Thailand's Jay Festival and the 3000-Year Holy War Over Eating Meat

[@OTRontheroad]

Quick disclaimer then location pins. First, this was a really intense video- unlike a typical food subject (where there's never THAT much written literature), delving into religion, it's...a mountain. We understand that anything relating to religion is a VERY tough subject to get right, and also, it's a deeply personal thing to many people, so please understand that nothing in this video is in any possible way intended to cause offense or personal disrespect. Our goal was to simply stick with facts related to diet and consumption of food. We put a lot of work into trying to get this as historically accurate as possible, and did our best to not give any impression of editorializing, but please, understand that in no way was any offense intended to any individual or group. Thanks for understanding. With that said, this week's pins: -Vegetarian Community of Bangkok - maps.app.goo.gl/VNyG5DX7BTdqegjF8 -Shree Bhavan - maps.app.goo.gl/5qWAx3BNZsBXTHmz7 -Veganerie - maps.app.goo.gl/uQz8o8ZEb5ddb7QS7 -Kini Puffs - maps.app.goo.gl/PXvxs5RNbYQJtLgS9 -The Fried Chicken Lady - maps.app.goo.gl/MyLAzbszeCnuEVhX8

[@journeywithparu6453]

Today we meet at Bangkok near biyoke sky

[@darajeffus]

Your documentaries are the wind beneath my wings! I just loved this so much, it was so well made, so thoughtful and balanced. I am vegan and Buddhist and love the jay festival.Thank you for making your content and sharing your perspectives.

[@altang884884]

you did a fantastic job!

[@JPMasonDun]

I’m a Buddhist in America, but I went vegan/plant based bc of health reasons primarily, and I was always leery about eating meat bc I didn’t agree with killing animals. I think health reasons is the most common reason for most of my fellow plant based eaters.

[@VeganV5912]

We are herbivores like gorillas. They don’t eat animals. And they’re huge✅♥️💪😬 🦍🦧🐵🐒👩🏽‍❤️‍💋‍👨🏼🥳. Scientific fact.

[@Niksg9424]

Let's fuckin gooooo Wife and I are vegan and eat almost entirely Chinese and SE Asian foods at home because of how easy it all is to make vegan, love seeing a channel that talks about it without the western youtuber "LeTs tRy ThiS WeIrd FoOd" veneer. Love your work. Im the cook in the house and I adore channels like yours that actually explore the culture around and in food honestly with an open heart and kind outlook. I was prepared for the "vegan cult" video to be just gawking and pointing at the members and their faith but it was such a sweet video, I go back to it a lot Big fan my dude, tell the Chinese Cooking Demystified folks they rock too

[@OTRontheroad]

Thanks so much and that’s awesome to hear. Will absolutely pass along the word to Chris and Steph as well. We’re dog-sitting for them as we speak.

[@Niksg9424]

To anyone here reading his reply, seitan is really easy to make at home, 90% of the time taken to make it is just waiting. It's delicious and all you need is a bag of flour, try it, it's really rewarding.

[@cronoz-sensei4259]

Indeed, its incredible how much good food you can make that is vegan by not trying to make a substitute and instead treating the food with the respect it deserves. I am as far from a vegan as one can probably get, but I genuinely cannot go a month without stopping by my favorite paki-indian place for Kadai Paneer. If Paneer wasnt so fucking annoying to make at home, you bet I would be adding it to almost everything. And I love that thats the approach that veggie/vegan food is taking. Because at the end of the day, good food is good food.

[@martyhandley4456]

That was a lot to unpack my friend. As a meat eater, the understanding of the religious nature of not eating meat is understood, you know you do you. But then I moved to China and experienced so many meatless options I was blown away. I can now make some sense of it and see how the devout view foods and their origins of that food relating to peace from within. Another delightfully eye opening production from the OTR team.

[@inzidenziaschulz7972]

Hitler was a vegi. This guy didn't became not infamous because of a peacefull life.

[@remiel_sz]

​@@inzidenziaschulz7972stop spreading misinformation.

[@greggmacdonald9644]

@@inzidenziaschulz7972 No he wasn't, that's a misinterpretation.

[@pretty5793]

This is the first time I have ever seen anyone discuss about Jains and their version of veggie food. Excited to learn more about them.

[@Kidynamo123]

I’m so glad I found this channel from the deep dive on the origin and history of sriracha. The writing and production in these videos is of such high quality and I feel like I’m gradually developing a more nuanced historical and cultural understanding of all these amazing flavors and cuisines I’ve been exploring as a home cook.

[@iskandartaib]

A Jain friend explained the prohibition about eating root vegetables - he said the Jain will only eat something that doesn't involve killing off the entire plant - taking leaves or fruit of a tree or a plant will still leave the tree alive, but if it involves removing the entire plant and eating it, or if it involves killing of the entire plant to get at the edible parts, then they won't do it. I'll have to go look for this vegan food court. When I visit Chiang Mai there's a vegan (or vegetarian - I think they use milk, perhaps even eggs) Shan restaurant I often visit. The first time I ate there they wanted to know if onion and garlic were OK for me. One of the amusing things about Thai (and Chinese) vegetarian cuisine is the mock meats - they'll actually have "chicken" or "pork" on the menu without explanation, even though it's actually plant-based imitation meat. I've been told it's because it helps non-vegetarians who are switching over, because it's similar to meat.. I suppose a lot of Thais are part-time vegetarian - they eschew meat during the Jeh festival.

