OPEN CRUMB - Best Practices. CAUTION - WET DOUGH! | by JoyRideCoffee

I briefly tried to summarize the best practices to get open crumb. Understanding the extensibility of the dough and adjusting it by hydration (depending on the flour), by the time of autolyse and by the folds (their number and intensity) is one of the key to obtain a loaf with a beautiful and tasty open crumb.
Recipe:
275g bread flour
50g whole spelt
280g water (270g appears somewhere wrong in the clip, I apologize for my mistake)
65g sourdough starter
7.5g salt
Method:
Autolyse with water and flour for 2 hours; mix with starter and then rest for 30 minutes; mixing with salt and then rest for 30 minutes; move it to a clean pyrex dish. total bulk fermentation 8h until (4 folds in first 5 hours) then shaping; rest in the fridge 20h at 3-4 deg. C; I bake at 240deg. C with steam for 10 minutes and then 30min at 210deg. C without steam.
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Inspired by:
- Trevor Jay Wilson: / trevorjaywilson
- Kristen (fullproofbaking): / fullproofbaking
- Claudio Perrando: claudio-perrando.com/

[@judylerch7991]

Oh my gosh!!! You're back!! Have missed your videos!!

[@BreadbyJoyRideCoffee]

Thank you Judy!

[@keban1986]

Welcome back

[@AlastairYoung1]

Welcome back! I've missed your meditations on seeking repeatable open crumb nirvana so much :)

[@BreadbyJoyRideCoffee]

:))) Thank you Alastair!

[@marcgrossman3212]

Why don’t you do all the folding in the original bowl ? Why do you move the dough into a square glass tray? More to clean……. Thanks

[@angelikaradominska5512]

You don't have to do this 😄 but this way this is easier to flip out the dough without damages in the alveolies.

[@Maymatthewmichael]

Your video is full of love and passion. Whom ever eating your bread is also receiving such love. Through your video, people learned how to make beautiful bread for their loved ones, and you are spreading that love and passion too. Thanks for your dedication-viewer from Hong Kong

[@barrychambers4047]

You seem to have a symbiotic relationship with you bread dough, Joy Ride! Welcome back, too!!!!!

[@BreadbyJoyRideCoffee]

Thank you Barry!

[@LoafHacker]

So good to have you back posting videos again!! And this one is another great one :)

[@BreadbyJoyRideCoffee]

LoafHacker hello here. :) Thank you!

[@jg-tp4up]

Your bread and the way you work the dough is poetic…. Love the way your shoot your videos and absolutely love your music choice, I could watch them all day. When finished and out of the oven the bread must be incredibly good. Thank you for your videos a true pleasure to learn and watch.

[@Zureiyaa]

Every so often I go check out if my subscriber alarm bell hasn't worked when you have posted a video, but no luck. I was really happy to see this video in my feed. It's always pleasure to watch these and also learn something new everytime :) What a gorgeous crumb and a great video! Thank you for posting again.

[@BreadbyJoyRideCoffee]

Thank you Zureiyaa !

[@WildThyme69]

I love your videos! The crumb of this loaf is more than artisanal - it's art.

[@BreadbyJoyRideCoffee]

Thank you Sophie!

[@CachafazBH]

I did miss your videos. Really nice to see that again! Also, I’d like to thank you for helping me improve the quality of my loaves to the maximum capacity I could get with the weak (10% protein) flours we find where I live in Brazil. After many attempts, I have now found my way. Tks!

[@WildThyme69]

See if you can find vital wheat gluten in a health food store! Gluten is the protein in flour, what the % is expressing. Bread flour is ~13% gluten. 1.5 grams of gluten per 100 g of flour raises the flour's protein amount by 1%. So if you're trying to go from 10% to 13% you'd add ~5g of vital wheat gluten per 100g of your flour.

[@CachafazBH]

@@WildThyme69 excellent! Thank you! A question: is the result the same as if I was using a 13% flour? Can it take the same amount of water in a recipe?

[@WildThyme69]

Another place to find vital wheat gluten is any place that sells vegan or vegetarian food. Seitan is a meat substitute made entirely of gluten (raw ingredient is vital wheat gluten)

[@agatalevay4151]

So happy to see you again! Missed your gentle dough handling!

