Busting a Common Bike MYTH

Why buying a bike on doing the "crotch" test can lead to bad fitting bikes.
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[@aquariumsfishmore]

I wish so many people would understand what you are saying. I have one road bike that’s a 54 that I can stand over perfectly and the “cockpit” is perfect. On the next bike I bought I went with a 58 because in smaller sizes of that bike was too cramped. I can stand over it but it does touch my man parts. I’ve had so many people see me stopped on it and say “Your riding too big of a bike!” If they would only understand how comfortable it is when riding.

[@davefeldman3740]

Remember proportions--different bike brands have different top tube vs seat tube lengths. Some are designed for Spiderperson, others for human bassett hounds.

[@anotheryoutuber_]

truths

[@dudeonbike800]

No, most bikes are designed for average body dimensions. There's variation, but it's pretty small. Otherwise, bike companies would be marketing bikes that don't fit the largest market segment. And that tends to be men. Men tend to have longer torsos and shorter legs compared to women. This is why many women felt WAY TOO STRETCHED OUT on traditional bike geometries.

[@markreams3192]

I have to disagree. Stand over clearance is safety issue. You should definitely have at least one inch of clearance. Two is better. Your nuts will thank you for it if you get into an emergency situation. Having your bars above the saddle with no drop isn’t really a standard fit for gravel or road bikes. While there’s nothing wrong with that position, production bike’s won’t do what you want fit wise. Most bespoke bike builders will do custom geometry to fit your needs for an up charge, of course. One such company is Co Motion in Eugene OR. There are many others. Don’t sacrifice safety for ride comfort. Get a bike that’s safe and fits all your needs.

[@Lamefoureyes]

Bahahahahaha

[@chris1275cc]

@@markreams3192 No, what your nuts (and the rest of your nether regions) "will thank you for" in the long run, is not being crushed against the nose of your saddle caused by riding a frame that's too small. If you are in an emergency and you happen to be pushed forward off both the saddle and the pedals 1 or 2 inches of clearance won't make a difference you are still going to be listening to Tchaikovsky. In an emergency stop situation you just don't dismount that way. Even if it really was for "safety" having little to no stand over is still better than riding around uncomfortable on the saddle causing soft tissue and potential nerve damage all the time, just on the off chance you get into accident.

[@thezonemtb]

Standover is extremely important for my 4'10" wife and has way fewer options when you get into the higher end bikes. Fortunately more companies are starting to understand there is a market for people under 5' tall that don't want a beginner bike.

[@Thinkrock]

Rodriguez bikes will make her a killer ride in her size.

[@dunkcyclist190]

I just swapped my 72yr old dad from his beloved Cross Check to a Bridge Club for some extra swing room, sloped top tubes helped him out a lot.

[@mikebikercanada]

Thanks for sharing this. I just sized up a couple months ago for the first time ever with my new Salsa Cutthroat, but started doubting my decision. Really nice to hear your opinion. Very reassuring. Keep these great videos coming. Mike

[@davetbassbos]

When you come to a stoplight, you're supposed to do a trackstand and sneak peeks at all the squares waiting at the stoplight (on their feet, losers) to see how they impressed they are at your near walking on water feat.

[@event4216]

I still can't do a trackstand. Instead, I loop around rear wheel, ready to go.

[@The1trueDave]

Bonus points if you're actually not that good at trackstanding and end up inching across the lane trying to keep your balance and end up 8 feet over the stop line before the light turns green :-)

[@markysgeeklab8783]

I look at people track standing like that, while I balance sitting down one handed drinking my bottle... the most useful thing I learned from bike polo :)

[@motaparatu]

Hardly anybody walks around here, they all like to stay in their metal boxes. I still do track stands at lights when they aren't too long. It's okay to rest your junk on the top tube as long as it isn't painful. Personally I prefer step through frames, but you don't find them on "road" style bicycles.

