October 2024 SSBM Tier List

[@Ghoats]

someone teach this man about adblock🙏😭

[@Tryc3]

Ublock Origin 💪

[@joeykeilholz925]

Or just crop 😭

[@SaltInYourEye_ICs]

Nah, he keepin it real

[@robloxmasterxddd9856]

Bro needs brave browser

[@SludgeBob_]

Full screen would work for me honestly. Ad blocker would be a plus

[@GoomySmash]

If amsa never picked up Melee Yoshi would still be considered unviable

[@Nick-em8zi]

I do think amsa makes it look so easy people overate how good you need to be to win with Yoshi

[@nbshftr]

@@Nick-em8zi amsa is de coolest player to ever touch yoshi

[@nathanprindler]

Jiggy's tier break is also earned on account that there's a *wide* gap between Hungrybox and the next competitive Puff main. So it's more an attribute to the player than the character, like aMSa with Yoshi.

[@LycheenutOWL]

Falco is somewhat in the same boat. Feels like Hbox's Puff & Mang0's Falco may have somewhat stagnated in development due to them essentially solo paving the way for the character for over a decade.

[@saymehname]

I agree about your take on Link and Roy. I think with adequate work put into those characters we will see new results.

[@jrodd13]

What about Mewtwo and G&W?

[@xbox7912]

@@jrodd13mr game and watch is my second favorite character in this game (first is CF) but I don't think he'll ever be GREAT 😢😢

[@saymehname]

@@jrodd13 mewtwo for sure if he wasn’t so light and his tail wasn’t such a bit hurtbox. But he dies so easy :(

[@revelation2-9]

Excellent list Hax. I think that Doc should be in C tier as well but other than that, great video. Keep up the good content.

[@Lioni177]

Hax getting Tommy Bahama AD's is peak

[@slugrex]

Nice tierlist. Surprising part to me was when you said Peach loses hard to Marth. Armada said a lot that he thinks Peach holding a turnip wins the matchup, without one she is losing

[@astrosandorbits5532]

If I remember correctly... he said she goes even with marth with a turnip in hand. Either way, the matchup improves for Peach considerably when she has a turnip out and that can't go unnoticed. It's one of those quirky elements to melee that make it such a great game

[@drakejoshofficialyoutubech5569]

Yeah Peach does really bad against Marth from what I've seen. At the very least it's bad enough that back in 2016 Mango was experimenting with Marth as an FD counterpick against Peach, and the crazy part is that his Marth even took multiple games off of Armada at WTFox 2

[@noyd4172]

@@drakejoshofficialyoutubech5569 Mango was taking games off of Trif with Marth earlier this year too.

[@TheBeggies95]

I think Marth wins but Peach payers have to stop acting like it’s an atrocious MU. Marth can’t kill or get in against turnips + peach punish and ledge trapping are strong

[@CoachOliverLynch]

This is the most accurate tie list out there. I also agree Yoshui is better than peach. I would even argue that yoshi slight wins vs marth. The use of super armor and marth's lack of reliable strong knockback moves creates a unique MU. No one else in the cast has this unique ability to counter one of marth's only weaknesses. Epic video Hax$!

[@Mecinimi]

Hax, learn how to crop your recording area so that you don’t have to have the top part of your browser or the ads! Guides for OBS are available

[@skedoom8421]

Or just hit F11 bruh 😭🙏

[@boxob093]

1:07 "number one is fox, needs no explanation" *explains for 1 minute 11 seconds* 💀💀💀

[@WesleyFiles]

It's an expression.

