He is so sweet. He could teach how to truly truck drive. Bless him.
@atabiabailey53822 ай бұрын
I agree 100000000000000000000% Great one Alex!!!!
@caroltalbott4692 ай бұрын
This gentleman's mind is way sharper than what we have out here now, that's a great asset in itself. I learned from them, miss them alot.
@user-wr6vz7ol8t2 ай бұрын
Excellent interview ❤
@MoveNgroove932 ай бұрын
Solid. I enjoyed it myself.
@terrybane62062 ай бұрын
This man got to experience the best days of American trucking. These drivers are going away so if you get a chance take a few minutes and listen to their stories. These old guys deserve respect.
@billy2bob632 ай бұрын
❤❤❤❤
@haroldenglish943Ай бұрын
He experienced this country at its best. Best for everything never to return.
@richard6606Ай бұрын
They deserve more than respect they helped build this country they were the back bone that held it together I’m 52 and drive I’ve been in and around this business my whole life growing up in trucks my father had the same knowledge this man has drove all the same trucks I was very fortunate to learn from my father and have his knowledge passed on to me I miss him and his knowledge and all the stories these men deserve respect for sure but we should cherish them all they were a breed of men that will never again be around .
@gailmorraАй бұрын
What about the women?
@richard6606Ай бұрын
@@gailmorra did the autocorrect hurt correct hurt your feelings??? Here I can fix it for you gale is that better now you can take you’re the wad out of you’re panties
@gdvibes12 ай бұрын
This man should be recognized as a national hero an American icon. This was awesome.👍
@jcallanan82Ай бұрын
That's for sure 👍 greetings from Ireland 😎😎
@6feet6figuresАй бұрын
@@gdvibes1 for what?
@davidsanders6957Ай бұрын
He'll, He qualify 's now for a monument on side of a mountain.
@ejthetrucka62962 ай бұрын
Those are the guys I miss in trucking. Those are the legends..✌🏾
@lonokolotowicz5597Ай бұрын
I am one of the guys.
@babettethompson38202 ай бұрын
Insurance has destroyed this country
@Issa_Alkubi2 ай бұрын
Now who owns them? The same politicians that send billions to Isra3l.
@yusef7mcbride9292 ай бұрын
Facts that’s why new truck drivers most times have to go otr or regional their first year
@jjjthomasson89022 ай бұрын
Amen and right on!!!!!!
@claudiajones3562 ай бұрын
Absolutely
@TheOneAndOnlyWisCaliАй бұрын
Major Facts
@captainawesome55602 ай бұрын
Thank you Sir, for your many years of service.
@John-kr7iz2 ай бұрын
this gentleman doesn't need to drive anymore, he should be teaching, he is a wealth of knowledge
@Kevo1993Ай бұрын
I agree with you on this
@John-kr7izАй бұрын
@@Kevo1993 thanks kevo 🙂
@peterdavis8471Ай бұрын
My thoughts exactly. Especially with the new generation of steering wheel holders 😢
@shottava9314Ай бұрын
Just imagine the stories his dad could tell about trucking if he was alive
@kevinwilliams552Ай бұрын
What's the sense rookies won't listen
@mitchellmiller1122 ай бұрын
I love old timers like him. I hope someone will hire him. Those guys paved the way for the rest of us. Those guys did it the hard way
@P_MurrielАй бұрын
Yes sir!
@rafaelgonzalez4175Ай бұрын
You are a disgusting individual. You want an elderly person to be hired rather than offer him a pristine retirement package. Honestly. This is called reached the limit. How old does a person have to be to no longer work? 200 years old?..
@franklinbrandon528313 күн бұрын
Looks like he would be perfect for Walmart trucking
@chetd516Ай бұрын
That man is about as genuine as you can get God bless him
@JW-lw8pc2 ай бұрын
My favorite interview ever love these old school guys. He's a legend
@alemaoyw9379Ай бұрын
Watching from Brazil. Great truck driver! This kind of people deserve max respect
@JS-dm2tzАй бұрын
He is a driver that built this industry. We all could learn something from him.
@andydavis69622 ай бұрын
We had a driver that was took off the road by the insurance company at 86! He is a legend at our yard. He is the only one on the 3,000,000 mile banner hanging above the driver's lounge. The original OG! ❤ Willie Shaw was part of Comcar. Went bye bye a few years ago.
