Commander Myths BUSTED: What You're Missing

[@turkeyrotmg9635]

Beezy...hiding a grave titan in that "brace" of yours just to secretly put into your hand is breaking the spirit of commander don't you think?

[@NitpickingNerds]

The only things that need to be braced are my opponents for this Grave Titan

[@kwonsolo]

Guys you can’t say ‘Gitaxian probe is great! You’re playing one less card!’ And say ‘Deck thinning is not relevant’ at the same time 😂

[@NitpickingNerds]

We like Gitaxian Probe because it’s zero mana to draw a card, trigger minor effects, and gain information. Everything else is bonus!

[@toddprit]

I love you guys but MAN do I dislike the cut aways to other camera angles. It doesn't work. Also the camera quality on Mia being different is jarring, at the very least all cameras should be the same and they don't look the same and it's distracting. I know you want to add "production value" and spice it up but the one camera, one angle way you've been doing it is much better and more comfortable to watch. Just my opinion.

[@gabrielkopp9248]

For what it’s worth, I’m not a fan of the extra camera angles. It’s not necessarily a terrible thing, but I don’t feel like it adds much at all. Keep up the great work!

[@gamesforjake1]

I like them personally

[@ticklemeozmo]

Unfortunately, I'm a little further down the road on them than you. I actually find them jarring and displeasing. I don't think this is a case of "we're trying something, it'll get better", I think I am reacting this way because it's a forced "single talking head to the camera" cut-in on what is a chill "back-and-forth co-hosted" podcast.

[@aselbst]

Kozilek isn't a great example of "dies to doom blade" because it draws a bunch of cards on cast. The whole "dies to doom blade" meme came out of the idea that your creature need to do *something* immediately--on cast, on ETB, or have haste--to be good. If you think that's "dies to doom blade" is wrong because some creatures like Kozilek are good even when there's removal, you're actually agreeing with the point, not debunking it--the conclusion being playing creature that get you immediate value. I actually feel like you guys make the classic "dies to doom blade" argument a lot. It's the reason you find Sheoldred, Whispering One so underwhelming, and it's the same argument as your making fun of "just wait until I untap" cards.

[@Shimatzu95]

The "everythung needs to do something immideately" mentality is exactly how yugioh powercreep made it a 3 turn(not round) game

[@erichunt1974]

If there's one myth that's true it's that you can tap Krenko Mob Boss to create a 1/1 red goblin creature token for every goblin you control

[@N4chtigall]

Deck thinning is a thing that have to be considered in landfall decks because I guess those are the only ones which are really affected by it. Ramping 5-10 lands out of your deck can really make a difference.

[@ZeIose]

Yes. But it’s a byproduct. Not the goal.

[@jaycue7641]

I think one of the less thought about benefits of a Landfall deck is that you get to shuffle a lot. And I know that may sound weird but hear me out. If you want to find a specific card and its all the way at the bottom, you will get more chances to possibly float it to the top. Fetching the lands out might help a bit, but not as much.

[@markrode7245]

or a land tax thinning 3 lands EVERY turn. as long as you didnt go first and at least 1 of your opponets hits land drops or ramps.

[@ajohnymous282]

@@jaycue7641if you’re shuffling properly you are just as likely to put a card you need on the bottom as you are to put it at the top. So shuffling a lot is not a factor

[@jaycue7641]

@ajohnymous282 that's debatable. Shuffling consistently can still give you a higher probability of seeing card that you want

[@llAlukall]

I found deck thinning to be relevant in regards to only one card, and even then only as a side effect in a mono white deck. Land Tax moves so many basic plains from my deck to my hand that I both always have at least one and barely ever draw one. Love Land Tax.

[@Thatbiddyboi]

Yes! Land tax is almost mandatory in a WUBAR deck

[@markdziamski4859]

Underrated cards. Arboreal Grazer and Elvish Pioneer. Turn one, Forests, tap for one of the mentioned, put another land in tapped, Flare of Cultivation, sac creature to cast for free, search 2 basics, one in tapped and one in hand to guaranteed land drop for turn 2. Now you gave 4 mana available in land, no bolt the bird, no Vandalblast the Sol Ring

[@PeterGast24]

putting cards in your deck to combo with flare of cultivation is a bit sus

[@markdziamski4859]

@ why is that. It doesn’t just go with flare. They also are one mana ramp spells

[@TubbyBubbleLove42]

To me lightning rod cards aren't cards put in the deck specifically to bait removal, but the card that happens to be in my hand that is less important than another card in my hand at that moment, so I use it to try and soak removal.