[@fisss306]

You never mentioned who in B tier clearly beats Sheik

[@papadelta9485]

ice climbers*

[@ssbmhax]

Ice Climbers, sorry

[@xbox7912]

@@ssbmhaxhope your having a good day hax

[@Phantom_madman]

Sheik puff and falcon seem to change a lot based on tournament recency. And peach would be higher if armada still played, you cant have that dominance with a character and if be next to pika

[@ariesomega2487]

The question is what is the argument for peach being higher. I am big peach believer but she clearly loses to fox, marth and puff. Gets beaten by sheik and goes evenish with falco/falcon. The fact that yoshi goes even with marth and puff alone makes him better. (Although he gets shit on by peach and falcon) it is a tough call but i would agree with hax that falcon is set and peach and yoshi could vary

[@Phantom_madman]

@@ariesomega2487 fact that armada never lost to a non top 6 player for years with peach proves to me the matchup are not as bad as people say. I refuse to believe you can have that dominance if the character is as bad as they say. Armada had pretty delusional tierlist takes with puff being nr1 and stuff. Best believe he downplayed the character severly. Armada often destroyed m2ks marth and sheik. He never lost to falcon outside of s2j once and silentspectre years ago. Character is right behind falcon at the minimum

[@quetzalcoatl4255]

@@Phantom_madman Armada never lost to S2J

[@Phantom_madman]

@@quetzalcoatl4255 oh im remembering wrong then, even more impressive

[@NinjaLobsterStudios]

I personally agree with you that if Armada still played Peach could be higher. A tier list is only accurate for the meta it describes and we no longer have a meta with a dominant Peach. However, there are some flaws with the pro-peach argument that I think justify Hax's placement For starters, Yoshi just wasn't as good back then. It's really not a reflection on Peach given the Yoshi development of the past few years. Secondly, and I think this is more important: Hax very clearly claims that Yoshi is the last solo viable character (I think Yoshi is justified as solo viable). Just because Peach could solo tournaments at one point in the past doesn't necessarily mean she is a solo contender now. Heck, Armada developed counter picks for Hbox and Leffen. If the best Peach ever couldn't solo Peach in a tournament, that strongly suggests the character isn't solo viable. If Yoshi is solo viable and Peach isn't, then there is no argument for Yoshi below Peach. Maybe it does seem odd to put Peach in the same tier as Pikachu but I think that says more about how good Pikachu is against random top tiers than it does about Peach.

[@heydms]

Great list! love hearing all the insight and thoughts around this!

[@loganmyall660]

Ready for some crazy opinions like fox in both place 1 and 2

[@Exl6243]

If Axe becomes dominant again, Marth would probably move down the tier list by maybe one spot, and Jigglypuff up by one spot

[@SharurFoF]

The problem with Roy is that there's no reason to pick him over Marth. If you're going to have a Roy secondary, it might as well be a Marth secondary unless you're Zain and you just like to mess around. So realistically he'll probably always be underdeveloped.

[@unapologeticasshat9214]

If you're using google chrome, google recently axed all adblocking compatibility with their browser. So anything chrome based is gonna experience ads now probably. Thats the reason you're getting that shit at the bottom. Also I'd argue that Jigglypuff is entirely and solely carried by Hungrybox, and wouldn't see her placings without him. I do agree with Yoshi above Peach but only very slightly. Unlike Puff whose tools are clearly defined, Yoshi takes a kind of gameplay only a very small niche of the community are going to be capable of getting to the level Amsa plays at. Also I think Ness might have a shot at being slightly untapped in the same way mewtwo is, they wont be winning tournaments but i can see some upsets in the future.

[@boxob093]

I use chrome, no issues here

[@Krix08]

firefox my beloved

[@HellCat_Kenny]

>using chrome ISHYGDDT

[@PolDlokay]

I agree. Hbox solely carries puff

[@clemmm.]

hey hax i've actually been waiting for your latest 2024 tier list. youre funny man

[@augustinius6586]

link over doc for the possible 14th spot is crazy.

[@KaitlynBurnellMath]

If the list is based on solo-maining, I don't think adult link would be 14th. Yes, he can counterpick one or two characters, just like young link can counterpick one or two characters (Armada's YL vs Puff). But from what I understand adult link has a miserable overall matchup spread.

