Why Buy This Saw? [video 516]

With a decent budget available how do you decide what #tablesaw to buy? After the recent vlog I had a lot of folks ask me what the other saws were that I considered on the path that led me to the dinky little #Festool #cordless trim saw, so I thought I’d do a quick talking head video about how it came about, and what my reasons were. Enjoy!
NB: I am not affiliated in any way with any of the above brands, and prices quoted are ‘street prices’ as of February 2023.
The restored Startrite TA 145 is still available; let me know if you’re interested and I can put you in touch - location is colchester, Essex.
NB: There are many “table saws” available, covering many aspects of woodworking with pros and cons to each type, and the ones I mentioned in this video are as follows:-
Site saws - Bosch GTS 10, DeWalt 745, Hikoki 36v, Milwaukee Cordless.
240v 16A Cabinet saws - SIP 01332 and Itech 01332, Axminster AP254PS13
240v 13A cabinet saws - Laguna Fusion 2, Charnwood W629, Charnwood W650
240v Lumberjack 10” cast iron ‘hybrid’ saw
Cast iron bench top saw - Axminster Workshop AW254TS
Cast iron cabinet saw - Axminster Professional AP254LTS
18v cordless Festool CSC SYS 50
Google them for more details.
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New to track saws? Tracksaw workshop & all tracksaw-related videos in a playlist here - bit.ly/TracksawWorkshop

[@michaeldullaway746]

Well done Peter on managing to say all those product numbers! I'm sure there are a few "bloopers" you had to edit out and save for a rainy day 😂

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Thank goodness for autocue! 😂👍

[@CrookedSkew]

Great video Thank you. I really like how you explain things, the logic used and edit so there's no waffle.

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Glad it was helpful! Thanks!

[@CrookedSkew]

@@10MinuteWorkshop You're welcome. Your process helps us buy tools. It's too easy to make impulse buys. What's needed, especially for this money, is a methodical approach and I completely agree that it we fly up to the peak of excitement initially with a new tool, the into the through of niggles until we rise up and plateau off, hopefully in a good state!

[@mahmut123456]

As I saw this saw's introduction, I immediately thought of your table saw video and that this would be perfect for your workshop. You can also build wonderful things without such an expensive saw but I think you can enjoy and make the best out of it, too :)

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Thanks! Yes, fingers crossed! 👍

[@sreval]

Hi Peter, great vid as usual ! very much interested in seeing how this saw performs....keep em coming.

[@hjworkshop1]

I brought the AC254TS and it is great. It can be small or made bigger and most importantly the noise was low and extraction was good. Thanks for how thorough you are- you have a way infront of the camera.

[@anwolfs9804]

I'm still scared of mine, so please be carefull in the "honeymoon period" I like your video's and wouldn't like this new addition stopping you from making them!

[@ellmannvictor]

I am so glad that you are doing this. I hope that it ticks all the same boxes for me. I am a fitted furniture maker, working out of a tiny single garage. I love making small, very precise things and need something quiet and with good dust extraction. So I will follow your videos and hope to aquire one in the near future.

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Thanks! Yes, looking forwards to getting it in my hands and having a proper play with it! 👍

[@54mgtf22]

Love your work 👍

[@pgriffithsulster]

You explained yourself very well, as we have come to expect.

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Thank you! 🙌

[@fugenfuller-rp1fu]

Well explained and similar thoughts on requirements than I had. I once purchased a used metabo 5348 for 50€ and it worker surprisingly well, also in hardword with only 500W power. Just take it easy and it will cut anything. It is silent (no brushes), angles can be adjusted accurately. The issue of dust collection got solved with simple enclosure around the base with a door in the front to set adjustments and a hole from underneath to attache vacuum. I won't miss for stripes and small parts. Everything that is smaller than the base of the track saw got cut on that saw. it is also helpful for groves and 🐇. Latly, it got some competition from the bandsaw. Thanks for showing the festool.

[@philipb867]

I have to say I love my Axminster Craft 25m table saw its great, its quiet, accurate and powerful with good dust extraction shame you couldn't get one.

[@williamdoyle649]

Your criterion for tablesaw choices are spot on.However,my friend,you need a bigger, more size friendly outerbuilding.I love your shop and all you've done with it.I sell Festool where I work and a few of these saws are here for evaluation and are generally liked.Cant wait for you to receive it and your honest review.

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Thanks! Working on it! 👍

[@warrensmith2902]

Looking forward to your experience. Here in the States the new CSC SYS 50 will be available later in the year. When I moved to a new shop, I got a small 10" table saw instead of a miter saw since I don't do much trim work that requires odd angles. Both are great sawdust dissemination machines. My home made cross cut sled works just fine to handle most of the small stuff and anything else gets the TS55 treatment. If I could replace that saw with one that has good dust collection, I could reduce the dust in my shop by 90%.

[@huckleberry3822]

I do exactly what you do for a living. I've done it for 40 years. The best portable cordless table saw I have found is the dewalt 8-1/4" 60 volt. I think its a 54 volt in the uk. Its precise, quiet, very good on dust collection. I have been using it in houses for the last three years. Zero problems. Hope this helps.

[@libertarian1637]

I have had this saw for years myself and am a,axed at how far battery technology has come over the years. I also have the larger DeWalt but find myself using the smaller battery one more often even when I have power at hand. When paired with the DeWalt roller stand it really is just do portable and quiet. When paired with a Bosch dust bag it does well even without a dust collector. While not intended I’ve found the DeWalt saw will even run a dado stack at least up to about 3/8” plywood; though I usually only run a couple 7 1/4” blades with a spacer which perfectly fits 5mm plywood, which is about the only affordable plywood left, but us good enough for drawer bottoms.

