Old Winco Dyna Generator (Part 2 ) - Engine Rebuild on a Briggs L-Head Engine

[@sofjanmustopoh7232]

The best small engine repair channel in KZbin

[@generaldisarray]

I really enjoyed this video, along with part 1. I love the fact that you are a "regular Joe" trying to fix something, you don't have a shop filled with a load of specialist tools and equipment. It means there's hope that anyone armed with a few basic tools can fix stuff like this. A lot of people would have thrown it on the scrapheap but you stuck with it... well done James, well done!!! 👏👏👏👏👏

[@jcondon1]

Thanks. Unfortunately even fixing it myself probably cost me more then it is worth. Most would have trashed it if faced with sending it to a shop where it would have cost a lot in labor. But I did enjoy it and learned a lot.

[@generaldisarray]

@@jcondon1 Nevertheless, you enjoyed working on it and now have a running machine you can be proud of cos you fixed it yourself.

[@haneyoakie14]

@jcondon1 you also have shown me how to do it. Your work here was very helpful in guiding me to do a rebuild of a 3 HP Briggs flathead. You gave me a visual map of what I needed to do. My engine runs well, and it is because I avoided mistakes I would have made by watching your work. Thank you!

[@johncourtneidge]

@@jcondon1 hurrah!

[@johncourtneidge]

@@haneyoakie14 hurrah! Great comment!

[@waynebrundidge206]

At the age of 11 my grandparents gave me a 3 1/2 Hp B&S engine in a basket. After talking it apart several times I didn’t have any space parts. I’m 72 now and still learning every day something new. Love your videos.

[@v-g-z3689]

This has to be the most interesting series of all your generator videos on your channel, not only because of the technical process, but also because of the type and age of the engine.

[@jayurban4313]

I give you 5 stars, a triple A rating, and a meritorious commendation for your perseverance on this one...........

[@johnsmith7676]

Your big clue here was in the previous video -- the glowing muffler. That always indicates a lean condition or a timing issue. By the way, you do nice work and have good troubleshooting skills. Well done, sir.

[@jcondon1]

Thanks

[@WeTrudgeOn]

I use a variation of the hydraulic method for removing stubborn rotor shafts. I have several different bolts drilled thru the center then tapped for grease fittings. thread em in the shaft and pump up with a grease gun and they pop right off every time.

[@zappy6782]

Outstanding job James! Nothing like bringing the old timers back to operating performance. She has more years of service in her to go.

[@davida1hiwaaynet]

So happy you decided to repair this engine. These are the engines which were running the world when I worked on small engines. Some of these engines were configured with the cam to crank timing retarded by one tooth, to optimize the engine's torque curve at the higher end of the RPM range where a 2 pole generator was to be run. This is probably intentional. I really don't think you broke the key in the flywheel removal process. I think it was half-sheared all along and causing the power loss and loud exhaust sound and red-hot muffler you experienced. The resultant high combustion temperature from the retarded ignition timing would explain the scored piston. That piston would have been overheated badly by the late timing. That could easily expand the skirt, reduce the clearance, and disrupt the lubrication film. In my opinion; had you tested the engine with its original piston but with a replaced flywheel key - it would have probably pulled rated power; but would have used a lot of oil and worn prematurely. Regardless, it's great to see it run well at the end!

[@stuungar3390]

Wow, never seen the hydraulic method before, thanks for teaching an old dog...

[@johncourtneidge]

Again, well done! Thanks. It's remarkable how many tight tolerances, spring tensions, jet diameters, etc, etc have to aline! It's, therefore, amazing that initial engineers stuck with it. Just like you! Hurrah!

[@battmann678]

Honestly, that was nothing less than brilliant. Congrats.

[@jcondon1]

Thanks

[@arthurbiringer5676]

That’s another award winning resuscitation! Great work!

[@woodhonky3890]

Main jet adjustment on all small 4-stroke motors: With engine warmed up, and at speed, open just until misses a little - then turn back in just until it doesn't miss. Running just a hair rich is better than lean. Lean running creates excessive heat in the combustion chamber. Small engine mechanic since 1968.

