[OLD] MOZERKER 4.0 - NEW VERSION LINKED BELOW!

[@Ki11ersix]

You don’t need to request access to the save file. Literally right click it and save as then drop it into your saves folder

[@calebhitt6179]

THANK YOU MY GUY YOU THE SHIZ

[@piripiro]

JFYI, both SSB and SRPM do not benefit short-fuse anymore. Not that short fuse needs them in its current state, but I wanted to point it out since you talk about it at 4:10 ;)

[@TheLaziMan]

Cant wait to get it fro ebay ;D

[@tophatdragon3056]

Can we have a FL4K build next?

[@silversans3937]

Will the explosive minigun upgrade work on this build?

[@bluebetto]

things that warms my heart: "Iron bear is viable again"

[@iTsJesusBruh]

Was IB ever viable?

[@Terminate1783]

@@iTsJesusBruh Yea many times

[@SkyeBerryJam]

@@iTsJesusBruh bro IB has some serious one shot potential now lmao

[@weatherboy2009]

Dude I was caught off guard because I didn’t know they buffed IB originally

[@berserk-_-majay4104]

I left at the worse time lol. My cousin mained her recently and showed me some of the shit he can do inside and outside iron bear and I was like when did she get that good damn it lol

[@jakebissell7930]

I need to update my Moze cause she was the first character I played as at launch of the game and now you made a better version of a ongoing build. Thank you K6 you are the man

[@Cuestrupaster]

There is so much weapons in the game right now that's very difficult to list every weapon that's viable... that's awesome!

[@DJwasHere66]

Took a break from BL3. Looking forward to ALLL of that. *chef's kiss

[@CARLOSVSCARLOS]

Got me so hyped for Moze. I don’t have PC, so no save file for me, but half the fun is farming for things yourself, so that’ll be fun for me. Thanks K6! Awesome build!

[@rolandoaramirez1746]

I stopped playing for a while because i was using the bullet hose moze build from joltz but with all the running my controller's sprint button was messing. Up i see all the fixes the updates and i can't wait to play again and now this build make me exited thanks killer for the build it looks great.

[@ralphGabbbbbb]

Killer Six and Joltz making Borderlands even more fun. Im glad 2k giving more love on you guys by giving early access. Waiting for other classes build. Also if you can, please share your M10 modifiers. Kudos

[@Ki11ersix]

Lootsplosion/Healy/Chain Gang/Buddy System

[@Impulsaxl]

As Moze main, my soul is warmer now. Thanks K6, i searched a long time to build smtg around the Sapper, but without any success, now I can play Moze AND survive, it's really a good feeling =)

[@Rogue9264]

I made something similar to this but can’t wait to see more of your builds. Great job

[@Alice-dp7nv]

I'm happy to see the peashooter getting some love, it's my favourite gun from the dlc but people don't talk about it because it's a purple

[@ELREGA2]

I play the entire dlc with the peashoter and Harold

[@extreme_primus6884]

The bubble gun

[@eggofwah4852]

Aw man I SOLD MY PEASHOOTER WITHOUT TRYING IT OUT

[@ELREGA2]

@@eggofwah4852 aw man I am so sorry, you can restart the playtrough and it again or do it in normal or expert, or other character, it's a really good weapon

[@piercedelp1624]

Hey K6! This is an amazing build and it works really well. I have a couple changes to make this work better. Since grenades are now scaled with mayhem level I farmed for a mayhem 10 light speed since it splits into almost 6 homing names each one with this build will give you a grenade back. They also home into enemies very aggressively and do as much damage as a shotgun blast. I have also taken the time to farm for a moze class mod that has plus 6 grenades so I can carry up too 17 grenades. Thanks again!

[@brandonwelsh5090]

Hope we see the other classes soon. Love your builds

[@RemingtonSteel]

None coming

[@Ki11ersix]

He meant Zane, FL4K and Amara builds :D

[@RemingtonSteel]

@@Ki11ersix Ahhhhh. Now the comment makes more sense

[@nGEnigma]

@@Ki11ersix I'd really love a FL4K build ;-; I'm struggling so hard with sustain but that's cause I'm using a build that was designed for bossing and not mobbing. I saw a build someone made earlier but imma try to work my own magic first.

