On Prelest (Spiritual Deception) - Fr. Seraphim Rose

Fr. Seraphim Rose writes:
The concept of prelest, a key one in Orthodox ascetical teaching, is completely absent in the Protestant-Catholic world which produced the "charismatic" movement; and this fact explains why such an obvious deception can gain such a hold over nominally "Christian" circles, and also why a "prophet" like Nicholas Berdyaev who comes from an Orthodox background should regard it as absolutely essential that in the "new age of the Holy Spirit" "There will be no more of the ascetic world-view." The reason is obvious: the Orthodox ascetic world-view gives the only means by which men, having received the Holy Spirit at their Baptism and Chrismation, may truly continue to acquire the Holy Spirit in their lives; and it teaches how to distinguish and guard oneself against spiritual deception. The "new spirituality" of which Berdyaev dreamed and which the "charismatic revival" actually practices, has an entirely different foundation and is seen to be a fraud in the light of the Orthodox ascetical teaching. Therefore, there is not room for both conceptions in the same spiritual universe: to accept the "new spirituality" of the "charismatic revival" one must reject Orthodox Christianity; and conversely, to remain an Orthodox Christian, one must reject the "charismatic revival," which is a counterfeit of Orthodoxy.
From "Orthodoxy and the Religion of the Future", p. 143-146. Buy the book here: www.sainthermanmonastery.com/...
For those interested, you can listen to my recent conversation with Joseph Sciambra on Fr. Seraphim Rose, "Orthodoxy and the Religion of the Future", and more: • Fr. Seraphim Rose & Or...
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[@oakandiron_]

As an ex Protestant… I can attest to this behavior. 😕 Lord have mercy on me a sinner.

[@user-qg3tq3uw3w]

Fr. Seraphim Rose was the one that taught me my Orthodoxy 58 yrs ago.

[@OrthodoxWisdom]

How blessed! Can you share more about your experience with him?

[@user-qg3tq3uw3w]

@@OrthodoxWisdom Fr. Seraphim was my godfather as well as my spiritual Fr. He was also my son's godfather. Are you on facebook message me and I well send you some of the things I remember.

[@kaylakincannon3458]

I’m only now coming into the (Orthodox) Church. God Willing, I’ll be baptized and christmated this coming year. But I still struggle with understanding how far and how many bitter tears I have to yet offer to let go of any notion of myself as a “good” person. As a former Protestant, I have found myself blissfully deceived with my own arrival at a state I was far from. We are not worthy. But through the Church and the grace bestowed, God can show us true love and humility.

[@kkonrad4165]

Please pray for my friend and family in the protestant church - they think we're of the same church and they can't see how unture that is.

[@aymtb]

It’s the relationship with Christ Jesus and accepting him as Lord and Saviour that matters. Perhaps you can give them your testimony.

[@BS-np8xt]

Accepting Christ is the initial first step, yes, but that's all it is - The first step. The spiritual life is a constant, daily struggle against the passions and towards the acquisition of the holy virtues, without which we cannot hope the Kingdom of Heaven. Heaven is a place for holy things! Ask yourself - Am I holy, or would I defile such a place by my mere presence? Luckily, if you sincerely struggle to imitate Christ, the Lord will help you on your journey in many ways and God willing, His mercy will compensate for the ways in which we will fall short at Judgment Day. If He didn't help us continually, our transfiguration would be impossible (And how great this help is!) Glory to God for all things!

[@aymtb]

As I said it’s a relationship with Christ Jesus this implied an ongoing process.

[@novaxdjokovic9592]

@@aymtb The problem is that unrepenting lesbian pastors covered in tattoos and piercings claim they have accepted Christ while also teaching that sodomy is fine and dandy according to Him. To "accept Christ" means nothing if you don't know what it means to do so. And if you do accept Christ, you should want to submit yourself to the Church He established. Refusal to do so can only be described as a type of prelest which of course stems from pride

[@aymtb]

Have you accepted Christ as your Lord and Saviour?

[@chanelg376]

This can also be applied to the rigorous laxity of following extreme orthodo bro ideas. One can practice the form of orthodoxy but don’t have the Holy Spirit within them if they don’t do it humity and love.

[@BrodyAleksander-YOB]

Orthobro ideas are usually right over the target.... I think it's the lack of humility and patience that is the problem you point to

[@leo11190]

Wow! I have and love Thomas Kempis’ book, “ The Imitation of Christ “, but after hearing this I can SEE what you mean!! To attain the virtues contained in the book without repentance can be sooooo dangerous! Thank you so much for this video. It’s opened my eyes.