[@OTRontheroad]

That's right- almost all written explanations say that Jain religion prohibits root vegetables because digging them up could harm insects in the soil...however everyone I spoke with directly for research gave the same explanation your friend did, which is why I included both in this video.

[@DrDog1212]

This is my favorite video I’ve ever seen on KZbin. I’ve been to all these places without knowing the background, culture, history, etc. and would have gone a lifetime never knowing. Thank you for making your voice the true representation of this mix of cultures, told in your own unique and transparent way.

[@OTRontheroad]

Very kind of you to say.

[@JenniferGee-t4k]

I routinely watch all the popular channels about SE Asia. I truly appreciate your approach of telling us history along with foods. Write a book? I adore the James Beard style of writing a quick narrative that gives both a taste of the history of the dish, personal history of the dish and the recipe. You have such a wealth of knowledge that opens up the lineage and future of food. It's rare to find such quality content. Thank you for your work!

[@ericgrumbles447]

I learned about Jainism a very long time ago, but this specific festival aligns with the 9 Emperor Gods Festival in Malaysia and I've been observing that festival's 9 days of meatless eating absent onion and garlic for many years now.

[@yenchyeang9833]

Wow, this is truly mind blowing to learn that Jae aka Nine Gods Emperor Festival in Malaysia is celebrated in such a massive scale in Thailand... In Malaysia it's purely a Taoist celebration where the 9 days vegetarian diet is observed only amongst the Chinese community.

[@ikkue]

It's not surprising if you look at how Thailand has the biggest Chinese diaspora in the world, so Chinese cultures naturally spread throughout the country even to people of non-Chinese descent.

[@drteddy70]

Celebration are wild in Phuket. Phuket has close cultural ties with Penang. Devotees will go into trance and pierce their bodies with a variety of metal implements.

[@turbochargedfilms]

Another masterpiece of a video, me and the family loved every second of it! A great exploration of a topic that a Bengali household like ours may not be all that familiar with, but your approach was highly informative and appreciated. One small thing I'd like to mention is the statistic that 44% of Indians are vegetarian; every statistic that I've seen from those in the F&B industry here (not that I'm in it myself, mind you) has shown that figure being closer to 20-25%, but also its important to note that a not-insignificant number of Indians observe vegetarianism temporarily (a common example being only following vegetarianism 2-3 days out of a week), thus creating a divide between those who describe themselves as vegetarian and those who don't but still follow the practice... sometimes. Further complicating matters is the fact that some coastal communities (like some of my own family in West Bengal) don't differentiate between vegetarianism and pescatarianism, and then there's straight up oddities like Niramish Mangsho; literally "vegetarian mutton", a dish that involves, get this, actual mutton! Nikhil Kamath's podcast involving people from the modern Indian F&B industries has touched on this topic, I don't remember the exact episode but it was fascinating to hear about it in the context of menu engineering. I'd also recommend reading up on how McDonald's and other QSRs deal with the divide between majority vegetarian and majority non-veg states, if you ever needed proof that India is not as much of a cohesive whole when it comes to this topic as people think (remember, India has more beef eaters than the population of Mexico!)

[@tw1nzor]

Better than Netflix thankssss @otr team

[@dondobbs9302]

Another gem! You-all are the best! There's one of those big cafeterias in Chiang Mai but, for some reason, it's closed.

[@supreeyakritsaneephaiboon2304]

Very very interesting; a ton of information that I was relatively clueless about! Thanx, very very mucho!

[@RockNRoll-wb8fn]

I LOVE THIS CHANNEL, SO GOOD RESEARCH ON THE HISTORY AND THE QUALITY OF CUTTING, SO WE WHO LOOK AT THE VIDEO WANTS TO SEE MORE, RESPECT TO YOU ALL IN THE TEAM 🙏🙏🙏🙏❤❤🤍💙💙🤍❤❤

[@jonnywas2665]

You guys never cease to impress, as borne out by your soring subscriber count! One of the most sophisticated, educational and well produced documentary channels anywhere on KZbin. Tuesday afternoon is fast becoming my favourite time of the week.

[@tony_xu]

Here are a few interesting topics to explore about Thai cuisine or food in general: * Jasmine rice (+ a few varieties of rice e.g. sticky rice) * Fish sauce (Thai, Korean, etc.) * Fermented condiment/ingredients (e.g. shrimp paste, Nam Budu, Pla Ra) * Fruits being used in savory dishes

[@myles.o.reilly]

Really excellent episode. Narrative, edits, cinematography... everything. Congrats, and thank you, from Ireland. So excited to be arriving in Bangkok on Friday. Have been admiring your films for a year now, and this one was just class.

[@kaungko7393]

Nice story telling and love the ending part :)

[@KilanEatsandDrinks]

Oh I didn’t know that the street food vendors modify their food to vegetarian during the Nine Emperor Gods Festival. Interesting! Some (not all) Chinese Indonesians celebrate the festival as well, known as Kiu Ong Tai Tei in Hokkien. But it’s not as big of a celebration as Cap Go Meh (the 15th day of Lunar New Year), where some (not all) in my island of Borneo have the tradition of self-mortification like what they have at the Vegetarian Festival in Thailand as well. I’m too lily-livered for all of these LOL I just wanted to add that many Westerners misunderstand things like tofu and tempeh, thinking that these are exclusively vegetarian or vegan, when in Asia we do have them in combination with meat and even offals 😁

[@fuzureo4693]

The intro was long but made the entire video so much more rewarding, great job as always!