[@Ki11ersix]

Going to be building FL4K live on stream tomorrow: twitch.tv/Ki11erSix with highlights posting here on YT the following day

[@2009MCKilla91]

LOVE the damage output K6 i will deff be checking this out for myself! Just got to farm a bit more for more gear lol

[@Pair0fDux]

Killer you beautiful bastard, this is the build I've been trying to put together. A build where both moze and iron bear get the spotlight together like they should have from the start

[@TheHahaman23]

I doubled up on nuke pods and fought Wotan tonight. I’ve never laughed so manically in my entire life.

[@patmurphy7266]

nukes are so much fun with a solid aoe blue tree build. My autobear was dropping BOMBS lol almost reminded me of Gaige except IB actually kills things

[@bierbuikje1604]

Got a deathless with crazy radiation stats, 17-20 mil per shot. Nukes be Nuking.

[@richardsampson2736]

Love double nukes

[@estormo9669]

Thanks made it simple been looking for a bit, but I hardly was grasping the process

[@martingarrett5499]

Been running a build with a Bloodletter, Old God and a Pearl, not too shabby, but always failed at the Maliwan Takedown. Now I have Killer's build with the Transformer, Sapper and Pearl, I kinda feel confident. Thanks for the updated build Killer, you're a star.

[@spooby74]

@ki11er Six Love this Build.. It's my style of fighting. Finally gave me a reason to get back into my Moze especially not having to spam IB and Nads. The lightshow works well with this build too.. Pretty much anything..lol Thanks again for an awesome build.. Love the vids, keep them coming

[@jessebroberg]

Love your builds and the fact that you make the saves available for them on PC! Keep up the Great Work! Would love to see Level 60 builds for the other classes.

[@Ki11ersix]

Working on them

[@konstantyj]

I've been playing around with this build, and find that the Roisen's Thorns worls super well with it! I loved that gun since I first got it and love that it's super great in this build. Thanks K6!

[@NotoriouzJay]

This video is super helpfull to me rite now as ive recently gotten lvl 60 and need to be more powerfull so thank u

[@johnrr6]

Good video! I like the idea of the Sapper Com and specking out of torque cross promotion because I’m finding that just kills me more than about anything else in the game right now. I’m amazed you’re using Explosive Punctuation. We have tested it over on the gearbox forum rather thoroughly and it just doesn’t hold a candle to grizzled. With the way they have scaled grenades up to snuff again, To The Last is absolutely worth the point. You might consider that as well. I do like the idea of the additional health regen from the Sapper. Because at M10 your shield and health goes down very, very rapidly from even the smallest enemies. Iron Bear is finally a useful action skill. I’m praying gearbox does not mess with it very much. So much fun! Haven’t had this much fun in the game in several months!

[@Spazzgasm90]

love this build! I was running a bloodletter/deathless Moze build for a long while and felt it just never felt good on M10. Decided to try this the other day. Definitely a ton more fun and viable!

[@Ilestun]

Weird, my bloodletter build fells like way mmore powerfull and tanky than this sapper build (tried both trough Mali true takedown).

[@tenjenk]

man I absolutely loved the pre- M10 build which let us effectively use every aspect of moze from bullet hozing to iron bear to explosives and a variety of weapons. That was flung out after M10 but good to see it back on some level.

[@sterlingh9418]

I think mindsweeper grenades spawned from IB minigun crits are bugged, maybe double-dipping from grenade and action skill scaling. My micro grenades hit for about 60M on M10

[@baconbitz7804]

It’s not they drop for 20 mil frequently with regular guns

[@sterlingh9418]

@@baconbitz7804 I got 20 mil before patch with regular guns when I'd get the cascading lucky grenade spawns from pull the holy pin, I'm talking about one minigun crit spawning one micro grenade that does 60M by itself

[@qq4954]

Archer H my Iron bears micro grenade damage does 136mil. When I have the explosive mini gun

[@imightmakefunofyou4433]

Shhhhhhh....

[@animehbkscm]

Something is fucky with the scaling in secondary damage sources. Zane's clone literally one shots everything with an OPQ because the explosion double dips.

[@trisfor1353]

Flipper, it's god tier without anointments

[@SteamedPickles]

I hope they dont touch it 😔 I can see a few pellet nerf coming soon though.