[@MattMingaBurns]

You sir, are an absolute wizard of the bread.

[@user-yn1vz4xi2w]

Thank you for coming back with such a wonderful bread!!!!!!

[@BreadbyJoyRideCoffee]

Thank you!

[@BTs-he1lg]

It has been 7 months, long wait is over. So glad you are back with more bread video. Watching your videos and listening to the soothing music make all the stress go away. Thank you - Becky

[@BTs-he1lg]

I didn't think that I can manage such a high hydration bread, but it turned out very well. Thanks

[@BashLoGiudice]

Always a pleasure. Excellent loaf my friend.

[@jolsmendoza4326]

Welcome back!!!!

[@BreadbyJoyRideCoffee]

Thank you!

[@kevinu.k.7042]

Always a joy to watch. Thank you 👌

[@albertferguson8361]

Love your table by the way

[@Whatisthis154]

You totally inspire me!

[@AmarEnergy]

What a gorgeous loaf of bread! Such a soothing video too. You've inspired me to take my starter out of the fridge today so I can bake this weekend!

[@BreadbyJoyRideCoffee]

Good to hear you start to bake :)

[@anka2612]

What a wonderful video ❤️and what a wonderful bread!👍 Thank you very much!!

[@BreadbyJoyRideCoffee]

Thank you!

[@jzjones7819]

Welcome back my favorite youtuber!

[@somethinggoodisgonnahappen]

Your videos are excellent. Thank you. 👍

[@BreadbyJoyRideCoffee]

thank you!

[@joshual335]

Welcome back! You have been missed! Nice to see you, Friend!

[@BreadbyJoyRideCoffee]

Thank you Joshua!

[@leventkurt9596]

Thanks for another relaxing video

[@BreadbyJoyRideCoffee]

Thank you!

[@mrstempo]

Welcome back, we’ve all missed you collectively it seems!

[@ronenn11]

Looks amazing! thank you for another great video.

[@BreadbyJoyRideCoffee]

Thank you Ronen!

[@nikosmix]

Good to see a new video...!And what a crumb that is...!!!Your points are always taken into account to make our loafs better...

[@BreadbyJoyRideCoffee]

Thank you Nick!

[@ianbown3543]

Amazing bread! such an inspiration, i really could meditate to your videos :)

[@BreadbyJoyRideCoffee]

Thank you Ian!

[@lolam.9291]

I think you do a great job with scoring ☺️

[@rimmakrylova5209]

It’s fantastic!

[@BreadbyJoyRideCoffee]

Thank you!

[@cherryreyes2466]

I am new to bread baking and sourdough. I am so happy I found this channel. I hope to learn much from you. Happy to subscribe to your channel from the Philippines.

[@nuraygumus9294]

Beautiful loaf and crumb,I’ll try this beauty and let you know,thank for sharing this video

[@BreadbyJoyRideCoffee]

Thank you!

[@eduardojahnke8970]

We were waiting! Cheers!

[@BreadbyJoyRideCoffee]

Thank you Eduardo!

[@nikinikolakaki9346]

Welcome back!!!! We missed your videos and we made some progress as well. I agree on this method and I could add that oiling slightly your pyrex dish would help to do even less "damage" to the integrity of the dough. Thank you! (and yes, extensibility and long autolyse is the answer...the master Trevor J.Wilson insisted on that)

[@BreadbyJoyRideCoffee]

Hi Niki! Saw your new wonderful loaves on facebook! Congratulation for so big progress! I also watched your visit in Thessaloniki, I was there 3 times this year and your pictures made me miss the city. :)

[@nikinikolakaki9346]

@@BreadbyJoyRideCoffee Thank you on your lovely comment!!!! (Thessaloniki is the city I studied at university and it's been a long time since I last visited...I have some friends and colleagues there and shared some thoughts on sourdough as well ...lol)

[@Ken-Sho]

Is steam necessary for baking? Love your videos, thanks so much for all the wonderful instructions!

