osu!mapping: overmapping

explaining how maps can utilize different types of overmapping while still being acceptable
this is one of the topics where i dont expect everyone to agree with me lol
osu!talk interview: • osu!talk Episode 44 fe...
maps referenced:
Nishino Kana - Darling by Giralda: osu.ppy.sh/b/493755
dj TAKA - quaver by Monstrata: osu.ppy.sh/b/915210
Nekomata Master+ - squall by wa_: osu.ppy.sh/b/234923
ginkiha - nightfall by Xilver and deetz: osu.ppy.sh/s/458456
M2U - Lunatic Sky by z1085684963: osu.ppy.sh/b/935948
Inferi - The Promethean Kings by Mazzerin: osu.ppy.sh/b/1083470
Reol - Streaming Heart by captin1: osu.ppy.sh/b/751180
Treyarch Sound - 115 by pishifat: osu.ppy.sh/b/870839
U1 overground - Dopamine by fanzhen0019: osu.ppy.sh/b/494818
Delain - Go Away by pishifat: osu.ppy.sh/b/1016263
EGOIST - Namae no Nai Kaibutsu by SnowNiNo_: osu.ppy.sh/b/513673
Kanae Asaba - Endless Starlight ~Inochi no Kirameki~ (OP ver.) by pishifat: osu.ppy.sh/b/1104260
PIKOTARO - Pen-Pineapple-Apple-Pen by Deppyforce: osu.ppy.sh/b/1099189
GRANRODEO - Can Do (TV Size) by Monstrata: osu.ppy.sh/b/1055880
Rise Against - Drones by pishifat: osu.ppy.sh/b/692088
REOL - Give me a break Stop now by SnowNiNo_: osu.ppy.sh/b/1058918
AKI AKANE - Hankyou no Barrier Seed by pishifat: osu.ppy.sh/b/925681
My Chemical Romance - Helena by pishifat: osu.ppy.sh/b/805855
THE ORAL CIGARETTES - Kyouran Hey Kids!! by pishifat: osu.ppy.sh/b/813775
SUPER BEAVER - Rashisa by deetz: osu.ppy.sh/b/725622
Meramipop - Sanae-san by EvilElvis: osu.ppy.sh/b/1049018
Rise Against - The Eco-Terrorist In Me by pishifat: osu.ppy.sh/b/788532
Harada Hitomi, Kayano Ai & Ogura Yui - Maware! Setsugekka (TV Size) by Skystar: osu.ppy.sh/b/314645
Ray - Hajimete Girls! by pishifat: osu.ppy.sh/b/1113731
Hanatan - If by Rizia: osu.ppy.sh/b/587577
Ice - L2 - Ascension : Act 2 (Liberation) by pishifat: osu.ppy.sh/b/630735
Porter Robinson & Madeon - Shelter by sukiNathan: osu.ppy.sh/b/1113570
that guitar clip: • Video

[@JustFizzyDance]

I love you for calling them "triples", instead of "triplets", which they are not.

[@pinksucccubus]

Exactly

[@rosariosta3899]

just tell me why you're using hitcircle.png as cursor, please?

[@pishifat]

it looks cool

[@rosariosta3899]

fair enough

[@suncuposu]

I watch these videos while doing projects it really helps

[@Athvia]

finally, now people cant misuse the word anymore

[@VinceIsDatBitch]

Lolinyan which word?

[@Athvia]

Marvincent Acuña overmapped.

[@VinceIsDatBitch]

Lolinyan Not everyone in the community watch his videos.

[@Athvia]

Marvincent Acuña they should though

[@granmasgotgame4433]

Hey pishi, I'm relatively new to mapping so please excuse my ignorance, but has there been any discussion about mapping more like a duet rather then mapping to emphasize/accompany the music? Meaning that the goal of the map isn't to emphasize/accompany the music, but rather to stand along side it and transform the experience? The closest thing I can think of (as an example) is a duet (classical). While at points one instrument may take priority over the other, it is necessary for both to have their own strong impressions in order to make the song, as a whole, work. In that sense has anyone attempted to map in a manner that gives equal if not more importance to the mapping and hitsounds rather than the music? This is kind of an abstract idea that may or may not have any value as a discussion point but i figured I'd ask a mapping veteran who seems to have a background in music. :)

[@mcmuffin3292]

Granmas Got Game you suck Kappa

[@Elyuwu_]

I can accept overmapping most of the time, but having huge spaces is something i cant play

[@norikitsune]

thank monstrata C:

[@adrianbonski1849]

huge spaces huge pp

[@fdnt7_]

Basically, you hate jumps.

