Oztent RV5 Review

[@RD-lf6tp]

Thanks for the honest, practical review. One thing i would have probably skipped if i purchase one would be the floor piece for under the awning - your recommendation to get one makes a lot of sense.

[@OTWD]

Hi R D, glad it was useful and greatly appreciate you writing such a kind review. Best of luck deciding on a new camp shelter :D !!

[@benlux2625]

Great video, I’ve had my rv3 for 15 years now and still going strong 👍

[@OTWD]

That's awesome. Here's to another 15 years. Thanks for watching mate 😬😬

[@simo2601]

This is such a great review, I just pulled the trigger and finally bought one after seeing your awesome little family using it exactly how I plan to.

[@OTWD]

Thanks Simon, hope you have some excellent family adventures! Our family has grown by one now. Still liking the oztent :D

[@MisterWeal]

Epic showing of the RV-5 thank you. Convinced me to get the RV-5 Plus and a floor mat. Cheers Bro 🤙🏼

[@OTWD]

Sorry for delay. You won't look back - hope you have a great time with the tent. Happy camping!

[@user-vu9hs5zu9y]

Thanks for taking the time to make this video, excellent review!!

[@OTWD]

You are welcome. Thanks heaps for watching

[@neilmitchelhill9388]

I have had my RV5 for 12plus years and it is still my favourite (also have hiking tent, swagger, 2 x swags, 3 sizes of wild camp awnings and a camper trailer 🥲). I leave the fly on permanently and use the RV5 option when 4wd is close and2 of us, or staying more than 2 nights. Good review

[@OTWD]

Hi Neil, thanks heaps for watching! and Thanks for commenting and the encouragement. Man after my own heart...with a collection of simple camping setups. I'm considering getting an RV3 for when I head 4WDing with just 1 adult and 1 kid. Cheers

[@jean-christophedupont5652]

Many thanks for this great review. We are getting rid of our off road trailer, and I think the RV5 plus will work perfectly for our trips. Your review helped sway our decision.

[@OTWD]

Can't go wrong I reckon. Great to see people downsizing/simplifying, hopefully it works out and you can carry on making great memories. Thanks for the encouragement, glad it was valuable!😬

[@1970groupie]

Very happy with my rv3plus. I also have the 2 side panels which for me are worth the added expense. They help keep bad weather out, while offering good ventilation, and add privacy if you want it. Very easy to install too. I don't see a need for a front panel, I prefer to leave the front open for the views and for cooking.

[@OTWD]

Glad to hear you are loving your RV3 like we love our RV5. We don't use the front panel unless we have a specific reason too - the outlook at the front of the tent is the best part. Thanks for watching and commenting 😀

[@chappie7523]

Smart idea with the S-Biner. I’ve used a small luggage lock when we’ve gone away from camp. Thieves are looking for quick and easy

[@OTWD]

Good idea. I think you are right - often a simple deterrent like that could stop an opportunistic offender. Another viewer suggest a cat bell on the zip/S-biner - another genius idea. Good for keeping track if family are getting up at night to do business aswell. Cheers Chappie !!

[@gregdogg10]

The front awning rolls up like you did not designed to zip down the front, that’s for the side walls. To clean/dry the bottom when packing up, whilst the tent is still up, flip it onto the door side. The frame is flat and allows you to dry out the bottom

[@OTWD]

Hi Greg, Thanks for the advice and taking time to comment! Yep, the zips are designed for walls, but work well with securing down the awning too - we've been in inclement weather and felt this was worth doing. Cheers, Dan

[@gregdogg10]

@@OTWD or just roll it up like it’s designed

[@petercrispin2129]

Thanks for the tip

[@TheImageRevelation]

have had one for 10 years will zip fly on for first time this year to preserve roof , bullet proof in storms ( cyclones ) , only guyed out twice

[@OTWD]

Awesome! Glad you have had a great experience with it. 10 years is a while for a tent. We've found that it holds up in heavy winds as long as the guide ropes are well placed! Thanks for watching.

[@conellisgreatadventure8864]

We stick a fishing bell on and around our zips overnight. I do a lot of fishing and very tuned to the noise

[@OTWD]

That's a really good idea. I'm gonna do this. Will probably share in a later video. Thanks heaps.