[@TheTechnopider]

Link is substantially better against fastfallers than younglink is. That, plus being good vs marth and a lot of the midtiers, actually gives him a much better matchup spread than YL who is actually IMO is SIGNIFICANTLY worse vs spacies

[@ln8496]

Young link has a much better recovery in thether>walljump>upb. But all of his moves are significantly worse than links. Link has very good moves he’s just dumb slow

[@youri7229]

Also, both armada and hungrybox agree that puff probably wins the YL-Puff matchup but hungrybox was just inexperienced in the matchup and melee was a less developed game in general. Link is definitely the stronger character all around, Young Link just doesnt kill consistently outside of N-Air :(

[@TheTechnopider]

@youri7229 Although yl nair DOES go crazy but its very overshadowed by the tomfoolery that is links nair. they are both incredible but yl's is just incredible in a more traditional way

[@youri7229]

@@TheTechnopider lmao at Link's nair literally not having the ending checkpoint flag and thus his limp legs can still deal damage. Melee is so awesome.

[@MrPomegranX]

I've been HEAVILY waiting for this

[@InsyloFGC]

oh yeah?

[@MrPomegranX]

@InsyloFGC Yeah!

[@CosmicRadiationMusic]

Although I believe Ganon deserves a C tier placing and that Peach is maybe better than Yoshi, this is a pretty solid rule of thumb list. I also believe with so much player variance that a lot of match ups that people see as "slightly winning/losing" is just 50/50, no need to make it complicated. (an example being fox falco)

[@verbatim7508]

Now my friends can't say Melee sucks because "half the roster isn't even viable" lol

[@PolDlokay]

There has been potential for Bowser lately.

[@wonkywombat12]

hmm, I feel like I'd add a tier in between your current b and c tier and put pikachu and dk into that tier. my reasoning is that dk and pika have honestly fairly similar matchup spreads, with a few exceptions. they both do pretty well into spaces and marth, considering that they are mid tiers (I'd argue that dk prolly does better into spacies and pike better into marth but who knows), and both get absolutely trunched by sheik. However, dk has a surprisingly good puff matchup, while pika has a surprisingly good falcon matchup (I would say pika does better into falcon than dk does into puff, but I think dk also does better into falcon than pika does puff). Then both of them struggle with peach (though dk I think less so), for Yoshi honestly I have no idea because the gap between amsa and any other Yoshi is just so absurd that drawing conclusions on his matchups feels difficult to do, and they both get dunked on by it's. Incidentally dk also beats pikachu by a fair margin imo (just kills insanely early). So yeah I feel like they're similar enough that they ought to go in the same tier, ordering between the two of them I would say depends on your opinions on which matchups are more valuable and such, but they feel very similar to me despite being wildly different characters mechanically.

[@Anybanks]

I think this is the first time we have the exact same tier list, maybe it's a sign I've grown as a pplayer

[@Kawaiilolrofl]

Falcon should be in S tier, but otherwise it's looking fine

[@michaeltallafs7731]

Sad to see peach go from 4th in your 2014 tier list to 8th

[@iZergCraft]

Recent(ish) tournament results fuel people perception of the cast. If not for Mango actually coming back into form, you might see Falco drop a position as well

[@YauDerAllerEchte]

Absolutely forgot about G&W as another character to look out for Other than that pretty much agree with the Tier List except for a few nitpicks, well done

[@LHSMeleeClub]

Gnw shield holds him back from greatness tho :')

[@YauDerAllerEchte]

@@LHSMeleeClub I know. He would be at least High Tier with good Defense in my opinion. But still, I think his great offense with his huge disjoints, his edgeguarding, his combo game on fast fallers and his top 5 recovery still make him underated in todays meta

[@ln8496]

It has absolutely nothing to do with his shield. Dk, g&w, and the chus have no tech roll. They dont go anywhere. Pika can mitigate this by having an actual better tech in place than everyone else. Dk kills you when he touches you and he has good movement. G&w kinda just eats shit when hes knocked down

[@soloconnell34]

Mewtwo should be 14 in the c tier, but I agree that all these 13 should be there. Mewtwo is the answer to falco that link is the answer to marth

