Orthodox Substitutes for the Gospel?

All Christians do it -- when we're trying to get people to become part of our church, we substitute things for the gospel, because we think it will work better. They're often good things, but they're not the gospel.
The question is not what "works" to get people to become Orthodox Christians. The question is what is right in encouraging them to convert to Jesus Christ.
So, here are some things that Orthodox Christians in the English-speaking world tend to substitute for the gospel when doing evangelism, and here's what we should be saying instead.
In this video, I mention:
This earlier video: • The Gospel is NOT a Sa...
My book "Arise, O God": store.ancientf...
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[@Aaron.T2005]

So basically the lesson is this: It is OK to admire and marvel over the beauty of the true Church that God gave us, but the center of our lives and evangelism should be the Gospel and repentance and a change of heart toward Christ, and explaining that the church is what God gave us to come to know him.

[@zzzaaayyynnn]

Which is a great message and approach, but when I converted to Orthodoxy after several years of study and working with a priest, the fact it IS the original "way" of Christianity made a difference in my acceptance of it over Roman Catholicism. But not the only reason.

[@specialcombatdefensivetact1784]

When I mention the Orthodox church is The original church established by Christ thru the Apostles still worshipping and functioning consistently since that time, with Apostolic succession, the automatic response has been, "are you saying I'm not saved?"

[@skibidi.G]

I fear that some unscrupulous pastors tell their flock that by just saying you believe in Christ gives you an autosave feature, and that you're done with trying being an actual Christian 😵‍💫

[@Demetra719]

@@skibidi.GIn many ways, this does happen. I don’t think pastors are saying that’s all that goes into being a Christian, but more or less, the auto save feature is a thing (if you “accept Jesus into your heart”) and is what gets you into heaven regardless of how holy you live your life. They don’t realize what they are missing. (Speaking as a former Pentecostal Protestant).

[@gregcoogan8270]

@@skibidi.G maybe some of them are unscrupulous, but many actually believe that because to believe something different from that, would imply what they label as a "work based" salvation. The actually, sincerely believe that all you have to do is hit "autosave".

[@robiszabo903]

I accidentally ruined Christmas talking like this

[@vsevolodtokarev]

Which proves this is an essential, important point. The Church was established as the instrument of our salvation; so called churches - for some other purpose.

[@terrymattingly6843]

One of my phrases: The goal is to move from “Come and see” to “O Taste and See.”

[@josiahkeen]

Orthodox converts often times present their story, whether they realize it or not, as an accomplishment rather than a journey led by the grace of God and based on their faith in Christ. Converts believe that if others only read the books or visited the services that they had they would also understand. It is not this simple.

[@johnsambo9379]

Not just converts. People born into it are usually the least godly.

[@troyyurchak3213]

As a person who recently came home to Orthodoxy, I truly appreciate this. "Who is Jesus? What did he do? & What does he expect?" All the other things may be true, but are tangential to the Truth, The Way, The Life.

[@Paisios77]

I appreciate this video, I am newly illumined as ofLazarus Saturday, but during my pursuit of truth, I discovered a lot of orthodox Internet Cowboys, who have everyone on blast, who are so argumentative, and so full of pride, I can't even use their material to share with others on a theological level. This is a reminder that it is about the gospel and it's about Christ and that's who we need to point to, Thank you Father Andrew

[@darkgandhi05]

I’m guessing that Fr Andrew made his channel to help fight the tide of terrible “Ortho-bro” content. God bless him

[@iakov1906]

​@darkgandhi05 who are these "orthobros"?

[@iakov1906]

​@@darkgandhi05^

[@darkgandhi05]

@@iakov1906 Following the gentle, respectful, Christ-like ethos of Fr Andrew, we leave “Internet Cowboys” or “Orthobros” unnamed. The Internet has allowed anyone to create a platform. Use discernment to find true Orthodox teachers who are trying to expose the icon of Christ within all of us.

[@iakov1906]

@@darkgandhi05 what are the common traits of these people you won't name so I know to avoid them?

