People don’t like Shadow of the Erdtree

[@Zombi3kill3rOO]

i don't understand why people are saying they're gatekeeping the dlc. in dark souls 1 you had to kill ornstein and smough to access the dlc. in dark souls 2 to access the poison dlc you needed to kill the rotten, the fire dlc you had to kill the old iron king and the frozen dlc you had to wither bet all 4 lord soul bosses or get 1000000 soul memory. and in dark souls 3 to access the 2nd dlc you had to either beat friede or get to just before the final boss which required pretty much the entire game

[@Tartiris1]

Most of the Negative review are chinese players giving a negative review over the anticheat localization not working.

[@clownshoegaming4772]

@@Tartiris1 the commercial success of the game is exposing it to weak minded gamers who will try it for a couple of hours then go back to pokemon, not before throwing it shade in the reviews

[@Cold_Zero_The_Wise]

I agree with you there ​@@clownshoegaming4772

[@anonisnoone6125]

@@clownshoegaming4772 I fucking hate comments like this. This just exemplifies the pretentious of FS fanboys. Wtf r "weak minded gamers? It's a fucking game mate, not an exam.

[@DionPanday]

Watching a boss do 15 flipping anime spins while you watch and wait for your turn to attack him once or twice doesn’t exactly sound fun to me. You can make a game challenging without having to make the game about pressing circle at the right time.

[@Fennyjbenny]

What boss are you referring to? Every boss in the dlc I have fought gives you opportunities to jump, dodge attack in between the longer attack chains. Rather than waiting for a 30 second window, they have a light attack or rolling attack window in between attacks on top of the longer charge attack windows. Positioning in particular can give you a lot of openings where you can get in a bosses blind spot do a large attack and completely avoid the bosses attack.

[@DionPanday]

@@Fennyjbenny Thank you for proving my point for me

[@lukewatson411]

​@DionPanday this reply is very confusing

[@soyborne.bornmadeandundone1342]

@@Fennyjbenny Oh boy you sound like a pro. Bet you got tons of videos proving how much of a bad azz you are huh!

[@soyborne.bornmadeandundone1342]

@@DionPanday There's a lot of combos that take forever to end. It's kind of boring! Bro counters you with "longer attack chains" some guy doesn't get your point that he just made lololol. Sigh this community is dumb. Makes sense though. 25 million copies sold and almost half didn't even make it to the round table hold haha.

[@doll1457]

The scadutree fragment system would have been better had they not implemented getting the fragments the way they did. Having no extras, putting them on field bosses or enemies that don't particularly stand out from the regular shadow dudes, and doing this on a huge, vertical, confusing map where most other things you pick up are just crafting materials or smithing stones really killed any enthusiasm I had to look for them.

[@rzxd1]

yeah exploring will at least get u lv 15it all until that. bad

[@thebigdoginthisbitch4733]

It already works well

[@anthonykarnes6804]

Git gud smooth brain

[@Hydra_X9K_Music]

​@anthonykarnes6804 I see you have absolutely nothing to respond with xD

[@Tartiris1]

Most of the Negative review are chinese players giving a negative review over the anticheat localization not working.

[@stormnorman7215]

I dislike the ideology of "I attack for 60 seconds and then you get a 1 sec window to attack 1 MAYBE 2 times before it repeats" The Elden Ring bosses have. It's not "too hard" its boring and not fun

[@GeorgePerakis]

If that's how you think the bosses work then you are literally just bad at the game. Every boss can be beaten in under a minute. You're just bad.

[@stormnorman7215]

@@GeorgePerakis 💀 okay bro, I’m bad at the game for not hyper mode ultra buffing myself to oblivion and one shotting the boss. Pathetic take

[@lakenwhite4179]

I only started gaming- AT ALL (other than 2 weeks spent playing Skyrim when it first came out) in November 2023. I just happened to remember someone mentioning Elden Ring so, I got it. My first playthrough was a WRECK. I had no eye-hand coordination, didn't know about target locks and, don't even inquire into my platforming skills. Short answer: none. I needed both of my brothers' help to get through the game. Now, in July 2024, I have successfully played through base game ER 6 times and counting. I've beaten every boss, by myself, at least twice. I love the game and was waiting on SOTE to come out. In less than a week, I have beat every boss besides the final main myself on NG+ (major regret there 😅). I am on a week of brickwalling the final main boss. I can't seem to get them below 25-30% health. However, despite my screaming and cussing at the TV, I keep trying. I may not ever get it, and it feels impossible, but I felt that about ER before and was wrong. So, we'll see. Maybe one day 😂🤞

[@robroskey6515]

I didn't get that experience, I found many openings to attack and no I don't use summons to distract them or op cheese builds, didn't even use all my shadow blessing upgrades . It wouldn't be a challenge if they just stood there for 3 seconds after every attack.

[@wilfredwayne7139]

Ignore that idiot you can beat the easy ones in about a minute but let's see him do that to radahn or Bayle without broken stuff like the lightning bottles we know he used.

[@jh9794]

Given that last boss i think miazaki has gone a bit too far into aiming for difficulty over fun. The visual dirrhea of that second phase took an already annoying but just learnable fight and added almost undogeable AOEs on top of everything else. Im not calling it an impossible fight, but i am calling it bull.

[@ksizzle3205]

I honestly think prime radahn isn’t even the hardest boss in elden ring like people are saying. Malenia took me more attempts and has more bullshit than radahn.

[@jh9794]

@lilsmooch6008 each there own, Melania while challenging never felt like she had undogeable bulsh** besides waterfowl. And even that becomes a lot easier to deal with once you learn how. Zombie radahn, the other hand has so many flashing lights it makes seeing anything difficult. His big desperation attacks aren't the hardest to deal with. It's just everything else.

[@ksizzle3205]

@@jh9794 i definitely agree that the light beams make it hard to see what’s going on but i didn’t find any of his attacks undodgable besides the double slash into cross combo thing

[@creeperYT9824]

@@ksizzle3205 same

[@aamirbhura007]

​@@ksizzle3205But malenia is an optional side boss which can be ignored whereas consort radahn is finale to one of the best game in last decade

[@Daytime_Anime]

This is my perspective as someone who played and beat my first and only souls game Bloodborne solo... Back in 2015 I had a lot of free time as a kid. I was still in high school and I could afford spending hours upon hours on trying to beat a boss. I thought it was fun and I "took pride in beating this really hard game". I lived for the rush you got when you finally beat the boss. But now I'm 25 and the idea of spending more than an hour on a boss is something I can't do nor do I find it fun. I believe some of these bosses feels like smashing my head against a brick wall until it breaks. And loosing 3,4,5 hours of my only day off work to beat 1 boss doesn't sound like a great time. My opinion on on the difficultly of Elden Ring is that the game does not respect the player's time.

[@PoliticsSux]

Or you could spend 45 mins exploring and gathering and then spend 15 on a boss. I’ve never played this genre and I used all of the tools the game provides in crafting and ashes of war to really punish bosses. You will lose sometimes, but you gotta learn what the stats mean. Blood loss is a broken stat sometimes. Kicking the shield foot soldiers leaves them open to riposte. Elden ring really respects your time. You just gotta use it wisely. I beat several bosses with no upgrades on weapons no summons as a lvl 1 wretch. I just gathered cookbooks and weapons. (Mind you lvl 1 with base 10 stats you can only use so many weapons) that’s what talismans are for (Radagons Soreseal)

[@austin0_bandit05]

I second this as well. When I want a real challenge I do a SL1 run or master a boss until I can do it hitless. There's a demographic of the fanbase that has fetishized this tedious level of difficulty. For example I was actually astonished at the number of people defending the final boss. And whats worse is that Elden Ring sets a precedent for their future games. It can only get harder from here. Who is the intended audience? The harder these games become the more niche they'll become. What was wrong with DS3 difficulty? Sekiro? Bloodborne? I always felt these bosses were "hard but fair" but thats come to mean "absurdly hard and fair for some".

[@PoliticsSux]

At the end of the day yes it’s challenging and they do not explain the stats well enough for NEW players. But the information is there. For example a lvl one weapon with sacred blade (HOLY stat damage) will demolish undead enemies (i.e. skeletons) because undead is weak to HOLY. Or those rock miners being weak to STRIKE type damage instead of SLASH because it will bounce off. Everything is well thought in this game and it can be tore apart. Watch some speed runs and you’ll see. But I’d rather read a little lore and investigate the world and learn by mistakes than have the 💩 force fed to me by game creators like Ubisoft or have the hud so plastered with 💩 that I couldn’t see the boss’s telegraphed attacks. The mechanics to be successful are there.

[@interpoles3295]

play a different game

[@castielffboi]

@@interpoles3295Deflecting criticism lol

[@shippy1001]

This is all good discussions, but the truth (at least to me), is much simpler than that, if the bosses don`t have Stamina, or don`t even allow you to drink a freaking flask, or summon, always focusing the player with hyper aggression and no openings to do damage, it`s a bad design and people have all the right to complain, they paid $40 for this and the DLC bosses are just bad in comparison to the main game bosses, not because it`s "hard", this is just a word people come up with, but because is cheaply designed with hyper aggression, how many people dying 2 seconds after entering the boss room because they tried to use a summon and got one tapped by the boss? Very few bosses in the main game are like this, while in the DLC, ALL bosses are like that, there is a clear difference. Use a shield build with Mohg`s staff, you are going to breeze through the whole DLC, it`s not hard, but it`s definitely not as fun as the main game, like people said it, it`s too difficult to be fun, and they are correct, I`m funneled to play a different style that I don`t like, just because it allows me take more than 2 hits. Anyone who says otherwise it`s delusional, even the dude "Let me solo her" was having issues with Mesmerr, you can`t see the bosses attacks because of so much clutter and camera issues, while the boss leaps across the freaking arena all the time, and what does this boss have? hyper aggression and unblockable fire damage.

[@bigboabossk8894]

I beat the entire dlc with no summons and my build is a quality build with the zweihander. The dlc is hard and there is something to be said about the quest design being linked to the breaking of miquellas rune, however if you find scadurtree frags you'll be fine unless you're just inpatient and quit after being beat by a boss more than 10 times. It's a souls game dlc it's gonna be hard. It's not for everybody but that's kinda the point

[@shippy1001]

@@bigboabossk8894 You cant use scardurtree fragments as your "get out of jail" free card everytime someone says the game is hard, the bosses still have hyper-agression towards the player, even if your summon is hitting the boss he turns and hit you as soon as you get close.

[@bigboabossk8894]

@shippy1001 I can't use scadurtree frags as a get out jail free card when people say the game is hard? It's a hard game scadurtree frags make the game easier. Scadurtree frags=easier gameplay. And just be patient and learn the bosses it takes time but that's the point you got this don't give up 🤍🖤🩶

[@kcold3277]

Even Radahn has multiple moves that allow for healing.

[@Bayle-the-Dread-Dragon]

@@shippy1001 yes the second part is annoying but I don't see your point for the first part

[@wearevenom82]

I don't think people come for the difficulty, the reason why we come back is for the worlds and atmospher. If difficulty was the case Dark Souls one and 2 would've been forgotten a long time ago. Shadow of the Erdtree is beautiful but it feel boring to explore and extremely punishing for classic builds.

