Poseidon X or Redwood. Which budget gravel bike is right for you?

My heart says one. Reasoning says the other.
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=======Budget Bike=======
Poseidon X: goo.gl/JsZ36J
Schwinn Bikes: www.schwinnbik...

[@tibbar1000]

If you go with the x you will save enough money to buy a 90’s mountain bike and put nice tires on it. Then you have everything but jumps and drops covered. I bought the x and just finished a long ride on pavement, dirt and a horse trail; perfect for that mix.

[@GuyInnagorillasuit]

The probably X makes more sense for the rail trail I spend most of my time on, but I love my Redwood's funky 'mountain bike with drop bars' vibe and the option to tackle more challenging singletrack than I would with a more road-ish gravel bike.

[@captaincoyote1792]

This is perhaps, the best video on not only the difference in the two Poseidon models, but what to look for in a bike that you will use, based on your individual riding style! I’m in my mid-60s, I can’t run like I used to, so I hike and bike, and wanted to get into bikepacking / accessing “out of the way” fly fishing/camping spots. So a year before I retired, I researched ad nauseam bike frame materials, tire technology, custom versus “off the floor”, etc. (I know my wife grew sick of my bicycle talk!). I finally settled on a high end bikepacking rig (rohloff, titanium) at a cost of ‘embarra$$ing’! The bike was originally designed as a single track MTB, and while the bike gets compliments everywhere I ride, I’m simply not comfortable riding it long miles. So now, realizing my foolishness at buying a bike I wasn’t able to sit on before purchase, I’m back to looking for a rig that better answers my ‘style’ of riding. Again, amigo, I appreciate this video….you’re communication style is top notch….you’re one sharp cat, brother!

[@shehateme9955]

Are you gonna put it up for sale? You could ger a few Redwoods if you like it & were so inclined.

[@Mr.MidwestNomadFamily]

My redwood shows up Tuesday. Not gonna lie, part of the reason I went with it over the x is that it looks cooler to me. I was also curious to see how the mechanical twin piston brakes would feel.

[@Merdock-yp2xj]

That diagram helped me make my decision, thank you !

[@Mclovinthedank]

I did an awesome snowy gravel ride on my X today.

[@ahmadzuhairi]

His face says it all - Redwood. In cycling the heart always rules over the mind.

[@frankducett9]

I like your graph. I had an X and my heels hit the chainstays. Going for the Redwood. I'm a commuter, practical, no car guy.

[@bsowhat]

Thank you for the comparison. BTW published reach and stack are entirely frame based. So fork, stem, etc, changes won’t change those frame numbers. Certainly those parts change rider fit.

[@mblasavage]

First off... Love the channel. Great content! I'm leaning toward an X frame after watching this video. I'll build it myself because... It's way more fun and I would end up upgrading components as well. My rides are 1/2 road because I ride to the gravel which is pretty smooth. ( Not many baby heads...ick) Thank you for the insight. I almost bought the Redwood frame. You just saved me some grief AND some cabbage!

[@BdHammerli]

I look forward to them both being in stock again.

[@SinAlameda]

They are now.

[@MeanChefNe]

@@SinAlameda not all sizes

[@aaronsnethen1523]

Thats a really good graphic for talking about bike capabilities. Ski industry uses something similar when comparing skis. Bike industry could totally adopt this. Maybe it has? I haven't seen it. Good stuff.

[@Scott-iz2yt]

how did you know i was having this conundrum today, eric?! thanks for the video

[@peterbaskind9872]

“Which one do I get?” In the COVID world, whichever is available.

[@biggaywizard]

I work for a bike shop, I literally tell people this.

[@sebastianschenker9775]

What I don't really like about all budget gravel bikes is that they come with mechanical discs. Have these gotten any better in recent years? I had tried some 15 years ago and didn't like them at all. Finally decided to do a hybrid conversion (with v- brakes) which was great fun and the reason I found your channel. Absolutely love it. Keep on tinkering!

[@pex3]

You can buy hydraulic calipers

[@PedalerzMN]

My X is coming on Wednesday, I can't wait!

[@YoungDoug13]

Watch out for the left side crank... mine stripped almost immediately (yes I installed the pedal correctly) I took it into my bike shop for a helicoil fix. The guy that worked on it let me know that the same exact thing had just happened to another X. So I would venture a guess that there could be a machining issue. I called poseidon about it, they offered to kick some money my way and were super thankful for the heads up. I declined any reimbursement since it was a cheap fix. Wouldn't recommend getting too far from home before proving that out.... Otherwise I'm stoked on the bike.