[@jcondon1]

Thanks

[@ernestbarcella175]

Same criteria as with 500 cubic inches aviation engines ,,, fuel is cheaper than engine overhauls !!

[@tedhowey9044]

All that stubborn surging because you fixed a spring. Nice. .Ines doing the same under load, I'll check the governor spring for sure.😊

[@midsouthexpress]

I have the same engine and carb setup on a 1980 Sears rear tine tiller. Never been rebuilt, knock on wood..Thanks for this video. It will help a lot if I ever need to freshen up my engine.

[@MrSmitty6969]

Best channel ever, this is day two of my video binge watching tons of your vid's, I feel like I can tackle anything now!!! AAA RATING, FANTASTIC CHANNEL, THANK YOU SIR!!!!!!! SMITTY

[@jcondon1]

Wow...

[@danielmurphy7147]

I agree. Very step by step and cool headed with dry humor. Keep making such excellent videos 👍

[@phillipmckinney7906]

I will always save a link to your videos as you are a true professional with small engines and you give so much info that id be comfortable working on one of my own so thank you very much for what you do and teach

[@markvincenzo4672]

I have a Winco/Dyna 5500 watt 11hp B&S electric start generator, very similar to yours except mine is in like new condition. I bought it new around 1992, was always stored indoors and it worked great for years until it didn't. So I bought a Ridgid/Yamaha 7500 watt generator and then fixed the Winco/Dyna generator. It had a bad diode which after replacing it, the generator worked great again. But it is my backup now as my Ridgid has a function display and a bigger fuel tank. Great videos!

[@stargazer7644]

Just have to say I really like your videos. Good pacing with the right amount of dialog and no time wasting fluff. Thanks!

[@Don_ECHOguy]

I read some of the comments and Wow, you got a tough crowd to please! You do excellent work and leave not much to chance... filming is topnotch as well. I'm working on a B&S 5HP with a monarch pump attached... engine was kept outside and stuck solid... piston, rings, and valves all stuck, but are all loose now. This engine has ball bearings and the timing marks threw me for a loop too at first, but both B&S service manuals show the same install sequence as what you did. Just to check though I backed off the bearing and there is no timing mark visible on crank gear, only on the crank counterweight. My engine WILL pump again... great stuff, keep up the good work! 👍

[@jcondon1]

Thanks. I hate doing rebuild videos because people are so critical. But been doing a lot of them anyway. Ifs not a sports car. It will be fine.

[@lawnguru2344]

Amazing😉I believe I have watched pretty much most if not all of your generator rebuilds. This one was one of your best ..i like Bubble Light was in the top 10 ! This is favorite episode..Watch you from the first week ..Keep up the Great work !!

[@brad9529]

I can tell you do this for the love not the money, I find your patience and intelligence a pleasure.

[@jcondon1]

Not for the money. Will usually fix them if I can sell it for more the the cost in parts to fix (not including labor).

[@brad9529]

@@jcondon1 of course its to make money like everything, but your love and care for what you do outweighs your commercial sense, you could make a fortune bodging it together, reusing old parts etc, but you take the time to do it right and that comes from being a decent person and respecting your self and your trade.

[@lesthompson5907]

running sweet now you've fixist it . often never wend wind them i have used I fixed , reliable engines les England

[@w2dmw]

Man, what a load of work, for such a little load capabiluty......I think you must choose an adjoining spring hole, to make the governor a little less sensitive........also, it will run better, with better compression, when the rings seat in after a little more running......Great job, and good find with that cam tooth foul-up....

[@Snookattack]

Thank You for your videos they are very informative and entertaining. I thoroughly enjoy them.

[@jcondon1]

Glad you like them!

[@somerandomguy3868]

Brought another one back from the dead, can't argue with your results

[@jcondon1]

Thanks!

[@larryniidji]

Thank you. Well done. Great info. I have an old cast iron block Briggs engine I want to tackle now. Inspiring.

[@jcondon1]

Best of luck!

[@dank6905]

I just bought Super Clean for $18.65 a Gallon,,,on Amazon,love this stuff.

[@RustyNail5856]

I new you would fix it. sounds sweet James.