[@TheOneGreat]

I come for both. I honestly have no idea what you mean. The lore is a big motivator for me and it's absolutely fantastic.

[@Stinkleberg]

People come for the difficulty. That's FromSoft's whole ride to fame. It doesn't matter how much of a gamer you are, unless you finished a FromSoft game, you're garbage.

[@wearevenom82]

@@Stinkleberg Difficulty is already expected, the worlds set them apart. I've finished all fromsoft games but Shadow didn't make me feel like i wanted to explore or learn of the world's lore, it just felt boring and straight forward. The other games felt like we had a point to killing all the bosses. You don't have to agree with me, it's just that not everyone plays these games like a boss rush, some just comeback for the vibes in between the killing.

[@samueldawkins]

you thought wrong

[@MachineMan-mj4gj]

The Scadutree Fragments were the radium bullet to the heart. From had never had a problem with scaling the DLC of their previous games, but now they somehow do. If they were so worried about people curb stomping the content, then maybe they should have balanced the game correctly.

[@Owlr4ider]

The difference is that their previous games were linear progressions with pretty set build options. Elden Ring puts a lot more emphasis on the player's build and how the player's play style and build choice should go hand in hand. While there is no such thing as a 'wrong build' in Elden Ring, there very much is a 'wrong build' for a given play style. The player than has to choose whether to adjust the build to adapt to the preferred play style or adjust the play style to adapt to the preferred build, or some sort of middle ground between the 2.

[@LeafJFYT]

I think the whole 'just get more scadu fragments' misses the fact that this system only exists because From had designed themselves into a corner with the existing progression and had no idea how else to make more challenging content without introducing an entirely new mechanic. Rune levels already started to feel irrelevant past a certain point in the base game and that would only get worse in SotE. As you say, they never struggled to scale other DLC content before. They are only in this position because of previous decisions that they made - so I think we should be more willing to criticise this decision rather than players for not liking it or not engaging with it. Especially as it's not a very good system - if the main incentive to explore is to find buffs that get you to the 60/70% DR needed to survive a boss attack, you've just made a system that gatekeeps rather than rewards people. This is the result of poor decisions by Fromsoft. I get that people can do SotE without the fragments, but I am talking about the intended design here - people are meant to use them, so it's not a player problem if they feel they are being forced to collect fragments to progress. I find it kind of weird we're mocking players for not using scadu fragments, when, afaik, we don't have the data on how many people were missing them and we're just taking From's word that they were. It is also convenient that at the same time From announced people weren't engaging with this mechanic, they also buffed the blessing to be much more effective - suggesting the balancing was off anyway. I am glad they did this btw - it's good they were able to acknowledge these issues and change them, but a lot of people are acting like there were no issues at all.

[@Owlr4ider]

@@LeafJFYT FromSoft didn't 'design themselves into a corner', they were exploring something new, putting a Souls game in an Open World setting, with everything this change entails. FromSoft tried many different things and in this expansion tried another, they will see what works and what doesn't if they ever decide to make another open world game in their typical design philosophy. Or heck, trying yet another genre altogether rather than open world, learning which parts of their typical formula works outside of their specific genre and which parts don't and thus need altering. Also, it's not at all about mocking players for not using scadu fragments. It's about mocking players who refuse to realize that Elden Ring is a different beast than FromSoft's other games and thus they need to approach the game differently. I mean some players don't and these players managed to beat the DLC using their old methods, without scadu fragments or anything else. All the power to those players. It's for the majority of players, who suddenly hit a wall with the DLC and were still too bullheaded to meet the game half way and instead insist that their old way of playing FromSoft games should still work perfectly in Elden Ring despite Elden Ring being a very different game from all their previous works.

[@chuckp342]

I'm not hating - I'm truly grateful for any additional ER content. That said, the Shadow DLC doesn't have the same feel as the base game. It's not as fun to explore (there's not much to find) and it's a little confusing getting around. Again, in 2024, Miyazaki and crew seem like the only "real" dev left. Thank you for the additional content.

[@sNNNNNable]

My 2nd playthrough I made a point to get more scadutree fragments and had like 5 or 6 before doing the first two bosses, then like 15 before doing the rest and I beat all bosses in 1 or 2 attempts. It was insanely easy compared to my first playthrough

[@Tartiris1]

Most of the Negative review are chinese players giving a negative review over the anticheat localization not working.

[@sNNNNNable]

@@Tartiris1 Yeah seems like that and people having performance issues. I haven't had any issues myself luckily

[@aBadWizard]

Ikr? It's so fucking disappointing that they made the difficulty based around such arbitrary bullshit. Literally just ride your horse around the map and pick up a few items and that makes the fights easy 😢 I wish they had come up with a better system that isn't so lame.

[@valentinvas6454]

​@@aBadWizardBro it's literally just the DLC version of the base games levelling. In the base game you can also just ride around and collect the best weapons and spells, talismans, smithing stones and flask upgrades. In the DLC you are already at a high level with maxed out things so what else could be done?

[@tedthetonberry225]

@@valentinvas6454 Yeah pretty much this. I will admit I did get angry on my way to Rellana (forget his name, but the NPC knight with the greatsword), and shat all over the game to my friends.....BUT...I learned it, I worked through it, and I know enough of the gameplay to survive now. Granted, I'm no ace player and still need help a lot of times on my end. Not a bad thing, i just get busy alot to really play to get good enough to become good at soloing.

[@kittymoo3297]

I recently put Lies of P aside, I got close to the end but found I just wasn't enjoying my time with the game. I didn't enjoy the combat enough to really want to push myself, and one particular lengthy run back to a boss had me call it quits. Sometimes difficulty can be fun. Other times it just wears on you. Sometimes it's not even difficulty, but simply allowing a player to engage with the parts of a game they care about. I beat the Final Fantasy 7 Remake late last year. I started out loving the combat, but by the end I simply had no interest in engaging with any of the games combat mechanics. So I set the game to easy to finish out the story, and I still felt satisfied by seeing the ending. At the same time Sekiro has one of my favorite combat systems ever put into a game. I loved throwing myself against those bosses and probably wouldn't have set it to easy or taken help if it was provided. It's all about whether the game is still enjoyable to the player. Honestly, Elden Ring's combat didn't click with me nearly as well, and as a result I found myself less interested in challenging the bosses and more interested in exploring the world instead. So in Elden Ring, I did end up using the provided help against some of the more troublesome bosses.

[@wolftales5203]

You play Sekiro but put FF7R on easy? Who is this person?

[@lanzaporros]

​@@wolftales5203OMG read the comment again Jesus christ, its all about how fun is the game for you not about difficulty

[@NormandyFoxtrot]

@@wolftales5203 I mean I don't play these games for their difficulty, for the challenge, I play them inspite of it.

[@wolftales5203]

@@NormandyFoxtrot yeah but sekiro is different. Sekiro is a stone wall, if you literally dont have the talent to play it, you just cant

[@NormandyFoxtrot]

@@wolftales5203 I didn't mention sekiro I actually don't like it and find it by far the least interesting and least enjoyable of their modern games.

[@jamess.3013]

I feel like difficulty in video games isn’t entirely subjective. A way to look at this would be to get data across multiple action rpgs titles and compare things like the hour played and if the game incorporates levels, that as well. So say that the average action RPGs boss at roughly 15 hours of gameplay takes a player 15 standard hits to kill, but kills the player in 9 hits. I can almost guarantee you that a comparison to a from soft game would find that an average player would die from a comparable boss after 5-7 hits and takes the player 20+ hits to kill.

[@RsBanez]

With the exception of Bayle and the final boss, the rest of the DLC bosses were pretty average in difficulty. I don't use summons and it didn't take me more than 10-15 tries to beat any of them, which is pretty standard for a souls DLC.

[@soyborne.bornmadeandundone1342]

Such horse crappp lol. Cell the gamer is one of the best players. Watched him do Consort Rad danny without summons. Bro struggled for like 5 hours. You're better than him??? Let me solo her struggled for about 3 hours on his first try. Let's say each try is close to 5 minutes. So you beat Rad danny in about 1 hour without summons??? Lol video proof or it didn't happen lolz.

[@RsBanez]

@@soyborne.bornmadeandundone1342 read my comment again

[@qrowing]

Hard agree to this one. Although Gaius also whooped my cheeks a good 30+ times due to, you guessed it, SCADU LEVEL. Had to take a breather on him.

[@clownshoegaming4772]

I genuinely think people have forgotten how hard a time they originally had, left their overpowered builds in a save file, expecting their op mimic tear build to just be able to roll on and enjoy some sightseeing in this DLC, no single area in this DLC was as hard as the haligtree IMO, and no boss in it is as tough as malenia was when you first came across her, radahn took me 1.5 hours, she took me days

[@christopherjackson2685]

This is exactly what has occurred IMO. Spamming Takers Flames while buffed to the moon can trivialize so much of the game, but that just won’t work with Mesmer, Consort Radahn, and even Rellana to a certain extent. Rellana was the first DLC boss I faced and I was using the Blasphemous blade and she absolutely destroyed me. Eventually I went out and explored and got my blessing up and found the Great Katana and it was GG’s after that

[@aBadWizard]

Wtf? Everything about the Haligtree was EZ AF except Malenia.

[@clownshoegaming4772]

@@aBadWizard has way cheesier enemy placement than anything the dlc had....like the fkin snails that spawn crystalians?.....there was nothing as annoyingly creative as that in the DLC

[@clownshoegaming4772]

@@christopherjackson2685 Rellana gave me more tourble than any other dlc boss.... I just steamrolled into her without any scabadoodles or wtf they're called.....took me way longer than radahn

[@tedthetonberry225]

Funny enough, most of my issues were the first 'two' remembrance bosses of the DLC. Rellana was understandably tough mostly because it was just difficult to get the combos down (and understand that sometimes my brain needs a LOT to pick up on the tells, especially with smaller foes like Rellana). My main problem was the Dancing Lion, and it's actually not the difficulty of the fight, but my anger was how many times I couldn't dodge because the foe made sure I couldn't see a damn thing. I've faced him three times already and not nearly as mad as before. Still, just remember that Elden Ring picked up a crap ton of new player DS3 to Elden Ring. So a lot of the complaints are people who aren't aware **how** Fromsoft does it's thing.

[@CheerfuEntropy]

So actually "another crabs treasure" came across a pretty decent way of doing a soulslike friendly easy mode: they made it granular. Do you need more i frames while dodging? armor? parry window? do more or less damage? there are sliders for that in the accessibility options

[@TheArmyofHades]

I believe its the type of difficulty that rubbed the players the wrong way this time. Input reading feels really bad and bosses are structured the same forcing the average player into a very specific approach. Bosses attack fast, have deceptive reach, have all side encompassing attacks, have roll catching methods, heal punishing attacks, weirdly timed combos, grabs with tons of active frames and non intuitive animations, huge aoe explosions and often times a type of status buildup. They also tend to not complete their combos or do more attacks seemingly at random .This is pretty much the elden ring experience for the average player and with few exceptions these traits are present at almost every boss in the game. Adding to that the ever present camera problem and the torrent that gets one shoted from sneezing at it and you take a century to recover from that plus you need a healing flask to regen torrent which is defaulted to no for some idiotic reason like who would even try to resurrect torrent only to press no at the end? It adds up to being too mentally taxing for people that actually have lives. And the goal is not to win the game just to get this over with or to be able to gain this unimportant sense of i beat that hard game, its to have fun.

