It’s pretty easy to make the “good guy” choices that games ask of us. NieR: Automata, however, offers an interesting choice that suggests players to be kind for its own sake, not just to please a game mechanic. Check out Wisecrack’s video: "The Philosophy of NieR: Automata!" kzbin.info/www/bejne/i5qyhYaBd95pg6c
@corruptlime65726 жыл бұрын
Man, you missed the opportunity to say good boy points.
@許進曾6 жыл бұрын
man do you know in the game when doing this act gives you a achievement. this is what i heard from other people who play the game if i am not correct please say
@dinotoothbarzaga86206 жыл бұрын
Extra Credits can you guys talk about horizon zero dawn
@LappenVI6 жыл бұрын
All through the video I felt the love you put into your work, and how big games are in your heart. I feel your motto "because games matter". Thank you.
@diegoviniciomejiaquesada47546 жыл бұрын
Oh Crap! I bought this game like half month ago and haven't even open it. I heard "Spoiler" and now I am closing the video. Will see it later once I play the game. The problem is that now I know that Nier:A is a sequel of other 3 games. Now I need to play those games before so I will probably play N:A on a year XD
@DanielRM925 жыл бұрын
To Sora-Kun from Canada, if you ever read this: I did it man, yours was the first message I got. I did it thanks to you! Thank you for this!
@jayvhoncalma34584 жыл бұрын
You got someone else's save data from nier automata?
@JukkaETC4 жыл бұрын
My message goes like: its hard, i needed help too but what if we got further.
@googol16644 жыл бұрын
yo i think you should try a text message or an e-mail.
@sjonnieplayfull58594 жыл бұрын
@@googol1664 i think there is some filter to prevent 18+ content in the game. Not sure, but there should be one.
@yanfeimain91354 жыл бұрын
sjonnie playfull pre made messages*
@renookami46515 жыл бұрын
"When making a game, the game itself isn't important. What really matters is to make players feels emotions." -Yoko Taro
@playerhateroftheyear10844 жыл бұрын
Exactly what Mr. Clemps says these games evoke from players.
@ObservatorioRS3 жыл бұрын
At least make those emotion feel good man. This was depressing... Anyway, great game.
@iaxacs38013 жыл бұрын
Said the man that throws the Square Enix headquarters building at the player in one of his games/crossovers
@BoWeava2 жыл бұрын
*Brilliant!*
@ZeranZeran2 жыл бұрын
and this is why I love Kingdom Hearts but I'm still mad about KH3..
@TheAlin12136 жыл бұрын
I remember a situation from The Witcher 3. I met some thugs harassing an elf in a city. I immediately reacted and drove them away but I got no thanks from the elf. Instead, she asked me what I had done this for. She made me aware of the fact that I don't give a shit about her safety as I would leave her in a moment letting thugs come back to her. And then I realized she was right. I only wanted to have a feeling that I behaved properly. Or didn't want to see bad things around me.
@hitmanwolf6 жыл бұрын
Games encourages selfishness... cause we allways expect something from helping others. True Heroes are the ones you see leaping to save someone without any hesitation. he didn't stop to think how much EXP and GOLD he was gonna get from it... he did cause that is what Heroes do.
@dnw0095 жыл бұрын
@@hitmanwolf That, good people don't seek reward for something that they have done. You probably won't even hear about them at all unless the people they helped wanted to share their act of kindness. As opposed to doing something good and then posting it on social media to show the world how good you are, and in effect making it more about what you got out of it rather than the act of kindness itself.
@christophersimms91285 жыл бұрын
@@hitmanwolf Alright deku
@gangstashanksta5 жыл бұрын
@@christophersimms9128 lol..Stain complex.
@damianstarks89745 жыл бұрын
When I encountered that I actually got her to thank me if I'm remembering correctly well I do like those elf girls XD
@real_krai5 жыл бұрын
Thank for your sacrifices, guys. You all helped me a lot! I hope I can help someone too. Cotni_Ho([BC]Wren), chalupa, Haise, koopacrazy, Moxy, 2B(akaimiruku), oyuyak9, Waldeinsamkelt, Tyrann, LOVE-QAQ, J4(Cosdark), Ricodouga, Leomund, NotTheRiver, FloJoAdern, YoRHa2B, naked_trap, patrick, Eva-02, Arimane, AA, MaRbLe, Codelex, Catherine, Vexin, Kaiki, Undyne, HaoGeWu, Arkanrichie, Kizuna, namaniku, Morggotth, UltrA, Ramenyumyum, Ghost, alice, Ashkers, thank you!
@scienceforthesciencegod82123 жыл бұрын
How many people did you get killed?
@themaddoctor53042 жыл бұрын
@@scienceforthesciencegod8212 they made their choice. They chose to help. God bless them.
@kkelus2 жыл бұрын
@@scienceforthesciencegod8212 He didn't, they choose to help all by themselves. They were gone long before krai started the game :)
@cameronjs2226 жыл бұрын
This last fight hit me hard. SPOILERS... When I was fighting the boss and died, I had no idea that all of the messages were from actual players. I thought it was just something the developers put in. And when the game offered help, I didn’t realize it was was coming from other players. I though it was just the game saying, in a patronizing tone, “would you like me put it on easy for you?” But after a dozen or so deaths, I accepted the help. It wasn’t until the game asked me to write my own message that I understood the help I received came from other players. When I understood the many, many ships that were sacrificed to protect me came from the deletion of others save data, I nearly cried. I had no idea that I had just been flippantly using up peoples sacrifices. As soon as it gave me the chance, I had to offered up all of my save data to help whoever came next, even though I had plenty that I wanted to do and knew I wouldn’t have time to go through it all again. It was completely worth it.
@bernardoheusi61466 жыл бұрын
The credit scene was fantastic. Will never forget this game, I´s my GOTY 2017
@ShePudding6 жыл бұрын
Lzy Nerd: That’s amazing. I had nearly this exact same experience, including having more to do. This decision was so much easier to make in... a different Yoko Taro game >.> ... because you could just say no and redo the boss battle after making a backup save file. You’d feel like shit, but nothing was really lost. It seems Taro set up the final fight this way because he’d heard about our tricks and found a way to up the stakes. Good on him. It’s almost disappointing that there’s still a way around it.
@TheHej26 жыл бұрын
I am crying when reading your story
@Goldmos16 жыл бұрын
I'm not sure what ending he is talking about, didn't need any help in my playthrou IIRC. Which figth is it?What chapter?
@anothernoob91106 жыл бұрын
I said no because I would give up my save when I was done doing everything I would try to do in the game first. Since you can theoretically give up that save whenever you want, just have to choose the last chapter in the chapter select and do the boss again.
@Vania16696 жыл бұрын
I did not delete my Save File the First time i beat the Game. I didnt want to give up something Incomplete, so i kept going Collecting endings, beating side-quests I even Defeated Emil's 2 Bossfights, which was insane. Then, i replayed the finale and gave up my save data To whoever got my Data, Good luck!
@Kitajima24 жыл бұрын
I just got the game, and I'm planning on doing the same. So good, and I never thought a video game would make me feel the way that game does
@vicelcia94703 жыл бұрын
Planning the same.