[@svensonb2118]

Retaliatory aggression is pretty good understood in psychology and game design. And yes the main point is that players affected to not play optimal. This doesn't mean they straight up focus their target, but it affects their decisions. Claiming it doesn't exist because it would be irrational or not fun is errrrm pretty bold.

[@TSGypside]

@18:33 I keep a "pettiness" token that I place on top of my deck in those situations as a visual reminder for that player that I will make a petty attack back at them at some point as retribution for that random 2 damage at the start of the game.

[@hansmelby5080]

“‘Who is Number 1?’. ‘You are, Number 6.’”

[@dirty_osiris973]

"Your mouth is writing a check that your deck can't cash." 😅😂 This made me laugh because it's so true

[@jacobtrillo6461]

Something that might be cool with the new camera angles would be maybe having more personal affects behind you both. Kinda like how you already have your two little personal shelves behind you on the mid shot

[@kwonsolo]

I hope you make a video for new players on what to expect from commander. When I first played I thought it would be just fun fun but I realized some decks are full of counterspells and removals. It really got me at first because that’s not what I heard. Also i started as a green player so I never understood combo decks but as I played more blue and red decks I realized sometimes certain decks need combos to win

[@pretty_fly_for_a_jeskai]

I learned the lesson on mana curves the hard way as a new player with Aminatou. Swapped to my boy Master of Keys because the curve still has a good top end but is much more reasonable.

[@DuxBellorum13]

Land destruction for the sake of land destruction is why land destruction gets a bad rap. The "I have nothing better to do so Armageddon". Is the problem.

[@jeremywitkowski7860]

Land tax for me is ramp but has the added benefit of thinning my deck. Grabbing 3 lands a turn over even a few turns does reduce your risk of drawing a land when you don’t need it.

[@archerfeett]

land tax doesn’t put you ahead on mana

[@jeremywitkowski7860]

@ I’m using ramp loosely lol. White isn’t exactly green when it comes to ramp

[@gizzad]

This video is brilliant. GREAT JOB!

[@grampaw5605]

Aside from emblems, Everything dies to removal. Everything.

[@martinheraud1744]

For removal, I think it's also about the number of times you get hit in a game. If everyone plays 3 for 1 (and I do play them a lot) then suddenly you get caught by someone trying to destroy someone else's thing a lot more often and that can create some kind of bad feelings

[@dubblehelix83]

I have designed two decks now that consistently play 6 mana cards on turn three and just grow from there. Green is broken, but it does take a lot of building around (and a commander that makes two mana)

[@PeterGast24]

the only card you listed that blows sheodred out of the water is archon, the other cards don't even have similar effects, it also obviously isn't an either or with any of these cards, a reanimation deck its going to want a bunch of stuff to bring back. You are also wayyy more likely to be able to cast sheodred (or any seven) compared to something like volgavoth, which is essentially an uncastable card for most reanimation deck

[@Tm00ne]

I kept a Sol Ring + Signet + Signet zerolander while playing another guy's deck. What he didn't tell me was that he had 25 land total... ... Still won that one though.

[@d.a.d.-ohgosh]

I think this was one of the best commentarys I've heard on deck thinning in Commander. Although as someone who used to play Modern I'd say deck thinning is statistically effective and worth it in 60 card. As far as the content creator domain goes I never hear anyone supporting deck thinning as important for Commander, however I've heard some awful takes. I won't say who, but I remember someone on a popular Commander channel saying that the math has been done and it doesn't work or do anything... I'm like no... Deck thinning literally on a statistical level increases your odds of getting something else. That's how math works, but my big issue was that it was an argument for fetch lands being overrated. It's a mighty hot take and terrible logic to cite 1 small upside as completely irrelevant and conclude that the best land cycle in the entire game is overrated just because of that 1 small point while completely ignoring the 100 other things that fetch lands are great for. It's also hard for something that is the best in a specific category to be overrated. Like... It's the best version of the thing... How can it be overrated? As far as deck thinning goes in Commander I'd say it's only relevant in 2 cases. 1. Land Tax 2. Deck with high redundancy and high density of deck thinners that are worth playing despite the deck thinning aspect of the cards.