[@The1trueDave]

@@motaparatu You can get mixte frames with drop bars but they are pretty rare (not really practical in aluminium and even less so in carbon so not a mass-market thing any more unfortunately).

[@davidcummings5826]

Thanks for the insight - VERY helpful! My wife has a very similar leg-torso ratio to you, Russ, and this is a very timely discussion as I’ve been perseverating over this precise topic while considering getting her a new bike (also the Sklar you featured in this video and a previous one!).

[@yazzmatazz86]

I don't know if I fully agree with this. I was riding on a road almost two years ago on a bike where I just about cleared the top tube. I lost my balance and during the fall bounced off the top tube instead of being able to readily plant my feet on the ground to regain control. I wouldn't recommend giving up standover and reduce safety.

[@SnakebitSTI]

That's what step-through frames are for. And while it's not what dropper posts are for, they are useful for putting both feet down.

[@yazzmatazz86]

@@SnakebitSTI Any bike with a generous stand over clearance or sloping top tube provides that benefit, not just step through bikes.

[@hippiebits2071]

I think the primary purpose of the bike deserves some consideration as well when making this decision. What might be fine on a bike used primarily for recreation could prove problematic for some in a dynamic urban commuting environment.

[@reeceholmes8546]

thanks Russ, I too am shortish, with back problems so I ride small frames and use a stem extender and swept back bars, works for me

[@patricksprojects]

Shorter inseam guy here. Personally I’ll never go above my inseam again. Had to bail once (no brakes) where my feet where fist to save me from practically going head first into a wall. Had a bruised groin for about a year and half. Never again lol.

[@CruiserBrah]

Absolutely true, my Giant Anthem it so much taller than all of my other bikes but once I am on, it is perfect for riding.

[@Michaelgroberts]

Nice nice 👌🏻 this is good advice! I’ve been thinking about replacing my lockdown, cobbled together “gravel” hybrid bike. It has always felt a smidge too long, so this could be part of my problem

[@riggseroni]

Super excited to see more content featuring the Super Something! The geo numbers for that bike look awesome. Might have to save my pennies for one of those...

[@Plexdet]

Honestly I just want a step through so bad

[@Korina42]

Soma makes a gorgeous mixte with all the fixin's.

[@Cobalt985]

If you are expecting any kind of load on the rear you will want to avoid step-through frames. Mid-steps are more than good enough for standover purposes. I have a step through and it gets wobbly when you load up the back end.

[@Korina42]

@@Cobalt985 That's what the front basket is for! 🙂

[@Ray.J]

Great video about an often misused or mistaken factor. Kudos!

[@nathanatkin1984]

Great explanation. I'd like a little more standover on my Rove but then it'd be far too short. Standover isn't really a big deal for the riding I do. Glad I got the size I did.

[@Frandaman84]

THANK YOU, I chose one size up cause I like how I look while riding the thing, I’m 5’8 but only riding 56, and it’s great, cause I’m also kinda scared of pedal strike, cause I think pedaling whilst turning also looks awesome

[@mikemaxwell2591]

Good video. I ride a frame much larger than my 28-inch inseam should be on, but I can stretch out while riding still seated. I climb well even seated, love it. A bike my proper size just feels so cramped. It is a road bike so hardly ever standing. Thanks, and be well. Subscribed!

[@mikespadafora9077]

Great advice that is so often ignored or poo pooed. The only things is that shorter stems can make the handling twitchy on fast descents

[@mavericklimsk]

Good tip. Thanks.

[@richardfuhrman5322]

This is a great video. I usually end up picking the larger frame, giving up a bit of standover height and seat post reveal. Smaller frame usually has me feeling cramped. I too like my bars even with my saddle or a tad higher. I recently purchased a Kona Sutra and was able to try a 52 and a 54. The standover was great on the 52, but even with slamming the saddle all the way back, and increasing the stem length, I couldn’t shake that cramped feeling. If I felt cramped on a test ride, it would have felt worse after many hours and miles on the bike.

