Pikes Peak Race Car Ep1 - The beast is born

Here's the first update on the race car build. So far we've offered up the Tesla motors and are figuring out how and where to mount them. Next step will be the battery pack locations and overcoming any issues that the motor locations have raised, like the steering problem mentioned in the video.
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[@lokmen__]

That intro is great

[@RustyChapman]

I learn something new every time I run a video from Electric Classic Cars. Well done, Richard.

[@ElectricClassicCars]

Glad you enjoyed it

[@TastierBackInThe80s]

Best part of these projects. The planning of everything. Having the frame and working everything around like Lego.

[@dehanbadenhorst1398]

I'm so excited to see it in action eventually, but the whole process is fascinating! I'm definitely watching every video of this project

[@pascalg7815]

FANATASTIC series! Thank you so much for immersing us in your tech thought process. As an engineer and tech crazzzy, this is just gold. The thought process is the journey that brings you to the final goal. Exceptional presentation and video series. Eagerly followed season 1 of ECC and will be looking forward to all that you upload. Thanks again for "inviting" us on this journey! Cheers.

[@b6s4shelter]

go on then Richard... start cutting that Cage! No Fear! this Buffy will fly!

[@d.beaumont9157]

It's going to be a beast. I like your positive approach, no problems just a rethink.

[@chargeheadsuk]

Who ever dies with the most toys with amusing names wins!!! Wedgee vs Buffy sounds like 1 all to me 🤔⚡🤣

[@bobskinner4389]

Thanks Richard ! Good luck with everything

[@micheltebraake7915]

This is fun! Figure it all out, then adjust it again.

[@craigbourne4792]

used to watch you on vintage classic car's, then found this :) Liked and subscribed..... ps love it.

[@stephen_101]

Looking awesome man! Remember to put a stake right up front on the bonnet to help with the slaying!

[@timjohnson67]

Thank you for a very interesting series of vids that even dummies like me can enjoy and appreciate your enthusiasm. Need loads more, please

[@dikkylahari]

Placing the batteries on the floor like skate board design will help in solving. I don't know just thought about it.

[@insAneTunA]

Because you talked about voltage drop I was wondering if the Ultra capacitors, a type of capacitor with a very high energy storage capacity from a company that is called Skeleton Ultra capacitors, could help to reduce that voltage drop even more. Their capacitors are very lightweight, yet very robust, and they have a ridiculous amount of energy storage capacity for their size and weight, and they are rated for very high energy flows. A Scottish island uses those Ultra capacitors in combination with their wind turbines. And 3 years ago the YT channel Fully Charged did a video about Skeleton Ultra capacitors. The host of that show even went to visit their production facility in Europe. I thought that it was worth mentioning, although you have to see for yourself if the specs from their products are good enough or even useful at all for what you want to accomplish. Anyway, big thumbs up, and looking forward to the next episode. 👍🙂

[@jasonperry6046]

I think I am most excited for the build. Originally I was excited about the performance. After watching this I am more excited about the process and why you made the decisions you did.

[@locknut5382]

Superb! I can hardly wait to see it running. Thanks for the video, Richard. 🙂👍

[@davidsingleton7240]

Richard! I just had an even better idea than swapping a Chevy Bolt engine into a 2019 VW convertible beetle engine. I saw the electric Austin mini with a 300hp Tesla model S front motor. Much easier to do, and about double the horse power! I love it. Keep the videos coming.

[@aaronsaldanha2815]

i wish if i could get a internship with u guys. I really admire your work, its soo good.

[@smoggydrones5664]

great project

[@500bht]

I like your idea for the batteries to be fitted into a hidden floor around the seat area. With the seat sunk into the middle will give a feeling of sitting in the car & not on top of it.

[@meirionrhys3786]

I thought of a part that might be of use to get the steering column over the front motor, the 2nd gen frontera had a steering rack with the pinion pointing up forwards, a short shaft to a 90 degree ish transfer box. if you google 2002 frontera steering column you'll see it and there is one on ebay right now!

[@ElectricClassicCars]

Interesting. That's a Bevel box which is what we were considering using. Didn't realise they were used the the Frontera. Thanks for letting us know. 👍

[@imiles5548]

Most all wheel drive electric scooter conversions run seperate batterys to each motor as you say there are more amps than the battery or bms can handle. GO TEAM BUFFY

[@johnshanks8506]

Thank you for the videos, both the technical and race car update. I truly enjoy learning more details about electric cars, especially more technical information that you are providing. I do have a question for your future video. Can you discuss the long term maintenance on an electric vehicle. We all know about 60k to 100k mile cam belt, cam chain replacement. How about electric cars. Could you discuss how to replace a single cell in a battery pack. I understand there are companies that can replace a single cell in a battery, can you explain how this is done and how they find which single cell is faulty. Keep the videos coming. Thanks

[@jeremyreynolds3574]

Fun working out the amount of batteries you will require, as race/events could/will be of different lengths and you don’t want to be carrying excess weight. You might even not need all the batteries all of the time.