@Al-cm8ny3 жыл бұрын
planning on doing the same
@DavidFerneau3 жыл бұрын
Well, if you accepted the help on the second playthrough of the finale, you basically stole an extra save file to donate your own, so essentially you haven't helped anybody. How "good" do you feel now?? 😂
@vicelcia94703 жыл бұрын
@@DavidFerneau that's why i still haven't finished the ending credits
@seriousbusiness3346 жыл бұрын
A short story on this subject that I was dying to share: The Person that I helped out at the end actually added me on steam. I got a random steam friend request a couple of days after finishing the game, and my heart was filled with delight when I saw that they uploaded a couple of screenshots of my motivational message and my little ship helping them. I now have a new friend, half a world away, because of Nier. Somehow, this always leaves me in awe when I think about it.
@Poki36 жыл бұрын
Wow, that's pretty awesome :D
@megatom70523 жыл бұрын
The power of a masterpiece game!
@erutz51906 жыл бұрын
I actually looked up one of the people who helped me and thanked him. EDIT: Only managed to remember one name, though.
@AegixDrakan6 жыл бұрын
That is so damn cool. :) I wish I remembered their names, but there were too many bullets flying around to really commit any of them to memory. ; _;
@xxxvi79546 жыл бұрын
I wish I could have done the same
@retro_marmota6 жыл бұрын
I wish i could do that too. Didn't think of that possibility
@TheGFFA5 жыл бұрын
Bless you!
@RifetOkic5 жыл бұрын
How’d you find him/her ?
@Roadk1ll216 жыл бұрын
"Wisecrack sent you" "Extra Credits sent you" Damnit I've been subscribbed to both for years. I'm so confused now 🤣
@extrahistory6 жыл бұрын
We're super happy that we got to do this collab!
@LaborVoicesInc6 жыл бұрын
word. YEARS.
@seanurbik51586 жыл бұрын
Extra Credits Are you thinking about a collab with matpat? Thank you for this episode by the way!
@aoli81426 жыл бұрын
Sean Urbik MatPat does theories, not really alike to Extra Credits. MatPat's pretty busy too.
@McFloT6 жыл бұрын
same
@awdrifter33946 жыл бұрын
Someone solo'd the final boss fight, it is possible. You just need to be really good at bullet hell games.
@SebastianHaban6 жыл бұрын
It MUST be possible because who should help the first person fighting the bossfight?
@AegixDrakan6 жыл бұрын
Probably the developers themselves. They likely put their gamertags in there to save the first wave of players.
@youtoober20135 жыл бұрын
It was devs and game testers.
@ajimit86693 жыл бұрын
But that's not how Nier Automata be played though
@Kira-mu2im3 жыл бұрын
Touhou fans be like
@HammerspaceCreature6 жыл бұрын
"I AM SO GOOD. LOOK AT HOW MANY GOOD POINTS I HAVE" would be so useful as a 5 second reaction video against half of the people on social media.
@michaelmorales16026 жыл бұрын
We need a "clip" function on KZbin
@cluelessmastermind70915 жыл бұрын
You want to use the video about kindness and giving as a comeback in an argument?
@dnw0095 жыл бұрын
@@cluelessmastermind7091 No people on social media claim to be good when it was hardly an inconvenience for them if it was at all. It was for themselves to show the world how good they are. Actual good people don't post the good things they do online, other people do it for them. Or it is never mentioned at all and the only reminder that you did a good deed is the good feeling you have and the person you helped remembering you for it.
@Razor48845 жыл бұрын
A gif could work. But I don't have the talent to make a good one.
@georgesheng55003 жыл бұрын
@@michaelmorales1602 Aged like fine wine
@npc68175 жыл бұрын
"when you are plaiyng dark souls and you see a blodstain somewhere on the map where you died before" so you mean every single inch of the map or what
@LucasTigy24 жыл бұрын
well no, some of them are just idiots trying to get you killed
@anonymousanonymous95873 жыл бұрын
Reset a bunch of times around a treasure chest, then leave a "Mimic, don't go here" there.
@soyUsernameWasTaken6 жыл бұрын
I don't usually do any of these... but when those encouragement messages start showing up on my screen, my tears was flowing down like crazy, i can't see anything. Probably it's the damn gorgeous music. Probably because it's always nice to know that people care. Probably because i already know that these people deleted their saves just to help me... Yeah, i'm a completionist. I read spoiler-free faqs before finishing automata. So i know damn well what was waiting at the end of that journey. But in the end, i wiped those stupid tears and smiled. Without any doubt whatsoever, i deleted my save. My 100% save where i've acquired everything in the game. Got my platinum. Best damn platinum ever in my gaming career.
@youtoober20135 жыл бұрын
WHOO! Platinum! I was thinking... why would anyone ever finish it before doing everything? lol Congrats. My best is Skyrim I think, I can only imagine...
@pineappleguy74956 жыл бұрын
Short story time: I was 17 and I was doing my second run on the campaigns of Black Ops 2 on the hardest difficulty. I'm ok at the game, but definitely not good, so I spent many hours trying to do it. I was close to ending the game when my girlfriend at the time, came after school, she had had a awful day, basically her friend turned on her, so she wanted to play (she almost couldn't play FPSs) so I let her try. Every time she try to move she got killed, so I took the controller and ask for one life, and without her noticing... I changed the difficulty to recruit... Locking all the trophys for finishing the game in X difficulty, then in died and gave her the controller. I remember how happy it made me seeing how her face changed after she finished the area and started moking me. It was a really big sacrifice to me, and I couldn't let her now I did that.
@claravinas92656 жыл бұрын
Exactly, it wasnt for you, it was for her,
@pineappleguy74956 жыл бұрын
L'Homme Éveillé is there any truly altruistic action? No, but that kind of thing does get close I think
@vacri545 жыл бұрын
This is a story of an actual sacrifice, not a "I've completed the game, do I want my name to be in other people's games for a save file I might never use again". You fucked your run for someone halfway through your game, not after you'd just finished it. That's actual sacrifice.
@dnw0095 жыл бұрын
I was about to say like I would never do anything with the save file of a completed game. It is virtually worthless to me as the journey to getting to finish the game was the enjoyment and my memories of it. Giving the safe game up so that someone else can also have an easier time at the end boss? Sure why the heck not.
@mrmacken6 жыл бұрын
I had several of my friends criticize and laugh at me for choosing to delete my save file for the idea of helping someone. I still feel good about my choice.
@CShep-qe6vl3 жыл бұрын
those friends are bad ones
@Xenowave Жыл бұрын
You're a real one for that.
@JohnJRM6 жыл бұрын
So happy to see this moment get an EC episode, as it's what made this game special to me. See, I made the sacrifice, but at first I reasoned that I could do it without sacrifice because I had PS plus and my save was backed up. I told myself that if I wanted to go and get the rest of the trophies or see the parts that I had missed, I could just reload that back up and be set. This was right before I went to bed at around 2 in the morning. I barely slept that night. The question kept nagging at the back of my head of whether or not I would be willing to do that if my save wasn't backed up. I kept thinking about parallels of my actual life where I like to think of myself as someone who helps others whenever possible and puts others above myself when reasonable. But would I be willing to do that in my actual real life job if I was told that I had to sacrifice a 40 Hour Work Week worth of things that I had created in order to help someone out? Would I be okay with myself if I explicitly said no to someone who really needed my help, just because it would require a sacrifice of me that, in the end, probably wouldn't matter that much in the scope of my life? I came to the conclusion that I would not be okay with myself in that situation, and only after deleting my backup save did I return to cognitive equilibrium. I'm not sure any other game ever affected me to that degree.