[@tkienjoyer]

redxlink thinking his main is s tier if not top 1. (I don't sgree with it but you gotta respect the optimism)

[@tuckerovermann6635]

What if we played that you had to split your 4 stocks between two characters? You pick the order they appear, blind to your opponents order

[@tuckerovermann6635]

Ooh or maybe we assign a point value to each tier and have a point limit. So you could have one stock of S tier and 3 stocks of C tier. Vs. 4 stocks of B tier. Or two stocks of S, two stocks of D

[@benjoleo]

I think Marth should be below Falco. Falcon, Pikachu, Yoshi and Sheik all seem much harder for Marth than for Falco and I think those matchups are important enough to outweigh Marth’s better Fox-Matchup

[@TheBeggies95]

You get it. Marth is 3rd. Falco is 2nd. But keep in mind, most lists are from spacies perspectives, they tend to ignore Marth weaknesses

[@MrPomegranX]

Hax, you had a rank set fighting the Mario "A Rookie" who I think is considered one of the best Regular Marios What did you think of that set?

[@Societyman123]

Captain falcon underrated

[@jesuspernia8031]

I think he’s 5th and Puff is MASSIVELY overrated and shouldn’t be placed above 6th

[@Ghoats]

genuinely surprised why people thought so low of link and roy for so long. there is no universe where mario is better then link and roy is right above pichu

[@duckbert3314]

What's your opinion on Mewtwo? Because in my opinion I think he's underrated.

[@kevinaweber6517]

Any thoughts on Mewtwo and mr game and watch

[@10Gpixels]

Link will make it. I believe

[@PalPlays]

Don't forget IC's abysmal Yoshi MU. They get destroyed by the next three characters above them. Their good MU against Marth doesn't save'em. You alluded that Marth/Yoshi was even. Did I get that right?

[@hylianmango8272]

WE GETTING AN ADBLOCKER WITH THIS ONE 🗣🗣🔥🔥🔥

[@astrojunkey]

Hax made this video for the sole purpose of saying Leader of the bunch, you know him well

[@r84nf04n5937f423]

Forgot link edit: I posted this before finishing the vid lmao my b

[@nwin4426]

Link mains rise up

[@AbefromanGW]

this is a very good tier list but why on earth wouldn't you just edit in a black bar to cover those ads at the bottom lmao

[@alexanderlane7863]

I actually think DK could go up next to pika, possibly right Infront of him, but I can understand pika being ahead because of slipperiness and speed

[@CatFighterForce9]

thank you for the positive content hax, ur a legend m8

[@redwarrior118]

DK might be better than Pikachu right now. DK does way better vs Fox than Pika does and has only one crippling matchup in the above tiers (Sheik) compared to Pika (Jigg, Peach, ICs). How DK does vs Peach is still unexplored though

[@jebril]

I main Peach, I think its slightly Peach favored but she doesnt dominate it like people think. She has great combos and neutral against him and can easily shield poke and pressure him but once he gets in he can destroy her with the cargo throw combo and easy kill set ups on her. Also his BAir is low key like Jiggs on her it’s so hard to space around sometimes.

[@xbox7912]

Can someone please explain, if Falco is so similar to Fox, then shouldn't they be right next to each other, then Marth?

[@lguy8476]

Why does DK look like he's getting arrested in the thumbnail lol

[@OmniAndro]

This year is DKs time in the sun; but my man Link is coming up!

[@ArtemisGlitch]

GAME AND WATCH

[@slippy318]

I don't see Luigi being more viable than Doc and the Links in the current meta.

[@heterodoxagnostic8070]

Didn't junebug say that both him and axe agreed that DK wins the matchup against pikachu? for that reason, i think DK should switch positions with pikachu.

[@Rynopb]

I think mario needs a little love. Some top player needs to push his meta. I think he is really good .