[@jsayin]

Great video! I am former Protestant myself. I am a bit guilty of this but it is usually in response to questions about my own journey to orthodoxy rather than evangelism. I am the black sheep of the family thanks to my conversion so I get questioned often by my Protestant family but rarely know what to tell them other than my own path. I will definitely keep this in mind.

[@BaikalTii]

of course it's only after a person is in the door and baptized, but let me say that hearing "Taste and See that the Lord is Good" waiting to receive Communion at Pre-Sanctified Liturgy is absolutely sublime.

[@BaikalTii]

@@donhaddix3770 the Holy Gospel according to St. John chapter 6 verse 51

[@OrthodoxInquirer]

​@@BaikalTii The end of John Chapter 6 is what made me realize I could only choose between Orthodoxy and Catholicism and since Roman Catholic doctrine has changed so very much, I came to realize that I had to be Orthodox. The Angel feeding the scroll to Isaiah and the Manna that came down from Heaven really convinced me. Besides, there are Greek words not translated properly in English Bibles. "Do this in remembrance of me" is actually Jesus referring to the Thanksgiving offering from the Temple. He wanted us to continue that sacrifice but it would be his body and blood. Eucharist is the word Thanksgiving.

[@kshfly1982]

Just noticed you have a map of Middle Earth behind you. ;) Excellent video, as usual. I've read "Arise, O God" twice now and really enjoyed it.

[@patricklee8088]

Thank you! I've had trouble in the past with the "come and see" approach and glad someone was able to put my thoughts into words.

[@zzzaaayyynnn]

It is a great invitation. A little vague, but it does allow people to come in with a fresh mind.

[@MrPanchoak]

Hi Padre! I'm a former Evangelical and I heard Frank Schafer myself. I don't like his crass attitude at all, yet I did and mostly still do agree with his conclusions. But having already read Lee Strobel's "The case for Christ" it was the Orthodox focus on the Resurrection which I was smitten with. As we sing Christos Anesti we focus clearly on this incredible event. I appreciate your thoughtfulness on the subject. I think you are spot on.

[@pg618]

Frankie boy has made himself Pope and he sees himself above the orthodox church now he is against orthodoxy he is a complete heretic now not just by a little but by an immense amount totally off the rails.

[@shawnbrewer7]

Another great video, Fr. Andrew! Arise, O God is a fantastic book.

[@mr.google2680]

I did the same mistakes you mentioned! I was also in prelest, and now thank God im well, and thank you for this message it was great to hear it and look back what i did wrong in my life, thank you again and all glory to God☦️

[@Boreas0529]

This is a really good video Fr Andrew. As a layman and new convert your videos are always great to listen to. When it comes to the topic of evangelizing is there any writings or works that you recommend by some people on how it should be done in depth? This video to me seemed like a good guide on what not to do, but as a recent convert i don't exactly have much knowledge on what I should do when it comes to evangelism

[@paulsjg]

14:53 ish. Couldn't help but notice the word 'tactic.' As you and Fr Stephen so often point out on LoS, techne is NOT how we engage with God or others in our our efforts to be faithful. I'm hearing you loud and clear. Excellent words for all of us.

[@rx88088]

Well said Fr. Andrew. Thank you for reminding us what the faith is all about.

[@DebbieWinskill]

Many are not old enough to remember or have experienced a Roman Catholic high Mass in the years before Vatican II, or, more accurately in the years before Vat II "made it" to the local churches. I am and do remember. Extraodinarily beautiful and moving. And the churches were full. Father Andrew is quite right that the Western Rite was beautiful, and Orthodox, for long centuries.