[@bronzieblue63]

Whenever I see a card that has a scaling payoff (for instance, Liliana's Standard Bearer), I always presume it will likely manage to do whatever it does typically at a rate of 1.5 and judge it based off of that (obviously changing if I think the condition it scales off of is more likely to be a higher number) that usually helps temper my expectations and helps me gauge in a more realistic sense like "Hey, at most I'll probably get like 2 cards from this, is it still worth it?"

[@0scl8r]

A proper lightning rod card is one that works in your deck, but may be less valuable in your current board state or hand. It doesnt have to be a completely useless. It could very well be a menace on its own, but theres simply another card thet will combo out or synergize better for the long term. 🤷‍♀️

[@DuxBellorum13]

I love inkshield... but I have it in an Orzhov deck that absolutely loves to play combat tricks so I am almost always keeping mana up for something even if its just to fuck with my opponents but thats the point of the deck. Holding up mana should be a threat that you can Back up at least half the time or people will start trying to call your bluff. Just like holding up mana for counter magic.. if you never counter anything, people will start to catch on to your bluff.

[@davidrosenberg9615]

Just play real threats to bait removal. I'd rather have two cards that can win me the game than one winner and one decoy.

[@prestonmitchell9135]

My commander take is all 5 color decks are green decks splashing other colors

[@sacrednyx626]

My Ezio deck running one forest disagrees

[@prestonmitchell9135]

@@sacrednyx626 the exception to the rule 🗿

[@bakerbakura]

My Jodah Archmage Eternal deck disagrees. I just have 40 lands and all 10 signets for ramp

[@dustinfindsrocks]

I think my sliver deck has more WUBRG cards than green cards

[@Lazydino59]

All decks with green are green decks splashing other colors

[@xanderjones6239]

See, the true pros play dark deal instead of windfall. Everyone only draws equal to the their hand, minus 1 😏 you can always spin it that you're down a card too Big brain 🧠

[@HexproofButHopeless]

Confirmed that Beezy is Smitty Werbenjägermanjensen 👀

[@rigatony6512]

i mean sheolred also resonates other stuff if you got her in deck you have other stuff that’s going to be pricey in the grave yard itself also 6 power swamp walk isn’t something to sneeze at

[@Cobracon7]

I only play Sheoldred in my Sefris Phyrexian reanimator deck, and shes the most unserwhelming of my tagets, shes just there cause i have her...

[@jeffreycooldude2048]

I'm making a Miirym deck and I decided to do away with land ramp and just focus on mana dork ramp. But what has happened is that I've had to rely more on creature tutors to get to those dragons to clone .... and maskwood nexus.

[@jaycue7641]

Maybe consider cost reducers. They provide a nice blanket effect and are slightly harder to remove than creatures.

[@dankbry]

One wrath and you're basically shadow realm'd. LD being taboo is what makes land ramp so good

[@meant09]

Fake threats shouldn’t be used but less synergistic threats that are still must be answered are a thing. For instance I have a selesnya humans deck and one of the few non humans in the deck is managorger hydra. I’m happy if it eats removal so my humans don’t but also happy to win games with it if they don’t. Even better if I have ozolith on board before they remove it

[@sickomobamba9619]

Idk man, when you have a deck built around reanimation/mill, they really do cost 1-2 mana. My old stickfingers deck is pretty consistent in presenting constant early threats for almost nothing.

[@slaysfordays3197]

Scrying to the bottom is the same as drawing a card. This is a hill I will die on.