[@relentlesszard8166]

Mewtwo, Link and Samus are all underrated. (Roy was too)

[@Singleparentof20000]

Just crop the website

[@kupaxykalee4454]

He’s finally back to kick some tail 🦍🦍🦍

[@DrFate-dd7ek]

I kinda feel like Marth and fox could be in SS tier, but that’s splitting hairs I guess

[@Perc1000]

sorry hax but armada didnt become the greatest melee player of all time for you to put peach in B tier

[@catandfishfc]

Armada is our mid-tier hero! I think if Armada never quit he'd be going Fox/Peach around 50/50.

[@DoctorHazy]

Surprised by no Gannondorf...

[@supwithit]

Am I crazy to think Marth/Fox and Marth/Falcon are both 50/50?

[@TheBeggies95]

Marth slightly lose both MU imo

[@rachelivy9712]

no that's a very reasonable take

[@dominater5]

dr mario is definitely viable imo.

[@FullTimeWilly]

Hell yeah roy mentioned

[@lorenzoricci4551]

How can Falco be S when no one other than Mango won with him?

[@saulgoodguy1840]

No way youre putting dk below ICs and pika

[@Wishael]

why isnt puff S tier?

[@nickmayer1651]

but where's giga bowser?

[@ln8496]

Getting knee>falcon punched as a true combo. Unviable

[@avantchop]

y is luigi so much better than doc? especially with franz's results and doc lee

[@jpetrullo6890]

NEVER GIVE UP HAX 🔥🙏🙏🙏

[@cjfast11]

ganon has untapped potential imo but i see the link yl arguments

[@Elivoltek]

Everybody sleeping on Ness. Someday Ness will be as refined as DK or Yoshi I believe

[@WesleyFiles]

How your comment finds me: 😴

[@yobobby9]

Naw i stay sleeping. He has a bottom 3 recovery in the game, just back throw and throw out any hitbox or get hit by his up b. His ground attack dont beat CC, his aerials get outranged and his special moves are bad. He just has yoyo/thunderjacket and a combo game better than Zelda, Kirby, Bowser. Pichu is better than him imo

[@Elivoltek]

@@yobobby9 look up ness wallrides

[@lotgxj9215]

Recovery is too bad sadly he would be great without it

[@memeaficionado]

I wish there was more representation for the other almost viable characters. Big fan of watching any of the plumbers and Ganon. Interesting that you think Roy has lots of potential, brings me back to the "skilled roy" meme

[@rachelivy9712]

I think Roy gets bodied by every high/ top tier except spacies so I thought that was weird that he is potentially a mid tier. Those are important match ups to be good in but a character does have to be good against the cast to be good. I think if Zain was playing Roy all the time there would be about 10 non-spacie characters to use as a counter pick for people to pick up without much effort. However Mango has won tournaments by going only Falco because he had all fast faller brackets meaning he didn't have to think about warming up his fox for Marths/ floaties. Maybe Roy is the most likely to get good bracket luck because of how many spacie players they are even though think Doc, Ganon, Link and others are all just solidly better characters.

[@skii_mask_]

gotta switch to Firefox for ad blocker!

[@ImWeirdBoy]

Much love.

[@ln8496]

Roy has a few workable top tier matchups but he has like way more completely unplayable ones. I actually think ganon/climbers vs roy are the worst matchups in the game, worse than bowser sheik. And it might not be close in comparison. The ganon chaingrab on roy is just as bad if not worse than sheiks on bowser.

[@INSANECRAZYHODAPP]

I just don't see Ics being viable, just people being bad

[@ln8496]

I found you

[@ln8496]

Insane carzy guy from smash boards

[@INSANECRAZYHODAPP]

@ln8496 I recently made a pretty cool combo video if You'd wanna check that out

[@TheBeggies95]

ICs benefits a lot of people inexperience in the MU

[@orionparsons7631]

I would genuinely love to see link and DK (low tiers in general) go far in the current meta i honestly believe DK has A tier potential or possibly even S

[@Haywire5714]

only cody can make fox work tbh

[@holyknightthatpwns]

People have been making fox work for decades, and Mang0 could make it as a fox solo again if he wanted to. Terrible take

[@TheBeggies95]

Awful take, 33% of the top 100 are fox players. Thats 1/3 of top players AND fox has the most representation in the top 30

[@trademarked2476]

@@TheBeggies95 also like, everyone has a fox, cant say that abt other characters.