[@neilyoung490]

Great video, half way through. The research, chef's kiss. But one small point with your history, there was debate during the life of the Buddha regarding meat. Devadatta, a monk that almost created a schism at the time of the Buddha, apparently wanted to have a strict no meat rule. The Mahayana split definitely restarted that conversation but it had already existed before. Now back to your video!

[@SoulChocolate99]

I commend OTR for going to this festival then taking on the immense task of historicizing its cultural connections and spiritual complexities: well done! This video brought back so many familial and childhood memories of seeing, comprehending, and eating vegetarian and vegan food while in Thailand. My cousins were always thrilled when we could visit a Jain or veggie stall just so we could eat the best seitan in Asia (before I realized I had gluten sensitivities). What made the food special for me as a kid was not the religious aspect, nor adherence to tenants in an anthropological sense, but that someone could create a vegetarian dish so akin to the 'original' meat: mock chicken, mock beef, mock pork. Speaking of 'mock', was that 'mock' hor mok in banana leaves on the vendor table? My guess is it would be with mushrooms. maybe. Anyhow, so happy that you do this. Eat slowly and eat well. A

[@Knbhgcomng]

Love this. Thanks for providing the map locations to these places.

[@Interneter1245]

Beautiful shots. Great narration. A wonderful host. I'll be surprised if you guys don't hit a million subs in 2 years.

[@OTRontheroad]

Thanks so much. Really appreciate it

[@renecomedy]

This channel continues to amaze me. I feel so much in awe of all this history. Having said this. I LOOOVED how much longing for fried chicken you had while making a video on the history of vegan cuisine. Not judging. Just found it humorous. 🎉

[@leviperkins1469]

This channel is underrated you guys are going down in history right next to Anthony Bourdain

[@apeist]

This is quickly becoming one of my favorite channels

[@OTRontheroad]

Thank you!

[@scrubadubification]

Great video. I have thoroughly enjoyed all your content. The deep dives into the stories behind the food is fantastic.

[@estabi]

This is an amazing story. I try to mostly eat plant-based and a big part of that is just a natural sense of ahimsa that I feel. Somehow you managed to link that with with other things that I find so fascinating like the Taoist/Buddhist convergence in Mahayana Buddhism, Chinese Opera and of course Bangkok. I hope I can make it for the Jae festival some day.

[@jacquespoulemer]

Hello Friends. Around 25 years ago I started investigating Buddhism. I have always had an interest in religion in general. When looking a bit into Thailand I had a question which didn't seem to be addressed anywhere. Ahimsa forbids killing and I wondered if the Thai military got special dispensation. How could they effectively fight? This Jay Festival analysis skirted the periphery of that question and Thank you guys very much for that. All the Best Jim retired Mexico.

[@tsurugi5]

buddhism itself never prohibited meat from the very start. Also the buddhism can be taken seriously at different levels. And it absolutely like other religions is used to justify divine kingship in this case dharmaraja meaning a ruler who rules and comes to power and deserves it due to his righteousness and virtue, including war.

[@jacquespoulemer]

@@tsurugi5 If I'm remembering correctly when asking for food one should "eat what is offered" Declining to prefer as Whitman put it. And one of the stories is that the Buddha died from buffalo meat consumption. I always wondered what provisions modern Buddhist nations had for their armies and police. you've now given me the 'hint' Thank you my friend.

[@soultraveler1111]

Such a great video that brought me so many memories from BKK, especially of the "The Vegetarian Society of Bangkok" Each time that I visit I must stop by to have yummy vegan food. 🙏👍👍👍🥰

[@goldensparkle]

Great video about vegan and the different practices between different origin. This deserves more views.

[@alyssamonique4120]

I’ve been vegan for 12years. Just found this page from the rice video and coming from a European and Filipino background then going vegan my love and appreciation for culture has really came from food & learning styles and history of food. How it brings us together

[@alyssamonique4120]

I’ve also studied Zen Buddhism since 5th grade and only took a few years to transition to veganism

[@caferacerinthailand]

Brilliant !, as it always is. Thank you Team OTR.

[@chrismcdermott1111]

Awesome, loved this episode! OTR Food & History just gets better and better 🙏☺

[@ThainaYu]

Theravada Buddhism have a law for monk that they could not be picky about food they got. And that in turn, leaving the interpretation of "do no harm" being that they cannot order or request to eat meat, so not harming anything by themselves. That also made them cannot request to eat only vegetable too To the extreme is, they can eat meat from the corpse of animal that die naturally. Because they don't harm anything for that meat And so lab grown meat actually sinless in Buddhism

[@erikahuxley]

There's no sin in Buddhism, only action which has consequences. People made it into a religion and impose their own rules into it which is the problem. For lab grown meat you have to look beyond the surface not just the claim. Kinda like saying solar panel and wind turbine are environmentally friendly and renewable because that is the surface claim.