@Michael-fd1gx6 жыл бұрын
Are you really helping someone or is the game tricking you into thinking you are. Because, how can anyone help you if it requires them to beat the final boss, which requires help to beat? Think about it, how did the first player to beat the final boss, do so when it cannot be done without the help of those that beat it, of which there were none?
@Chameleonred56 жыл бұрын
@Michael MAnville They were helped by the developers and playtesters, of which there are many but still a finite amount.
@youtoober20135 жыл бұрын
@@Michael-fd1gx I was going to say. It was the developers that designed the game. They circumvented it by design for others to be able to have the experience. @John Morelock I applaud your admiral attempts at cognitive equilibrium. Never easy, always worth it.
@sunbro90766 жыл бұрын
Good old Dark Souls. When you sacrifice your character to save the host. Jolly cooperation at its finest or something.
@E-102_Gamma6 жыл бұрын
gr8 b8 m8.
@C454D6 жыл бұрын
When a boss annoyed you. When it infuriated you. You then, now having risen above it seek to return the favour. I will still remember one sunbros desperate act, as my character fell (the host), he didn't give up and ran in and finished the last hit. Winning the fight. To you sunbro, I salute and I made sure to help 10 more before I proceeded onwards and see them win or at least make it that much easier for them. While it may not be a great sacrifice, it is a sacrifice of our time we could spend elsewhere. It isn't much, but not much can be all the world to others. Remembering that while this video does talk of sacrifice being something meaningful, always remember that even those sacrifices you make that have little impact on you, may be the biggest moment of someone elses life or playthrough.
@OuterRing6 жыл бұрын
The host is the reason why your there, if the host dies you gone anyway
@Carltoncurtis16 жыл бұрын
☀️PRAISE☀️
@insaincaldo6 жыл бұрын
I mean, yah..You do your sworn duty. Any sunbro who wouldn't die for the host should turn in their sun badge.
@TheGFFA5 жыл бұрын
The ending brought me to tears. I'm not too proud to say that I sobbed uncontrollably. As someone who suffers from severe depression, the ending spoke to me on a deeply personal level, in a way which no other form of media ever has. I'd already been studying Japanese for a year but the ending of the game gave me a goal: to become fluent, so that when I travel to Japan, I can personally thank the writer and composer for literally saving my life.
@MrFrig246 жыл бұрын
I supported this game on day 1 by buying it digital at full price and that is something I don't do often. The director of this game Yoko Taro said in a GDC conference something along the lines of him wanting to push his game beyond the boundaries of what we currently think a game should be or how a game should be. I think this idea is really necessary and support it to move the art of game creation forward and beyond the realm of just entertainment. In my opinion indies have been in the forefront regarding this aspect and I have tried to support them by buying digital copies of the games on different platforms, but, I also wanted to support a AAA title like this because I wanted to encourage big companies to take more risks with directors and developers with weird ideas like this one.
@alrightagain46056 жыл бұрын
Franklin Isalguez Agreed
@FaliusAren6 жыл бұрын
um It's a regular jRPG with Platinum combat and the occasional funky mechanic... Hardly revolutionary in any way.
@goldenlokosian37406 жыл бұрын
While that may be true, it doesn't make it any less cool for what it did do
@yaoipool83616 жыл бұрын
Extravagant Sobriquet no, it’s actually incredibly revolutionary if you actually play it. I’m guessing you haven’t, seeing as there’s no way you can play it as NOT see how it’s at least slightly revolutionary
@squidsona85094 жыл бұрын
I like to just say the end credits song is titled "the weight of the world" which just makes ending E even more beautiful
@johnnyvanheteren9636 жыл бұрын
This war of mine does the "give someone something to help them" a bit better, in that the medicine or food you give can be really important to you. Yes, they might return your kindness, but you may not live long enough to see it.
@Poki36 жыл бұрын
When I learned that the save will be deleted I declined, since I had some things to finish up (interestingly you have to confirm your intention to delete many, many times, but if you say no the game immediately is like "OK, got it"). But after I did the other side quests and achievements, and after playing the entire game over again (yup) I said Yes. ...you do get a new Title Screen though :P
@recon4416 жыл бұрын
Poki#3 I did the same thing. I couldn't go through with it the first time I encountered the credits. There was still so much I wanted to do so I went back to chapter select, did all the side quests, found the info caches, finished the DLC, and earned my platinum. Then I went back when I was ready to "die" to finish the credits and give myself up.
@gonzalodiaz62065 жыл бұрын
" But that's love, to give away everything, to sacrifice everything, without the slightest desire to get anything in return" - Albert Camus, The Just.
@harmonlanager26706 жыл бұрын
That means the first guy to offer himself up must have been a badass. He got through the final boss without the option to call in help.
@heinrichdubloon31396 жыл бұрын
U562 Uh, bug testers, quality control checkers, employees of Square Enix???
@anonymousanonymous95873 жыл бұрын
Him or her: All that hardness, it's impossible to do this unless you're a master like me! That's too hard. I have to do this. I have to give up my save file, so others weaker than me can see this.
@themaddoctor53042 жыл бұрын
@@anonymousanonymous9587 they must have been some of ultra Instinct level of gamer!
@MrBioWhiz6 жыл бұрын
I remember that moment where i finished that boss. I legitimately sat there afterwards and debated with myself if i could do what those players did for me. If I could be good. I couldnt. And i walked away from my computer, lit a cigarette, smoked it, and sat outside staring into the early morning night sky wondering who i really was for a further 15 minutes. Never before had a game quite managed to punch me in the gut like that. And that is why nier automata is one of my top 5 fave games of all time
@sisco51534 жыл бұрын
That was me as well besides the smoking part
@anitasarsazi7114 Жыл бұрын
U spoke my mind
@CSLucasEpic6 жыл бұрын
I would say that Wisecrack sent me, but I am subscribed already to both channels and I often watch videos from both so...
@jarnMod6 жыл бұрын
I cried for the first time in years when those guys offered the help. And when the game asked, I offered without a second thought. Maybe the way to encourage people to give, is for them to receive.
@fucknuggectmegee55796 жыл бұрын
Off haded but the "awaaaaaaaaaaayyyyy!!" Was so freaking cute omg
@canine82846 жыл бұрын
reminded me of another channel. "MAN ON THE INTERNET AWAAAAAAAAAYYYYYYYYYYY" go check em out they're doing a chrono trigger musical (and they did an undertale musical to great effect)
@christophpoll7846 жыл бұрын
I did not play that game (yet...) but I saw a let's play of it. The player (a girl, she liked 9s quite a lot) was totally.... broken by this question. I really want to play that game someday... maybe just to help someone else. Sometimes, I wish this game mechanic would be there for other rpg`s too.
@Not.a.bird.Person6 жыл бұрын
You may not realise this yet, but without this game, your life is incomplete. Play it.