[@robbaillargeon5056]

I believe I have watched pretty much most if not all of your generator rebuilds. This one was one of your best by sticking to it to determine what the actual problem was. The one thing I couldn't figure out was the damage to the piston and cylinder wall when none of the lower end was damaged. I didn't think timing would do that...either it runs or it doesn't, or in this case, much reduced power being timing off by several degrees (one tooth). Excellent work!!

[@dadskrej5226]

The piston/cylinder damage...with the timing off, and the exhaust valve partway open when it should have been closed, possibly canted the piston to one side when the plug fired, scuffing the one side of the piston/cylinder. My idea/theory.

[@phbrinsden]

Great video. Learned so much. The compressed air leak down test is totally new to me. Definitely glad to know about it.

[@danmiller6880]

One thing I noticed - that you pointed out - was the glowing muffler in part 1. While not unusual at a heavy load, with no load, usually that's not right. I've seen that before with valve timing issues. I've got one very similar to this one - from 1974! And it still purrs like a cat. They haven't changed much. Keep up the good work, man!

[@jcondon1]

Dan Miller yes in part 2 I found it was a valve timing issue.

[@danmiller6880]

@@jcondon1 You do good work, James.

[@repairitdontwreckit4257]

Enjoyable video James. As you know a lot of us guys that are watching these videos have a lot of our own tools. But we don’t have everything. I enjoy watching you solve the problems with what you have. I especially liked your piston ring compressor. A simple stainless steel gear clamp did the trick. Nice.

[@noelcastle3986]

Great video best couple of hours I've spent in a long time watching them .. Looking forward to a follow up video once the rings bed in and compression goes up to normal specifications.

[@aboumarakhossam]

Well done Mr James, great job

[@whitesapphire5865]

Interesting..... I had a feeling that valve timing was off, as eluded to in my earlier comment (part 1) but hadn't really considered that someone might actually have been in there and loused it up, but the overheating of the exhaust, and cylinder block, fit in perfectly with what you found. It would also burn the exhaust valve over a period of time. Good work James, on a job well done 👍

[@andrewgrace4410]

Thanks James, boy that was a challenge, great troubleshooting 😊

[@kiwibryntoo]

I prefer undoing the shaft bolts with an air rattler... less chance of bending anything. That timing mark issue has solved a problem I have. Thanks.

[@amphibiousone7972]

Outstanding Work! That's quite a Gem Boss. I learn a lot from your experience. Thank You 🤝

[@AlatarBlaze]

Man a small engine block washer would be a nice addition to your shop

[@jcondon1]

It would. But have not rebuilt enough engines to justify it yet.

[@AlatarBlaze]

@@jcondon1 how did you learn so much about generators...is it a hobby or a profession?

[@jcondon1]

Matthew Johnston just a hobby

[@AlatarBlaze]

@@jcondon1 oh ok with as much as you knew about them i figured it was your profession...anyway love the channel just wish i could find a genny around my area so i could fix it up

[@CajunGreenMan]

I made a small parts washer with a plastic colander, five gallon paint bucket, a fountain pump from Harbor Freight, some hose, and Simple Green. If you're going to do engines in it, definitely have to upgrade to a metal colander! ROFL!

[@robstirling3173]

The usual 'rule of thumb' for ring gap on an air cooled engine, was 3 thousandths of an inch gap for each inch of bore

[@jcondon1]

Thanks. Am rebuilding another now. Will user that rule.

[@williamlogan4049]

What a battle excellent outcome and video,thank you

[@hpda44]

Great job! I love that you take these older engines and make them good again. Very interesting

[@sikorik9964]

Those old Briggs were really meant to last back then, not so much now.

[@rancelynch6514]

Very, very interesting and informative video. Very good of you to think about testing and checking the timing. I'll bet it was assembled wrong at factory. You know that the engine has to get hot to seal all the tolerances and then it runs like a champ.

[@paulboomer7109]

Back in the day we called that gauge a go no go .you are right on the money with that valve!🔧

[@ebony5766]

Holy cow this was great! What an amazing channel!!

[@v-g-z3689]

Excellent troubleshooting and repair job. Got yourself a new subscriber there ;) Greetings from Germany!

[@stephengordon8968]

That thing sounds great , great job !