[@smashmonkey6304]

I think the actual issue is far more simple than the video is making it. Demon Souls came out at a time when games were getting progressively easier and easier. So it was refreshing to have a game that didn't hold your hand and let you lose. Now, that's not an issue and there are at least some hard games out there. Souls however keeps emphasizing that aspect and is at a point where it's jumped the shark. Games can be too easy but they can be too hard too. The problem is that the former is better than the later. Kirby is easy as shit but people still have fun with it. Too hard means you are just beating your head against a wall. I think the issue is that the market isn't hungry for hard games and From Software is pushing up against the "too hard" wall.

[@LeafJFYT]

Yeah I think your first point is really important actually - the difficulty for the time was refreshing, but so was the way the difficulty was designed. People focus on the bosses but the difficulty of Dark Souls 1 at least (I never played Demons) was that *every* part of a level was intended to be challenging, which was something that was new and refreshing for its time. You really had to pay attention to every encounter, at least while you were still learning the game, so your progress through a level was literally measured in inches, and the estus flask system facilitated this by giving you a pool of mistakes you could make. You could see your improvement by the resources you saved, which would help you push even further. It was a very methodical form of difficulty. ER opts for a much more mechanical style of difficulty and it also largely focuses these moments on the boss fights. I think it's kind of telling that when people talk about difficulty in ER they often bring up the bosses and not the dungeons or environments. I don't think there was a single area in ER or SotE that felt like it really demanded my attention in the same way that older From titles did. I didn't get that sense that I was making painstaking progress through a dungeon, learning to master encounters and conserve resources. That methodical flow has been replaced with peaks and troughs where the difficulty will spike massively at bosses/minibosses but with stretches of filler in between consisting mostly of repeated enemies with the same general encounter design - which is ironically very similar to a lot of the big titles that From initially set themselves apart from. That isn't inherently bad but it I think it's a step away from what originally distinguished From from the competition. There are actually lots of games that do mechanical difficulty really well and so being 'hard' isn't really a mark of individuality, and in some respects, ER does not do this as smoothly or as satisfyingly as other games, including previous ones in From's catalog (Sekiro).

[@zoran1551]

the reverse is also true, when you want to playwithout summon because you think the game is boring with them. A lot of people will call you dumb and stubborn, even thou ER without sumon isn't necassary more difficult than DS3. What i hate, is that the sumons allow F.S to get away with boss design that are lame (vaillant gargoil for example) and it is not that it is too difficult, it is just difficult for the wrong reasons.

[@joaoluizkfsantos8392]

They never needed an excuse to do some lame bosses (belfry gargoyles in 2, for example), so idk if that has any relation to summons 😅

[@RAGEGAMING33]

If you think the gargoyles are to hard or to hard for the wrong reasons. Then that sounds like you are problem not the fight.. learn the fight imstead of bitchn n moaning about it on yutube.. gargoyles lol pls its a 165 bosses base gamew your complaining bout gargoyle shut up 🤷💯

[@LEK]

@@RAGEGAMING33 You pretend like they couldn't just add less but more meaningful bosses. Most bosses apart from the story bosses are half-assed and these make up the majority of these 165. The fanboy coping is crazy lmao. It is a great game but it has its flaws, the dlc in particular has a lot of major flaws.

[@TheBoshman95]

Its just becoming an arms race between Fromsoft and the top players.

[@pawe6199]

I think it's not as much of a problem of core, hardcore souls audience, but rather the mass casual audience who just picked up ER coz it was popping off, people who got their builds from the internet and watched how to cheese X boss. Those are the people who gave negative reviews. Because on day one, when they started playing SotE, they were on their own.

[@soyborne.bornmadeandundone1342]

@Foul.Tarnished410 That's not really what it is... It's mostly a hole gamer gater types just being dix.

[@Cold_Zero_The_Wise]

U support this, but also the "Veteran" who beat the game with OP builds and Weapons, who then Started the DLC only to find by Design the DLC kinda takes those fun toys away from them so now it's scadu hunting time and to learn the complexity of the new bosses.

[@richardjamesIII]

It's parallel to the base game. When you start, EVERYTHING two shots you. Level up, get more gear and upgrade, and whaddya know, suddenly you stand a chance. Blessings are crucial. They ARE the leveling system. Choosing not to use them is choosing to do a lvl 1 run. Good luck and don't b**** about it.

[@iamdoom9810]

I think after people get used to the Scadutree Fragment system, the reception towards the DLC will warm up and it'll overall beat the "too hard" allegations. Because once you're past Scadutree level 1, the progression of difficulty is comparable to the rest of the game.

[@kash1Mz]

Pretty much every complaint about difficulty in dlc ends at shadow tree fragments system. Should have been one static difficulty. There are other ways to get people to explore. Stripping them of power and scattering it all over dlc is bound to make people upset. Atleast make it possible to toggle it off and not make it permanent for that character..

[@Fennyjbenny]

What would you suggest? The fragment system creates situations where you feel overwhelmed and need to go and get more powerful. They wanted a system that wouldn’t trivialize the base game so making more powerful gear or adding additional weapon upgrade levels wouldn’t work. I would prefer if it was directly tied to mini bosses personally like in sekiro but that has its own drawbacks. I like that finding every fragment is rewarded, the base game equivalent felt disappointing when you get to the later stages.

[@dusttodust915]

@@kash1Mz they're not technically permanent cause the stat boosts from the fragments don't carry over to the base game and the weapons and gear aren't op as far as I know.

[@kash1Mz]

@@dusttodust915 They are permanent to the dlc for that character, thats what I meant.

[@breezy4640]

thank you for talking about the possibility of difficulty options. i will also die on that hill, there is nothing wrong with playing on "casual" or "easy" mode. some people need that. and it would benefit the hardcore players, too. they could brag that they beat the game on "nightmare" mode while rl1 and 0 scadu fragments. it'd feel like even more of an accomplishment for them. meanwhile, the players who are content with casual mode or have to play on casual mode will also feel fulfillment from playing the game, too. i really think that fromsoft games would benefit from difficulty options. also, this video is very well made. i'm surprised it doesn't have more views! you did a great job

[@MachineMan-mj4gj]

I’m of two minds: one, being unforgiving is part of the Souls formula, the little somethin’-somethin’ that brings the experience together. On the other hand, this isn’t mainline Dark souls, and Elden Ring is nowhere near as tight as Souls proper.

[@nayyarrashid4661]

Nightmare mode or rl1 is your personal challenge. No one is interested in making the overly difficult than the person himself who is doing it.

[@TheDarkEnigma]

I think miyazaki either lied about playing elden ring poorly. Or what he considers playing poorly is actually a lot higher of a standard than people interpreted Also. Yes i agree with most of this video. Though the issue with the 'easier options' is that the community complains about them and end ups weakening them later on. The play your way argument only works when you arent actively punished for playing your way. PvP balancing i get should be thoroughly fair. But DONT punish solo or co-operative players for the sake of difficulty while also encouraging them to play their way. Also. The Shadow blessing is the stupidest mechanic i have ever seen in a souls game. You made a whole dlc and catered it around an artificial extra scaling( which makes you wonder if the level of the bosses is artificially inflated to make the blessings more important) then on top of that placing the scaling around the world to 'encourage' exploration feels like a lack of confidence in your own world design. We need to cater to lower and higher skill level players doesnt really work when 70% of the pickups in the dlc are items most people can buy ( casual or serious) from the roundtable before even beating mohg. The thing ive always loved about souls games is that despite their difficulties i could still immerse myself. I rarely had the illusion broken and never saw the game as just a game of animations or numbers. This dlc has broken that massively. As i progressed more and more, the illusion of the world broke. Its a linear corridor in most of the dungeons, the bosses feel like a numbers and animation analysis simulator instead of a desperate fight, and the dlc doesn't feel like an immersive world anymore. It feels like a game, which i know might seem wierd but it's now less of a 'nice, i beat Golden Hippo (as an example. Ive beaten everything except radahn so far) it feels more like 'nice i beat the systems and the camera'. Thats a surprisingly bigger difference than some may think . Midra and Messmer were honestly the only bosses in the whole dlc that didn't feel like a number or animation game. They actually pulled me back into the game and made me have true fun again. So yeah, they did make some great bosses to me. This dlc is all over the place in terms of quality and im sick of pretending it isnt.ive played every Fom game since og Demons Souls over the course of 14 years and yet im told im wrong about my opinion because i dont agree with the hive mind. The dlc should be difficult yes, it is a dlc for a souls game. It should be vast. But those things shouldn't be exclusionary. A lot of people are hitting the point now where despite being souls players since the beginning they just cant keep up anymore and are insulted or punished for it. For their loyalty. And then there's the Elden Rimmers who claim you arent willing to adapt or learn soley because your a souls 'vet'. Like what? Souls ' vets' have probably been more adaptive because of all the variations in combat and styles over the years. Its not even a pride thing. Its a matter of muscle memory. Most souls games including elden ring do play alike at a base level So a souls 'vet' would naturally have a slightly higher starting skill level. Thats not a pride thing, thats simple memory. I dont have pride. I suck at these games. But ive played souls games and souls likes for a good half my life. Yet to be insulted and invalidated ,to the point of receiving real hate messages and even a real life threat at one point, from some souls groups ive been in for years, which ive left now. I also follow a sticks and stones kind of mind point but the vitriol is overpowering at times, soley for being able to see and acknowledge the cracks in something i've loved for years is a massive middle finger to me as a fan. If the souls games continue to get more and more ridiculous for the sake of difficulty alone, and the community continues to get more and more 'elitist' then good. I'll know its my time to leave because theres nothing left for me. There's a lot of decent people in the community. Some chill people, some who even love to meme with mimic tears and gestures. And there's still the spirit of the sunbro in co-op too. But i dont know, think im at my breaking point now. Ive got Sekiro and several Armored Core games to finish. As well as older From games like Shadow Tower, King's Field, Otogi or even Eternal Ring or Enchanted Arms. I'll keep loving FromSoft. But i i don't think i can keep loving souls style games anymore. And thats what stings the most. Again, great video man. Some really good points that didnt seem biased towards one opinion or the other. A pretty well balanced analysis honestly.

[@soyborne.bornmadeandundone1342]

Mind blown. Feelings put to words better than I ever could. You need more subz lol you sooooo need more subs. Thank you so much for this : )

[@FleaOnPeanut]

He [Miyazaki] continued: "But in preparation for Shadow of the Erdtree, I played through the main story of Elden Ring. I want to preface this by saying I absolutely suck at video games, so my approach or play style was to use everything I have at my disposal, all the assistance, every scrap of aid that the game offers, and also all the knowledge that I have as the architect of the game ... the freedom and open-world nature of Elden Ring perhaps lowered the barrier to entry, and I might be the one who's benefiting the most from that, as a player, more than anyone else." -The Guardian I add this quote because you make it seem like Miyazaki is a capable player who is tuning the game to some git gud player specs. If you ask me he's actually just a writer and game dev feeling increasing pressure to make every new Soulsbourne game more challenging or up the ante instead of optimizing for fun or new assets or story. That's just my correct opinion though. But hey, maybe you like fighting the same dragon boss for 6th (yes, actually) time in one DLC? There is a game design issue with SOTE and part of it stems from a lack of time and assets and another comes from the fact that it should've been Elden Ring 2. A sequel I'm hoping we'll never have to endure given that the Soulsborne premise has begun to truly sour after 14 years of repetitive use.

