PinkKittyRose vs ALG Andy. SEMI-FINALS Game [3] ALTTPR Tournament Spring 2018

[@jedcauffield1858]

I love 💗 PKR commentary! Can’t wait to see her 4-5 years of improvement too!! First time ALTTP Randomizer SR watcher

[@crimedog7576]

"And Andy skillfully avoiding almost all of the rupies." and, "Oh no, we are truly wizards." I lolled twice. GREAT commentary guys.

[@user1982]

the commentary is cringe

[@DrakeyC]

I think PKR's early-game routing is actually very smart. Kakariko is great for item density, but there's a lot of checks you need to do there - Sick Kid, activate the Flute, Magic Bat if you get the items for that, the library, and if you have the items for it you can dip into Dark World for two dungeons in very close proximity, one of which needs no special items to complete. So by not immediately going to Kakariko and checking South Shore, PKR gambles that if she finds, say, a Bottle or the Flute there, or even just more Bombs, she can just cross those things off the list when she goes to check Kakariko later and get them out of the way early, and if she finds nothing then she doesn't lose anything by going to Kakariko second (unless Boots or Flute are there).

[@ibreathexcellence]

I have to give it to PKR, her routing is god tier. Every game I've watched of hers she makes choices that always seem to pay off. I'm going to call it, when her execution becomes as good as someone like christos or andy, she'll be unbeatable

[@ZeldaTheSwordsman]

It's looking like part of what cost her was not using her canes when they would have been helpful.

[@civilhate5876]

She played the game of her life and still lost. She is so awesome. I'm inclined to agree with you, her routing and stuff is basically perfect. The deciding factor is usually Andy's execution and the fact that he hovers. The hover is a gamechanger a lot of the time.

[@jedcauffield1858]

@@civilhate5876 First time watcher of ALTPR SR, where do they hover @?!

[@civilhate5876]

@@jedcauffield1858 its only over certain gaps. Andy does it in a couple of death mountain caves. He can do it in Hookshot cave for example. He can also hover the gap and skip the Moldorm two fight in Ganon tower. If he lands this stuff, it's only a few seconds here and there saved, but it adds up to 30-45 seconds or more across the game.

[@larelare1]

Top notch routing from both racers. It was one of the best races I’ve seen. I’ve rewatched it a couple times.

[@ScottJohnHarrison]

I am so hyped to see this match - Pink Kitty Rose impressed me so much with the routing she did the last two matches. Only the finals and third place remaining.

[@lokstir4568]

Scott John Harrison ya same. Never watched any of her races before but her early game routes always seemed to work. Major props to her.

[@Jim-cj7pj]

Started watching her in round 3 of the tourney. She is very Impressive for sure. Bummed she lost but still top 4 from over 500 is amazing

[@wknight8111]

PKR had some really good routing decisions, especially early. Checking mini-moldorm cave for the bottle saved the double-dip on kakariko. She skipped the double-dip into dam by routing it with swamp. She skipped the double-dip on Zora because she got the flippers in PoD. She skipped the double-dip to Lake Hylia because she checked there after the flippers . It's actually kind of depressing that you can make so many great decisions and still lose to Andy

[@ZeldaTheSwordsman]

Yeah... Of course, she also made a couple bad decisions. Including not using her Canes when it would have been advantageous. She lost time to dragging the statue during the first dip into Skull Woods, instead of just slapping a Somaria block onto the switch. And she lost time to trying to dodge the lasers on Laser Bridge rather than use the Cane of Byrna.

[@Oblic008]

Close race. Andy is clearly a better runner, but at this level, they're all crazy good. PKR routing is confusing, but seems to work out for her. Still, seems like she enjoys gambling more than playing the odds. Overall, a great race to watch til the end.

[@IceMaverick13]

Yeah PKR's routing choices in the mid-game (usually) feel very much like she's trying to maximize the amount of gambles she takes on her route. A gamble heavy style like that usually just means the game is a total blowout one way or the other. If it pays off, she's ahead by miles for getting some required item crazy early, if it doesn't, she's super far behind and just gets crushed off of the sheer time loss. This situation against somebody like Andy - who can basically execution his way out of bad luck - is pretty much the only kind of matchup where her getting a gamble that pays off doesn't actually guarantee that she's going to be super far out in front. Outside of this kind of matchup, the really swingy nature of a gamble-heavy race is actually kind of boring for me to watch. It's exciting up until we see the result of the big gamble, after that, it's basically a decided game and the rest of it is kind of meh.