[@danielnichols3594]

I would love to know more about your starter maintenance routine and how you build/maintain a vigorous starter. I have had major issues with access to specialty flours during the pandemic and avoiding chlorinated water sources (chlorine/chloramine). This inhibited my starter strength for many months until I figured it out. I'm not sure if I could get my starter to stay at peak for 4-5 hours - especially now that winter is approaching in the U.S.A. I'm glad to see your videos again after an absence of some months.

[@BreadbyJoyRideCoffee]

I don't have a very exact procedure. I work more with the senses and intuition than with accurate measurements. I don't have a clear recipe, sometimes I feed 1: 1: 1 (if I want to have the starter fast ready for bread), other times I feed 1:12:12 (if I want my starter to be good for bread after 12-14 hours) or whatever. Sometimes I forget to feed it and I feed it only after 24 hours. The only certainty is that I always keep it at room temperature, I only put it in the fridge when I'm gone.

[@valentinvisan5363]

Superb ! Îți mulțumesc, a apărut filmulețul tău fix când mă simțeam pregătit (și ușor temător) să încerc o pâine cu mult mai multe alveole în interior :D Îți doresc spor la brutărit și filmat ! :)

[@BreadbyJoyRideCoffee]

Valentin! Multumesc. Si tie spor la brutarit!

[@pattikanoh2353]

Another great video. What is the size to your oval banneton? THANK YOU I love all your videos too.

[@nilsandersen]

I love your videos So addictive to watch I appreciate the great lengths you go thru to create the open crumb, but how would I modify if I just wanted an even distribution of small crumb for a sliceable loaf?

[@WildThyme69]

You'd want to lower the hydration to make it easier to work with (~70-75% water, if the amount of flour is your 100% reference) and you could knead and handle it more aggressively. He made "art" crumb in this video, and it's gorgeous and hard to do! A tighter crumb is easier. He definitely has an "every day loaf" video

[@Zureiyaa]

Two things that should get you closer to tighter (still open) crumb: 1. Add another coil fold later in the bulk proof. Coil folds both strengthen your dough but also build structure. Think about it like this, if you have 3 bubbles on top of each other and you fold it in half, now you have 6 bubbles on top of each other. If you fold that again, now you already have 12 bubbles on top of each other. Coil folds help build layers and one performed at a later stage, let's say 30 minutes before shaping can help you even out the crumb and make it more uniform. 2. Retard your loaf in the fridge for longer. It will build up slightly more flavor, but it will also have the effect of evening out the crumb structure. For a wilder crumb, you could retard your loaves in the fridge for less, but to get the uniform crumb, it will help. Hope these are useful tips!

[@bronwynadams2636]

Gluten Morgen, JoyRideCoffee. Do you have any basic sourdough bread making videos in German? I have shared some sourdough starter with a German friend who lives in the Black Forest. Many thanks in advance. We really appreciate all your great videos and very helpful tips. 👏👏👏🙏🙏🙏

[@djembeboyzach]

Lovely :) Whats the purpose of the new clean bowl. Can i just do it in the original or do i need a second one

[@Breadhunter2001]

You make the most beautiful breads I've ever seen. Tell me, do they always look so great? Do you have failures (I sure do).If you have failures, can you share some of them with us and tell us what went wrong?

[@BreadbyJoyRideCoffee]

Because I experiment a lot I have a lot of unsuccessful breads. I would say that more are unsuccessful than the good ones :))) But most failures are good for learn. So your idea is very, very good, I'm going to try a clip like "let's learn from mistakes".

[@patricklim9345]

looks amazing! do you feed the starter everyday? I think living with starters needs lots of care and energy lol.

[@noerbella2021]

Masya'alloh very very goood

[@BreadbyJoyRideCoffee]

Thank you!