[@PedalerzMN]

@@YoungDoug13 did it strip at the bottom bracket or at the pedal?

[@YoungDoug13]

@@PedalerzMN at the pedal.

[@YoungDoug13]

@@PedalerzMN "prowheel" is the brand of cranks mine came with.

[@PedalerzMN]

@@YoungDoug13 well that sucks sorry you had to deal with that. I was planning on swapping the crank out pretty quickly but I was hoping to throw the prowheel one on another bike

[@kristiandawe85]

I agreed that the x is the more sensible bike, but I wish I could have both, its so hard for someone like myself to pick one when I love just about every bike I see. I also agree that the redwood looks a lot cooler. I wish they offered the redwood in a glossy red color, it would look so sweet. I keep picturing the redwood in my mind with the highest end Shimano grx groupset in glossy red. I think it would make it a even sweeter bike with grx, but the redwood is pretty sweet already in its stock configuration.

[@tikas408]

Another angle and benefit of the redwood is if you enjoy the chill party pace of road riding, the redwood absorbs all the rough road rides and saves your body from hand, shoulder, and back aches you normally would feel from road riding. It's a great road bike for me because of the supple ride. I do have a carbon road bike (Canyon endurace on 32c tires) but I just love the Cadillac feel of my redwood.

[@peterplanz2310]

That’s my thought as well. The roads here (well, the back roads where I’d ride) suck as far as conditions.

[@SponsoredByMeFishing]

I bought an X pretty much entirely from watching this channel. I'm pretty happy with it.

[@YoungDoug13]

Same

[@cjohnson3836]

How does it feel for longer rides? I'm looking for something more "road adjacent" in a gravel bike. I already have a Surly Ogre for the heavy lifting, otherwise Redwood would be taking my $$$. And, both are truly overbiked beyond reality for where I live. But, my road bike just doesn't really entice a lot of use where I live with 1) all the road debris on pavement and 2) the need to do farm roads outside of the city if you want to avoid traffic. So, I'm looking for something that will crunch up the road miles to get me outside town onto the farm roads for the duration of the real riding. Would you place the X here? Side question, does the new gen X still have that V-shaped edge on the underside of the toptube that makes it a little uncomfortable to shoulder?

[@YoungDoug13]

@@cjohnson3836 it's definitely "road adjacent" I've always been comfy on it for day long rides over mixed terrain. Definitely spices up the fire roads compared to my xc bike.

[@SponsoredByMeFishing]

@@cjohnson3836 I think it might just be what you're looking for. 90 minutes is about my limit right now, but I suspect that's more about my own fitness than the bike.

[@bruhmaxxer]

The warning at the end of this video is actually quite enticing

[@oldfreddyhardtail912]

It almost made me want to "Undsubscribe"!

[@coreyreeder2321]

Dreaming of a redwood. I have an old 23c road bike that still works fine. This would be my N+1 bike. Capable of almost everything I’d want to do and built for adventure.

[@TamBikeOnHotToo]

Ofcourse still my project monster gravel ftw 🚲😎💯

[@scruf153]

I am going with the x as I will be using it for commuting on mostly paved roads

[@MrJayspeaks]

I want that motorcycle. And the Redwood!

[@jasonparks754]

And PLEASE do a video on your X build up!

[@clint2627]

It’s creepy that I’ve been thinking I want a gravel bike and you put out this video. Get out of my mind man!!

[@phoreal9273]

wish they have the tubeless option for the X

[@ryanS593]

I own a road bike and a mtb. I went with the redwood because I wanted something right in the middle and it definitely doesn’t disappoint.

[@banjomechanic]

I got the X for exactly those reasons. Slapped a 44t chainring on it and ride it road, rail to trail, and a couple of mountain bike trails that were a little much for it. But I'm still here and the X is still here as well. Surprisingly solid bike for $700.

[@AquaBara]

Where would you put the new Poseidon X Ambition on the chart?

[@jeffreyrule8143]

Thank you for your review.

[@derekrobertson7260]

I know you’re chart is totally made up but I think it would be interesting to see you try and add a few more bikes to it. I’d be especially interested to see where you’d put your stump jumper.

[@DEXVD]

Would probably begin where the Redwood ended and extend right to MTB, would need a longer graph where MTB is expanded into XC, Trail, All Mountain, Enduro and DH to be more clear on where its capability would end.