[@ThainaYu]

@@erikahuxleyWell, surely in Buddhism has no equivalence of sin in Christianism. But the word sin in Buddhism was used to translated to Akusala, Adharma, and bad Karma in general

[@malithaw]

​@erikahuxley You are incorrect. I assume you are not a buddhist because there IS sin in Buddhism called Papaya/Akusal. It is sin in a literal sense but it is not the same as the Christian sin. Never try to interepet Buddhism or any other dharma through Christian or Abarahmic religious terms because that's how most westernes end up with either a skewed understanding of Dharma or nt understand it at all. Always try to learn the Dharma through a liturgical language like Pali/Sanskrit or even lay languages like Sinhala or Thai. Belive me when I say this that a lot get lost in the translation.

[@erikahuxley]

Yes people like to fool themselves throughout the ages with laws they need to follow in order to be good. To be told what is right and what is wrong. Not just the Hindu but Ancient Egyptians as well.

[@thastayapongsak4422]

​@@erikahuxleyWhat you are talking about is Karma. There IS sin in Buddhism. The name is Paapa.

[@bernardlokman5442]

Jae itself might be directly borrowed from Phuket Peranakan Hokkien’s ‘Tseh’. Nine Emperor Gods/Kiu Ong Ya festival is celebrated in Malaya too, particularly by the older Chinese. It usually also involves burning of sacrificial ships. The ship burning tradition to cleanse disease are celebrated during different times in various regions of diaspora, which I think might have to do with the position and visibility of the big dipper at those particular parts of hemisphere.

[@angsern8455]

There's also the story that the nine emperor's were originally ghosts of nine pirates that turned to buddhism later in life and the sending of the ship is the send them back out to sea after the festival is done. People would then start to eat meat again.

[@bernardlokman5442]

@@angsern8455 there are at least 5 versions of the story of Hokkien New Year (Jade Emperor’s bday), as well as countless versions of boat burning tradition, some ultranationalistic confucian ones too. People tend to create narrative to accommodate their own beliefs, so I am not surprised.

[@Mechstar1]

Awesome Documentary, good research and images, better than most pretentious Netflix ones.. please make more of this kind of videos.

[@chatchaweewong1071]

Nice one guys, Thanks for making such a great vid!

[@doncasto8520]

Thanks for making this video. It was awesome!

[@sts0868]

Very interesting. A Thai chef someday told me it is not possible to combine Thaifood and vegan food. Now I cant wait to try it out. Thanks for the great video!

[@seminky5341]

I came across your chanel by acident and have been binging since! Keep up the good work. You are much better then Mark weiner as he is just an influncer but you are a chef and an educator.

[@ชมพรรณโชติดิลก]

ไม่เคยรู้เลยว่าอินเดียมีร้านเจแถวอินทรา ต้องไปลองทานแล้ว ขอบคุณค่ะ

[@IdeaStudioBKK]

The look on your face when you realized they were just cooking regular fried chicken is priceless lol. Also that berry crumble square from Veganerie is one of my favorite deserts in Bangkok. Some of my favorite dishes in BKK are jey food, it's just so dang good.

[@cxxx9756]

'The deep-fried dry shiitake mushroom is my favorite. I had it at MBK food court. Its taste and texture were almost the same as the deep-fried beef. Very delicious!

[@oscarmora4602]

Informative

[@jakanemo]

So happy you made this video :)

[@saelfeman]

Great series!

[@StephanieLuna-r3b]

What is the name of the video that you made which outlines the two sides of the Buddhists?

[@ahumanbeingithink]

Does anyone know the music piece that plays in the background from 2:00-3:00?

[@OTRontheroad]

It's Mozart, Piano Concerto No. 21

[@ahumanbeingithink]

@@OTRontheroadthank you thank you so much!! 🙏 🎉

[@amusedblank]

The explanation about Buddha's last meal simply adopts Theravada explanation of what happened and what Buddha ate (and somewhat offensive to a larger population of Northeast asians). India has a strong veg tradition and just because of that it is highly likely that Buddha's diet largley consisted of plants. Jains make up only a portion of Indian population but the majority of hindus practice some sort of vegetarianism making it the largest veg country in the world. There are lots of teachings about being kind to all living beings in Buddha's teachings without even relying on Jainist interpretation of ahimsa. (I'm not a biddhist btw.)

[@OTRontheroad]

Like any research, our job is analyzing data. The view explained in this is what is accepted in the vast majority of scholarly writing. It's not unanimous. But given that we're talking about religion and everything is explained in this video with caveats of disagreement- we'll fully stand behind how it's explained in this video. It's accurate.

[@Iceyfire12]

Honestly for years didn’t know why it was called Jay until now!!! I only thought of Jay Fai 😆

[@Jazzsmile1]

Hi! I'm Kritsada from Aranyaphathet city , Part of Sakaeo province in Thailand. I love your video so much I hope you guy come to visit my hometown one day. Thank you .

[@OTRontheroad]

I’d be so interested to check it out! What would you recommend from local food?

[@Jazzsmile1]

@@OTRontheroad I recommend Vietnamese food It's Very famous here sir

[@JUANORQUIO]

W❤W! That’s Awesome And Sumptuous Foodie Adventure! Cheers!🥂❤️✨

[@JihouGijutsu]

This channel needs to survive, so even as a vegan who appreciates cultural analysis through food you guys need to get some more eye on you. Education is the best way to fight oppression.

[@kartik_adhia]

I read Gandhi's biography and he was also part of a private group of vegetarians in London. so it must have started before WWII for sure.

[@MatthewTheWanderer]

On that list of names at 2:12, Vegan is easily the best option! Also, even though I am not a vegan (I'm eating meat while watching this, in fact), I find this video to be absolutely fascinating!