[@johngodsafe5887]

Really great, I’ve learnt so much, thank you. Could you please tell me what temperature you bake this at and wether you use steam to help the crust, thanks again

[@BreadbyJoyRideCoffee]

I bake on baking steel (preheated) at 240deg C for 10 mins. with steam (I pour water over the heated vulcaninc rocks) then 25mins without steam at 210deg C. You can see on my past videos. Or here: kzbin.info/door/cLCX8VIcNWIu6BJyjWQDwwcommunity?lb=UgyVXU1zbtYfpTiV_tx4AaABCQ

[@marilinebraz2832]

So I don’t think I saw you saying the hydratation of this bread and I am lazy to make the calculation. Can you tell me? And also I love your videos. Did the lazy bread and I just loved the tecnic

[@starlightcraftsGB]

Very interesting, but what a process! How do you make the starter? The loaf looks delicious, but I didn't realise that having that many holes in the bread was something to treasure. Lots more room for butter, I suppose.

[@chunkapur5057]

Hey, so happy to see you back here, Mr. Joyride !!! 🌺🌺🌹🌹😊😊🌻🌻 Thanks to you, the bread has improved vastly - been making 125gms emmer wheat+125gms sprouted wheat flour + 180-190 gms water Noticed that you no longer do the long stretch or the lamination ? Will try this new way now 😊😊👌👌👌🌺🌺 thank you

[@BreadbyJoyRideCoffee]

Lamination is not absolutely necessary. You can compensate with an extra fold or two later. Thank you very much!

[@chunkapur5057]

@@BreadbyJoyRideCoffee the sprouted wheat flour tears a bit during lamination...that's why so happy to try this method of yours 😊😊🌹🌹thank you

[@user-jd4ye4tz5r]

Hello Your breads are amazing. I want to achieve that but my dough always just tear apart easily at the first or second fold. Will the dough temp affect? My room temp is always about30 degree

[@superfoodsmoothies]

Love the video! Amazing loaf! Is it possible to leave the dough out at room temperature for the final proof instead of going in the fridge for so long? I'm in the tropics and my dough over ferments if I have it in the fridge for more than 3 hours as the dough doesn't cool down quick enough. I'd love to get your crumb results and wondered if leaving it at room temperature in the banneton for a couple of hours would work? So happy you're back! I love your videos, such good crumb and so relaxing ❤

[@ianbown3543]

have you got a freezer? i sometimes put mine in the freezer for 20-30mins before putting in a cold 1-2c fridge. You could just cut the bulk ferment down a bit also

[@superfoodsmoothies]

@@ianbown3543 good idea! I'll try the freezer before the fridge, thanks! 🙏

[@BreadbyJoyRideCoffee]

Sure you can leave at room temperature instead of going in the fridge. Make some try - one hour, two hors ...

[@mahualm]

Thank you again for yet another very inspiring video. I started sourdough bread making with guided videos and yours has really helped and truly kept me going back and not giving up. I have a question, I used to live in Europe with mostly cooler temperatures, mild summers and have recently relocated to the equator. So very warm and humid. Temperature ranges from 27C on a rainy day to 34C on a normal day. Humidity range is also high between 70-90%. I’m struggling to control my long fermentation process. I keep the dough in the fridge in between the hourly coil folds. Then leave it out for a few hours to bulk ferment before shaping and overnight proofing in fridge. The baked bread doesn’t have the same rise and open structure as before. Should I reduce fermentation time? Reduce hydration? I do 75%. Any tips from the master are very welcome! Thank you for giving me the motivation!

[@barrychambers4047]

I'm not the master, but, could you inoculate with less leaven to help slow the fermentation? You can also control your dough temperature by using an ice chest with just a little addition of ice, from time to time, to help regulate the temperature.

[@mahualm]

@@barrychambers4047 I guess that might be an option, putting in less levain. The ice chest I’d say is basically going to be doing the same as putting it in the fridge? Thanks for the suggestions :)

[@BreadbyJoyRideCoffee]

I couldn't tell you the exact rule for your environmental conditions. But I'm sure you have to do some experiments with courage. Both in terms of bulk times and in terms of proofing times. And then draw conclusions. I do a lot of tests and I have a lot of unsuccessful breads. But I learn the most from these mistakes.

[@mahualm]

@@BreadbyJoyRideCoffee thank you. You’re right. One of the lessons to learn from making bread is not to be afraid of getting it wrong. I need to experiment more and take the pressure off from getting a ‘perfect’ bread every time. Will play around with the timings and see what works best. Keep your inspiring videos coming, they really help!