[@SuperbFairy]

True tbh, it's a weaker effect but binning a card you don't want for an unknown is always good in every game

[@drmajalis1583]

I believe I read somewhere that mathematically each scry is worth about half a card draw, but I'm pretty sure that was strictly analyzing one v one sixty card formats

[@bladethebeast2]

Its not though. Its good sure but it doesnt add anything to your hand. It simply assures a single card you dont want won't go into your hand

[@slaysfordays3197]

@@drmajalis1583 the effectiveness of a scry to a draw depends on how often you bottom the card. If you would bottom 50% of the time, then scry 2 would be equal to draw 1. If you are looking for a specific card like a board-wipe, then the number of cards you would bottom increases and so does the relative value of the scry.

[@Lazydino59]

In 2025 where every card has card advantage stapled to it and power creep is going wild, this take gets less and less crazy every set 😂

[@agee1961]

Wow. I love the nitpicking nerds.

[@tylermiller1699]

Lol she's only 5 in my deck. Thanks Kr'rik.

[@henry5003]

Beezy I know you had an octavia deck at one point. Should windfall go in my octavia deck?

[@OmegaSD18]

Beezy wearing a brace cuz he tried to bust Grave Titan... and GT fought back 🤔?! Lol, for real, hope you're okay, hope to catch you two in Chicago!

[@STS-qi1qy]

'Bait removal' is a brave position when the easiest removal in Commander, of true lightning rods, is player removal....

[@jaycue7641]

I have legitimately baited out counterspells though.

[@oldmanstrolseeyt2121]

Sheoldred, Whispering One being an underwhelming creature is such a bad take😵‍💫 Maybe in higher power pods, I guess? But if you want to let the black player get an extra Reanimate every upkeep and force you to sack a creature every turn, then I'm down to sit at your table🤣

[@SuperbFairy]

Their point is there are cards that actually do more at 7 mana and are a better slot for the deck, if it's turn 5-7 and no one has removal for your pretty vanilla sheoldred then it really is a skill issue on the player parts

[@Prioletti]

Turn one or two she isn’t as good as the others they stated.

[@Lazydino59]

Nah it’s a pretty good take. Sure she will take over the game if she sticks for 2-3+ turns but what bomb in 2025 doesn’t? She’s 7 mana does not impact the board when she comes down. At 5 mana maybe she’s good enough (so Sheoldred), but I can play like 1-2 7 drops in my deck and I’m not spending it on something that doesn’t win the game when it comes down.

[@maxvincent6903]

I know someone who will dedicate the entire game to ending your game if you attack them with a 1/1 on turn 2 or 3

[@shanghaikid9093]

I run a Mono Green Kodama/Kamahl and I can tell you that if left unchecked I will absolutely run away with the game by turn 5 8/10 games.

[@marsrocks247]

much less jarring side angle cuts. it will settle into place just be yourselves! good seeing the channel grow in subtle ways

[@RazorDevil1]

18:15 there's some petty ass people who take little bit of damage so seriously at locals, even in my friend pod. they'll just 100% focus you the rest of the game for poking them for 3-4 FREE damage. some people dont care if they lose the game, and will genuinely throw if they feel targeted. i guess i could just NOT play with them but our group is small, beggars cant be choosers

[@RazorDevil1]

another big one is "you won last game so im focusing you this game". that kind of mentality is so annoying but people DO these a lot.

[@bronzieblue63]

@@RazorDevil1 For me it's when I see "Oh shit, this dude was uncontested early on and he ran away with the game, I need to deal with his high value pieces before he spirals out of control" I agree that it's a petty move to hard focus someone just because they won last game, but it's another matter entirely when you see how their deck runs and you realize what you need to do to counter it so they don't get out of control like the last game. Because it's entirely possible they play pieces you didn't realize had strong synergies with other cards they have in that same deck until you see them in action. But if they're switching decks, then yeah it's mad petty.

[@momosworkshop]

Great video but I really don't like the extra camera angles, it's just jarring and doesn't add anything.

[@ItsSaME-Joey]

Beezy slingin spells so hard dude gotta brace the flick of the wrist

[@marimi46]

Didn't they change the rule with clones and flip cards? Like the clone now gets the backside of the card if that card transforms

[@stfinalwrath]

That's what I thought as well. Not entirely sure with this type of copying though myself.

[@martinheraud1744]

I've won so many games wiht windfall cast by someone else

[@senescentfear1000]

Idk why you hate on krosen grip so much, multiple cedh players at my lgs have said its the premier way to stop alot of cedh combo pieces, especially things like underworld breach, i do suppose its worse in more casual settings though

[@mufasafalldown8401]

It kills Sensei's Top so it is automatically amazing.