[@wv9459]

Thank you for this father. I’m a catechumen and want to share my new knowledge with my family (Protestants) and this is an amazing perspective. All these things you talk of are playing a part in my conversion, but you are so right that these shouldn’t be the evangelistic techniques. Sure, they interested me and were maybe some of the first seeds planted in my life, but it seems like they don’t stick for anyone else

[@Илья́Впрямь]

Thank you for honing our focus; let us set our face as flint, as the scriptures say. By God, may we present, to our neighbor, a positive vision of Christ our Lord. Side note-coming off of the Areopagus-I actually appreciate seeing “the face of Fr. Andrew”, especially after years of “sola voci”

[@user-wz5gc2td9s]

#3 really reminded me of my first visit to my parish last year. I kinda went in expecting grand beauty....but it wasn't 😅. Funny enough, being of western influence, if I had to pick a church based solely on aesthetics, I probably would have become Roman catholic. And I found the orthodox aesthetic to be a bit too foreign for my tastes...at the time. Since then, I've warmed up to it and see it's beauty. But luckily for me, aesthetics wasn't the only thing I was after and I have been a catechumen for almost a year now.

[@WilliamPotting]

This is so good. I’ve been guilty of many of these “evangelistic techniques” myself. You’re right, usually doesn’t work but has the opposite effect.

[@paulsjg]

21:00 Bringing it!! Amen and amen.

[@skibidi.G]

Truly He is Risen! 👌☦️🤙

[@user222j22]

☦Greetings from a Russian Orthodox.

[@justanotherlikeyou]

Thank you Father for this. As a convert to Orthodoxy I have found myself using the one true Church line quite a bit with people. I guess because it helped me. I don't think it's necessarily a bad tactic, as you said it is a true statement, but I get your point about the Gospel first. I will say this, that line I only use with other professed Christians and not non-Christians. Probably because I assume professed Christians have already heard the Gospel and might need something more clarifying about the Church itself. With non-Christians I'll definitely use the Gospel as the first thing.

[@acekoala457]

The best way for us to demonstrate that Orthodoxy is the One True Church is not to float it in people's faces but to live it out by using your feet. Attend Services, maintain a Prayer Life, live as Christ Commands. This is more telling than words.

[@hugoalonsopalaciosibarra4690]

When i heard that Orthodoxy was the true church i didn't felt offended tbh, I felt several things like, confused, scared, and similar things.

[@cjschweisthal3830]

Love the Lord of the Rings map lol. Great video and explanation

[@EricBryant]

I am still in the dating/catechumen phase (and I am ok with this for now) and I also purchased your book "Orthodoxy and Heterodoxy" last year and read it and use it as a reference guide. I appreciated what you said in this video quite a lot. You're right: The "One True Church" statement can really be jarring and cause total system failure for us as "heterodox" Christians. And even that term can be difficult and jarring. And then once you get over - if you get over - that system crash, you have another one coming with icon veneration as necessary for salvation. And if you manage to not have drowned crossing the Bosphorus after encountering the above two, then you have the equivalent of a Blue Screen of Death when you encounter Theotokos hyperdulia. And I don't think I need to tell you at all what happens when Sola Fide and / or Sola Scriptura crumble. May as well replace the entire hard drive at this point because Disk Defragmenter and Norton Antivirus can't even deal with this.

[@tjkhan4541]

May I ask, for you as a catechumen, what has been most convincing / compelling for you to move toward Orthodoxy, from your old framework?

[@sakamotosan1887]