[@jcondon1]

Thanks, but working on video #3 and the oil is not looking as good as it sounds.

[@Hugo_Overthere]

If you remember this engine had periodic excess turning resistance as the piston traversed the cylinder. The overly tight ring gap which Mr. Condon found, even after cylinder honing, would explain the excess resistance. The new properly-gapped rings solve this problem.

[@davidwallace785]

Love these videos. Great technical knowhow.

[@tgm49]

Wow a hose clamp for a ring compressor I would have never thought of that

[@jcondon1]

Not my first choice, but it works (most of the time).

[@BruceBoschek]

I saw a mechanic in Turkey reassemble a 12 cylinder diesel marine engine using a hose clamp for each ring since the grooves on the pistons were too far apart for the clamp to go over more than one ring at a time. The pistons must have been almost 20 cm (nearly 8") in diameter. It was a painfully slow process, but the mechanic did not look like he was in a hurry. 🙂

[@stargazer7644]

I have that same engine on a coleman powermate generator. It has been a solid generator for decades. I could tell immediately when you started it that it didn’t sound right. I guess that was the timing.

[@rustyrepairs2565]

A little late to the game but those Winco Dyna generators are definitely solid. I had one that was dual fuel from the factory way before anybody else made them. Great video!

[@tbas1972]

The nut you were turning was the governor sensitivity there should be a tab with a spring to the governor arm, that is the way to adjust engine speed, good find on the timing

[@Gfthce3426]

Time off could create to much heat and cause the scoring and thd overheated exhaust was indicating that as well . Interesting ! Really enjoying your channel. Thanks

[@larryskeeper1197]

That engine should settle a bit after the rings bed in. Neat job, thanks for showing

[@philoso377]

I love to watch the hydraulics in action with positive result. BTW in another channel I saw how a bearing can be removed from a blind well, in absence of a special puller, by hydraulic technique. The idea was to pressurize the junction between bearing and the well bed with hydraulic fluid by feeding through the bore of bearing. Normally this is a dumb idea because water or oil will escape through bearing balls. The trick was to increase viscosity in that fluid - to a consistency of mud and clay - plus inertia. (Same inertia seen in this video aided by an impact driver). In this case, pulverized news paper sock with water was used (although oil and other fine tissue may work too). The mixture was fed through the bore a small batch at a time aided by a firm push of a rod of equal bore size until the paper mud show up at the bore rim. At this time pounding starts, the rod is hammered into the bore full of mud. Water can be seen gushing out between balls but the mud stay in. Continue adding mud after each drive. It was fun to watch it actually worked on something seemingly impossible without the right tool.

[@allrock1238]

One of the challenges with old small engines as well as older automotive engines is that they where designed to run on Leaded Gasoline which was much easier on valve seats due to how that toxic additive coats and lubricates and cushions valve to seat impact ,modern engines that designed to run on unleaded fuel have hardened exhaust valve seats due to unleaded fuels lack of property . Running an engine designed for use with leaded fuel on unleaded requires machining the block (in the case of a L head Brigs and Stratton) or head and pressing in a new hardened valve seat, or using a special purpose lead replacement fuel additive (that does not contain lead) ,Small Generator engines due to how they operate at a relatively high load and speed are more prone to this issue. there are lead free fuel additives for this issue. you will find a lot of old small engines brought back to life that will burn up the exhaust valve seat (if its not hardened) due to this issue.

[@ernestbarcella175]

these Briggs I/C come with hardened seat hard stelite exhaust valve and cast iron sleeve ,, they are great engines develop good power and with a bit of character

[@johnclarke6647]

I found the main jet setting on those carbs was about .75 to 1.0 turns out on the main jet. I usually turn them in until the lean out with a load on the engine. I had the same carb on a 2500W Chradtsman gen set.

[@gaetansimard1594]

Wow! You always impressed me! Bravo!