@b.abrackus6403Ай бұрын
The Kellys truckstop in Shreveport Louisiana this gentleman mentioned as his favorite truckstop, was a 76 Auto/Truckstop back then...the Kelley family sold it to Petros maybe 20-25 years ago, it's still open today... Awesome interview ❤❤
@DukeTrana2 ай бұрын
When they say to respect your elders this is the guy they are talking about
@garydingman1035Ай бұрын
I’ve been Driving for 37 years and I still love talking to Senior Drivers like him . God Bless Him
@RogueTrucking3952 ай бұрын
A real Old School GearJammer from back in the day. He’s what comes to mind imo as an old school Trucker. Insurance companies as well as company policies have hurt this Industry. Much respect to him.
@davidsanders6957Ай бұрын
Dude reminds me alot of my hard, hard working Daddy ! God Bless you man.
@travisstoneking40492 ай бұрын
Third generation truck driver and I can tell you the stories I have heard is mind blowing definitely could not do that kinda stuff nowadays. Great interview a lot of people don’t realize diesel fuel used to be cheaper than gasoline.
@mikep16462 ай бұрын
Thank you Driver. 💪💪💪
@THEHOLYSPIRIT72 ай бұрын
That's why I'm not trucking anymore.... The trucking industry is a disaster 😢.... Did 14 yrs no respect nor consideration for the truckers anymore... It's all about the company's interest....
@charleswelch-ju2vqАй бұрын
God bless him
@2pink1stinkАй бұрын
I'm still stuck in it with fedex. I almost quit today over taking candy for driver appreciation week. Then I was told I'm only getting half an annual raise this year, and was informed there will now be notifications in the truck from the driver facing camera about my seat belt or if it sees my phone in view anywhere, or if I am eating. I'm done with this. Especially if I'll never afford a home and can barely even buy a car.
@ellagoldie9686Ай бұрын
How do these companies survive?? Especially with the %age of turnover...how??
@Daniel-wd4jgАй бұрын
Hats off ol' Buddy! My Dad retired Teamster CF in Portland Oregon. 47 years...thru depression and WW2 until the '80s. Consolidated Freight Leyland James invented the Cabover Freightliner in Portland. Great interview!
@shawnmceachin7202 ай бұрын
Tell him we ❤️ that dude
@bullishmorale13442 ай бұрын
Great interview!! I like hearing those Old School stories from the unsung heroes of the trucking industry 🔥👏🏻🔥
@404TruckingАй бұрын
“Keep on trucking, let the black smoke roll” Legend.
@MasterWitchDoctor27 күн бұрын
this man would be the best person ever to train drivers.
@josephcogean88962 ай бұрын
Hey, Alex. I've been driving 51 years out here. I hope I could be as lively. As that man is at 88 and I hope he does find another driving job. Cause he deserves it first truck. I ever learned how to drive with a Diamond Rio. That's an old truck but trucking the life of a trucker is what you make of it. It's definitely difficult sometimes, but it's also a beautiful thing. Get to see a lot of people don't get to see and he's right about truck stops back in a day. The owner would buy your lunch. Buy your dinner, you're pulling a bill. You truck up what she windows. Clean your floors and sometime you'll have to pee in it. Go in and take a shower or they would pop your try that today. And they steal it. Good luck. To that old truck driver, I hope he gets a few more years of driving.God bless him
@MuthaTrucker2 ай бұрын
Appreciate you too!!!!!
@just-incase34832 ай бұрын
Diamond Js on I-80 In Pennsylvania was the big hangout spot, I miss those days so much!!!
@calebsmith36192 ай бұрын
ATHS should recognize him in there magazine! Sure would like to meet him. Hear more of his stories.
@waynejones6656Ай бұрын
A man with this kind of knowledge would make a good trainer. I learned to drive listening men like this wayyyy before CDL and driving schools everywhere. I learned washing trucks, fixing flats, and getting the do's and don'ts from guys hanging around the shop. They were a wealth of knowledge.
@Marvin-lg9jt2 ай бұрын
I really appreciate you interviewing this nice senior trucker Alex!😎😎😎😎😃😃😃😃😃🍺🍺🍺🍺🍺
@MuthaTruckerАй бұрын
🫡🇺🇸🚚
@joeclark729815 күн бұрын
This was one of the best truckers. Can't believe no one will let him keep driving
@livetoridecandoАй бұрын
Insurance companies have ruined trucking, cars ,medical , and everything else where insurance is mandatory.