[@flipwhatthezipp4609]

The flipper with a 300/90 anoint and this build is awesome though! If you get the first shot as an explosive shot you can hit up to 4M in one shot lol

[@lincolnmccallum8393]

@@SteamedPickles I really hope they don't nerf it but yeah it really is powerful so I can see why they would.

[@bakedmomo5693]

finally an S tier weapon for Moze in months. sadly, none of the devs main Moze so i see a "fix" coming because their man(the other 3) is no longer at the top. which Moze has only been for DAYS!!! while the other 3 have been OP SINCE DAY 1/LAUNCH!!

[@Admo8090]

@@bakedmomo5693 have you actually been playing since day 1?? Cuz Zane was definitely NOT OP when the game released... As a matter of fact, he was the weakest and least uses vh in the early days of BL3. I dnt remember the exact date, but it wasnt until gbx buffed Zane's action skills and fixed some other things that he actually became viable. Then dlc 1 came out, and with it, the Seein Dead class mod.

[@MutantSlayer9]

You have made iron bear an absolute boss destroyer and I love it mayhem 10 is so easy with this build thank you for making it

[@erwangerin7210]

Well, I was awaiting this new version and, I gotta say, I'm not disappointed at all !

[@wickedthemadhatter9713]

Yo imagine a self destruct ability for iron bear like in titanfall (the obvious inspiration for moze) If iron bear is giving you mega damage when destroyed and you get infinite ammo, you run in and suicide bomb a group so you kill enemies and do crazy damage with infinite ammo. Build name- kamikaze bear Edit: i could see k6 playing this for fun and joltz for meta

[@blacksunserpent]

Yeah, lol, you really thinking titanfall was inspiration for Iron Bear? That's a joke.

[@l4m8d46]

one thing makes me like forge is when holding a cov gun, you will never worry about running of ammo, because cov guns count all ammo you have is in magazine, which forge will generate all ammo you have

[@NotoriouzJay]

This is really gonna help just finished the game and need a build so thanks

[@Ki11ersix]

[@YoshKen]

Fun Fact: don't use your rocket launcher next to Iron Bear because you will kill It

[@mr.pockets8523]

I shoot it all the time with my yellow cake it's survives.

[@jamieturner6835]

@@mr.pockets8523 no, explosive weapons shot by iron bear while in iron bear, if you shoot it at something nearby the splash destroys iron bear as it has really high damage now it's scaled

[@Dmoney6278]

@@mr.pockets8523 when i use back burner IB disappears

[@Electro_Katarina]

Dizzyant backburner does friendly fire

[@non-binary-fox]

don't use splash damage weapons close to you period your gonna end up killing yourself at that point and New U's are expensive

[@mrmosty5167]

I just got my Moze to 60 today and started farming Captain Traunt before doing the DLC. By having most of your skills and a Mind Sweeper, Iron Bear shreds him in seconds with Vanquisher Pods and Target Softening. The trick is to get lucky with the reloads so you can hit his power pack then the secondary explosion from crits absolutely destroys him.

[@Davey-lm1qq]

Hey k6 I just wanted to let you know that the targetting rockets might be a tad better for some because if you run buddy system, like myself, iron bear will shoot them for you. Also I'm not the greatest at aiming with iron bear so I get more kill confirms

[@breadwinner541]

Lol ofc you used the unkempt Harold in the thumbnail. Really mozerker now. Great vid k6

[@wilfordcabrera8900]

Thanks I needed this kind of build for my moze!it is rudely amazing.

[@AnnihilatorNL]

Omg i didn’t know about the sapper 😦 I’m playing moze for the first time and that’s a must have!

[@Ki11ersix]

drops often in DLC 2.

[@AnnihilatorNL]

Thank you, good build btw. Looks very solid 👌

[@Ilestun]

If you super lucky to drop a multivitamin Old God and a great Sapper.......thats kinda a great combo. However I think foot soldier Moze outputs the more damages in a 1HP build and bloodletter COM. Going for Forge is so overkill when you take into consideration the INSANE ammo efficiency of the flipper.

[@aethyr4006]

Hey thx for the build! It's actualy not so far from what I've done before your video came out. I just need now a good Sapper com, but it is a b**** to farm!

[@Masterm1nd23]

The Duc works very well with Moze as well. One of my go to weapons as it has high critical damage and splash damage of course.