[@jason200912]

If you're cramped. Set the seat all the way to the back and swap the stem to one that isn't 60mm long. Slamming the stem will also extend reach as well as increase aero of your body.

[@TheMirrorVision]

That Sklar is a beauty.

[@BrianRPaterson]

Too true. I care more about getting the reach right than standover. And I'm a big fan of sizing up a bit. I'm not as flexible as I was, but I find that leaning the bike makes getting a leg over easier. Cheers

[@moto_rad]

I love being over-biked. I am 5 9 and a 34 inseam. All legs and arms. The 'correct' size of bike for me generally has me leaned over very far even with the stem all the way up, because my saddle sits so high. Large bikes fit well, even one XL bike I have is a pleasure compared to any Mediums

[@richroberts8238]

You generally do great job with your informative videos. If these your personal bikes very interesting builds. No STI? Mech Disc up front and calipers at rear. Lots 1x. Nice gravel bars. All my current builds bar at least level if not higher than saddle. No suspension seatpost yet.

[@martj.1350]

I like how you discuss this topic from different sides without offering just one „correct solution“. As you mentioned, body proportions play a big role, but also mobility. I have a rather long inseam but a hard time stretching out into an long reach so I prefer my bikes on the shorter side with quite a bit of stem an saddle post showing (what you called “cramped”)

[@wescheslak9408]

I always enjoy your videos and channel. And I have some party pace stickers on my bikes and gear.

[@Self_Proppelled]

I have a step thru frame. I bought the largest size I could, now my seat and handlebars are perfect for me at their lowest settings. Very solid.

[@Harry_Lew]

It was a bit easier in the days of quill stems when a Nitto would give you all the extension you needed. Not everything new is better. Now to change stack height you need to invest in a new fork and a large number of spacers.

[@lemizle]

Yes! Quill stems were great for this! There are a few modern frames with quill stems, but they are rare. 😢

[@JulianKent]

You can also get fork tube extensions if you want it a lot longer.

[@Exgrmbl]

@@JulianKent its a very dodgy and silly looking solution. Just use a threaded headset with quill stem

[@charliesullivan4304]

This video seems to be advocating lousy compromises as being acceptable. There are other solutions and that's one of them.

[@sepg5084]

I never had a problem building my own bikes. I don't care what contrarians and hipsters say, i am never going back to quill stems nor cable brakes.

[@Windingify]

Totally, only I like to have room for bags in the back as well. So I look for frames that accommodate that. Alas some seat post room.

[@jason200912]

Stand over is only useful to see if the bike is too big. All riders are gonna be better off using frames too small or frames at correct size...both are gonna be good

[@cheezy-rider]

Glad to see you make this video. I have the same problem but even more so. I'm 6' with a 29 inch inseam. Slight case of dwarfism I guess. Lol. When I find a bike that has crotch clearance it's way to small while riding so I got bigger and deal with it. I guess when I can't anymore I'll have to admit I'm old and get a step through. Lol

[@SimpleShoes1]

I'm riding a size 50 gravel bike right now I'm 5'7 it's a little big stand over wise but when I'm riding it felt good because the reach is just right.

[@MarcS4R]

i have a Salsa Fargo in XL which i love riding, L size would have been better for Stand over height but the xl frame just feels better while riding

[@asherbeal8357]

Good advice Russ. 🍻

[@c.m.7692]

Cool stuff thanks.

[@MelvinHughesatp]

Even if the reach increases more, there are so many excellent options for shorter stems (like the Discord "0" and "30mm" samples) these days. I ride a Riv A. Homer Hilsen from 2011 that is technically "too tall" for me with short stems. It is perfect.

[@zalsentzer]

Good one, Rus!

[@derekhobbs1102]

I finally catch a premiere.

[@Jacob99174]

Bro! Nice work

[@mattkretchmar6374]

I'm on board with this. I like roomier riding positions even if I have to be careful stopping.