[@edwardbroyles9738]

I'm not particularly knowledgeable about electric technology, especially if it's in a race car. But I really love trying to follow your explanation of the how & why you place things. This technology, in my opinion, is the future of motor vehicles. So I like to learn more about it. I followed your broadcast show on TV and hope to see it come back.

[@ElectricClassicCars]

Thanks. Season 2 of Vintage Voltage is already out on QuestTV here in the UK. For other countries I'm not sure when it will be on air.

[@edwardbroyles9738]

@Electric Classic Cars previously here in the U.S. they had it on the motor trend network. I've not even seen ads for it yet. This network has been going through some issues and isn't very consistent. But since you say it's started I'll keep watching for it. THANK YOU

[@godslittlehelper3209]

@@ElectricClassicCars ever thought of using hub motors?, f1 use the same tech in there cars.

[@ElectricClassicCars]

@@godslittlehelper3209 We've used a hub motor on a motorcycle conversion we did a few years back but for various reasons they're not really great for cars.

[@jeppenordfosskristensen7319]

Lovely project 🤘🏻🇩🇰🏁🇬🇧😎

[@Cheapsh0t247]

Really interesting build, thanks for the share. Would love to see this run against the latest Rimmac machine when its finished

[@nickcooper14]

I like it, will be interesting to see the setup and tune of the motors

[@robj5780]

Your feet might get very toasty having them so close to the front motor.... Can't wait to see the final design and drive of Buffy

[@bodilidily]

Seems like a very tight fit for everything, will be interesting how you fit it all together. Won't be slow though!

[@rrs1912]

It will be interesting to see how you will manage cooling of these batteries

[@mrmawson2438]

It's going to be great when it's done an I like the fart at the end 😂

[@spudproductions7606]

Well spotted. 😀

[@ElectricClassicCars]

It's Spuds trademark. Just be thankful that KZbin doesn't support smellovision yet. 😆👍

[@mrmawson2438]

@@ElectricClassicCars 🤣

[@deltajohnny]

Awesome project! 👏👏👏 I wouldn't like to have the feet so high, so I'd place these batteries somewhere else 😉😉

[@oapfu]

I am definitely interested in learning more about steer-by-wire, even if you do not end up using it on Buffy.

[@philtucker1224]

Hi Paul I think a lot of modern family cars are using that system now. I think it’s just basically electric motors driving the steering rack back and forth controlled by sensors on the steering wheel boss..

[@oapfu]

@@philtucker1224 Correct, but has it gotten to the point of being practical to put steer-by-wire into home-built or low-volume EV conversions (e.g. Buffy...or the kind of project someone else might dream of trying in their own garage)?

[@pawpawbandit3871]

@@oapfu not "pure" steer by wire without a steering column; and that system would definitely be a potential safety issue / need serious safety testing.

[@robertfack3082]

I don’t think you will have any problem joining the steering column to the rack using simple universal joints. From the video it looks as if it could be done with just two joints but it is difficult to judge from the camera angle. If there is a problem there is a really nice piece of kit used on the VW type 2 (T3), the square fronted rear engined Transporter. It is used to transfer the motion from the vertical steering column to a horizontal shaft attached to the rack mounted under the front seats. It mounts under the floor below the pedals.

[@ElectricClassicCars]

Yes, that VW Bevel gear is exactly the one I have as a backup.👍

[@russellbaker9136]

Like the way this is going All the weight down low Will rear motor behind the axle line give you some more traction ?

[@knowledgebyte]

What in the way of safety systems and firewalls will you be putting in? And will you be doing any crash testing?

[@seanmack5402]

Hi, Richard Bring it on... Buffy to infinity. I always wondered what a Tesla P100D drive train would be like if it was bolted to an Ultima style space frame chassis with smaller capacity lighter batteries. A dream project so good luck & I am looking forward to seeing your wonderful project come to life. My only question for tech talk would be:- How on earth do you source the Tesla battery modules & power trains for your incredible & exciting projects?

[@ElectricClassicCars]

I initially thought about basing it on an Ultima but I thought a Beetle silhouette race chassis would be funnier and more in line with ECC. 😁👍

[@pauladams1829]

It'll be brilliant to see this thing fly! Have you considered making a "skateboard" then fitting a frame around that?

[@gillianst-claire176]

Hi Richard, Tesla put their batteries under the floor, could you do that with biggest section or even a smaller section? You have loads of ground clearance, of which you only need a small amount even on a bumpy track. So you could take the batteries as low as suspension travel height, although the lower you go the riskier it's going to be. But remember their is loads of room, just where you want it!!!! I'm an engineer too but not in this area, Electronics & Computing, but retired. Good luck with the project & keep up the good work. From Ian.