[@justinmorsch3208]

If you want to play a lightning rod, just play spellskite or some other protection piece lmao

[@brianpenner9286]

Luckily ive almost never come into the situation of a loop that cannot be broken but i will say for the purposes of the multiplayer Commander format... Its a very braindead rule. If you as a player have gotten yourself stuck into a loop that you cannot get out of, you lose! Even if the next player removed a piece of your setup which is causing you to get stuck in an infinite loop - so sad but you lose and the others are allowed to finish the game like any other normal Commander game before you got yourself into that mess 👍

[@TubbyBubbleLove42]

Just gotta rule 0 that take with the group your playing with beforehand.

[@johnascencio8356]

I’m a 60 card player and I even believe deck thinning (like cracking fetch lands for no good reason) is overrated in 60 card Taking one card from even a 60 card deck to a mathematically insignificant

[@TubbyBubbleLove42]

It's mathematically insignificant in one game. But if you play enough games, it could end up being the reason you win one of them. Or lose by paying that one life for a fetch land.

[@jaiar12]

Do you think Obama plays

[@obadijahparks]

XD no

[@punkypinko2965]

With people's lives? Yes. Taking bribes to buy his next mansion? Yes.

[@prestonmitchell9135]

He plays in a 4 pod with biden, trump, and Bill Clinton every Tuesday afternoon

[@Cybertech134]

@@prestonmitchell9135 Probably not that fun with Trump winning all the time.

[@Saixjacket]

Trump definitely azorius control lmao

[@michaelpatalano9884]

Beezy hurt his wrist shuffling too much??

[@jameslamb4846]

Going infinite only makes you lose the game on Magic Arena because it crashes 😂

[@Cobracon7]

Land tax is one of the only good deck thining cards...

[@DrDesumThePanda]

4:48 tell that to my Radha, Heir to Keld or Ruby, Daring Tracker decks with twenty 4-mana ramp spells and the rest 5 mana+ cascade or discover cards.

[@crawdaddy1234]

3:51 Say Sheoldred was a 2-mana 1/1, would I put this in my deck... maaaaaaybe? What's it good against? If you get it early, it's either not going to take out anything OR it's just going to get the extra 1/1s. And if you get it out late... it's only going to get the extra 1/1s. And if a deck only has a couple/few creatures, then they probably don't particularly care about their creatures in the first place. And if you get it out early, what else is in your graveyard?

[@superpower172]

Idk, a one sided edict on every upkeep is pretty insane for two mana lol. It basically locks your opponents out from playing less than 2 creatures a turn until they get rid of it. And the second ability is crazy. If you build around self-mill or have tutors that put stuff directly into the grave, that card would be even more busted. It’s not about the stats so much as it is the effect in commander

[@crawdaddy1234]

@@superpower172 How many creatures do you need to reanimate over how many turns to win? Why reanimate Sheoldred when you can just search for and reanimate the creature you actually want? It seems like you're adding a step because value? And if you get it out on turn 2, people may not even have creatures to sacrifice... and by turn 9, they may have 5 or 6 creatures to choose from - "Oh no! I sacrificed my Solemn Simulacrum," or "Oh no! I sacrificed my Llanowar Elves," or "Oh no! I sacrificed my snake token," etc.

[@zakbrooks7354]

​@@crawdaddy1234I think a better example here would be to make her 4 Mana. At two, she would just become a stax piece that has other things it does. At four, she plays roughly the same as at two, but is significantly slower. That's where I feel your argument makes the most sense. Now you aren't getting as much Mana cheated when you bring her out, and all the other arguments you made still apply. Play her late, the edict effect may be nigh useless. Play her too early, well how many creatures do you even have in grave? Four Mana really is the Mana value that makes her the most mid imo

[@crawdaddy1234]

@@zakbrooks7354 I can dig.

[@DarthLukee]

What's happening with the wrist beezy? Hope all is well!

[@bmprosser]

Grudges are just negative politics and as with a deal-brokering should not last more than a round of turns

[@matthewanderson3261]

Heck yeah.

