They Told Us Cyclists Don’t Actually Use Bike Lanes

We hear this surprisingly often: “My city built bike lanes, but cyclists don’t actually use them. They just ride on the road or the sidewalk instead.” For this video we decided to get out our clipboards, put on our research hats, and go collect some data on how commonly cyclists ignore bike lanes and why they do it.
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#cycling #urbanplanning #bikelanes

[@alsifjlasieflooo]

"If the road or sidewalk is more appealing than the bike lane, there's probably something wrong with the bike lane." Oh my god, a thousand times YES!!

[@WalterStucco]

there's not proof that's true though. the most probable reason is the path of least resistance, people don't use bike lanes because they don't want to, because roads are ALWAYS more appealing than bike lanes, unless they are forced to (high speed roads for example, were they can't match car speed or streets were they do not want to cycle close to vehicles, like the first example in this video). For the same reason cars use highways when they can instead of narrower roads, there's nothing wrong about them, they are just less appealing IN GENERAL. Besides, with that logic we could say that the fact that people prefer cars over bikes means that THERE'S PROBABLY SOMETHING WRONG WITH BIKES, don't we?

[@truetrueevil1]

I'm a road cyclist, and TBH unless the road is over 40mph I will ride the road often. Wide cycle lanes are great and I make good use of them but narrow tracks I often end up stuck behind scooters and tootlers. Around me there are also a lot of on pavement assigned cycle lanes and they're dreadful, potholes, trees, roots, signposts in the middle of them, pedestrians standing in them because they don't realise they're cycle lanes and they divert around bus stops, to pedestrian crossings of roads etc. I've even (with love and good humour) shouted at a few police officers/CSOs strolling along in the pavement bike lanes.

[@znail4675]

@@WalterStucco Why are roads ALWAYS more appealing then bike lanes? Not having to deal with cars is rather appealing when on a bike, It's only when the bike lane is unsafe, crowded or bad in some other way when the road starts to look more appealing.

[@RafTheDude]

​@@WalterStucco Hard disagree. I use the sidewalk because I have to partially commute through 4 miles of a stroad. Having vehicles zooming by at 50mph is not pleasant at all. As for your claim that "maybe there is something wrong with bike lines," the reason why there is something "wrong" with them is because they are designed around car infrastructure. And because cities are often designed for the car and have a higher capacity, people will inevitably choose a car when the option is available. For me, that option is *not* available so I have to use the sidewalk from time to time, so I am ever happy whenever I see a purely dedicated paved trail on my way to work.

[@DailyBeatings]

@@RafTheDude It's not only the cars at speed, but the rudeness when using the bike lane on a stroad. I've had people lay on the horn and start yelling at me multiple time when traveling through an intersection while in the clearly marked bike lane. It's like you don't exist, even with all the signage we have to "share the road".

[@neckenwiler]

If people criticized cars as much as they criticize bikes and scooters, we’d be in a much better place.

[@58209]

@@Alexrocksdude_ that sub goes to the extreme and is very toxic to anything that isn't walking or public transit. cars are still necessary for things like door-to-door disability transit, small deliveries. and work vehicles, but they refuse to accept that disabled people and workers burdened with essential equipment need access to small personal vehicles.

[@kenflict9931]

@@58209 untrue, im part of the sub and the majority do understand that some cars are a necessity. we just want to get rid of cars that unnecessarily waste space. and wanting more walkable places actually helps disabled people because they can walk there or use some other way of transport, instead of driving since there are disabled people who have to rely on others to drive them.

[@58209]

@@kenflict9931 multiple times i've witnessed fuckcars brigaiding and taking over threads. arguing that disabled people need to be rounded up into nursing homes like we need to be sequestered into asylums again. y'all can claim the sub is whatever you like, but the reality of your sub's culture is that it is highkey ableist.

[@pwarn1]

@@58209 right tool for the job. I own a car but I don't know if it starts. I commute on a bike (motor, mostly) and I load my 5ton truck before heading out to urban (so uncivilised) Vancouver area. My point is drivers are creatures of habit. Often unecessary habit

[@godw1ll99]

lol what? like half the country, u.s, criticizes cars. that is like saying no one celebrates pride as an entire month is dedicated to doing just that...

[@Nein9Nine]

A week or so ago I pulled out of the bike lane into the car lane at a red light (this is a street with low speed right outside the ferry terminal) to make a left turn in Halifax, NS. This prompted the guy IN FRONT of me to roll his window down and say "yOu knOw TheRE's a BikE lAne thERe, rIghT??", to which I responded, "Yes, I'm turning left". This got me the classic retort: "SO??". I said "I can't make a left turn from the bike lane", so he rolled his eyes and his window up before I could ask him if I was in his way on my big rolling fortress of a bicycle BEHIND HIS CAR. The entitlement some drivers feel over public space (the streets of our cities) is mind-boggling.

[@BlueCyann]

I bet he went home and whined about wasting his taxpayer dollars on bike lanes that nobody uses.

[@adrianalexandrov7730]

@@BlueCyann I rode in Finland and what they often do on the highways and sometimes in the cities is make a bikelane go underneath the road, so that you can turn left.

[@jnharton]

I don't live in Canada and maybe that guy was unnecessarily rude, but there is a fundamental reality that's problematic there. AFAIK the whole point of a bike lane is to keep car and bike traffic separated. So crossing into the car lane is sort of a violation of the principle, but also a safety issue and makes you a traffic hazard. The fact that the road is marked for a slower maximum speed is valid, but at the same time bicyclists and automobile drivers are operating very different vechicles with a somewhat different set of assumptions. If the government, municipality wants people to do what you did, they need to formalize rules and mark/sign roads in a way that facilitates it.

[@adrianalexandrov7730]

@@jnharton it was red light, not that the traffic was moving at significantly different speeds.

[@ichijofestival2576]

@@jnharton Across North America, bikes exist in a liminal, partly-overlapping space between "vehicle" and "pedestrian." Any laws recognizing them are a complete mess, riddled with so many conditionals that it seems you could do just about anything. And that's because the infrastructure is so inconsistent/nonexistent that if lawmakers laid down any solid rules, they'd have to actually spend the time and money to make sure those rules could be followed. And so that's the system we've got: in cases where 'the system' is deemed impractical or unworkable, wing it. Ride on the sidewalk, ride with traffic ("vehicular cycling"), whatever you need to do. And that's what this guy did, and was legally entitled to do. (Of course, local laws vary. If you haven't seen it, "Bike Lanes by Casey Neistat" illustrates how broken those laws can be.)

[@Aleksandar6ix]

I am a Toronto cyclist, and though I do use the bike lane myself, I would actually feel SAFER riding on the street instead of the lanes due to all the people that don't pay attention to what's coming on the lanes - opening car doors, stepping off the sidewalk, right turning cars not using their mirrors, etc.... Now that I see this video, I think I actually WILL use the road, as long as I can keep the pace.

[@tomlxyz]

So the bike lane is designed wrong

[@dermick]

@@tomlxyz Exactly. Go to NL to see how bike lanes done correctly.

[@FakeSchrodingersCat]

The main thing is the as long as you can keep the pace part. Though I agree the major reason is when bike lanes are designed wrong, if you can keep up with traffic then only the real assholes are going to get mad at you for riding on the road. Personally I just can't go at the speed of car traffic both because I am not fit enough but also because my bike is built for comfort not speed, so crappy bikelanes or the sidewalk for me.

[@nicholassapp7136]

Former Toronto cyclist here. I usually stuck with the bike lanes, but downtown near the University would get crazy congested. Moving into the car lanes was necessary. I'd also point out the obvious: bikes are vehicles and bikers have every right to take a lane. I'll usually stay to the right, but not if it's a left turn.

[@RobeonMew]

Exactly. self important bikers who go slow and ride center of the lane, forces me onto the road

[@kenny1514]

Our societies have also normalized traffic violations by car. Some examples include: - not using turn signals (especially here in Quebec). - not fully stopping at Stop signs. - parking in "no parking" zones, including on bike lanes. - and the most normalized of all is driving above the speed limit.

[@steemlenn8797]

The stop sign thing is simly because 99% of them are stupid. Hard to blame people ignoring something that should not be there in almost all cases. The last point has also a lot of wrong road design at fault. If your neighborhood street looks like a highway, people will be using is like that. Drivers do wrong here, but the builders are the ones at fault.

[@loup9003]

Agreed on point number 1. Especially dangerous when the driver not using their signal is turning right, but you, as a cyclist, is right next to them, waiting to go straight ahead. I have to either wait that cars passes or put myself in front of them so that they see me and don't turn in me. Of course, all of this is happening on a stroad, here in Lévis.

[@kenny1514]

@@loup9003 I have been hit a few times by drivers doing exactly that when I am on my bike or scooter and on their right. It literally makes me anxious and super vigilant when I am going around town now

[@kenny1514]

@@steemlenn8797 I agree that poor road design is where the problem begins. However, on the last point, I will argue that no pro car centric residents are in favor of traffic calming measures/design. In fact most of the ones I have talked to actually want design that allows them to go even faster with their cars

[@steemlenn8797]

@@kenny1514 That may be true, but is still no contradiction to what I said. Proper road design MAKES people drive slowly, even if they want to be faster.

[@alex2143]

Usually when people say "cyclists don't use the bike lane", what they mean is "i saw a cyclist that didn't use the bike lane". Because if they see a shitty driver, they go "what a shitty driver", but if they see a shitty cyclist, they go "those shitty cyclists". The answer "well then there is something wrong with the bike lane" usually works. It makes no sense whatsoever that bicyclists would opt to mingle with multi tonne metal boxes going at lethal speeds rather than infrastructure specifically designed for them, UNLESS said design is really shitty.

[@Devilwarrior89946]

That’s really the problem. people that view cyclists as a minority of people who likes bikes, or who likes trains, trams, planes, or anything. But there’s also car enthusiast who geek out about cars. However the majority of people probably just want to get from point A to point B. If you give cyclists their own protective lane completely separate from cars. Design bike paths that activity try and avoid cyclists and car drivers from intermingling with each other on the streets. I bet no one would even bat an eye about “those shitty cyclists” because they have their own road or lane to get them from point A to point B just like cars do. When I hear people say those words. Some portion of the population car dependent, don’t see that riding a bike from point A to point B is also a transportation tool. Instead of a “recreation” or “sport”. Also I want to say this on a tangent. A bike can’t severely damage car, even if it went very fast. But a major car collision can heavily damage a car from even function at all.

[@jwtrull6431]

100% echo what Justin says above, but also this. If I'm not using an available bike lane, 90% of the time it's because there's something wrong with the bike lane and usually it's for SAFETY. I have felt very unsafe in many parking-protected divided bike lanes because both pedestrians and drivers don't seem to see me as well. I often feel much safer in the roadway, where I'm more easily seen and have more time to react to conflict with pedestrians and turning autos. Usually the common problems are: peds crossing street at odd spots to get to businesses or cars, peds walking in the protected bike lane as if it were a sidewalk, cars turning out into the roadway and trying to see around parked cars, or cars turning into businesses and not seeing me because I'm obstructed by parked cars. For these, reasons I find it unsafe to ride in many protected bike lanes. If you are riding at a very leisurely pace most of these conflicts are much less of a concern, but if you are travelling at 10+ MPH they quickly become a concern. Unfortunate choice for me to have to make.

