Photographing Old British Petrol Stations on Expired 4x5 Film

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In this video, I head out for a day to shoot some expired 4x5 Kodak Vericolor III film. The goal for the day was to hunt down some old classic British petrol stations and pumps and see if this film was worth shooting.
I also take you through the entire process, including developing it back in the office, scanning it (multiple ways-GFX100 and Epson V700), and going over the results.
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[@chopinho65]

The slightly fogged print of the old pump is so beautiful! I don’t think you should be disappointed - the fogging shots are simply lovely

[@igormkovalchuk]

that’s my fav too, ugh. so lovely

[@viewfinderthis]

Got to say I love the look of the faded film with the scenes you captured! They fit so well together honestly!

[@photomitch]

I’m working with some expired film right now. 25 year old Kodak Tmax 100 that I mistakenly bought off eBay. I Tested one roll and got very good results from it. No fog whatsoever. I was expecting the fog or some type of density problem but the negatives came out perfect.

[@BukezFinezt]

The pump pictures and the garage turned out so good. I do like that fade. Gives it a weird vignetting. Gorgeous

[@garyclennan2993]

Bonus points for the mug in the bathroom. 😊

[@nathanjohnson5304]

Finished one video and checked the channel, only to find a video posted 30 seconds ago! The rabbit holes are some of my favorite content from you. I do the same thing, and it helps so much to see the results from another photographer with as exacting a process and compare results.

[@KyleMcDougall]

Cheers, Nathan! The rabbit holes get crazy sometimes, but gotta do it!

[@andyvan5692]

great subject matter, PS: don't fret, yours was lucky, I did the same on a Hasselblad 500c\m using expired and now discontinued Fuji Pro 400H (but I also shot it at EV 15!) so nothing showed up, all a white out, my problem was also doing architecture shooting by a river, so got a lot of glare to make matters worse. my understanding of this problem is that it is chemistry, the silver ions get old, so the "by the book" recipes don't give enough time or concentration of active ingredients to do the job similar to fresh stuff (what they where written for), research suggests 1-1.5 x exp. time per decade, but, like reciprocity failure, one needs the makers datasheets for the correct compensations.

[@rugglez]

I love the 5x4 portrait of the garage owner.

[@HolmesThom]

The fogged faded old man was sick though. Great vibes. ❤

[@lensman5762]

VericolorIII? Brings back memories. I used to to use a lot of this film in the mid to late 80s for shooting portraits and even a few weddings, and it wasn't even expensive. Good times.

[@geireplekake820]

Nice video! Some tips from me on handling expired color film: - Always do ISO-test of film before using it in the field, to find the optimal ISO. I suspect you overexpose too little, expired film may be very slow the only way to know for sure is to test beforehand. - I found out that developing at room temperature reduce fog for many expired color films. It works as a restrainer. For example 20 minutes on 20 degrees. But again you need to test your process before you go out and use the film, to be sure it works.

[@KyleMcDougall]

Cheers. And yes, this was very much an initial test. I'll have to do another run.

[@jean-marcschwartz2525]

Only the imperfection is perfect. Like a lot the portrait in front of the garage. Yellowish border and the blue, work very well.

[@jamie.dop_]

I really enjoyed this. Im based about a two hours from there and love how in this video you didn't show the images until the end... keeps the suspense! Always full of info, tips and detail. Thanks Kyle. J

[@KyleMcDougall]

Glad you enjoyed. Cheers!

[@heidkr00gaz]

The garage, what a find!

[@ZeLoShady]

That photo of the old blue gas pump looks awesome with the fading. It really helps convey that 'old' feeling and acts as a great vignette. I think the same would be true for the portrait if the gentleman was in that center door as opposed to the side where the fading/fogging starts to overlap with him. Great shots either way though

[@user-nj3qm5xf6v]

I loved the fogged and faded pictures! They work really well with the subject matter. I think the fogging around the red, weathered VW added to the story. I bet this is an effect people will want to recreate in post-processing their digital images just to approximate what you achieved in analog!

[@ilaion11]

On the GFX scans you have some vignetting on the way to the sensor. I don't know what adaptor are you using for the lens, but if its exit to the sensor is anything narrower in diameter than the diagonal of the sensor, you will experience vignetting that will show up as brightened corners when inverting negatives.