[@fabrisseterbrugghe8567]

One small factor potentially spreading vegetarianism is the rise of Alpha-GAL allergy. Mammal meat becomes completely indigestible, but milk lacks Alpha-GAL, so it's okay. It's made me pescatarian, but vegetarian is the easiest way to handle it. As I'm living in the south to look after an my mother, I will say, it's tough. Even now vegetables are often made with fat back or tasso ham.

[@siriratt9037]

ชอบคอนเท้นต์เฮียนะ เทศกาลกินเจในคอนเท้นต์นี้ ขาดอีกที่คือ นครสวรรค์ เค้ามีที่มาที่แตกต่างกันในเรื่องกินเจที่นั่น Food history แบบนี้ เคยดูแต่ของฝรั่ง มีคนมาทำแบบไทยๆแบบนี้ ก็เยี่ยมมาก ถ้าจะว่าไป แต่ละจังหวัด เค้าจะมีอาหารเฉพาะของเค้าแหละ แต่บางพื้นที่ อาหารเฉพาะก็หายไปพอสมควร เช่นจังหวัดเกิดดิฉันเอง สมัยปู่ย่าตายาย เนื้อส้มที่เค้าจะหมักในไห ปลาหมากนัด ก็หายไปแล้ว ไม่มีให้กินแล้ว ส่วนตัวก็เคยทานสมัยเด็กๆมาก ไม่กี่ครั้ง

[@Best-SiLenZ]

Ok. I'm Thai, I ate Jay food once in a while but I have very little information about the believe itself. Its kinda mixed and have blurry lime between Bhudism and other believe in Thailand nowadays. Also, I love your closing thought. I too believe in delocious food, if you think about it, food really can bring people together.

[@shushunk00]

i would like u to know that so called Hinduism which is whitewashed version of brhaminism(bhramins that r priests, self claimed higher caste who tried to control the subcontinent population,still trying to, despite being the minority) is hijacked from bodh dharam (initial stages of non idolized version of buddhism) lot of buddha's statues in the south Asia were demolished and uprooted or modified to current day god,goddesses of "hinduism" this were done by the bhramins, even universities run by the disciples of buddha were demolished, taking everything out of the universities and even the teachers so that there couldn't be any non idiolized version education,so lot of disciples moved to central,east ,southeast asia for their safety then it became idolized version which is now what we know as buddism, also the bhramins did change/bury a lot of ancient texts,historical texts that would make them look bad a lot of part of history from the subcontinent is missing,and the priests were successful to spread the narrative that hinduism is an ancient religion but its not,the first mention of vedas was in 11th century and the language that were written were the language not older than 10 or 8 th century ,so not from 3000-5000 bc as the bhramins tried to claim and by the texts they wrote for hindu texts,they were successful up until now as new archaeological findings r coming regularly that defies what they tried to claim I am an ex Hindu , antitheist(not against the believers, but I am against any dogma-all religion and even capitalism) no religions r peaceful or violent in nature, they r just mediums to control masses, which removes critical thinking and engages in tribalism which is bad and regressive. capitalists use their capital to manipulate masses to create violence in the name of religion, race, ethnicity, etc. religions r one of the best mediums to create a divide between the working class, so that the capitalist class and politicians can exploit and live in luxury.

[@uweschroeder]

There is a very big difference between vegan and vegetarian. The Jay Festival is vegetarian and by extra religious restrictions even exceeds most vegan standards. That however doesn't mean the ingredients are actually vegan - that's a big misconception. Just because it's a vegetable doesn't mean it wasn't fertilized with fish meal, blood meal or bone meal - all of which quite common fertilizers and all of which turn a vegetable non-vegan.

[@drteddy70]

Chinese traditional religion is a snycretism of Taoism, Mahayana Buddhism, folk religion and Confusianism. The mixture is so intricate it's sometimes difficult to tell them apart. But the Nine Emperor Gods festival is not actually Buddhism, but more Taoism/Chinese folk religion. Chinese vegetarians don't eat garlic, onions, leeks and chives. Potatoes, ginger and other root vegetables are permitted.

[@brucetaylor8848]

Have a study of the pillars of asoka.....marble monoliths inscribed upon what should and should not be eaten......pillars of asoke if you want to study the spread of Buddhism..

[@winteryolive]

Does the 'chai' concept really imply veganism as opposed to vegetarianism, or is it just that the regional cuisines, whether vegetarian or non-vegetarian, don't involve many dairy products in the first place? Dairy itself is not explicitly forbidden on the Buddhist fasting days or for monks, right? What about for the Santi Asoka community? I've only ever encountered Western veganism. Dharmic vegetarianism doesn't prohibit dairy. On the contrary, dairy products are inherently pure, holy, and even used ritually in some vegetarian traditions in South Asia.

[@thastayapongsak4422]

No, poultry is very much common in south east asian food. Dairy is unheard of in native cuisine, but it is also "prohibited" for people who participate in this festival.

[@jeremycline9542]

The resto-chain Loving Hut comes from Thailand. Now I can see why.

[@nnkkiepattranit246]

I’m not religious, well not anymore. But growing up in Thailand, Jay festival is definitely one of my favorites food wise. Good job OTR for covering these less known topics about Thai cuisine. I’ve been super homesick since moving to the States and your content takes me right back home.