@stevehudson74292 ай бұрын
The experience this old man would bring to the table is valuable
@rodneystewart89582 ай бұрын
That man is a true hand it's sorry that he can't get a job yet theres people out here that shouldn't be
@TheMyertj2 ай бұрын
I’m 64 and drive for a small company in Arkansas that’s Self Insured, They’re interested in Experienced Driver
@derekmcmanus6228Ай бұрын
I am 65 and I am also looking to go to work for a company that is out of Arkansas to and I’d love to be able to drive a truck again but have not drove in a while because of things that I have had happen to me, and I have had my CDL class A for over thirty two years back in February this year.
@davidcraig92332 ай бұрын
In a similar boat, 29 years experience, no tickets, no accidents, no CSA points and I’m constantly being ghosted by companies.
@charleshanna20892 ай бұрын
Yep ! 38 years OTR nearly 4 millions accident free miles with no moving violations Im either over experienced or not what theyre looking for If I do get an offer they want to pay me 0.38 cents per mile
@mikepeg992 ай бұрын
2 words 1-Russian trucking Company in 2-Chicago. You'll make more money than you can spend. 32 years experience myself and I wouldn't work for anyone else
@charleshanna20892 ай бұрын
@@mikepeg99 is it 1099 ?
@mikepeg99Ай бұрын
@charleshanna2089 Yep. 1099 all day long. You'll make 60-70 cents a mile, and Russians also highly respect experienced truck drivers. 1099 is not bad at all, it's just that everybody doesn't know how to operate and utilize a 1099 properly. The secret to a 1099 is to run most of, if not all, the money you make into separate, small businesses. Laundromat, pizza parlor, car wash, online biz, etc. Let the small businesses pay the taxes for you. Once you make money from the small businesses, you put that money in your pocket.
@mikepeg99Ай бұрын
@charleshanna2089 I'm on a trip right now. My dispatcher set me up on an LTL flatbed load going cross country. When all is said and done, I'll make $2800 for the week, and that's a slow week.
@garywoolen97662 ай бұрын
Been driving for 44 years it's not fun anymore to much regulation
@scottbrown4022 ай бұрын
One of your best interviews EVER! LOVE listening to these old hands talk shop!
@MuthaTrucker2 ай бұрын
It was great spending time with him
@DrivingSue2 ай бұрын
A beautiful man. KEEP ON TRUCKIN..
@edgarcorreiamelo2 ай бұрын
Insurance companies are running this country!!!
@jackwilson4722Ай бұрын
Yep..running it in the ground...
@zachharper216Ай бұрын
Actually Joe Biden is
@zachharper216Ай бұрын
Kamala actually
@Aviatorpeck19572 ай бұрын
I get this man's frustration I started trucking in 1976 when all you needed was a chauffeur license! I was off from 1983 to 1996 due to life issues and then retired in 2019 after being an owner operator for the last 13 years of trucking I did oversize/ heavy haul I been looking to get back into it and no one will hire me saying I need at least one to two years of recent experience freaking crazy No tickets No accidents I am 67 Y/O in good health... Crazy times in trucking...
@llewellynwhite17452 ай бұрын
I am 88 years old and I had to quit driving at 80 due to insurance. I only had one accident 50 plus years ago. I learned on a H model mack with duplex. Everything he said I can relate to. I live in northern maine and use to deliver in the northeast. Does anybody driving remember when NO CROSS BRONX to get to the GW bridge. I am like him I miss it.
@MuthaTrucker2 ай бұрын
Thank you for everything and moving America
@jim-zx7gzАй бұрын
Wow an H model Mack....my dad owned a G model Mack in 1964. Was just a kid then. Remember the pole standing upright getting into the sleeper you could bang your head on....the large manual drive line park brake on the dash board....
@davidbarnhouse51192 ай бұрын
I enjoyed listening to this man, I have only been out here 34 years and would sit with someone like him just to hear the stories he could tell, I've got some, but to listen to him talk about the old companies and truckstops, it's history. It's guys like him that taught me what I know today in trucking, on driving going over mountain passes, I know trucking sucks today between insurance, fuel prices and scamming brokers have ruined this industry and people that know nothing about driving, my hats off to this legend, and yes he's a legend!