[@87392v]

Damn, that video was tightly scripted.

[@bastionbrom8927]

If people are legitimately making some of these arguments them the nitpicking needs community may be bad at magic. Lol.

[@ryantomczak2248]

Interesting how you both can say that having some staples doesn’t make your deck more powerful, but the entire internet was fighting over Mana Crypt and Jeweled Lotus when they were banned. Half the internet was saying they are not bad and the other half was saying they make your deck too powerful. I wonder what you two think of that?

[@paulszki]

I think certain categories of cards just make your deck more powerful period. Your deck has to be a complete pile and/or you to be a pretty inexperienced player to not have a significantly better shot at winning any given game with a Mana Crypt in hand. That said, I think the point really is that people just randomly jam certain popular cards in their deck and think "now my win percentage will go up" and A LOT OF THE TIME (not all the time, sure), it just doesn't really do much, because their deck isn't made to make use of that card. Maybe the more nuanced point is that a bad deck only marginally improves with some stapley chase card, while an already great deck can become much better with it. If you're putting Surveil lands into your deck but without fetchlands or outside of green/x decks that can fetch them via farseek, nature's lore, three visits you'll end up with a tapland that you have to naturally draw into, so you only see it like maybe every third game and WHEN you draw into it, you might be bummed out that it enters tapped. Compare that to someone cracking a fetch turn 1 or ramping into it turn 2 with some regularity. -> 1. you actually get to play the card more often. 2. the timing of the land's arrival is different, it comes down early from your ramp vs naturally drawn being a tapland when you REALLY wanted an untapped one. People just hear that card xy is powerful and so they run it, without having much of an idea WHY it's considered powerful or a staple. And sure, a Rhystic Study is often times game winning, but people will also randomly jamming Brainstorm without any shuffle effects. Then there's these pseudo-staples, like Reliquary Tower, which most experienced players will tell you not to run, unless you have a specific reason (and that reason isn't that you might draw 10 cards of a Rishkar's Expertise occasionally and you can't be bothered to discard three lands and couple of ramp spells)

[@ryantomczak2248]

@ Taking the player ability out of the conversation, my point is a card like Mana Crypt doesn’t make your precon more powerful. It is still a 5, it does not become an 8 because of one card. A lot of people think that it does though. I find the opposite with cards like Rhystic Study, Esper Sentinel, and Mystic Remora. I feel they are usually dead cards because unless drawn and deployed early players generally have the mana to pay for them. In the case of Mystic Remora not so much, but deploy a creature or two and it is not an issue. I have seen several of these effects draw zero cards over the course of several turns because they were deployed late game. I actually do not run these cards outside of cEDH, and I do not always include them in my cEDH decks either. There are better options nowadays like Polliwog Prodigy, for example.

[@Cybertech134]

@ The inclusion of Mana Crypt objectively and mathematically does increase the power of your deck and would make a precon more powerful than it would be without it.

[@ryantomczak2248]

@ And here we go again. Let’s look at a hypothetical situation. If someone walked into a LGS and grabbed a random pile of white cards. Threw in some basic lands and made a commander deck, would the deck be any good? The answer is no. Now throw in a Mana Crypt, is the deck suddenly good? No it is not.

[@Cybertech134]

@@ryantomczak2248 I didn't say it would be good. I said it would be better, which is objectively true no matter how you spin it. Also, your hypothetical is stupid. People aren't building commander decks like that and precons are most definitely NOT designed like that.

[@trianglesquare2973]

First?

[@NitpickingNerds]

🥇

[@therizzler.jizzler]

pls stop w the solo shot camera angles. u should totally do it whenever ur cat pulls up tho

[@MBurgland]

I wish you would speak more calmly. You give me a ton of anxiety with how loud and fast you speak, lol. Slow down, young man, and talk like you are having a normal conversation with friends.

[@prestonmitchell9135]

Welcome to talking to energetic people and/or people with adhd

[@michaelpatalano9884]

I watch them on 2x speed and think it’s fine

[@SilverBlack831]

There's a volume control on your device

[@bennett4789]

scram geezer

[@SilverBlack831]

@@bennett4789 🤣🤣🤣