[@415volts]

Hi Peter, great video as always and really interesting to see your detailed rationale of choosing a final product - that's a process that all customers make I know. Everyone has criteria, and in UK footprint size is generally near the top of their list in my experience too. All the best. Cheers, Nick - Laguna UK ;)

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Hi Nick, and thanks! If I had the space we’d be talking, no question! 👍👍

[@Mike35858]

As always a great informative piece to camera Peter.

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Thanks!

[@petercoughlan103]

I previously owned a Charnwood 650 couldn't wait to get rid of it replaced it with a Startrite panel saw brilliant piece of kit.

[@robmoss3501]

I’ve been talking to few kitchen fitters about this saw ( myself being one as well) but we are all being put off by the price, so to see a good review from yourself might sway or even confirm our doubts about this product. Looking forward to seeing it.

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Look forward to getting my hands on it! I agree, it’s top money for a ‘site’ saw - especially when you compare it to the likes of the Milwaukee and Hikoki cordless - but in my brief time with it, it seems a much better product, and much better suited to finished cuts rather than, say, 600mm rips in OSB, which is where I feel the others are pitching themselves. We’ll see, when I actually get my hands on it. 👍👍

[@jeffhawkes3380]

Hi Peter, I have been watching your videos for a while now and I must say they are very informative. It was watching your videos that got me hooked on the Festool Quality. I have just taken delivery of the CSC SYS 50 this week, and I absolutely love it! Like yourself I am space restricted and it's super compact portability and accuracy is fantastic. I have also got the trolley/table on back order. Looking forward to your full review. Jeff Hawkes.

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Thanks Jeff! Looking forwards to getting mine! I didn't go for the trolley as I want to make my own cabinet for it, but the trolley looked like a fantastic and versatile base. 👍

[@cedartreeworkshop]

Pete - thank you so much for the in-depth share-out of your journey and decision making process - it got me thinking about my needs for a new table saw and I have some new things to consider. The higher accuracy/repeatability with the digital controls might be an time saver on many of my projects. As I would like to keep my 2 car garage workshop open, the smaller size would help avoiding filling up space with equipment (I know, I'm unusual in this way by US standards). I do hope these comes to the states in the future. It has a lot more going for it than the Sawstop for the kinds of projects I build.

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Thanks! I believe Festool have recently announced US availability, so fingers crossed! 👍

[@andyc972]

Thanks Peter, a breathless run-through of your selection process with some interesting observations, looking forward to seeing the saw in action ! If you need help with the millions give me a call ! 😉

[@matthewwysocki5019]

Thanks for sharing your purchase process. I like the way you define your needs and then move through options. I ended up buying the Dewalt 7491 and found it to be just adequate. It is noisy and fairly accurate but not so good with sheet goods, or dust collection. Since then, I have gone Festool with just about everything minus the Kapex, which I will buy within a month. It is pricey, but looks like a joy to work with. (I should say, I am retired and thus a hobbyist spending my children’s inheritance!). 😊

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

The kids would only blow it! 😂👍

[@joeladam742]

I knew it, you do make millions off of KZbin 😊 you must be the only woodworker on KZbin without a sawstop. I enjoyed your video. I went through a similar exercise when thinking about replacing my dewalt job site saw for my small workshop and then just decided to not buy a new saw due to the lack of options for a small saw, and I was not willing to pay for festool or sawstop.

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

It’s true! 😂 I’m told that Sawstop throw out saws to KZbinrs pretty regularly, so that may account for the profileration; I remember Michael Alm saying he was offered one gratis just after he’d bought one - they wouldn’t work out anything for him financially, so he covered up all the branding… 🤷‍♂️👍

[@chevyimp5857]

Exciting times.. 😄 can see this saw going down well with the kitchen fitter/fitted furniture people.. looking forward to your first impressions.. really rate my small DeWalt but it it makes a right old racket..

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Yes, absolutely. 👍

[@MCsCreations]

Pretty nice saw indeed, Peter! Congrats! 😃 Stay safe there with your family! 🖖😊

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Thanks, will do - and you too!!

[@steffendetrick]

I subscribed because everything sounds better in a proper British accent. I’ve never seen his work but I am already convinced he makes the most extraordinary pieces 😅

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

😂😂 It’s all true! 😆🇬🇧

[@adrianodonnell3853]

Mine arrived earlier this week after a few weeks on pre-order from Axminster. Looking at the type of work you do Peter I think you'll be happy with your purchase. Great features, accuracy and very impressive dust collection. Only thing I'd have liked to have seen is the option to use a mains adapter as well. Hikoki have it for their 36v Table Saw. Festool have the know-how for this as they're already using it in their cordless sanders.

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Thanks Adrian! And yes, indeed - mind you, those mains adapters for the sanders cost about as much as an extra couple of batteries! 😂

[@barberspaddockwoodworking]

Can't wait to see how this works out Peter. While this wouldn't be a saw for me, the thing that I'm really intrigued by is the technology. The electronic display, motorized controls etc brings out the nerd in me. Makes me wonder what table saws will look like in the future!

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Thanks, and yes, looking forwards to getting my hands on it. Funny, the digital, motorised doodads are the least appealing thing for me! Then again, I thought lasers on a mitre saw were a gimmick… 🤷‍♂️😂👍

[@newdutchworkshop7026]

Check out the Martin T75 and Altendorf F45 if you want to see the future :) These large sliding panel saws already had motorized CNC controlled functions two decades ago and nowadays the options are endless and the precision is amazing, working to 1/10th of a millimeter and 1/100th of a degree. This might sound silly but it makes all the difference in a professional environment. I believe there's a video where Peter explains why he never moved to a larger workshop and I think it's really inspiring to see how he runs a business out of a shoebox workshop. I certainly wouldn't be able to do that!

[@Z-add]

@@newdutchworkshop7026 yes and that aldendorf also has 2d nesting of your parts in their electronic display.