[@TranslatedAssumption]

I have been 100% guilty of this in the past when I subscribed to Catholicism and even sought to enter what I thought was a so-called, "Eastern Catholic monastery that was Orthodox in communion with Rome." The extreme delusion and deception that I was under was so devastating to me in every conceivable way. I can look back now and see through the eyes of authentic Orthodoxy that Orthodoxy was in fact offered to me several times throughout my life but I had always turned away from it due to worldly loyalties to certain people, ideologies, heterodox religions, etc.

[@SAHOVNICU]

You have been deceived. Eastern Orthodoxy is a heretical religion. This sect is under Anathema as per canon 110 of the council of Carthage in 419 AD for denying that Original sin must be washed away with baptism. They are blasphemers of the Holy Spirit by rejecting the Filioque.

[@anond2015]

I was raised non-denominational Christian, became agbostic as a teen. Experimented with magick as an adult. So when I came back to Christianity, I wanted mystical experiences that I looked for in meditation and magick. I heard about hesychasm and started leaning toward Orthodoxy out of a desire for mysticism. Then I got discouraged because everyone said that lay people should not touch it without souritual guidance because of the danger of prelest. But THEN I looked into the theology and attended Divine Liturgy. The Holy Spirit has humbled me so that I don't mind at all sll if I ever experience spiritual visions. I just want to work on my sinful nature and love my neighbor more. My dad is trying to get me to attend a charismatic church, get "baptized in the Spirit," and receive my prayer language (speaking in tongues). I don't have the heart to tell him that I don't believe that the heart of Christian life is babbling and falling on the ground. Lord, forgive me if the Holy Spirit is behind it, but I don't see the humility and repentance out of that movement.

[@vladvalo]

Similar background.my family was Mormon and I also broke off as a young teen and experimented with magic. I have been humbled and led twords orthodoxy. Stay strong brother ☦️🕊️❤️

[@JordanBrown-km5kf]

Rarely is petacostal speaking in tongues that of the Holy Spirit. I have heard on multiple occasions that these speaking of tongues is of blasphemy in diffrent languages to casual observers. The gift of tounges is legible to the one speaking and the reciepient as language is a gift of God. You are on the right path of Orthodoxy and hopefully you can show your family it is right by being rightous yourself.

[@Unseen.Warfare]

I have the book and I made a post and dropped the link in my Bio. Many people need this message my brother. You are so blessed. ☦️🕊

[@OrthodoxChristianMusicProject]

Wonderful excerpt and topic. Not ironically, even in modern Bulgarian, “Charms” is Prelest (прелести). Proverbs 31:30 "Charm is deceitful, and beauty is vain, but a woman who fears the Lord is to be praised." Reflecting on scripture we see the warning as this verse contrasts Eve and the Theotokos.

[@Georgeos777]

the word for fear in connection to god is always "respect" , its like with wordly parents, fearing them means something is really wrong, but respect is good, like many other translation errors. Nevertheless 31:30 is great

[@icxcnika1823]

@@Georgeos777Not really, unless the translator is not up to scratch. Check it out on the original translation from hebrew to Greek in the Septuagint. If your knowledge of the Greek language is lacking, you’ll feel it in your heart ❤️ and Soul and right down into the marrow of your bones. Wish I could write in the language of my forefathers . All good. God bless you and your household. Greetings from where I am. ✝️. 🌴🐊

[@Georgeos777]

@@icxcnika1823 thanks, yeah maybe i should mention that when i said it i meant the tanach not the new testament in terms of the word "fear", i simply cant see fear in any relation to something good or healthy

[@icxcnika1823]

@@Georgeos777 Thanks for clarifying it. I was under the assumption you meant what you replied anyway. Have a great Lent Georgeos . You may be interested in the kukukuku tribe of cannibals , that friends and I spent a few days full of emotions, excitement and danger beyond belief. Take care, and God bless. ✝️. 🌴🐊🇵🇬

[@CabinC82]

I’m reading this book at the moment, it’s fascinating.

[@d0g_0f_Christ0s]

Whoa, I have that T Kempis book, I would never have known that book was bad. Is it even possible for a 50yo Protestant lifer to convert? I hope so. I know the right thing to say is 'with God, all things are possible' but my faith is weak like a tumbleweed, though there is no other option. Glory to God, Amen.

[@kkonrad4165]

Thankfully Our Lord is merciful. Even if your faith is the size of a mustard seed it can grow to be an enormous tree. and, you can ask Him to increase your faith. He is good.

[@saintedward318]

I have The Imitation Of Christ too. Time to purge my library of certain books.