[@Skiridr22]

Use a drive by wire system for the steering that will illuminate the shaft

[@IndependenceCityMotoring]

Seems like too much power for that type of chassis?

[@goosegog]

Richard - Looking at the front hubs, the design looks to me like the steering arm angle relative to the kingpin position dictates that these hubs are designed to be mounted with the rack behind the axle. I reckon with the rack mounted in front of the axle, the Ackerman angle will be incorrect and you'll get loads of horrible tyre scrub on lock. A virtual line drawn through the track rod end and kingpin should intersect with the centre of the rear axle to give good Ackerman angle.

[@andypryke6750]

Great to see the idea's and progress, any thoughts on a super capacitor/s for an instant hit of energy?

[@LosZonga]

At that amount of power, will you consider going a bit wider, even if you place batteries around to get a decent 50/50 weight distribution, it's still not a battery pack that sits at the bottom and the way motor mounts look like, they will be higher than expected too. Also the steering shaft...kind of skinny, imagine in turns with all the power at angle drifting you don't want that to snap.

[@mrmawson2438]

👍

[@BackPackMac]

Can you not rotate the rear motor 180 so that its closer to the centre of the car and then you can just move the two supporting frame struts and keep the existing rear cage frame? Assuming you can effectively reverse the polarity of the motor - or is that the limitation ?

[@ElectricClassicCars]

We can do that but it would then hit the diagonals in front of the rear wheels so we'd be in the same situation. We've reversed motors a lot in the past as a motor doesn't care if it's spinning one way or the other but as the rear motor is the master and the front is the slave motor, the wrong rotation would confuse the front motor so we're going to leave them both in the orientation Tesla intended. 👍

[@oneeleven9832]

Question a lot of people seem to be doing these conversions in different countries. I was wondering where all the Tesla motors are coming from ? There can’t be enough from damaged or crashed vehicles surely and the ones i see don’t look new🤔

[@garyzurasky7312]

You should find someone who can 3D print up some plastic mockup motors for you. Lightweight and all the mounting points would be exactly where they should be.

[@ridefast0]

Interesting project. Just a thought - with the massive acceleration you are going to have, even with a low C of G you will still get a fair bit of weight transfer to the rear, but you are putting the higher powered motor in the front. Sounds like a recipe for front wheel spin, I don't know why you wouldn't put the higher powered unit in the back? You can put batteries where you like to balance things. If Elon's Plaid is the same layout, more power at the front, you might get an advantage by doing it the logical way round?? Best of luck taking down the man.

[@elmerwilliamson1970]

Need to set this up to run the Pike’s Peak hill climb in Colorado Springs, Colorado! Find out what class and specs you need to have and go for it!

[@ajwright5512]

Got any initial thoughts on battery cooling? Excellent vid. Always beautifully produced (except for the fart at the end).

[@ElectricClassicCars]

We'll definitely need battery thermal management, both heating and cooling. The details of how are a little fuzzy at the moment. 👍

[@TKomoski]

How many parachutes are you going to use to slow that rig down?

[@markm6488]

That motor is wider than the frame😂🚀

[@ScubaSam242]

Exciting ⚡️🔋⚡️🔋⚡️🔋⚡️🔋⚡️

[@nealm1814]

This could turn into the ECC equivalent of Project Binky

[@ElectricClassicCars]

I hope not. That build lasted about 7 years didn't it? 7 months is long for me. Life's too short. 😜👍

[@shannons1886]

The name is a direct rip off.

[@duncanburnet9185]

Looks like you still have a lot of head room, would the CG change that much if you put some batteries under the seat?

[@philtucker1224]

Great update, because the car will be so light for power to weight and due to the massive torque kick of the electric and the fact that you can’t “feather the clutch” I expect the front to regularly lift on hard acceleration despite the front motor position. Is there enough room for a couple of the batteries to go right at the front maybe ? 🤔

[@ElectricClassicCars]

Yep, weight distribution will be key. 👍

[@StacyODell]

Hot swappable batteries would be amazing if possible -- pull into the pits, fresh batteries, off you go for more racing

[@timfolly7323]

Seeing this project has reignited an idea I had. With the terrible modern designs of cars today, why can’t we build a basic electric chassis and motor and have classic body styles of the fifties or whenever that are built to fit the base chassis. I love the style of the vintage cars but like the tech of today. A handful of vintage bodies that fit the same chassis. Not a engineer or mechanic but that’s my idea.

[@drewdig]

Have you ever used Ultracapacitors (e.g. from Skeleton) , I know they're used in e-Buses but haven't heard them being used in cars?