[@DenyThisFlesh]

You can use the Flipper by itself and kill pretty much anything. I missed the Kyb's Worth being so amazing like it used to be, but the Flipper is a great replacement for it. The damage it can do is insane for an smg.

[@aemankheidi6983]

I love this build thank you 🙏🏽

[@julius242]

YEEEEEES I LOVE IT!!!!

[@alexparker3483]

Awesome Moze guide! Thanks a lot

[@fertigtoast]

The plumage is insane on moze! It oneshots almost every enemy and you never run out of ammo. But it is most effective in the deathless+bloodletter build with the radiation annoint.

[@titouanjunay1163]

Happy to see I can use this build without any DLC!!

[@jamesmark5601]

The madman. He made Moze even better.

[@IIMado]

Game is amazing so far, just wish there was an Diablo 3 adventure mode to make playing more characters easier en less grindy.

[@tobzilla2812]

i just hit lvl 60 and thats finally a build i wanna play thx :)

[@samthewizzy]

Tobzilla first playthrough?

[@ivaniturrasaldias6631]

I completed the guardian takedown with this build thanks you!

[@patmurphy7266]

legit loving Moze right now, so good

[@tomstallworthy3660]

You should’ve taken 4 points out of fire in the skag den and put it into the one on the right that gives you more cooldown ( can’t remember the name) more than one point into skag den doesn’t do to much, also the one point will still allow you to get that extra dot. With your sapper com you really do not need the green capstone, +5 iron bank will give you enough ammo regen with redistribution to always stay up and on things like launchers wont even take much advantage of it it’s mainly means of destruction that does the infinite ammo on them. Try the light show on moze as it procs short fused so so much. Finally with bossing, yes the backburner is very good but try hitting his crit spot with iron bear and and if ur using the right weapon will literally instantly kill and boss. Just my take on the build, love the video. 🙃 You’ve inspired my to put a sapper on my build as I’ve always been using blast master pearl, for damage but sapper would be nice to not have to worry about not reloading and I wouldn’t have to spec as far down into green as I would have more points into sapper and I don’t have to worry about reloading resetting stacks.

[@BethsAbodeStainedGlass]

Great video as always K6! Anyone else notice on the backburner the splash killing yourself more than usual? Also, multiplayer Zanes clone using backburner will kill allies flat out? Didn't happen with cake or any other big splash rocket launchers.

[@asteranx]

What we really need is an anoint that plays the Captain Haunt theme just like, all the time.

[@razorwooo1724]

Ive played 23 days worth of borderlands 3, only have Flak characters (6) w/different builds After seeing this i think im gonna convert to moze, holy shit that build is insane!! 100% seems alot more fun

[@sly9263]

You don't need to go deep enough for clip regen etc for this build to keep infinite ammo... it already works with some clip size increase items/skills. Simply put, take all those points wasted to get to the last 2 tiers in green and put them into damage output in other trees.

[@LuminousLuna01]

Been using a similar build with the Insider shotguns, does a lot of work but chews though ammo a bit even with the ammo regen bonuses. I also run nuke bear as a panic button

[@hushex5150]

Cuttperse Launch pad is one of the best artifacts for moze by far Edit: i tried this build and my consecutive hits ogre shreds hard!!

[@logangrantham3203]

Number 246! Hell yeah! Gonna have some fun with this when I get home

[@catsnlean]

Used to play the hell out of amara. Then this beautiful patch came out.

[@AmandaMcCarterWrites]

Amara's melee is back. So if you want to punch everything in the game, you can now. At Mayhem 10.

[@Just-J-10]

Too bad work is so busy. I haven't had time to play BL3 lately. I still need to finish the story and level towards cap. I want to finish the main story before I touch the DLC. My Moze is going to be a blast!

[@ethantsai8261]

The gargoyle is an EXTREMELY powerful weapon, on my extra projectile & bonus dmg/kill skill on action skill Zane build I was melting people left and right

[@LordZeroTheNightmare]

Seeing yellowcake and OPQ over there. Chuckles as a tear drops lol. OPQ will be beast next year at lv60 if there’s no more lv increases in the future

[@imager8763]

Awesome! Thank you!!!