[@d0g_0f_Christ0s]

@Horaō I have (do), St Spyridon GOC (6weeks), it's the inside (me) that concerns me, I'm a crafty old dog. It was 3am when I commented after the last compline (end of day analysis is never heart warming) Lord have mercy. Thank you for the invite into the hard way. God bless.

[@matushkajustina8978]

@@d0g_0f_Christ0s in Detroit?

[@dianadallalnctmrcmc9303]

Its NEVER too late to repent. Sure you can repent. I went from Atheism to Protestant to Orthodox. It's never too late to repent.

[@JovanSerbia]

Thank you very much for your works. God bless you ❤

[@areyoutheregoditsmedave]

my friend, this is the best orthodox channel on youtube. i wish all of online orthodoxy was like this. thank you for these readings.

[@Alex462047]

I find it utterly compelling that even Fathers of the Church fell into this state. How much more careful should be the ordinary parishioner without such knowledge as these Fathers! This is a very timely warning for me. Glory to God for everything!

[@orthodoxwitness2374]

Thank you for this wonderful clip. It's amazing to witness how the very people who have to some degree or another fallen into prelest disdain this divine medicine which can help them to struggle against this condition and enter into the authentic spiritual life. They feel "judged" and "uncomfortable" when they hear that the spiritual experiences of protestants or catholics, or indeed their own spiritual experiences, may not have been as pure as they thought, and are thus offended by this teaching, revealing that they have not even surpassed the first step on the ladder, which is self-renunciation. Fr. Seraphim will no doubt be canonized as a Saint, and the process for his formal canonization has already begun. One can hope that at that time, his unjust critics will stop gnashing their teeth at him and begin to humbly sit down before his feet and listen to the divine medicine issuing forth, especially considering that he is simply passing down to us the teachings of the Holy Fathers who have come before him. In the final analysis, these 'critics' are not fighting against the "uncharitable" attitude of Fr. Seraphim, but against the Orthodox tradition itself.

[@OrthodoxWisdom]

Indeed! Very well put!

[@marcusaurelius1477]

Every Liturgy we confess ONE Holy Catholic and Apostolic Church...

[@marieegypt7091]

I didn't realize that about Thomas K. When I was with Mother Teresa's order that was one of the few books we were required to have!!! It's been so long ago that I don't even remember its contents...thank God.

[@junesilvermanb2979]

The Missionaries of Charity (Latin: Congregatio Missionariarum a Caritate) is a Catholic (Latin Church) religious congregation established in 1950 by Mother Teresa, now known in the Catholic Church as Saint Teresa of Calcutta. As of 2020, it consisted of 5,167 religious sisters. Members of the order designate their affiliation using the order's initials, "M.C.". A member of the congregation must adhere to the vows of chastity, poverty, obedience, and the fourth vow, to give "wholehearted free service to the poorest of the poor." Today, the order consists of both contemplative and active branches in several countries.

[@nightowl4206]

Please post more chapters of this book if possible. Thank you! ☦

[@icxcnika1823]

Love 💕 and greetings from an Orthodox Christian living just about beyond the end of the world 🌎 🌍🌏. ✝️🌴🐊🇵🇬

[@INeedGod87]

Lord have mercy on me a Sinner

[@davidkehrer7342]

Thank you for sharing

[@UnprofitableServant-bq3mx]

I have been guilty if this before. More than once i was given a vision which lead me farther astray form our Lord. Only narrowly escaping the delusion that I brought on myself through growing weak in my faith and meddling in dark arts. I now am seeking Holy Orthodoxy, and have attended two liturgies thus far. My wife has gone deeper into ortestantism as a result and now claims that I have demons and that she no longer is my wife. She will hear no reaoning despite me telling her that she is the one who is being decieved.

[@biljanacevetkovic6480]

BOG POMOGAO , OCE SERAFIME !

[@berwynsigns4115]

So when "God the Father" and "Jesus" appeared to Joseph Smith (founder of Mormonism) he wasn't lying, but saw an actual vision from demons?

[@OrthodoxWisdom]

This seems far more likely than completely making it all up

[@shannon6708]

OMG! I read Thomas A. Kempis "Imitation of Christ" as a young person and tried to say the rosary like he said to do. I was visited by the devil trying to chain me. Jesus in his glory showed up and I woke from the dream saying, "Thy will be done" Thy will be done. Unfortunately, it turned me off from praying the rosary. My advice sticks to the bible, go to communion and make sure you give the glory to God. So much deception in the world today. Keep your focus on Christ.