@shottava9314Ай бұрын
Yeh it’s bad these flip flop wearing drivers could careless about the history of trucking
@claudiajones3562 ай бұрын
I've never stop loving being in the midst of trucks i only get fuel from trucks stops while traveling just came back 2 weeks ago from a 3 k mile car road trip loved the trucks stop and just seeing the trucks yall be safe. Love this old trucker
@normanott6442 ай бұрын
I started in 76 still driving today just not as much. 35 years of that was livestock.
@RebelMontana2 ай бұрын
My dad is 67 and he couldn’t get work. He ends up retiring and collecting social security checks
@yoyojoe92402 ай бұрын
Come On Sir, it is time to Go fishing.....You earned it..!!
@sandleman3006Ай бұрын
Sounds like he'd rather Truck than fish. He's a fish outta water.
@alanlewis7924Ай бұрын
That's good advice for some one but that will not put food on the table. If your a working man you won't end up rich!
@CassieNye-jb4xi2 ай бұрын
Insurance…A LEGAL WAY TO STEAL MONEY FROM THE WORKING CLASS!!
@johnf14412 ай бұрын
I’m also in same situation I have 15 years experience ZERO accidents on my record I run my own authority and simply looking to go company driver and NO ONE will hire me.
@texhianАй бұрын
the job market is hard right now, as a mechanic with schooling and experience i could usually get a job ANYWHERE. before i got my last job like 3 months ago it was scary how hard it was to get a job
@CamioneroVlog2 ай бұрын
Respect 🙏
@tylerbaldwin1633Ай бұрын
By far one of your best interviews! These guys helped build our country they deserve a lot more than they get.
@JonJon5052 ай бұрын
Respect for the old school drivers
@rinkrude12 ай бұрын
Age Discrimination...SUE!!!
@davidritter214562 ай бұрын
Dude with what money? Him like others don't have the finances to retain a lawyer! He might write to the Federal Equal Employment Opportunity Commission. Just a thought.
@Dominancelogistics2 ай бұрын
He shouldn’t be driving anyway. He’s been in it long enough to have stacked his money. He’d be taking a job from an American with a young family. We have enough illegals doing that.
@mikerobinson27522 ай бұрын
My mentor is in same boat passes med card but insurance won't let him work
@kirkjones98272 ай бұрын
I remember when I drove tomatoes trucks. There was an old school driver. Late 80’s. He would run. In his 80’s the dispatcher told the night dispatcher. 1 load(275 miles) he would take 2 and the night dispatcher got chewed out. He had a stroke. Drove with his right arm. Rest his left arm in the steering wheel and shifted with the left.
@HaiPham-yn8fm2 ай бұрын
I'm 43 years over the road and now DOT rule that I'm disqualified for CDL holding and they take back my CDL
@stephenchechowitz14322 ай бұрын
The insurance companies. Need to be reeled in. Congress should immediately pass Legislation that Insurance is now a non profit business. Any profit should be shared back with the paying public and not the Board of Directors. Immediately !!!!
@Jamie-f8y2 ай бұрын
A true Highway Man
@garystoner5781Ай бұрын
Fantastic interview!!! Been driving since Feb 1974, myself and still driving, even though the best times are.behind us now. God bless that man and his kind were the backbone and mindset of a true professional truck driver . Keep on trucking!!
@BourneSosa2 ай бұрын
This man should be driving, he don't even wear eye glasses
@jim-zx7gzАй бұрын
This gentleman is absolutely correct! I started with my dad in the early 1970ies and everything he says is spot on....
@VanceBrown-r7v2 ай бұрын
I’m 64 years old and driving for TP Trucking pulling a flatbed. Give them a call.
@bernardjackson-o9zАй бұрын
Man this was a cool interview you can tell he just really loved it every word was genuine
@Siggred2 ай бұрын
They wont hire you? Forget em. 61 years exp means you open a driving school and show them how its done.
@brothermyke65232 ай бұрын
This ole Man would make an excellent driving school trainer.
@danaroberts45202 ай бұрын
If I had a trucking company I would hire you in a heartbeat
@PureTruth1970Ай бұрын
A dedication like his should be see as something like a war veteran! He might not have fought on the beaches of Normandy or the jungle of Vietnam but the old dude sure feed millions of Americans by each trailer full and to me in my eyes thats a Veteran of our nation!