[@jesuspernia8031]

The most common character in the game can only be made work by one person?

[@TastyLemon123]

Good list

[@Swampson1738]

HYPE

[@yobobby9]

Imo it goes: S: Fox, Marth Fox is even or + on whole cast, he is on any stage. Marth is 55:45 on Fox in Bo5, Even or winning on anyone else. But for Sheik who he is 44:55 with. So basically loses 1 MU but Wins against the best character. A: Falco, Jigglypuff, Sheik - Falco is 50/50 against Fox and Marth, but has a slight disadvantage on some stages. He could slightly beat Puff and definitely beats Falcon. Otherwise he is 50/50 with everyone else in top 8, he is basically A+. - Puff beats Sheik, so she goes ahead of her but they are pretty much tied for 4th. B+: Falcon, Peach, Yoshi Hot take: Falcon is 6-4 against both spacies, it is uncommon for him to get lamed out by them. He losses to Sheik 45-55 as well. Against Marth and Puff he is 50/50 and beats lower tier characters except for Chu. Falcon is basically B+. - Peach goes 50/50 with Falco and Falcon, but every other MU is slightly losing. Yoshi doesn’t really win any MU’s, but losses 3 for sure. B: Ice Climbers, Samus - Pikachu, Luigi-Doc -Icies beat Sheik, Pika and Doc. They lose to almost everyone above them. - Samus who is tied with Pika, goes 55:45 with Fox. Does okay into Marth & Peach depending on stage. Does not totally lose into Puff & Sheik. However, does lose to Falcon and Falco. While Pikachu goes even with Marth & Falcon. Does okay but losing to Falco and Sheik. But he gets destroyed by Puff, Icies, Peach and Fox. - Luigi and Doc are kinda opposite of eachother MU wise. In MUs like Fox/Falco, Marth/Sheik, Falcon/Puff. One is good and the other is bad. They lose to everyone in their tier except Pikachu. C: DK, Mario, Gannon, Both Links DK is bad when behind in stocks almost like puff. Once people figure out safe, non cc able approaches and edge guard setups for his character he will end up around here. The rest is self explanatory, this is the pocket pick tier, they only have 1 good top tier MU and 2-3 decent high tier MU. D: Mewtwo, Roy, G&W Pretty much, good character but “fatal” flaw tier. I think M2 has the highest potential due to his execution kinda like DK’s meta but way harder. Roy does good into spacies for this tier, bumping him up. G&W does good into floaties who arent peach or icies. D-: Pichu, Zelda, Ness Pichu has the best punish game here and recovery. He’s defensive game is poor but has a good ledge dash, shield and small hurtbox. Zelda > Ness due to recovery since ness is basically like lil mac when it comes to edgeguarding. F: Kirby, Bowser. Kirby is actually bad, if just punish roll in up tilts and know how to edge guard him due to his low air speed. Bowser is pretty much unplayable except on Yoshi’s, which will be banned in bo3s.

[@johawk360]

lets go hax

[@MUGEN64]

good list :)

[@stradeup207]

CONTENT

[@SBLPanda]

GOATTTTTTTTTTTTTT 🐐🐐🐐

[@lotgxj9215]

🎉

[@RiqMoran]

dont show this to leffen

[@bobrze]

ublock origin

[@CollynsTV]

hax ma boy

[@5gods]

Dorf, Doc, and Luigi where??

[@David-eo5ik]

🎉hax$ babyyy

[@iHealix]

W

[@alexanderespinoza]

im gay

[@kylemanley915]

Luigi beats Samus

[@NiekloLaarman]

Dk better than doc, luigi and samus is so just a bad opinion.

[@PolDlokay]

Unlock origin

[@tomoflathead]

noice

[@murlock792]

Joke video Forced to watch ADS Weird tier list

[@lotgxj9215]

Nice haha