@@tjkhan4541 For me personally, it would be things like authority and where it comes from, i.e., not from me. I don't get to decide what Christianity is. That was decided long ago by people far more knowledgeable and closer to the beginning of the Church than I. Christianity didn't come from the Bible, it's actually the other way around. That's why not all Christian practices have to be explicitly in the Bible. That idea is actually completely new and made up and even arbitrary. There is no reason to believe that all practices have to come from the Bible unless you just believe someone who tells you that. The Bible was never meant to be used in that way. It's used for the Church's liturgical services. It's not the whole of Divine revelation and claiming that it is requires evidence that there is no other. Oral tradition of the Apostles is also Divinely inspired, and the only reason people nowadays think it isn't is because of the invention of the printing press. One way or another, I'm going to be following someone's traditions. The Apostles' or the reformers' traditions. I know which I'd rather follow. Authority doesn't come from me or from Luther or Calvin or Zwingli, and that means that Christianity wasn't made up, it didn't need to be restored, it was revealed to man by God. If the Holy Spirit preserved and guarded the Holy Scriptures throughout time, why wouldn't He do the same for everything else the Apostles taught? Why only the written word? If I don't accept this, then I have to rely on my own understanding of the text and decide for myself what it is saying. Why should I have to do that? Who's to say that I know I'm right? Why should I believe, for example, a Baptist's interpretations over a Lutheran's interpretations, or a Presbyterian's? Some say they all agree on fundamental issues, but even a cursory glance at what they all believe shows that this is not the case. Baptists don't believe that baptism actually does anything, and so they don't baptize children. Lutherans on the other hand, do believe that baptism does something. Both are basing their beliefs on the "clear" teachings of Scripture. How do I know which one of these I should follow? If baptism as an infant doesn't actually do anything, why do they need to be baptized again as an adult in order for it to not do anything again? If the Scriptures are so obviously clear, why do so many people disagree on what they are clear about? That doesn't sound like the definition of clear that I understand. As a Protestant Evangelical, Christianity seemed arbitrary and made-up to me. I accepted it because I was told it was important to go to heaven when I die, but this was rather disconnected from this life. Believing in Christ was something that was all in my head, and then I had my regular, secular life on the side as well. That's not to say I wasn't sincere or genuine in my convictions. I certainly was. But there was no substance to it. I felt like I was standing on shifting sands. Why is God going to reward me for believing the right things rather than for my actions? Why is God going to punish people for not believing the right things, regardless of their actions? That doesn't sound like justice at all. That sounds totally arbitrary and made-up. And that's because it was. Orthodoxy is logical and consistent, as well as being holistic. It encompasses the whole of one's life. It's not "all in your head". This lines up with God being the Logos, the Word (Logos is translated as word, but Logos is more accurate), the ordering principle underlying reality, the Tao, the Way. Truth isn't just an idea or a concept, Truth is a Person. We're not Muslims. There isn't some great gap between God and humanity and we humans exist just to stroke Gods ego or something ridiculous like that. It is a human person Who sits on the Throne of God: Jesus of Nazareth. Human nature has been united with the Divine, making it possible for us to become by grace what Christ is by nature. The greatest and most glorious creation of God is Man. Man has been perfected in the person of Jesus Christ, in Whom we can also be saved from our corruption, resurrected, and deified. We're also not Muslims in the sense of basing our whole religion on a book. Muslims consider themselves "people of the book", but Islam is not a Church. We are not "people of the book", because we are the Church, the Ekklesia. Islam is not a Church, only an ideology based on a book. When you try to divorce Christianity from the Church and base it solely on the Bible, you make it like Islam in this way. When the Church is all the believers, and being a believer is defined differently depending on who you ask, then there is no Church. Only ideas and phantoms.

[@tjkhan4541]

@@sakamotosan1887 thanks for your perspective. I do think you still have some concepts and definitions twisted, based on your comment. But I’m sorry for the unhelpful place you were stuck in, and glad you’re not stuck there, and I pray the Lord keeps shining more light for you. Grace and peace.

[@deedeepembleton3737]

Thank-you for this Fr. Andrew!

[@markbuchman6247]

Thanks, Father! Great video.

[@zzzaaayyynnn]

The way I speak of my Orthodox belief with non-Christians and atheists differs from how I speak of it with Roman Catholics and Protestants. I did have one Episcopalian friend (active in her church) say "Do you really BELIEVE all that stuff?"

[@maydayredparade]

So much of the problem here is how we define "evangelism." As a former Protestant coming from the Reformed tradition, "evangelism" has tended to mean "overcome someone's objections with really good arguments" - in other words, trample all over their free will with a sales pitch. Ultimately, I have come to the conclusion that trying to convince someone that they should become Orthodox doesn't work. I have had much more fruitful conversations when I have shared my personal experience of how I have encountered Christ through the Church. If that's interesting to someone, they will follow up and explore more - and hopefully have their own encounter with Christ through the Orthodox Church.