[@jsrodman]

@@jwtrull6431 People are definitely VERY cavalier about how they interact with parking protected bike lanes until there's a critical mass of bicyclists that force them to take it seriously. I have to shout or ring a bell to stop pedestrians from walking directly into me all too often.

[@poppinov8797]

What about the grown adult men that ride on the sidewalk and shout at women pushing strollers to get out of the way? I see cyclists on the sidewalk two or three blocks from a street with a bike lane. What about all those shitty cyclists? Are they all fictional too?

[@eleven-eleven-eleven]

@@jwtrull6431 Yes! The problem is that the bike lines need to be separated from the pedestrians as well. That so-called protected bike lane on Bloor is a nightmare because pedestrian often use it as an extension of the sidewalk. Having to ride down a narrow tunnel with parked cars on my left, with people shuttling across the bike lane to the sidewalk while, at the same time, having to watch out for pedestrians wandering into the bike lane from the sidewalk on my right is faaaaaaar from ideal. It's stressful and dangerous. Meanwhile, there's slower cyclists ahead of me who can't hear my bell because they're wearing headphones and riding in the middle of the bike lane. Yes, I'm a faster cyclist but I'm not exceeding any speed limits. My solution is to either avoid roads with protected bike lanes altogether or to just ride in the traffic lane with the cars. Seriously, it feels much safer to me.

[@tomchristensen9588]

As a UK cyclist for my whole life, it's often safer to cycle in front of cars sometimes so they see you rather than relying on them checking their mirrors before they turn, but I tend to use the bike lane for long stretches.

[@theblackrose3130]

Most of the bike lanes in the UK are next to useless. I call them paint gutters. Many of them are not even painted wide enough for cars to pass you the legally required (1.5 metres)

[@lf1980]

agreed. paths behind parked cars are downright dangerous. Bad enough some drivers dont register you when turning on or off roads, but when you're completely hidden, you stand no chance, especially if you are moving at any decent amount of speed

[@OliverCrowhurst]

Here in Australia most of the roads don't even have bike lanes, and when they do, they're filled with gravel, glass, or are just way too bumpy to ride in. This is why (as a 'sports' cyclist as you call them) I always just use the road, because it's much safer and the road surface is much nicer.

[@jbosco3970]

g'day mate. what are your thoughts on separate bike infrastructure funded by a special annual levy on bikes. with funds registration being managed by the corresponding biking orgns in each state rather than the state govt. ( which just gets spent on utter rubbish)

[@OliverCrowhurst]

@@jbosco3970 yeah that could work

[@Jessev741]

@@jbosco3970 All that bureaucracy just wastes money. Bike lanes leave everyone better off by removing cars from the street, creating less pollution, etc. There should be as few barriers to cycling as possible and cycling infrastructure should be paid for from general funds just as roads and sidewalks are.

[@peterlip8]

⁠@@jbosco3970 most roads are made using tax payer dollars. Why can’t bike lanes be built with tax dollars instead charging us a levy??

[@paceline]

@@peterlip8 Bosco doesn't seem to understand that many of those cyclists own and drive cars too.

[@namenamename390]

Seeing cyclists on the sidewalk reminds me of a post I read by a guy who commuted by unicycle. His reasoning was that riding a bike on the sidewalk was illegal where he lived, despite the fact that there were no alternatives except driving on busy stroads. Unicycles however are exempt from this ban, so he was legally allowed to use the safer sidewalk while still being faster than just walking.

[@Jodamo]

Unicycles are the way. Bicycles are 2 wheel cheaters.

[@AileTheAlien]

Let's goooooo!

[@Amir_404]

Lets be honest, that guy was probably looking for any chance to ride his unicycle.

[@carstarsarstenstesenn]

Good for him but I wouldn't see that as a win. Riding on sidewalks sucks unless it's very wide and has no people coming in and out of buildings-which is rare. I only ride on sidewalks if there's no people walking on them and it has to be wide enough to pass a pedestrian

[@pwarn1]

There are no rules for unis. Too few, slow and compact to matter but cyclists on the sidewalk are a liability. Go ahead, endanger pedestrians, leashed dogs, strollers. "Reasoning" :) good one

[@GoshDarnHippies]

As a delivery rider for many years, I’m glad you raised that many of these lanes are too narrow to pass safely, and make it difficult to cross to the other side of the street. Cyclists are always allowed to take the lane in Ontario according to the HTA if they can 1. Go the speed of traffic, 2. Need to make a turn, or 3. The bike lane/shoulder is dangerous/blocked. On Bloor Street in Toronto, my friend was actually harassed by Toronto police for riding on the road because according to the cop “he’s supposed to be in the bike lane”. After calling all kinds of backup they let him be because they don’t even know the laws they’re enforcing.

[@Altema22]

Excellent point. I frequently go on group rides, and in those instances we don't use the bike lanes if they are small. I remember the occupants of a huge SUV threatening us and yelling to get off the 25mph limit road because "there's a bike lane right there! $&#@$". A group of 40 cyclists with various degrees of experience on a 36 inch wide painted lane... I'm sure it will be fine!

[@panbalala]

@@Altema22 White, a bit overweight and with sunglass +caps ?

[@TunaBagels]

Police don't need to know the law. They're burly bureaucrats with guns.

[@rogerwilco2]

It is so sad that a lot of police has turned from officers serving and protecting the community to being "law enforcement".

[@SharienGaming]

@@rogerwilco2 thats an odd way to spell "mercenary"

[@LilBoyHexley]

It is actively upsetting that those suburban shopping centers have huge lawns of grass between the parking lots and the road, sometimes more than 2 lanes of traffic worth. But the only non-car infrastructure is a tiny sidewalk just a few feet wide.

[@robgrey6183]

That's private property. Maybe you should offer to buy it and turn it into a bike lane.

[@LilBoyHexley]

@@robgrey6183 Okay? Is that meant to make me think this land use is cool?

[@onyxtay7246]

@@robgrey6183 Private property which cannot be used for anything else due to regulations requiring a parking lot and a wide space around the road in order to compensate for drivers deciding to fling their cars over the sidewalk through reckless behavior. You're a dumbass. A problem like this cannot be solved by individual actions, because the system we operate within is flawed.

[@motherlove8366]

One notion that annoys me to no end and is seldom mentioned is that some of the biking infrastructure is completely unintuitive. Sometimes in big intersections that bike signage just stops and the only safe thing I'm comfortable doing is going the pedestrian way. Similarly we have bike lanes that merge onto bus lanes, which is fine when there's no bus but silly when there is one as there's no room to overtake, so you have to merge back onto the road, and merge in and out of the road is the most dangerous thing you can do. We also have a lot of lanes painted on the sidewalk which is fine sometimes, but some other times I just use the road to avoid the 50 million bumps on and off the sidewalk at every single intersection that stop you from every getting speed and make me more worried about accidentally getting a flat. It only just recently occurred to me that having the bikes/pedestrian go down to car level was a design choice and not an inherent road property, and you could just as easily have a continuous cycle lane and have the cars go up the bike bump when turning. Another thing we have in Luxembourg is specific crossing lights for bikes and pedestrian which I definitely never use and have seldom seen anyone using because idk how they're programmed but you have to wait an absolutely ridiculous amount of time (sometimes 4-5 minutes) to get a green light as a pedestrian or bicycle. So I do as almost everyone does, look around and go when it's clear. One really positive thing I want to share is that with bicycle infrastructure being actively developed in Luxembourg, it becomes incredibly obvious that the more accessible biking is, the more people bike. I see many more cyclist now and many different types of cyclists. Lots of small folding bikes, lots of race bikes, lots of cargo ebikes, it's awesome and really reinforces the idea that infrastructure is the main problem.

[@Alina_Schmidt]

Exactly! A lot of times you don‘t even know where you‘re supposed to go.

[@Poptartsicles]

It doesn't only suck to bike on a narrow unprotected bike lane, it's downright dangerous! If you aren't a seasoned rider or if weather isn't great, it can be borderline suicidal.

[@SmallSpoonBrigade]

In those cases, you'd either ride in the road if you can keep up, or on the sidewalk if you can't. But, honestly, as a motorcyclist, I have very little sympathy for cyclists given that near complete lack of either training or protective gear. I don't wish ill on anybody, but you do kind of deserve whatever happens if you're not protecting yourself. It's hardly just card drivers that make things dangerous, any crash at speeds that bikes can go, especially downhill, are going to be serious crashes. The lack of a motor doesn't change that.

[@Poptartsicles]

@@SmallSpoonBrigade You do realize there are many other countries in the world where riding a bike is extremely common and safe, and most of those places they don't wear any protective gear. Being hit by a car is THE MOST dangerous thing that can happen to a cyclist. Cars are dangerous, cars hit with literal tons of force, not bikes. Safety and protection starts with the road being safe in the first place. Pedestrians don't sprint across highways in hockey pads to be safe, no, they demand a crossing be installed, they demand infrastructure. Pedestrians and cars are rightfully separated. Bikes should also be separated for the same reasons. Commutes shouldn't be a life or death decision, and it's cars that make it one.

[@Angultra]

That's actually the best case in my Toronto suburb. If you're lucky, a narrow painted line for a couple blocks then disappears suddenly; most just ride on the sidewalk. With no bike lane at all and wide stroad (the default), 100% ride sidewalk except for the occasional roadie. The sidewalk isn't even used much by pedestrians since most drive. Plus massive parking lots with rarely a bike rack in sight.

[@mourlyvold64]

@@SmallSpoonBrigade "you do kind of deserve whatever happens if you're not protecting yourself" Fair enough. But when you organise your infrastructure better (like in the Netherlands) statistics show that more serious head trauma occurs in bathrooms than by cycling. So then the question is: should we start wearing a helmet when taking a shower?

[@jeffeyro]

I unfortunately agree with you. Where I live, pretty much all we have are narrow unprotected bike lanes. I've always loved them, and had no issues, but when I brought my wife on a ride it was not the same experience. She's a beginner on a bike, and riding in the bike lane just doesn't work for her. She gets super nervous, starts making mistakes, and really doesn't like it. I've ridden my whole life, and I'm very comfortable on a bike. I never really thought about how the bike lanes feel for someone with little to no experience on bikes. I use to think the protected bike lanes were a little overkill, but I've changed my mind, and support them. The city I live in has talked about implementing them, and I hope they do!

[@halgerson]

I started watching (and became a patron) because I really appreciate your positivity and optimism. It probably doesn't drive viewership as much as the righteous indignation of other channels, but you make me hopeful that change is not only possible, but is occurring.

[@betula2137]

Optimism! ;3

[@SaveMoneySavethePlanet]

Agreed. I’m all about the more positive vibes. Lord knows I have enough other things in my life trying to make me as angry as possible…

[@ayauyqr]

I've been searching for a word or phrase to describe why I don't like some other similar channels, like Not Just Bikes, and I think I might steal "righteous indignation". I mean, the dude over at Not Just Bikes makes great points, but his condescension is a major turn off for me.

[@magladek]

To be fair, righteous anger/indignation can galvanize the people to put in work towards change too. Just depends on the person consuming the content. I like Oh The Urbanity a lot too, but sometimes extreme, forced positivity can be just as off-putting (not saying Oh The Urbanity feels forced).