[@ernestbarcella175]

I appreciate and share your enthusiasm with generators of any kind or brand , and your pursue for a perfect result ,,, I have experience with Briggs Straton that the cam loves profile is not of the best geometry ,,even when the correct specified clearance is adjusted if you pay attention when the valve make contact with the seat is very well beyond any reasonable valve timing and that is the reason you see such a low compression I have ground the valves stem to simply satisfy a normal valve timing of some 10 to 15 degrees of overlap right at TDC and only then the intake seals good right after BDC ,, but the clearance is then excessive in the order of 20 25 thousands or more ,, for sure the cam followers do not take full advantage of the acceleration and deceleration ramps ,, they do click , but they run great ... Thank you for the effort in producing these videos ,, EB.

[@airdrop1670]

We tried dielectric grease on paper gaskets in water pumps , it stopped leaking and made the taking apart very easy with the gaskets reusable .

[@larrykelly2838]

Gees Doc., this was a tough one, watched both parts.

[@jcondon1]

It was. Am still wondering how the timing was off.

[@larrykelly2838]

@@jcondon1 I think the timing was off when it was made at the factory. They used it but really never loaded it up.

[@TheNovaJohn]

Nice catch on the diagnostics, I luv these old engines If I may,, on some engines the carb needs the filter/housing to stop hunting. It depends on the setup but in some cases the longer intake tubes straighten the airflow, condense it down into a laminar flow. In some cases the carb opening can get a poor signal, air doesn't enter in properly and causes issues in the venturi. Now this may not have been the issue here but as you know that intake system is impressive. These are updraft carbs. Not seen in too many engines. Much like the old Ford Flat heads. I wouldn't be surprised if these carbs would run one of those engine rather well!

[@jasonjoncas5998]

You have to break those rings in run it at full load 1 hour than change the oil the leakdown test will pass.

[@v-g-z3689]

Yep, that should do the trick. Warming the engine up with no load, then going to full load for at least one hour, better 2 hours, then changing the oil usually helps.

[@jonmanuel4597]

Another good one James. A little advanced for me..... but I have it saved in case.

[@vincentshelpfulhints4085]

Thanks for sharing

[@alexisautube]

I enjoy all of your videos! I would have tried to find a socket which will be the right size to fit over the shaft without touching the bearing and then used a three jaw gear puller. Just another idea. Cheers!

[@geoffreyhall7843]

Amazing amount of perseverance and thought went into this rebuild. I would have given up after one or two carburetor rebuilds! Might be my favorite episode, along with the go-cart build. Thanx, as always.

[@ddyeo503]

That one tooth off was a great find! Explains why the muffler was red hot and why the piston was damaged by having too much heat in the engine,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,

[@flir67man84]

Awesome save

[@jackx4311]

Nice job, James!

[@tonyc.4528]

Those may have been Acme threads inside the shaft. That's what you'll find are used on bench vices and such. Great job!!

[@llib51]

Very impressive!

[@taftr]

I have a Tecumseh SnowKing, that has been in service for about 30 years. I doing the same full rebuild, due to excessive ring blow by. It also has an adjustable carb. One of the features of that is you can adjust or optimal performance under various outside temperature conditions. You can also adjust it to optimal performance under load. So when you load it down and it seems to run a bit rougher, just tweek the main jet a little

[@uploadJ]

re: " It also has an adjustable carb. One of the features of that is you can adjust or optimal performance under various outside temperature conditions. " His Briggs in this video works the same way - just 'hit' the carb adjustment screw for optimum performance at the time!

[@filter4now]

Thanks for the info - very informative of the details of an engine problem. I'll tell you a couple of things you may want to try that have helped me. I've rebuilt 2 of these and when they are surging at no load - there's a couple things I found. First - I always replace the governor spring as the constant stretching and tension over the years will inevitably wear it out. Second, the idle jet and main jet have to be absolutely perfect along with the governor spring tension - or else the surging continues at no load. I hate how the exhaust is always pointed at my face when I adjust it - I feel like crap from all the carbon monoxide I sucked in last night even running it outside.

[@jcondon1]

I was just working on a 10hp Tecumseh flat head and was thinking the same thing. No way to adjust the governor spring without putting your face right in the exhaust. Not the best design.