[@JimboJet737]

Hi Peter, you mentioned the DW745. I have it and it does have some issues, the primary one being too damned noisy. That said the fence and table is great if a little short on infeed and out feed. Despite this, it’s exceptional value for money in my opinion and believe it has now been updated with some improvements in the form of the DW7485. Not sure if it is freely available in the UK or on its pricing, but I’m sure it is a good “budget” option vs the new Festool which unsurprisingly is prohibitively expensive for most people.

[@richardmoss9188]

This sounds like an explain I give to the mrs when I’ve been in the pub longer than said.

[@danlopretto7222]

You’ve taken the plunge! Can’t wait to see how you trim it out once you’ve lived with it for a few months.

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Me too! 👍

[@louiesworkshop2023]

Hi Peter, hope your well my friend, great shortlist of table saws, you clearly have put alot of thought into this, I am lucky enough to have the big Laguna fusion 3 which is a beast but a very nice table saw that is extremely accurate, I love my festool 55 and use it alot mainly for cutting down sheet stock but I really couldn't do without my table saw, you will find that having the Table saw will make some cuts agood deal easier than the rail saw, in my humble opinion I think there is room for both saws, anyways your choice of the little festool table saw is interesting and I am looking forward to seeing you put it through its paces, stay safe, Louie . Northern Ireland Uk

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Cheers Louie! Yes, it’ll be interesting to have some time with it; if I had space I’d have a big hunk of cast iron - but I don’t 🤷‍♂️👍

[@bradleytuckwell4881]

I would love to see the bloopers on this video Peter for a short one I think it took a few hours to make and on your your choice with the table saw I think you made the right one for your shop it ticks all your boxes like you said I’m looking forward to seeing your review on it down the track after using it for a while

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Thanks! Bloopers weren’t too bad, but man, all those product numbers! 🤦‍♂️😂

[@teac117]

I ended up in the same space predicament. Although I have access to buy a SawStop CTS so I'm eagerly waiting for you to get your hands on the CSC50 to put it through its paces and see if its worth the price premium.

[@marty259]

0.22 there she is .the mafell plunge saw.what a wonderful piece of engineering it is. The ultimate enabling tool

[@dougsaunders8109]

You are really pulling me along on this one Peter…… All jokes aside, interesting insight to your buying process. I 100% agree that you just don’t know how something will work for you until you get it back and try it in your own space / working environment

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Cheers Doug! 👍

[@JamesSmith-dt3yf]

Look forward to seeing it

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Me too! 👍

[@keving8682]

Peter I appreciate the kind references to Paoson and his work. I also very much respect his work and am building one of his workbenches at the moment. When I saw that cast iron small tablesaw that he used from Axminster I was very intrigued both by the cast iron on such a small saw but also the motor. Too bad there is nothing similar here in Canada. I sure wish we had access to some of the tools and materials (ie: black mdf) that you have access to in Europe!

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Thanks! Paoson is a great channel and does very meticulous work that has a lot of appeal. 👍

[@Sunnbuzz]

Being a Brit that has lived 2/3 of my life in Canada I was already envisioning bringing a few pieces back lol

[@lendevonuk5479]

Hi Peter, very interesting…. I Look forward to it! Len (Devon 🇬🇧)/

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Cheers Len! 👍

[@S7tronic]

Congrats on your new saw, the digital blade height adjuster looks very useful. I was waiting on the TKS 80 to be released 2 years ago and really wanted it for the sawstop functionality. I was under pressure to get a saw for a project at the time so I went with the erika 85 instead from Sauter, delighted with it. An Erika 60 is about the same money or less than the CSC SYS 50, well worth consideration if it is for mainly workshop usage.

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Thanks! Interesting - I think the digital blade height is a bit of a gimmick and cant see myself getting any benefit from it - but then I thought that about lasers on mitre saws as well... 🤷‍♂️ 😂

[@robthewaywardwoodworker9956]

Such a bad ass looking saw. It should be exceptional. I also like the look of that Charnwood W629. The small form factor of these saws with a sliding table is so appealing. Good luck with that Festool.

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Thanks! Yes, hope so! 👍

[@aapoapina7390]

I'm personally also looking forward to see how festool saw performs. I also have very small workshop and have tracksaw for those bigger cuts but I often need a tablesaw also for repeating narrow cuts and accuracy.

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Me too! 👍

[@mwoody4560]

Good luck. I hope it works out. I don’t own many Festool tools because of their premium pricing. But they are known for quality. This video reminded me of my quest for my first tablesaw. I had some of the same considerations. I bought the Ryobi BTX3000. My favorite saw to this day. Unfortunately Ryobi became part of an american company and the saw was discontinued and no longer supported. Eventually I thought I needed to move on and so I sold my Ryobi and bought a cast iron cabinet saw. I do like this saw and it still works great after 20 years. But I wish I still had the Ryobi, it was so unique, high Japanese quality, and my first saw.

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Thanks! 👍

[@Therealphantomzero]

This when I saw it would compliment me well. I do cabinet installations, and use the track saw mainly for that. but I don't like bringing the big DeWalt table saw because of the weight, and with my lower back issues, it really is a problem for me

[@Y4k407]

Like you this saw you ticks most boxes for me as I have very limited space. if they did a mains adaptor for it I would order one right now. With the option of buying batteries later if and when it suited me. Awesome video

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Thanks! You’re not the first person to mention this, and I agree completely - seems like a crazy lack of forethought. I’m in the Festool battery platform already for the drills, so it’s less of an issue for me. 👍

[@johncorrall1739]

I bought the lumberjack hybrid saw a little over a year ago. It’s a great saw,powerful and accurate. Flat cast iron top,good dust extraction and relatively quiet. It’s not a portable saw,it’s way too heavy to transport to a job site. I bought it because my workshop is small and I needed a saw I could move when required. What sold the saw to me was the saw has wheels that can be jacked up by a foot pedal,this is included in the price. I don’t regret the purchase.