[@FoundSheep-AN]

What was the way of saying the rosary that deceived you? What technique exactly? I am orthodox, I never read the book but I say the Rosary without using my imagination. I simply read for each “mistery” the passage of the New Testament with my eyes while praying with my words … as orthodoxs we can pray the so called Rosary (which was suggested even by the Early Father of the Church) but we are called to pray with the Nous, the intelligence. Not with emotions nor with imagination running wild nor imaginating the scene

[@shannon6708]

It's complicated and hard to describe in a text. If you read Thomas A. Kempis book you will see. However, I don't recommend it. I learned that Mary is giving, and She gave us her son. Mary just wants her to accept Jesus into our hearts. The gist is it's a very Misleading book Just like this video warns.

[@shannon6708]

@@FoundSheep-AN I've started praying it again now that I am spiritual more mature and have the right intention. I used to get attacked spiritually by the devil when I said it. The rosary is a spiritual weapon, with a lot of power. It's hard to explain what I experienced metaphysically especially online. Things came up for me like accusations from the devil about some dabbling I was doing with the occult in my past. I dont dabble anymore...too dangerous.

[@moranaokeoke990]

​@@shannon6708i hope there is no more attacks. I get you, was in new age myself. Hope more people will realise how dangerous all that is. This book is very good for people who were/are in all that as Fr. Seraphim was as well. God bless you.

[@RETROGEMBOUTIQUE]

Praying for Ukraine 🇺🇦 ❤

[@OrthodoxWisdom]

And Russia 🇷🇺 ❤️

[@caseywhite3150]

Amen to both

[@zahkov7951]

We should pray that ukranians repent fir what they did to Russian.people in.Donbas for 8 years. Only repentance will bring peace. We all should repent we all are big sinners

[@sophrapsune]

The war is evil.

[@NorthernObserver]

Praying for Peace. Christian brothers should never war on one another. Truly this War is the work of the Evil One.

[@sophrapsune]

I wonder what he made of the early experiences of St Symeon the New Theologian, in which the saint stated that he had the first of such visions with minimal prior effort of purification.

[@OrthodoxWisdom]

Some need more purification than others and some make great progress in purification quickly if their repentance is deep.

[@daviddavid7667]

I AM

[@dope1725]

🙋

[@yeet3718]

Muslim here, I have some questions on what you are saying about Prelest. Possible to correspond via email?

[@OrthodoxWisdom]

Yes. Please email me.

[@Meliann11]

I have a question. St. Paul saw a vision of Christ and yet he was impure prior to that. Was he an exception? Thank you.

[@OrthodoxWisdom]

That was certainly a spectacular and uncommon event in the life of the Church. St. Paul had a very special calling from God.

[@first_namelast_name3760]

@@OrthodoxWisdom that vision is confirmed through his teaching and his teaching is confirmed and accepted by Apostles and thus by Church.

[@daughterofkingjesus7]

Hi! Jesus loves you, for God so loved the world *John 3:16 KJV*. Repent of your sins and trust in Jesus alone for salvation and my friend, you will be saved😉. Acts 2:38 KJV ❤️

[@dylansaus]

Check out Chrislam too

[@ciscodealmeida8541]

The Essenes dressed in white, the Pharisees and Sudanese dressed in black and grey for a reason, the fallen ones introduced black to the so called Christians to impede their Spiritual progress.The so called Saints never caught up on the trap, makes one wonder on their understanding.

[@Unseen_warfare.]

Black is worn by the Monks for the remembrance of Death.

[@ciscodealmeida8541]

@@Unseen_warfare. its BS , another thing if if you a monk for more that 7 years and have no blessings , like stop a storm or a fire, or any other, give it up, get a job.

[@Unseen_warfare.]

@@ciscodealmeida8541 All the monks do is work. Worldly thinking. Obviously your secular miserable mind can’t comprehend.

[@anond2015]

​@@ciscodealmeida8541 Being a monk is about dedicating your life to growing closer to God. It's not about performing miracles. And I really don't think God cares about what color clothes you wear lol.

[@anond2015]

​@@ciscodealmeida8541 So God bless you, and Jesus Christ have mercy on us all.