@christophpoll7846 жыл бұрын
Kevin White just bought it yesterday... the first hour is already amazing...
@i.1476 жыл бұрын
The game really is worth every cent. It's just mindblowing in terms of storytelling, scenery, animation and gameplay.
@arcticgalegamer81395 жыл бұрын
I plan on getting the game this summer. Honestly. . . . maybe I'm too selfish. . . I want to say that without hesitation I'll help someone. . . But I don't know. . . Maybe once I actually get through the game I can.
@shibukamiya84286 жыл бұрын
NieR : Automata? You mean existentialist simulator?
@egoborder32036 жыл бұрын
goddamn I cried so hard at the ending of Nier: Automata and now I'm crying again watching this! NO REGRETS
@hitmanwolf6 жыл бұрын
...and that was the most genius "Anti-Piracy" thing ever. i wasn't able to beat it, cause i am a Pirate... no help for me. :C
@yukariyakumo83006 жыл бұрын
It's really disappointing that you pirated this game.
@hitmanwolf6 жыл бұрын
@Yukari is fine... after that ending, i went and brought it out of shame. Full-Price btw.
@yukariyakumo83006 жыл бұрын
Thats cool. In that case your pirating is fine with me.
@kerricaine6 жыл бұрын
same...i just thought it was really hard as an anti piracy measure, but then i read about the fight is supposed to go. that alone made me go buy it.
@TheGFFA6 жыл бұрын
Bravo.
@extrahistory6 жыл бұрын
This episode was inspired by a blog post James wrote for iThrive, if you want to read more about empathy in Nier Automata: ithrivegames.org/nier_automata_true_kindness_requires_sacrifice/
@ethand27316 жыл бұрын
This reminds me of Terry Town is Zelda: BotW. I helped them build the town not because I wanted a reward. But because I wanted to see a town build from the bottom up then as the NPC's there started to become a community I wanted to help even more.
@Quonzer6 жыл бұрын
Same here. Watching it grow and develop was fun. :3
@HebaruSan6 жыл бұрын
Alternately, a morality tale about the importance of off-site backups.
@AegixDrakan6 жыл бұрын
I feel like that also applies to the actual story of Nier Automata as well. XD
@bitemyshinymetalass73936 жыл бұрын
and the call me mad for having multiple backups for my po.. very important project files.
@CJWproductions6 жыл бұрын
It's interesting - at first, your androids can back up to the Bunker and be safe. Then, some nodes go down momentarily. Then the Bunker goes down and your lifeline is gone. Then the save files. Meanwhile, the machines are networked at first, but then the network goes down. This has a profound effect on the machines. Then Pascal's village loses their backups. And the Tower, too. In it you can find things that certainly seem like trophies for YOU and YOUR progress. And the Tower's AI tells you it's meaningless. It was all for nothing, and it'll all be erased so the cycle can restart. So really the whole game was preparing you for this moment and trying to get you ready to accept the annihilation of your progress.
@letsgococo51926 жыл бұрын
"'But why do you take in a stranger such as myself?' Said Taleswapper, 'when you don't know me to be good or evil?' 'Because once, we were strangers, and good folk took us in"' -Alvin Miller, Seventh Son
@Keln026 жыл бұрын
Nier Automata? Best game of 2017. Never had such an experience :) The ending in itself is a masterpiece.
@jonnrussell37666 жыл бұрын
I wasn't expecting to be impacted so strongly by what this games does, just by hearing about it in this video made me want to cry, I'm going to have to go by Nier: Automata as soon as possible.
@jonah53296 жыл бұрын
i baught it and for the later half of the game i had 100 plus cash it was pretty easy
@baldman38456 жыл бұрын
I highly recommend it. Currently it is my favorite game that I've played. It's not for everyone, and it does have its flaws, but it's a game everyone has to at least try.
@JM-vl3cy6 жыл бұрын
Play this game he's freakin awesome. Probably became my favorite game of all time, but for very personal reasons that you may end up not understand or just not being impressed with. So do not hype yourself too much about it to avoid any dissapointment (maybe it won't fit your definition of a good game, who knows), but at least get to try it and see by yourself
@santi35746 жыл бұрын
It made me cry 9 fucking times. NINE!
@recon4416 жыл бұрын
I cried when I played the game and still cried watching this and Wisecrack's video almost a year later 😭 it's too beautiful to miss
@ArthurTaytSohn6 жыл бұрын
Well, the Forest King was a good exemple of kindness. He sacrificed himself to give his parts so other machines could live. He never expected anything in return...
@rowtow136 жыл бұрын
This was such an amazing moment. But it's still smoke and mirrors. "Helping" just means someone sees your name and message. If you don't sacrifice your save data, that doesn't mean someone's going to be left hanging in the future. Also, you probably have PS+, which means your save data is probably backed up and you can just redownload it.
@jh-wq5qn6 жыл бұрын
rowtow13 if everyone took that route though and assumed somebody else will pick up the slack, you're then creating the problem, and some other player would eventually indeed lose and not have any backup. Its not even saying one way is better than another, its just asking if when you played the game, did the meaning you found along your journey make you decide the sacrifice is worth it or not? Also when something is deleted purposefully from the ps4 hard drive, I believe it deletes in the could as well.
@vegetalss46 жыл бұрын
No, it wouldn't that's rowtow13's point. Even if nobody, _ever_, choose to help the game would send ships with names from the list of pregame names it included when it was released, just like it did for whoever was the first to get that far. Nowadays it might choose a name from the list of people that have already helped once instead. Because of course it does that, several helpers dies each time on the way to each victory, if the help was actually limited it would have run out a long time ago. You do lose something, the memento of your playthrough that your savegame represents, but you doing so only affect the name attached to the help other players receive not whether they receive it or not.
@Yenastuundepaspris556 жыл бұрын
''We are stuck in a cycle, Other Self.''
@BenGJerome6 жыл бұрын
I'm a huge fan of both of your channel and was thrilled to see both your videos about the same topic and that you guys did a collab. Love it!!
@Darasilverdragon6 жыл бұрын
Man, it is SO hard to get through this episode without tearing up
@seanmurphy34306 жыл бұрын
I feel like saying "this doesn't have narrative spoilers, but it does have mechanical spoilers" is one of those statements that reductively divides games into separate "gameplay" and "narrative" pieces, despite the fact that in a game like NeiR: Automata, that distinction is profoundly arbitrary. The moment you talk about IS as much a story moment as a gameplay one; you've just presented it without context. I mean, I don't personally care about spoilers in general, but I think that spoiler tag was pretty misleading to those who do.
@Gef1056 жыл бұрын
Well the moment they are talking about is completly gameplay...there is no story(related to the game story), or do you consider credits story? There is some narrative happening but is your own and other player's. I thought the spoiler warning was well placed, and that they didn't reveal anything about the story really.
@svenskapankako6 жыл бұрын
Yeah absolutely, I was wondering which "last boss" he was talking about. I had played the first ending. But it was not, so now I know basically how the story will be when I get to the true final boss. Which was not what I wanted. Hopefully I'll have forgotten this when I get to that ending. (It will take me a while)
@owbu6 жыл бұрын
They said they would spoil a mechanic and then talkes about a mechanic. How is that misleading?