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Yep, and the fact that it comes with a mobile base is a big plus in a smaller workshop. 👍

[@alexwood020589]

I've got the Axminster workshop 10 inch saw. I bought it a few years ago when it was still under the Axminster red hobby brand and about £500. Im generally very happy with it, though like most Axminster products, it took some tweaking to get good results from it. The stops for 90 and 45 degrees were both way off. The 45 degrees one was about 43, so it wasn't possible to dial in 45 degrees with a digital angle scale until I adjusted it. The fence is suuuper naff, and the dust collection is crap. It's only 1100W, and it's very easy to stall the blade. All that said, I've had spectacular results with it now that it's all tuned up.

[@clutteredchicagogarage2720]

That seems like nice saw. I live in the USA, and I own the Milwaukee M18 battery-powered jobsite table saw. I went with it because it's easy to buy in the USA, I already own some M18 batteries, and it is indeed quite portable and lightweight. I occasionally do some woodworking and carpentry projects in my garage in Chicago. When it's warm outside, I take my saw out to my garden with a couple lightweight, adjustable-height folding tables (one for the saw and one as an outfeed), and I can get decent results with my cuts. I love the portability of my saw. Even though I always hook up a shop vac + dust separator to collect sawdust when I use the saw, I always prefer to work outside in the fresh air in my garden when the weather is nice rather than inside my garage. When I do work inside my garage, I have to park my car out on the street, which is a pain since I'm in the city and I often have to circle around my neighbourhood a bit to find street parking. So I think I'm willing to sacrifice a little bit of precision to have a tool that's optimized for portability and ease-of-storage. At some point, I may look at some small hybrid cast-iron saws. On the one hand, I'd love to have a truly flat machined top to my saw, and I'd love to have a rigid and sturdy fence. On the other hand, sometimes when I'm working on a project out in my garden over a weekend, we'll suddenly get some rain in the weather forecast, and I'll have to take my tools back into the garage until the rain clears up and then carry everything back outside to resume work. At those times, I'd much rather carry around a saw that's 20 kilos rather than a saw that's 40 kilos or more... Still, I'm jealous when I watch all these videos on KZbin of people who have these great cast-iron saws with large, precision-machined work surfaces, rigid fences, and great dust extraction.

[@DavidLee-cw6ci]

You know what I want? A vastly stripped down table saw, just the "guts". The motor, blade and adjustments for depth and angle, and a minimal table, so that I can mount it in a bench like people mount routers. I don't need a massive table, the workbench is the table. Some people do this with circular saw hacks, but they're not designed for that.

[@homer009x]

Interesting choice of saws available to you. In North America we don’t get any small bench top cast iron choices, didn’t even know that existed, especially with sliders in such compact size. For us, cast iron tops start with floor standing models only.

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

👍

[@paulmaryon9088]

Great video thanks Peter, I'm considering this saw myself, though would rather it was corded, so looking forward to your review\ opinion once it arrives, thanks again hope you're well

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Thanks! Honestly, I’d prefer it to be corded as well, but it’s intended for site work, which is principally cordless these days. 🤷‍♂️👍

[@cameronpeters7250]

great video there seems to be a gap in the market for a highly accurate job site size saw with a quiet and refined build but im looking forward to your video on the festool im really interested in how you get on with it

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Thanks, and yes I agree. Looking forward to getting it! 👍

[@paulmaher4466]

Hi Peter , I have been looking at the csc ,I fit kitchens for a living so needed something compact and accurate , most of my kit is festool so I have plenty of batteries , I did have the dewalt site saw a few years back but it’s to heavy and the dust goes all over the place , love the breakdown you must have spent hours going over your list of saws ..

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Cheers Paul. I think a lot of kitchen guys are looking at the CSC! Look forward to getting my hands on mine! 👍

[@davidmatke248]

I'm excited to see how you like it Peter. I'm even more excited to learn that the CSC SYS 50 is coming to the US later this year! I just wish it had the Sawstop technology in it.

[@robertpearce802]

Last week, I raised the same point with Peter about Sawstop technology. He pointed out that the technology requires an earthed supply which is not available on a battery tool. This makes sense to me.

[@davidmatke248]

That does make sense, but I still wish it had the finger saving technology.

[@markhedquist9597]

Whoa! Coming to the US?? Ok, then. I'll take on a second job to start saving for one now. Or maybe a second mortgage. Lol

[@haleccles1971]

Thanks Peter, a very interesting video. I’m in the same position, very little space (shared with a motorcycle and a large planer thicknesser from my old workshop. I bought an old Jet table saw that I have to move to use (and the motorcycle and often the planer) but have booked a demo on the Festool and suspect it’s the way forward for me. Looking forward to your longer term thoughts on it!

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Thanks! All I can say is leave your wallet at home when you have the demo. 😬

[@haleccles1971]

@@10MinuteWorkshop I will have to move the decimal point to the left if I do buy one!

[@BrookesWood]

Ah Peter see 14 years experience isn’t good enough for some people 😂 Great video & very informative. I am looking for new next saw, wish this was in my price range but gives me some ideas of the features I might want.

[@madventure2318]

Best of luck with it, Peter. I have the Milwaukee M18 saw and love it but… I just wish there was a power adapter. I had a big job on cutting a lot of oak and it just ate batteries - even the 12ah ones. Waiting about for big (and expensive!) batteries charging is not good for productivity! The new Festool one looks stunning and very well designed - doesn’t all Festool - but batteries just aren’t worth the hassle for me for big kit. With all that said - I will watch your video with green-eyes because it does look soooo cool.