[@taylorcarmines7236]

Excellent review - well beyond the standard types of comparison/analysis

[@johnnydoe66]

The Redwood would be my first choice, stability, adventure capable, and 1x.....

[@andrewmaxwell8181]

The new Poseidon X is 1x too.

[@AdamButlerDucote]

As someone who mtn bikes on his crit bike sometimes, and has also spent tons of time on the road with his XC bike, I don't understand when anyone talks about "stability" when discussing bikes. The rider makes a bike stable or unstable. A bike might be more or less responsive to rider input, but that doesn't make it inherently more or less stable. Stability is just a concept in the rider's mind; it's a feeling that has more to do with arbitrary comfort.

[@johnnydoe66]

@@AdamButlerDucote A bike's frame design has alot to do with stability. Yes it's up to the rider to have the ability to ride and maintain balance, but if the bike isn't designed correctly it will be harder to maintain some semblance of control. That's why there are so many differences in frame designs as far as chainstay length, seat and head tube angles, and bottom bracket height. Would you be able to ride a mtn bike on a downhill run that has a 90° head tube angle vs. one with say a 66°?

[@mikearan30]

Great video I myself own the X 2021 version and support the team hardcore lol love the Redwood too will be getting their Triton from them soon hopefully no matter what bike anyone picks just owning any of these machines is a must. Got support the team lol

[@oldfreddyhardtail912]

The question is: How is the Redwood as a "fast" commuter? I want something to rip around town, but also be able to take it on 'family trips' and escape for an hour or two. An MTB is a bit boring for logging roads, but I don't know if a full "gravel bike" is really where I want to go. Besides, the price point is VERY enticing!

[@Leo-gt1bx]

So which would you choose?

[@oldfreddyhardtail912]

@@Leo-gt1bx I ended up buying a Lauf Seigla - much more expensive, but I'm madly in love with it. I still ride a lot of singletrack on my hardtail, but the gravel bike gets more use than I thought it would.

[@oldfreddyhardtail912]

I should add that the Seigla is REALLY fast. It's not something I'd leave locked to a parking meter, but I use it a lot to rip around town.

[@kak93]

This video was soooo helpful!! Thank you!!

[@tomrussell7899]

For my short little legs, the Redwood is the only one in question. it comes with 650B from the factory, and also in Extra Small (XS) which the X does *not*.

[@xonelifex]

Great review my friend! Helped a lot!

[@Spindatt]

glad to aid!

[@nanaluke]

Nice comparison, now can you do this same video but for every overlapping bike in the Surly range?! 😅

[@cjohnson3836]

That's easy. Every Surly bike will do every thing, except win a race.

[@elbonian1166]

Redwood sounds like a great touring/gravel bike…

[@sabergo1]

Well thought out and explained. Thanks.

[@JoeWill231]

That’s one hell of a recommendation, you left me confused. Lol. The redwood looks more fun to me🤩.. thanks for the review..

[@MrModtronix]

Well thought out and informative. Thank you.

[@aldenabesa9096]

Okay the redwood! 😊

[@loyanglionscc]

Thanks for doing what you’re doing

[@Metaphysics-for-life]

Thanks for the comparison ... Redwood for me :-)

[@jaybusa7690]

Great video bro thanks

[@toy2day1]

Poseidon X, only changing the 38t crank to a 46t one...

[@rdl8443]

Haha glad to see I'm not the only one that overrides logic and rationality with "but it looks cooler"

[@allanmarquezini777]

Wow man, i wolud love if we had some of this great cheap machines here in brazil...

[@johncaban4310]

You should offer a flat bar for the Redwood. Looking for a comfortable city and trail bike.

[@goodstuffrighthere]

Call Poseidon

[@911sareforever]

So I as looking at building a vintage mtb with a goal of running 50mm 29xc tires but this bike just does it and is pretty cheap

[@PoliticusRex632]

Redwood may have been intended for long distance gravel/offroad bikepacking but its true purpose is MOUNTAIN CROSS! That's right, you heard it here first. A cyclocross bike for places a cyclocross can't go.

[@DEXVD]

I think they call that Monster Cross

[@carlnormand]

Great video as always. Really like your content. I have been eyeing the redwood for a while but being in Canada with the Exchange rate and the shipping it makes it less of a budget bike. Any canadian resellers out there?

[@nmcheese]

It would be interesting to see the Redwood with a suspension fork.