[@anthonymalovrh2912]

Have similar measurements - same problem - need a larger size frame. Rode a 21 inch frame Schwinn Super LeTour 12.2 back in the 70s. That frame fit me.

[@nathanaelshumsky2977]

Wow such beautiful looking bikes !

[@48plittle]

I agree with the recommendation to not use stand over as a basis for bike fit. I'm 5'11" with shortish legs, but I have a long torso and long arms. I get large size frames. This allows me to bring the seat down a bit so the bar and seat height are very close to level. This saves my bad neck and shoulder from a whole lot of pain. I also don't feel all cramped up.

[@aquariumsfishmore]

I’m the same way

[@cameron9832]

I personally fit better on extra large sized frames (19-21"/58-60cm). However my standover height is not ideal. On most of my bikes my top tube is either touching my crouch or I have less than 1" clearance. When I try smaller, large sized frames (17-19"/56cm) I have better standover height clearance but I need to raise my seat post up to the max to get good leg extension, I feel cramped, and I would have to put a bunch of spacers and/or get a longer stem to make it work Many people are in-between sizes and will fit differently on other style/brand frames. When purchasing bikes, people should find the 2 sizes they they could fit on and try them both out if possible. If buying a frame only or buying online, I guess look at the geometry and compare it to your current, previous, or most comparable bike available. Regardless, tough decisions need to be made. It's never easy.

[@markysgeeklab8783]

I size based on reach & I go for longer reach so I can drop stem length and avoid the horrible handling of a long road bike tiller stem. I've seen a lot of gravel bike reviews by road riders who buy gravel frames based off their road bikes FRAME geo then complain the stem is too short (while looking for my next road bike that will be a carbon gravel bike on 28mm/32mm slicks). Good vid btw

[@Fatbutnotflat]

I have come to terms that "slightly touching" is now considered normal standover clearance. And then theres the wheel size issue that means i'm unable to use frames that have level top tube, unless it uses 26"x1.9" or less. Bigger wheel size + level top tube means the top tube is already higher than my inseam. Negative clearance.

[@user-en3zk1rw7q]

Wicked good video Russ. I think more bike myth-busting content would be most helpful to your followers.

[@scottl8469]

Thank you. Can’t believe my local shop is still fitting bikes this way. Bejesis.

[@rasmuswi]

I've never actually understood why standover is important at all. On my daily commuter I've opted for a frame I can't stand over, because it gives me a slightly more upright position on the bike. On the other hand, on my "Sportier" bikes I have some standover, and really long stems, to get into a lower position. Also I've destroyed the standover on most of my bike by mounting big top tube bags and other stuff on the top tube.

[@normanchan2001]

I agree, i feel top tube length makes such a bigger difference in terms of fit.

[@NeilHodges]

I have the opposite problem: very long legs and a short torso for my height. If I size for standover, I end up needing a 60mm or shorter stem. Even worse is on my Crust Romanceur with TRP Hylex brakes and their crazy-long hoods: even a 35mm stem is too long! I pretty much always have to go custom to get a good fit without tons of seatpost showing, as well as at best tons of spacers/quill showing or a super short stem.

[@nickc8760]

I’ve had that same problem myself. Im a tween 6,2 ish. Sometimes the next size up and sacrificing sand over isn’t all that bad.

[@Adventuregirl96]

I have the opposite problem. I am 5'10" with a 34" inseam so I have long legs and a short torso so I need to size down and I still have to routinely use a shorter stem.

[@haemstah]

Same height and inseam here. Normal arm length. There are certain frames out there that suit, without having to use a short and/or upright stem. Just harder to track down, if not going the custom route.

[@FfortheT]

Same problem here, if I take "right" size, I am stretched. And if I then shorten the stem, I end up hitting my knees on the bar when standing up while paddling. I put A LOT of research into my last bike, so knees stay within 1cm distance, this problem solved. But likely I should get more spacers to avoid cramping my shoulders... It's tough.