@rgrimund24686 жыл бұрын
Sean Murphy, that's really a sign of solid game design. The mechanics and narrative should be interlinked. I've garnered no information from the story, but it does give me an idea of what NIER is. That's something no other final boss fight description has ever done for me without needing far more context that would spoil the game.
@Msoulwing6 жыл бұрын
@Swedishpancakes This "boss" has almost nothing to do with the actual story of the game. It's more of a bonus segment.
@greensmurf2215 жыл бұрын
"Emotions are prohibited."
@Glockenspheal6 жыл бұрын
Hmmm, this two videos just tell me something, I'm not the kind of person that empathizes through video-games, or at least, in-game characters, because I know they are meaningless, however, if I'd played this game, you bet I'd give my save-file, no backup either, which leads me to thinking, is there a way to make a completely artificial NPC worthy of empathy?
@onrev6 жыл бұрын
There is a wonderful mind body philosophical experiment you can do that calls into question why you place such an importance on humans/biological creatures (not sure where you stand specifically) as the sole arbiters of consciousness. I encourage you to do reading on the topic and a lot of it is touched on by the "Chinese room thought experiment" that you can use as a jumping off point. But know that it is very nuanced and i'm only touching on a SMALL portion of the implications that thought experiment wants to examine. What the thought experiment forces you to conclude (or at least one of it's solutions) is that a room full of people who speak Chinese, can collectively translate English into Chinese, but you would not say "the room, understands Chinese". in which case when extrapolated to AI, while the individual algorithms and programs that translate one word to another as a input/output machine, the machine itself can never truly understand Chinese. This is a solution alot of people intuitively arrive at, but you are given pause when you realize the same can be said about you and neurons, or your brain activity. So then we explore the other path, that consciousness is an emergent property of otherwise understood phenomenon, and that we do indeed say "the room understands Chinese". Which means you must accept that, a robot who can, by all intents and purposes, emulate human emotion to a near perfect or indistinguishable degree, will then be merited ALL of the same affordances we give our fellow man. We are forced to acknowledge that even if we PROGRAM or hard code (or much more likely use a neural network to teach it) each input/output, if it is indistinguishable from a human response, then it becomes or gains this nebulous notion of consciousness. I Cannot stress enough that I am a layman delving into topics well above my pay grade. I encourage you to read the literature directly or at least from someone more qualified then me. But it is a fascinating starting off point if you're interested in the topic.
@genybr6 жыл бұрын
Why do you empathises players, but not NPCs? Probably because they are basically immortal and can't suffer enough. They have no future for smiles and their tears are nothing. But hey, in the VNs you can feel empathy to the characters, even in GTA I you will feel RAGE for the Diver from the VC1. Probably live emotions is the key?
@Glockenspheal6 жыл бұрын
Thanks for all the input so far, soon after I posted my comment I started thinking back to NPCs or characters that have made me empathize for them, there are quite a few actually, so far I've seen that having either a strong bond or a relatable scene really helps which comes as quite obvious to be honest, but even then, why do I feel empathy for a select few while the vast majority I don't really care that much? I'm gonna reflect on this more, I'll post my thoughts then.
@sophiejones77276 жыл бұрын
Depends: do you empathize with movie and book characters? If you do, then you will eventually encounter a video game character you can empathize with. The difference is mainly in how hard video game writing is, and the fact that most video game characters are not that well written. If you don't empathize with movie or book characters, then you will likely never empathize with a video game character. Your brain just doesn't work that way.
@Wolfwood20576 жыл бұрын
I feel like the answer is: No, not without installing malware onto your computer. I feel Undertale got close to it, giving people characters they loved and the idea that if they went too far, they might never see those people again. The problem being basically....you can still find the save data, even if it's hidden on your computer. You can delete everything that makes the game know of the bad things you've done. There's still a reset button even when the game tells you there really isn't. The idea that the game can 'rob' you of your happy ending goes away when you find out you can get around it. So, basically...without a game that went into malicious territories, it's be difficult to impossible to make a truly empathetic NPC. Because if you really feel bad about your decision you can always reset and start over, no matter what the game tells you.
@GoreSpattered5 жыл бұрын
I beat the game today and left it with a heavy heart, not only for my save but with an understanding that all of those ships were people who did the same. Thank you all. I know it's just a game but it feels like it meant so much more.
@DKCR646 жыл бұрын
This is one of my favourite games, just for how different it was in its attitude towards 'what makes a game'. The parts you brought up were especially meaningful I found, as well as (MINOR SPOILER ALERT) little pieces of dialogue scattered throughout such as when the woman in the resistance camp complains about the pains of having to retrieve your old body once you've died. It manages to connect perfectly with what you as a player have to do, as well as remain completely in-universe due to what the characters have to do once their memories have been re-uploaded. I desperately want to see more games take this attitude towards their storylines, it would make for some incredible games.
@FaliusAren6 жыл бұрын
There's an attitude toward "what makes a game"? Nier: Automata pretty much plays the "being a game" card straight if you ask me
@DKCR646 жыл бұрын
Perhaps I worded this a little badly. After all, Automata never denies being a game or shies away from it. The final words are proof enough of that. What I meant is the game manages to tie the actions that characters have to perform with those that a player has to perform. Without directly breaking the fourth wall in quests or most of the gameplay, it still draws your attention to the fact that your actions are being mirrored in the game, creating a state of semi self-awareness at times. As well as this, I think it plays nicely into the same sort of genre as works such as Bladerunner, which I personally enjoy as a concept. The progression of black and white good vs. bad which slowly merges over time makes for good stories.
@metametodo6 жыл бұрын
I watched the wisecrack one first, I found it deep and thoughtful, I was already touched a bit, but then I came to this one, and started feeling emotional right from the beginning, halfway I was in tears. Damn. I wish I could play this game, such a strong philosophical content, with a really deep meaning. I'm really crying.
@Athalwolf136 жыл бұрын
Is it odd that I get very, very emotional when I remember? Especially the song? I love how this is framed...Not only did you endure for the sake of 3 characters who you played, saw their experiences, their struggles and if you watch the YORHA stage plays even their reason why they are so apathetic to this all, so filled with rage and regret.... I genuinely kinda want to replay Nier Automata, because no, i didnt see everything yet...but...i want to have the three to have their chance. A chance to live in a better world.
@holyflutterofgod6 жыл бұрын
I don't think it's odd at all, I absolutely get the same feeling.
@ihappy16 жыл бұрын
I loved it, both the words of encouragement from other players and how the song gets a choir behind it really made a single player game feel communal. Also if you haven't yet go check out the lyrics to "Weight of the World," they encapsulate 2B's character and story so well
@Athalwolf136 жыл бұрын
Oh i know Weight of the World though i can't listen to it without crying.
@dafaqu6946 жыл бұрын
ihappy1 each of the weigh of the world represent the character The english was 2B, the japanese was 9S, and the chaos was A2
@velo8366 жыл бұрын
My “message of encouragement” in Nier was a sex joke, I hope i helped someone out.
@SebastianHaban6 жыл бұрын
"Seeing your playstyle made my boner die as well", "Now you're as cold and unmovable as my ex in bed", "This boss is as hard as finding a gf if you are looking like me", "Do you know what's in my pants and as hard as this bossfight right now?" I'll lead myself out....