[@stevenjohnson9714]

I shot a lot of 35mm Kodak P3200 that was expired about 20 years. I overexposed it all about 2 stops sometimes 3. I usually developed normally at 3200 iso, but the ones I liked the most are the ones I pulled to 400 ISO when shooting at the beach in harsh sun. I’d shoot those at 50-100 ISO and develop at 400 in HC-110. The photos still had good contrast, but the shadows really opened up and held good detail, it was still sharp considering the film grain, but it also had that 3200 iso grain which just felt like it went well with the sandy beach vibe to me. Expired film can be fun with its pleasant surprises as long as you can shift your perspective of perfection.

[@andrewj6231]

My rule for shooting expired film is 1 extra stop of light for every ten years out of date. It’s worked really well for me but sometimes there are just some expired films that no matter how you expose them they just don’t turn out nice. Vericolor III though is a good one.

[@aaronalbores3999]

Last time i bought expired film I did it because it was cheap, and it was for testing home made cameras. In that case, one of the rolls was foggy and the other one was so thin that the image was barely visible. No problem, it was useful for testing the cameras. The thing is that now, depending on where you look, expired film may be the same price or even more expensive than fresh film (i guess old stock is expiring too, but still it's hard for me to understand it...). Based on my experience, i would probably never buy expired film again. It's a lottery, you may get some fog, wierd colors, or you may get nothing at all. That said, i think the fog in your photos is nice. It's not hiding your subjects, it matches the mood, i like it.

[@SteyrM1912]

I have a bunch of Vericolor III and Vericolor 160 in 120 and 220. It's probably my favorite discontinued stock. Most of it is from 1993-1999, I've gotten good results shooting at EI 64 to EI 80.

[@nicholasdavidsmith]

I recently ordered my first large format camera and watching this video was a huge inspiration since I already love shooting expired film. ☺️

[@kentmillerstudios]

Hey Kyle, Found your channel last week. I shoot a bunch of old expired films. I start at 1 stop for every 10 years it's outdated. Then I develop the first few sheets and see if it needs more developing time. Color is the worst to deal with when outdated. Shifts and fogging are normal. Enjoy the process and embrace the outcome. It brings out the history of shooting old film. You really never know what you will get. I'm looking forward to seeing more of this in future shoots. Thanks for sharing. K

[@KyleMcDougall]

Definitely learning to embrace the imperfection!

[@p_aulwhite]

The expired film images were my favourites, especially the portrait and the red car in the back yard.

[@andrewbuckler]

I shot some supra 800 from the 90s, three stops over was definitely the way to go. Probably talking is0 20 for the vericolor 160. Good to know that the colors are still nice and unshifted.

[@michaelhulland2915]

My friend and I shoot with a lot of expired film, that's mostly what's in my freezer. They're of varying levels of good and bad but it's interesting to see the results, can get something very interesting. If you can get film that's been frozen it can last a long time. I have some ektachrome 200D that expired in 88 and shot it at box speed with no problems as all. It spent it's whole life frozen and that's how I'm also keeping it, it belonged to a college here and they would have had it from brand new.

[@ulyssesnathanialowen3831]

the last 2 images of the old pump . with the fogging on sides , actually works in a way of to an extent..

[@wv_]

My experience is generally the first decade 100 iso or below can be box speed, anything above needs half a stop. 20 years needs an extra stop at 100 ISO and two stops for 400 and above. I generally over expose a stop so.... The only films i've struggled with were 800 ISO expired films

[@gadolinium09]

Imperfection is perfection in many eyes.

[@nohatemedia3786]

I just got a box of Vericolor III myself from 99 and I can't wait to try it!! So glad I saw this and it's just getting started! Can't wait for the end results!!! Edit: really happy about the colours from the sheets! Can't wait to get some sheets into my Busch Pressman 4x5 and get some shots in the portfolio! I def will be exposing at 50 or 25 iso though because the results appear to be better vs at box speed

[@jnrickards]

A friend learned that I was using film and gifted me ~25 rolls of 35mm, various brands. All 20yrs old so I used the advice I had read, 1 stop/10 years and the images came out great.

[@SinaFarhat]

I shot expired freezer stored slide film from 1995 and most of the rolls turned out great with some magenta shadows that is fixable when editing the photos.