[@eldenjim]

I said it once, and i’ll say it again: You make me and my เจ parents proud

[@matthewjanney2399]

i wanna say part of budhisms bent twords vegeterian/vegan diets in china related to the evolution of monastic culture..that in china the begging /alms rounds werent as culturaly viable so they had to farm and prepare their own food...so you see the more hard vegeterianism crop up where the begging/alms stopped

[@neilyoung490]

Excellent point.

[@pipsasqeak820]

Im not vegan, but whenever I can I will actively go out of my way to eat Asian Vegan Food, because its actually good food. Its not weird chemicals fake meats or very questionable flavors, its actually good wholesome food. Why the west is so hostile to Asian Vegan food (especially Southern Chinese/Thai/Vietnamese) cuisine completely baffles me

[@atlnla4112]

Isn’t it Jae?

[@eswillie]

Thanks for an interesting and informative episode. I loved the reference to the Lotophagoi from the Odyssey, since I read a good deal of that in the original Ancient Greek in high school and can still recite about twenty or thirty of the first lines. That being said, and although I'm in no way vegan or vegetarian, some of those dishes did look appealing and I'd have no problem trying them (although many of them did look slightly bland). One other note for me is that I'm familiar with basic Buddhist and Taoist philosophy and writings, and initially at least neither one speaks of gods or religion per se, although that's how they are commonly perceived (same as Confucianism, which is merely about decency and common sense). I'm not certain, but I believe it was Karl Marx who said that if god didn't exist, man would have had to create one. That's just our human nature, and I'm fine with it. Just don't ever expect me to eat food without onions and garlic, particularly garlic.

[@nidohime6233]

Is interesting how for a long time being a vegan was a luxury of sorts. Think about it, many philosophies surrounding on not harming animals and abstaining on eating meat developed in civilizations where agriculture was advanced enough to feed millions of people, in very fertile lands such as the Indo river. For a hunter-gatherer society refraining of consuming any animal produce was a death sentence, because unlike us they didn´t had the warranty of getting food every day we now get from granted. We now have thousands of options, and we are getting better on finding new ways to reduce meat and dairy compsuption, even when morality isn´t involved. And just a funny idea I have, I think the reason why Buddha still ate meat was because he himself didn´t knew where it came from. After all we are talking about a man who didn´t knew what was aging, sickness or death for almost 30 years, so I wouln´t be surprised if he didn´t knew why Babe suddenly was gone, yet still had a nice porkchop the night before XD

[@MsLilsweets]

What are they gonna do with all the animals?

[@osnisida]

culinary anthropology at its finest

[@amitzyraizy7774]

Make one show where u taste the vegan food and tell us how they are. Like more emphasis on the diff food and ingredients.

[@jimshelley8831]

Because of high cholesterol I try to avoid fried food vegan or otherwise.

[@jcnavera]

I got to see this in Phuket last year. Lots of vegetarian food, firecrackers, and self-harm 😅

[@angsern8455]

Self mutilation and for those who don't know, only those who are possessed by the gods would go through this.

[@secular13]

Truffles/ mushrooms might have been the last Buddha meal,the issue of meat eating was different back in Buddha times w/ out industrial farming and slaughter houses and supermarkets full of chilled/frozen meats.

[@dr.casebolt]

Yes, there is a very important oversight in this video -- there are two different interpretations of the story of the Buddha's last meal. The name of the dish he ate is translated as "pig's delight." One interpretation is that this was a dish containing pork. The other, however, is that it was a dish containing ingredients that a pig would want to eat, which is usually taken to be mushrooms. Different lineages within Buddhism tend to take whichever interpretation is compatible with their view about meat-eating relative to the first ethical precept of the pañcasila -- not talking life.

[@ClockSeeker]

I believe in Bangkok have 2-3 Jain temple.

[@Darkstar001]

If eating meat is a choice, I ask why do people choose cruelty. Vegan food is delicious, healthy and far better for the planet. I wish people would step up and make the transition. I guess its easier to just be a follower.

[@CRneu]

Psychology Today has written a few articles about the reasons people dont/wont go vegan. It basically boils down to sunk cost and society pressuring people, especially in western countries. If people go vegan they have to admit they were doing something pretty bad, which a lot of people simply don't want to do.

[@Diseasesexplained]

I am proud Jain

[@foodhistory1387]

Love your work, guys! Another great vid. We are to expect a new one soon?

[@OTRontheroad]

Tuesday!

[@LtZetarn]

Buddhism is believed in the way of the balance. buddhism didn't forbid anyone from eating meat or forcing their follower to go full vegan only or not eating foods at all. Vegan pratice and Fasting (not eat anything at all) is the same of extremism believes and it's not how the "balance" is.

[@ilakya]

I hate those I personally call "hoovegan" that condemned anyone who eats meat. And I hate western vegan foods. Why do we force people to live miserable lives eating those tasteless foods when we can eat better? As a Thai. I really love jay foods just because it's delicious and would have it every day if it could be found and not bothering others. Couldn't we just live happily while the others around us are happy too?

[@ashissethi1068]

Bro sounds like navratri?!!

[@d1kobraz]

Lol. Nice T-Shirt! Greetings from Russia!

[@OTRontheroad]

Hah thanks! A gift from Daria’s sister when they came to visit. If you are new to the channel, check out our Pattaya video, did a long part on Russian food/culture in Thailand

[@mamashinecalma2165]

❤️❤️❤️

[@TsunamiWombat]

Vegetarian and Vegan food that is good because it tastes good and those foods are good is... good. Amused to see the video's title acknowledge Veganism is a religion, though.