[@coreyreeder2321]

I think you could get a comparable mtb for hundreds less if you want a suspension fork. There’s a lot of suspension in those fat tires 👍

[@DEXVD]

Was trying to see how my yet to arrive Norco Search XR A1 would compare to these bikes but there doesn't seem to be enough geo info on the X to get an idea of whether the Search would be more similar to it than the Redwood in terms of geo. Had originally set out to order the "All road" Norco Section but also considered the Search and CX Threshold, when I noticed the Threshold and Search geo was fairly close. I had the idea that maybe the Search might be the sort of Jack of All Trades (okay at everything but not the best at anything except some range of gravel), outperforming a HT XC or CX bike on road but unlike the Section, capable of at least attempting CX and likely just as capable if not more than the Threshold on gravel, fire roads, double track and light single track. Not sure where the Search's capability would lie on your chart but my intentions would pretty much eat up both bars on your graph.

[@PoliticusRex632]

I was about to pull the trigger on an X last year with 2x and Shimano but they ran out. I waited for it and it comes back with Microshift and those superwide bars. No good to me now.

[@ahmadzuhairi]

Heard the Advent X works wonderful and is almost bulletproof.

[@PoliticusRex632]

@@ahmadzuhairi it's not cyclocross gearing though.

[@johnnylong2049]

To me, The reason why the X is considered a gravel bike is because it can fit a 650b x 1.9/2.0.

[@ggrimreaper3816]

On the fence between these two bikes and the state 4130 all road. Might get the 4130, it can have 650b or 700 tires.

[@davidobrien8438]

@spindatt You say at 3:45 you cannot confirm (measure) the reach of the X due to not having the stock stem and handlebars. Reach is a *frame* measurement, not a compete bike built/setup measurement. Reach is the distance between a perpendicular line to the ground thru the bottom bracket and another one thru the top of the head tube (i.e., the same end point as effective/horizontal top-tube measurement).

[@williamlebron9873]

Great comparison. So how tall are you? I am thinking so hard on getting the Redwood but the X is very tempting too. I’m just over 5’11. I’m leaning to maybe a large. If I order one I just want to get it right.

[@SinAlameda]

Same. Did you buy one?

[@Anth230]

Well???

[@todd92371]

Wouldn't the Redwood with thinner road tires on it greatly expand it's potential?

[@chaotic2insanity]

Just recently a KZbin channel called “the bike sauce” just released a video of the Redwood with 700C wheels. Rather than having bulky tires on the wheels adding some hybrids or roady tires will make the rides smoother on pavement. The 650b wheels can be more for your off road trails.

[@pinatadonkey5934]

So I’ve watched every video you’ve done in both bikes. And I’m still torn between the two. I don’t plan on doing any racing, just leisure riding and finding some cool paths to take long rides on (northern NJ) so based on this video the X seems like the best choice for me. But, I also know I’m super interested in bikepacking as well. And the tubeless ready, thru axel on the redwood is super tempting for the future proofing aspects. So I guess my only question is, if I got the redwood and put some tires more akin to the X on it, would it still be enjoyable and comfortable to ride on road?

[@bigc1504]

I am asking the same question to myself

[@paulscheibelein5953]

Same question for me

[@paul_smithson2619]

Same question for me. Especially for someone who is going to have to ride asphalt to gravel. Looking at some rides that are 50% or more road.

[@davidburgess741]

If there were any gravel around here I'd choose the Redwood. It's road or mountain.

[@Marc-vl9id]

Nice video. I’m 5’ 7” with a 31 inch inseam. I don’t know whether to buy the small or medium Poseidon x. Can you please help me out?

[@abosworth]

Did you ever make the video on your X set up? I just ordered one so I'm curious to see what you put on it. I'd like to get hydraulic brakes and Shimano 105 at some point I think

[@jasonparks754]

What is your height and inseam, I'm curious since you ride a large on both the X and the Redwood, thanks!

[@dombeck221]

It went together easily in less than an hour. kzbin.infoUgkxHL1v1R3NE5x4KiYfyt8dnQmyNYz7qi5L Make sure the front fork is forward or the pedals will hit the front tire. Tires are both a little soft so it needs air before I ride it. The rear wheel didn't come with a clamp regular bolts hold it on. The front had the clamp. No scratches out of box. Rims are a little off with a slight wobble. They could have spent more time with the spoke tool fixing the run out. So far out of the box I'm happy with it. I did replace the pedals with a nice aftermarket set. After riding it a bit my A$$ is a bit sore so I ordered another seat. Overall I'm nearly 60 and didn't ride a bike in 30 years. I like my new 29" Schwinn. It will be used for casual rides with my friend.