[@martinuselvin]

10:03 how do you not hit yourself when using complex root (you didn't even get dot)? I am still get hit and eventually die even with no torgue cross-promotion and every skill that gives incendiary dmg (skag den, cloud of lead, stoke the embers, experimental munitions)

[@DankDynamite]

Moze has been my favorite character since release but the gear has always been ridiculous to farm has that changed

[@desmune7779]

Yea bro she’s broken & easy to build now

[@Ki11ersix]

They buffed a LOT of weapons and fixed game balance so yeah farming is easier. They’re also working on spreading out loot pools

[@DankDynamite]

Okay looks like I'll finally go back to moze over amara

[@jamesshorts9655]

farming just for something isn't too bad anymore. farming for god rolls is still ridiculous.

[@TheLaziMan]

WOW I love it!! Cant wait to use this set ^^!!! Bdw i have a question have u restarted camp to get 60lvl perl or?

[@Ki11ersix]

That’s the only way to do it unfortunately (without cheating)

[@TheLaziMan]

@@Ki11ersix cheers, bdw thank you for showing timestamp i love that ^^

[@ThunderwingDS]

So I just got a rough build set up for this iron bear wasn't doing much damage so was confused realized after my game crashed forgot to load hotfixes and then.... HOLY SHIT!!!!! Just gotta get the rest of the gear now

[@tjzdroik7844]

Watched this to see the better gear I could use. I'm with you on that lader sploder Killer, fucker drains em man. Thanks for the help man.

[@girlweird833]

Thanks for the build video. I haven't played in a while cuz I didn't like the state of the game. I guess now's the time to get back in it.

[@Ki11ersix]

This last update massively improved the game. You can literally use just about any gun now and build diversity is back

[@girlweird833]

@@Ki11ersix I play on PS4 so I gotta a lot of farming to do, but its not like I'm doing anything else.

[@Ravenjim93]

one point in security bear helps auto bear dramatically, i also love using rushin offensive with either hex nade (beam nades are gun dmg) or a backburner to fully heal in one shot. Grizzled IMO is far superior to explosive punctuation, especially since topped off is still a 300% cdr, thus adding 40% more cdr WHEN doing splash isnt as efficient as removing 5 sec on mob kill all in all, not a bad build, but i would just use a couple points differently

[@williamhess3873]

I literally just built her mech and now I can farm Mayhem 10 gear without any specific build just by eating bosses which honestly is nice, but I can't play with my fav guns, or any guns at Mayhem 10. Iron bear isn't just viable, he makes bosses possible without a build so now I don't need to waste time farming lower OP levels. Really is nice and it is how I want it, so I hope they don't nerf it, but I'll be working on this build hopefully ultimately.

[@DRUNK__SOULS]

Hazardous Beacon with 100% damage after exiting iron bear does a loooot more damage than the flipper can. Also I use the “500% damage elemental explosion on critical hit” anointment on my flipper for better results :)

[@purplenurp5590]

Yeeet I have the same build didn't think anyone else was doing this but I'm using the nukes on my mech

[@adamcollins8907]

I could really use a good Fl4k build now that he is level 60. Particularly for True Vault Hunter Mayhem 10. Any suggestions?

[@Kova4a]

You can always use unkillable Fla4k. All you need is a red fang class mod. You can also stack 50%+ action skill cooldown rate from items and pretty much keep game burst up constantly. All enemies attack your pet and you can do whatever you like. You can get a robin's call shotgun and never run out of ammo - it doesn't matter that it doesn't do tons of damage as you can take your time. I find it boring to not get shot at but I'm pretty sure you can take true takedown solo if you want - yeah, it will take you a lot more time than the current OP Moze but you can do it

[@StuffJohnson]

I would love to see a video on the Sapper. I don’t think any of the larger bl3 players have made a video specific to it yet.

[@aetherninja]

I'm putting out some really nice numbers with the Beacon, I'm surprised you don't have it in your kit.

[@DenyThisFlesh]

Most of the new DLC weapons are really strong. Seems silly to nerf some of the good new weapons only to then release even better weapons in the DLC. What do I know though. I just play the game. Lol

[@Ki11ersix]

It’s very good but on Moze the Miscreant is a superior pistol

[@jf_kv_]

At various points (e.g. 10:39) you regen the FFYL meter, how does that work? I don't think I've seen that before.

[@Luddle_Puddle]

It's a guardian rank skill

[@jf_kv_]

@@Luddle_Puddle Damn. I'm blind. Did not see it despite having almost reached said skill. Thank you.