[@brbvat9920]

What is this nonsense that the Imitation of Christ "flatters the reader", "conducts the reader to union with God without previous repentance", and teaches "an intoxication attained without difficulty"? Have they even read it? The whole tone and content of the work is diametrically opposed to such sentiments. For example: 1.17 On Monastic Life: "Habit and tonsure change a man but a little; it is the change of life, the complete mortification of passions that endow a true religious." 1.21 On Sorrow of Heart: "Consider yourself unworthy of divine solace and deserving rather of much tribulation. When a man is perfectly contrite, the whole world is bitter and wearisome to him." 2.9 On Wanting No Share in Comfort: "A man must fight long and bravely against himself before he learns to master himself fully and to direct all his affections toward God. When he trusts in himself, he easily takes to human consolation. The true lover of Christ, however, who sincerely pursues virtue, does not fall back upon consolations nor seek such pleasures of sense, but prefers severe trials and hard labors for the sake of Christ. When, therefore, spiritual consolation is given by God, receive it gratefully, but understand that it is His gift and not your meriting. Do not exult, do not be overjoyed, do not be presumptuous, but be the humbler for the gift, more careful and wary in all your actions, for this hour will pass and temptation will come in its wake." 2.11 That Few Love the Cross of Jesus: "Jesus has always many who love His heavenly kingdom, but few who bear His cross. He has many who desire consolation, but few who care for trial. He finds many to share His table, but few to take part in His fasting. All desire to be happy with Him; few wish to suffer anything for Him... Many love Him as long as they encounter no hardship; many praise and bless Him as long as they receive some comfort from Him... Those, on the contrary, who love Him for His own sake and not for any comfort of their own, bless Him in all trial and anguish of heart as well as in the bliss of consolation. Even if He should never give them consolation, yet they would continue to praise Him and wish always to give Him thanks." And there are many others like these. Do not be deceived by such baseless accusations against so great a spiritual work.

[@junesilvermanb2979]

The Imitation of Christ en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Imitation_of_Christ

[@TinaHyde]

Maybe the dangers in that book are found elsewhere, in more subtle ways? I can’t really claim to be even a novice of Orthodoxy - my knowledge is far beneath that of a beginner. I fully acknowledge my ignorance on this topic. And my laziness in doing my own research. I’d love to hear more from an orthodox priest on why Fr. Seraphim warns us not to read it. Edit: Actually, after rereading those passages, I see the guidance on pursuing virtue, enduring hardship, and loving Christ…but the Holy Mystery of Repentance seems to be missing.

[@brbvat9920]

@@TinaHyde Concerning the Holy Mystery of Repentance (Confession): 4.3: "It is indeed necessary for me, who fall and sin so often, who so quickly become lax and weak, to renew, cleanse, and inflame myself through frequent prayer, confession, and the holy reception of Your Body, lest perhaps by abstaining too long, I fall away from my holy purpose." 4.7: "Carefully examine your conscience. Cleanse and purify it to the best of your power by true contrition and humble confession, that you may have no burden, know of no remorse, and thus be free to come near. Let the memory of all your sins grieve you, and especially lament and bewail your daily transgressions. Then if time permits, confess to God in the secret depths of your heart all the miseries your passions have caused." 4.10: "Do not remain away from Holy Communion because of a small trouble or vexation but go at once to confession and willingly forgive all others their offenses. If you have offended anyone, humbly seek pardon and God will readily forgive you.... What good is it to delay confession for a long time or to put off Holy Communion?"

[@Charles3x7]

Yeah, I’m very skeptical of such a profound accusation.

[@juniorgallo8786]

Since in Orthodoxy we are invited to always follow tradition and the words of the Saints, its is enough for me to know that Saint Theophan the Recluse, Saint Ignatius Brianchaninov, Father Seraphim Rose, and many others, taught against it. A book can have a lot of "virtuous" information" that may at first glance seem wise and correct words, but if when reading the book the reader is in any way feeling "highly inspired" or "special" or in a state of rapture, no matter what is written, it is worth to follow the discernment of the Saints, whether it is inspired by the Divine Holy Spirit or not. Also, the main dogma is not to be remorseful, and/or in constant prayer. Repentance is a whole different thing, it is putting to death the old man, it's a life-long commitment of changing the way we view the world and the way we interact with the world. You cannot start to imitate Christ because you've just read a book. For the necessary kind of repentance to happen, humility, obedience and denial of exalted feelings are crucial. Being ALWAYS low to the ground and NEVER believing in supposedly received gifts or exulted feelings, or lofty sensations, or tears while praying, or visions etc are key teachings in Orthodoxy that seems to be missing (or at least not properly highlighted) in the book in question. Maybe that's the reason why it is deemed spiritually dangerous by the consensus of Saints.