[@SocraTetris]

Ah yes. Artist intent. That thing which is singular individualistic and audiences have objective access to. Never disagreeing.

[@SocraTetris]

In seriousness though, i liked this vid

[@EmeralBookwise]

To me the biggest problem isn't that the DLC bosses are difficult by some arbitrarily "objective" standard, but rather that they are disproportionately difficult compared to the basic enemies. To me Schadutree Blessings make basic enemies far too easy, while conversely being barely enough to keep pace with the bosses. This is in stark contrast to FromSoft's previous games where fighting past hords of regular enemies was just as much part of the challenge as the bosses, but now in Shadows of the Erdtree it feels more like the bosses are the only challenge and made all the more difficultto compensate for the lack of difficulty elsewhere. It just makes the entire experience feal lopsidedly disjointed, as if I were playing two different ganes awkwardly stiched together.

[@JulianShowers]

Fromsoftware generally, and Miyazaki in particular has a specific design ethos which goes beyond just making hard but fair games, the design of mechanics and how they are integrated is often done in such a way that players are expected to figure things out through careful thought and consideration rather than being directly guided through the systems. This lends itself poorly to many traditional means of tutorialization and their preference towards diegetic mechanics directly opposes modes. However, with such items as the bell demon and Kuro's charm and the traditional souls/runes increasing effects there is a clear precedent for using in game items to affect the difficulty of the game. Therefore adding items for this explicit purpose could be a means of offering difficulty management without altering the core game. For Elden Ring, cursed talismans which cannot be removed without breaking them or with the assistance of an NPC which do things like halve the rune cost for levels, reduce enemy mob aggression, or increase the timing of enemy boss recovery windows could all be ways to offset the challenge for players without enough skill or time to engage with the game at the intended level. This would also allow players who grow comfortable with their level of ability with the game to peel away some or all of those items to engage with the game on the same design space as everyone else. For 99.9% of players I think that would be enough, for the few who are unable to offset their own inability with just that, I have always been a proponent of game mods being made for the direct purpose of helping the disabled players and for new gamers. This places the use of these tool out of reach for the average player who would use them to remove themselves from the designed experience while having them exist for those who already have a reason to go looking for them.

[@clownshoegaming4772]

this is the correct reply

[@Jade-ur8pl]

The scoobydoo fragments are why I won't play Shadow of the Erdtree. I really didn't like exploration in the base game and just want to rush the bosses. If I can't do that, forget it.

[@stevemichael652]

It really depends. If you have no issue using summons , the game difficulty is just about right. If you like to solo bosses, a classic FSW staple of gitting gud, well you have a point. The game is now designed for summons, not solo. It’s to the point where going in solo is considered the new challenge run. That’s concerning.

[@naterod]

I’ve been all about summons since the mimic tear. When I was stuck at a boss i used to summon other players now I just use the mimic.

[@papertoad456]

Facts.

[@rebirthofgodrics907]

Calling solo a challenge is quite annoying. The game is design to be done solo, summons are there to lighten up the weight. Is like saying the game was designed around the blasphemous blade cause of how it makes the game more manageable. Playing without summons it’s just the normal run, playing with summons is normal run too, it’s the same as making an op build with blood fiend arm without summon. A challenge run has more to do with doing something the game didn’t intend speed running, rl 1 naked, playing with a banana or a hit less run. Summons is in the same line with cracked pots aromatics or magic they are not essential but can surely improve your performance not using sorceries isn’t a challenge. Hitless is a challenge cause you are trying to do something the average player can’t do. There’s a big crowd doing no summons there’s very few people doing hitless or rl 1. Fighting a boss 100 times is not the same as starting the game all over again 100 time cause you failed the challenge.

[@stevemichael652]

@@rebirthofgodrics907 you’re correct. Only, the devs know the summons are going to be used more than the other stuff. I’ve beaten the dlc with mimic and it’s so damn easy I was offended. The margin for error is maximized tenfold. I’d go solo for hours , see where I messed up, and then the one time with mimic, make those same mistakes a few times but bc of mimic, won on the first attempt. The game is NOT meant to be played without summons. They made the bosses that hard thinking everyone was on board with the ash summons and that’s not the case.

[@thebenc1537]

Not every game should have the same level of difficulty. Candy Crush and Dark Souls both exist and thats a good thing. Some games should be difficult without catering to the unskilled. When things get difficult some people are weak and quit while others are more strong willed and continue on until they are victorious. We need games like that.

[@aolegion35]

1. Tree fragments or the amount they level you isn't the problem. Finding them is. If you want all of them, the game forces players to go out of their way. Leveling isn't organic. This has been a bad idea in every game that has done it. 2. Souls games do not need a difficulty slider. If you don't want to learn them, then don't play them. Elden Ring is the 1st Firmsoft game I've really been into. I've played others but never gotten into the beatings you have to take to learn the bosses. This is the identity of Souls games, and if someone doesn't like it, they don't have to play it. Video games are luxury items, not necessities of life. Lastly, why make games that make you go out of your way to even know whats happening in the story easy. The only thing you get from it is saying you played it, and if you can't beat it on even its recommended settings, you have nothing to bring to the conversation.

[@bazokarpg1999]

After beating the dlc twice one with summons/ashes/cheese and one fully solo, I have to say the scadutree system is a bad system that didn't solve anything and ruined several things for me. It makes the dlc less replayable due to need of being on lvl for specific bosses. It didn't stop the exploration from being less boring because they are pretty much a none reward instead of exciting things like weapons, armor and talismans It ruined coop as hosts lvl vary and some of them fight bosses like messmer and Midra at low levels where their basic attacks take 70% of my hp Despite being as important sacred tears and golden seeds they are placed randomly unlike sacred tears and their are no extra fragments to make them less tedious like golden seeds.

[@LeafJFYT]

The lack of spares to make collecting feel less tedious is definitely a big problem - I collected all fragments but one in the DLC, meaning I was a scadu blessing down and would have to scour the entire map I'd spent 20 hours exploring to find the fragment I missed, just to get an extra % or so - yeah, no thanks. You're also right about it being a non-reward. Scadu blessings don't really make you feel stronger, more like you're just overcoming an arbitrary barrier. It's not a system that feels good to engage with but without it, there'd be even less reasons to explore.

[@AstonishingRed]

My opinion won’t be a popular one, but I do want other people who shy away from these games to experience them. The thing is, I want people to experience them as they were intended. Without a casual mode. Fight through the bosses and find their own ways to overcome them. That’s the intended Souls experience that’s united so many fans for years 😊

[@LuciferHunter-kt7pm]

I didn’t really have too much trouble at all. I’m not sure what’s going on here.

[@soyborne.bornmadeandundone1342]

Lol I only died like 100 times, I kicked azz!

[@SiliconSlyWolf]

I forget the channel, but it was a guy who beats Souls games with unusual things, like a guitar hero controller, and he's accused some of the base Elden Ring bosses of getting to the point of unfair. And in short, I didn't enjoy my time in the long run in Elden Ring, I didn't feel joy at beating a boss, but more of a relief the misery is over. Nioh however, I actually enjoy, as various things seem to come together that make me feel I'm actually developing strategies. Ironically though, I have beat Elden Ring but not Nioh yet. Only reason is Elden Ring more open world allows me to get back to most bosses quicker, whereas Nioh can sometimes required I fight back through parts of the stage again and again, and drain my time vs. feeling of progress, BUT, I absolutely enjoyed that progress I have done. I've always had a somewhat slow reaction time, I can never do parry mechanics in the vast majority of games, especially when enemies have fast, medium, and slow attack speeds. It's just impossible for me to do, but I can beat games that encourage parry, but don't require it. But there there's people with worse issues, one I heard of recently on another youtube channel, is someone with a brother that has Kabuki syndrome. His brother has physical difficulty keeping track of the idea of even having things like healing potions in a game, and the difficulty of even Elden Ring, considered easiest of the Fromsoft games, this guy might not be able to share the experience with his brother without mods. Also, there are people who might actually get into difficult games more with a easier one first, or easier game settings. You get going, learn the game, then start to think "I can do better," and then crank up the difficulty. Rich of Review Tech USA even mentioned Elden Ring got him to consider the other Fromsoft games again, when he previously felt he just didn't have time to bash his head against the wall with them. I will ALWAYS be pro difficulty options. You either lose potential customers by gatekeeping them out entirely, and might gain even more sales if a person can easy into the game and try even more of them later.

[@topoffthecoupe1871]

Nah.

[@murums2104]

I am hyped for the DLC! But first i need to complete the main story

[@josec.6394]

The problem is not the game being hard. The problem is being hard for the wrong reasons: undodgeable attacks, delayed attack spam, and unfair mechanics. Bloodborne, Sekiro, and DS1 were hard but fair, I beat all of those and would do it again. Those games were not accessible, but they rewarded getting good at the mechanics, so beating them felt earned. In Elden Ring, the games feels unfair and painful without summons and meta builds and too easy with those. So difficulty is not the problem. I can beat a boss like Malenia first try with the mimic summon and spamming the rivers of blood, but that wouldn't feel earned to me. But if I want to beat a boss like that on my terms, I'll have to engage in broken mechanics that are not fair in any way like Waterfowl Dance. The previous games knew how to strike a sweet spot between those 2 difficulty poles, but it seems they are not interested in fairness as a core of the difficulty anymore. As it stands, I'll not be pruchasing from soft games until I see a change in design philosophy. It's not worth my money anymore, and it pains me to say that as a great fan of Miyazaki.

[@Onorel]

There is an easy mode in Elden ring, just not through sliders. You get a gold pickled fowl foot and you go kill Greyoll, you cheese the night cav and then boom you're like level 40ish. Then you go get the bloodhound's fang, get it to +5. That's ER's easy mode, takes like an hour or so. Then when you can you go get the blasphemous blade, you press L2, and you win, they might as wee roll the end credits at that point. I don't understand why people want a slider so bad.

[@thebenc1537]

But I found this giant enemy with some normal sized soldiers and the big guy hit me with a giant club and I died. The club was bigger than all of the trees in the game, I dont know how the hell he made it! I tried one more time, this time attacking the smaller guards first. I died. I hate the game. It should be easier for people like me! A game be this hard only when someone changes the difficulty settings!

[@Onorel]

@@thebenc1537 I get it. This game isn't a cake walk by any stretch of the imagination. But I'm a 44 year old dad, casual player, and I've beaten the DLC twice now. If you want I could help you out man.

[@thebenc1537]

@@Onorel I was being sarcastic, mocking the people who whine like that. I guess I imitated them too well.