@Daisho326 жыл бұрын
Doing this thing at the end of the game (I'm trying not to spoil it) is also a good way to say farewell, have closure. The game is asking us to make the ultimate sacrifice a player could make, and it's a great way to move on. NieR Automata was the greatest video game I played in a very long time, but there are other games to discover. That said, I don't know if any game will passionate me that much in the future.
@AegixDrakan6 жыл бұрын
That one moment took the game from a fairly competent 8/10 to me and bumped it up to a 9. It was genuinely clever. It's really rare for a game to really do something that affects me on a personal and emotional level, and this one delivered in a truly great way. spoilery bits below - - - - - I did the thing. I hesitated for a moment, but was like "I'm done with the experience. I've seen all I need to see. And this? This means something. Sign me up." Interestingly, as I was going through the game, I was thinking about how refreshing it would be to see someone get shown in no uncertain terms "Everything is meaningless", only to respond with "So what? I make my own meaning" and go on to prove that. And then that segment happened and I realized...That I could be that person. I have barely the slightest hint of regret (there was one thing I had left I could have done that I'll likely never get to do now), but I'm glad I did it :). So...I guess all that's left to say is "[I thought it was hard too.] [But in the end,] [fight for what you believe in]." And if you see my name show up somewhere unexpected, you're welcome. ;)
@w.kuiper3166 жыл бұрын
I think I did, Can't go back and check though.
@abbysaito53486 жыл бұрын
Still lurking streams for my 4 save files...
@thelneffableus32366 жыл бұрын
Why not play it again?
@jmalmis6 жыл бұрын
Near A tomato
@Duskpixie6 жыл бұрын
It's funny, in RPGs I play an evil character more often than not, trying to be as villainous and demonic as I can and seeing just how far I can push it, but when I'm playing MMOs, where I'm dealing with other real people, I ALWAYS play a healer. I wonder what that says about me
@seanmurphy34306 жыл бұрын
Kalameet is judging you, Dan.
@wu1ming9shi6 жыл бұрын
Goddammit! Just by imagining that possibility of doing this if i had the game almost made me cry.
@OnLyStrahl6 жыл бұрын
Nier:Automata = Best singleplayergame I ever played.
@FullCircleTZ6 жыл бұрын
I get chills every time I see or hear the ending. Thanks for making this video.
@terosscrimmypub60596 жыл бұрын
but thicc robots tho
@TheGermanoidProject6 жыл бұрын
So if you play this single player game without an internet connection, you are fked at this point. Great news. But on the other side, you can backup your save file. It's just a folder. That's how data work.
@the113826 жыл бұрын
I don't get that sacrifice part(but then again, I haven't even played the game), can't PC players back up their save file to prevent their save file from being deleted? It is a regular practice for some players.
@CtisGaming6 жыл бұрын
It's also at the end credits. The story has many points-of-no-return where you can't previous quests and content. Restarting from nothing is your only option anyway since you can't go back from the ending tower or choose which campaign to continue from after completing the game.
@yukariyakumo83006 жыл бұрын
You could do that but you would only really be cheating yourself.
@android19willpwn6 жыл бұрын
they can, but playing Nier on PC is enough of a sacrifice in itself that it's kind of a wash.
@GoldenMechaTiger6 жыл бұрын
Android 19 Why is that?
@mrrodgers06 жыл бұрын
TheHermago Poor optimization, and the keyboard+mouse controls are clunky, making it miserable to play if you don't own a controller.
@EsporHB2 жыл бұрын
I kind of ruined part of the sacrifice for me because at that point I knew which end would trigger the data loss and saved it to the end. I still lost all my progress and feel sad about it. But it would have hit me harder if I didn't know anything about that.
@jonasmemborg41965 жыл бұрын
There was this one time in WoW, when a new player approached me, asking for a few silver to buy some armor on the auction house, which he thought looked cool. - During my own earlier days with WoW (late Vanilla, early TBC), I fell in love with this armor set, the Overlord plate set. It took me a long time to gather all the different pieces, and sometimes I needed just that few silver for a piece of the armor on the auction house. Certain pieces were really rare, and having little luck with drops, I saved up coin. I struggled through and got the complete set. - In that moment, as this guy asked me for a hand, I was reminded of how far I'd come, how this used to be me, and how often I'd been just a minute late before an armor piece was gone. Smiling, I thought back on all those adventures I'd had, and proceeded to give the guy 100g, wishing him memorable adventures in WoW as well.
@doodoothedishonored90933 жыл бұрын
I hope I’m not the only one here who just sat for 5 straight minutes just giving good to the hobos in Skyrim’s holds, not because I think the gift of charity is good, but just because, I don’t know why, I grew up in a somewhat wealthy home, upper middle class, so I can’t relate to the beggars issues, but I do something to help with them, I don’t know what this is, I wasn’t raised told to donate, I just did.
@obblivionkr6 жыл бұрын
God, I actually got teary eyed in this video because I was reminded of the moment when help swooped in.
@Kanrail6 жыл бұрын
An Extra Credits episode that isn't defending the shady, shitty practices of the AAA game space. Thanks, and please keep them up. No need to try and defend the undefendable unless you're playing devil's advocate.
@mgraham01606 жыл бұрын
Great, now I gotta play the game again. And bawl my eyes out. Again. Unless I eat the fish.
@davec16 жыл бұрын
Kindness, even when it costs nothing, is valuable and meaningful. Sacrifice is no necessary requirement of kindness. Equating sacrifice to something being meaningful is a romantic notion, like the silly notion that artists must suffer in order to produce true art. By that I don't mean to devalue sacrifice, of course, but let's not devalue "inexpensive" kindness either.
@lostbutfreesoul6 жыл бұрын
What I find interesting is this: When you pressed yes, you are chemically rewarded and richly so. When you pressed yes, you are able to watch the delete occur and carry memory of it away. This creates an interesting little problem, as chemical reward and memory are ultimately personal things. Pressing 'Yes' could be to trigger our own brain's reward systems, and nothing more. That moment to reflect on the ability to replay the game would even strengthen this reward system when we did press 'yes,' knowing we might never be able to reach this point again due to time restraints. I was going to ignore this but felt the need to add it: When you pressed yes, you knew you could tell others about it Not only can we can go on to proudly state 'we did this sacrifice,' but there is a period to add a message prior to the choice. While I am sure it is something only those with spoilers would know going in, that it occurs after leaving a message would still allow for a 'I was here' moment. This begs the question; how many people clicked 'yes' knowing very well they can tell others they pressed yes? Yet, even if it is nothing more then 'Chemical, Boast and Memory' trigger, it is presented sooooo very well! BRAVO.... now off to watch Wisecrack.
@timberlord16376 жыл бұрын
well, every single person who does something does it with the intent of their brain. so even if they dont get recognition from others, everyone will atleast get a little reward from themselves. which is perfectly fine and understandable considering that as long as you know that you did good and well, recognition from others come second or later.