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Thanks! And yes, I agree re the mains adapter, it’s a baffling decision not to something available - even a power brick would get you out of a tight spot - and I’ve heard from more than a few kitchen fitters who’ve said that it’s the batteries that’s the most off putting aspect, as they’re not on the Festool battery platform. 🤷‍♂️👍

[@jayschuon8330]

The shop looks great Peter ! Can't wait to hear how you like the new saw. It is a very interesting design that hopefully offers the mobile carpenter high precision and repeatability. The Sawstop josite saw is a pretty good saw and has pretty good dust collection. But the Festool would be lighter on an this aging carpenters joints. Best regards

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Thanks! Yea, shame the Sawstop doesn’t make it over here. 🤷‍♂️👍

[@andrewschultz2504]

Interesting sir I faced similar thoughts about what to get for a table saw. I heavily considered the festival but the only packages here were the full package with the legs and Support I had quite a few Bosch battery powered tools at the time so I ended up buying the Bosch GTS 18 V - 08 n14 prop factor. I tend to shy away from festival battery powered tool due to the batteries, not going all the way across the line of tools I find the dust extraction extremely good for a benchtop, portable Saw

[@robertbankhead8661]

Good luck on this saw Peter, I have space and accessibility to SawStop so I dropped $2,200 US on one. Have to say for accuracy & performance, love it. Only nit, can't get a 45.5 angle nor a -0.5 as well, guess I'll have to break out tape to do that. Look forward to your overview. Long Live Green Machines!

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Thanks! Love the look of the big sawstop! Shame we don’t get them here. 🤷‍♂️👍

[@charliesslave]

Got mine last week from Toucan tools, the stand is on back order though. In the honeymoon period,. as you put it, I am very impressed.

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Nice! 👍

[@redhornet07]

VERY jealous, looking forward to the videos where you use the saw in anger. Also, "Goldilocks saw..." love that!

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Thanks Paul! Yes, looking forwards to using it! 😆

[@jimbo2629]

Kity used to fill the gap that you are looking for. I would suggest getting one on eBay when they turn up. Small, quiet, cast table and well engineered. I had a garage workshop when I bought my Sedgwick 315 30 years ago. It’s quiet,safe and has dust extraction. It’s enormously better than what you are proposing. I didn’t have the space like you, but I made room for it. Everything less is just a toy(almost). I use it for ripping and a mitre saw for cross cutting. I have a site saw in another place and it’s just not good or safe enough. Horses for courses. As you say, you don’t know till you’ve bought and used it. Those plastic fence guards are a nightmare. Mine exploded when the wood jammed in the huge clearance insert provided. Sort out a kick stop as a priority for safety and convenience. Great video as always. I’m tempted to suggest you should get a bigger workshop. Small house, big workshop works for me.

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Thanks, but I’m afraid I disagree; I had the Axminster version of that small kity and it was horrible - terrible fence, sloppy, non-standard mitre slot, and no dust extraction to speak of. The only thing had had going for it was a cast iron top and an induction motor - and the fact it held it’s value really well! One of the few power tools I’ve managed to turn a profit on, lol! Not sure what you mean by a kick stop?? Would love a bigger workshop - there’s ~900sq ft available at the end of my road, but they want £27K/year plus vat (roughly 7 times what I’m paying now for 3x the space) so not going to happen! Also, I make KZbin videos - what would I do with the space? 🤷‍♂️👍

[@richardhasler6718]

'KZbin millions', yes, I always suspected your workshop was actually just a film set, the actual carpentry is done by unseen apprentices and when you are not filming, you are sunning yourself in the Bahamas! Look forward to seeing that new table saw. I have the Festool cordless plunge saw and I must say it is an absolute dream to use on site. Hoping the table saw will be the same.

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

It's all true... 😂 😎 ☀️

[@RichardWalker66]

Peter, if you are still waiting, then Amazon UK has stock. I’m not affiliated to Amazon in any way, it just seems unusual that they have stock whilst all the other regular Festool retailers in the UK (and Festool themselves) have been out of stock for a while - and I suspect they are all still waiting. I bought mine a while ago (from the reliable team at D&M) and I absolutely love it, although I admit that I’m a newbie woodworker and amateur so my opinion counts for nothing. I’ve built a (not so portable) jig from aluminium extrusion that allows to me to cut larger boards accurately using the SYS 50 with an Incra Positioner when needed. Really looking forward to your review - keep up the great work. Richard W

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Thanks Richard! Honestly, it had never occurred to me to try Amazon! I'll take a look, thanks! 👍

[@multirevelator]

please do a little check on when you tighten the guide rail if it pulls is fractionally out of 'true', i think this can be an issue on the little tabletop saws, especially the proxon

[@redC16]

I have the same wants/needs as yourself for a table saw. Having no festool batteries and really never ever needing a cordless table saw - I can't go with this new Festool. The Dewalt 10 inch is the perfect saw if the extraction was just a little better and it didn't scream like a banshee!

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Yep, those two things were deal killers for me and the DeWalt, sadly. I almost didn’t get the Festool because of the battery, but then I thought why not?. 🤷‍♂️👍

[@WoodworkJourney]

Good stuff, hope you really enjoy it Peter! We certainly don’t seem to have the choices that our chums across the water get - but that seems to be the case with most woodworking tools. If you’d have gotten the expensive Axminster, I think it takes dado blades so people would have just complained anyway 😂

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Thanks! And it’s already been mentioned that ‘the Festool won’t take a dado stack…’ 😂🤷‍♂️👍

[@WoodworkJourney]

@@10MinuteWorkshop 😂😂😂

[@5280Woodworking]

I can live without a miter/chop saw but never again will I be without a tracksaw or table saw. Tracksaw only for years and years but I never realized you can get by without a table saw but you’re only kidding yourself that it’s the better way. At least for me. Looking forward to the hybrid workflow

[@ThisTall]

In my opinion, with that thorough of an analysis, one thing nobody could call you is a brand fanboy. Which is actually a great unintentional advertisement for Festool after seeing how often you end up in that platform.