[@smiffy5467]

There's a great garage with the old Shell pumps at Colyford in Devon, check out Amy's at the filling station and you'll get some images...

[@tompoynton]

Your Dawsons shot from a few months back is one of my favourite photos of yours

[@russellsprout2223]

Super-interesting and enjoyable video. Love the look of the expired Vericolor and what a fantastic location at Retford. A hugely successful day out. Atb

[@nazardzhavala256]

you seem happy in this video and its nice to see your passion come through

[@tree267]

Just down the road from the first garage in Burley is Beaulieu, which has a cool classic car garage, usually a few outside. Also there is an old petrol station with old pumps on the A36 at West Wellow.

[@KyleMcDougall]

Seems like there's a few down there!

[@AlexLuyckxPhoto]

These look pretty good! I guess I'm going to have to dig through my own film collection and find whatever Vericolor I have kicking around and shoot it this summer.

[@LauraMendes-we2np]

I shoot a lot of expired film and I'm way too used to that yellow/red fogging in the photos (more than i'd like lol 😂). What I learned is that if you think it needs +1 stop, usually it's actually +2 at least 😂. If possible, it's best to bracket if you're testing a batch, or if you really want to ensure that you got it. But great shots, anyway! Love your videos! ❤

[@brianbeattyphotography]

lots of cool history. I really like that old truck too. Nice work!

[@KyleMcDougall]

Thanks 👍

[@bearpaws5942]

I adore the fogging. I love making my images vintage in appearance. Shoot what you love right?

[@KyleMcDougall]

Indeed. Cheers.

[@nerwin]

I really enjoyed these type of videos by you Kyle...something oddly relaxing about it. Perfect to watch with a cup of coffee haha. it makes me want to get out and take photos although winter and very cold weather doesn't excite me as much but I am looking forward to shooting more film this year because you inspire me so much about the process. Thank you for being here and sharing your journey with us.

[@KyleMcDougall]

That's awesome to hear. Thanks for watching.

[@xander1052]

To me, these still look a lot better than any expired results I've gotten, where the grain went to 11 and the reds died

[@stevespencer9001]

Excellent project Kyle, grab these time capsules before they disappear and the portrait was taken really well ❤

[@synlfo7828]

i miss the British weather so much .Especially the country side when taking photos. Its like having a soft box overhead. Sunny places are so overrated hahah

[@KyleMcDougall]

I'm definitely learning to embrace it!

[@ianblackman2144]

There's an old garage and petrol pumps in a little village called Much Wenlock just outside Bridge North it is a brilliant place to photograph old garages

[@KyleMcDougall]

Just visited there yesterday!

[@tylerhuttosmith]

I have quite a few sheets of expired vericolor in 4x5 that I got 2 years or so ago when I first started shooting LF. I got them cheap and thought it would be a good way to learn and wouldn’t feel guilty about wasting sheets. Should’ve gone with cheap black and white or x ray film lol. The results were underwhelming and I had similar fogging to yours and even crazier color shifting. Mine is a little older and I don’t think it was stored well over the years, but it’s still fun to see what I can get from it every once in a while rated at ISO 50 or 25 now that I know what kind of results to expect.

[@TwangThang57]

Love the look of the non-perfect images!

[@iNerdier]

Hehe welcome to the vagaries of ancient expired film. Has the characteristic base fog and colour clouds on the edges. Sometimes it’s great, sometimes it’s hyper cooked. Often shooting at box and pushing a stop in development works decently but essentially it’s test every box and try and find cold stored where possible. Some of my favourite portraits I shot on film which was water damaged and had emulsion layers flaking off so it had wild colour smudges at the corners though! I’ve got a fridge full of old (tested) slide film if you’re interested.

[@KyleMcDougall]

Yeah it's something I'm learning to embrace. Just used to working with fresh film, so it always catches me off guard a bit. I think I'll pass on the slide film for now. I already have some in my fridge.