[@jiggy3s]

The Tamil food you showed in Thailand was Brahmin food not jain. There are hardly any jains in tamilnadu. I remember being in thaIland during the month of vegetarianism in Buddhism but even the idea of vegetarianism was alien to most thais, I haven't seen any Buddhist vegetarian cultures. Vegetarianism is a brahminical concept. Of purse the jains are even more strict but main stream vegetarianism is due to brahminic culture. While now a days the brahminical version of vegetarianism is not as strict as jains and some even eat meat.... vegetarianism is basically a brahminical concept and hence the reverence for cows which provides milk to their diet..it's not pure vegan but lacto vegan

[@aoibhealfae]

wow.... you guys ate stink beans. That's very impressive. On the level of tolerating budu and tempoyak (fermented durian).

[@OTRontheroad]

Please watch our video on the Stink Beans! Sataw is literally my favorite thing in existence. We did a whole video on the topic. (EDIT) We also did one on Khao Yam (Budu)

[@larsmathiesen8999]

As a Thai food fan and lover of history I always drool over these fantastic OTR deepdive into a rabbit hole :) But as a Greenlander I must say that in Inuit culture the only thing close to vegan food is when you catch an arctic grouse you ring its neck, put its butt to your mouth and squeeze its body and enjoy a warm herbal tea. Should be very delicious and healthy with nice flavors of heather and heather berries :)

[@vg3971]

Jainism didn't start around 500 BC by Mahavir Swami. He was 24th Tirthankar in the line, which goes back to 1st one as Adinath who lived thousands of years before 24th one Mahavir Swami. I seriously think that you need to do proper research on the subject and not rely on what it feeds you immediately online. Dig deeper to find proper truth as many time truth is overcast by false narratives flooding online.

[@OTRontheroad]

Consider this your final warning- troll any more videos and you're going to get blocked. Again- facts are facts. I don't deal in mythology, I deal in archeological and written evidence.

[@jaiku99]

Hey, this is not a research paper. It’s a KZbin food channel. He has done more than enough research for this topic. Don’t be rude dude.

[@rightlibertarian4412]

😋❤

[@mencken8]

There’s no “war,” religious or otherwise. I eat what I like, and if others wish to eat the food my food eats, well and good.

[@Patrick-yc3tf]

All of it comes down to compassion. We all want to live in peace. Killing unecessarily for food is the first ever discrimination and violence to a child in a time when we know we don't need animal muscle fibre to thrive.

[@tarjei99]

Apparently heart disease and other life style diseases is associated with food with a high glycenic index. In other words; plant food.

[@SamithaSumedha]

first of all I get some records straight that's why I am writing this comment here.... I'm a born Therawada Buddhist from a really reputed Buddhist family with the history of about 500 years so I feel I am more than qualified to give some contextual facts about this video that I feel that is incorrect according to the therawada Buddhist scripture.... Sir you are implying that load Buddha has had wild boar as his final meal before his passing and I beg to differ on this matter ask this claim is sexually incorrect even according to four and a half Millenia old therawada Buddhist scriptures.... in fact the Buddhist text say as this, the Lord Buddha had his last meal as he was already weak at that moment in time and about 3 months before he had already released his "ayu sanskara" that means he had already decided that he will let go of the last connections to his life and after that in 3 months time he will pass away.... so ask for this fact first of all he had expressed that he will pass away in 3 months so the final meal is only the last reason of his passing.... so the second fact is Lord Buddha had eaten a food item called "Sukara maddawa" as his last meal that was given by that Goldsmith.... so as for the interpretation of the original pali language of so many Buddhist Scholars agree on this that "SUKARA MADDAWA" is a type of a mushroom that is associated with pigs or Pig farming.... there are two common ideas about what kind of a mushroom is this.... first one is there were this type of a mushroom that is grown in mud puddles that has been created by pigs hence called Sukara Maddawa as the word Sukara in pali language literally means Pig.... and the second idea and most believable one is these mushrooms are a type of wild truffles which was believed to be grown in North Indian latitudes that Buddha lived.... as we all know truffles are really directly associated with pigs as for thousands of years pigs were used to sniff out riped truffles only to be replaced by trained dogs in the middle of the last century buy French.... I say this must be true because Lord Buddha died from a food poisoning and in all the cultures in South Asia cook wild boar and most not all of mushrooms thoroughly before eating.... but only exception even today is truffles.... even today they are shaven on the top not cooked in any way most of the time and eaten completely Raw.... so these factors point out that even at that time wild truffles were a rare delicacy only reserved for rich, so as hey Goldsmith obviously he must be rich and could afford the best quality high-end wild truffles that has been brought from Pig herders which in the wild should have trained their pigs to sniff out pricey wild truffles..... and the Goldsmith obviously presented his level best when it comes to food for the Lord Buddha not knowing that the raw truffles that he is presenting eventually will lead to the demise of Lord Buddha himself.... so that's about that.... and in the common context in therawada Buddhism there are no restrictions to a meet based diet but Lord Buddha has shown that there will be consequences when it comes to eating meats and having a lust for taste of meat will hinder your Journey towards enlightenment..... there are much more information about this and could definitely provide more information in the future comments if needed....

