Onward Notre Dame: The Michigan Rivalry

[@joshuabennett8110]

Really wish that ND and Michigan would play on a regular basis

[@Atwater20]

Me too! I might not be alive the next time they play. In the past, each year, I mostly looked forward to Michigan playing Ohio State and Notre Dame.

[@markjackson6431]

Michigan should be Notre Dame’s mandatory yearly opponent not USC or Navy

[@Atwater20]

@@markjackson6431 Agreed!

[@JosePerez-vz1qq]

The 2013 game was phenomenal.

[@jonathansantiago8093]

Notre Dame wanted to renegotiate their TV contract with NBC. However, NBC couldn't give them the contract they wanted because of the BIG getting a lucrative deal. They also said that if they wanted to get the contract ND renegotiated, they should join the BIG conference.

[@Playback007able]

Missing Jeff Jeffers enthusiasm & excitement he used to bring to WNDU’s game day coverages of Saturday home games…was great to see him reboot his celebrity career with cameo appearances as the Star Wars character, Porkins.

[@smill1985]

May he RIP.

[@teofilstevenson]

The Game is amazing however to have this game on the other end of the Michigans schedule (game 3ish) made CFB just better.

[@drayiii980]

As a Michigan alum, while Michigan fans will always say OSU is our biggest rival (which I 100% agree with) in my experience I think the dirty little secret is more Michigan fans hate Notre Dame more than they hate OSU. And I think ND fans hate Michigan more than USC, although USC is ND's biggest rival

[@kellancarney810]

as an ND fan you are absolutely correct.

[@dreadthedreads4567]

As a Michigan fan I’d say I despise them both equally haha….but I see your point

[@wingedbuffalo4670]

As an ND Alum, you are only partially correct. In recent years, perhaps ND's greater antipathy is towards Michigan than USC (as you suspect) -- BUT that's only because USC has NOT been dominant of late against the Irish the way they were under Pete Carroll or (even longer ago) John McKay and John Robinson. If USC starts winning against ND with great frequency again, USC will easily return to the "most hated" rival role. The thing that REALLY makes Michigan detestable to ND fans is the fact that they went WAY "over the top" in their "rivalry" against Notre Dame. It's one thing to want to beat your rival on the field for "local bragging rights" (e.g., Michigan vs. Ohio State), as well as for prized recruits, National Championships, and other football "honors." That's completely normal and "par for the course" with ANY great rivalry in any part of the Nation. HOWEVER, it's a COMPLETELY DIFFERENT THING -- WAY OUT OF BOUNDS -- for one school (and its coaches and administrators) to be so filled with HATRED, ENVY, and VITRIOL towards the other school that they make REPEATED AFFIRMATIVE EFFORTS to DESTROY the other school's football program in its entirety !!!!!!!! THAT'S exactly what Michigan REPEATEDLY attempted to do to Notre Dame -- especially in ND's early, fledgling, vulnerable years before ND became "ND" the National Team and they truly could have been destroyed. Here is just a short, partial list of the MALIGNANT actions Michigan undertook against Notre Dame: 1. They cancelled games against ND 2. They REFUSED to schedule future games against ND 3. They REPEATEDLY REFUSED to allow ND into the Western Conference (and later Big 10) 4. They continued to BLACKBALL ND at every possible opportunity 5. They THREATENED and INTIMIDATED OTHER Big 10 schools into "NOT scheduling" games against ND 6. The result of #5 is that, MANY times, ND couldn't get enough games against Midwestern teams to fill out a schedule, so Michigan's malicious interference forced ND to have to travel on the road all over the Country (at GREAT additional expense) just to get enough teams on a schedule for the season ... and the great irony is that this is exactly how ND became THE NATION'S COLLEGE FOOTBALL TEAM with fans in ALL parts of the Country. Needless to say, Michigan's spiteful actions caused ND to become ever more powerful, wealthy, successful, and followed ... meanwhile (at least until the invention of cable and satellite TV in the late 20th Century, and the creation of the Big Ten Network) Michigan was left to stew in its own jealous bile, largely relegated into being merely a Midwestern REGIONAL team. So, in truth, Michigan is a TRUE VILLAIN in college football. Now by expanding the Big 10 coast-to-coast, Michigan (which fancies itself the "greater among equals" and "big dog" of the Big 10 entitled to push other member schools around) has actually embarked upon the model that made ND rise to prominence a century ago !!!