[@ButSeriouslyThough]

Father, this is an important topic, but I feel that this video does not sufficiently answer it. As you know, the Gospel, principally soaking, is the good news of the ingathering of the Jews, the restoration of Israel, the defeat of God's enemies, the universal knowledge of God and the Law, the inscribing of the Law on one's heart. St. Peter in his sermon to the Jews in Jerusalem expresses the "Gospel to the Jews": the fulfillment of the eschatological expectations of Judaism, demonstrated from the prophets. St. Paul in his sermon to the Greeks in Athens expresses the "Gospel to the Gentiles": the final judgment to come, the oneness of God, etc., as partially announced by the philosophers but now fully manifested in Jesus. But what is the "Gospel to the Christians" supposed to be? You say that we must announce not aesthetics, not theology, but first and foremost Jesus. But, in my experience this results in only one thing: the heterodox are offended by this. "I already know most intimately Jesus in my church, why should I join yours? Are you claiming to know Him even more closely than I do? Or that I do not actually know Jesus?" We have the commandments, but so do they. We have the Holy Spirit, but they make the same claim. We have the sacrifice of the Eucharist, but they have offerings of incense, that is, prayer. We have the saints as examples of true Christians, true members of Christ, but they see all Christians as equally saintly. So what is to be done here? They are very much unimpressed by the Orthodox claim to be the Church of God. They already believe they are in the Church of God! And they even speak of mystical experiences of Jesus far beyond what I myself may have known. So, how to evangelize in such a situation?

[@junioralfa3628]

That is quite the dilemma. You've expressed it very well. Thanks. Hope you get a response. God bless.

[@thankyou8622]

Through your works. through who you are. dont try to change their mind unless they ask you to. just love them. St Seraphim of Sarov said "acquire the spirit of peace, and thousands around you will be saved".

[@EricBryant]

And I 100% agree: you just can't beat the Orthodox esthetics. It's worldview altering Beauty. That's why my plan is to continue attending Orthodox liturgy even if I never get Chrismated. I know God is there through the Form of the Beautiful that is conveyed at every turn and in every part of the temple.

[@andrewdurand3181]

I have further problems when it comes to proclaiming the One True Church that sort of expand on the last point about the declining Christian population in general. Well, partially that and partially something else. What do we mean when we say that we have the "True" faith? Are we saying that Protestants and Catholics don't worship the True Trinity or the True Christ? Are we saying they don't have the True Scriptures? They don't have the True Communion? True Baptism? Which part isn't true? We accept non-Orthodox baptisms. So were they true? My biggest problem with the statement, "We are the One True Church," is that it lacks nuance. We do in fact recognize the God of the Protestants and Catholics. We recognize their baptism. We will ALL say the Creed together with little disagreement outside of a couple words that, with a little charitable theological discussion, can be often reconciled. I don't don't like to say I am part of the One True Church because I don't want to disregard all that is True with other Christians. I prefer to say instead that the Orthodox Church has the fullness of the faith. We remain in tact. We have preserved what is ancient. This leads to discussion of why we make this claim and doesn't start the conversation with a polemic. The food that other Christians have is often good, but the Orthodox table is fully laden. Come and partake. And I feel this way because of the decreasing number of Christians and the increasing antagonism of the world. I want to recognize Allies in this larger fight. I want them to know that the Orthodox Church recognizes their God as True but ALSO is equipped with the necessary fortification to battle the fallen. Too often I see Orthodox Christians focusing on their fight against other Christians. Why? We don't need to do this to be confident in where we stand.

[@Magicarpet-z4r]

Father, do you recommend any particular materials for Catechizing new converts? I know you’ve talked about getting away from the “Orthodoxy 101” approach, so I’d love to hear more about your approach.

[@frandrewstephendamick]

Honestly, I don't know of many such materials published recently that actually train people to do the things the Christian life entails. Fr. Evan Armatas's book "Toolkit for Spiritual Growth" is aimed in this direction, and of course a lot of ancient catechetical material is designed to teach the virtues, but it needs some adaptation to be comprehensible to modern readers. It is a big gap that needs to be filled.

[@Magicarpet-z4r]

@@frandrewstephendamick I take to heart your admonition about comparing the Faith to other traditions as I am more guilty of doing that than anyone. I think it’s easier to explain something as “this and not that” rather than a full-orbed treatment of the depth and Spiritual beauty of the Orthodox Way. It’s natural to compare as we exit our former traditions but I hope to rise above that to a True knowledge of Christ through His Church. Thank you again for your time and all your work, Father! May it be Blessed.