[@mjfalcon007]

Thank you so much for your very thorough review and helpful tips for setting up and putting away. I met a young family this week at our local caravan park who has one of these and the HX Screen and I took an interest in it. This was a helpful video

[@OTWD]

Cheers Michael, appreciate you watching and taking the time to comment :) ...Once you learn about these tents...it kind of stays on your mind, until you end up getting one! Sorry for planting the seed. Happy camping!

[@diannefarrell7715]

This review is very informative. I'm thinking of purchasing this tent to use between selling my current camper and buy my next one...

[@caver6292]

Great review of features, pros and cons! And you are now officially an enabler! I did not know that there was a fly available to fit this tent (I own one that gets attached to my Batwing when extra friends come along) so I just placed an order for one...(OzTent should give you a bit of credit for that sale! LOL) Thank you from Florida!

[@OTWD]

Glad you found the video useful - it still takes me back thinking about my videos reaching people on the other side of the globe - Hello from Victoria Australia! Sorry to make you spend more of your hard earned money!! It's worth it though😬

[@cstout1634]

A little late to the review but youve help me out. Thanks for the explanation!

[@OTWD]

Thanks Charles, did I convince you to get one? We haven't looked back. Thanks for watching :)

[@emredenk]

Hello there, quick question. In hot summer night, I felt like fly stopping air circulation. If you dont use tent in day time is there any other point other than protecting it?

[@OTWD]

Reduces condensation. Tent get's less wet in rain - easier to maintain the canvas and faster airing out at home. Thanks for watching mate. Sorry for late reply, needed to take a break for a bit. Cheers

[@denniscalvert3390]

I know this vid is two years old, but the easy way to clean the floor is to set it up and push the tent forward with the front on the ground, if windy just peg down the front.

[@OTWD]

Hi Dennis, sorry for delay. Thanks heaps for correcting me on this😬. In another video on the channel named "Sharing YOUR Oztent Tricks and Advice!!" I expressed the better way. Best wishes. Cheers

[@Fivegeeee]

Great video mate appreciate the effort you put in

[@OTWD]

Glad you liked it and thanks for commenting!! Cheers

[@reneecopeland1095]

Great review! Thank you

[@OTWD]

Welcome! Thanks so much Renee.

[@fourbyforester]

Useful! Excellent review!

[@OTWD]

Thanks heaps for watching and leaving such kind feedback! :)

[@davidfromdownunder]

Great review mate, had the full set up myself with peaked side panels / front panel about 8 years ago and loved it. In the end had to move it on purely due to the packed length and weight. Purchased the Jet Tent f30x with all panels (by Oztent) which had it's pros for walk in head room but again cons due to packed down weight & 1500mm length. Between the two I owned a Darche AT6 Air Volution but it was MASSIVE and a real pain in the ar$e to put up particularly on my own or even with two people. All these tents were overkill for me and the Mrs so hence we all now looking at the smaller Darche AT4 for a much simpler set up and pack down but I must say I really miss the ease of putting up and packing down an RV / RX Oztent so perhaps we may return in the future. Anyway great video, will be sure to check out that spot if anywhere down in VIC should we get there someday, it looks magic! Little inside scoop for you in return being from Brisbane check out Teewah or Freshwater in Cooloola NP (just across the river to Noosa Northshore from Tewantin) miles and miles of beach to explore. It's the gateway to Fraser Island without the huge costs involved of going over from Rainbow Beach (Inskip Point) or Hervey Bay. Anyway if you are ever up this way with your young family check it out it's the most cost effective beach 4WD / Camping experience to have in SE QLD and its one of the best spots you'll ever explore. Not only that the you'll have heaps of beach to drive well past 3 hours either side of tide and its not thick and boggy dry sand that you'll get at our other well known sand beach 4WDriving hot spots of Moreton Island, Bribie Island and Fraser (K'gari) Just word of warning avoid peak times of school holidays in particular Easter / Xmas as it's a carpark! Mid week outside of school holidays (March - mid May) or early October - early December) is best. Mate if you want more info don't hesitate to reach out as I enjoy helping fellow sensible campers out where I can with local knowledge. Have a good one 👍

[@OTWD]

Hi David, So sorry for taking so long to reply, I'm so grateful for you taking the time to leave such a thoughtful and generous response. As per a recent post in my community tab, I wasn't aware people were commenting on this video - DOH!! Sounds like an ~RV3 for just the two of you may be a winner? The air tents are a good idea in theory, but nothing seems to beat the rugged simplicity of the Oztent RV. I recently bought an Oztent RS-1(mini RV but swag size), for my solo trips or with my daughter too (we got + son since this video was made!), and its also bulky as, makes me wonder whether I might as well take the RV5 everywhere. Thanks for the hot tips on QLD beach spots. I have relatives on Sunshine coast, so a trip that way is definitely on the cards in the near future - I will be sure to reach out and appreciate those tips. My wife and I went to Lady Elliot Island for our honeymoon and we feel an attraction to that QLD landscape! Thanks again mate.