[@chiddybrendan]

I was mostly nodding my head in agreement till it got to the Bishop Ignatius' views on 'The Imitation of Christ', which are downright stupid. I don't understand, has he even read it for himself? A book that has repentance and humility as recurring themes running from the first chapter almost all through? What part of this book discourages people from repentance before seeking closeness to God? This is just another manifestation of deep arrogance and pride manifesting but with a 'spiritual' cloak; so common with the Orthodox 'spiritual/ascetic' grandmasters. This is completely stupid!

[@robertjarman4261]

I fully agree.

[@NavelOrangeGazer]

Read "The Life in Christ" by St. Nicholas Cabasilas. It's the Orthodox version minus all the "mystical" roman catholic prelest. Your indignation about this is indicative of your delusion. And go read Fr. Seraphim's writings on the originator of this spiritual delusion in post schism papal protestantism. Francis of Asissi.

[@chiddybrendan]

@@NavelOrangeGazer Nonsense! Your lack of proof for your accusation of ‘prelest’ is indicative of your stupidity and arrogance. Tell me where in the Imitation of Christ one is discouraged from repentance before closeness to God! I can hardly take seriously people lecturing on spirituality and asceticism, but in whose poise and words the stench of arrogance and pride disgorge. It’s ironic. It’s hypocritical. It’s fake. Unfortunately this is so common with Orthodox‘spiritual’ gurus who are so sure of the evils of Catholicism but eerily silent on the equally tragic history of Orthodoxy. Pretending to care for the speck in the eye of others but bombastically oblivious of the log in theirs! Unidimensionality, egocentrism, and ethnonationalism are not what I wish to see when listening to a Christian message.

[@ciscodealmeida8541]

These men in Black with wild beards that will even frighten an Angel, why, do they think they will be more godly looking that way ,its like a Burca. ,But if he can walk on water,well then im sorry for the critic, if he shaves can he still walk on water ????

[@ciscodealmeida8541]

@@renee2356 Black clothing was introduced by the Fallen Ones to religions, they had their reason, its a negative shade not recommended by those that understand energy; the Pharisees and another i dont remember now wore black or grey ,the Essenes wore white.so did the Disciples and Jesus they were Essenes no one talks about them, sad All the Anti-Christ religions wear black, funny hey

[@Unseen_warfare.]

“The American Ministry of Elder Joachim of St. Anne's Skete and the Miracle of His Beard” Go read about that.

[@ciscodealmeida8541]

@@Unseen_warfare. He could have used the Miracle for something better.

[@criticaloptimist7961]

Imagine a spiritual teacher advocating for spiritual purification before they can obey the 1st commandment, before they can seek to love God with their whole heart, mind and soul. Imagine a spiritual teacher advocating the rejection of the means for the end. Imagine a doctor rejecting the medicine until the patient is healed. Is not the act of seeking God the very thing that heals the soul, yet here the soul must be healed before one dares to love God?! Such is the spiritual delusion here advocated. Indeed this is an example of a tendency of spiritual error in Orthodoxy, in which mere apophaticism leads to imbalanced asceticism and the rejection of the good tidings of God given to those who sincerely approach him. Purity cannot come to those who do not seek to love God first, and any attempt at asceticism that is not first rooted in the act of love for God, and which does not flow from it, is idolatry and are given up to their own spiritual delusion and become jealous of those given grace for their simple faith. Certainly repentance and asceticism are important for the spiritual life, but to suggest one cannot approach God in devotion until one is purified is probably the most demonic of spiritual delusions one can fall into. Certainly Satan would rather us focus on our sins in a perpetual war with them rather to positively direct any thought in loving devotion to the Most High and his Son.

[@OrthodoxInquirer]

I see your public playlists and they don't look Christian at all. "Repent, for the kingdom of heaven is at hand" was our Lord's first command.

[@Unseen.Warfare]

Why do you think God would give the councils the authority to compile to Scriptures into The Holy Bible but you aren’t going to accept the Church that’s the only reason the Bible has been preserved? Yes, indeed it was preserved at Saint Ann’s Orthodox Monastery in Mount Sinai. The complete Modern Version of Our Bible wouldn’t be Available to us if it wasn’t for the Orthodox Church. You have Thrown away 2000 years of Martyrs and Saints and The Holy Traditions of the Sons of God in the Inheritance of. Jesus Christ the Messiah Not just the Traditions of Men. In your Rejection of the Traditions of the Jews that Crucified our Savior the very ones who he forgave and many of them were converted amongst the ones who crucified him actually. Literally you’ve taken the Bible out of its historical context and are practicing Lawlessness. Jesus Christ will tell you he never knew you. Point blank period. You haven’t been testing the Spirits. Go test them. Seek and You Will Find!