[@Luddle_Puddle]

@@jf_kv_ No problem

[@glockworkorange1435]

Rushin' Offensive works with the vanquisher pods you're using. Just aim and run and it procs.

[@celerysarcade]

Hey hey hey hey. K6. Short fuse no longer gets stainless steel bear. HOWEVER, both Short Fuse and Fire in the Skag Den receive Mayhme scaling, cause them to deal approximately 600% more damage. This results in about 93% fire from Skag Den and around 465% from Short Fuse.

[@dwaynejohnson9997]

Stainless steel bear no longer works with short fuse. Spec into torgue cross promotion for more splash damage for Moze and iron bear. Torgue CP procs short fuse also

[@Ki11ersix]

No. Do NOT spec into Torgue Cross Promo unless you wanna kill yourself with splash damage a LOT

[@WitherKing-bw3vf]

I love my moze becouse of the ability to have unkimited ammo. But i dont like to spec in the last two rows of the green tree. I prefer to get my ammo back by doing splashdamage (dont know the perk name but ita in the blue tree 😂). Having all of mozes weapons doing splash damage as well as using a cloning maddeding tracker. I never run out of ammo. You just dont need the last two rows of the green tree. Min 2 points you can spend in the other trees. But thanks for the build. I love to watch what other people do with my lovly moze. 😂❤️

[@johnnazar180]

I noticed in IB, some enemies hit for around 100k damage. Seemed kinda nuts imo

[@bbyanttt]

Yo can anyone tell me what artifact/Mod or whatever he uses to get his timer replenished in ffyl @ 10:33

[@frankyhorn2475]

It's the guardian ranks, dealing Damage to an enemy has a chance to replenish ffyl , but it has diminishing returns

[@dewaynewalker2252]

I now have multiple things to do now after seeing this video. 1: Farm for all the gear in this video. 2: Create multiple versions of Moze like I did Fl4k. Time to go loose sanity.

[@thewardwizard]

Would you be able to put together a bossing build together for Moze now she's absolutely fantastic in the Bear? I've been using the laser cannons and in a singular use of bear, I've been able to bring down graveward on M10... Love the content!

[@BigFezzo]

Yay finally someone who answered my question of, is the Soul Render good on Moze

[@lanthiex]

Great build! Any recommended modifiers?

[@davidmsmith268]

On PS it feels like the exploding rounds from Ironbear have a weird delay and the overheating seems too random. It makes no sense that I can fire both at the same time but sometimes one side overheats and the other doesn't. I wish they would make that more smooth but they'de likely just screw something else up.

[@yeettodabeat4537]

Im on ps4 and Everything works fine dont know what’s wrong with ur iron bear XD

[@WingZX1103]

Yeeeeeeaaaahhhh!!!!!! Let’s do this

[@strydrplays1997]

hey killer, how would you level this build from 50-60? coming back to the game and looking to jump into Moze and this build has such a spicy balance betweeen gun play and iron bear!

[@tonythen00b]

I am curious to see how you'd do a build focusing around the Bloodletter class mod

[@tomstallworthy3660]

The bloodletter isn’t really that good anymore as you loose out on 90% damage with the pearl and 200% damage on the blastmaster (if ur using one) the un needed survivability u get from blood letter isn’t enough to compensate for the amount of damage you loose

[@AleXelerate8]

This build and that classmod would be amazing for tediore chucks.

[@flipwhatthezipp4609]

Why not put points into Torgue Cross-Promotion? Its an extra 30% splash or are points just to give Iron Bear a little extra damage?

[@d.b.gardiner5740]

Thank you!!!

[@Ki11ersix]

You're welcome!

[@SpudNug69]

From farming class mods, how many did you need tofarm till you got a +5???

[@ethanponce8794]

I just got back into this game and been playing alot of my moze. Are there any better weapons to look out for other then the ones you showed in the video or all the weapons shown the best atm?

[@Ki11ersix]

Those are pretty much the best, BUT since this videos release we got buffs to The Lyuda, the Headsplosion and several other weapons.

[@kenneththornburg7797]

This was very useful 😃😃😃

[@baconpig1037]

I’m wondering, why not use Torgue Cross Promotion? It’s extra splash damage which would buff everything.

[@thefatbatman7334]

K6, for new Moze players which tree would you recommend them going down first, green or blue?