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Ha! I’ll use anything, me! 😂👍

[@martijnfransen9933]

Hi Peter, i live in the Netherlands i bought the axeminster bench top saw (craft) great saw. Though i have it for a year now it good available here now (gereedschappro approx 1100 euro) i have the smaller (216mm) version and i added the side extensions to it. It is a relay nice saw. But on top of this you then also should buy a dust extraction with bigger capacity 100mm port a normal shopvac will not work. That also adds to the cost. Br. Martijn

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Thanks Martijn! I already have a 100mm vac, but part of the appeal of the Festool is that it’s designed to use a regular CTL extractor. 👍👍

[@joytekb]

Cant wait

[@Smartie40.]

Surprised that you dismissed the Festool CS50 and CS70. You said you did not like then so fair enough but I have owned the CS70 for about 6 years and find it so versatile. I removed the legs and made a cabinet on castors with a CTL26 built in. Works amazingly well. Can position it in seconds to use surrounding surfaces as support or out feed tables. Extraction is great and can just lift it off the base and take it the work place if needed. Then you have the fantastic pull saw feature, which for me takes the place of a chop/mitre saw. This is hands down the most useful, versatile tool I have and I just love using.

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

That’s what I’m planning with this saw, cabinet with vac beneath. 👍

[@oldkingcrow777]

That Milwaukee table battery powered one is shockingly good, and insanely quiet. I have the dewalt with the rolling collapsible base and while it's extremely loud due to minimal construction around it, I love that saw heh

[@martinoamello3017]

My working partner has the Milwaukee cordless we use quite often on the job..It's kind of heavy to move around, but I'm kind of old so it could be me. Accuracy is pretty good for being cordless, but as long as you know your limitations and don't try ripping gigantic sheets of plywood and such it's a decent job site saw. I have a SS 52" in the shop for heavy lifting so we're covered with the Milwaukee on the job in customers homes..It's about as loud as the typical cordless circular..I think it's built around the Milwaukee cordless circular..

[@stevenliggins1623]

Great video yet again and I am definitely in the market for the festool . Storage is a problem for myself, and being able to store the saw in its on systainer makes sense. One thing , I can't help but wonder is you mentioned that you can't have a 16amp supply to a saw. Why not?

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Thanks. Re the power supply question, there's a very long and convoluted answer to that, but the short version is I've been in the workshop ~20 years and it's just not going to happen. 🤷‍♂️

[@stevenliggins1623]

@@10MinuteWorkshop oh ok. We will leave it there then. Thanks for the great video's

[@barrydoxseyuk]

Great video, I purchased the Axminster 254 saw, less the sliding table due to space. I also prefer to use a table sledge. I visited two of the tool suppliers that I use. One has stopped being a Festool supplier, and the other is strongly considering pulling the plug. Both are due to supply and pricing issues. This has left me a little cold to future purchases. I have made many in the last few years. It was suggested that the UK base may be going??

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Thanks! Haven’t heard anything to that effect, but interesting, and noted, thanks! 👍

[@suavesmithy]

Just got mine a few days ago , not used it on site yet 😊

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Nice! 👌

[@mikeking7470]

I came back to this video today, the Lumberjack looks a lot like the recently discontinued Ridgid R4512 (USA). The new Ridgid looks just like the Delta 36-725T2 (except for color), a saw that has both a lot of love and a lot of hate in USA, mostly motor woes. The Delta is sold mostly by Lowes and the Ridgid is almost a Home Depot house brand. I have two tablesaws, a Shopsmith and an old Delta 1160 tilt top and an ancient DeWalt radial arm saw. So, I am not in the market for another saw. If I were buying new, in the USA, I would probably opt for the new smallest Sawstop (a Festool owned company). Where I looking for another "project" a Delta Unisaw is offered right here in town for $500 (a steal but it needs 3-phase power or a VFD to make it work). The best news about the Festool is that you should be able to recoup all your money if you decide to resell it.

[@spilleradam]

Hi Peter, I agree with you about the Festool table saw, I don’t like it I don’t like the design, and its way to expensive.

[@FierceSleepingDog]

That Lumberjack saw looks like the Rigid saw which was also sold as a Craftsman (Sears) saw. I used one for 15 years. My first TS. I upgraded to SawStop last year. The Craftsman saw is still in my basement. I need to sell or donate it.

[@SwimBikeRunFastest]

I'm glad you didn't end up with a Charnwood. The build quality on mine was unacceptable and it went back. I ended up with a 10inch sip which I loved to bits for a few years but it took up too much space in my 2 car garage. I've now got the titan bench top saw. For £100 it's amazingly capable. It's not accurate in the slightest but it works. The portability and small form factor make this festool look very tempting.

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

In which case I’m glad I didn’t end up with the Charnwood as well, lol! 👍

[@phil2782]

I work in an apartment garage. When you get it I'm desperate to get sound measurements! If it's as quiet as it seems it will be a game changer for small shops.

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Yep, I’ll be doing real world sound tests when I get it. 👍

[@kickpublishing]

I look forward to an entirely cordless workshop one day - just need a cordless bandsaw and planer

[@Realism91]

The workshop will run off Tesla style batteries and need to be plugged in over night.