[@samogonbrother]

@@thebenc1537 those spelling errors made it a perfect impression

[@santiagomoralesgarcia1802]

I played Draks souls 1 10 years ago (2014), I used a normal sword and a shield to beat the game, some bosses were hard but still fair, the real problem was going all the way to the boss room because those bonfire were really that far form thoes bosses. Then I played bloodborne in 2015 and the dlc in 2016, using blades of mercy, those defield bosses were hard because a lot of them can one shot you because you have the half of your HP, also Orphan of kos was very aggresive, but even with that i keep saying those bosses are fair because hunter moves very quickly. Laurence and defield watchdog took me 2 hours and 30 minuto to defeat them. bloodborne has some problems with latterns being very far away from some bosses Then Dark souls 3 happened, I felt some enemies should be in bloodborne because how fast some of them are and the ashes one is slower than the hunter. Nameless king is hard because his delay attacks and frieren is hard because she has 3 phases. I played with a normal built so the fairness was reaching the limits. Nameless king took me 2 hours to defeat him. I played sekiro in 2022, getting used to the mechanic was hard at the beggining but at the end the game becomes so great to play, even when saint isshin took me 2 hours and 30 minutes to defeat him, i really enjoy the fight, even the next day i played against isshin again because like a said that fight (a lot of fights in sekiro) is really fun. Now it is the trun of elden ring, 2/3 of the game is great (Mountaintops of the Giants shouldn't exit), exploring feels great, at the dlc being small but more dense makes it better than the base game, but the base game and dlc is made of using OP builds (like armoc core 6) or using mimics, if you are using normal builds like i did in dark souls 1, bloodborne and dark souls 3, you are going to suffer, but the worst bosses are more over tunned than the bosses from bloodborne and dark souls 3, when tarnished moves and attacks slower than the ashes one and hunter, I wacthed a video where the final boss in the elden ring dlc spent 13 seconds attacking, and even with all those Scadutree Fragments he deals small damage. I spent almost 6 hours defeating malenia, 2 hous defating the dancing lion (have few Scadutree Fragments), 3.5 hours defeating rellena ( Scadutree Fragments), 2.5 hours defeating messmer (i have like level 8 in Scadutree Fragments), but somehow i was still suing my build and part of me was sasying get gut, the dlc final boss happened, spending two hour in him but second phase was the moment I said enough I changed my build and used a shield build, and yeah i defeated him in 3 tries (trying to get used to that build), and the I felt angry and didn't enjoy that battle (to be fair i didn't enjoy most of the elden ring bosses) . I don't kwon if fromsoftware is trying to make bosses for those "NO HIT RUN" guys like it is showed in 16:13 but malenia with that waterflow dance and dlc 2nd phase final boss showed the limits of the character moveset.

[@81stCommander]

I realised straight away how import the Scadu fragments are. Luckily finding them suited the way I like the play Elden Ring. I like to try and explore the whole area before I even attempt to beat the main boss of that area. So I was level 12/20 by the time I got to Messmer, and didn't have much trouble with him. I would rather spend my time exploring the game and levelling up and getting loot then wasting my time by rushing to a boss and being underleveled, then dying over and over. I'm gonna use every tool I've looted to beat the game in the most fun and convenient way.

[@The7DirtyWords]

there are only 2 hard bosses Giaus and Final Boss....this is my first and only soulslike game and this DLC isn't that bad if you aren't bad at games.

[@puncherofbread]

I do want to preface this by saying I am someone who plays lots of souls games so this might be a bit biased but here we go. Shadow of The Erdtree reminds me a lot more of Old Hunters for Bloodborne when everyone was expecting the DS2 or DS3 DLCs in terms of steps up. Old Hunters is unique when compared to other FS DLC because other than SoTE it's the only DLC they made for their Dark Souls but something else type of game. Dark Souls and by extension Elden Ring involve a large number of open systems at the player's disposal and they can pick and choose what to integrate into a build. Then the DLCs add more content into the existing systems with more bosses, areas, and enemies but keeping that same open-ness. Bloodborne is more similar to Sekiro because it revolves around a smaller number of closed systems that depending on build the player will have better or worse affitinity with (Arcane w/ throwables and spells, Skill w/ reposte, Strength w/ overall DPS, and Bloodtinge w/ guns). There's other systems like rallying, breaking limbs, and gun parrying that are foundational to combat although some builds rely on them more than others for effectiveness. However, most of base game Bloodborne is pretty leniant with how you can engage with these systems. I'd say they can more or less be there if you can use them although if you are good at using them it can often give you a real edge in combat as intended. Old hunters ups the difficulty by not only making more tense encounters but also reigning in how much you can ignore the systems. Parrying can be pretty much ignored in the base game if you are a strength build but in the DLC some of the scariest enemies imagineable can be brought down by nothing but a pistol and a good visceral. And that's why I really like Old Hunters, because it's not only more of my favorite game but it allows me to use more of the fun systems in the base game without instantly killing my opponent. Shadow of The Erdtree brought back that same feeling for me that stepping into Old Hunters did where it focused on tightening the systems around the player and wanting them to engage with them more. In the base game I rarely summoned unless I was really stuck because no matter what summon I used I just couldn't fit them into my playstyle. By the end of the DLC I had gone from looking at my summons as a handicap I didn't need to a friend that had valiently fought alongside me on my journey. I also found myself using magic and buffing myself more and especially when I would get stuck on a boss I'd just leave and come back when I felt ready. And the fact that jumping is now incredibly helpful against certain bosses instead of feeling like a traversal mechanic was a great feeling, running from attacks was also a fun switch up. I honestly found the base game of Elden Ring to be kinda meh at times especially in the boss department and this DLC had a fantasic boss roster.

[@theroguerider]

I would put collecting items to get stronger on the “artificial difficulty” list very top. The game is about passing through a fog wall and beating the boss. If you are unable to, you get a little more HP, FP, STR, etc and head back in and hopefully that extra bit helps along with you getting better at the mechanics. So suddenly making progress is tied to collecting trash along the sides of the road instead of improving? Now come at me, who cares, but I love ER and really like SotE, but this is just boring. If someone wants to go in overpowered, why was it suddenly an issue when it never was before? Why are there so MANY areas that are so empty? There are so many things they could’ve done differently starting with “nothing”. You need to be a certain level to beat Mohg, that average is where it all starts and you go from there. Or maybe fragments are dropped off of bosses? So you are progressing through the game still feeling like you have to beat X to be good enough for Y. No, instead I’m wandering around wondering if I’ve found all the fragments to help me. Are there more fragments to reach the 20/10 cap? Like how there are SIGNIFICANTLY more golden seeds and sacred tears to proceed. No, there is JUST enough to get the cap. I get it, you people loved it, but criticism doesn’t mean there is hate, it means we care enough to say, “was this really your best?’ After TWO years and change, THIS is your GOTY quality DLC? Infinite poise and stamina enemies? Other than Radahn, I found most of the bosses pretty easy. The regular enemies were a bigger pain in the ass usually. The issue is this in my opinion, you have MANY types of players that have been in this narrow niche in gaming. Most gatekeeping with BULLSHIT comments like “gitgud” and other useless bragging. There are no-hit run players. There are always solo with no summon players. There are ashes and NPC summon players. There are people who summon real players. All of these people are playing the game the way they want to play it. FromSoft has always set you free and told you to figure it out and play the way you want. Elden Ring comes out and it’s more accessible than ANY OTHER Souls game to date so it brings in a TON of new people who hear even they can beat it. So with this new found player base, what does FromSoft do? Levels you with the DLC that says, “Hey you may want a specific physick that drops off a Fire Golem. And you might want this particular weapon for this fight. Oh, and there’s a talisman that will make this fight easier too. Oh and don’t forget about collecting all the fragments.” The game with all the freedom suddenly tells you that your build, the one you played the whole game with, and have gained enormous amounts of synergy, isn’t going to cut it because… well, because they don’t want you burning through the DLC? Why are they suddenly telling me this is what they want? *I* am in charge of the “easy button”. I press it by over-leveling if I wish, or under-leveling to increase the challenge. But suddenly they’re concerned? I personally felt like the levels and the overlapping verticality of SotE was amazing, but as a whole, it’s a little hollow beyond that. Mind you, FromSoft “hollow” is better than 90% of other games out there. It’s just weird how a game that was developed over 2 years somehow felt rushed to me. A lot of questionable choices were made that could’ve been eliminated easily. FromSoft has really gotten into this “always making a game” idea and I think it might be finally catching up with them. If you’re running out of ideas on how to make bosses, you just make it artificially harder. It’s why Dark Souls II is seen as an outlier. I’m sure this is too long for most attention spans, including mine, but I think people are being too polarizing. REGARDLESS of what YOU think, it doesn’t mean SHIT to someone who feels differently. You thought it was easy? Great! As long as you had fun, that’s all I care about. Stop shitting on people who are having a different experience. I’m sure you’ve run into a boss that tore you a new one and a friend said it was “easy” and vise versa. It’s just how these games work. I don’t know why I was so in tune with the boss attacks in the DLC, but I was and I beat them far easier than I EVER have in any other game. my bonafides: Platinums in all souls games except for Sekiro because you can’t build yourself up like the other games AND my nerves are SHOT (long story) and I can’t react fast enough to the different responses to attacks. Be well fellow fans, we all want the same thing here.

[@Owlr4ider]

I don't think that the DLC actually forces you to play a specific build but rather it forces you to optimize your chosen build, both in terms of the build itself and how your play style takes advantage of your build. Elden Ring's innovation in the Souls genre is precisely this aspect of building the character, which is much more pronounced and important than in any of their previous titles. A lot of people simply don't understand this aspect and insist on brushing it aside because skill should make up for everything else. Well, it still does, it's just that skill in Elden Ring is not just mechanical like it was in their previous titles but also analytical. Elden Ring is simply not the game to try to beat at level 1, completely naked and with only your starting weapon like you could do in basically every Dark Souls game if you were skilled enough.

[@theroguerider]

@@Owlr4ider My best argument against that would be how often you go to Radahn fight to help and how many people are spear and shield.

[@Owlr4ider]

@@theroguerider There are many different reasons why spear and shield is a very popular setup against Radahn. Some of them have to do with power level, others with player expectations(trying to replicate that Dark Souls classic sword and board play style), etc. It doesn't mean it's the only choice, far from it.

[@Magnificent-S]

Er does have an easy mode it’s called making a bleed build or a magic build

[@jaytico5835]

Hard but fair was the ideology.

[@DionPanday]

Emphasis on was

[@samueldawkins]

@@DionPanday yup

[@Bayle-the-Dread-Dragon]

Scadutree fragments exist guys

[@samueldawkins]

@@Bayle-the-Dread-Dragon shut up you know you aren't telling anyone something they don't know

[@Bayle-the-Dread-Dragon]

@@samueldawkins but if they are struggling to the point of whining they clearly rushed to the bosses and never explored

[@TheMajesticGG]

I really don't get how people beat the base game and think the DLC is too hard. It's really not that much harder than the base game.

[@MildsandThatYac]

Exactly and especially with all these broken spells and weapon arts. Stun locking has never been easier

[@benjamincorbett]

It’s a bit easier I think. Both very hard

[@kjbzabrini768]

I'm almost 90% sure that these people wanted their builds to be as useful as they were in the base game so they ignored exploring and went straight to the bosses and got two tapped. I just started playing yesterday and I've already beaten 4 remembrance bosses,this dlc is not lightyears harder than the base game like some reviews are saying.