[@AndersSvensson_norrkoping]

Hi Great video! What doug temperature did you have? You are totally inspiring!

[@BreadbyJoyRideCoffee]

I never measured the temperature of the dough, I couldn't say. Thanks!

[@highandicap]

Long time no see Maestro!!!

[@BreadbyJoyRideCoffee]

Thank you!

[@robertawearmouth2273]

Do you have any videos on how to get your starter to stay at peak for so long?

[@andreasggustavsson]

Hi, I have a question. Do you think lowering the amount of sourdough to like 5-10% (instead of 20%) and consequently bulk much longer would have same effect on extensibility as an autolys have (more bulk time = more extensibility)? The reason for asking is that this could potentially make the whole process easier since you could mix everything in at once (flower, water, salt and sourdough) and just bulk longer to get the extensibility while building up dough strength in the normal way through folds. Or is an autolys still preferred to get good extensibility even though you have longer bulk? Would love to have your input on this. And great to see you back on KZbin again btw 🥳

[@BreadbyJoyRideCoffee]

Yes. That's right. With a small inoculation we delay the fermentation process. But you need to stay for hours around the dough to make folds and so one. But will work too. I do this with the loaves fermenting in bulk overnight while I sleep. Stay untouched for about 9-10 hours. The problem is that in the morning the dough is extensible but does not have the structure created because I did not fold it for so many hours. It requires preshape and a much tighter shaping that usually degas the dough. The bread is ok, very tasty but still not like the one you worked on carefully. I work on this. I'm trying to find a solution and I'll definitely make a clip when it works. Thank you!

[@nikinikolakaki9346]

@@BreadbyJoyRideCoffee I have tried lower inoculation too and have delayed the extension at the end of the fermentation but not overnight. Just took my time on making a loaf (maximum 8 hours 22-23 temp. and it came out great, not like yours but this time extension made a difference. And the final rise in the fridge was 30 hours)

[@ptangolee]

Do you ever oil your glass pan? My dough sticks to it and won’t come out when I flip the glass pan.

[@Liz-ux8be]

Always enjoyed your videos. It always seems so easy haha ...... May I know what is the percentage of your bread flour protein ? Thank you for sharing again :-))

[@BreadbyJoyRideCoffee]

Don't know. On bag is wrote 3% in 30g ... but seems to be confusing

[@enricofalcone9697]

We missed you

[@BreadbyJoyRideCoffee]

I missed myself too :)))

[@tomlimcj]

does it make a difference to use AP flour or Bread flour? i used AP flour and its too wet, gluten network is weak and constantly see surface of flour wet. will bread flour change the game?

[@cliffcox7643]

I have only Bread flour and whole wheat and rye.. What amount of the other flours and which flour can I add to make this?

[@waaaaa695]

Please what do you dépend on to determine the duration of autolyse ?

[@fotimadavron1929]

Hello! Do you bake bread with seeds? Wholegrain?

[@michaelsallinger193]

Do you notice any appreciable difference from autolyse to fermentolyse and it’s affect on crumb?

[@maryan74]

❤🤗

[@rainerrain9689]

Hi, check your Amazon links, they aren't working. PS: what size Pyrex dish is that ? { can't find out with the broken links}. Also, I have no spelt, can I replace it with Rye ? Thanks.

[@skyelarsson3428]

Can I ask how you don't have it stick to your hands? Do you have floured or wet hands when handling it? Or neither??

[@gabea.2123]

Beautiful loaf! I find it surprising that contrary to popular advise, you don't seem to tighten the dough too much to "give it tension" on the top. Not even cinching it once it's in the banneton. It's a very gentle handling all the way. Again, "create tension" is what I hear everywhere. I've always wondered if so much "tensioning" doesn't deflate the dough unnecessarily.

[@BreadbyJoyRideCoffee]

this degree of proof create inner tension (gas inside) so we don’t need too mich tension at shaping

[@JoseLausuch]

Lovely video! How much protein has the flour you used here?