[@maxbee4460]

Hello Peter, That was a great diagnoses of saws available and to suit your requirements. We can all fall into a trap of the best of this best of that, but it’s down to exactly what you said, budget and what YOU really need it to do, not what someone else thinks, is the best since sliced bread. Etc,etc. For me I needed a site type saw that I could store away on its side when not in use, have a large top for support and budget of £600ish four years ago. I purchased the Bosch GTS10XC, would I recommend it? No, there’s too many inaccuracies in it which took a lot of effort to sort out. So I’ll be very interested like many others to see how you get on with this Festool. I’m always interested in what you do and say. Max

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Thanks Max! Interesting what yoy say about the Bosch; that and the DeWalt come across as some of the better site saws out there, and I know more than a few folks who use them in the workshop as well. And yes, I'm interested to see what this saw is really capable of too! 👍

[@simfro2530]

Hi Peter, Have fun with your new saw hope it works out for you. Seem you missed the black Friday sales from Axminster. They had the AW254TS available for a good price. I got one of the last ones and I am for the most parts really happy with it. Was very surprised how quiet it is.

[@e.bertrams]

Looking forward to the next videos starring the new saw! Am sorely tempted myself, but I don't like or need cordless tools all that much. Btw, what's that about you not liking the CS50 or CS70?

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Thanks! For me the CS50 and 70 fall into the same category as the TKS 70/80 and the old CMS systems; I just don't like the use of a proprietary profile around the edge of the saw table instead of regular t-slots/mitre slots in the bed. I understand why they did it, but I just don't like it.🤷‍♂️ Same for the Mafell Erika as well. 👍

[@TheMrMax777]

Great video! Would be interesting to hear about the Mafell Erica 60. It should be nearly the same size as Festool csc sys 50.

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Thanks! Like the CS 50/70/TKS80 the Mafell Erika relies on proprietary extrusions around the edge of the machine for accessories, inspired of simple mitre slots. That just really annoys me, for completely irrational reasons, but if I’m spending that kid of money I don’t want to be annoyed about it! 😂

[@TheMrMax777]

@@10MinuteWorkshop Thank you for your response :)

[@rolandkeys8297]

I was recently in the same position and went for the Festool FESTOOL TKS 80 EBS basic package. The only thing that made me buy the last one from Axminster it was the sawstop. As someone that has had an accident involving a power saw I was very interested in this feature. The rest of the saw is not up to the speck that I would expect from Festool, to many to mention here. Its not that it don't cut, it dose, and it cuts well, just little things that add up. If you ever want to do a review on it I would be happy for you to borrow it

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Thanks, that’s kind of you, but I’ve had a pretty close look at a few of them and like you, didn’t really feel the ‘sum of the parts’ added up to what was being asked. I have mixed feelings about the sawstop tech, and on reflection I wasn’t prepared to put up with that saw just to have it. 👍👍

[@TheSwedishMaker]

It will be exiting to hear what you think about it. I was a bit concerned with the motorized height adjustment when I first saw it. But it does seem like a very convenient and really good table saw.

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Me too! Yes, I still think it’s a bit of a gimmick, but it’s factory calibrated - they say - so I’ll see how aI get on. 👍

[@mickwilson127]

Just got the Axminster one at the last Black Friday for £1650 it is the dogs danglies. It replaces a 20 year old Sheppach POS

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Nice! 👌

[@damiendowney5121]

This may have been more up you're alley Peter , TWX7 1800W Contractor Saw Module 254mm

[@markjarman7819]

Being a festool crazed madman myself I’m looking forward to seeing what you think of the new saw. Out of interest peter what don’t you like about the tks 80 and the cs 70? I bought the cs 70 set myself with very little use and find it a great saw once set up properly.

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Thanks. All the Festool table saws - until this one - follow the same pattern established way back by the CMS; instead of a simple t-slot/mitre slot there’s a proprietary extrusion around the perimeter of the saw that handles all the accessories/moving parts, and I just don’t like it. 🤷‍♂️

[@markjarman7819]

@@10MinuteWorkshop I can’t help but think this new saw Will development into a bigger unit. I guess I make you right it a old design. Thanks for the reply Peter😊👍

[@DesignerMaker]

Great video Peter, I’ve just been going through the same dilemma myself. Just wondering why you dismissed the corded Festools? Personally I am hoping the Festool Cordless tech eventually migrates to the corded variants.

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Thanks. It’s purely a personal thing; all the Festool table saws - until this one - follow the same pattern established way back by the CMS. Instead of a simple t-slot/mitre slot there’s a proprietary extrusion around the perimeter of the saw that handles all the accessories/moving parts, and I just don’t like it, unfortunately. 🤷‍♂️👍

[@thetallcarpenter]

Be interested to see how you get on with this saw Peter, as I've been looking to replace my portable saw for quite some time🤔Unfortunately, I can only buy a new pencil with my KZbin millions😆 Thanks for the video👍

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

A whole pencil?? You're doing better than me! I usually just nick them from Ikea... 😂

[@thetallcarpenter]

@@10MinuteWorkshop 😲

[@francisbeland8959]

I'm in the exact same situation; small shop, mostly track saw cuts, need a table saw for smaller cuts, DUST EXTRACTION IS A MUST. I'm really curious to have your inputs about that dust extraction capability since there are no over the blade port. I'm hopeful but skeptic about that. Other than that, it seems like the perfect small table saw. Great accuracy and enough power for the small cuts it's designed to do. Do you have an ETA of reception?

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

The blade is completely sheathed under the table, so the extraction is pretty direct - given that most of the sawdust should be being expelled downwards by the action of the blade. But I'll see when `i get my hands on it back in the workshop. 👍

[@gingerelvis]

Interesting to see the process of elimination to where you ended up and will be even more interesting to see how it works out for you and your circumstances. It's not the way I would go personally, I have a bit of a fetish for old lumps of cast iron that will out live us all (not afraid to say it) and battery powered would really put me off but I do understand 16A is an issue, 3 phase more so for the DIYer like myself.