[@drayiii980]

@@wingedbuffalo4670 Yup I have a theory a lot of it also has to do with the fact that the teams almost always play each other within the first 1-3 weeks of the regular season. With ND/USC and Michigan/OSU those games are always at the end of the season- or at least midway through the season when USC travels to ND. What I’ve found is that both Michigan/ND fanbase ALWAYS think the other one is overrated when they play, largely due to how early in the season when it’s too soon to tell. It’s extremely easy to hate a rival that you chronically think is overrated

[@wingedbuffalo4670]

@@drayiii980 Hi @drayiii980. I don't disagree that the two schools' fanbases may frequently believe the rival school is "overrated" and/or has "too easy" of a schedule (or at least I can "sort of" speak on behalf of many ND fans, as I don't "know" how UM fans think). But I don't think the respective fanbases hold the "overrated" opinion about the rival school "because" the games occur early in the season (necessitated because the Big 10 [any conference really]) dictates pretty much that non-conference games must be played early in the season before the "conference schedule" begins). Rather, I think the causation of the "overrated" beliefs are generated first and foremost by the basic core antipathy felt between the players, students, alumni, and fans of one school towards the other. I believe that, even if the occasional games between ND and UM were played later in the season, the antipathy would be substantial enough to generate whatever excuses/justifications might be necessary to proclaim that the other school was "overrated." :) One additional piece of history that you might find interesting -- and quite ironic when you thjink about it -- involving some ND fans' additional antipathy towards USC also involves USC's maneuvers to disrespect ND. Probably only older ND fans will know this, but in the early 1960s at a time when ND was experiencing a downturn in winning and USC's John McKay was building the USC powerhouse program, McKay and the Trojan administration pulled a rotten power move on ND. For the longest time, the annual ND vs USC game (originally established by none other than ND's Knute Rockne and USC's Howard Jones -- with great impetus from their wives) was alwayd played in LATE NOVEMBER close to THANKSGIVING -- REGARDLESS whether the gamewas out in LA, in South Bend, or at a neutral site. That way the schools could always count on playing that rivalry game late in the season and at a time when the lengthy cross-country train trip would have less adverse impact on the student-athletes missing class. Well, ol' John McKay and his pansy Southern Cal Trojan players decided that they "didn't like" the possibility of playing a road game at ND in colder weather and/or facing a possibility of early winter snow ... so McKay DICTATED that ND "MUST" agree to schedule the game NO LATER THAN MID-OCTOBER any year when it would be ND's home game; and if ND refused, McKay said he would CANCEL THE RIVALRY SERIES. I don't know if McKay was merely bluffing, or if he really would have gone through with it (???) -- it was way before my time. But because ND was not in a strong position (having a marginal football program compared to USC's losing team and having not yet hired Ara Parseghian), and because they were anxious to maintain the historic intersectional rivalry, ND's Administration "caved" to McKay's and USC's demands. And that's why during every "odd" calendar year when ND hosts the USC game in South Bend, we play it in mid-October; but in "even" numbered calendar years when USC hosts the game out in LA, we have to travel out there every Thanksgiving weekend. I wish ND would have told arrogant, too-big-for-his-britches McKay pound sand, and "if" USC then chose to end the series, so be it. Neither team from a great program had the right to dictate terms to the other IMO. Of course, because USC greedily coveted a chunk of the Big 10's TV $$$$$$$ above all else, they happily blew up and destroyed the venerable PAC 12 so that they could suddenly join a much more lucrative 2024 megaconference "Big 10 on steroids" (compared to the days of the 1980s when the already-high-quality Big 10 actually had 10 member schools before adding formerly independent [like ND] Penn State, and before poaching additional schools such as Nebraska, Maryland, Rutgers, etc. from other conferences). Never mind the fact that blowing up the Pac 12 thereby made USC student-athletes' lives in ALL sports that much more challenging and difficult on a much more frequent/regular basis owing to the far greater and lengthier cross-country travel distances to/from the Midwest (thereby now REGULARLY disrupting the kids' sleep cycles and taking them out of class earlier and for far longer in order to jet across the country all the time to participate in regular new conference athletic events than was the situation formerly when most [i.e., Pac 12] competition remained within the Pacific Time Zone and along the West Coast [except for OCCASIONAL out-of-conference match-ups]) ... After all, who cares about the kids receiving the best quality of education when there is more $$$ to be made by the school, right? ESPECIALLY when the schools stand to profit MEGA-MILLIONS MORE by joining a new mega-conference Big Ten starting in the 2024 season ... Moreover, this constant undermining of the student-athletes' sleep cycles and education impacts other former Pac 12 students such as kids from UCLA, Oregon, Washington, etc. ... AND ALSO adversely impacts the student-athletes from the gaining conference [Big 10 in this case] as well, particularly in sports such as men's and women's basketball, baseball/softball, soccer, etc. that have longer schedules with much more frequent competition than football has [basically football plays on "only" a weekly basis for about 3 months]). This is yet another reason why I (and others I'm sure) have lost LOTS of respect for USC (and their former Pac 12 cohorts). I suspect USC will always be able to preserve its late season "rivalry game" with crosstown rival and fellow new Big 10 member UCLA (which will guarantee them NO "cold weather Big Ten game" at the very end of the regular season, and they will probably also be able to continue avoiding an end-of-season "cold weather game" in the Midwest when hosting ND in "even" years ... but I would have to think USC should now be vulnerable to have to come to UM, OSU or somewhere else in the Midwest on occasion in late October, and early and mid-November(at which times the air temperature could be "cold" for USC players, especially if the games are at night). Given all that, it would be nice -- ironically for the Big 10's ease of scheduling by blocking out USC's final two regular season games every year for UCLA and ND regardless which stadium is the venue [ND stadium or the LA Coliseum for the intersectional ND-USC game, and the LA Coliseum or the Rose Bowl for the USC-UCLA crosstown rivalry game now a Big 10 contest] -- simply to get USC back on the ND schedule for Thanksgiving Saturday EVERY season. That would be poetic justice.