[@fuwameanssoft]

Every low diff is undermapped though

[@gothicwvlff2]

wha

[@vidaronosu4394]

depends. I'd rather say most

[@prawtism]

Overmapping is love, overmapping is life

[@maddafakka7783]

Is there any chance of making a video on Hollow Wings' style of mapping and your opinion on it? Or at least a reply here, because maybe a video about it wouldn't really have much to talk about.

[@pishifat]

looking at individual mappers is something i've been thinking about, so we'll see

[@maddafakka7783]

okay, looking forward to it!

[@verbosi7y275]

Annddd here it is lol

[@over_loadcode]

Great video, very helpful!

[@WangleLine]

Those videos are soooo good :D

[@Haganenno121]

pishi, what do you think about mapping to barely audible patterns of the song? For example, I listened to shelter many times and never even cared/noticed about 1/4 in the chorus, but I see most mappers in monstrata's set map it to 1/4 even though it's clearly an unimportant beat.

[@pishifat]

i don't want to answer cuz you'll know soon

[@TensePeacock]

Hey, can you agree when people talk about maps as in "Free pp 2k16 jump shit maps", and what do you think about the term "Free pp", do you believe some maps are truly "Free pp"?

[@ZeldaMstr109]

not surprised about the preview for the video.

[@SoraSlayer]

very interesting tutorial. Enlightened my small mind.

[@xIcedShadow]

yo, i know I'm 'bout 4 years late but... when you talk about the two songs at 168 bpm and 336 bpm, we know they're both 168 bpm, technically speaking the "fastest" one, or the more intense one, as you correctly said, is in double time. Double time in music is when the regular accents are "doubled", that means, if you where accenting beats 1 and 3 with kick and 2 and 4 with snare, now every quarter beat is accented with the kick (1 2 3 4) and the in-between beats get accented by the snare, but the tempo is the same, you're just playing faster. Punk music is great at explaining these concepts (full time, which is the regular, half time, double time and even "punk time" as some call it) since you often have pace changes that involve these "gimmicks", but the song's tempo is always the same.

[@xvstar_]

I feel like he consistently has had a sore throat for more than two years.

[@soulstealer8997]

The third point for excuses to overmap just reminds me of how people get several maps ranked when the harder difficulties have extremely forced difficulty.

[@Tachibana_Rika]

1st time i subscribe osu player, even tho i am not a mapper, I like him

[@fiddleblue]

Can you make a video explaining about modding and how to do it? I read the wiki, and barely understand it.

[@gfsd20433]

would you like to talk about controlling star rating? i'm a newbie mapper and don't know why the star rating suddenly rise a lot while mapping. i try to read others maps to be references and make similar stuffs in my map but i don't understand why my map usually get very different rating that i didn't expect :/ just want to know what i may do wrong in my map.

[@gastonsantiagoparada6075]

Did someone noticed that pishifat voice here at x1.25 sounds like actual pishifat? he will be a DT farmer in 2020

[@uyak0]

Can u make a video about the Timing setup panel with more detailed explanations??

[@katl8825]

I'm assuming you've seen the reddit post about 2016 pp mapping...thoughts, opinions? also, do you think some songs have set difficulty levels (based on the how the song sounds alone)? one of your most emphasized points is mapping reflects music. does that mean some maps' difficulty is limited by how the song sounds, and that there's absolutely no way to map (for example) a slow song into a reasonable 5-6*?

[@pishifat]

the reddit post kind of contradicts itself a little too much i think a song definitely influences how it can be mapped, both with how much energy it has and what rhythms it supports

[@jfdsjkre3243]

Could you do a video on patterns? like how you place circles and sliders in different places. I've had alot of trouble with patterns and I need help :(

[@pishifat]

that's kind of what all my videos are about :(

[@jfdsjkre3243]

***** really? i can't see that :o

[@lawrencfgsdfg]

pishifat needs to come back in 2024 mapping scene ...

[@cinamonster]

Rabbit's Jumping Style maps or TAG4?

[@bpobrienbob]

what is your opinion on the new style of mapping in which people make a normal map for a majority of a song and then go apeshit with much harder jumps right at the end to raise the amount of stars?

[@DRk1ll3dm3]

Braeden O'Brien i dont think it is simply used to only raise the stars. i personally think its to test your nerve controll. and not every song allows can use it. most of the time when you do so it you can hear the ending is near and the song gets more intense in a way.

[@fred-ko6vy]

Triples are satisfying

[@Zahar_Ch]

I don't even map song.But this was on my recommended..