[@Jacksparrow4986]

@@ayauyqr well he is positive. Just not when talking about north America...

[@gilesclone]

You should try some typical cities in the US. Often the bike lanes are really door zones, gutters or parking lanes. You see a much higher percentage on the sidewalk or street when that happens.

[@ciliciaann3504]

I live in rural Illinois, What is a bike lane?! 😩

[@chrisdaigle5410]

Not to mention that the bike lanes are NEVER swept and they're full of sand, gravel, glass and other debris. It's even worse when the lanes are beside and travel lane.

[@seattlegrrlie]

It is garbage day, let us put our garbage cans in the middle of the bike lane instead of our driveway

[@I.____.....__...__]

In my schitty, half of the bike-lanes are filled with telephone-/electric-/traffic-light poles or metal garbage-bins bolted to the ground. I currently opt to ride in the sidewalk while I work on my ability to fly or phase through solid objects. 😒

[@phastinemoon]

God, yes. My city is pretty bike friendly compared to other cities in the US, and STILL, these bike lanes SUCK -- the upkeep on the road is terrible, and there's constant potholes and cracks, for one, and they're always just kept separate by just a line of paint, so you constantly see drivers using them, or just parking in them. For my safety, my bike is a pedestrian and F999 any of you who say 'Get off the sidewalk'.

[@Nils_Ki]

Being a German who has also lived in Denmark for many years and who has always frequently used the bicykle commuting to work, I have seen lots of examples of both really bad and really great bicykle lines. German cities have a lot to learn from Scandinavian and Benelux cities on that front.

[@arvetemecha]

being french and having friends from Aachen and Köln, I can assure you you have great infrastructures compared to what we see here in the north of France...(which has no excuse to become more bike friendly, it's slowly getting better...but such a long way to catch up with the neighbours). Not far from home they built a bike lane so wrong I wonder how the could think of it. If you want to ride on that lane, you have to stop every 50m to cross the road and follow on the other side. I wonder if it's some kind of prank they did...

[@Henning_Rech]

Fully agree, the majority of bike lanes in my area (SW Germany) are useless, dangerous, but for sure expensive. Either they are shared with pedestrians (walking in groups side by side, walking a dog with the leash cross the narrow lane) wich legally have priority! - they are allowed to block the lane as long as they feel. Or they are dangerous because they are off the car road, and though the cyclist would theoretically have priority over traffic from side streets, they even cannot see a cyclist coming. Or they just end somewhere, with no solution for the cyclist to enter the car traffic. No way to turn left into a street if you are on the bike lane. On demand traffic lights? - there is an inductive sensor for cars, and a push-button for pedestrians. Nothing for cyclists.

[@blacky_Ninja]

In my german city the‘ve build a very nice bicycle lane with it‘s own traffic lights and such next to the road and many cities now plan to upgrade their bicycle lanes aswell. 🥰

[@Imintune...]

Lanes are too narrow gor multiple users

[@Nils_Ki]

@@Imintune... that is often the case in Germany, yes: bicycle lanes being to narrow, to curvy or not well enough separated from sidewalks. All that makes fast going bicyclists evade to the car lanes.

[@coreysimmerer]

Great video and response to the sentiment that “cyclists don’t use bike lanes”! Unfortunately, I feel like many anti-cyclist motorists just look for every excuse to continue to dominate urban streets. A common one I hear here in Baltimore is that “they built a bike lane and nobody uses it” which is usually a) mostly false and b) because the city still has a fragmented protected bike lane network, discouraging use except for less risk-averse cyclists. I think more data collection like you two did would help the cause. I would love to see more of those automatic bike lane counters everywhere

[@Richard-qx2zx]

"We put in 200 feet of bike lane connected to nothing as a 'pilot program' and nobody uses it! Bike lanes are worthless!!"

[@rangersmith4652]

Motorists complain about having to share _their_ roads with slower bikes but think nothing of forcing bikes to share _their_ road with slower walkers. Go figure.

[@ripred42]

Sadly data isn’t really the issue. Most of these people are operating from an irrational emotional frame about their “territory” being taken away from them. I’ve been to public meetings where drivers will claim the data presented is biased or made up.

[@polendri4812]

A related one is "they took away a car lane to add bike lanes and I never even see cyclists use it", for which I think the frustration is understandable at a surface level. It's tricky to explain how it takes a critical mass of bike infrastructure before it's practical enough for people to want to use it, and trickier still to explain how having these awesome empty bike lanes to tempt people out of their cars with is sort of the point.

[@slothpalms8124]

There's plenty of research and data to support cycling and pedestrian infrastructure, not to mention entire countries that do it amazingly. Car centered people just ignore it because they're too used to car-dominant infrastructure to be able to think of anything different. It's not the amount of data that needs to change, it's the people that refuse to accept it.

[@ReubenAotearoa_]

I ride outside the bike lanes: 1) to avoid the bicycle priority traffic signal which prioritises turning cars 2) pass slower cyclists (because retaining car parking in more important than wider lanes) 3) to avoid broken glass and slippery leaves 4) to avoid clueless pedestrians and people getting out/into parked cars 5) because cars pulling out of the parking garage and businesses and crossing the cycle path don’t see you 6) because halfway along the road the cycle lane switches sides, then switches back further along. 7) to make a right turn (cyclists are expected to cross with pedestrians) So the bulk of these are because of poor cycle lane design. It’s what happens when you try to appease the residents who are stuck in a 1970s small town mindset and are obsessed about those rates bills (have they not seen Strong Towns?): you get the worst of both worlds.

[@hillyseattlenarrowstreets6087]

Agree 100% with you and that's why I converted my bike to an ebike - mountain bike with Bafang BBS02 mid-drive. It offers good speed (28 mph) and power to deal with riding in traffic. If you're going too slow on the road, you make drivers mad. Always have a Left hand mirror so you know when you can take command of the road, and have a good bell to warn pedestrians and other bikes if you're nearby or passing. Also, try not to be a jerk. Safe rides Reuben!!

[@fluuufffffy1514]

Oh yeah, #3 is a big one! Need more street sweepers, for real

[@pwarn1]

Bike lanes are simply impractical. Politicians like them because they are polarising, whether you ride or drive

[@sethtenrec]

@@hillyseattlenarrowstreets6087 try not to be a jerk! 👍👍 more bicyclists need to follow that one!

[@GuillaumePerronNantel]

I always go same way than cars because it’s easier to navigate and safer. I hate those cycling lines because the closest rider to the road goes face to face with cars and pedestrians are mostly unaware of riders, purely dangerous. Also, transitions between cycling lines and roads are sometimes bumpy enough to make it dangerous. The bumps could break a wheel or make you deviate from you trajectory while cars are left and right.

[@rileyrat13]

As a fellow two wheeler (motorcycle) and runner, I feel the pain of cyclists. In my area I have no safe running paths and have to run on the edge of in town roads or the shoulder of higher speed out of town roads and it can be downright horrifying at times. On my motorcycle, it's common for people to cut me off, merge into the spot I'm occupying, and just flat out not notice I exist. This stuff is nearly daily yet all you hear about is how a biker did this or that to them once...like 10 years ago so it's the rider that's unsafe.

[@JohnSmith-pn1vv]

In 1872 I saw a man run a red light on his Penny farthing

[@CRneu]

Yeah I've lived all over the western US and as a runner it's downright scary AF to run on some remote roads. People don't pay attention, there isn't a shoulder, but there isn't really anywhere else to run. Motorists are ridiculous about it too. I've been honked at a "run down" by trucks because apparently them having to let off the throttle and go over the middle lane a tiny bit is a huge issue for them.

[@Portablesounds]

The reason I will avoid using bike lanes in some places (at least here in the Bay area) is due to how much road debris is swept into the bike lanes! I've had 4 tires pop using bike lanes here, one of them was even brand new! Also my commute bike lane allows parking from 7PM to 2AM, but people ignore this so I either dangerously weave in and out of traffic or just occupy one of the two lanes as I should.

[@FirstLast-jm4dx]

Not to mention the bike lanes are often in worse condition than the road...

[@zometthecomet]

YEP not to mention the fucking homeless people are so fucking bad in Canada and the police do NOTHING at all to help… glass is being thrown everywhere and not being cleaned up 😢

[@MrsBifflechips]

When I talk to people about the lack of bike infrastructure, they often say "But [your street] has bike infrastructure!" However, it's the type that Ogilvie Rd has -- a besewered and potholed gutter with a painted white bike, threaded between cars that want to turn and buses that want to stop. It's terrifying and deadly and I really don't blame people for not using it. It feels like an afterthought or a symbolic gesture. It could be so much better! It could be a practical way for people in the area to pick up groceries or get take-out or go to work or school. Thank you for the video (and all the data collection)! I do love the positivity and reasonableness of your videos.

[@EricaGamet]

"Besewered" is a great word that I will endeavor to work into normal conversation.

[@thurstonkuriata7929]

Similarly, Melbourne, Australia has 'bike lanes' between parked cars and moving traffic on most major roads - these do nothing for cyclist safety and are really just there so that cyclists are forced to ride on the very side of the road, out of the way of cars.

[@MrsBifflechips]

@@thurstonkuriata7929 And cyclists between traffic and parked cars creates a huge risk of the cyclists being doored. This happens in Canada too, particularly where this arrangement is in a downtown area.

[@street_ruffian]

@@MrsBifflechips yeah I feel like it's really just a buffer between car traffic and the parked cars for the doors to open that then they just label as a bike lane.

[@thurstonkuriata7929]

@@MrsBifflechips Exactly! The parked cars are arguably more of a threat than the moving vehicles when this terrible road design is implemented. Insultingly, the government here is well aware of the problem, and are going to put protected cycle lanes on on of the busiest and most dangerous cycle routes - and yet somehow this project is expected to take three years. Three years to reconfigure a road that causes the most cyclist injuries in the state.

[@betula2137]

Yes. So basically, generalisation from some outliers who's main reasons for not using a bike lane is because that lane isn't suitable for their purpose. So, good design standards, like wide bike lanes on aerials to move people

[@alex2143]

Exactly. And if sports cyclists keep driving on the road rather than on bike lanes filled with normal cyclists, then that probably means that there's no place for them to go and be sports cyclists. But it's really stupid to blame normal cyclists (bike commuters) for what sports cyclists do. Most cyclists just wanna get to where they need to go.

[@hanstun1]

@@alex2143 There is no reason for blame. Besides a few spots, here in Toronto at least, a cyclist will be faster than a driver.

[@steemlenn8797]

Bike lane aerials. I like the idea. Let the bike lanes float above the car traffic and look down on those losers in their self-propelled invalid thrones.

[@geroutathat]

Good design and 20 people might use the cycle path, so spend what, 350k on it?

[@betula2137]

@@geroutathat Did you watch the video? You seem to be describing a residential streets, in which case you don't need a cycle path, just good homezone design because it makes practical sense. On commuter routes, separated cycle lanes have more capacity and a higher cost-benefit than a 4-lane highway, and this increases significantly in more urban areas where car capacity cannot increase any more due to efficiency.

[@silentwf]

Really like the "if drivers drive on gravel road, there must be a problem with highways" analogy!

[@rianfelis3156]

I suspect what those comments usually mean is "they painted a bicycle gutter right next to the parked cars, but nobody uses it because it is full of potholes and the constant risk of someone opening a door. Oh, and how dare they use the road to go from that to their actual destination without even a line of paint!"