@notsosmolkween14335 жыл бұрын
This gives an additional layer of understanding of the ending for me. Originally me and a friend did think about it being about cooperation and being selfless but then i heard how yoko taro admitted that the ending had been inspired by a coca cola commercial that wanted to inspire unity and understanding despite racial differences and difficulty. This was during one of the recent GDC sessions he took part in. Its somewhere online. He wanted to make a game mechanic that would make everyone work together and help each other because ultimately, we are all the same: we are all humans and we are all players struggling to finish. Its also very humbling... By making it about sacrifice by being selfless, its still about feeling good about yourself in helping others. Empathy is beyond that and not about yourself at all. While its hard to teach, sometimes debated to be impossible to teach empathy, if things we consume from the media as well as discussions continue to expose us to the idea and how it really is, at least it would make people aware of it and try to practice it in their lives.
@justinsmith41166 жыл бұрын
This war of mine?
@Vedrlaufnir6 жыл бұрын
Ok I might be some kind of hollow monster or something cause in my case there was no kindness, it was more an act of frustration. First of I tried the end credits fight over and over on my own at least 20 times, cause I just couldn't imagine a game having a "battle" that would become impossible if you went offline; after so many attempts and getting tired of trying, I just gave up and accepted the help just because I had enough and wanted to carry on. Then the game asks if you want to help others with said risks in mind, and I said yes just cause I couldn't care less about what would happen to my game. Even now I'm wondering what's going to happen if one day, when the servers have gone offline, any of us wants to play the game and gets to THAT moment. I'd also like to point that I did not like the hacking minigame, which didn't help at all with that ending credits sequence.
@owbu6 жыл бұрын
wait..what would I want with a save file after I beat the game? Is there a reason you cant finish everything you want to before the final boss? I´ve never started an end mission before I am done with the game.
@briant17846 жыл бұрын
In nier automata specifically, there are multiple points where you can lock yourself completely out of content by progressing the story before you've completed every quest available. What seems to be "just another story quest" (especially early on in the game) can lock you out of content with no way to ever get back besides starting over. At no point does the game tell you something is a point of no return.
@DemagogueBibleStudy6 жыл бұрын
+Brian Talbot That's not entirely true. A chapter select feature is unlocked after the player reaches their third main ending.
@Mordalon6 жыл бұрын
At the point this ending becomes available, there’s a lot of stuff you can still do, so you are potentially missing out on a bunch more content.
@i.1476 жыл бұрын
And route A shares its sidequests with route B. so if you skipped a quest during route A, you can still do it during route B. And yeah, there's a chapter select unlocked after ending C. So no worry. I personally finished 100% of the quests, even if I missed some of them during route A and B.
@NuculearFallout16 жыл бұрын
This actually almost made me cry like twice man
@marcpuzon6 жыл бұрын
Other Dan placeholders will make this REALLY confusing for the people who haven't played Nier Automata but decided to watch this anyway.
@Poki36 жыл бұрын
Eh, they got the point across. All the better for people that decide to play Nier after since even if they remember this it'll be vague at best.
@LemonMoon6 жыл бұрын
I haven't played or watched the game, but it made sense to me.
@lordzaboem6 жыл бұрын
Far too few KZbinrs collaborate on anything. Due to the business structure, the cultural obsession with continuous growth, and the limited quantity of eyeballs out there, it's more of a competitive than cooperative in the community of KZbinrs. I am surprised and pleased to hear that a collaboration happened here. Although I have never played the game and very much doubt I will ever have time to do so, I found this video fascinating.
@DJ5un5 жыл бұрын
No lie, that part of nier made me cry
@fracture40473 жыл бұрын
I made the sacrifice when the game asked for it. And this was when I was convinved that thisbwas the best game I have ever played. But man, it really hurt when, after I begged for months to get my friend to play the game, they decided to keep their data in the end. They ,ever went back to finish their side quests or to get the platinum trophy. They just kept it for themselves. Man, it just felt so weird thinking, how could you not do the same for others
@annieoplis74586 жыл бұрын
GENERAL KENOBI!
@FENomadtrooper6 жыл бұрын
A surprise to be sure, but a welcome one.
@colin-kun36114 жыл бұрын
I never played Nier but hell thats definitely a hard decision to make.
@blacksun546 жыл бұрын
orrr you just make a copy of your save file (if you play on pc)
@Zlyde0076 жыл бұрын
congratulations, you missed the point.
@blacksun546 жыл бұрын
I disagree,is creating a backup of your save not a choice you can make? does the act of saving your save file past that kind of decision not make a statement about that person their desires and motivations? t osay that that's missing the point I feel is negating that other choices exist and that people aren't just black and white.
@Zlyde0076 жыл бұрын
blacksun54 you missed the point again. key word "sacrifice".
@Zlyde0076 жыл бұрын
blacksun54 oh yes it does say a thing about their desires and motivations. its that those people are not willing to help others if they have to sacrifice or lose something.
@blacksun546 жыл бұрын
I agree, but I got a completely different message from the game. there are millions of players playing the game and if even a fraction of those sacrifice their save data there are tons of people who have helped. but I don't feel that a sacrifice is necessary, they already play with the idea in the beginning of the game you die and get downloaded into a new body. Immediately the sacrifice of the main characters is rendered pointless, and to step away from the game a bit recently there has been a ton of analysis into the heroic sacrifice and more often than not there is a safer faster or more efficient way of getting the job done, the sacrifice in and of itself is pointless.
@Nikolai45675 жыл бұрын
I didn’t do it. Because you don’t actually help anyone, if no one would do it, the ships would still appear because purely logically the equation does not add up otherwise, the DEVELOPERS could not risk to truly rely on human kindness. And that is why your sacrifice is truly meaningless, not only in a cosmical sense, but even for any person at all. It’s a ruse, a lie.
@Mad-Box6 жыл бұрын
So. Who sacrificed at the end of the game? I did. And i have no regrets.
@samcherry47416 жыл бұрын
Mad Box I honestly feel like I would have felt less satisfied if I didn't
@Not.a.bird.Person6 жыл бұрын
I did too and I have no regrets. Never before did any game come close to make me feel this good about losing 50+ hrs of saved gameplay.
@insertname16676 жыл бұрын
I did but I had been habitually backing up my save anyway so not only did I help someone I was able to still keep my save and when ever I feel like it, I just sacrifice it again and redownload.
@Zlyde0076 жыл бұрын
Dante McMahon but that isnt a meaningful act. it just means you will only help others, if you dont lose anything.
@johngard156 жыл бұрын
I did, and in my second playthrough I messaged the name of the player that sacrificed for me to thank him. Also, it doesn't let you sacrifice a second time
@biggerdoofus6 жыл бұрын
Correction: "saves". The game doesn't just delete one save game, it deletes all of them, and I think that's a major problem with this way of going about it. The game is littered with reference to family and kindness, yet makes no attempt to discern whether your choice to help a complete stranger is also going to sacrifice the work of someone else just because they happen to be sharing your console. Also, I think the definition of kindness put forth here is over-emphasizing permanent costs. There's nothing less kind about putting preparation in to make sure you don't need to sacrifice much before helping someone in need. On the contrary, I think those that do the most good tend to be the ones who know how to keep doing good because they don't overexert themselves. Bill and Melinda Gates come to mind.
@Churundala5 жыл бұрын
now i'm feeling guilty for saving my data
@hancocks38716 жыл бұрын
I have been subscribed to both Wisecrack and Extra Credits for at least a year now. Great video. This video reminded me of the "Writing on Games" Nier Automata video. Have you ever reached out to him. He has some quality content.