[@dolkilu]

hey pishi do you think separating the "maps referenced" into good example & bad example is a good idea?

[@DRk1ll3dm3]

when i look at some maps like snow drive, i think why isnt this ranked. and then people tell me its overmapped. but is it really? is it rankable?

[@GaussianWonder]

what`s the skin that makes the cursor look like a big circle and leaves a thin layer of color behind?

[@lithium820]

can u explain why monstrata maps work. i find them un-intuitive and they usually have not a lot of flow (Kimi no Shiranai Monogatari for example. Reverse slider -> circle -> reverse slider) im noob and i want to flame monstrata pls explain

[@bananya6020]

he maps it for pp and it gets ranked because bns and qats also want pp

[@faizyusuf2470]

Can you make a video about "creative" ?

[@adumneeli4966]

4:50 sliderth

[@SolaEclipse]

lol I was waiting for a Hollow Wings mention but I guess not...

[@trickking6318]

LOL ITS SOLA AYY

[@SolaEclipse]

TrickKing ayy

[@trickking6318]

SolaTheDemon Ayy

[@Owlwasnothere]

As a mapper, what do you think about Haitai map in general?

[@pishifat]

it's not a map worth focusing on. lots of maps use big jumps

[@Owlwasnothere]

Thanks for feedback. Thought asking about this, because I don't know any map, that got so much hate from the community, except maybe A.L.I.E.N., as It's called overrated because of mindless jumps and also being only a bit more than half a minute, while still giving loads of pp. Personally, I think, It's not as "overmapped", as people think, but It doesn't feel like the song does have "more intense" parts in it, just feels a bit too much.

[@phoneticalballsack]

i n d i r e c t a d v e r t i s i n g

[@ReLoadedProject]

How did you snap like that @ 1:32 ??

[@-dubu]

Unless you're mapping mania. In which case just map 1/8 everything and you will have "good map".

[@isy406]

ー。ーユイ not really lol

[@themelancholyofgay3543]

skystar

[@nebulakz]

I love your skin is there a download?

[@gothicwvlff2]

its on his osu profile

[@nebulakz]

@@gothicwvlff2 3 years ago, got the skin now but thanks for the help regardless lol

[@YoungDeet]

was anyone else sad when he didn't include adults toy for the slider part?

[@gothicwvlff2]

what

[@citriphos]

3:36 pishifat why

[@jaakkohintsala2597]

interesting as fuck

[@wibs0n68]

skin download?

[@CooOOookiez]

no offense, but i find doubles much harder to play than simply using 3/4 gaps lol >

[@M0nst3rish]

you know when people tap with their fingers on a table? try to do that with your tapping fingers it felt pretty weird to me at first but you get used to it, ghosts assassin is a good map to train it IIRC

[@karamboubou8579]

another use for undermapping is easy diffs

[@streakertree14]

I am not overmapping 222bpm

[@TheSkeepKK]

CAN DO EET

[@toreole5831]

i hate people that overmap without a real reason. its not related to the music, it doesnt simplify anything, they just put shit in there to annoy the crap out of you and its cancerous

[@-rumble4798]

I want your skin D:

[@artentie]

автор субтитров - герой

[@johnb1653]

pishifast boi

[@orbsandtea]

Aren't Arles maps overmapped? He makes really fast and challenging maps out of relatively slow songs, and it often feels like I'm making additional music with my clicks when playing. But his maps are awesome, and really enjoyable to play. : D

[@VRazorGaming]

Hello There

[@ZeldaMstr109]

personally, i think you should get a "mapping god" title on your profile pishi for being able to provide all this information on mapping. personally.

[@Fureimuu]

shoutout to Mazzerin

[@mightyalekslive]

Fureimuu The Promethean Kings

[@moodman1151]

His maps really aren't overmapped though. It's not like he is mapping TV sizes and making them 8 stars or something

[@marekkratochvil3786]

Am i the only one who thinks that most of skystar's maps are overmapped? ..

[@Kelpoflakey]

Marek Kratochvíl in a bad or good way?

[@delusionships]

1 2 3 4 1234 1234 1234

[@G6GamingSociety]

how do people start to understand what people talk about when everyone who hears them think they're some sort of osu mapping professor or something? it's like everyone starts talking in this lingo that makes them sound like there's some deep meaning behind these maps which can only be explained using esoteric musical theoretical terminology. I honestly wouldn't be surprised if a majority of them just turned out to be giant charlatans.

[@wan5343]

How to overmap? just ask Mazzerin

[@moodman1151]

Just because his maps are hard doesn't make them overmapped