[@BaikalTii]

allow me to recommend two- "The Beginnings of a Life of Prayer" by Bishop Irenei, St Herman of Alaska Brotherhood and "Great Lent" by Fr. Alexander Schmemann, St Vladimir's Seminary Press.

[@rx88088]

Fr. Thomas Hopko's 55 Maxims are a great start for a "how to" guide.

[@cwthomas]

Guilty of #1, but never liked #2 and #3 for different reasons of my own. Though on the first point about the original church. To me, when presenting the actual gospel of "Who is Christ, What did He do, What does he want", many people would say "All Christian churches present Christ, I can go to whatever church suites me best to meet him and hear the gospel". Of course other churches present variations on the actual gospel and then people are left wondering "well which one is the most accurate?" To me, the "ancient faith" argument is a really strong argument that the Orthodox gospel is more correct than one from another tradition. So for people like me, presenting me with "the one true church" argument causes me to immediately think "if that's true then they probably have the most accurate gospel.

[@zita-lein]

Well done, Father. ❤️💙

[@pg618]

So you say come and see jesus in my jehovah's witness church or my Baptist church and the answer is no. Our Lord Jesus is our reason our purpose our goal. And you may see him in the forest and in the trees and the beautiful sunset but if you want the body of Christ to get to the head then you go through the one holy catholic and apostolic church.

[@TheSpyridon1]

we miss the simple Gospel according to St Paul in 1 corinthians “ 3 For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; 4 And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:” i’d love to see a difference in catechisms fir those who are christians coming to orthodoxy , and those who are coming to Christ anew . lotsa danger when we lose the simple gospel in all our “ rah rah orthodoxy”

[@jesseandjuanita]

Amen!!

[@johnmichaelbullock594]

Padre, I have a question for you. I'm a protestant and tend to be more open minded around baptized Christians. If you've been baptized in the the name of the Trinity and not apostate, I view you as a Christian. My church and denomination (CREC) tend to accept baptisms from protestant, Catholic, and Orthodox churches. Does the phrase "the Orthodox Church is the original church" or "only true church" mean that people baptized in the Triune name (Protestant or Catholic) are not christians? I ask genuinely because on the interwebs, it's a bit of a mix bag of "yes" and "I don't know" or "no". Anyhoo, I've been enjoying your shorter stuff from the longer LOS or Amon Sul podcasts!

[@willhedges6639]

My priest says any baptism in the name of the trinity with triple immersion is legit

[@reidmartin6209]

Yes, they are Christians, just Christians who belong to other churches besides the Apostolic one(s).

[@Smh1054]

That depends on what you mean by Christian. If by that you mean an individual joined to the one body and bride of Christ the answer is no, only Orthodox Christians fit that description.

[@ApostolicEchoes]

There is no baptism outside the Church

[@ericlammerman2777]

Protestants view other Protestants, Catholics, Orthodox and Coptics as Christians because its required by the "Invisible Church" doctrine, that essentially anyone who confesses "Christ is Lord" with their mouth is a Christian...and therefore part of The Church. If it worked this way in Orthodoxy, we would have open communion; but we do not. Your Trinitarian baptism would, however, (likely) be deemed acceptable if you desired to unite yourself with the mystical body of Christ. You would need to be catechized (generally for at least a year), to renounce some false teachings of your tradition, and ultimately be chrismated when received into the one, holy, catholic and apostolic church. I don't have it in me to tell my Protestant and Catholic friends and family members that they aren't Christian. Instead, I recall Mark 9:38-41 as well as Philippians 1:15-18...and focus on my own salvation.

[@Jd-808]

That’s not how I interpret “Come and see”, though maybe that’s how some intend it. I see it as an invitation to a way of life. Protestants tend to think of Christianity as primarily about ‘believing the right thing/things’ whereas Orthodoxy is focused on one’s individual actions. So, stop living in your head, stop wanting to be convinced by reason before taking action. Just come and see.