[@toddhackley1241]

What if one went with a redwood with narrower tires?

[@mr.yumiygotem8318]

I just got a Poseidon bike I got the drop bar with off-road wheels it’ll be my first ever bike I got online so I’m a bit worried

[@erikbartelt9060]

Sold me on the X.

[@davidbierbaum4881]

Actually, DO make a video on how the X is built up. Also, in a point of curiosity, has anyone tried matching an Advent X rear with a double chainring front?

[@GeekonaBike]

Speaking of the axles, can you tell the diff in the ride between thr QRs & the Thur Axles without looking?

[@emmber19]

No.

[@RazzFazz-Race]

To my Opinion: the difference between Redwood and MTB is the rigid fork.

[@MOBILEVITAL]

If the 30% of my rides gonna be roads the Redwood is still a good option?

[@bruhmaxxer]

How to order the bikes in Canada without almost doubling the price with freight alone?

[@UrbanSuburban010]

I was wondering the same thing. Almsot ordered a Redwood but couldn't even find shipping to Canada.

[@robotmuseum]

This is super helpful. But which is more supple? I had a CX bike with carbon fork before and my teeth would clatter on every little bump

[@KuriosPC]

So, the X is pretty much a hybrid bike, right?

[@tibbar1000]

What kind snd size bearings does front wheel of the X use? Thanks

[@mshanem80]

Do a vid to see if sram and shimano shifters will work with the rear der. and cassette

[@namarocks101]

Do you think the X could be as good as the Redwood when switched into wider 650B tires instead of the stock 700c 35mm?

[@shoeonhead]

Pls answer this question for this person. Lol

[@jmotravelingteam]

It's an excellent question. Haha

[@RyanAggabao]

I think the point of this video is that both bikes are good at their respective uses

[@DrPepperZZZ]

That's what I was wondering. How much of their respective uses have to do with tire choice?

[@luistejeda5248]

Random question but do you know exactly how much the redwood’s fork weighs? I’m wondering how much weight someone would shave off of that chunky boy just by switching out to a carbon fork.

[@davidross8233]

Low stack is a bummer

[@SoSwiff]

What’s the largest chainring that you think you could fit on either?

[@supracurious]

Dam, that X has a double chain ring. The current stock doesn’t have the double chain ring. :(

[@veganmatters6963]

the x makes a lot of sense if you are riding to the gravel track and perhaps over night getaway

[@stangeric1]

@8:54 Midnight sleepy and this dude jumps at me on the screen like that wtf? 😴😲😓

[@BDSaints7]

What size X did you get and how tall are you? I'm almost 6.1 with shoes on and I just ordered an XL because I heard the sizing runs a little small.

[@879doogie]

Can either of these bike accept a Gates Carbon Belt Drive?

[@jered2177]

Does anyone commute on a 20" bmx bike?

[@MikeyTiger37]

Are they any UK/European distributors for Poseidon? Would love one!

[@MikeyTiger37]

Or are there any UK available equivalents that people would recommend?

[@ahmadzuhairi]

@@MikeyTiger37 I would go for the Sonder Camino in the UK. That's like the Redwood equivalent. Camino was my second choice.

[@mb61j2]

What about state all road?

[@ExperiencedNovice2024]

Does your toe ever hit the front tire on turns on either of these?

[@adamyelle4901]

X for me. Not enough gnar around here for the Redwood.

[@bosun120]

Are the new Dropbar X wheels tubeless compatible?

[@ahmadzuhairi]

Does anyone has any information on the Redwood stock wheel width? Can it sit a 2.5" tire?

[@andrewmaxwell8181]

Stock is 2.35, I think in another video someone said 2.5 is the max.

[@MxCraven]

Do I need to unsub for the video about how the X is built up?

[@Scruffybirdd]

How tall are you?

[@imnotajedi]

Since the new X has a carbon fork how would that compare to the aluminum fork? How do you like the aluminum fork on either of your bikes?

[@Spindatt]

my X has a carbon fork with aluminum steerer, the new one is full carbon. I wouldn't notice a difference besides weight

[@imnotajedi]

@@Spindatt Ah, ok then what are your thoughts with the carbon fork on the x versus the aluminum on the redwood?