[@ElectricClassicCars]

My chief EV technician has used them before. They're great for receiving and storing energy very quickly and the delivering that electricity quickly. 👍

[@elmakcnc5960]

u did nice technical programs about electric cars i know that u cant tell to much about cost but maybe you can give us some idea how much cost more less Tesla batteries and other stuff.regards

[@SamzikEST]

Cool project! What company makes these hubcariers in front? Or who sells these?

[@trevorforzetting3019]

I'd really love to know which products you are using for the lower control arms and hub/knuckle/strut assembly?

[@evscott1346]

Can more structure be added to the roll frame front and back within the beetle shape to add and protect more equipment?

[@BombSponge]

Do you fabricate your own brckets and mounts or grind them off non runners?

[@ElectricClassicCars]

We fabricate our own.👍

[@BombSponge]

@@ElectricClassicCars 👍

[@johnwoolf66]

You've almost got enough headroom to be able to fit a whole layer of batteries in the floor, how tall is your driver? 😁

[@ElectricClassicCars]

Either that or we roof chop it to improve the aerodynamics. 😜👍

[@philtucker1224]

Good point John although I think having the batteries surrounding the seat means it will be fairly close to optimum anyway..

[@ElectricClassicCars]

Just tried the batteries under the seat. Unfortunately with a helmet on its dangerously close to the top cross bar on the roll cage, so looks like under the seat batteries is not an option.

[@francisgaliegue6645]

SInce you're into crazy projects, why not go for an electric rally car? It would of course have to be 4WD but more importantly it would have to have enough energy to complete a full day of rallying, including road sections :p I imagine the energy required to complete a gravel stage (say, like in Sardinia or Greece) would be quite high, since you spend a lot of energy ejecting loose gravel instead of actually going forward... And tuning regen would also be quite a challenge :p

[@davidwilkie9551]

So the Tesla beater is a beaten up Tesla rebooted?

[@jossentjens7154]

Well done! RE: front motor, is it no possible to tilt/swing the motor down a bit, to free up space for the steering rack? Although, I am also curious about steer-by-wire technology...

[@ElectricClassicCars]

You can tilt it a little but there's an oil pickup at the bottom so tilt it too much and it'll start pulling air through with modifications internally. But you're right, a slight tilt might be a good idea, the only problem then will be it impeding the pedal assembly.. 👍

[@jossentjens7154]

@@ElectricClassicCars Thanks! I initially though (minimal) ground clearance and suspension travel might the limiting factor, I did not consider lubrications… E-motor are high revving which implies a gearbox, right?

[@ElectricClassicCars]

@@jossentjens7154 That's correct. 👍

[@seangourley14]

Not really applicable to this project but wondering if it is possible to ‘over volt’ the motors? Using a 7s pack would still give good power under a voltage sag situation. I’m asking as I want to use these LG Chem batteries with a model 3 rear drive unit. It is for a very light kit car for sprints and hill climbs so I don’t need much capacity. I was going to use a single 6s pack but wonder if a 7s would be possible? Great project!

[@ElectricClassicCars]

No, the inverter wouldn't work at that higher voltage. You need to check what the voltage range of the inverter is as it will be built and designed to work within a specific voltage range. 👍

[@joshuasmith7369]

Buffy is the name of Kaylee Rogers's dog.

[@noah786]

You may want to consider loosing the box under your feet for ergonomics sake.

[@TestTest-eb8jr]

Question: how many kWh is stored in one LG module? Suggestion: rotate the rear motor/inverter 180 degrees along/around the line through the axles, putting the weight of the drive unit more towards the middle of the car (this way the motor spins in the original direction but it does put the motor/inverter "up-side down", is that a problem?)

[@ElectricClassicCars]

Unfortunately the drive unit can't be mounted upside down due to the internal oil lubrication system. 👍

[@mattw6549]

Just curious can you buy Tesla motors from Tesla itself. Or are you getting salvaged motors from crashed teslas

[@Mobile_Dom]

is drive and steer by wire not an option here?

[@ElectricClassicCars]

That's something we're definitely looking at. 👍

[@malkum61]

Which race series is this aimed for? Sorry if you have answered this before.

[@dengoogle967]

What steering rack did you use?

[@BrianSmart1959]

Electric remote servo steering?

[@replica1052]

(would a dallara x1/9 body kit fit)

[@k13ehr]

To have an update don't we need to see what you are updating from, I assume there was a previous video where you had got this far, I don't see one, so has it been removed or is this a goof?

[@Yonner666]

Had a brain waive 🤔 How about Buff-E The Plaid Slayer instead of Buffy?

[@spudproductions7606]

I like it.

[@alexmatthews9536]

I thought the M3P was 490bhp

[@LosZonga]

So vampires and fiction...what's wrong with English people? Just for laughs I live in Transylvania. Good name btw, the project looks awesome for now.

[@k13ehr]

A bit boring just pointing at parts no work to see, hope part 2 is better as this is similar to the way the BS TV program is done, basically making a interesting subject about as vague as possible.