[@Disilludes]

GO IRISH

[@teofilstevenson]

Jerome is talking out of his back end, the best of Michigan talent does not all go to ND. 🙄

[@dreadthedreads4567]

If they did they gotta explain why we’ve got a chip 🏆 and they haven’t even sniffed the playoff 😂 Go Blue 〽️

[@Enonymous99]

My dude, he doesn’t mean that literally He means it in a passionate way about himself and his friends and teammates who chose to go to ND

[@dennisgroce7862]

@dreadthedreads4567 they literally been to 2 playoffs before Michigan even went and won one. Where you been ... You can't be a true football fan... you screaming bandwagon bruh 😂

[@dennisgroce7862]

​@@teofilstevensondude said they never sniffed the playoffs...he needed correction 😂

[@PatrickMHoey]

ND wants so bad to be the rival to Michigan that Ohio State is 😂

[@williambrennan7863]

Probably the reason they're not is because Michican't knows they can't afford to lose to ND and OSU every year

[@pandaotu]

Notre Dame is never/will never be Michigan’s “rival”. Michigan is their enemy

[@wingedbuffalo4670]

With all due respect Mr. Hooey, DREAM ON !!! ND lives rent-free in the minds of Michigan fans and administrators. After over a CENTURY of anti-ND VILLAINY perpetrated by U Michigan, ND finally was desired by Michigan to join the Big 10 (only because ND had buit itself up into a "valuable property" and "national brand" DESPITE MICHIGAN's repeated acts of TREACHERY to try to kill ND's football program) ... but after ND had already succeeded in "making it on its own" after Michigan's treachery, ND rightly told Michigan to pound sand -- at least where its football program is concerned. ND is a member of the Big 10 for ice hockey. The sad truth is that ND badly wanted to be a member of the Big 10 for MANY decades, beginning in the late 1800s, and repeatedly attempted to gain the Big 10's assent (which U Michigan always blocked because its "leaders" were virulently bigoted and envious, hated ND, and thus constantly "blackballed" ND -- among even worse other treachery). ND in the Big 10 makes PERFECT geographic and academic sense. I would not mind being a member of the Big 10 -- even in football -- IF Michigan and the Big 10 were willing to make a reasonable accommodation out of proper respect for ND's football independence and heritage the way the ACC has. ND can be a full member of the Big 10 in all sports except for football; and in return, ND will guarantee the Big 10 "x" number of games on its annual football schedule. I would even be willing to increase the "x" factor from 5 annual ACC games at present to 6 games with the Big 10 (3 home, 3 away every season). The football regular season is notoriously short, and ND has MANY storied matchups all over the country that need to be honored and preserved (some of which could actually be incorporatred into the Big 10 conference schedule now that the Big 10 has re-made itself from a concentrated Midwest regional conference into a coast-to-coast ridiculous mega-conference). And it could truly be "the best of both worlds" for BOTH the Big 10 AND ND if the Big 10 were willing to reach this reasonable accommodation. For example, we could GUARANTEE the following ANNUAL rivalry matchups on the Big 10 conference schedule: 1. ND-USC (we already play annually, and that's a rivalry that absolutely needs to be preserved just like Michigan vs. Ohio State, Alabama vs. Auburn, etc.) 2. ND-Michigan 3. ND-Ohio State Apart from that annual gauntlet of elite tough games for each school, ND could also have the Big 10 schedule two of other lesser rivalry games (yet still very much historical rivalry games in descending frequency) on a two-year cyclical basis (home and home) such as: 4&5 a. ND-Michigan State 4&5 b. ND-Purdue 4&5 c. ND-Penn State 4&5 d. ND-Wisconsin 4&5 e. ND-Nebraska 4&5 f. ND-Iowa And then the 6th game would purely be a more attenuated 2 year home-and-home RANDOM pairing with all the remaining other Big 10 teams. 6. ND vs all other remaining Big 10 teams on a 2-year random pairing. 