[@michellebissell2099]

Great review thanks!!! Definitely6 buying one of these :)

[@OTWD]

You are welcome, Michelle, glad it was helpful ! Thanks for watching

[@chris.m3194]

Very Very informative! Thanks heaps

[@OTWD]

You are welcome, Chris. Thanks for watching and good luck!😬

[@davidnelson2369]

Great video mate, cheers

[@OTWD]

Appreciate you watching mate! Sorry for the delay in replying. Happy camping! Dan

[@koostwee]

A fourth target audience for the RV tents in my opinion is the solo traveller, because of the ease of setting it up solo.

[@OTWD]

Good call. Met a bloke today (recognised me in Total Tools store from my Oztent videos!) and he just bought an Oztent RV5 to spread out in by himself. I reckon I'd go the RV3 for that, but atleast he'll have room. Infact... thinking about the RV3for trips where it's just me and one or two of the kids 😬

[@aleksbencun4339]

cracking review dan .. youve just sold the RV 4 to me

[@OTWD]

Damn, wish I was making a commission! Cheers Aleks, glad it was useful mate. Thanks heaps for commenting.

[@nevillecartwright7292]

Thanks for your video mate! I have 2 x RV5 tents and just love them! Kids in one, wife and I in the other - works a treat! I agree that the only real negative is the awkward size. Thankfully I have a Patrol with a full-size roof rack which holds them no problem. Greetings from South Africa

[@OTWD]

You are welcome Neville, thanks heaps for watching! 2 x oztent would be a great setup, do you find carting the bedding in and out a hassle? Are they readily available in SA? best wishes!

[@nevillecartwright7292]

@@OTWD thank you for your reply! My biggest bugbear is indeed setting up the stretchers and the bedding! 🤣🤣Nevertheless, once they're up, we all sleep very well! The Oz Tent range and all it's accessories are available in SA, but being premium quality, are expensive. I was happy to pay the premium though, and have not regretted my purchases. Greetings back to you mate!

[@kennygravey]

I would have put the pole on the back of fly under neath the fly to keep it nice and straight just my OCD

[@mitchfittock6531]

Good video mate

[@OTWD]

Thanks heaps Mitch! Appreciated!

[@richardduke9788]

Good information ! Thanks 😊!

[@OTWD]

Bloody welcome! Thanks for watching and taking time to comment :D

[@TDXAV]

Cheers for the detailed review! I'm keen to know if the RV5 still suits your needs with two kids? Mine are 1 and 4, so the tent is no use to me if the whole family (and I guess luggage) doesn't fit. Also, any issues with setting it up on sand?

[@OTWD]

Hi TDXAV, sorry for delay mate. We have ~1 and 3, so similar ages! Its still good for us Its easier to handle/setup/packup with two people, many hands make light work. I bring this up because, its not that simple when you pull up at camp after driving a while, and you want the kids to sit still. I think this challenge will happen with any tent, or multiple swags, or roof top tent with awning room. There will be some challenge there. 4 years old may be a great age to learn about hammering in pegs, so that helps! We all fit inside fine, suggest just need to check widths of mattresses you use, or stretchers. We have Zempire Monstamats, and it really only fits three 'king singles' across. Our son is still in a separate portacot so we are OK , it all fits just. Once the kids are a bit older, we will probably get a camping bunk bed, check out Disc-O-Bed Kid-O-Bunk, expensive but I've heard good things. This will allow plenty of room inside. Basically we line up the beds and have some room for bags and getting changed at the entry end as you walk in (a small duffle bag each no problem). Everything fits in the back of the Prado OK, but we are looking at getting a trailer- We have run out of room and the packup /setup is just too intensive/impractical. To clarify, we will keep using the oztent when we start camping with a trailer - so yep it still suits us. In sand, recommend having the mesh floor saver, its designed to let sand fall through it, but not come up through. It will save the kids getting heaps of sand in the tent, and make the awning area more usable. The PVC bucket floor of the tent means you wont have any issues. Oh and don't forget your trusty dust pan and brush :D Cheers mate

[@chadmcmartin791]

I'm in the same boat. I also have a 1 & 4yr old. I think I'll get the RV5 with additional enclosed front room. That way we can sleep in the tent and store bags in the front room. Great Review by the way.