[@drpulpit]

the two people walking along the road in the background look as if they walked into the Fifth Dimension. Poof! Vanished! Fun. thanks for the pointers on the right "fit".

[@roguecode2354]

I can relate to this, the top tube on my bike touches my nuts but I still would not want a smaller frame. Its a 53cm (seat tube) track bike and It is just right for my arm length and seat post length. I am about the same height as you.

[@gwionwilliams4391]

I’m intrigued to see what crank length you decide on after experimenting with the Appleman adjustable crankset. I hope you make a video on this soon 👌

[@ScrubsIsee]

Yes! Me too. Crank size is a really overseen fitting element when choosing a bike. I‘d really like to see more about it

[@dinodildo666]

I wonder if the consensus would lean to longer or shorter. I just got a new rig and the shallower BB drop means I can only just get my toes on the ground when on the saddle. Not the end of the world but something to get used to when dismounting. I wouldn't want a shorter crank simply because it would raise my saddle and put my further off the ground.

[@SnakebitSTI]

@@dinodildo666IIRC, research says err on the side of shorter. I think Dylan Johnson made a video about it.

[@charlesblithfield6182]

Great advice. I have a bike with little standover that fits perfectly riding. I got a mini velo recently that’s super easy to get going on (I have five bikes!). What is the bike you are demonstrating with? Looks cool.

[@thatbmxguy]

I mainly look at the top tube length. Somewhere around 52 to 54cm length. Not the height number. Normally shops aim me at 56cm but the length usually seems too long even with a short 50mm stem. I'm just not a aero seater either (I find it too painful). In bmx I'm supposed to like 21.5 top tube as people say and yeah standing it is ok but sitting with a high seat it's just too far and stretched. Also the longer front end feels too light sitting down as all my weight is on the back wheel not on both like I feel with 20.5... I tested many frames for what I'm doing with my 20" wheeled bikes. 20.5 seats me just right. If the seat angle is slacker then it's too long. Straighter angle then the bike jack hammers. Short chainstays. Same feels too much road shock. Kop? Well I find it kind of true too. Knee over pedal seating. There's lots of bike fit practice. It's all about how the rider feels. And not all riders feel the same on each bike.

[@escgoogle3865]

Sage advice. Me, I take the bike up a 8% out of the saddle. If my knees crash the handlebars something needs to be adjustment or it's just a no go.

[@nerigarcia7116]

Stack and Reach are far more important measurements than Standover when choosing a bike. I'm a short rider and if I go by standover alone, I would be riding 47-49 size frames because I have relatively short legs. This is fine for my road bike as sizing down feels better to get a more aggressive fit, but on all my other bikes it doesn't seem as useful. In reality, I have fit anywhere from a 47-52 and been able to ride them all comfortably. One of my gravel bikes is a 52 and touches on the standover, but the ride geometry fits perfectly well. And it is rare on a bike that you will be standing over it with two feet flat on the ground, maybe when you're in the parking lot chatting with your buddies will that happen, and then you'd probably want to rest on the top tube anyway. Even at a light you usually only take one foot off the pedals and that allows you to open up your hip, lean the bike, and place a foot firmly down should the frame be a tad larger. This only tends to be a short people problem but it makes sense when you're between frame sizes, no matter your height.

[@SnakebitSTI]

There's a reason roadies often rest with one foot on the ground and one cheek or thigh on the saddle. Road bikes are designed to ride, not to stand over. For people who want an easier time stopping or getting on/off, I recommend a step through frame and/or dropper post, not a frame that's the wrong size. Not joking about the dropper, either. I'd seriously consider adding one to my road bike if not for the proprietary seat post (bike companies... sigh). They're so convenient.

[@longstrid48]

I completely agree, size those bikes up. I think Ive got your same measurments Russ and one of the best bike fit choices I ever made was sizing up to 55 cm on the horizontal top tube Crust Romanceur from a slightly sloping top tube 52 cm Kona Sutra. Let that top tube caress the gooch. Hot take larger frames just look better too.