[@criticaloptimist7961]

@Horaō thanks for your reply. If you can convince me I will change my mind. I understand how it may seem like I am misunderstanding or misrepresenting what is being said in the video. I see that the Orthodox teachers are claiming that to desire or seek exalted or advanced spiritual feelings or visions "without repentance" or "disregarding repentance" is delusional. To this I agree. But interwoven into this is, I believe, a false ideology which I think may hamper the spiritual progress of Orthodox who rely too heavily on strict asceticism without proper devotion and works of righteousness. We must not reject the truth that to desire and seek exalted spiritual feeling and vision is a good thing. Jesus encourages his disciples to do so. In the Lord's prayer, we are to pray "give us this day our daily bread". Many people incorrectly interpret this part as asking for their food for the day, but a literal understanding of the Aramaic would read "give us this day a taste of the morrow", meaning "give to us today a taste of the age to come". Seeking this spiritual experience of the world to come is of the very essence of the faith that Jesus taught. In some quotes given in the video I find a few in particular to be troubling: Bishop Ignatius says, "the book(Imitation of Christ; Kempis) conducts the reader directly to communion with God, without previous purification by repentance..." And I.M. Kontzevitch, says, "the ascetic, striving to kindle in his heart Love for God while neglecting repentance, exerts himself to attain a feeling of delight, of ecstasy..." In these two quotes it is quite clear, it seems to me, that these Orthodox representatives believe that one must repent from sins and be purified before one can direct their heart to communion with and love of God, and experience feelings of that love. These ideas are asserted as if the very act of turning whole heartedly into loving communion with God is not principally the very definition of repentance and only means of that purification. It would appear they want to speak of a different kind of repentance than that spoken of by our Lord, who said "come unto me all ye who are heavy laden and I will give you rest, for my yoke is easy and my burden is light". Such a heavy and burdensome load it must be to fight this war against sin when we cannot come to the Lord and be healed in his loving embrace. I think the fundamental theological error at work in these ideologies is that sin itself is perceived to be the fundamental problem with man, and so he must make war with it in such a way that it must be rid of before one can come to God. At least that's the sense I get from these quotes. In truth, man's fundamental problem is his ignorance of God because of having turned his thoughts away from communion with him, and that sin is a *symptom* of that ignorance. We must focus on the first commandment in order to be purged of sin and all else flows from that. Hyper asceticism is limiting and can be damaging as well, and also create its own kind of spiritual delusion, or prelest, when it is attempted foolishly without attention in devoted communion with God. I suspect there would be even more saints, and greater, if the Orthodox church got this right, and perhaps the world would be set on fire and the new age will dawn.

[@user-qs9cz4bp3r]

Very beautiful but let us not forget the following information. Today the Old and Authentic ROCOR is the Russian Orthodox Church Abroad (ROCA) that was formed in 1920 by bishops who were forced to leave their homeland along with millions of Russian people, all fleeing the horrors of the communist system. The ROCA bishops, clergy, and laity remain loyal to the original mission of an independent ROCA. Despite protests from within the ranks of bishops, clergy, and laypeople, on May 17, 2007, a large part of the ROCA entered into Eucharistic communion with the MP with the signing of the “Act of Canonical Communion” and is now known as the Russian Orthodox Church Outside of Russia (ROCOR - MP). The Moscow Patriarchate (MP) and the current ROCOR-MP do need to repent of the heresies of Ecumenism and Sergianism. The smaller part of ROCA that chose to remain loyal to the historical Russian Orthodox Church and to continue the mission of the ROCA is not in Eucharistic communion with the Moscow Patriarchate (MP), the state-controlled official Russian Church. The Churches of the ROCA remnant are present today in the Diaspora District of ROCA. The list of Parishes is present on the rocana and auroca web sites. The ROCA Churches are located in Australia, New Zealand, St. Petersburg, as well as in the U.S. and Canada. For these who would like to understand more about the history of the Russian Orthodox Church Abroad (ROCA) they can read the article "ROCA the Beacon Of Light" by Protopriest Nikita Grigoriev on the rocana web site. Also, we remember that the Russian Orthodox Church Abroad (ROCA) Council of Bishops in August 1983 in the person of its Metropolitan Philaret of New York (1903-1985), noting the extent of the Ecumenist contagion, issued an Anathema to Ecumenism in the straight line of the Holy Fathers, condemning anyone who participated in this heresy. When the Church pronounces anathema on a certain heresy, we must NOT forget that it is for eternity. Anathema to Ecumenism (1983) "To those who attack the Church of Christ by teaching that Christ’s Church is divided into so-called “branches” which differ in doctrine and way of life, or that the Church does not exist visibly, but will be formed in the future when all “branches” or sects or denominations, and even religions will be united into one body; and who do not distinguish the priesthood and mysteries of the Church from those of the heretics, but say that the baptism and eucharist of heretics is effectual for salvation; therefore, to those who knowingly have communion with these aforementioned heretics or who advocate, disseminate, or defend their new heresy of Ecumenism under the pretext of brotherly love or the supposed unification of separated Christians, Anathema! --- Note: The relics of Metropolitan Philaret of New York were found to be completely incorrupt in 1998.