[@cyberjunk2002]

I have only ever heard it in the context of come and see our worship, not come and see us serve at a homeless shelter.

[@johnsambo9379]

You are generalizing and that's a phallacy about Protestants.

[@johnsambo9379]

You are saying Protestants aren't focused on their actions? Lol

[@acekoala457]

​@@johnsambo9379 Seen it both ways. Some Protestants I grew up with lived without cares about sin and others were enslaved by their sins and personal interpretation of what constitutes sin.

[@pg618]

It's hard to believe that Frankie Shaffer is not excommunicated I can't think of an orthodox church left or right that would accept where he is at and what he preaches now it is completely contrary to orthodoxy in any jurisdiction.

[@robertjarman4261]

An evil yank.

[@acekoala457]

He is Apostate. Doesn't need to be formally Excommunicated.

[@noahjohnson2611]

There are not enough thumbs to "up" this video.

[@vickipritchard2082]

I'm a Protestant and almost converted to Orthodoxy because of the Protestant church's recent compromises with wokeness in its hierarchy. The Orthodox faith and church service and its lay members , I loved, but finally had to back out. After watching many Orthodox You- Tubers with Orthodox priests and Orthodox theologians arguing that they are the one true church, that a convert must renounce his or her past Church affiliations, as well as understand that all spiritual experiences with Jesus were invalid if it didnt happen within their church walls, and then must be scrutinized with the priest to decide if they are valid, I found disorienting and saddening. I was saved and water baptized in the name of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit, and also healed of epilepsy by the laying 1:17 on of hands by an Episcopal priest who spoke in tongues, decades before I knew that Orthoxy existed in more than an art history book. If men must carry their unsaved, arrogant, argumentative natures into the church, be it Protestant, Orthodox, or Catholic, then I will wait a few more decades on them, and continue to study the Bible, pray and worship in my own way on my own. I can't deny my Protestant Christian roots where I learned the Word, the mystery, the glory, the love and faithfulness of the Father, Son and Holy Spirit, both inside the walls of the church or all alone, crying out to God.

[@frandrewstephendamick]

You will find sinners in every church. And the idea that one must utterly disavow every good thing that has ever happened to them in order to become Orthodox -- well, that is not Orthodox Christianity at all. Orthodox Christianity is not something best represented on the Internet. It is in actual parish life.

[@vickipritchard2082]

Thank you for responding to me.

[@vickipritchard2082]

Yes, the parishioners were the sweetest people ever.

[@zachandevajensen4600]

Part if the reason I converted was that I learned how open Orthodoxy is. "Only God knows who is 'in' and 'out'"

[@vsevolodtokarev]

4:45 "We're not Jewish, but we are Orthodox, we're not Roman, but we are Catholic we're not -Protestant- Evangelicals but the Bible came from us, we're not denominational we're pre-denominational" is a paraphrase of 2 Corinthians 6:9-10: "as unknown, and yet well known; as dying, and behold we live; as chastened, and yet not killed; as sorrowful, yet always rejoicing; as poor, yet making many rich; as having nothing, and yet possessing all things." 7:36 "It's a negative thing to say because it's defining us by what we are not". There is nothing wrong with that approach. We are doing this regarding God all the time, it's called "Apophatic theology". 11:52 Isaac the Syrian goes into great lengths to develop this point. "None other but His very Son said these things concerning Him, lest we doubt it; and thus He bare witness concerning Him. Where, then, is God’s justice, for whilst we are sinners Christ died for us!" This alone dispels the claim (12:58) that "this idea that we don't believe in the angry God makes no sense". 17:16 I agree that the aesthetics is very auxiliary to the essence of Orthodoxy; and yet coming from aesthetics makes sense for most of us; at least for the married men. I fell in love with my wife to a great part because of her astonishing beauty; that superficial beauty is long gone, but since I learned to recognize inner beauty of her soul; though surely some men refuse to be faithful and divorce. Father, what you are saying is to the point - except going too far on some occasions I outlined above; but you missed one important aspect. All this evangelization is a futile human effort unless the Holy Spirit, Who does dwell in the Church, works His part; and that's where there is the problem. I have been in the Church most of my life yet I can't say I have the Holy Spirit; I have not met Jesus the way He promises in John 14:21. Symeon the new Theologian insists that without meeting the Lord we can't believe in Him or love Him as we should; and wouldn't be able to evangelize, one should think.