[@akaraikiriakatsuki3157]

My bikes certainly doesn't have tolerance on standing position. However I made a habbit to stand on the pedal then angle the bike to get off safety

[@marcusathome]

One very simple method to get the reach right: hold your elbow against the tip of the saddle and reach out towards the handle bar. There should be between 3 and 6 cm of space between the tip of your middle finger and the middle of the handlebar. The length of your arms somewhat correlates to your inseam length and thus this gives you a good starting point for bike fitting. If it doesn't fall into this range, the frame and setup probably isn't the right size for you. Standover doesn't mean anything due to the availability of bikes with sloping top tube.

[@adamroyal38]

😂 when you spoke about it making no sense prioritizing stand over for something bought to ride it was both funny and deeply wise. Thanks for consistently making, imo, quality and authentic content

[@davidreidy5750]

Those rigs are sweeeeeet 🗽🚴

[@michaelchatfield9700]

I did this with my Soma Wolverine. I completely missed that the stand-over was based on 700C, but mine is equipped with 650b. Quite cramped. I should have gone for at least one size bigger.

[@banjomechanic]

I rode a frame with no stand over clearance for years, its a cheap steel fixed frame but I cannot get rid of it. I hate to admit it but it is one of the most comfortable riding frames Ive ever had.

[@Conformist55]

I made this mistake with my last bike. Like you I have a 29” inseam but I’m a hair under 6’7 I bought an xs frame and I never managed to make the bike feel right.

[@kroee]

The standover height is a Minimal requirement! Sometimes you need to stand over your bike, like in traffic or after an emergency stop, and you shouldnt be punished for this with a punch to the balls because the designer was bad at their job

[@PathLessPedaledTV]

2 seemingly opposing things can be true. Standover is nice to have. Standover tells you nothing about how a bike fits when you're riding.

[@b4oh]

I remembered that you had a salsa cutthroat but I’ve never seen you ride a Fargo, I feel like it’s everything you look for in a bike; geometry wise (and external housing!) would you ever do a review on one of those?

[@SimonCurrey]

Excellent I am even more extreme 5'10" with a 29" inner. I have various bikes Triban 3, GT grade carbon, Ridgeback world panorama. The biggest challenge is the touring bike when loaded at 30KG. With that weight it needs to be kept dead upright. Otherwise it spins instantly around the rear wheel to the ground. Fortunately there's just enough slope in the top tube to cock a leg over. I am a fit 68 year old with a giant upper body and tiny legs 😊!!

[@frankhugh2052]

There’s a great Andy Hampsten piece online about bike sizing.

[@marcomcdowell8861]

At 5 foot 3, I find the recommended SMALL frames very uncomfortable. Depending on brand, I find medium, and for my Giant hybrid, a large comfortable. I don't know if my legs are disproportionate, but I feel squished on smaller frames.

[@erics9214]

So, what you're telling us, Russ, is that the bike companies have built in a nut punch to their frames. Given everything else they've done to decrease fit, fewer sizes and poor frame design, that tracks.

[@christopherwebb3517]

I remember back in the 80s, a horizontal top tube = boy's bike and a sloping top tube = girl's bike. As far as I can tell, that was never an official distinction, and I have no idea where it came from, but that (non) rule was set in stone for the kids in my town.

[@clintboyer5303]

A good consideration for the current market of bikes. Maybe this could also be directed at Frame brands to 1. Increase standovers for bikes so they will fit a larger demographic of riders 2. Prioritize fit over aesthetic. Promote diversity in riders in addition to diversity in fit. It's ok to have different fits resulting in different amounts of seatpost and headset spacers showing. I think there are few fit disadvantages in having more standover clearance. A rider with longer legs can always have more seatpost and add a few headset spacers for a trade-off of folks with shorter legs to have the standover clearance they deserve. I think there's an argument for more inner triangle framebag space, but I would suggest there are alternative ways to store luggage on a bike.