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

If I wasn’t constrained by power and regulations, I’d have been all over a cast iron ‘project’ saw, but it is what it is. And yes, I’d have preferred it not to be cordless. 🤷‍♂️

[@toddstrope157]

Interesting choice, would have thought the TKS80 would have knocked it out of the park for you. I had to watch the UK Festool channel to get more details, and it’s kind of an anomaly to me. It does not appear to have the SawStop technology, and they seemed to have created another blade size, so compatibility with any track saw is out. But the digital features are geeking me out. Like the TKS80 (though SawStop just introduced a similar US variant), neither Festool variant will make it across the pond, so I will just have wait to see how you make on with it. Thanks for another well crafted video.

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Thanks. Sawstop flesh-sensing tech requires an earth/ground which you don’t have in a cordless tool. I dislike the whole family of Festool cs 50/70, TKS 80 table saws as they all carry over the worst of the old CMS - no mitre slots, and a reliance of proprietary extrusion to handle accessories. Also the fence is an optional extra on the TKS80. 🤷‍♂️ CSC SYS 50 uses the same blades as the latest TS60 tracksaw btw, so there’ll be plenty of choice. 👍👍

[@toddstrope157]

@@10MinuteWorkshop lack of mitre slot would turn me off the TKS80 as well. The TS60 looks like an interesting addition, something else we won’t see stateside. Having the same blade size across plunge and mitre and mini table saw could yield a useful kit. Makes more sense now and thanks. Looking forward to seeing your review, but for me, I’ll stick with my Makita XGT 😉😀😏.

[@ErikSutton1]

Got mine Tuesday. Preordered it immediately when they came out here in Sweden. Working in a 2x3m shed as my workshop, so this table saw was a dream come true!😅 Unfortunately had to send it back the same day as mine came with the sliding plate being roughly 1mm lower on the left side (so not co-planer with the table) resulting in cross cuts not being square. Dug through the manual, but unfortunately no way to recalibrate or adjust the tilt of the sliding plate. Festool told me to send it back ASAP😅 Bummer since it is completely new, but should be getting it back fixed at the beginning of this week!🙏🏼 Festool has some incredibly swift and high quality customer service !🙌🏼

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

That’s really disappointing. Curious why you’d return to Festool and not the dealer?

[@ErikSutton1]

@@10MinuteWorkshop Didn't really consider that to be honest. Figured it was open, so not much to be done other than a service appointment to be readjusted by a festool technician.

[@ErikSutton1]

@@10MinuteWorkshop Just got mine back again from repair, and it still has the same issue unfortunately, starting to wonder if I'm just being picky😅

[@lemech]

What was Festool’s response to the lower height? Is it by design or a tolerance issue? Can’t really understand why Festool did not make it level or at least only a very very small difference only. 1mm or 0.5mm seems too much.

[@ErikSutton1]

@@lemech unfortunately it's a tolerance issue. Definitely a design flaw, they basically said it was within their acceptance tolerance. Really a bummer considering the price of this thing and it being 0.5mm tilted to the left making it non co-planer... They said I'm welcome to send it back for repair free of charge in the hopes of getting a better sliding table part, but I would just be rolling the dices at this point!😅

[@amconsole]

Been thinking about the CSC SYS 50 and it seems like a great "gadget" for cutting trim bits to final size on the jobsite. It appears to be accurate, easy to set up and stow away, easy to transport, somewhat quiet (until You actually start cutting) and has dust extraction, although even the Festool promo video shows a lot of dust still flying everywhere above table, as there is no above table extraction, just below. The real worry for me is the very limited capacity. The blade rises just 35mm above table, the max rip capacity is just 280mm right of the blade. That may be within 90% of trim bits on a job site, but it's just not enough in a shop. It's different for Peter, as he cuts panels to size with a tracksaw. And in the space allocated to the table saw would never really be able to outfeed a 600mm piece right of the blade anyway, but most of the benefits of the tiny Festool systainer saw are wasted in a shop - it's portability and ease of carrying it around, battery power, it's all nice when You're working in someone's kitchen or walk in wardrobe, but hardly necessary in a shop. And then there's the price. Aside from DRO display, the rest of it seems to be subpar to say a Laguna F2 that sells for less money, has cast iron, vibration free table, can cut through more than 35mm without flipping the board over, has a larger variety of and cheaper blades available, has dust collection below and above table, and will probably cut smaller pieces just as accurately. The Festool is a great jobsite tool and the price ir not much concern for a professional that needs to fit a kitchen every other day, but it's probably not the best choice for a workshop, even a small one.

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Yeah, I go through all the reasons in the vid why I ended up with this saw, and why the Laguna 2 - and a few others - just wouldn't do it for me. Not sure where you're getting the 35mm depth of cut from though - it's 48mm; not huge, no, but then neither is the CS50. Bottom line, if you need a tablesaw to cut panels or big lumps of natural timber, this isn't it - it's a dinky little lightweight trim saw that I'll be using in a workshop, because I'm interested to see how it handles those small tasks. Not sure where you are in the world, but as I say in the vid the Laguna 2 is £2400 here, the second most expensive saw on my list; I paid £1700 for the Festool, with batteries, about the same price as another three saws that I rejected for one reason or another. There's no one-size-fits-all table saw, but I'm prepared to chunk down a decent piece of change to see if this is right for me. 👍

[@Torres913]

The Csc cuts higher than 35mm. Also, disagree with the dust extraction. I’ve been cutting inside with it. The bag that comes with it is the best Festool bag they’ve had with their tools! I know it only has the dust collection at the back but the saw seems to be driving most if not all the dust into the bag. And to be fair, it’s a saw that’s really compact so they probably had to leave something out!

[@deanmartin7593]

6:18 Felder also offer saws with the skin sensing technology here in Europe on their full size sliding table saws. I think Bosch have saws with the same technology too.

[@10MinuteWorkshop]

Thanks. The Bosch has ceased production pending legal action, and I’m not looking at a full size slider. 👍

[@deanmartin7593]

@@10MinuteWorkshop more for your views as I know you’re sorted with a saw. If someone did want it, it is available in Europe