[@harbourdogNL]

I have three or four boxes in my freezer. And a few boxes of Portra, some Chrome, some Tri-X and I think some Agfa B&W. Exactly the same type of thing I used to shoot with my Crown Graphic...vernacular architecture and landscape. I miss the ritual of setting up for a shot. The methododical steps, the sequence, the clack of the film holder, the whish of the dark slide, and then making sure it's the right way round when you slide it back in. I miss darkroom work. 14:52 I ran the E-6 and C-41 lines for a custom photo lab in Toronto for a few years back in the late 80s. Big dip and dunk machines. I'd suggest the fading on the edges is a result of insufficient agitation, not enough 'fresh' chemistry getting to the film surface...can you adjust the speed of the rotation? Warmer dev will also give you more density from the film that produced the thin negs. We had to keep the chemistry with half a degree of the correct temperature, and we plotted densities every hour on the hour. 3:52 That lens is looking a bit dusty. And no filter?

[@studiojege287]

Great to see your how-to and dedication! Well done.

[@lieutenant-dingo7237]

Great video! Did anyone else find the colors on the epson can a bit better? The greens were less yellow/ brown and reds were a bit deeper. Im sure its something you can mathc easily, bit still.

[@zacharyfuhrman7130]

Kyle, this hat is an absolute banger. Great video, too. Verichrome has some interesting tones. I'll have to keep my eye out for a pack or two.

[@Casualfulltime]

Great Kyle. I stopped using expired for critical work. Life is to short and moments are too fleeting to take risks with old film. Waste of chemicals too 😄 Great that you took more images though. Side note- I love Kodak Gold too!

[@GoldSeals]

Im amazed that your still able to develop color film..I never did color film before,only black and white.Ive used film canisters to develop the black and white film,and also used a box with a light inside it to print on paper,and some enlarging too.Your on the right track with your film..Nothing will come close to using film as far as quality..It took the industry a long time to come out with an acceptable digital camera..Ive had some fuji film out perform kodak film in some cases.

[@treyusher32]

I gotta build up courage to go ask owners if I can shoot there locations like you do! It gets you a better connection to the shots you take and you get to meet more people. It also saves you in the long run I feel if people catch you photographing their stuff without their permission lol doesnt look good.

[@KyleMcDougall]

Yeah, definitely recommended. People are usually cool about it, and it's nice to be upfront about what you're doing.

[@GJones-zx5nr]

Very hardcore rabbit hole, but came out on top 🙌

[@c.augustin]

I second your choice of the Jobo 2520 tank - even with manual rotation (it just has to be fast enough, an error I made at first, until I saw how fast a processor actually rotates the tank). Best results so far with 4x5. But rather bad results with 35 mm and 120 film (so I'll stick to the smaller 1520 tank and inversion for those). The Kaiser light pads are rather bad (at least mine is)! I experienced problems myself with 4x5 negatives that I first thought were light leaks (which actually were one problem with the Intrepid 4x5) and development, but didn't go away no matter what I've tried. In the end I made a medium gray shot of the panel, and after increasing contrast in post the uneven lighting became visible. I changed to a Raleno PLV-S192 (a tip I've gotten from the CEO of Valoi), and now it works much, much better! The problem with the light source becomes apparent when negative contrast is low, and with color negative film, as the contrast has to be (sometimes hugely) increased in the conversion process. Much less visible with slide film (high contrast itself) and correctly exposed B&W negatives (also rather contrasty), where the uneven lighting is not "stretched out" by increasing the contrast in post.

[@KyleMcDougall]

I'll check out the Raleno. And yeah, I feel like the Kaiser isn't the best. Thanks for the heads up.

[@messsucher]

I feel those "warm vignettings" are more from the camera scanning methods. A lot of the films that are underdeveloped or underexposed makes more lights from the light source that illuminates the negative comes through from outside the camera, and thus flares the image. But the negative itself might actually be fine. Thats why I only try to camera scan at night now, theres less environment light that pollutes the negatives. I just find if the film has very low density, its extremely easy to get those light pollutions

[@KyleMcDougall]

That's what I thought as well, as I've had issues with that in the past. But it was the same with both the GFX and the flatbed. And if you look at the negatives you can see it on there.

[@Lifebydesignvlogs]

After a few minutes of watching i subscribe i like the energy

[@franciscomolina1729]

Hey Kyle ! Really good video. The foggy images look pretty good actually. I just wanted to suggest to you, that it could be a fixer issue.I can see that the fog is not only in the exposed image itself, it is also on the frames of the sheet, which should be totally transparent. I had kind of the same problem in W&B film. After developing, stop bath, fix and let it dry, I had like this kind of glare all around the sheet. I tried to put it back in to the developing tank and fix it again, the same time, then you should do the stabilizer bath and wash. All the glares gone. I could worth a try, never tried this on Color film. Let me know if you try it and works!! Keep it going !