[@bertb3731]

The Sklar is looking really good, Russ. What handlebars are those - how do you like them?

[@raymondclarkeimages8one8st97]

When I come to a stoplight, that's when I take my feet off the handlebars.

[@StayZero556]

My bike is a 62cm. Straddling the top tube it’s right up in my crotch and getting on the bike I either have to do the ole one foot on a pedal kick off maneuver, or I have to lean it over to clear the saddle. Old school thinking probably says I should’ve sized down but when I’m in the saddle that bike fits me like a glove.

[@escgoogle3865]

If I ride my 63.5 cm bike with 38mm+ fluffy tires i have the same problem. Back in the day of 21,23,25in bikes 23in (58.5cm) was way to small so I just got used to riding big bikes.

[@marcel750p]

When are you going to review the Ritchey corralitos?

[@Rose_Butterfly98]

Oh I can barely stand over my main bike. Of course, it is actually too big, I should be riding an s or m size, it's an L. Lucky I have long legs and it has very slack geometry especially for a 2017 MTB so it's usually okay unless I have a large backpack. It's only an issue at lights anyway, like sitting on the top tube while standing. I tilt it a little to get on usually.

[@logtothebase2]

I tend to disagree, I cycle a fair proportion in stop start urban traffic and on mixed use parkland paths, tow paths often shared with dog walkers, fishermen and casual strollers, the main issue for me is to be able to comfortably stop and stay on the saddle and get my toes flatish to the ground, to make stop start cycling easy to do without popping on and off the saddle all the time. That's a personal preference i suppose and in a way not related to standover as bottom bracket height and saddle height are the critical measurements (somewhat disproving my own point). Nevertheless I still like some clearance over the crossbar, My inseam is shorter than yours and it is at a point where particularly with 700c and 29inch wheels with fat tires just that level above the road means small issues of the height geometry are critical for bike fit. Longer legged riders have adjustment down as well as up in modal frame sizes, as you say fore and aft corrections can be made in stem length and on saddle rails within limits.

[@stevekelly6544]

When is the review of the Super Something coming?

[@TheMirrorVision]

Interesting that you’ve noticed stack increasing more than reach when sizing up. When I compare dozens of MTB frames I actually notice the opposite where the stack:reach ratio trends lower (I.e. closer to 1:1) as you get towards XL where small frames typically have a higher stack:reach ratios and look to be much friendlier towards your back.

[@PathLessPedaledTV]

Speaking specifically of road and gravel bikes like I showed in the video n

[@MrRay645]

Great video, think it depends and seems like it’s changing. I’m tall and finding high enough stack is difficult and noticed lately the reach is increasing a fair amount going up sizes but the stack only slightly. *i guess you could call the bikes I’m looking at more racy or sporty gravel bikes than what I ride day in day out and what you typically post here. Kinda seems gravel is going more “race” or “road” geo with larger tires vs more all day bike packing style. Like you said “the slammed look” Be thankful your not 6’3” with more leg than average, most bikes I tested looked like TT bikes once I set my saddle hight lol

[@MrRay645]

Might have figured out the confusion. Seems small to medium the reach hardly grows just the stack, large to extra large or xl to xxl it’s mostly reach very little stack

[@dinodildo666]

Have to side with TheMirror Vision. On the Kona Unit for e.g. Large to extra large, reach increases 35mm while stack increases 9mm - edit: Saw Russ's comment about gravel/road. Okay, you are right there Russ! Kona Sutra 56 to 58cm stack increases 19mm while reach increases 5mm!

[@robertcorcoran4951]

I always prioritize Effective TT....

[@craigscott3133]

Good tips. But I'm curious about your front rack. Nice and simple. What is it? Thanks!

[@davidmoskovitz]

Big fan, here, so the spirit of this comment is all positive… it takes real courage to admit that you’ve spent (how much?) on several pretty deluxe bikes but were still relying on stand-over! Otherwise nothing substantive to add. I will say that unless you ride real rough stuff, leaving your steerer longer than nec for a while is not a bad idea, so you can try moving things around. You can always cut more off.