[@benjamincorbett]

@@kjbzabrini768 yeah you’re right.

[@austin0_bandit05]

How is it not harder than base game? It has Malenia, I guess but the rest of them werent that bad

[@KekkonenInJapan]

Great video! I don't know. I used to think that the souls-games should have difficulty options, but now I'm not so sure. On the one hand, these games are incredibly designed and there are people in my life that I would love if they were able to play them, but I also have to think back to when I started playing. I bounced off both Demon's Souls and Dark Souls and finally it was Bloodborne that became my gateway drug. Thanks to finally conquering Bloodborne I am now a huge fan that has gone back and played all their games. But if difficulty options had existed back when I bounced off Demon's Souls and Dark Souls, I probably would have lowered the difficulty, and in so doing I would have robbed myself of this wonderful experience finally overcoming these games. That I think is the danger with difficulty options. But things like summons, ashes of war etc are great ways of mitigating that difficulty without turning it off, in my opinion.

[@NoChylDyl]

This dude decided to spit facts for 33 minutes🔥

[@Raidon484]

The question of "Can a game be too hard" is undoubtedly to be answered with yes. Take a look at a neat little boss called "Any Radiance". It's just a mod, don't worry, but if we were to get a game that difficult, then it would be too hard.

[@MilkT0ast]

Heres a quick tip for any one struggling with the dlc. Focus on "physical damage negation" Use the Dragon Crest Great Shield Talisman (20%) Use the Opline Hardtear in the Physiks Flask. (10%) Eat Boiled crab (20%) And cast Golden Vow (10%) That's a total of 60% off the damage you would normally take. And this is NAKED. if you wear heavy armour, it can get up to 80%. And all this for 25 faith. And 1 talisman slot and 1 physics slot. Very very low investment for such a strong build. And if you don't want faith, just don't use Golden Vow.

[@clownshoegaming4772]

or just bleed......maybe some frost....but deffo loads more bleed, it's even more OP than when rivers of blood was the go to

[@soyborne.bornmadeandundone1342]

Great advice... Unless you were me going in on ngplus7. Then everything you just said kind of means jack shiz lololol

[@Cold_Zero_The_Wise]

​@@soyborne.bornmadeandundone1342if it's NG+1 then your wrong I'm on NG+ and running now Scadu tree blessing for the my first go at the DLC and I'm having a blast

[@david_kingori]

​@@soyborne.bornmadeandundone1342he is correct. Buffs do more negation than actual armor. Even on Ng+7, they work wonders

[@david_kingori]

You don't even need 25 faith since golden vow is an aow and an item (consumable)

[@chrislail3824]

I’m stuck in Dragon Pit and it feels awful because it’s just rough, I’m trying to get through this and it just feels unfair because of how much I’ve put into it. I like the idea of a new level system and I’m trying to adjust but the gap in time between release and this makes it a little too hard.

[@prestongarvey4259]

I would love the dlc alot more if enemies didn't 2 shot me when starting out, simple dogs and soldiers destroying me because I didn't want to collect scooby doo snacks because I shouldn't need to, I was ready for more adventure, to explore and take in the beauty of the world, instead all I received was frustration from start till now, I have not beat it, stuck at Bayle and want him dead before I blow my own brains out. The bosses are way too flashy and fast, very few of them don't have 20 hit combo's like Romina I believe her name is, I liked her, loved her because she didn't have some flashy aoe move that covered the entire arena and even if I dodged I'd still get hit or had combo's so long and so fast that I have no time to think. Or Trina's knight which reminded me heavily of Kos from his sword, he wasn't bullshit and I enjoyed his fight. The Demi-human in the cave that fights like a skilled assassin and uses the force, liked his fight, or the Omen thing that had a cool clone gimmick, loved that one. but Messmer, Bayle, standard enemies, those fuck off walking burning men peppered around the map, all just...fucking stupid. TLDR delete Bayle from the game, worst boss I've ever had the displeasure of fighting in any game ever.

[@RickMartin-xt1id]

Scrub Mentality

[@soyborne.bornmadeandundone1342]

@@RickMartin-xt1id It's always the actual scrub who insults others like this. Notice you don't have ANY footage of you being good at the game. Typical bad kid calling others bad kids without permission. Any a hole has a phone that they can upload footage with since about 10 years ago. No excuses scrub. Nothing more annoying than a bragger who can't back up his claims. Prestong makes a good point. Finding the fragments was more chore than good times.

[@GreenStreetSlim]

FromSoft games are not my cup of tea. Put maybe 40 hrs into ER, but then got exhausted. I pretty much agree with everything you said in the vid. You may be great at From Software games, but you may need to play RTS games on easy or get stomped in competitive sports games. I will say this though, if you ignore game mechanics then bitch about them, you really really need to "gitgud" at video games.

[@slouch186]

games can feel too easy or too difficult for an individual player to enjoy, and that's fine. different people want to have different experiences.

[@mvh-]

Final boss is pretty crazy. Other than that this DLC is not that hard at all. Spoilers Lion: fun boss, decently difficult Rellana: kinda difficult but fair and fun Messmer: very hard, just as fair, the single most fun boss fight imo when I was learning him. Commander gaius: yeh this guy sucks but he’s not that hard Putrescent knight: hard, kinda fun Scadutree avatar: not hard, decently fun Romina: very easy, somewhat enjoyable Radahn: ridiculously hard but still fair for the most part. Not that fun if I’m honest sometimes feels like bs Leda: (if you want to count her) was annoying as f*ck but not too hard. Bayle: Beat him 4th attempt, Ik a lot of people struggle with him and Tbh Ik a lot of people might struggle with a-lot if these bosses. Very fun fight, super epic boss. Also, F*CK YOU BAYLEEEEEEEE. Overall I understand it’s not just a get gud angle, some players like mentioned in this video will have strengths and weaknesses but the game isn’t impossible, only the nerds will make fun of you for not be able to beat it summonless. Its doable for the average player like me so anyone can beat it with enough effort and time.

[@soyborne.bornmadeandundone1342]

They can never show proof that they did it without summons. Funny that...

[@HuntersGamingx]

The dlc final boss made me make a new player. Trying to beat him at NG+6 was too much for me.

[@jh9794]

I salute anyone crazy eno8gh to go that high. But after J2 I tend to just start a new character.

[@soyborne.bornmadeandundone1342]

@@jh9794 Thank you for saluting me. I did it twice. Crap cost me over 100 rune archs lololol

[@patrickempson7366]

If they let us have our stats from the base game carry over into the dlc and whoever thought it was a good idea to do a weird leveling system. We don’t care if we steamroll it we play these games multiple times.

[@benzyl350]

I think one of the best and worst aspects of fromsoft games is it's relationship with people talking a out it online. I got the DLC and I play Elden Ring regularly, but I have not beaten it yet and don't know even how far into it. The problem is people heard the DLC was coming out and they basically tried to speed run the thing without taking it in, I think, because they have been looking too much into all 'steps' to win it, rather than treating the DLC like more Elden Ring. I found the scaterdtree bits from exploring, I found the revered soul whatever by just exploring. I didn't look up walk-throughs or tips and tricks. I think that's the problem with the DLC is there's too much information online and people are missing the point of exploring and taking in the game for themselves and having their own experience, they want to have the 'right' experience which they will never have if they're constantly looking up lore videos and consulting everyone else online to for how to do things right. Don't get me wrong, I love the unbridled passion people have for Fromsoft games and their desire to talk about them online, but this can really detract from just experiencing the game for yourself. I think you should at least play these games blind first and look up stuff if you're truly stuck and literally feel like you have nothing else to do, but Elden Ring has so much content I can't imagine a situation where you can't go do something else if you're stuck. I get stuck all the time in the DLC. I don't stop playing, I just hightail it in the other direction and go find something else to do. Bosses will be there when I'm ready. And I think that's the playstyle the Fromsoft philosophy encourages but is actively diminished by this overzealous need to hit all the steps to win. If the internet says your next bit of story progression is locked behind a boss of some sort, a lot of Fromsoft heads will do what they always do, bang their heads against the wall dozens and dozens of times and brute force their progression rather than letting it happen naturally through exploration. I think that's what the scaterdtree fragments exist for, to make players have to go explore just like they did in the base game. That's why no one considers getting more estus charges in the base game as a problem, but somehow getting the fragments in the DLC makes the game harder. It's the intended way of playing.

[@rezm1r]

As a Capcom/Nintendo fan, I believe games are meant to be played, not lived in for too long. (Guess this could go against live service games too, huh?) Video games are interactive media/art/storytelling. Self-expression to some regard like you mentioned. If the gameplay isn't fun, character and environments are not memorable, and the music or ambiance isn’t up to snuff or immersive, then it's considered a bad game in my eyes. Replayability is also a big factor, because it shows how much content there is to find and what the players may engage in if they desire that higher sense of skill. I've played Dark Souls 1 complete and passed by elden ring for a few hours and love the gameplay and how it meshes well with storytelling and game design. I usually play games now on harder difficulties to get that edge of enjoyment out of them so i can learn the games mechanics to the fullest (if it isn't artificial). Some day, i'll complete one of the Ghosts n Goblins titles, as that is one of the rare games i have yet to finish out of a library of hundreds that i have beaten. Challenge is important to the dedicated player. It should drive them if the skill and content are rewarding and expressive.

[@dsteddd6087]

I think that scadutree stuff is the reason of this drama. And I kinda agree. It dissconnects the main game from the dlc. F.e., I played main game for the first time when dlc already came up. Im not that good at these type of games so I tried to kill every boss in every location possible (also i thought that smithings stones are so rare, so i only upgraded my weapon to +6, hoping to find my perfect weapon later)). I was lvl 140 at the end of the game. And then, dlc has new rules that no matter how lvld or strong you r - you will have to collect some new stuff to be able to compete with this world. If this was like new game Elden Ring 2: Revenge of Miquella it would be fine. People would react positevely. “Its nee freaking game, it has to be hard”. Meanwhile, players are forced to be weak again in the same game with new rules. So for me the whole experience (game+dlc) doesnt feel cohesive. Also, lorewise (SPOILER AHEAD!) - we became Elden Lord and then first boss (For me personally it was random knight in some mausoleum) oneshots us. Kinda doesnt make sense. So yeah, new rules - should always mean new game. Or people will backlash.

[@liamzriouil9597]

souls games are really hard to et into for me because of the difficulty, i just get turned off after smashing my head against a wall for 1hr . I feel like from an outsiders perspective to fromsoft games, shadow of the erdtree is kind of like having to relearn how to play the game for veteran players kinda getting that first experience of getting your ass kicked all over again . Feeling like a noob after haven sunk a bunch of hours into souls games is a good feeling for some but isnt for others.

[@benjamincorbett]

Others get a similar frustration from animal crossing. Both games aren’t for everyone.

[@DanielRamirez-vb2ix]

just another lowley tarnished that tried but failed in mending the elden ringer🤣

[@ZacTheCrippleFTW]

I had to give up on the final boss of the dlc...I'm terrible at Souls games I used everything abused the maxed out Mimic Tear in the DLC maxed out on the fragments that buff you in the dlc used the NPC summons in bale's and Messmer's rooms. I even went through the base game twice more to beef up my stats...tbh the DLC wasn't so bad but that final boss...I gave up...I just looked up the ending on KZbin...I tried for 2 weeks...