[@noccer]

Terrific review, thanks a lot, helped me decide on which model I wanted to buy. Went for an RX5 in the end due to the zip in flooring. I really would like one of those spreader bars for the fly sheet but am finding it hard to stomach $60 shipping to Victoria for a $45 tent pole 😆 ☘

[@OTWD]

Glad you found it useful :) Thanks for watching. Yeah...camping gear can be a money pit, and easy to fall into traps! Maybe keep an eye out and see if you can get a deal one day - keep an eye on marketplace too, etc. I reckon that spreader is worth it. Interested to hear how you (and the family?) like the RX5. Happy camping😬

[@noccer]

@@OTWD thanks, I trawl marketplace a lot! Recently, I bought a few spreaders from ALDI for just $13 each. However, I've noticed that these spreaders don't have the same independent end swivel feature as the Oztent ones. Instead, they fix rotationally using the telescopic mechanism. So, when twist-locking them, I'll need to ensure that the spigots align with the holes. Despite this, at the affordable price of $13, I'm determined to make them work, I might even modify them a little with a glued/tied double eye swivel link at 1 end ✌️

[@RogerCampillo]

Great review. Probably the best one I’ve watched. I’m considering it. Hopefully you can help me to take a decision. I have a 1,5 year old son, and I was thinking on a rooftop tent for aloud 4x4 adventures, but I find the OZTent very convenient for my needs. Of course both the rtt and the OZTent have its pros & cons. I really like the rtt way, but now I’m not sure if the oz tent will fit better my needs. What do you think? Thanks!

[@OTWD]

Hi Roger, thanks for watching - I will answer this question later today, just been snowed under mate!

[@OTWD]

Hi Roger! Thanks for waiting for my response mate. If you want to have the absolute fastest setup possible, then a hardshell rooftop tent will be best, because you can probably fit your bedding inside. The key downsides are increasing the centre of gravity - more wear on vehicle over time, and more chance of rollover...not to mention losing roof space. The oztent will be lighter (approx 3-4 times lighter) at the expense of setting and packing up bedding each use, and ofcourse extra time pitching the tent. A hardshell rooftop comparable in quality to the oztent, I have found to be 4 - 5 times the price of the oztent. This is why I like the oztent so much. So much room, les weight, less cost. Lastly, I consider safely, I would not trust my 3YO on a rooftop ladder by herself, and Im sure she will will want to climb up/down all day long if the ladder in view, especially when I am not looking!!! So wonderful to hear you have a young family like me, but ideally you dont want to spend this money over and over with an ever changing setup - before the rooftrop seems ideal, you will go through a phase it is probably quite dangerous to your young ones. I remove that risk for our kids by sticking with the oztent, and focus on ways to make the oztent more convenient to setup, and make the bedding easy to set up. I think one day for us a good rooftop will be better, but with young kids, would keep it over and over. Hope this helps mate. Thanks so much for your kind encouragement. best wishes. Dan

[@RogerCampillo]

Hi Dan!! Many thanks for your reply it’s very useful. I honestly didn’t think about the risk of the ladder and the kid looking for to climb it, but that’s a good point. Yeah, I know all the implications on the vehicle carried by having the rtt, and it’s mainly why I started the research of good alternatives. I’ve been free camping with and without ground tent my hole life so the setup/pickup times are not a concern to me. Having the 4x4 I was thinking on a traditional book style rtt because the setup time is ok for me and having a family I see more advantages compared to a hardshell rtt, mainly the space and usability with bad weather. But honestly after watch your review of the OZTent I started to change mind. Your experience with the tent and family gives a quite different perspective. I also have 2 dogs (boxers) that we want to carry with us and the OZTent would make it way easier that a rtt. Many thanks for you feedback mate!! If you plan to visit Spain anytime don’t hesitate to write me!!