[@PathLessPedaledTV]

I am a flawed human.

[@obriaind]

Stand over was a reliable-ish starting point for size back when every bike had a horizontal top tube. It’s functionally useless in a post-compact-frame-geometry world. It literally means “you can stand over the bike.” It tells you nothing else any more.

[@jarekb-a7530]

I am on exactly the opposite side, with long legs, and short torso. Often I am between two sizes, I had two bike fittings and both were saying that I should have 56 cm road bike (trek domane with relatively short reach 377 mm) and you know what, I cant't ride this bike. Also I have my custom gravel bike built on a genesis vagabond frame set, size L. Way to big (manufacurer guidens were saying differently) I aksed the fitter will it help if I downsize the frame and he said not really. After a yaer of trying to adjust trek to my needs I decided to take risk and buy a smaller frame for my gravel bike. I can't stop riding it now.

[@junaid42465]

As kids, we would often ride adult bikes even when our legs would hardly reach the pedal. We would ride off the saddle or do half pedalling. Also, we used to ride with one leg through the frame. 😂😂 Never in 35 yrs of riding bicycles I’ve ever come across a emergency situation where I would need to jump off the saddle and straddle the top tube. I still can imagine how is it possible. It’s normally, put one foot down or swing the leg over the saddle and dismount (like triathletes do in transition) or simply jump off the bike and let go. When sizing a bike, I feel one of the most important factor is that the shoulders should remain relaxed while riding (any kind of bike). Sometimes two bikes with exact dimensions but with different BB drop will differ in standard over height, although the stack & reach would be same.

[@mathisgraening1931]

i never heard of standover or considered it for sizing..? is this a normally used metric? i choose with stack reach an more generally with a geo sheet. Definately a more precise method.

[@JimS870]

I've seen some 52 or 54 cm bikes with like 800 mm standover. Insane.

[@haemstah]

Good for the taller inseam riders.

[@scottwistinghausen5026]

Nice camera work on this video

[@Jamie-Lynch]

I’m 6’ with 30” inseam. Fitting is tough. If the “standover” fits, the rest doesn’t.

[@alexmurdock9101]

What is that front rack? I've got a Swood T-rack but looking for something that supports my Carradice style bag.

[@boumex8842]

Well since i am tall dude the balls touch method is pretty good for figuring out if a bike is big enough for me.

[@radiocontrolled9181]

At 5'7 1/2 I was in between a Small and a Medium size MTB (27.5). I went with the S size and then changed the stem with a little longer one, not too much. It feels perfect now and I dont regret my decision. I prefer a smaller frame. I also never even considered buying a 29'er because I firmly believe that those are more suitable for taller riders, like 5'11 and taller. Shorter riders look funny on 29'ers imho.

[@dfermette]

29" was developped for riders over 6'2"

[@radiocontrolled9181]

@@dfermette I think the 29'er was developed to sell millions of new bikes after convincing the masses that 26 was expired 😊 About what you said, still there are thousands of shorter riders who ride them, some of them 5'6 and even much shorter than that, who imho look funny on a bike with waayyy too big wheels for their size.

[@jeffandersen6233]

I've always sized up then have issues with reach. I agree that there are numerous fitting factors and manydiferent kinds of bikes. Only test is to try them out. Over the years I look back and really can't think of one bike shop that really helped me with sizing. That's a shame. I'm taking my time on my next bike.

[@cecilecorpuz5735]

When selling a bicycle I'll always asked what type of riding are you planning to do, if you're are going to race then go with the so called proper fitted race bike, if your not then go a size or 2 up, once I know their plans then I'll do my best to steer them in the right direction.

[@bikdav]

I use the ‘stand-over’ method up front to make sure that it doesn’t crush my crotch. Then, I make adjustments from there. I refuse to spend a king’s ransom for fitting sessions.