[@SaveMoneySavethePlanet]

Your conclusion is almost exactly what I’ve found in my own research on bike infrastructure: the primary goal is to increase safety. When people feel that safety is higher like in the first two examples the. They’ll use the bike lanes. If they don’t (like in the stroad example) then they won’t use then bike lanes. It’s actually that easy! Thanks for getting hands on with the research on this one!

[@rangersmith4652]

Increasing safety for people who already cycle is a reason to make a bike lane, but a more relevant reason is to entice drivers out of their cars and onto bikes. Crappy bike lanes that limit speed and force cyclists to share with walkers fail miserably at this.

[@SaveMoneySavethePlanet]

@@rangersmith4652 I agree. Part of my argument is actually that increasing safety DOES entice more people out of cars and onto bikes. My wife is a great example of this. For the longest time she refused to go biking with me and I thought she simply didn’t like bikes. But then we moved so we’re close to a protected bike path and have access to a bike share program…suddenly she’s more than happy to go on rides with me! In fact, she wants us to buy some beaters off of Craigslist so that we can use bikes more often when we go out for dinner/drinks/activities on the weekends! All because she actually feels safe now.

[@EzraM5]

@@SaveMoneySavethePlanet ABSOLUTELY agree. I have been cycling for about 4 months now and the only reason I've been able to do so here in Detroit is because this suburb in particular actually has incredible infrastructure for it. However, there are other towns that just simply do not have them or force you to use the sidewalk, if there even is one. It's all well and good to have bike lanes, but if they are not well separated so that there is minimal interaction between cars and cyclists, then it might as well not even be there.

[@SaveMoneySavethePlanet]

@@EzraM5 yup! You’re basically hitting on all of the things that I ended up putting in my video on bike infrastructure but I’m still editing. The key number that I found was 20 MPH. Once, car traffic starts moving faster than that, it becomes way more likely that a crash with a cyclist will put the cyclist in the hospital. So any bike infrastructure along a road that goes faster than 20 MPH needs some form of protection.

[@rangersmith4652]

@@SaveMoneySavethePlanet I'm glad to hear that. Yes, safety is a factor. But if we claim it as the _main_ factor we will end up with speed-limited, non-connected shared paths instead of realistically useful bike paths. Dedicated bike paths get us where we want to go at biking speeds, and are also quite safe.

[@ACanette]

About sport cycling, that's exactly it, we ride way too fast for the bike lane and don't want to endanger fellow cyclists.

[@rorychivers8769]

We usually frown on people doing 'sport driving' on public roads :)

[@OntarioTrafficMan]

That's still an issue of infrastructure quality. Here in the Netherlands it's no problem to cruise at 30 km/h along the bike paths because they're wide enough for overtaking, have separate sidewalks and intersections are designed accordingly

[@sergeissakov5002]

Sport cycling is easily compliant with the rules of the road. And anyone on an ebike can travel at sport cycling speeds and would have the same safety issues in the separated bike lane.

[@OntarioTrafficMan]

@@sergeissakov5002 only if the separated bike lane has a design speed too low

[@sergeissakov5002]

@@OntarioTrafficMan it’s practically impossible to build separated bike infrastructure in most urban environments that safely accommodates typical sport/fitness/ebike/commute* bike speeds. Cycling at such speeds is always safely accommodated using the full lane on the adjacent roadway. How are you “here in the Netherlands” and also “Ontario man”? Anyway, 30 kph is better but still too slow for many cyclists and ebikes. Our class 3 bikes travel up to 28 mph which is 45 kph, and many sport cyclists can cruise almost as fast, certainly in spurts, and almost anyone can bike that fast on a downhill grade. Besides, “intersections are designed accordingly” is easier said than done. Especially mid-block intersections with driveways in cultures where drivers are not conditioned to stop, look, and yield to cyclists wherever crossing bike lanes. And when the “protection” is parked cars the potential for someone to suddenly step into the bike lane is ever-present. This makes speeds above 20kph dangerous. Finally, the space for enough width for overtaking and “intersections designed correctly” is often simply unavailable. *For commutes longer than a mile or two where time-of-trip matters.

[@TG-ss4he]

I live in New Jersey in the United States. I can use a multi use pathway to get to work for 90% of my commute and then I’m on regular roads with no bike lanes it can be dicey so obviously I have a bunch of lights on my cycle ! I’m always amazed to see other parts of the world like what you showed and even the Netherlands and even other parts of the United States like California that have total dedicated bike lanes I wish we had that here !

[@thomasguillo3595]

I was told a few times to ride on the bike lane in places where there was no bike lane. That makes me think that drivers complain about this even if there's no solution for cyclists

[@thomasguillo3595]

@Cecilia Cole I'd say mostly drivers don't like to have things slowing them down : a tractor, a bike, an old driver, a car stopped on the road (better if stopped on the bike lane so it doesn't bother them). Well I guess it's just that culturally we created this speed culture with cars, if you take a car it's to be fast and you want it to be reliable time wise (not always the case unfortunately)

[@SmallSpoonBrigade]

The roads are for powered vehicles. Bikes generally have the option of riding in either the road or the sidewalk provided that both exist, and they adhere to the rules appropriate to where they're riding. Much of the anger comes from cyclists that insist that it's their right ot clog up an entire lane by riding a few MPH while there's an appropriate sidewalk available, or running red lights and generally behaving irresponsibly. I do think that if the status quo were for cyclists to not be breaking so many laws and causing problems in traffic, that the attitude wouldn't be so hostile.

[@SmallSpoonBrigade]

@@thomasguillo3595 Yes, and it's also typically illegal for most of those things to be impeding traffic. I do believe that tractors have a carve out to allow them to operate under the speed limit for practical reasons. Anything else requires specific protocols to be followed. For example, those convoys of ancient cars that can only do 30mph have to have trucks flagging for them to warn approaching cars of the slow speed vehicles.

[@thomasguillo3595]

@@SmallSpoonBrigade sidewalks are not made for cycling. I mean this might not be obvious when you're not used to cycle, especially at high speed. That said I can't tell about American laws but from what I heard they are very random. Here in Europe, bikes belong to the roads if there are no other options compulsory available. And often in the countryside there's no bike lane to be used, then riding on the road is the only left choice. In most places there's a need to secure the use of bicycle with good infrastructure that create less tension and gives more safety

[@6smeargle]

I frequently use the road as a cyclist when I need to pass people riding in the bike lane. I have a generally faster pace compared to most people - so I end up overtaking most riders. The lanes on Bloor St. in Toronto, for example, are narrow and most people (in my experience) are not very accommodating of those wishing to pass. Sometimes, the lanes can also be quite full - making it even harder to pass safely and effectively. Those are the instances in which I signal that I am leaving the lane, use the road to pass the cyclist(s), and then signal my return to the lane. I try to stay in the lane as much as possible, but in those instances where it looks like I'm overtaking the cyclist in front, I'll simply pass going outside. Sometimes people will drive scooters or motorcycles in the lane, too, so when I see those coming TOWARDS you occasionally, I obviously leave the lane. The other aspect of bike culture I've noticed in Toronto is slower cyclists refusing to be passed by others. There have been numerous times where a cyclist I've passed has gone through a red to get past me, only to go slower than me once again. It's bizarre - and another instance where avoidance by going out into the street usually solves my problem.

[@eleven-eleven-eleven]

Totally agree with everything you said. Ever continue on to Danforth where the bike lane dodges in and around the restaurant patios? It's insane. I ride on the road or choose a parallel street here!

[@6smeargle]

@@eleven-eleven-eleven I rode out there for the first time recently! Beautiful area, but the bridge has a lot of potholes before, on, and after it, so it's hard to enjoy the views. The patios are nice, but they are a little disruptive and you get very close to pedestrians - which you need to be quite attentive towards. I really want the patios to stay - if the road could simply be 'pedestrianized', that would be ideal.

[@hendman4083]

I am more amazed you have any cyclists at all. Of the four locations you showed, only the second has somewhat decent cycle infrastructure. The first has a bike lane that is too small and there is not enough "door space" to the parked cars. The third with the painted gutter along the stroad, is a disgrace and a death trap. And the fourth dumps you alongside pedestrians, and the designers recognize this as being unsafe by imposing a maximum speed for cyclists. Hats off to the people that still dare to ride a bike in circumstances like that.

[@Jacksparrow4986]

I'm german but my guess is if you look at the traffic situations for cars (congestion) you will find that car oriented infrastructure sucks for everyone, as everyone is forced to drive everywhere roads are full and horrible. See not just bikes 'best country for drivers' to see what happens when accounting for other modes too: driving becomes way more pleasant.

[@jasonarthurs3885]

All of this; my daily commute.

[@MrAnonymousRandom]

With whiners like you, there will never be enough bike lane usage to pressure politicians into expanding bike infrastructure. A marked off section of the road, even unprotected is a huge improvement over having to visually maintain a gaps between the curb/parked vehicles and traffic. As both a cyclist and a driver, I bet a lot of people who are complaining about bike infrastructure being insufficient ignore that safety education is your first line of defence.

[@TlalocTemporal]

I don't think we have any protected bike lanes in my city, narrow or not. Shared use paths are the gold standard for bicycle infrastructure here, and many of them are afterthoughts squeezed between roads and sound barriers or safety rails.

[@steveballzack1409]

@@MrAnonymousRandom A marked off section of road is absolutely useless. It's exactly the same thing as a road with a dirty, sewer and broken glass filled shoulder, only with a bicycle painted on the ground, and you're just as likely to be hit by a car in both scenarios. No, there needs to be more "whiners" if there is going to be meaningful change. Ottawa is the biggest hypocrite city if it can declare a "climate state of emergency" and then paint a line on the road and call the gutter a bike lane and build the crappiest public transit system in the world. The politicians need to be held to account.

[@torpedyellow]

0:47: "Standing near a parking protected bike lane..." What sort of "protection" is this for cyclists when they can crash into the doors opened by careless fellow car passengers? Living in Germany I would avoid all those sort of bike lanes because they are much too dangerous. This a bad example for bike infrastructure in Toronto. If you would count the cars blocking the bike lane while parking you will find that in busy places these bike lanes are blocked so often that it is less dangerous for cyclists to stay on the road instaed. In Germany a car driver has to pay 100€ for stopping on a bike lane. If he is caught more than 7 times he looses his driving license. And even this severe punishment doesn't keep the bike lanes free of parking cars. The only way is to protect the bike lane from the car traffic and car parking totally by obstacles which cannot be passed without damaging the cars. That's the way many bike lanes are built in the Netherlands. They are really safe bike lanes and they are used by 100% of the cyclists and not the "parking protected" ones.