[@RogerCampillo]

@@OTWD last question. How much do you recommend to purchase the hole setup? So tent+fly+complete deluxe side and front panels?

[@OTWD]

@@RogerCampillo Oh wow! Spain! No plans mate, but I will keep that in mind for sure! The reach of the internet is truly amazing :D With two boxers, I'd recommend the Oztent even more. Whether they are inside, in the front enclosed room, or just outside but still at ground level, I'd definitely feel better compared to sleeping on the roof. Best to keep everyone and pets together securely - that's how I think about it. With regards to upgrades, I would do it in this order - mesh floor saver, fly, side walls, front wall, but it depends on your needs. I just did it one bit at a time when I saw each part on special. It may be hard to compare prices, but I paid approx 2000-25000 AUD for the whole setup. Hope this helps mate. Sounds like you have a great family life and best wishes getting out camping.

[@andrewcarr3650]

Easy to dry the underside. Get it home, pop it up in 30 seconds and flip it onto the front face. Just remember to peg it down!

[@OTWD]

Good call..I figured this out eventually😅. And yep, I've had some toppling tents drying....in surprisingly low winds too! Sorry for taking a while to reply, Andrew. Thanks heaps for watching mate!

[@xxsteve]

Nice review mate!! I’ve got the RX-5 but interested to k ow more about the ‘crab spreader pole’ would the spreader pole not go on the underside of the fly like the awning ones? I’ve found when windy the fly can be a bit flappy/noisy. Also what were the awning poles you got? That’s really good you can peg them down, recently had the awning skipping around in heavy winds! Cheers! Steve

[@OTWD]

Hi Steve, apologies for the delay mate😅 - I do respond to all comments, sometimes it takes me a while. These are some great questions. The poles (spreaders and the upright bent spigot/peggable foot) are made by SupaPeg in Aus. Drifta sell a kit made of these poles - enough to make the peak sides of awning with uprights, and two spreaders for the awning - search google 'Drifta Tent Pole Kit'. I put the awning spreaders on the underside of awning for convenience, and similarly I usually put the fly spreader on the outside because of convenience - to twist lock the pole underneath the fly would require crawling through underneath the fly at the back of the tent. It may be much of a muchness, depending on how good you are at pilates/stretching! - but its the habit I have gotten into. Having a crab claw spreader on the fly definitely helps keep it stable in high winds. Be sure to check out my other oztent video about the side walls + front panel - I show the poles there too. And keep your eyes peeled - later in 2023 I plan to do a video talking purely about the pole (Drifta) upgrades I use . Cheers and happy camping!!👍👍😁

[@EnShinNoi]

Excellent review. I really like the look of these tents but 2m packed! That's no good for me. I want something that will fit in the wagon, seats up. Back to the drawing board 🤔

[@OTWD]

It makes it worth buying a roof rack, if that helps - I like it that much ;) ? I haven't found anything more rugged and simple that fits in a wagon boot. Even if I do, that's valuable space for other gear! Thanks for the kind feedback Trissyboy! Glad you liked the video. If you have a small camping crew, then a simple dome tent might be the answer? Also, Drifta sell an aluminium plate that can be mounted to roof bars to support the tent along the whole length, if you dont have a full length roof rack (not cheap though!). Let me know what works out for you, a lot of this is like 'silver bullet' stuff, where there needs to be a compromise, because we 'can't have everything'. Best wishes mate :D

[@EnShinNoi]

I ended up with a Blackwolf Turbo 300. Fits sideways in the boot very snugly. Already taken it out for a spin and it went well. I have two large dogs so I made the improvement of lining the entire tent floor with foam gym tiles.

[@jaredmarriner1689]

Hey mate. What size Crab Claw did you get to spread the Fly?

[@OTWD]

Hi Jared, sorry mate, took a break, back now. Same width as the tent - so same as the front awning ones. Check out Drifta website info on it. The RV5 is a bit wider than the 3 and 4 so needs a slightly wider spreader.