[@garymucher9590]

Two issue that will help you doing such rebuilds. First, if there is no end gap specified, then you use the standard of .004" per inch diameter. Example, a four inch diameter cylinder would have a .016" ring end gap. Secondly, you really need a ring expander, to install rings. You may get away with install rings without any issues until one day, you snap a ring and have to wait for new ones to arrive. There are very very cheap, but well worth the cost. Thumbs Up!

[@jcondon1]

Thanks for the info. This was the first engine I have rebuilt. So did not have the proper tools. Will look into purchasing a ring expander. Most likely will be rebuilding a Briggs 10hp soon.

[@gregkieser1157]

Awesome series of videos. Learnt a lot……..😂

[@M10000]

Parts 1 and 2 are great! I admire your stick-toitivness! Getting old things to work is the greatest skill of all! They don't make ANYTHING new that's good! RIGHT TO REPAIR!!! Why don't the Chinese make discontinued gas tanks?? Maybe you could help wake them up?

[@captain150]

Really interesting series on this engine. Quite surprised an old school flathead is that sensitive to cam timing. Looks like the cam has about 60 teeth, so 1 tooth would be about 6 degrees. Just 6 degrees and it ends up with 1/3 the power it should, crazy!

[@deangentles4966]

hi james you spend a lot of man hours on this, but i think its not about money but the buzz, great video , part1 and 2

[@jcondon1]

Thanks. Yes this one was cheap and I liked the look of it. But even fixed up, still not worth a lot of money. I like the older engines. They are built much better. Have not seen a ball bearing in any of the newer Briggs generators.

[@willrobbinson1]

good out come after multiple problems that was not obvious

[@philoso377]

I learn something not obvious to all beginners - the timing meshing of cam gear.

[@geraldeaston-lf4ud]

good job

[@donaldelrod9172]

if you have already figured this out, disregard but when i worked in a welding repair shop, these type small generator rotor removal was using a solid rod made from an original mounting bolt with the head cut off about a half inch short and then a slot cut into the end to use a screwdriver to screw it into the end of the crankshaft. then a bold of the proper thread was screwed into the end of the rotor where you tapped the threads, til it applied pressure to the shortened rod and would pop the rotor. hope this makes sense.

[@jcondon1]

Did that recently. Worked well. Of coarse a week later I realized the bolt I cut down was not an extra one.

[@rohanabope3614]

thanks sir

[@adnacraigo6590]

We used to spray a little aluminum paint on head gaskets to insure a good seal. It probably doesn't matter much with air cooled low compression engines though.

[@stephenlawyer3031]

Briggs has a tool that holds the flywheel that works real well.

[@Farm_fab]

my dad had an old rototiller that had the valves "grow," and he had to grind his as well. it did much better after that.

[@deborahabercrombie9461]

good save

[@barthanes1]

You said "clone carb" and i heard "clown car." 😂

[@UpInSmoke54]

Now the engine sounds normal, in the first video, it sounded weird!

[@nascar20970]

I use wheel bearing grease or the best is white sandwich bread to remove blind hole bearings or taper shafts.

[@aterack833]

Just a heads up, the taper in the ring is for gas assisted ring sealing pressure, think of the ring as another piston that forces toward the bore, and the taper as it’s sealing ring, or as it’s crown, the pressure is directed to the grove instead of the outside and that causes the ring to push outward and the rest of the pressure pushes the ring down into the piston ring land and the piston itself, typically the pressure outward on the ring and downward on it is enough of a percentage that the ring doesn’t drag behind and the piston doesn’t race past it (causing the gases to escape?) but if the piston does go faster than it then all it will do is act like a tapered seal on a valve and stay seated until the rings move faster and seat on the bottom land again giving room for the taper to act as a piston again, this is mostly just for compression gasses and isn’t used on lower power versions of the same engine bore size

[@jerryglen986]

Superb job 😊👍🍻🍻

[@jcondon1]

Thanks 👍

[@michaelmathews295]

Remember that a slappy valve is a happy valve.

[@FishFind3000]

9:20 you know you can very easily discharge it by shorting that contacts with a screw driver. Then there’s no safety issue.

[@williamwhitehead8362]

You need to put the filter on and the For that breather and that should help with your hunting

[@aerotro]

The old ring looks a bit oval shaped which would cause poor compression, glad you got new piston rings.