[@nicolescats2]

Parking protected is better than no protection (bicycle gutter) because getting doored is significantly less dangerous than getting run over. Canada doesn't have great bike infrastructure, so infrastructure that has significant problems can seem great by comparison to everything else. Especially when compared to some parts of the U.S. that don't even have sidewalks everywhere. As someone who walks, I hate having to walk against traffic, and step into the grass every time a car comes on certain streets. And I'm thankful that very few streets have this configuration, with sidewalks on one side being found on most neighborhood streets, with streets that are busier or located in more walkable areas having sidewalks on both sides. Have I walked in the grass because I don't want to cross the street to use the sidewalk, of course. It's still irritating to have them only on one side, and if I'm in a position that allows me to be safeish (against traffic) I may even consider walking in the street. But just like the video mentioned in regards to cyclists, if you see someone outside the lane designed for them something is wrong with the lane. Like lanes that don't take you where you need to go (one sided sidewalk), or lanes too narrow for passing (causing runners to pass me in the street, sometimes with traffic). This behavior is a sign you need to improve infrastructure, not remove it. I'm just thankful that most car drivers around here, despite not always seeing pedestrians, know not to honk/yell at them when they do see them, even when those people are outside the sidewalk.

[@koreydeese890]

@@nicolescats2 You haven't seen the video enough times of a woman being doored and going directly under a bus, or you wouldn't make that statement. I'd rather be ran over by a car from behind then be doored, hit the road hard, and THEN be ran over by a vehicle.

[@platedlizard]

I’ve been riding my bike a lot more this summer and the number of times the bike lane (unprotected in my area) is used to store construction signs and other objects, to the point where I have to use either the road (often busy) or sidewalk

[@basillah7650]

burn that stuff illegal to be there

[@officialgreendalehumanbeing]

At least in NYC, it’s very common for police to park in bike lanes and many bike lanes offer little to no protection from cars which leads to more people riding in the streets. Also outside of Manhattan and some neighborhoods in Brooklyn, bike lanes are very few and far between. In most of Queens and the Bronx, the most you’ll get are sharrows.

[@diegodelamota1199]

I agree. I live in Midwood, Brooklyn and my main mode of transportation is my bicycle. There are no bike lanes in most residential streets. They're mostly concentrated in the avenues. This would be fine if it wasn't for Brooklyn drivers, which speed on these narrow streets way too often. I ride my bike like I stole it, simply because riding normally doesn't get you anywhere in the city.

[@peskypigeonx]

As a person living in the Bronx, the Laconia bike line is one of those bicycle gutters, but continuously used by people double parking or walking for some reason?!? Not to mention that it’s on a steep hill so I’m worried for the bikers I still see prevailing in that.

[@eleven-eleven-eleven]

Haa... I like sharrows!

[@petergunn9149]

Living in flushing Queens the bike lanes need to be safer. I ride on the sidewalks most of the time because people don’t know what they are doing driving and I feel uncomfortable riding on the road 👍

[@jollyjo320]

The other day I was biking down a main arterial with a painted bike lane. I used the bike lane and then went to the center of the road to make a left turn onto a small side street. While I was waiting for oncoming traffic to clear, a driver drove their car around and past me while yelling something to the effect of, "Stay in the bike lane!!!" Some drivers just don't know how turning-while-biking works, so if you inconvenience them even a teensy bit they'll assume you're the one doing something wrong.

[@whazzat8015]

Common

[@joelknox7753]

Happened to me the other day. Also a painted bike lane, and I signaled left, checking behind me to see if the approaching cars were paying attention. This particular intersection even has a painted bike lane for the left turn, but to get there you obviously need to cross the (2) car lanes. How do the cars suppose we cyclists are supposed to get to that dedicated left turn lane? Teleportation?

[@legojenn]

Why couldn't you add ten minutes to your trip by doing three right turns? That car driver's ten seconds is valuable. For the past couple of years, I've been getting around by car due to illness and injury. I'm likely to not be able to bike for another couple of years. I miss it, especially biking along the western parkway in Ottawa. However, in my time getting around in the car, I've noticed that the clear majority of offenders are car drivers. The speeding and tailgating are irksome. Maybe it's a numbers thing. There are more drivers than cyclists, but unfortunately it's not personal. Car drivers are jerks to each other too.

[@Focus_On_Your_Driving]

I live in an area that is not conducive to cycling. However it is legal and I see some that get into a lane like a car and insist on the same respect and privileges. Ok. I'm not going to mess with you, but why insist on the entire lane making cars have to line up and wait to pass when it's clear? I know, some idiots get too close, but there are idiots in all walks of life. I've seen them side by side, when I understand they are to ride one behind the other. I've also seen them insist on being a car, but when it doesn't suit them, they run through red lights and stop signs, go the wrong way down one-way streets, etc. Ok, bikes give you more flex-ability, but either you are a legal rider or not. Then take into account y'all are the only thing on the road insisting or rights and privilege but have no license, tag, insurance, or anything else that makes the rest of us legal drivers on the road. If you truly want to share, then share fully.

[@whazzat8015]

@@Focus_On_Your_Driving I drive like I ride. I don't hold up traffic, but I pay as much tax for the use of road as they do, am a legal user, and ask the same respect and rights , with regard for effort and safety.

[@pinchecookie]

loved this video thanks for making it!

[@MideoKuze]

You should have brought up how cities that are cycling-hostile will often "put in" a couple bike lanes (paint bike symbols in some gutters or sharrows on the road). Cyclists in these cities have typically already learned to ride defensively, because it's what they've had to do, so they're not unfamiliar with riding in traffic or on the sidewalk. When this meagre "infrastructure" is put in, sticking to it can often be more dangerous than just doing what you've always been doing. Sharrows are actually worse than nothing, so there's no point in observing them. Gutters can be in bad condition or inconsistent, making it necessary to weave in and out of traffic, which is also extremely dangerous, and worse than just using the road. There's a bridge near where I live that technically has a bike lane, but it's a narrow gutter that's barely big enough for you and turns into an extremely exposed lane in the middle of the road, bumpered on one side by several intersecting streets and parking garages with poor visibility. The road runs at highway speeds. In those sorts of situations, it's safer to be out where drivers can see you and will make room for you. Misguided urban planning can make bike infrastructure that seems absolutely pointless or worse, sometimes feeling like a token gesture, other times feeling like cyclists are being tucked away so motorists don't have to slow down, without concern for their safety. These can often be the first steps towards a city building real bike infrastructure, but sometimes I feel like they aren't even worth it.

[@jayobannon5359]

I believe the underlying problem with any cycling infrastructure is that it is always a compromise, at the cyclist expense. Cars and bikes cannot safely coexist together.

[@hariman7727]

Also an issue is that some cities just do not have the space to put in bike Lanes, so any attempts to actually add them will make commuting in the city harder and the roads more unsafe.

[@MideoKuze]

@@hariman7727 Narrowing vehicle lanes can often (depending on design) cause drivers to drive more carefully, counter-intuitively making them safer. I can't imagine a place or time when putting in protected bike lanes is a bad thing.

[@hariman7727]

@@MideoKuze imagine harder, and picture streets that are already too crowded to have more than two lanes of cars going down that can't even fit a bus or large truck.

[@MideoKuze]

@@hariman7727 Two lanes is more than enough, but sure, if you can't put a protected bike lane in else make the lane too small even for cars, then a painted bike lane is pointless. My city had one of those and just turned it into a one-way, where bikes could go in both directions.

[@drewmclean163]

My initial take on the question was one of coverage; do the bike lanes actually go to places that people want to go to? Do they offer an efficient route there?

[@SmallSpoonBrigade]

The lanes should only go in on streets where there isn't a reasonable alternative and where the road isn't too steep to keep up with traffic. Any other bike lane is more about forcing people out of their cars than bike safety. So often the bike lanes around here are only a block to the side of residential streets with less traffic and less risk to the cyclists. Or they'll go up steep hills with a sidewalk a couple feet to the side. We do have some streets where bike lanes do make sense, but most of them are completely pointless and just serve the purpose of taking road lanes and parking from cars.

[@hariman7727]

@@SmallSpoonBrigade Pittsburgh is a prime example of how not to do bike Lanes. All Pittsburgh did was take existing bus lanes and then labeled them as bike lanes, which ruined years of effort to get bus traffic to stop holding up regular traffic.

[@Einstein-wasnt-all-that-smart]

What would a reasonable alternative to a bike lane be?

[@superj8502]

The people using the road to overtake/go faster really prove my point: two unidirectional bike lanes on opposite sides of the road are a pretty bad layout. There's no space for overtaking and you often need to cross the road to reach your destination. I'd much rather have a bidirectional shared pathway or, even better, one on either side. You probably only need two on busy streets tho. In calm streets crossing is not gonna be an issue and on roads nobody's gonna cross outside of intersections because there's nothing to get to on the other side.

[@paul1993willy]

Unidirectional bike lanes only present that issue when they’re too narrow to allow to safely pass. The Saint-Denis bike path in Montréal shows an example of unidirectional paths wide enough to allow for safe overtaking. The northern part of it is large enough to allow three people biking side by side.

[@AileTheAlien]

@@paul1993willy it seems more likely that people in car-oriented cities would support two side-by-side bike lanes, than separated lanes that take up more space. (Or at least be less likely to oppose them.) I'll take every chance I have to get more good-enough bike lanes, instead of no bike lanes.

[@ethandanielburg6356]

I would argue that bidirectional bike lanes on streets, while much better than nothing, aren’t as good as unidirectional bike lanes because there tends to be more conflicts at intersections with cars and bikes turning. As others have mentioned, you can have wide enough unidirectional bike lanes to allow faster cyclists to pass slower cyclists.

[@barvdw]

@@ethandanielburg6356 there are places where I wouldn't want my bidirectional bike lane to be replaced with unidirectional ones. E.g. along a canal or other impassable obstacle, I prefer to be on that side, or along a very wide and busy road, I would hate to have to cross twice just to be on the 'right' side. Such wide roads often have two bidirectional bike lanes, one on either side, where I live, because crossing it is not safe. But on a road of normal width, yes, unidirectional bike lanes on either side are my preference as well.

[@Garrick42]

@SUPERj 850, I'm going to have to disagree with you there. Sidepaths, which are what you're describing, are awful for cycling, not least because they put one direction of bike travel opposite the flow of adjacent motor-vehicle traffic. The AASHTO Guide for the Development of Bicycle Facilities spends pages discussing the problems with sidepaths. A rider is more visible and predictable as a part of the traffic flow. Does that mean "taking the lane" on an 80 km/h arterial? No. But in the US at least, increasing infrastructure to move bikes away from cars is used to argue the viewpoint that bicycles don't belong on the road at all. And guess what? I need to take roads to get to the places I go.

[@hto560]

Lol I think this is the first curse word I've heard on this channel. Y'all seem like very chill people. I appreciate the videos y'all make very much. I really think that all of the youtubers in the last few years making content about proper city design have really amplified the message to the masses. living here in the US I was so excited to hear discussion of "Walk-able cities on National Public Radio for the first time in my life just a few months ago. For me in particular It was like something I always knew I wanted and liked but couldn't articulate or understand until I learned the vocabulary to vocalize it from content creators like your channel, strong towns, and not just bikes. Keep up the goodwork :).

[@rubenssautter9242]

I usually do not ride in bike lane. I've crashed two times when I was riding in a bike lane. Two weeks ago a car leaved a garage without seeing the bike lane, I had to convince her that She make the mistake. It's just more safe to ride alongside the cars, even if those seem to be. Sometimes our intuition is wrong.

[@WalterStucco]

"that She make the mistake" She is on the safer vehicle, so she assumed that users on less safe vehicles would be more careful because their safety requires more focus on the users' side. Just like people with babies on board drive more carefully, regardless of what other people on the road do, because a distraction could cause severe damages to babies that would be a non-issue for adults. People look left and right before crossing the street because they want to live, not because they want to prove they are right and others are wrong.