[@eurotoura]

Great review and answered so many of my questions. Would you consider it useful to back a 4x4 up to the awning to give shelter for cooking or to keep dry when accessing stuff from the rear of the vehicle? Enjoy your family camping guys you look to have a great set up😊 my question is because my use is for the UK and Europe where sadly the weather is as I am sure you know to be colder and wetter than in Aus😢

[@OTWD]

Hello! Thanks for the kind message. Camping warms the soul, doesn't it? I think you can get it wetter and colder over there, but here in Melbourne we can have four seasons in one day! I'm sorry it took so long to get back to you! I reckon it can absolutely be used with a vehicle butted up to the awning. What vehicle do you have? Considering the height of the boot door, I think there is enough height adjustment in the stock tent package to get it all under the awning comfortably- but maybe it will require longer poles if your vehicle is lifted, or you have an upward lifting boot hinge. I've got a shelter system made by Drifta Stockton called the HexaTarp (copied from the snow peak hexa tarp), this would be more ideal for butting your vehicle up to, then have the RV butted up to it aswell - I believe they distribute in Europe - this might be worth some research! Thanks again :)

[@eurotoura]

Hi Dan. Thanks for the advice. I have a Range Rover L405 and think it may be to tall, but will certainly look into the alternative tarp you suggest.Enjoy your camping guys and look forward to your future posts 👍 Paul.

[@mytennisinstinct]

Best way to carry an Oztent rv4 on a sedan with roof racks? I saw you mentioned a drifta roof rack but I live too far from anyone who supplies them

[@OTWD]

Just need to support the tent along the ~2m length so there are more that a few points of contact (ie. It's not recommended to put straight onto roof bars with 2 points of contact) On the video sharing video comments (where i mentioned the drifta carrier), someone suggested using a ladder. You may need to get creative 😬

[@MrBarksone]

Mate just wondering if its cheaper to get the extra spreader poles from say BCF instead of getting the drifta kit? The drifta kit is $230

[@OTWD]

Hi J, looks like most similar aluminium poles available are ~$30 each for an upright, and ~$40 for a spreader. The drifta kit has the larger bent spigot, and the peggable foot (and are twist lock) - which I can't see from any of the other big retailers - this is what I like about the drifta set. Apart from buying direct from supapeg (aussie made who supply drifta) or buying the parts separately and modifying supapeg poles yourself, the kit seems expensive but I think its reasonable value when you consider the price of the 6 poles + an aussie made canvas bag. Its an investment for sure but I'm glad we did it. Another way to consider it - The oztent comes with 2 poles already, and if you buy the side walls (see my other video kzbin.info/www/bejne/rZbMoHd4msyZe8k) you get two more uprights and one spreader. If you were considering the side walls this is a good way to get the extra poles, then you can buy one extra spreader separate to complete the set if needed. To get the peak for the cheapest price and If you aren't interested in the side walls, you could buy two uprights and one spreader separately, this would allow you to make the peak, spreader across on the peak, then buy the second spreader if you need it down the track. Good luck, let me know if you come across anything else different/interesting. Cheers

[@frankmcdonald147]

Is it possible to leave the fly attached permanently? Just thinking about saving setup time. Grey vid 😊

[@OTWD]

Excellent question. I haven't tried it! I think if you are careful and you manage (ie tie up) the guy ropes, it should fit in the bag. More chance in the Drifta bag than the standard bag. Since posting video have also seen Kelmatt third party bag which looks bigger too. Thanks heaps for watching and the kind feedback :)

[@rowdy5697]

Yes, you can leave it attached. Another tip for packing the tent into the bag is instead of picking the tent up and trying to stuff the tent in the bag, pick the bag up, place it over the tent and then flip the bag. Makes life a lot easier.

[@j8rimoon]

Hi does the oztent need to be seasoned before first use?

[@OTWD]

Hi Jay! I would season it before first use, but if the weather looks fine when camping....as long as its done before decent rain it should be fine :) Best wishes

[@SgtsTanTaco]

What kind of chairs are those??

[@OTWD]

Sorry for delay, took a break. Either a Jet Tent Pilot, or Helinox Chair 2, depending on which one you mean.

[@antony3678]

Appears to be a very expensive pain in the ar$e. 30 second tent that takes hours of extra setup! 😅😅😅😅😅 I couldn't justify the cost for the size and weight when packed and all the stuffing around to setup for a long stay. Plus it's made in Ch!na 😮😮😮

[@OTWD]

I love it - lighter than a caravan or trailer for us. Extra setup is optional, but honestly doesn't take us long. Fair enough opinion, what do you recommend instead?