[@OTRontheroad]

Thanks for writing but please understand- this is a story that has a TON of history and documentation. Your interpretation is one belief that we read about and considered, and I do respect it, however it is the minority interpretation even among scholars. What we explained in this video is the consensus among approximately 95% of historians as I’m sure you’re aware- it doesn’t mean it’s correct and please know I mean no disrespect towards your beliefs and knowledge, but it does mean that I feel comfortable with what we presented and will fully stand behind it.

[@sagard.yenchilwar1379]

totally agreed why would a person who have left his throne and a life of luxary to persue truth will contradict his ideals for a piece of meat ... i mean even if buddhist monks are forbid from eating meat slaughtered for them but can consume one which is not specifally slaughtered for there consumption in bhiksha [ i believe it reflects regardless of what is offered mere sustainance is the goal] but in todays age its just this buddhists do not resonate wirth this core meaning ,i do think something like this is the case ... for example this stories take place in foothills of himalayas temperate region favourable with mushrooms and it is not farfetched to have some mushrooms which are specifically associated with boars ,,,pigs are known to forage for food in the wild, and they have a keen sense of smell that allows them to locate various types of food, including truffles. so i do think theres that

[@SamithaSumedha]

@@OTRontheroad I do not know personally where you got your information from but there is no direct evidence from anywhere that load Buddha had ever eaten any meat or in that matter a wild boar as a final meal also.... if you need more further confirmation about this claim you could definitely contact sri lanka pali and Buddhist University which happens to be quite nearby to my current location also and Sri Lankan Buddhist information center.... you could definitely Google those places for yourself and contact them and definitely could confirm this claims as the wild boar theory is false.... Sri Lanka is the current governing body about Therawada Buddhist information and even monks and preachers from Thailand come down to study Buddhism extensively in Sri Lanka so the wild boar theory about Lord Buddha is totally unfounded and speculative as my above informative original comment suggests.... in Buddhism and talking about Buddhism no one cannot offend Buddhism in any way and we do not take any offense by anyone because factually and literally the practices and theory about Buddhism is the most factually accurate religion in the world right now.... we as Buddhists know that by observing and adhering to the teachings of Lord Buddha will and already is improving human Minds to levels that was unparalleled in any religion and Buddhist Meditation and the practices can do that for you and it's scientifically proven at this moment in time.... so something as trivial and insignificant as what load Buddha has eaten for his last meal is all but irrelevant in the larger context of Buddhism so just because of that fact misinterpretations like this will not Ever offend us true Buddhists because some misinformed claim will not corrupt the core values of Buddhism... I just wrote this down to just to set the records straight about the factuality of the claim that you have made and that's was the sole purpose of this comment threat nothing more nothing less!!!

[@SamithaSumedha]

@@sagard.yenchilwar1379 definitely I definitely second your opinion and in fact there are only one instance that Lord Buddha had allowed to eat meat to a Buddhist monk.... if the monk was alone in dark jungles meditating and he became possessed with some dark demonic Force (of course as Buddhists we believe in non-human beings sometimes really powerful and could kill you if nothing it's done about it and there are so many stories in Buddhist scripture about this kind of situations) it's only at that moment if that possessed Monk is requesting for raw meat or live animals for its flesh it is the only occasion that Lord Buddha had allowed his followers to eat meat and this is directly indicated in Therawada "Winaya pitaka" of Thripitaka one of the most vulnerable Buddhist scriptures that explains the code of conduct for Buddhist monks.... you could definitely copy and paste this keywords and find this claims and verify this yourself if you are interested.... mind you I have to say this clearly there are no restrictions to eat meat in therawada Buddhism but as I have explained on my original comment there will be consequences if you eat meat continuously and you get addicted to it.... and I have to clarify this out also there is no Jainism in Sri Lanka and the Buddhism in Sri Lanka has not ever been corrupted by Jainism after it came to Sri Lanka and that's why it is said that current headquarters of Therawada Buddhism is Sri Lanka.... and he explained about five precepts and the 8 precepts were copied from Jainism to Buddhism and I do not believe that at all because the 8 precepts has been in Buddhism from the start... of course there might be commonalities between Buddhism and Jainism because the day of the Jaine monument at the time of the Lord Buddha had a direct rivalry with Lord Buddha and the Buddhist scripture extensively Remark that for the whole of Buddhism in general.... as I know it's because of the courtesy that was given by Kings towards Buddhism and losing to Buddhism is not an option for the Jaine preachers..... PS - I have just read in the comment that you have also mentioned about that "Thrikotika parishudda mansha" (ත්‍රිකෝටික පාරිශුද්ධ මාංශය in sinhala language) in this theorythe monk has to confirm that the meat was not slaughtered for him in three ways.... so as you happen to know about this I don't think there should be a thoroug explanation needed on this matter....

[@juamu1132]

oyster is vegan. fight me!!!!

[@someguy2135]

Oysters with the last animal product that I consumed before going fully vegan. Since then I have learned that as far as science can determine oysters are not sentient but some vegans worry that they may discover that they are at some point. I was considering going back to eating oysters instead of the algae based Omega-3 supplements that I take in order to save money but I worry about what the oysters consume that may bioaccumulate and affect my health. I also noticed when I stopped eating oysters that I had fewer symptoms of inflammation. Some meat eaters claim that it is impossible to thrive on a purely plant-based diet but they never address the idea that they could get those nutrients from oysters. It would remove an excuse they are clinging to.