[@j0nnyism]

I think you’re confusing unfair difficulty with artificial difficulty at times but you make some good points

[@guswautier9410]

The point of the fixed difficulty is that it allows you to be able to beat something difficult. In most games with difficulty sliders I end up choosing the easy option because it allows me to do so but in Eldin Ring since I can't do that I was actually able to beat the game at the intended difficulty. Adding and easy mode makes the game less accessible because most people including my self would not have the willpower to access the game. You used the quote "a game for everybody is a game for nobody" and that holds true here. Having the opportunity to play a difficult game without the option of playing it on easy mode is a feature in itself that a few games at least need to have. I would be sad If I was not given the chance to challenge myself anymore. The channel Ratatoskr made a video on this view of the difficulty discussion which was really good.

[@DionPanday]

Elden ring sold 25 million copies, won game of the year and Miyazaki himself said the game was made more accessible for new players. If there was ever a game made for everyone it’s Elden ring. Wich is why demons souls is superior

[@Wrath8036]

You mean the one where world tendency in place where when on death you lost half your health, and got locked out of areas beacuse a world bad world tendency? If your not then you didnt play the same game as it was inteneded. Demon Souls has to be one of the most brutal fromsoft games, even then those are only some of the machines that where left out of the remake. ​@DionPanday

[@albert2006xp]

Are you real? If you can't help yourself from turning the easy setting on, that's not on the game, that's on YOU. Praising the game for baby proofing itself against your own foolishness is absurd. Also, the game isn't hard because way too many players have beaten it. That should be your first clue. I've played enough multiplayer games to know that not even 1% of gamers are remotely mentally capable of beating something truly hard. The trick is the game design makes the game SEEM hard, due to presenting you with challenges that you can postpone and do later and having to learn by trial and error. What people mean by the game is too hard is that the game doesn't let them skip their way through only doing the main line like they do in the other games they've thoroughly robbed themselves out of experiencing properly. It's not that it's hard, it's that it's not fast enough to get through, it's that it's designed to not be rush-able. They want to pay money to play games less because they're pathetic casuals who think they got better things to do than game. I think these games are clunky bad PC ports that are too console-ized but screw those people that finish 120 hour games in 30 hours. No sympathy for them.

[@david_kingori]

​@@DionPandaynot for everyone but definitely for a larger audience

[@kairu_aname]

My problem with ratotoskr is he's self proclaimed "miyazaki di ck rider". The problem there is that when you criticize the game lore and how you interact with it he responds with, "Well, you're not a writer. Show me books you've written."

[@the.bloodless.one1312]

The bosses in Elden Ring aren’t too hard. They’re poorly designed for the moveset of a Dark Souls game. Sekiro bosses in Dark Souls. Dodge roll, sprint and poke.. while the boss is back flipping, teleporting, cartwheeling. I’ve had fun with some of the DLC bosses. They’re not PURE a$$… but so many of them haven’t even gotten close to giving me that engaging back and forth flowstate of Bloodborne, and that feeling of “I wanna fight that boss again!” So many bosses just blazing all over the arena, and you’re spending half the time running after them with the slow af Dark Souls sprint speed.. And then when you do get close there’s a 40 year long attack combo you gotta dodge through.. me then FINALLY at the end of that you have a fraction of a micro second to poke the before it starts back all over again bouncing off the walls and swinging of the chandeliers.. ☠️. it’s just one sided, and it’s a drag. It’s not fun. I literally keep thinking how much more fun some of these bosses would be if we had a DMC move set FFS.. These are complaints I had with the base game also. They shouldn’t have made this game play like Dark Souls if they wanted To make bosses that are so quick and aggressive. They shoulda done like what they did with Bloodborne and modify the move set or add new play mechanics to match the boss design.. Dark Souls was ALWAYS a slow methodical game. The play mechanics are not suited for DMC style bosses..

[@Owlr4ider]

Except Elden Ring is not a Dark Souls game, it's its own thing. Your build is actually important, unlike in any of the Dark Souls games. You need to be able to take advantage of it. The way you described combat tells me that you simply didn't put enough emphasis on the build aspect of the game, either the build itself, how the build you chose should fit with how you prefer to play the game or both. You know all these 'cheesy overpowered builds'? Yeah, they exist for a reason. I'm not saying you should play a cheesy overpowered build but I am saying is that you should incorporate certain elements that some may call 'cheesy' or 'overpowered' when these elements fit the play style you're trying to play. It's the same argument people had in Sekiro when they refused to use the augment system and than complained about a bunch of things being too hard because they refused to engage with that system. Some of these people did stick it out and eventually mastered the game to such a degree that they prevailed despite their stubbornness, others did begin using some of the augments, not necessarily the most OP ones mind you but those that fit their preferred play style. Many others did neither and simply quit. Elden Ring took the augment system of Sekiro to a whole other level, to the point where completely ignoring it simply is no longer an option, like it was in Sekiro. It's simply your choice of how to engage with the system, not whether to engage with it in the first place or not.

[@kairu_aname]

​@@Owlr4ider Of course you "git gud"ers never understand a point.

[@Owlr4ider]

@@kairu_aname If all you got from my post is 'git gud' than you're beyond help. I don't know what else to tell you...

[@kairu_aname]

@@Owlr4ider That's all it boils down to.

[@Owlr4ider]

@@kairu_aname Hardly. In fact my entire post was about everything other than git gud. But than again, as I just said, I can't really help you there... Reading comprehension is hard, I know. Maybe you need a refresher, I don't know...

[@Ordoabchao-x9k]

Thanks to SOTE i went back to playing koei games, from ninja gaiden to rise of ronin. They're so much better combat wise and the characters there actually look like humans and not putty people.

[@metalcyborg8601]

Maybe I just have monkey poop for brains and/or too am biased (as Elden Ring is possibly my favorite game ever), yet while I don't entirely disagree with wonky animations and balancing and whatnot, I also think the criticism is slightly overblown. Going into SOTE I loved the feeling like I was back at step one in the base game. It basically told me if I want to stand a chance at this expansion, I needed to git gud... again. Didn't matter how OP I was in the base game, I was gonna get shredded in SOTE if I didn't level up myself, my weapons, abilities, etc. It told me if my build and playstyle was already tightened up in the base game, I was going to need to further tighten and refine them for the Land of Shadow. It pushed me to get better, better, and more better. I know the difficulty argument is something we are all tired of at this point, but I want to put in my two cents. FromSoftware's games are designed for a very specific experience. They are intentionally designed to be hard in order for the player to feel a sense of pride and accomplishment. Some people have repeatedly requested that FromSoft put an easy mode in their game despite the company repeatedly saying they have no interest in doing so. There are people out there who don't care about that pride and accomplishment feeling and just want to beat the game. If that's what you're looking for, then the SoulsBorne games are simply not going to be for you. I feel like some people want to try Elden Ring simply because it is popular and want to fit in with the cool crowd. If you just can't bring yourself to enjoy the game for whatever reason, if it just isn't clicking for you, don't push yourself to continue playing. No one will think less of you at all. I certainly will not.

[@grinreaper2774]

The dlc gives all of the tools necessary to make it easy, it's up to you to use them.

[@soyborne.bornmadeandundone1342]

Another a hole calling it easy while not having any videos of him smoothing through the game as if it was easy lol.

[@D3humaniz3d]

I hate the association between Fromsoft games being "that difficult game you play to challenge yourself". That's bullshit. I've played these games since DS1 and the main motivation for me was going forward and experiencing what the world had to offer, the environments, creatures, items and lore, not the difficulty. Difficulty was a narrative tool. If an activity is not fun, I don't do it. ELDEN ring does not provide enough well developed, engaging mechanics to justify the level of complexity Fromsoft decided to give their bosses in the entirety of ER - and in my opinion, they realized that, and added Spirit Ashes as a band aid.

[@LazerDisk]

The final battle feels underwhelming visually and doesn’t really feel like it’s built up to. I think something more akin to the path to Bayle is more in line with hyping up and preparing the player, but reaching the final boss felt meh. I felt more from the battle right before against Leda. Gwyn, Gehrman, and orphan of Kos feel tragic. Soul of Cinder, Gael, and Sister Friede felt climactic. I feel like a capstone on a story, side or otherwise, should feel like the culmination of it all, and the final boss really doesn’t do it for me.

[@musicbrush9231]

I hate hard games because I want to have fun and not get pissed off from getting killed a dozen times in the same place. Having said that, I'm still playing Lies of P as I write this because I want to get better and teach myself to not let the frustration get to me. If it's too much, I put it away until later after I've calmed down. I still have other games I can enjoy until I finally beat this game.

[@BS-gk2cb]

I will die on the hill that scadutree fragments are implemented horribly. It’s to the point where if you point out design complaints in a boss people just respond “use what the game gives you, like the fragments”. This is insane to me. When did gamers become so complacent with design flaws that our solution to difficulty is to just jam bigger number instead of learning how to engage with the boss mechanics in advantageous way? Difficulty by itself is never an issue, but the design to get that difficulty absolutely is.

[@Owlr4ider]

The fragments are the symptom here not the cause. Elden Ring is not Dark Souls, nor Sekiro for that matter. It puts a lot more emphasis on the player's build than any other From Soft game in the past. It's not about the fragments per se but about creating a good build and mastering it in terms of how you actually play it. Just learning the boss' moves, your timing windows, etc, isn't enough any more. They've done that time and time again and decided to experiment wish something new. Giving their players more freedom than ever before in how they engage the game but as a consequence this freedom is actually meaningful. As in if you intentionally use a bad build you are going to struggle. You're not supposed to be able to beat Elden Ring at level 1, completely naked with just your starting weapon like you could any of the Dark Souls games if you were skilled enough. That's what makes Elden Ring different in the From Soft catalogue.

[@Owlr4ider]

The biggest issue Elden Ring, and especially the Erdtree DLC, have is precisely in the managing expectations department. Elden Ring is a From Soft game, which comes with a pre-existing set of expectations. It's also set in the Dark Souls universe so it's seen as a Dark Souls game, despite not at all being one. Than you have this other, opposite, notion of being the most accessible From Soft game. So on the one hand you have the hardcore From Soft fans who expected Elden Ring to be another Dark Souls experience which means that if they were good at Dark Souls they should have been good at Elden Ring. On the other hand you had all these new people who were promised a more accessible experience who simply refused to adopt the necessary mind set of playing any From Soft title, of failing over and over again while learning from your mistakes each time and gradually improve until you finally overcome. The main game had its share of 'issues' with bosses like Melania but the DLC takes it to a whole new level. Both camps mentioned above have the same issue, but for the opposite end of the spectrum. The hardcore From Soft fan base expected mechanical skill to be the end all be all in Elden Ring like it was in all the Dark Souls game and to a slightly lesser extent Sekiro too. You know the type, the ones who challenge themselves to beat all 3 Dark Souls games at level 1 while being completely naked and only using the starting weapon. In Elden Ring these people hit a massive road block as this simply is no longer possible. These players were so prideful and stubborn that they refused to use the tools the game gave them, in terms of build options that are viewed as 'cheesy' or 'overpowered' and even god forbid summons(of whichever variety) even when their usual method of overcoming Dark Souls bosses ceased to work. They refused to change their build, or even simply incorporate a few of these 'cheesy' or 'overpowered' tools into their preferred build(as there are so many options to mix and match different things). On the other hand you have the players who expected a more accessible setting and simply felt lost because they expected Elden Ring to hold their hand like every other game they played did, you know the typical non From Soft triple A experience... So while these 'easy mode' options certainly exist in the game, as you mentioned in the video, they actually require effort by the player to obtain them, the game doesn't simply hand them out to you, nor are they an instant win button or a god mode cheat like very old(80s and 90s era games) used to have. Elden Ring is such an interesting case study in the sense that rather than trying to appease everyone but ended up pleasing no-one, it did the exact opposite: trying to appease no-one and ended up pleasing everyone(as in hardcore From Soft fans and filthy casuals alike). Of course pleasing everyone comes at a cost, which is clearly seen in every discussion surrounding Elden Ring. From the difficulty to the boss design to the open world, etc. While many people have something they like in Elden Ring, they also have things they dislike because Elden Ring was not designed to catered specifically to them. In typical From Soft community fashion, the discussions are all heavily skewed in favor of the hardcore fans, as everyone else receives the obligatory 'git gud' replies, whereas these very hardcore fans themselves need to 'git gud' at Elden Ring, as it's simply not Dark Souls and require a different mind set.