7. Games 7-12 remain"at large games for ND to schedule throughout the Nation. Arguably, all of this would in effect impose the "toughest" Big 10 schedule on ND alone, and ND would also retain the flexibility to retain its other traditions (such as playing Navy annually as a "debt of honor" game) and its desire to preserve its valuable "national brand" that was built up OVER MORE THAN a CENTURY (thanks to U Michigan's villainy against ND) that would enable ND to schedule games against SEC teams and others throughout the Nation. In exchange for ND being willing to commit to at least 6 annual Big 10 games on its schedule (and possibly more if some "at large" games occasionally feature additional new Big 10 teams that are more distant and in the least frequent rotation such as Oregon, Washington, and UCLA -- all of which ND has played on its schedule on occasion), and further in exchange for ND being willing to maintain annual slug-fests with Michigan, Ohio State, and USC (plus at least two semi-frequent physical games against the likes of Michigan State, Penn State, Wisconsin, Purdue, Nebraska, and Iowa ... plus another random Big 10 team), ND MUST then be eligible for consideration to participate in the Big 10 Championship game at the end of the regular season IF its Big 10 CONFERENCE game WINNING PERCENTAGE is one of the top two CONFERENCE GAME WINNING PERCENTAGES in the Big 10. In the event THREE or more Big 10 teams happened to post identical "perfect 1.000" winning pergentages in their Big 10 Conference games, then ND would be the first team dropped from consideration for that season's Big 10 Championship Game (by virtue of playing "only" 6 Big 10 scheduled games to attain the perfect 1.000 conference game winning percentage instead of the other teams playing 8 conference games and attaining the perfect 1.000 perfect winning percentage for conference games, regardless of ND's strength of schedule for at-large games, including against SEC teams) ... UNLESS during that season ND's schedule actually just so happened to have voluntarily featured 8 or more Big 10 games ... in which event ND would be back in the mix for selection to play in the Big 10 Conference Championship Game that season -- however the Big 10 would decide which 2 conference teams possessing identical conference winning pergentage records that season would play for the Conference Championship (e.g., decision by lottery, coin flip, strength of schedule, national poll ranking, or whatever method the Conference had established in advance). I believe that "IF" the Big 10 truly wants ND "that badly" to join the Big 10 Conference once and for all, and they were willing to accede to this VERY REASONABLE accommodation that's respectful of ALL/BOTH parties, that ND in fact WOULD join the Big 10 for all sports. Who knows, if the Big 10 really wants to transform itself into a "national coast-to-coast mega-conference," it will actually follow this suggested model for ND and reduce its "conference schedule" for football back to 8 games annually instead of 9 (4 home, 4 away), with as many as 4 of those 8 conference games for each team remaining as annual rivalry games, with the others being randomly selected conference games ... that would enable each Big 10 team also to schedule 4 "at-large" games outside of conference commitments wherever in the country they wanted (including scheduling more Big 10 teams if mutually acceptable to the affected teams). I would imagine that the "big boys of Big 10 football would probably want to preserve these ANNUAL rivalry games on the perpetual Big 10 master football schedule however: 1. Michigan vs Ohio State, Michigan State, Penn State, and ND 2. Ohio State vs Michigan, Michigan State, Penn State, and ND 3. Michigan State vs Michigan, Penn State, and Ohio State 4. Penn State vs Ohio State, Michigan State, and Michigan 5. ND vs Michigan, Ohio State, and USC (plus semi-regular games with Michigan State, Penn State, Purdue, Wisconsin, Nebraska, and Iowa if ND joined the Big 10 with the Big 10 accommodation) 6. USC vs ND, UCLA, Oregon, and Washington 7. UCLA vs USC, Oregon, and Washington 8. Oregon vs Washington, USC, and UCLA 9. Washington vs Oregon, USC, and UCLA 10. Iowa vs. Nebraska, Minnesota, and Wisconsin 11. Minnesota vs Wisconsin and Iowa 12. Wisconsin vs Minnesota, illinois, and Iowa 13. Nebraska vs Iowa 14. Purdue vs Indiana 15. Northwestern vs Illinois 16. Illinois vs Northwestern, Wisconsin, Purdue, and Indiana 17. Maryland vs Rutgers