[@ZeldaTheSwordsman]

Something I've noticed about playing rando casually, at least in the current version (dunno about V29), is that picking up pots in the dark seems to be reeeally finicky. Did EP lampless once and knew I had to be right up against the pots a couple times but Link did not want to pick them up. Andy going to the house and then immediately savequitting back to Sanctuary could have been indecision, or it could have just been hitting Start too fast. Old man living on Death Mountain is explained in vanilla. He's the grandfather of one of the Maidens, and thus on Aghanim's shitlist as someone who could potentially expose the facade before the seal is properly breached. Marjevic, the "orm" in Moldorm's name comes from "Worm". Zelda 1 manual art outright portrayed it as a giant earthworm, whereas A Link to the Past-onward reimagined it as a centipede-like creature (probably because of the Zelda 1 Moldorms being made up of linked spheres in-game). The protrusions from the body segments are its legs - the art confirms it. Somebody should reeeally show that art to the ALBW/LA(NS) art team, because they for some reason interpreted the protrusions as spines or fuzz of some kind, resulting in what has become known as Burgerdorm. ALBW already needs an enhanced rerelease because there's no post-game save, so why not fix Moldorm's graphics while they're at it? Also, semi-vanilla Moon Pearl! The problem with doing PoD right away this seed is that they don't have the hammer yet - and thus would be gambling on there being a vanilla/semi-vanilla hammer. Probably another reason they checked Catfish. Andy took some unlucky damage that denied him the Hammer Jump, slowing him down in PoD. Meanwhile Pink's Zora check was more efficient despite not routing it in with Catfish because she had the Flippers and the Boots, so she was able check Waterfall Fairy and grab the ledge item in one trip, and make it faster than Andy's first dip. Not checking Hype Cave sooner is something that hurt Pink in Game 2, probably on her mind when she did it. Not finishing PoD after getting the Hammer makes sense - the path to Helmasaur King is fairly quick and thus can be blitzed through, and it's all that's left. Pink, you have the goddamn Cane of Somaria! Don't waste time dragging the statue! Nooooo! That probably cost her a bit. Both of them know what Swamp did to them last time. And so does this seed, apparently. What the fuck XD A pity Pink didn't gamble it not being in the sunken chests, she could have picked up some time that way... but also understandable. Oh gods the Mitts on the tablet what is this even lmao. Pink, what is with you and not using your canes?! Just use Byrna and you'll be done with Laser Bridge lickety-split. Augh! It huuuurts! You're smarter than that.. It's painful to see you lose time and resources when you had an item that would have let you do it quick and easy.. You really should have whipped it out after failing the laser dodge that first time, instead of risk failing it all three other times _because_ you failed it the first time (which is what happened). Ooh, if only Pink had done full left first... that was costly... And with the time lost to the statue, the bridge, and the worst enemy in the game she _especially_ couldn't afford it... At that point her best hope was on Andy to choking somewhere like the gauntlet, Lanmolas, disappearing floor torch puzzle, Trolldorm II, or Ganon. Or finding the Silver Arrows. Still, well done for going the distance like you did, Pink. Well done.

[@scottlhotka3691]

I don't know anyone in this community. I only found this race in KZbin, I don't use twitch. So my opinions and thoughts are completely un influenced and unbiased. I saw Andy in his first round race, before a single person was eliminated. I think it was like my 5th race i ever watched I thought to myself then, this dude's gonna win. Called it.

[@Slain087]

There's good reason why he was one of the participants in the AGDQ showing of randomizer. Say what you will about his and ChristosOwen's safe routing choices, they're gods at execution.

[@IceMaverick13]

When your execution is as good as their's is, there's no reason to make the crazy gamble plays. I'd actually argue that once your execution gets as good as them, it hurts the time to go out of the way and check some crazy gamble. If you can perform at such a high level constantly, the "safe" route means you're rarely going to be doubling back for no reason other than you wanted to gamble. The high skill level of these players usually covers the luck factor on item locations. Being good at the game means you can catch up if somebody else gets luckier than you on a risky route.

[@RadiantPickle]

Oh, look. It's Andy vs ChristosOwen in the finals. What a surprise. (sarcasm end)

[@PaulRizzo504]

Andy got extremely lucky. GT is routed a certain way for good reason.

[@thepotato513]

Shoutouts to Dark Magic Ian

[@Zabyne84]

The commentators clearly didn't watch game 1/2 lmao. "Pink what is this routing?" when she literally did the same in game 1 and 2.

[@jsrodman]

Marjevic with the research.

[@DrakeyC]

Welp, I have no reason to watch the race anymore.

[@invaderpopz]

why is christosowen allowed to compete if he makes the logic

[@collectibles4u]

Love the seed But the commentary was the bombose

[@nemooceansoul1137]

Has there been any pedastal required seeds this tournament?

[@moseistrujillo8300]

nemo oceansoul there have been many, but good luck trying to find one. There has been hundreds of matches

[@nemooceansoul1137]

Moseis Trujillo D= i know

[@JGTheGamer]

I think there was one in the quarterfinal rounds or the top 16. Can't remember which, but the fire rod was on the pedestal.