[@vaska1999]

It's too bad that together with some sound advice, this man clothes rank spiritual pride in the cloak of humility, something found far too often among us Orthodox. The Holy Spirit is definitely present within the charismatic movement. As always, including in Orthodoxy, it too is vulnerable to spiritual deception, of course, but that's not the norm.

[@OrthodoxWisdom]

It’s a fearful thing to speak so boldly against a saint. And yes, he is a saint and will undoubtedly be canonized one day. It’s one thing to disagree, it’s another to claim a saint is guilty of “rank spiritual pride.”

[@moranaokeoke990]

If you really are a Orthodox then you would know that acting of most those charismatics would be caracterazed as a demonic posesion in Orthodox church. We dont have mumbling unknown languages, barking, falling on floor, screaming etc people in church or on Lyturgy. And even if it would happen to have, on such person wold be readed exorcisms.

[@joachim847]

Yeah... no. The charismatic movement is unsafe, sure. But to outright condemn the whole thing is absurd.

[@OrthodoxWisdom]

Is the Holy Spirit animating the Charismatic Movement? God is certainly working there to bring people to salvation, as He is with everyone, but the unique characteristics of the charismatic are clearly not inspired by the Holy Spirit. Have you read the whole chapter on this Fr. Seraphim? This is just a short excerpt focusing on prelest which is found far beyond the Charismatic Movement.

[@joachim847]

What do you think of people who might otherwise become Orthodox, but who disagree with Seraphim Rose?

[@Football0Lover]

Condemning demonic inspiration is in fact, the opposite of absurd

[@OrthodoxWisdom]

We can be Orthodox and still be wrong about things. The main thing is humility and a willingness to submit to the mind of the Church. St. Augustine submitted his views to the Church for correction if needed, he didn’t stand proudly thinking that he couldn’t have been wrong about some things. For me and many others, bishops on down, Fr. Seraphim was correct in his analysis in Orthodoxy and the Religion of the Future. Have you read his whole treatment of the Charasmatic movement?

[@joachim847]

@@OrthodoxWisdom I'm just tired of it. Seraphim Rose isn't a saint, and if I criticize him or am found to disagree with him about anything the dogpile begins. Should I just not say anything? Probably, but then everyone who comes across this stuff online assumes all Orthodox agree with him, when probably most of us don't.

[@ivandinsmore6217]

"Father" Seraphim Rose was an American homosexual who dabbled in Buddhism. He was a wolf in sheep's clothing and we do not need to take anything he says seriously, any more than we need to take seriously any other American.

[@mzoesp]

I respect your perspective, but to make such generalizations is small minded and un-Christian. A person’s sexual history or sexual proclivity is irrelevant when one has risen to a life of Christ and transcended sexuality all together. The same goes for a person’s nationality or race. True spirituality transcends all those modes of identity, and sees the same potential of God-consciousness in everyone no matter who they are. That is what Christ taught. Everything else is just separatism, hatred, and egotistical self-serving delusion.

[@lilly1803]

It's a blasphemy what you're saying. He repented fir his sins and changed his life completly. Grace to the Lord!

[@violekadams5682]

Which means Saint Maria of Egypt should be just be view as just a harlot of Alexandria . Do not forget she started her trade from 12 years old. But will give glory to her as with repents she transform into and desert Angle . We give glory to our Holy Mother Maria of Egypt may her prays be with all of us amen.

[@sanja5580]

Shut up your mouth. And repent. The men is a Saint!

[@juniorgallo8786]

Father Seraphim Rose IS (because he's alive in Christ) one of the holiest and I highly recommend his texts. Even as an Orthodox layman, before becoming a monk, he was already a prominent apologetic for the faith. bear in mind that many torturers/murderers of Christians who converted to Christianity became Saints later on, so judging/condemning a man for "supposedly" having commited fornication before his conversion doesn't seem reasonable, to say the least. I suppose you know that any non-marital relationship is fornication, and thus sinful, right? The One without sin is Christ, brother. Be careful not to judge. Glory be to God!