@Chiefgeargrinder2 ай бұрын
A little secret this old driver needs to know. Get your own Truck and your own insurance will be back to normal. The loop hole my company uses is that drivers that are uninsurablle due to saps or accidents become insurable when they buy their own trucks and sign on that way.
@CarlosRoman9042 ай бұрын
If they buy their own trucks the drivers pay extra for insurance, his point is paying 15k extra is not something he or any company wants to support
@Chiefgeargrinder2 ай бұрын
@CarlosRoman904 one of our drivers is 83 years old and still does flatbed with his own unit. He pays 1200 a month.
@CarlosRoman9042 ай бұрын
@Chiefgeargrinder oh I thought regardless the insurance companies will charge more good to know
@vroor322 ай бұрын
@@CarlosRoman904 dude, when I started in 2017, I was paying $18K/yr ... I got rejected before that for a speeding ticket, so I went bought me a $10K truck, got my own MC at $18/yr ... Fast forward, now I still have my $10K truck, paid off reefer, and insurance is $4K/yr everything included.... So ya this old guy is full of crap 😂
@enochbachinoАй бұрын
@@vroor32 which insurance company bro
@CarolinatruckherАй бұрын
I love this man ❤ he’s adorable
@sablehund1219Ай бұрын
Best interview you've ever done, would've watched an hour of this gentleman talking!
@BAJARACER43XАй бұрын
I can relate, if I put on my reume i have 35 yrs experience as an auto tech i never get a call, If I say I have 15 yrs experience, I get calls all day. Shops don't want older guys
@JoviParsonsАй бұрын
Hands down one of your best interviews Alex!!
@atothekinay2 ай бұрын
He’s 88 years we can respect the experience but his cognitive abilities are deteriorating so it’s a huge liability.
@WillGroves927052 ай бұрын
Mmm, he might speak slow, but thats just wear and tear, and maybe bc of where hes from
@Mattie_Ice2 ай бұрын
Some men don't know when to hang up their hat. 88, cmon man go home...
@improvisedsurvival59672 ай бұрын
But some newb is no liability. His experience more than makes up for his cognitive abilities. 88 though I’d be done
@francisdotso85942 ай бұрын
The likelihood of him dying at the wheel is much higher than some noob
@doomsterinthehouse2 ай бұрын
But Biden is The President!
@chrislovett6120Ай бұрын
After 61 years the last thing I want to do is keep driving a truck. I’d retire right after 35 years if I could
@Bryan-lg3fn2 ай бұрын
Ive been on the road for 30 years and im disgusted how so many foreign drivers think its a sport . Legs up on the dash , tailgating , taking there breaks on the fuel island , throwing there trash everywhere .....And then the idiotic ELD's , Automatic trucks , Collision mitigation crap ....its all garbage pushed on carriers by the scumbag insurance companys
@Joe-d7m6kАй бұрын
And yet--- trucking is NO SAFER, OR BETTER.
@xx1xbryanx1xx2 ай бұрын
They look at him as a liability 😮😮 per insurance
@broncobill1104Ай бұрын
A wise man once said... This is that man! Seriously great wisdom in this video. Love it and God bless
@SmurffitnessАй бұрын
Look. He should have enough money saved up from that long of a career. And at that age, should not be driving something so big and heavy.
@DanielGarcia-zz9eg2 ай бұрын
61yrs!!!!!!!!!!! I'm guessing he's 79. You're way to old to drive. Need to enjoy life. If driving is your passion, sign up for uber to keep your mind busy, make your own calls That's a hard core driver . Driver for life ❤❤❤❤❤
@ALCRAN20102 ай бұрын
I think he said 81
@wallytimmins3562 ай бұрын
@@ALCRAN2010 83 he said.
@JacksonGuitarsPlayer03Ай бұрын
61 years I won’t be surprised if this man knows how to shift 2 shifter trucks
@tyscott59482 ай бұрын
Good interview
@Baconleader1046Ай бұрын
after this much experience and you still wanna be an employee the. I wont blace those trucking companies
@VchaosTheoryVАй бұрын
This is one interview that i wish were longer. It's sad to see he can't get employed, but to be fair, he's put his time in. Hopefully there's still something out there for him. There's not too many legends out like him anymore.