[@KyleMcDougall]

Very interesting. I'll have to give that a try and see what happens. Thanks!

[@davidh8258]

that garage was awesome finds, i could spend alot of time shooting there, another great video showing your process

[@KyleMcDougall]

Cheers. Definitely a cool find!

[@andretim75]

Again such a great and informative Video Kyle !! Actually I thought and imagined you could maybe use this expired film also in different scenarios. Let`s say you could go to a place full of people, horse race comes to mind , also even summer festivals, park sceneries , beach sceneries. And then get some shots with this expired film would be adding a sort of timeless expression to the human behavior when it comes to public gathering and just groups of humans in different scenarios. But of course i would love to see this expired film used on landscapes and intimate sceneries as you intent to do !

[@KyleMcDougall]

It has a unique look to it. I'll definitely keep using it for these garage scenes.

[@key2adventure]

I shoot a lot on expired film, and i like the look. Your images look gorgeous to my eyes exactly for the dated look.

[@tommorgan3125]

...the art of imperfection!

[@vyrnmn]

2:03 No interesting cars? That's a Saab 900! Very interesting!

[@davidxflood]

That always happens when I turn up to make images of some place! :-D

[@inzaneartworks3109]

Definitely prefer the GFX files over the Epson. I love the look of expired film. Great work!

[@KyleMcDougall]

I was surprised by the difference, especially in the reds.

[@adventureuav]

I've had horrendous edge bleed/fogging/color casts on literally every expired roll of Kodak I've ever shot.

[@gonzalovillar83]

I use expired film most of the time because it’s cheaper. Sometimes I get weird results , specially in 35mm. In 120 is usually ok.

[@aureliomarsili3902]

Really cool video and photographs, fantastic place !!! Ciao from Italy...

[@tombarber9181]

I've not worked with expired film yet.... but I do have some 1987 vericolor as well, alongside some 1967 Ilford and a roll of 1947 Kodak..... of which I dont fancy my chances, but if you don't shoot it you never know... right?

[@john_murch]

Got a few rolls of expired Vericolor in 120 from the mid '90's and one from 1982. It's a bit of a crap shoot with expired film, should be interesting to see how they turn out, will definitely over expose.

[@Larpy1933]

This vid. is a 100% win. Thanks.

[@keithwiebe1787]

I've been scanning some of my negatives and positives from 30 years ago. Everything from 35mm to 4x5. I see no point in ever shooting film again. But hey, that's me. I do have some neat shots of an old trading post in b/w and went by it the other day. It's way dilapidated compared to 30 years ago. Should have shot some pics now. I may go back tomorrow or so.

[@garrettmain3712]

Dude this is awesome.

[@dan-le-brun]

Was that Burley I spotted near the beginning? If so, I grew up near there. What a fab project.

[@KyleMcDougall]

Yep, great spot.

[@viktorbjorkman5632]

When you scan with the GFX, do you darken the room or not? I noticed you said you tried to mask of the light source, but reflections bouncing around from daylight/lamps can also contribute to fading in the positives as well, and I notice it a lot more with old/thin negatives since the algorithm give them more of a "boost" during the inversion process. Just a tip you might want to try out :D Also, really well made and comfortable video as always, Good luck!

[@KyleMcDougall]

Cheers. And yep, scanning in a dark room with everything off.

[@roberthennings]

Have you tried Flat field correction on your GFX? It would correct all the abnormalities you get out from a vintage lens.

[@KyleMcDougall]

I've never managed to get good results from it. Always ends up doing strange things to the images.

[@michelelonghi5231]

I shot some twentish year old vericolor too (135 film), I exposed it at 64 iso, and I've got the same exactly the same results. Maybe it's the film itself that degrade in this way

[@perin99]

Nice video. Have you photographed much of Manchester? Many of the old buildings from the industrial revolution are still there. For clues on locations there's a great channel called "Martin zero." Would be an interesting project on large format.

[@KyleMcDougall]

I haven't. I'm more of a rural person. Maybe one day!

[@BIbiVstf3sx]

could this be the vigniette from the lens used on the 4x5 causing the fade? since the film is old, it could be more sensible i guess

[@KyleMcDougall]

Definitely the film with these.