@hancocks38716 жыл бұрын
and quick question, when will the next upload on the Extra Plays channel be?
@Wisewolf_of_Avalon6 жыл бұрын
My problem with the logic of that Boss fight is that it's not realistic. For me, the sacrifice of my save data is meaningful if I'm able to clear it without help. That means I'd have contributed +1 to the system. Logically, since nearly everyone needs help, there should be no one left to offer help. Even if I went back to beat that boss fight alone and didn't have to "sacrifice" anyone else's data, my personal contribution would still be -3 accounting for the saves I lost beating it with help. I know I'm skipping past the overall meaning of that choice, but it's just my take. For me it feels like a cheat. Just like how I "wasted" those other people's saves.
@alexgiovannini58376 жыл бұрын
I feel like I have to play this game. I literally just cried with happiness watching this video
@XzaroX2 жыл бұрын
This is why you should do all the side quests BEFORE you finish the game. Then deletion of saves will be pretty meaningless. I always do all side content first. Or you could just cheat the system by backing up your saves and experiencing both lol.
@satyasyasatyasya57466 жыл бұрын
So, i'd love to play this game, but I feel I wouldn't be playing a game, but trying to unpick and navigate some eccentric director's mind, and it bothers me somehow...I'm kinda avoiding it now.
@jazzmaster9096 жыл бұрын
Satyasya Satyasya Play it. you are missing out
@youtoober20135 жыл бұрын
I know what you mean, but in the end, it's a game, get lost in it, it's designed for you to make the experience your own.
@samanderson70576 жыл бұрын
The concept that it isn't helpful or 'good' unless you suffer for it is troubling. Self-flagellation is not 'good' unless it meaningfully aids others. Any message of the form 'you must bleed this much to demonstrate self-sacrifice' implies that being nice requires a substantial amount of self-harm. That, in turn, risk confusion between the idea of helping other with the idea of hurting yourself. That nicely gives rise and power to the argument that "good people are only working out their own psychological needs." The 'heroes are out for themselves' argument turns morality into an ouroboros without any real basis. That is demonstrably untrue, but there is no need to hand the self-justification out. What if instead of the normal trivial gold to beggars, the player was asked to give a percent of all future earnings in either money or experience to the digital beggars; would that be enough? No it would not, because either it would be punishing players for being nice and get hit by the family values groups or act as a reason to explore all that 'extra' content. What if content was actually cut off? Cut-off in the sense that no profile from that game could access it. Again, no because players buy games to play them and the family values groups would be displeased. The consumer protection groups would also have words for the developer. Games are strange in that making a game harder rewards the player and making the game easier rewards the player. Longer and shorter play-throughs are both rewards. I suppose sacrificing graphics might actually be a way to punish players, especially if the extra, freed up computing power was used for some good end.
@robinvandemaele34306 жыл бұрын
How about copying your save beforehand?
@JM-vl3cy6 жыл бұрын
you can't, the game deletes ALL the saved files you have. There's probably a way of preventing this outside the game (with backups and stuff), but it's impossible in-game
@robinvandemaele34306 жыл бұрын
I see, but I was thinking in a way of saving, closing the game, backing u^the save on a usb drive, picking the help option (wich'd delete the save on the hard drive) and then plugging back in the usb and copying it onto the hard drive so you'd have the best of both worlds.
@AndresLionheart6 жыл бұрын
Yeah, you can back up the save before going into the true ending, finish it and then restore your savefile. You won't have the true ending done, but you can still keep playing and do other stuff.
@insertname16676 жыл бұрын
AndresLionheart not to mention with the backup save you can keep continuously sacrificing and helping others.
@Michael-fd1gx6 жыл бұрын
Are you really helping someone or is the game tricking you into thinking you are. Because, how can anyone help you if it requires them to beat the final boss, which requires help to beat? Think about it, how did the first player to beat the final boss, do so when it cannot be done without the help of those that beat it, of which there were none?
@lorecraftlp61556 жыл бұрын
The thing is, even in real life, helping someone else is never a purely selfless act. If it was, we never would have developed the trait in the first place. Helping others survive at cost to us is bad for survival. We always get something back, even if it is just the endorphine feedback loop that male us 'feel good'. Often, we get more than that, too - a contact, a reference, a kind word, help in the future, a favor owed. If nothing else, you could tell a potential future partner about it over drinks, and make yourself look better. But really, this is not a bad thing. Religions and philosophies have been harnessing this concept of reciprocity from the dawn of mankind, and maybe earlier. Next time you thing "there's nothing in it for me", yes there is. Just ride the endorphines you get in exchange. Ideally, we can make an upward spiral of endorphines and favors that can benefit everyone. At least until that one jerkass messes up the entire sistem with selfishness.
@collindippel96366 жыл бұрын
One of my favorite games
@Rayfireful6 жыл бұрын
"Can you help this old man to deliver this message to..." (Dragon roar be heard) "(Same old man)...Never should have come here!!
@johngard156 жыл бұрын
While I really like this video and plan on trying to work true sacrifice and empathy into my D&D games, I'm still not 100% sold on the empathetic message of Nier: Automata. Kindness and empathy are as equally meaningless as cruelty and callousness in the framework of its nihilistic themes. The game is basically mocking you for thinking that your sacrifice has any greater meaning. In essence, it is saying "you think you're a good person and you can make this real sacrifice, but any significance you place on that sacrifice is an artificial construct of your mind." I still did it, and it was one of the most transcendent moments in my gaming history, but I don't think I necessarily displayed empathy. What I felt was a deep embrace of the pointless struggle to create meaning in a meaningless world both in the game and in life; it was the most profound way a video game could convey that message I've ever seen.
@Michael-fd1gx6 жыл бұрын
Are you really helping someone or is the game tricking you into thinking you are. Because, how can anyone help you if it requires them to beat the final boss, which requires help to beat? Think about it, how did the first player to beat the final boss, do so when it cannot be done without the help of those that beat it, of which there were none?
@CJWproductions6 жыл бұрын
John Gardner To me, it displayed a profound sense of solidarity in the face of the existential problem. Like, there's no greater meaning than what we make, and we're as capable of evil as we are of good, but in the end, we can stick together and help one another. We can. And I chose to. I don't think it's a 1:1 representation of reality. I'm not planning to donate all my money to charity or something like that. But I can keep my eyes open for things I *can* do, and I think it's a good message to carry with me.
@jorgepeterbarton6 жыл бұрын
A Nietzschian idea of futility of progress? you sacrifice for nothing? is it self-negating because on completion there is only an end, so you sacrifice for others' completion of the game. and a self-negating outcome of exchanging something of value, for a reward to feel good? the point of the game is a struggle so Amor Fati, love the struggle and suffering, why sacrifice to make it easy!
@youtoober20135 жыл бұрын
Downer much?
@Chocohalation6 жыл бұрын
I haven't played the game, but the NieR: Automata system feels flawed. Challenge is part of the game. It's not necessarily a good or a bad thing, it just depends on what you want. By making another person's game last challenging, sure, you might help out a guy who wants it , but you could also help someone who couldn't care less. I just can't see how this would help much at all.