[@seemi8053]

@@WalterStucco wrong way around. The person manoeuvring the heavy machinery should act responsibly and keep to the traffic guidelines. At least in Germany you have to let people on superior roads go first (including bikes on bike lanes)

[@zensuufu]

@@WalterStucco No, it is 100% the drivers responsibility to look out of cyclists before entering the bike lane. Way too many drivers just don't consider pedestrians and cyclists, they just speed by even when the law requires them to stop. They often look down on peds and cyclists, even insulting and yelling at them at times. If I had a nickle for every time I've seen a driver not look both ways before entering a lane I would be a rich man. All they care about is oncoming traffic, they only look one way and treat us like shit when they make a mistake. I apologize for generalizing here, but this has been my experience in every place I have lived in. This is exactly why I tend to ride on the sidewalk, because I do not trust most motor vehicles when their drivers are so aggressive and in denial of their responsibilities. Car culture is gross, it's a huge issue in America, it creates car slums, encourages obesity, and destroys the local environment.

[@WalterStucco]

​@@zensuufu it doesn't matter who is responsible. If I don't see you and run over you and you are wearing noise canceling headphones and not caring about the road because it's someone else's responsibility, you risk to hurt yourself, or worse, does it make you feel better that it's not your fault when you go around in your shiny new wheelchair? It is also the police responsibility to stop thieves, but I do not go around wearing a very visible golden watch worth thousands of dollars in a not-so-safe neighbourhood just because safety is not my job. I think people get this all in the wrong way. Do you throw your baby on the crosswalk because it's drivers' responsibility to stop? or do you carefully plan the crossing in the safest way possible? Being suicidal for the sake of being suicidal is incredibly stupid. "Way too many drivers just don't consider pedestrians and cyclists" that's a reason more to be on the safe side. again, if you know there's a danger do you jump in without a doubt or do you try to avoid it? Anyway, too many cyclists don't care about anything, they are the worst road users, especially if you are a pedestrian. I fear bikers a lot more than cars. At least drivers know that they can and will be identified, bikers just plainly don't care and believe that traffic laws do not apply to them. As you are proving right now with your comment, they are also not scared to die, proof that there's an higher chance that they will do something dangerous, just because it's possible. "Car culture is gross, it's a huge issue in America" As non American: American culture in general is gross and it's a huge issue.

[@zensuufu]

@@WalterStucco I 100% agree with your last statement. Believe me, I'm not a fan of many aspects of this country. Everything else though doesn't really apply to my experience at all. I don't know what the laws are where you live but I'm fully aware of traffic laws here. Here the pedestrian and the cyclist always have the right of way when crossing the street or riding in the bike lane. I took the same driving test everyone else did. Operators of motor vehicles are supposed to look both ways before entering a lane, they are supposed to wait for oncoming pedestrians and cyclists before continuing. Like wise, pedestrians have the right of way over cyclists, as a cyclist I look both ways and stop for peds and allow them to continue, I do the same for cyclists when I am driving. It really is not that hard, a lot of drivers here are just impatient and don't care about the safety of others. I would just like the same respect on the road that I give to others. Blaming cyclists for the mistakes, neglect, and rudeness of careless drivers is just silly. To clarify, not all drivers are so careless, some are very respectful and patient and will stop as required. Of course it goes both ways, there are careless cyclists too, but I don't see them nearly as often as I see careless drivers. I feel like I can trust cyclists when I am driving, but I am terrified of cars when I am cycling simply because they are way less predictable and dependable when it comes to the laws they are supposed to follow. We obviously live in very different cultures and situations as your experience is completely different than my own.

[@notsavingpvtbrian]

As someone who bikes a lot the reasons to not ride in a bike lane were common ones. Other reasons are that merging lanes is the most dangerous part of any normal commute and where a crash is most likely to happen. If there are cars every block or so I'm not risking my life jumping in and out of the lane so other people can go marginally faster, I'm just going to stay in the primary position. Here in Philadelphia the bike lanes are often poorly maintained and can be full of gravel, pot holes, trash, have homeless people living in them, etc that will all contribute to me not wanting to ride in them. In some places the risk of being doored in the cycling lane is very high. I've also found that on narrow unprotected cycling lanes, staying in the cycling lane will lead to people passing closer and at higher speeds rather than sitting just outside the lane which forces them to slow down and move over. What it generally comes down to is not wanting to put my wellbeing at risk so someone else can drive marginally faster.

[@atholmullen]

Thank you for saying what I've been saying for years. If cyclists choose to ride on the road instead of the path alongside, there is something wrong with that path. I'm in Australia. I generally prefer completely off-road paths. Sadly, they are all classified as shared paths and have issues with oblivious, ignorant or deliberate problematic behaviour. There are some places where paths run alongside roads, and the road is a better option even on my 1991 mountain bike at about 25km/h when the cars are doing 70km/h. If I ride on the shoulder of the road, I get right of way over vehicles turning in and out of side streets, and vehicles are far less likely to ignore me when driving in and out of properties. If I ride on the path alongside the road, I have to give way to every side road, the kerb transitions at the roads are rough and jarring, the concrete slabs are often uneven due to settlement, and there's the problematic behaviour issue. My rule of thumb is that a path that is crossed by driveways is not suitable for bikes. It's just a wide footpath (sidewalk).

[@MrCyclist]

I am in Canada, and just today cycling in Brampton, Ontario a suburb of Toronto, I avoided the bike path for the very same reason mentioned. The road had few cars and smoother road surface.

[@GlassSpider]

Thanks for this! Some great data from this one

[@dvderek]

I really love your channel and absolutely love a ton when you go out and collect data! It's so awesome

[@OhTheUrbanity]

Glad to hear, because these are some of the most fun videos to make!

[@dvderek]

@@OhTheUrbanity hahah amazing! I also love collecting data. Watching the numbers go up is a blast

[@abchaplin]

I am one of those who cycles on Colonel By Drive's roadway. I find 20 Km/h too slow and the multi-use paths are too cluttered with slow cyclists or, worse, ambling pedestrians. I keep looking for you two, but we have not yet crossed paths. Look out for a old guy with a Santa beard and screaming yellow helmet and jersey combination on a gold Kona gravel bike.

[@AileTheAlien]

I don't mind ambling pedestrians as long as they're not walking in tandem, talking up the whole dang width. :|

[@atomicsmith]

Many cities sprinkle a few bike lanes around because they hear it’s the hot new thing, or to score some points on some sustainable development program. These are often: - disconnected from other bike lanes, - on less desirable routes, - down in gutters with potholes, manholes and drains - on a shoulder next to fast moving traffic Why would anyone choose to ride in those

[@hariman7727]

There's two problems: One, oftentimes there's no room for a bike lane so you end up with what is at best a glorified shoulder that's about a foot away from traffic. Also one, a lot of towns and cities literally do not have the physical space to add bike Lanes without making commuting more dangerous and putting people at risk.

[@JSBax]

I tend to ride on the road in some of these situations. If you take up a lane and people can't overtake too close you're fairly safe. You're also in exactly the right place for all the turning cars to see you. Crossing streets in our separated bike lane (literally one in our city) feels like an expression of hope, I find it really scary. I also hate shared use paths. On a shared use path, as a faster rider you are endlessly trying to avoid traffic, and the killer: everyone else is now the vulnerable road user. And pedestrians can be crazy unpredictable... I'd rather take responsibility for my own safety with the cars any day.

[@whazzat8015]

Potholes and debris

[@pindermf]

Great video, and nice field research!

[@proposmontreal]

Brand spanking new protected 3m bike lane right in front of my door and I have not seen many cyclist if at all using the street since. So the type of lane will make a difference on it's usage. Good video as usual!

[@coreysimmerer]

I think another thing is how well the lane connects to the city’s larger bike network. If it’s all fragmented, less people will use it. At least that’s how it is in Baltimore

[@fritzp9916]

Slow, possibly insecure cyclists will use the bike lane if it's well protected from cars. Otherwise they'll use the sidewalk, or just not ride a bike at all. Fast cyclists will use the bike lane if it has a high quality surface and is wide enough for them to safely overtake slower cyclists. Otherwise they'll use the road. A 3 m wide smooth asphalt protected bike lane will be used by both types of cyclists, and all the ones in between those extremes.

[@paulaspinall919]

Hopefully the bike lane goes to somewhere that people want to go.

[@proposmontreal]

@@paulaspinall919 yup. Other bike lanes

[@AndyB-yv3zg]

I lived in Windsor as a kid, and would always ride the bike on the sidewalk, with the roads often being too poor quality for a bike, let alone a car. I think in car-dependent suburban environments, riding on the sidewalk is the norm.

[@whazzat8015]

ADA CURB CROSSINGS HELP.

[@Chris-mf1rm]

Great video. Like to see more research like this.

[@coopaloopmex]

This is fantastic. Great Data!!!

[@Skzzlemister]

I think I said this before on another video (maybe one of yours??) but we have a mayoral candidate in Rochester, MN that says on his website that the city should abandon its goal of adding more bike infrastructure because “bike lanes on surface streets get limited use and we should give preference to a car based transit plan.” I messaged him and asked him if he ever considered why the bike lanes are underutilized. Crickets…

[@gert-janvanderlee5307]

Offer to lend him a bike so he can experience what it's like to use them.

[@mikko.g]

2:37 .. that was me being apparently the only person who doesn't use the bike lane on Laurier in Ottawa, and I find the bike lane unsafe and have been almost hit by turning cars, or cars leaving driveways, usually once or twice a day if I'm in the bike lane, but, also I tend to go quickly and can match the speed limit on that road. Also, I am actively trying to normalize bikes on the road to the vehicle drivers, cars do not deserve all the infrastructure that is built for them.

[@nicholasbrassard3512]

Thank you for covering this, as someone who has biked a considerable amount throughout the Ottawa/Gatineau area, I love using bike paths, especially those that are farther from the road (mixed use paths). I hate being close to cars. People always ask me how I manage without having a car. It costs me nothing and I can bike from gatineau to the ottawa suburbs in great time. Thanks again for being bike supporters for our area :)

[@kendenny9729]

Thank you for this insight and positivity . I will be looking more closely at our own bike lanes her ein California, USA.

[@codex4046]

I'd request people that make these claims to give a few examples of places where cyclists prefer the road over the bikelane and try figuring out why. This video did show 4 roads and stroads (probably chosen by you?), the argument would be way stronger if it's locations where drivers claim it to be the case.