[@motorvelo]

The fogged petrol pump viewed towards the road is the best. The others really nothing much to commend them. It looks like you are sacrificing the process over the quality of composition. Having worked for years with large format, shooting many thousands of sheets of it, B&W, Colour neg, and transparency I understand the pull of a 5x4 camera with all the advantages of movements and depth of field etc. However I don’t get the shoot on film then scan to digital before printing that goes on. If photographers are going to go down that path then I would suggest a technical camera with a digital back. For me it would have to be analogue all the way from film to print. Something achievable with B&W but a stretch for colour. However that being said I never did care what the image was shot on, just the end result.

[@ThePhotoDept]

BABE WAKE UP, NEW KYLE MCDOUGALL VIDEO DROPPED

[@KyleMcDougall]

🎉

[@laurencewhite4809]

What kind of light board do you recommend when it comes to home DSLR scanning? How strong does the light have to be, etc?

[@KyleMcDougall]

I just use a light panel that came with my Valoi kit. The light pads that I have, one is by Kaiser, but I feel like it has some unevenness to it.

[@MarchMeadow]

Great video! But why didn't you photograph the black Mercedes in front of the Polo -- much classier IMHO 🙂

[@strongislanduk]

Was the second stop in Emsworth? Loving your videos, looking forward to watching the rest of the video.

[@KyleMcDougall]

Yep!

[@davidpearce2981]

Rule of thumb expired film for every decade give it extra stop of exposure. I loved what you did anyway, what area was this

[@doriangasseling]

That Lada at the end is neat, always liked those, not many here. Also, how'd a Goodlids hat all the way from here get to you? haha

[@KyleMcDougall]

Haha, straight from their website!

[@Cookerab]

Man I miss my CPE2.

[@user-xw7ie6jv2x]

Love your idea . I used to work at one of these in the 60s : now sadly gone. However, " bunch of film, bunch of Rangerovers" ? What is happening to the English language ?

[@inkaststudio]

9:00 Is that a Hudson Bay mug? Lol

[@KyleMcDougall]

Haha, yep, good catch.

[@keithwiebe1787]

Yes, way underexposed. We always got back density numbers from the lab and on known film (most everyone shot VPS back in the day professionally) you wanted the density to be a number 66 whatever that meant. Other film were a crap shoot on the number. Yep, give it another 2 stops and you'll be there.

[@stevef2114]

Do you think the fogging on sheets was due to those touching in the box for a long time? Where were they stored before you got them do you know?

[@KyleMcDougall]

Not sure how they were stored. I got them from a good friend, but he got them from someone else who was the original owner.

[@keithwiebe1787]

By exposing it at iso 25 or 50 the light edges will straighten up. Nothing really to do with old film but having too thin if negative. Your scanning camera is just showing it's vignetting slightly on a thin negative.

[@jvermillion1052]

The faded images are better IMO. Just having a normal looking image, HoHum dime a dozen. The expired images from thin negs have mood and mystery. Toss the normal ones and keep the fades...

[@BullitTom]

I really liked the fogged images, especially the pump and garage portrait. Also, what fleece are you wearing?

[@KyleMcDougall]

Cheers. It's by Berghaus.

[@BullitTom]

@@KyleMcDougall cool, tried to track one down, can you remember which model it was? Looking forward to the next video

[@browntown52]

Not relevant to the 4x5, but do you at all miss the ed9000 scanner? I shoot 6x6 exclusively, playing around with the idea of 6x17, but think ultimately ill go with the Epson or possibly a used ed9000. Not in the budget to put a gfx100 on a stand for me

[@elementi17545]

Hi Kyle, great photos, I really like them! What film holder did you use on the V700? I'm struggling finding any good holders which can scan the borders too. Thanks! :)

[@KyleMcDougall]

Just used the stock holders for the V700.

[@itsmrjack_]

Super interesting and inspiring video as per usual Kyle 👏👏👏 Having myself just this week bought a V700, but specifically for scanning prints rather than negatives, I'm interested to know - do you plan to stick with your GFX scan method or might you use the V700 again? You mentioned colour differences but did you find any benefits to the V700 in terms of sharpness and resolution ? Or does the GFX still win out?

[@KyleMcDougall]

Cheers. I'll definitely stick with the GFX. I found it to be more detailed as well.