[@frandrewstephendamick]

1) "This, but not that" is a rhetorical form, but the content of what I was describing has nothing to do with 2 Cor. 6 -- one is not a paraphrase of the other even if they share a rhetorical form. But that still is not the gospel. 2) Apophatic theology is mainly aimed at God. I wasn't rejecting apophatic theology. It is an important and useful thing. But that still is not the gospel. 3) St. Isaac is using this rhetoric to make a point, and the point is not that God is unjust -- that would be very explicitly against the Scripture and a denial of the Day of the Lord which is mentioned over and over. Rather, his point is that God loves us. But that still is not the gospel. 4) I didn't say that aesthetics can't or shouldn't attract people to the Church. But that still is not the gospel. 5) My video was not about everything related to the gospel -- it's not designed to be a comprehensive examination of it. Of course the Holy Spirit is critical to evangelism. What I am discussing here is what the content of preaching the gospel actually is.

[@1117Acts]

I struggle with the words, “the one true church” because scripture tells us that the church is the body of Christ. It is no organization because not all in an organization are a part of the body of Christ. Christ is clear in Matthew 7 that MANY (he uses that exact word) will come expecting entrance to heaven upon which he says, “depart from me, you workers of lawlessness”. Just trying to work your words in a Berean manor. Ty for explaining much in love.

[@orthoslavie]

A bit quiet sound

[@Agaporis12]

Alithos anesti!

[@Aleksandr-Herman]

I really loved all you other videos. But this one left me concerned. As soon as you separate the Church from Jesus or Jesus from the Church in the work of salvation, or true Gospel, you will get Protestantism. There's no way around it. Reductionism and simplification leads to theological relativism, which leads to destruction. It is Western, it is dangerous , and it is not orthodoxy. I'm a former protestant btw and had enough of "it doesn't matter what church you are in, it only matters if you are with Jesus"... Duh....

[@frandrewstephendamick]

Who said anything about separating the Church from Jesus or from salvation, the true gospel, etc.? God forbid! The point of this video was to talk about what the gospel is and not to substitute anything for it -- even good things that we should not do without. The gospel is the proclamation of Who Jesus is, what He accomplished, and what He expects. That doesn't mean nothing else matters or is somehow separated. The idea that "it doesn't matter what church you are in, it only matters if you are with Jesus" is not something I remotely accept, and I have published a lot of material that is very explicit about all that. I have no idea how you could get that from anything I have ever said, including only this video.

[@iuliua]

No minister of Jesus Christ has Mordor in the background.

[@frandrewstephendamick]

It's a big map. Is Mordor the only place on it you're interested in?

[@acekoala457]

Mordor is Symbolic for our own world. It is a good reminder, but also remember that the Ring was destroyed March 25th. What else happened on March 25th?

[@xtusvincit5230]

Orthodoxy is nothing but distractions from the gospel. Vestments, droning, crowns, etc. Nothing could be further from Christ who walked the earth with nothing more than tunic and sandals.

[@frandrewstephendamick]

That Christ is now enthroned in glory in the heavens and His Church worships Him in the manner He commanded. That's not distraction. It's focus on the most important thing.

[@gregcoogan8270]

And when He went to the prayer services in the synaoguge and the Temple, there was vestments, dronings, headcoverings, etc.

[@vsevolodtokarev]

Only an utterly ignorant person can say this. Our vestments are rooted in how the apostles dressed.In 2 Timothy 4:13, Ap. Paul reminds him to "bring the cloak". What is "cloak" in English is "φαιλόνην" (philonion) in Greek, that's the kind vestment an Orthodox priest wears to this day. The tunic, called sakkos, is also in use. Yet other sacred clothes are rooted in the Old Testament. Yet some people need an excuse not to be in the Church. I understand.