[@canadian__ninja]

Jeff Grant there have been many but as others said it's like finding a needle in a haystack. Might as well just start at the beginning of the playlist and you'll find a bunch by the end.... Which would likely be next year :p

[@abcyclops]

@Jeff Grant Yeah, It was both an Aga and a Ped seed if I remember right. Let me just check what I watched.... kzbin.info/www/bejne/qWa9fGCkbd2Zjsk hippo vs AmazingAmpharos Game 2 -Was going to outline the happenings, but nah, watch it yourself. Its a good one. Welcome to a Full Aga+Ped seed.

[@AnthonyMEMU]

this plus the tie last round, WOW

[@rossmacdaddy]

I don't understand... I thought they said if they finish within 3 minutes it had to be re-timed and it's ruled a tie?

[@VenomousCamel]

3 seconds

[@Jannesverige]

Damn, suuch a nailbiter.

[@Mephil]

"I think its supposed to look like ganon" - Christ, its a skull and bones

[@HeptaD22]

I played this game for the first time in the early 00's and only in the last few days did I realize that it was a skull and bones. I honestly thought it looked like an upside-down sword with some weird things sticking off of it.

[@gandalf-on2um]

YEEEES ANDY YOU ARE THE BEST

[@pandamonium8182]

Commentator is so full of himself lmao

[@NeighborhoodJackson]

Deadass b I'm actually mad andy won this. It's like he has a problem. He can't let anyone else be better than him

[@jsrodman]

A problem I wish I had.

[@MewtwoStruckBack]

This is the darkest timeline. We have someone who was part of the team who literally made the game against someone who is pretty much known for playing rando and streaming. No dark horse. No upsets. It feels like a circlejerk. I got into watching, and starting to play Randomizer because I thought "okay, this requires skill, but with the random element, there's a CHANCE someone who isn't in that god tier of skill to pull it out and win something. You don't have to be one of those people that does nothing but this game every hour of the day to have a chance." It wouldn't be like, say, competitive Smash where you have to have been around for five years to even have a chance to make it out of pools at a supermajor. Or in the regular, non-random speedrunning communities where you're almost sure who's going to win before a tournament match even starts based on each player's personal best. And yet here we are, with virtually no surprise, with this matchup. As a spectator, I'd like to see the suckout. I watch Texas Hold'Em wanting to see the established pro go all-in, have the best of it, and then get four- or two-outered on the river. I watch football hoping someone will knock off the Patriots (finally someone managed that shit.) I watch the NBA hoping the Warriors lose (sadly no such luck this year.) And I watch rando hoping to see the less-technically proficient, less consistent but still "good" player take a route divergence from the established pro, get rewarded for it, and go on to win. As that's no longer possible this run, I'll end up not watching the finals, only clicking the last submitted video, clicking near the end to see who made it into GT first, watching the last few minutes if it's close, and giving a "meh" and hoping that the next tournament format results in more parity between competitors.

[@eliasE989]

I think that many people disagree with you. The keysanity tournament's finals races with Andy and Christos were one of the best ones of the tournament. With this setup it is possible that we will see top notch tight races where every little detail and smallest mistakes are going to matter. It wasn't a piece of cake for Andy and Christos to get to the finals. Christos nearly got through the quarter finals and was saved only by that fall by Kyong after fighting Ganon and PKR was very close beating Andy here. It really could have gone other ways. But, here we are and I'm exited about the finals.

[@sysys1]

Yeah I find that whole comment a bit odd. I enjoy watching a game between two of the highest skilled players. Regardless of the luck factor, the best players are going to make it deep more often than anyone else. The other extreme is the WSOP ME final table -- every year it's basically like 8 guys I've never heard of and 1 obscure pro. And I don't find that very exciting.

[@MewtwoStruckBack]

I'm surprised Christos didn't scoop given that was the cause of his win, really. Kyong beat Ganon first. For it to be walking off the edge after the fight concluded that cause that? I mean...shit.

[@MewtwoStruckBack]

If the only people that keep winning are the established players, that doesn't give me, someone who's interested in getting into it, much hope of doing well without years upon years of experience before having anything to show for it. If it's going to take that long to even be relevant, why should I even start playing in the first place? Poker placing is kind of what I want to get closer to, but instead of it being say 8 randoms and 1 pro, something closer to 3-5 pros out of 10 would be nice. Enough pros to show skill is rewarded, enough new faces to encourage potential new players that their time wouldn't be wasted involving themselves in the scene.

[@amusedjoker9644]

Randomizer is a skill heavy thing. Luck is involved, yes, but not as much as you seem to think it is. Andy and Christos are both VERY skilled players, both in execution and reading the seed. Randomizer is pretty much 80% Skill, 20% luck, with skill being able to overcome 15% of that luck factor at a sufficient level.