[@BreadbyJoyRideCoffee]

Can;t find on a bag. They say 3%/30g flour. Confusing for me ...

[@JoseLausuch]

@@BreadbyJoyRideCoffee Yeah, I think in South America they give the nutritional information from 30g as totals.. That must be around 10% protein per 100g.

[@BreadbyJoyRideCoffee]

@@JoseLausuch seems too low for this hydration …

[@JoseLausuch]

@@BreadbyJoyRideCoffee Indeed, but if it's stone milled with high extraction, it could handle high hydration I guess.

[@joepehoski650]

What is the ambient temperature of your kitchen in this video?

[@joepehoski650]

Sorry, I didn’t wait the 10 seconds where you answer that question You are an artist … and, probably, a zen monk :-)

[@andreisorinmihai8507]

Salut, vreau sa iti spun ca pâinea ta e ceva ireal, as vrea sa învăț sa stăpânesc fermentarea asa bine ca si tine. Eu stau in Anglia, am descoperit o faina, Dove's Farm organic bread flour, 13% proteine. Fantastica faina, ofer niste alveoli gigante la 70% hidratare. Daca ai avea posibilitatea sa o incerci sunt sigur ca ar iesi ceva spectacular din mainile tale. Mulțumesc pentru acest content si ca inspiri lumea sa mănânce sănătos si gustos.

[@BreadbyJoyRideCoffee]

Salut Mihai, iti multumesc pentru mesajul fain. Stiu de faina Dove's Farm dar n-am folosit-o nicioadata. Dar o voi cumpara, am vazut ca se poate cumpara si de prin Romania. Merci!

[@sparkyheberling6115]

3:59 How does speed and energy harm the dough?

[@gustavovitorino2524]

Is your starter a liquid or a stiff one?

[@rast125]

Why my dough doesn't extend at side. It only rise.

[@wrenisland]

Lol! I was wondering how you came by the Gold Medal flour!

[@BreadbyJoyRideCoffee]

:))) I don't know anything about it. But worked. I also received King Arthur Bread Flour (organic and non organic)

[@danielnichols3594]

@@BreadbyJoyRideCoffee Gold Medal Flour is a better-quality bread flour sold in many large supermarkets in the U.S. owned by General Mills, a big food company based in Minnesota, U.S. King Arthur is also widely available and considered to be one of the best mass-market bread flours for home bakers. I've moved more to King Arthur in recent years but I haven't yet gotten a lacy/fluffy crumb like with your breads. It's interesting that you add salt 30 min's after the starter. I've read conflicting opinions on how important this step is.

[@ThePhilbox]

Are you at sea level? I'm curious if you could achieve these results at altitude. I've never see anyone address this part of the equation.

[@archivist68]

I hope you won't mind my small comment on this. I am at 6500 ft/1981.2 meters in the Rocky Mountains. Bulk fermentation seems identical to sea level. The tricky part is the timing of all rest/fermentation stages. Fermention, in general, appears to speed up at altitute (lower air pressure, I think). I've overproofed many loaves, but I have produced beautiful ones, as well!

[@WildThyme69]

I don't think altitude should affect fermentation. It affects cooking/baking/canning as water boils at a lower temperature (due to the decrease in atmospheric pressure). Temperature has the BIGGEST effect on bread baking BY FAR. The temperature of the water you add, the room you proof in, the starter... Bakeries even try to keep their flour at a certain temp! A swing of 2-3 degrees can increase your fermentation time by 30+ min. There are formulas online if you're interested in this.

[@BreadbyJoyRideCoffee]

My town is at 415m altitude. I don't know if there are any visible differences at sea level. (as can be seen at different temperatures)

[@archivist68]

Here we go--I knew I saw this somewhere. This is from our CSU Extension and I have observed the same effects. I hope this helps: extension.colostate.edu/topic-areas/nutrition-food-safety-health/high-altitude-food-preparation-p41/#yeast

[@raquelvidal1561]

Traducido a español porfa!!!

[@coralgabriel6882]

The dough is really wet I am having trouble help

[@bavariasuhl]

ling time no see

[@belindajavier7910]

You know, your recipe is confusing.