[@comradekims.d.]

I was a master at sekiro and I definitely agree this dlc is artificial difficulty but I only play souls to cheese.

[@LuckyRaphi]

The only complaint i have about the dlc, it was empty sometimes. Even more empty than the base game. I loved the boss and enemy design and the dungeons were cool but short. It was so much more than any other souls dlc. Radahn was probably harder than melania (on level 14, i was to lazy to find the upgrades) but he was actually easy when i found the trick. The last boss was truly a masterpiece, I know what you did there Miyazaki 😂

[@JustADadGaming]

Thought your video was great, I am not amazing. Most of the DLC bosses take me somewhere between 30 and 70 attempts but if I’m struggling too much I explore I get some fragments I level up a bit and each new level helps me overcome. I think that is most peoples issue. They want to brute force it, I do too, but I know my limits so I will play by the rules.

[@highlord2841]

Erm actually, you have to be in the late game to access the DLCs in all of the Souls games, also people are going to end up destroying this DLC as an RL1 with no Scadurtree blessings, and others that do it no hit, and if they can do that, then you can do this DLC normally, and with difficulty selection, if From doesn’t want to do a difficulty slider because they want everyone to have the same experience, which can’t happen with a difficulty slider, but you can make the game easier, you just have to work for it, like everything in the game. Also, I’m beating this DLC, naked with a pot on my head and my swords in my hand, I am doing this, and I am getting my ass kicked, but I’m getting up and trying to win, until I do win, and everyone has that potential in them, they just need to work for it. (P.S. I’m absolutely loving the DLC, it is amazing)

[@whiskeybuddha1995]

I loved the base game and the DLC. Made me yell a few times in frustration but if I wasn’t enjoying the overall experience then I wouldn’t have continued. They make games with a vision and they’ve continued to stick to it while tweaking things here and there. The same ppl that will yell “if You can’t afford it then don’t buy it” when something is price gouged are *some* of the same ppl whining about getting an easy or casual mode.

[@rogerchandler2241]

Aswome game level 178 still not beat it close to beating lot of bosses got to level up wepons a bit more

[@pajeetsingh]

Radahn second phase 😢😢😢

[@philip47478]

You are very wrong about Ac Valhalla. The difficulty is way more accessible than in Origins and odyssey. You can actually explore and advance through the full story in higher level areas, without being at required level or buying xp boosts. I feel like people sometimes don't play the game they criticize and they parrot the same talking points they heard somewhere else.

[@wilfredwayne7139]

Heres an idea 10 scadutree fragments you get one for each boss and dont have to go looking for them every time you want to play the dlc.

[@soyborne.bornmadeandundone1342]

Also did they have to do freaking 50? Also you need that exact amount lol. Can't find the last few and can't remember if you got them already or not? Lol have fun back tracking for hours.

[@wilfredwayne7139]

@@soyborne.bornmadeandundone1342 I beat the dlc about 4 times first with 18 blessings the rest much less it's like you said you miss one your f..ked. and every other playthrough who can be arsed.

[@wilfredwayne7139]

@@soyborne.bornmadeandundone1342 I beat the dlc about 4 times first with 18 blessings the rest much less it's like you said you miss one your f..ked. and every other playthrough who can be arsed.

[@ombra711]

From software failed at making the leveling system that replaced actual leveling, compelling. No one wants to hunt scadu(shadow) shit. I get they were trying to find a way to make the game difficulty for the NG++ folks but this method just seems arbitrary and like BUSYWORK. In a FromSoft game that is a shame.

[@Adastra14]

When you read a subjectively difficult book, you don't choose a reading difficulty. You learn the language by reading other "less difficult" books, which engage in subject matters in a more approachable or accessible way. When you're ready, you'll try your hand at the first book again The same goes for FS games. The "language" used is not immediately accessible like other games but if you learn the LANGUAGE of the game then you will start to navigate better. For me games like Crash, Cuphead, Ori, Hollow Knight, etc .. are the absolute S tier in difficulty.

[@gabrielm3340]

To me artificial difficulity on a game that is rewarding with the "dance" will always meet failure, the shadow tree system, should be a option for for player to scale the challenge, is different when is a mandatory item, forgetting the dance, cuz you can't learn it when it takes less than 2 or 3 mistakes you not worry about learning at that point, you worry about survival, and this is not bloodborne we don't have the intuitive tools to make it viable with the basic tools with have. In my eyes at least the final boss fail that difficult/fair check. to me is just someone pet project gone wrong. other bosses were manable some frustrately so... But whoever design and made does good bosses know what it suppose to feel to do the "dance" a boss doesn't not need to be hard hitter, to be fun, it need's to be engaging with out feeling to much pressure on perfection, yet some feel that check few. but still there do, the expansion is a fail test subject in my overall eyes, after I finish it. there some enemy's I like fighting, but others I rather never deal with ever again.

[@ithuhalinqua1026]

Anyone can watch a movie, yes. Anyone can play a game. Whether the movie is something you enjoy or the topics are something you can handle is something completely different. In other words, games are for everyone, but not every game is for everyone. Just like how movies are for everyone, but not every movie is for everyone.

[@ithuhalinqua1026]

As a sidenote, I'd also like to add that I agree that it's incredibly unnecessary to tell people they suck at the game for playing a certain way. At the same time, why does it bother so many people to hear it? I suck at these games. I tend to be overleveled and use cheap tactics to get through. That doesn't mean I don't enjoy playing the games. And I don't let people get on my nerve just because they think I'm not any good at the games. The only reason you'd be upset by it, is if you agree with them but cannot accept that you agree with them.

[@Smilodon_ex]

Only boss that hard is the final 1 but theirs way to tank him so I honestly think it was great DLC just players maybe forgot how challenging the journey is cause base game wasn’t easier either

[@DRENIC10]

Two words: Get Good

[@soyborne.bornmadeandundone1342]

Lol rich coming from a scrub who thinks that elden beast cheese videos make him good. I wasted malenia ngplus 7 without summons and didn't even get hit. A much harder boss on a much harder difficulty. But oh look at that, I agree with this video while you don't. Perhaps your git gud attitude just got destroyed? Yes it did lol.

[@samuelgaijin2565]

Endless combos with very limited windows to attack and arena wide aoe attacks. Everything else is fine.

[@thebenc1537]

The DLC already sold 5 million copies. That level of popularity tells me the game is not too hard.

[@soyborne.bornmadeandundone1342]

You determine how hard a game is... Based on how many people are playing it... Hmmm... Idiot alert!

[@soyborne.bornmadeandundone1342]

Dumbest take in human history lol. Farming is hard yet most humans have planted something before lol.

[@thebenc1537]

@@soyborne.bornmadeandundone1342 farming is not too hard.

[@x___________________]

I think the shadow fragments are the biggest problem I didn’t realize what they actually did until Messmer. I thought being two shot was just how the dlc was gonna be like. Once I realized and collected them the dlc became a lot easier. The shadow fragments is literally a difficultly slider which is bad in a fromsoft game i think they need to remove it and I will hate when I make a new play through that I have re collect each playthrough it’s a chore it’s not fun maybe the first time exploring is but on second playthrough it won’t be it would be a waste of time

[@julianbrewster4633]

You can and will die on that hill about difficulty options in FS games. They have and will always make a deliberate choice not to have them. Thats their artistic direction and the idea to "get as many people to enjoy the game" is foolish as you pointed out in the video. Dealing with stamina consumption and limited resources is the MO the genre they created. Tweaking the numbers for a more accessible mode goes agaisnt their direction. I do agree that SOTE was too hard and its why they change the numbers for the fragments. I don't think it was a backpedal. I think it was a mistake, especially considering they nerfed lot of builds prior to the DLC.

[@cybroxde]

It's completely natural to want as many people as possible to enjoy a game you like but adding easy options would simply not work for that. Your friends would probably play the game, yes, but it would likely be rather boring to them and even if it wasn't, you wouldn't get across the one thing you wanted them to experience, which is the feeling that makes those games so special for you. The whole easy mode discussion is obsolete, because it stems from the faulty assumption that everyone must be able to like something these days. That's just not how the world works. You like some things and don't like others. That being said, Shadow of the Erdtree does go a bit overboard in the other direction. There usually are difficulty corrections in Souls games (kindling, buffs, consumables, etc.) but the encounter should be designed around NOT having them. This DLC pretty much expects you to apply the difficulty corrections, which works but is worse than other entries before that would leave those as optional for people that want to lower the challenge.

[@PalidFingers]

Yeah I don't agree about the difficulty. Miyazaki and the devs at From Software are not stupid, they know about difficulty settings, if they didn't chose to put them in there is because it went against their vision of the game. It's about the designed experience, and is up to the developer. They give you a lot of options to go through the main game, you can coop you can gather items, buffs, cheese enemies, you can level up to 500. And if it all fails that game may not be for you. Also you can always ask for help.

[@BinaryReader]

Ah, didn't really enjoy the DLC, i felt that the game would have been better if it worked as a natural progression of the players base game level, and not require fragments. The mohg fight was a clear level skill check, the game could have just gone from there, with difficulty ramping up gradually. The stark difference in difficulty, especially no stagger on DLC enemies was exhausting. Also I found the bosses both difficult and boring. I liked the exploration, especially the abyss castle. That's about it.

[@dusttodust915]

Yes games can be too hard, but the eldenring dlc isn't it. games haven't been "too" hard since before the 2000s. But even then they were far inbetween one another. You know the classic arcade like games where you had limited lives and 1 health and chapters that were long as hell with only 1 check point at the beginning of each lvl of those chapters like fucking contra as a example.

[@naterod]

I’m not that great of a souls player but I’ve still played them all except for Sekiro and DS2. I’m at the last boss. It’s not that hard.

[@C1ph3Rboy]

Dlc is not that hard, i beat the dlc 2 time; one time with summons and one time without summons and now that they power up the scadutree fragments its much more easy