[@OhTheUrbanity]

Unfortunately when people make these claims they're usually talking about a random city, usually in the U.S., that's not practical for us to visit. But our 3rd and 4th sites were specifically chosen to *try* to find cyclists not using the bike lane

[@maxm1065]

@@OhTheUrbanity I agree with it's not looking good here, personally I am located in Daytona Beach Florida and am a college student. The road my university is located on is actually slated to have more accessibility and wider sidewalks along with curbs and such to be put in. As of now the university put in a 10ft wide sidewalk on one side of the road for students to use to commute between the apartment complex and the university, despite there being a 5ft painted bicycle gutter. The only time the students use the "bike lane"/5ft painted bicycle gutter is when the sidewalk ends or they will cross and get onto the otherside of the road where there is an 8ft trail/sidewalk. This takes me back to the project they're proposing to improving the road. They want to put 8-12ft sidewalks on both sides where there arent any or widen some existing ones. Additionally on only PART of the length of the project they want to put 5ft bicycle lanes (unprotected bicycle gutter). Personally this doesnt make sense to me. 1. Students will almost always use the 8-12ft sidewalk/trail because it's not in the road even if it is just immediately on the otherside of the curb 2. why would I get off the sidewalk, get into the bike lane only to get back onto the sidewalk when the bike lane ends? 3. Drivers don't treat pedestrians or bicycles with any respect, I've had more than my fair share of times where I have had right of way due to green crossing signals and I almost get hit by someone making a turn and then getting angry at me. 4. Speeds on this road are rated at 45mph, double neighborhood speeds. But many times people can easily hot 60mph on this road. Mixing a cyclist going at most 15-20mph with 45-60mph traffic is just outright suicidal. I can continue with various details and why I think the project their proposing needs some major changes, but I think you get the idea.

[@maxm1065]

@It's not looking good totally agree. I would rather take the 5ft sidewalk that is uneven and get wacked by a branch if I'm not careful rather than be in a painted 5ft bicycle gutter and get hit by a car going 45-70mph and have possible lifetime injuries. People where I am don't even let pedestrians cross when they have the green walk and run red lights all the time, regardless of if there are pedestrians in the intersection.

[@Joseph-du1cp]

Most commonly in my commute is the same cyclist deciding "Hey I'm a bike!" then "Hey I'm a pedestrian, when I get to a stop sign/light I don't have to stop!" then deciding "Hey i'm a car now cause it's the fastest route this very moment!" Over all just deciding what rules apply to them so they don't ever have to follow any of them.

[@Altis_play]

very interesting approach to simply filming the different types of bicycle lane !

[@roivosemraiva]

I live in Central Florida ,where we are fast becoming a cycling community. Why? Because more bike lanes and bike trails have been built to move people about . We have just recently opened a C2C trail which crosses Florida from Coast to Coast. I have been a bike commuter for 10 years now, and many times I use the Sidewalks just to avoid heavily vehicular traffic.. thank you for your cycling channel

[@roivosemraiva]

@Spots Corner were you able to record his Tag Number on your Phone? Sorry to hear about this. I have seen many vehicles inadvertently driving on the bike Trails. They follow GPS maps in their phones than using common sense. See you on the C2C Trail.. has the Connector in Brooksville Finished Yet?

[@zometthecomet]

People that are that old need to be FORCEFULLY retired and have their licences taken away! NO I DONT CARE ABOUT THEM AT ALL😅

[@onyxtay7246]

@@zometthecomet I mean, if you care about them then you _also_ want them to no longer be driving. Before my great aunt passed she was a lovely and sweet woman, but she could not safely use her car and needed to give it up.

[@zometthecomet]

@@onyxtay7246 fair

[@andyiswonderful]

But, what about during the summer heat?

[@chalkies]

Bike and subscribe forever 😍 Great video as usual. Suggestion for another topic, if you're interested : -what's the solution for arterial roads like Bronson in Ottawa. It's just so sad looking compared to Preston and the North part of Bank. Gracias!

[@bruceboa6384]

I'd love to see Bronson fixed, especially between the Canal and the Queensway.

[@bikesarebest]

Great video!

[@paulgrieger8182]

4:14 Nothing says pedestrian safety like having your body between the cars and the guardrail.

[@georgeg7840]

The shared pathway on both sides of the Lachine canal is great, cyclists and pedestrians get along reasonably well and the pathway is very safe. There is an underpass under Monk bridge which is not unlike what you would see in Finland (I watch videos by ‘Not just bikes’ and ‘Shifter’ too).

[@TheScourge007]

This is why personal experience is never a sufficient guide to understanding the world. People who talk about cyclists "not using the bike lanes" are likely experiencing confirmation bias: where folks have a pre-existing bias and only notice whatever confirms that bias. Everyone experiences that which is why doing something systematic like this is so important to check and see if that's what's happening. This is also good for counteracting some things cyclists will say too. For instance that multi-use paths are somehow not great bike infrastructure. Over twice as many people took that multi-use path than any of the other options. Slow bikes and pedestrians work great for lots of people and that makes sense when considering that going fast on a bike takes energy that a lot of folks don't really want to expend.

[@TheScourge007]

@@tristanridley1601 Here's the thing, I like having that dedicated bike-only paths too. But I do think mixed use pathways are in general more used and a video like this reinforces that. Indeed busy low-car streets in Europe are also heavily utilized. Of course the question then is why. To me it gets at 2 things: 1) most mixed use paths I've encountered are plenty wide enough and 2) destinations. For 1), really I've used extremely crowded mixed-use pathways a number of times and spending most of my time going faster than 10 kph (and often up to 20 kph) hasn't been difficult for me. The only time I've ever had it so crowded I was better off dismounting was when stalls where set up in a path (which is a bad thing when bikes use a route). Too narrow of a path and I could see that but paths I've taken in North America are generally plenty wide even with high traffic amounts. 2) Most North American mixed used paths I've used have had good destinations. Frequently that's a park which shouldn't be underrated as a great biking destination, but I've also seen mixed use paths around businesses and homes. Meanwhile, I have ridden some separated bike paths in cities and they are great, but often I'm cut off from half the destinations I could visit by needing to cross over a car road. Multi-use paths are often just streets themselves with no cars around and that's even more convenient despite the foot traffic. I do think fully separated, high quality bike lanes are important for cities. But they're often just highways passing through that have some limitations as real streets. Mixing bikes and pedestrians can create full streets that are real destinations. So I don't agree with any implication that they're second tier compared to other bike infrastructure anymore than I think a car-based city street is lower tier for cars than a highway. Sure, you can go fast and unimpeded on a highway, but a highway's not a destination. A street is slower and more crowded, but it's where you actually want to go.

[@mindstalk]

Haha, good point about pushing back against all the "I take the road" comments here, when the video we're responding to is all about real data of 90% of bikers taking the bike path or shared path.

[@notl33t]

I live in an area where the speed limit is 20 mph (30 km/h), so truthfully, most bikers can basically flow with traffic, and in fact, are frequently faster than traffic. Once you factor in the cost of car maintenance and car parking, even if you own a car, it's too expensive to drive anywhere, and way cheaper and easier to bike or walk.

[@danielinniss]

Is there a minimum speed on roads? I wonder why there is frequent mention of ”keeping up”

[@mourlyvold64]

"...most bikers can basically flow with traffic..." The way I see it, if you haven't provided safe and relaxed enough cycling infrastructure for children, the less abled and the elderly you haven't achieved anything in the way of a mature traffic system... Especially the children because they are the future drivers that then grew up cycling as full fledged independent participants in traffic, which I think is the single most important contributing factor in the succes of (for instance) the dutch system: All drivers, their mom and their children are cyclists first... For now, enjoy your ride!

[@zometthecomet]

Yeahhhhh I ride my bmx to the park and my 25 tooth sprocket is not going 30 km an hour 😂😂 deal with my speed or pass me don’t make it my problem cuz your in a hurry just pass and keep it going 😂😂😂

[@Stuartrusty]

Glad I found this video. I'm a UK road user who prefers to use a bicycle for a majority of my journeys and have been cycling on and of for 43 years. Most of what you say here is also true for cycling infrastructure here in the UK. With the recent and seemingly unpopular change in the prioritising of vehicle types and changes in cycling infrastructure, I have noted the following. A good proportion of cycle paths are shared with pedestrian traffic with all the challenges that go with it. For a seasoned rider such as myself, it's actually slower to use shared cycle paths than it is to use the main road or shared bus lanes. With the further confusion of an advisory speed limit of 15MPH on pedestrian/cycle paths also stating that "If you regularly exceed the speed of 15MPH then you are advised to use the road." As my average speed is 17-18MPH on short journeys and commutes, I stick to the roads simply for the safety of slower riders and pedestrians. The problem for most casual and commuter riders is there is no legal requirement for bicycles to have a speedometer in the UK, so how would they know how fast they were going? I use my old Garmin 800 and a wireless speed sensor so that I can check my speed, but as I stated, it is not a legal requirement in the UK for bicycles. As was also observed in your video, the lanes are often too narrow and poorly maintained compared to the main road, there are many other riders of varying awareness of traffic rules and abilities actually making it safer to use the main road rather than keep dodging in and out of the cycle lane to pass other users. Now I understand that not everyone has the experience and confidence in or with traffic that I do. There is also no legal requirement in the UK for training on how to use a bicycle on the road correctly and safely. There are government sponsored schemes for training road users on bicycles, but again, it is not a legal requirement. There is nothing stopping anyone buying an old clunker and using it on main roads and highways.

[@davidcorley1146]

Really excellent video! Excellent commentary and completely agree with all your observations where I live in the United States bike lanes are incredibly rare and very often very poorly thought out.

[@psycholist724]

It takes some practice to get comfortable riding in traffic with cars but it can be done, pretty easily, in fact. The funny thing about speed differential is that if the cyclist is the slowest vehicle in the lane, then everybody else slows down and there's no more speed differential. Speed differential becomes more of a problem the farther "out of the way" the cyclist moves away from normal traffic.

[@paulemilecolas7982]

I love your videos! This one really hits home. I live in Montreal and commute by bike as much as I can and in those cases, I will use the proper bike paths when they're adequate. As an avid competitive cyclist that's used to riding beside cars, I will often ride with cars if I know I can't ride at speed (+30kph) in a bike lane. I'll often get honked by cars just because I'm in front of them even though I'm riding at the speed of the cars in front of me 🤷🏿‍♂️🤷🏿‍♂️ I've ridden the Ogilvy road bike path and I can understand that people don't feel safe riding beside cars going 60kph without any separate infrastructure Keep up the good work guys!

[@alexseguin5245]

From my experience, I've found that drivers in Montreal are generally respectful of cyclists. I live in Laval though, and in that city I get honked at once in a while lol, generally for silly reasons. I think the more cyclist you have in an area, the more well behaved the drivers become.

[@m.e.3862]

Luckily on the south shore the bike paths are completely separate from traffic. The only time you deal with cars is at some intersections

[@Chuzz1]

this is awesome, you guys deserve more subscribers!

[@JohnMFlores]

So... more parking garages for KZbin. Got it. Love the analysis and commentary. Subscribed.

[@rent2darnhigh]

I was on Bloor st this Sunday. The bike lane is too narrow, you can not pass anyone without going out of the bike lane (not to mention the gutters in the bike lane). Since I was just riding casually without any need to be somewhere, I got yelled at couple of times to "step on it" or "lets gooooo". I just ended up taking a right onto Shaw St as its much more pleasant with ample room for bikes and cars to pass.

[@paulblichmann2791]

Problem with multiuse paths: people use them as a public park. You're supposed to use them TO GET TO the park!! (of which there are plenty)

[@Lv99Slacker]

I'm from Austin TX. I mostly ride in the street, because bike lanes are never swept of glass and other debris that can cause flats.

[@brandy1262]

I used to live in Ottawa and would agree your findings are pretty much what I would expect. Ogilvie was one of the options I had to ride to work. Never took it as it seemed too dangerous.

