts

[@NicolasRaimo]

not having smart chargers can mean being removed from deal its in T&Cs so bare that in mind

[@mikejoseph425]

@@NicolasRaimo I had heard that. My Octopus app says attempt failed each time I charge the car. I got in touch with Octopus to ask if they knew why it malfunctioned and they totally ignored the question and just said another tariff may be appropriate??? In view of other comments about taking 15min for the charger to switch off in conjunction with potentially drawing from my batteries which I do not want, I am reluctant to go back to Jaguar to ask how I could disengage the timer on the car if that is causing the problem, as I am content with the current situation Thank you for your warning

[@NicolasRaimo]

@@mikejoseph425 Zappi should be live now with octopus might be worth asking them to use that as the control

[@mikejoseph425]

@@NicolasRaimo Are you saying that even though I have had Intelligent since May 2023 and Octopus told me everything was approved and connected, it has only just started to work. I don’t know if it does work as the only time my ev is plugged in during the day is after a full charge in off peak period and I have not unplugged the car. Looking at a lot of comments, I am not the only person to have this issue

[@tonykelpie]

It seems the problems are down to people not understanding the criteria of the controls that apply to this system

[@NicolasRaimo]

Partly but not entirely

[@rjmacf0015]

And who would be behind that then??

[@anthonyhill8061]

on Oct Flux working well but its hard to get a bill from them at the end of the month...

[@NicolasRaimo]

Billing needs no gaps in data and that can mean a delay

[@ratscabies8458]

My Tesla M3 with a Tesla Gen3 charger increases to 48amps and trips out when Octopus start to charge. If I just use the Tesla scheduled charging after 11:30 then no problems it remains at 32amps. I’ve had to delete my car from my devices. Anyone else had a similar experience?

[@BiohaZd5]

Does anyone know when other chargers will be added that support Octopus Intelligent?

[@NicolasRaimo]

It’s likely zappi be sometime in next 6 months and indra maybe within 12

[@awestrope74]

Wallbox was available in Beta for a short while but is no longer. Hoping that gets added back soon.

[@ladams5356]

If the OHME do get push notifications working that’s huge help

[@NicolasRaimo]

CEO him self promised me 4 week turnaround

[@ladams5356]

@@NicolasRaimo if we set 1A load balance that would keep charger off grid ? ( bar the 1A ) ? If so could we ask for minimum of 8a LB to be down to 1A or even zero ?

[@01genics]

When did using electric become so complicated

[@NicolasRaimo]

You don't need to be on a complex deal its down to if you want to save the MOST amount of money!

[@StartMan09]

When’s the Zappi coming into Octopus Intelligent?

[@NicolasRaimo]

It’s the next charger currently being worked on by all sides

[@BiohaZd5]

Any official blog posts or articles that confirm this ?

[@NicolasRaimo]

@@BiohaZd5 octopus dev team working on loads of protects at once and sometimes issues in other projects hold them up meaning zappi could be in a month but it could be within 6, I do have some great things in common with lloyds grossman thou

[@alistairlambert3275]

Really useful video Nick. I have not had any issues as I connect the car at night and disconnect first thing in a morning. Home battery system has not drained and charging off peak has saved a fortune.

[@NicolasRaimo]

Do you do that to avoid these issue?

[@alistairlambert3275]

@@NicolasRaimo No Nick, I just don’t leave the car plugged in when charging is complete. Also I only charge 30% to top up the battery twice a week and the off peak window usually manages that.

[@NicolasRaimo]

@@alistairlambert3275 no I mean you going out at 11:30 to plug in or are coming home that time…

[@alistairlambert3275]

@@NicolasRaimo I see. I tend to plug the car in around 18:00. On the Ohme App there is a toggle switch to charge only at cheap (7.5p rate) so it only charges within the 11:30 to 05:30 window.

[@NicolasRaimo]

@@alistairlambert3275 Its in the octopus T&C your meant to turn that option off on intelligent not doing so can mean the removal of the deal so just be aware! octopus.energy/intelligent-ohme-faqs/

[@peterblythe5219]

Why do you always refer intelligent as octopus intelligent & not intelligent Octopus, it just confuses many from my experience

[@NicolasRaimo]

Your the first person to ever mention it… and I mention it octopus intelligent as firstly the company selling it is octopus and the name of the tariff is intelligent. If you were naming another tariff from another provider I think common English language would say you’d declare provider then tariff name

[@JohnR31415]

If octopus just made the OI “extra hours” API available to customers then we could automate it all from our existing chargers… Heck, if they MQTT enabled the octopus mini then they could push the flags from that directly… that would be a nice integration for most people.

[@NicolasRaimo]

Octopus won't allow you to join intelligent unless they control the API of the charger or the car as they want full control of when it starts and stops this may even mean it could schedule a charge and then change later. However what am asking if when they do have these hour slots they send them via the API to automate everything else

[@snozzuk2]

6 hours of off peak *

[@NicolasRaimo]

Assume you were listening rather than watching? Yep I noticed day before publishing that misstake so I edited a visual correction in video but didn’t have time to re-record the vocal

[@darrenduffy170]

What a load of waffle,

[@NicolasRaimo]

how so?

[@paulbuckingham15]

Its not compulsory to watch.

[@alistairlambert3275]

It’s one of the most useful videos on KZbin. It’s complicated but Nick’s doing his best to explain it.

[@JTCamper]

Ha ha waffle!