@biggomega5502Ай бұрын
Awesome video!!! Wish that fella the best!
@WilliamDrake-m4w2 ай бұрын
Remember getting S&H green stamps, My grandma loved getting them from me.
@ifronnin2 ай бұрын
As someone who grew up in Northwestern Minnesota, his references to freezing in North Dakota hit home. There was one winter where I broke the passenger window of my diesel pickup truck (1988 F350 with the 7.3 idi). That winter we had windchills of -75 degrees. I had to let my truck idle for days at a time because the temperatures never reached zero degrees Fahrenheit for weeks at a time. When driving I had to bundle up in blankets, insulated coveralls and a bomber hat. But my first car didn’t have a working blower motor, so I had to roll the windows down to defrost them, and turn the heat off to prevent frost. That was dang cold. At least the pickup had working heat (that is, once the engine warmed up after idling or driving for an hour). I lived near Grand Forks, ND for a few years. Now I live in north-central South Dakota, close to the ND boarder. By most people’s standards it’s virtually the Arctic here during the winter, but by my standards it’s a tropical climate.
@PatrickMurphy-tp8wrАй бұрын
Thank you for your service!!!!
@TruckerBigDan2 ай бұрын
Schneider would hire him. When I was an in house instructor my oldest student was 82 years old. I don’t know if he could stand all the rules being an ex chicken hauler though.
@davejarvis7522Ай бұрын
WOW. This guy is down to earth and nice
@carrollbridges64272 ай бұрын
Thk u pop for the 61 yrs u gave to America, and u are missed.b
@brianpeavey50022 ай бұрын
I drove truck for 30 years. It sucked!
@jamesjournell867Ай бұрын
& hands bye far one of the very best interviews that u have ever done on yur channel 💯 %
@StarzCinemaBeatsАй бұрын
No reason why this man should still be working smh
@mrmitchell4089Ай бұрын
Exactly
@stevep7562 ай бұрын
There is a reason why social insecurity starts at 62. Originally people did not make it past their 60's. Also there needs to be common sense to just go retire and enjoy life a little bit. I know plenty of drivers in their 60's and 70's that already collect a fat pension plus social insecurity. I tell them to go home already because I am not old enough to collect anything and need the freight. Some told me the did not save and will not compromise their lifestyle at home. Then I remind them they are never home. Duh!
@Nomad-rm5iw2 ай бұрын
Live longer and you will understand
@francisdotso85942 ай бұрын
Common misconception, while the average age of death was just under 60 at the time of social security formation, that's only because the infant mortality rate, as well as the child mortality rate, were so high. The young dying so frequently skewed the statistics drastically, but as childcare got better, the life expectancy went up
@Chris-mf6bj2 ай бұрын
Please gives this guy a chance 😢 you can tell trucking in his blood
@Mattie_Ice2 ай бұрын
He's too old. Have some sense.
@narc61502 ай бұрын
It's a huge RISK.
@vroor322 ай бұрын
@@narc6150 yup. Probably too stuck in his old ways ... Plus WE DONT KNOW his driving record ... It could be very messy 😂, bunch'a crashes here and there ...
@theodorebowers97372 ай бұрын
I am 75 yrs old drove the B macks too .today my son drive for 20yrs now it like driving a Cadillac Belive me you would not drive a truck if it was like we had it . God-bless America 🇺🇸 God-bless Donald J Trump 🇺🇸
@vroor322 ай бұрын
@@theodorebowers9737 there's always a trumptard bringing in unneeded politics to the discussion 😂
@mumblesbadly77082 ай бұрын
He needs to take up acting, taking roles as a retired trucker. Don’t even need to give a firm script. Just let him ad lib. He’d crush it! 🤗
@MuthaTrucker2 ай бұрын
Agreed
@pointnIaugh2 ай бұрын
I bet that he doesn't park at the fuel island.
@scottberry52662 ай бұрын
And if he does, he’s got a pass.
@lonokolotowicz5597Ай бұрын
This is the kind of man I started driving with. I drove my first truck, 1964 it was a 46 Brockway with a flat head six, 90 horsepower. 3 sticks. Max speed 45 MPH down hill with a tail wind.. Hartford Ct, to JFK on Sunday morning. Air freight deliveries to the air lines.