[@cubeofcheese5574]

I thought the argument "but bicyclists don't use the bike lane" was talking about bike lanes that are built and then have very low usage period. Not because they're on the sidewalk but because people just aren't biking

[@OhTheUrbanity]

People make both of these arguments

[@robertdeckard2136]

Of the several times I've had someone in a car get confrontational over me "not using the bike lane" they just didn't know what they were even talking about. By "bike lane" they meant a shoulder interrupted by several right hand turn lanes. (I was not turning). Sometimes the word they were looking for was "sidewalk". I haven't had to deal with this in a few years though. I'm not sure if it's because the time and route for my commute changed or because the people here are getting more used to seeing cyclists or if there's some other factor.

[@PorkShark]

As a cyclist, I ignore bike lanes cuz: - drivers don't respect it, 99% of the time they enter the bike lane without signaling and I've had many close calls. Its not worth it. - bike lanes are too narrow. frequently there are obstructions in the bike lanes, like homeless people, trash, rocks, all terrible for riding a bike. - I'm not comfortable being so close to cars cuz people here drive like maniacs. Nobody signals, headlights are too bright so you can't bike at night without being blinded, people strap 1000 decibel horns and blast their horns with 0 hesitation, 80% of people objectively drive terrible here

[@1981menso]

Here in San Diego we have only a few protected bike lanes. Most Saturday mornings when I get to them someone has parked their car in one and blocked it off. To the street I must go.

[@mindstalk]

Yet drivers complain about bikers "not obeying the rules".

[@sabrinusglaucomys]

A driver who was clearly in a rage once yelled at me "use the bikelane"... while I was turning left at a light. There was obviously no way to do that using the bike lane but clearly this person didn't bother considering a cyclist's point of view.

[@crowmob-yo6ry]

Israel is the best country ever! Palestine sucks and is gay! Palestine is not even a real country.

[@rolandxb3581]

Is it possible that at least some of these people mean "there's hardly any cyclists period who use the new bike lanes"? For example, if a road is busy, you see a continuous stream of vehicles. Its probably rarer to encounter an equally busy bike lane. If there are 50 cyclists in half an hour, people see that most of the space in the bike lane isn't used (its looks pretty empty) so they think its a waste of space. They forget that cars are much bigger and clog up a lane much quicker than cyclists. And even if a bike lane transports fewer people, it's also smaller and has other benefits.

[@jonwarland272]

You are exactly right. And they use the same excuse to make more car lanes. The lane is full of traffic, so we need more lanes.

[@SC-gs8dc]

Part of the issue is they're comparing it to the busy street it runs beside. People forget that so many streets particularly in residential areas might only see 100-200 car trips in an entire day (4-9/hr). In terms of usage per area (or volume) of road, cycling/multi-use lanes likely get more use than (guessing) 50% of the roads in many cities. (Roads need to be wider and thicker to handle vehicles) They should probably be comparing it to the service roads beside main roads ... I don't hear many complain about those even though they tend to have less traffic than a bike lane.

[@blitzn00dle50]

I just tell them that nobody would drive if the highway abruptly terminated and they had to share the tracks with trains

[@cal1953]

Loving the videos! My city's local council has finally started converting on-street painted bike lanes into dedicated protected bike lanes, but it's a slow roll-out, and as such not many cyclists use them as they simply don't connect residential areas with other areas of interest such as schools, shops, workplaces and leisure areas. But don't get me wrong, most people who are cycling, use the bike lanes where and when they can. I think many people forget that these infrastructure developments can take time to fully develop. The city spanning bike network of Amsterdam didn't just develop over night and took decades to fully come into fruition. Which is all the more reason why we should be supporting these projects! The more these networks expand and connect communites with themselves and one another, the more peope will opt to use them to travel, commute, shop, etc... And it's not like adding a dedicated and protected bike lane is going to hurt anyone regardless. Keep it all up 😄

[@mackiefarrell]

I really enjoy it when you guys use footage of Ogilvie Road. I live just off Ogilvie and it always feels so cool to see footage and content about a road I use everyday. Also, I agree that the lower use rates on Ogilvie are due to the quality of the bike lane. Especially between the merge off St. Laurent and Cyrville, cars cross the bike lane so fast and I'm pretty sure basically no one is looking for cyclists. It's so dumb too because the road has a lot of width to it and could easily be reworked to make adequate space for bikes.

[@aaquibattawala6051]

As a cyclist in Mumbai for more than a decade when I take my commuter or my road bike out, I have always rode on the road and have gotten use to the flow of traffic and most if the time you are perfectly mine with them , but because their people not obeying traffic laws (neither do cyclist) you have to get adapted either ways !! What most developed countries have called "bike lanes" , I don't find them necessary as a cyclist learns to adapt to the road and the follow of traffic and the people adapt to cyclist on the road you get better enjoyable environment, we had bike lanes in our cites the reason they didn't work was people used then for parking and the cops didn't enforce much because of Mumbai being a densely packed city , even if you had a good cycling tracking it always has pedestrians walking on them. I have faced same issues in Bike Lanes in New York City specially around Time Square where people just come out blindly on the road (bike lane) and it's us cyclist how are responsible !!! Thats why me , my cycling group and friends prefer to ride on on road. We as cyclist always have to be extra Vigilant..

[@joenuts5167]

And India has insanely high traffic and pedestrian fatalities lol

[@phototristan]

The utter lack of inclusivity often being demonstrated by car only drivers is staggering. I drive a car too as well as bike and think we all want less car traffic and less pollution, so there needs to be available alternatives to cars. Paris France has such bad car traffic and pollution now that they made it law that you can only drive a car a few days of the week, depending on your license plate, otherwise it's illegal to drive your car. Does it really need to get that bad here too before they actually accept some change for the better? Even if they don't use them themselves and/or totally hate bike lanes because they don't understand them, can they at least acknowledge that bike lanes make the streets more inclusive and being against them makes them anti-inclusivity?

[@Alexrocksdude_]

All the bike lanes in my area of Florida are on suburban arterials only 😭 We do have nice multiuse trails though, but they are not a substitute for commuters. Another great video btw I’m saving this for future reference!

[@chriswellsx]

When I commuted in Toronto I preferred bike lines but in the street would do. Downtown there are so many intersections that vehicles don't get up to their top i.e. speed limit -- as long as I can accelerate as fast as a bus does in traffic then I move at the same speed as everyone else.

[@rjh00]

If cyclist need to get on the road in order to pass slower riders, then that means the bikelane is bad, there should always be space for passing and I don't mean very carefully maneuver past the other person, no you should be able to comfortably pass another rider without even thinking about it. For the speedy riders I think changing the single lane paths into dual lane paths would make the most sense, that way you have space for a slow rider, you have space for someone to pass them and then you have the opposing lane for the speed riders to pass both of those riders. And yeah, I wouldn't even count the people riding on the sidewalk on that one road, that bikelane which should not be allowed to be called a bikelane is way too dangerous, instead the city should just widen the walkway and have one side for cyclist and the other for pedestrian. Heck, that walkway looks narrow even for walking, if you come across another person one of you need to walk over on the grass so you can pass each other comfortably.

[@SmallSpoonBrigade]

Which is fine in areas where you're either constructing new roads or have the space to give up a lane. Part of the problem is that in so many of these areas, you're taking lanes of traffic that are needed for things like trucks and buses and handing it to cyclists that aren't paying the taxes to build and maintain the roads. They then ride in ways that are unpredictable and in violation of the laws governing use of the street, and get rewarded for it by having property reassigned specifically for their use. I don't entirely begrudge the lanes, but it's disingenuous to suggest that it's an entitlement to have these permanent lanes, especially in areas where they aren't usable during several months out of the year due to ice or there are already parallel roads that don't have as much traffic.

[@nmpls]

20kph is just such a comically low speed limit that it shouldn't even count as bike infrastructure. I suspect even most semi-casual cyclists are breaking that limit regularly on sections.

[@michaeloreilly657]

Particularly on any kind of gradient.

[@sergeissakov5002]

20kph IS comically low, however, it’s appropriate for such infrastructure because of all the crossing hazard risks. Especially whenever the so-called “protection” is parked cars the potential for someone to suddenly step into a cyclist’s path is practically constant. Not to mention the possibility of someone in a car pulling across the bikeway at any driveway or intersection. This legal and practical low speed limit is why such infrastructure is reasonable only for short trips of a mile or two, but impractical for longer trips where time-of-trip matters, or for anyone riding for fitness. Furthermore, anyone on an ebike can travel at sport cycling speeds and would have the same safety issues on this infrastructure.

[@russellhorsefield9199]

In Australia and in South-East Queensland in particular , there is 3200kms of pushbike paths yet on the weekends many hog the roads 2 abreast not allowing cars to get through.

[@UDumFck]

Feel like you describe each observation environment but omit “while drinking a beer.” Seems like it would fit with each one and your narrative style. :)

[@ordinaryorca9334]

Ogilvie actually makes me angry, they have the space to protect the cyclists, they even used it to protect the pedestrians and still they have you cycle next to and at intersections even through car traffic?!!! Who even thinks of that, why not pave the cycle lane with nails and glass shards while we're at it?

[@steemlenn8797]

Costs, in both cases. Just that in one case it's the official reason, in the other case not.

[@kailahmann1823]

@@steemlenn8797 the irony is they added a pedestrian path at a place, where are probably 50 times more cyclists than pedestrians… in the Netherlands and Northern Germany this would be a bike path, which the rare pedestrians also have to use. Nobody here would build infrastructure *ONLY* for pedestrians in such an environment.

[@kurtsullivan7965]

I miss living in North America and want to live there again someday, so I really appreciate all the effort to change things and make it safe for non-motorists. Thank you.

[@francoisdemers1203]

The comment about cyclists not using bike lanes is often made when they aren't actually bike lanes, but "multiuser" paths, mixing bikes with walkers, runners, kids, dogs on leashes, etc. These are designed for slow leisure riding and not proper for any commuting cyclist riding over 20km/h. There are tons of these multiuser paths in the Ottawa region and we often get yelled at by drivers for not riding on them.

[@Lunageldia]

I actually had a guy ride in the road right next to a partitioned bike lane today. Older man, going maybe 5-8mph, not really all the way in the car lane, but wobbling back and forth too much to want to risk passing right next to him on an otherwise tight road (for an American road that is). Truly baffling to me, but like you mentioned in the video, the vast majority of people I see bike on this street use the partitioned lane. Edited for typos and such.

[@drea4195]

As a cyclist, I find multi-use pathways to be a pain. You really have to slow down to accomodate pedestrians. I would rather use the main road in that case.

[@franzzrilich9041]

When I was younger, and road bicycles, I made it a practice to avoid riding in large cities, and bike lanes are suicidal for bicyclists. What really works are riding in alleys, or service lanes, and eight-foot wide asphalt multi-purpose paths.

[@alexwalker9803]

Same in the uk. At 51.4613701, -2.5703629 in Bristol. I used to cycle on the faded old cyclelane on the road next to a lovely new tarmac cycle lane because it was more direct. The cycle lane was difficult to get to and off, one end you supposed to dismount and then to reach next bit go down a kurb between parked cars and the other end had bus shelters. The amount of rage I would recieve when cycling at same or faster speeds than the people in traffic was insane

[@brendannoggle7272]

Debris! Where I live the protected bike lanes have debris blown into them by passing cars but no vehicle traffic to blow the debris out. Any thoughts on this?